People Know Reading is Good and Still Don't Do It.

Summary

Podcast Summary: Book Riot – The Podcast

Episode: People Know Reading Is Good and Still Don’t Do It.
Hosts: Jeff O’Neal (for Rebecca Schinsky), Vanessa Diaz
Date: April 27, 2026

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Overview

In this lighthearted, chatty episode, Jeff O’Neal and Vanessa Diaz sift through recent book world happenings, industry news, literary awards, curious book surveys, odd book/product collaborations, and adaptations. With their trademark bookish wit, they ponder why—even knowing reading is “good for you”—many don’t actually do it; dissect award shortlists; marvel at book bans; and gleefully skewer some of the odder mergers between books and brands.

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Main Discussion Points & Timestamps

1. Opening Banter & Literary ‘Minor Changes’ Game ([01:34]–[04:28])

• Hosts’ playful discussion: What minor details would they rewrite in literary history if they could, like adding a letter to Roald Dahl’s name or standardizing classic authorial myths.
  • “Can I get rid of the umlaut above the ‘e’ in Brontë? … Also, can we just agree that Shakespeare existed?” – Jeff [02:58]
• Listeners are invited to suggest their own changes by email.

2. Housekeeping & Upcoming Interviews ([03:14]–[04:28])

• Upcoming episodes: Interview with Laura McGrath on the role of literary agents (“Middlemen”), coming April 28.
• Mom’s, Dad’s, and Grad’s book request slots are now closed.

3. Women’s Prize for Fiction Shortlist ([07:26]–[11:13])

• Shortlist highlights:
  • Flashlight by Shuzan Choi
  • Dominion by Addie E. Kitchens
  • The Correspondent by Virginia Evans
  • The Mercy Step by Marcia Hutchinson
  • Kingfisher by Rosie Kelly
  • Heart the Lover by Lily King
• Hosts’ reactions:
  • Neither host has read all the books—Vanessa jokes about “winning the game” of not having read majorly-hyped award books for years.
  • “I opened this list like maybe this year and…no, I have not read a single one of these. I own three of them.” – Vanessa [08:16]
• Prize value acknowledged (£30,000, sponsored by Audible and Baileys); winner announced June 11.
• Fun: Quirky judging panel bios amuse the hosts.

4. Listening Habits and Accessibility: Audiobook Feedback ([11:30]–[13:46])

• Jeff receives listener feedback on a previous assertion that “nobody just sits and listens to audiobooks,” reminded of the importance of accessibility for blind and visually impaired listeners: “Amia culpa. …I hope this inclusion in the main show will show how open we are to that sensibility.” [12:36]

5. Survey: People Know Reading Is Good (But Don’t Do It) ([13:46]–[17:13])

• Key (dubious) survey results:
  • 30% believe reading makes them “better than others”
  • 82% say not reading is “intellectually limiting”
  • Very small user base sampled (“2,000 of those users that they poll…from a book summary app”) – Vanessa [13:46]
• Hosts question the merit and wording of such surveys, and feign horror (and amusement) at questions like: “Have you invited a date over just to show off your bookshelf?”
  • “Who is out here playing Careless Whisper when you walk through the door and chill…?” – Vanessa [16:13]
• Overall conclusion: Most people believe reading is good but don’t read as much as they think they “should,” much like exercise or volunteering.

6. Hugo Award Finalists ([17:13]–[19:28])

• Best Novel Finalists:
  • Death Drop of Corruption – Robert Jackson Bennett
  • Death of the Author – Nnedi Okorafor
  • Shroud – Adrian Tchaikovsky
  • The Everlasting – Alex E. Harrow
  • The Incandescent – Emily Tesh
  • The Raven Scholar – Antonia Hodgson
• Vanessa is eyeing The Raven Scholar; both hosts note their continuing, tongue-in-cheek “streak” of not having read the shortlist.
• Jeff highlights Amal El-Mohtar’s novella (The River Has Roots) for unique audiobook features (author and sister singing).
• Note to listeners: Hugo voting is accessible and impactful—“could actually make a difference.” [19:24]

7. Top 11 Most Challenged/Banned Books of 2025 ([19:30]–[23:05])

• Frequent targets: Sarah J. Maas, John Green, Gender Queer by Maia Kobabe, etc.
• Grim stats: Book censorship remains at a near-record high; 92% of challenges are initiated by groups/government officials, not parents.
  • “The statistic…that just remains important to me is…92% of those book challenges are initiated…by non-parents.” – Vanessa [20:27]
• Call to action: Show up for libraries, school boards, and book freedom.

8. Ridiculous Book/Product Collaborations ([23:21]–[29:04])

• Recent “collabs” covered:
  1. Yankee Candle x Reese Witherspoon – Book-themed candles (“least ridiculous”)
  2. Crystal Light – Book genre-inspired drink flavors (“prickly pear for history”…“passion fruit for fantasy”…)
  3. Prego x StoryCorps – Pasta sauce + dinner table oral history kit (“Connection Keeper Bundle”)
  4. Hellman’s x Jennifer L. Armentrout – Garlic aioli for her vampire book (“Primal of Blood and Bone”)
• Hilariously, these are likely designed for TikTokers and book influencers.
  • “We just gave a bunch of free ads to Crystal Light, [Hellmann’s]. Garlic aioli, I guess that’s what they’re trying to do…These are for TikTok.” – Jeff [28:41]
• Shout-out to book riot staffer Danica Ellis’s “next” potential collaborations: Frida McFadden kitchen knives, Hunger Games pool inflatables.

9. Practical Magic 2 Movie News ([29:04]–[31:52])

• Vanessa is thrilled (“I have booked a plane ticket to go see it with a member of the staff.” [29:47]).
• Movie is based on Alice Hoffman’s “Book of Magic” (the fourth book), not directly following the first film/book.
• Maisie Williams (Game of Thrones) joins the cast as Sandra Bullock’s character’s daughter.

10. Noteworthy: Quinn App & Audio Erotica ([31:56]–[33:52])

• Rising trend in “audio erotica” with celebrity narrators.
• Shaun Hadassi (of “The Bear”) is the most requested reader and is now narrating a chef-themed romance, “Yes, Chef,” on the app.

11. Frontlist Foyer: Book Recommendations ([33:52]–[39:03])

• Vanessa recommends:
  • London Falling by Patrick Radden Keefe
    • Nonfiction about a British family’s son with a double-life tied to high-stakes Russian money and intrigue.
      • “It’s everything we’ve come to know from Patrick Radden Keefe and I loved it.” – Vanessa [36:17]
• Jeff recommends:
  • Middlemen by Laura McGrath (in-depth on literary agents)
  • This Land is Your Land by Beverly Gage (American historical road trips)
    • “Beverly Gage is too normal… I want a weirdo.” – Jeff [37:46]
  • Call for suggestions akin to Sarah Vowell/Bill Bryson.

12. David Sedaris & Literary Humor ([39:03]–[41:18])

• They reminisce about Sedaris’s funniest essays and their capacity to re-listen for laughter.
  • “My family and I will, on a hard day, listen to David Sedaris…” – Jeff [40:28]

13. Upcoming at Book Riot ([41:18]–[44:24])

• Upcoming Patreon drafts: Summer reading, fantasy league, and a book club of Jesmyn Ward’s memoir, “On Witness and Respair.”
• Listener engagement: “Shoot us an email—[e-mail].”

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Notable Quotes

• “I think I am better for having read seriously and deeply. So ergo…does that not…mean I think…I guess I’m flawed in other ways. I’m just trying to get to par with my reading and other people already ahead.” – Jeff [14:54]
• “Who is out here playing Careless Whisper when you walk through the door and chill…?” – Vanessa [16:13]
• “The voices in the room that are the loudest are like the most giant case of ‘she doesn’t even go here’ I’ve ever heard in my life.” – Vanessa on book challenges [20:40]
• “We just gave a bunch of free ads to Crystal Light, [Hellmann’s]. Garlic aioli…These are for TikTok.” – Jeff [28:41]
• “Beverly Gage is too normal… I want a weirdo.” – Jeff, on road trip books [37:46]

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Useful Timestamps

• Literary “minor changes” game: [01:34]–[04:28]
• Women’s Prize Shortlist: [07:26]–[11:13]
• Audiobook accessibility feedback: [11:30]–[13:46]
• Survey: Reading makes you “better than others”: [13:46]–[17:13]
• Hugo Awards: [17:13]–[19:28]
• Book bans & ALA list: [19:30]–[23:05]
• “Ridiculous” book/product collabs: [23:21]–[29:04]
• Practical Magic 2 news: [29:04]–[31:52]
• Quinn app / audio erotica: [31:56]–[33:52]
• Book recs (Frontlist Foyer): [33:52]–[39:03]
• David Sedaris stories: [39:03]–[41:18]
• What’s next at Book Riot: [41:18]–[44:24]

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Tone & Final Thoughts

The podcast is witty, self-aware, broadly accessible, and always brimming with affection for the world of books and reading—while not afraid to poke fun at itself, odd industry trends, and the quirks of book culture. Both hosts drive home the importance of access, advocacy, and the pleasures (and perils) of being immersed in literary life.

Transcript

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[Jeff O'Neill]

This is the Book Riot Podcast. I'm Jeff o', Neill, sitting in for Rebecca today. Vanessa Diaz is back, though you don't get to pepper me with our literary arcana today. Just regular flotsam and jetsam from the world of books.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yes, regular old chitchat of an interesting nature.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Got some nice comments about the Byron episode. A lot of eyebrows about Don Juan being how to pronounce that. That forever in my soul, I think. So Vanessa, this would be a fun game for us to play sometime if we could just go change a couple of minor things in literary history. Not like huge things, you know, like Virginia Woolf doesn't walk into a river like I'm picking. And like we can't actually change who people are.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Like correct.

[Jeff O'Neill]

It should be Don Juan, which I guess have to change the rhinestone, but that I need. I also need there to be an N in Raul Dahl's name. I've needed this for a long time, so I'm Putting those to you. Does anything jump out to you like that?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Mine are largely of a Barbra Streisand effect or like the Berenstain bears, which I didn't put on the agenda, but there's a new Berenstain books. Berenstain book coming out and my.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And we just want them to be Berenstein. Just, just agree that like, just gonna

[Vanessa Diaz]

go in there and swap a little vowel out. Those are the rules of time travel, right? You can't do anything that's like, I'm gonna alter history, but I can like change a little something.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah, that's. That's like probably I should ask Roald Dahl not to be an anti Semite. Like I would do that if I could. But like that's beyond the pale what we're talking about here.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So instead I will add a letter to his name and all the world.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Or like the Brontes. Can I get rid of the, the umlaut above the e? I just always forget. I just kind of forget. Also, can we just agree that Shakespeare existed? I would do that. Is that too big? Maybe that's too big.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I mean, that's a sentiment thing. So hopefully that, that works for our little made up game. But I like that.

[Jeff O'Neill]

So if you could change the world of books and reading these little tiny ways, choose an email podcast book riot.com and I will, I will promise to give you credit there. Let's do some housekeeping. James by Percival Everett is over in the zero to well read feedback right now. There were hails and huzanas from those of you who know that we get Rebecca and I got one in the can and technology ate it. So that's over there coming up later in the week in this feed. I just recorded an Interview with Laura McGrath Solo1 about her book Middlemen, Literary Agents and the Making of American Fiction, which is about the role of literary agents in contemporary and really 20th into 21st century literary fiction. If you listen to this show, you'll be interested in her book. It's an academic book, but it reads. It reads like it's. It is an academic book, but it's not a lot of jargon. It's not very long, 219 pages, but there is some juice in that. In one moment, Laura goes and she listens into a literary agency zoom call when they're going through their slush pile. I will not spoil how that goes, but there's some really interesting moments in there, so you can check that out. It will be available. This feed coming out is Monday the 26th. It this releases on the 28th, so it'll be available soon.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Monday is the 27th, so the 2027th.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes. Okay. Yes. So it comes out Tuesday the 28th, so the next day it'll be out and available there. I don't think I've got any other housekeeping things. Mom's dads and grads. Requests are closed. Thank you very much. A few people got in under the wire there, Vanessa. All right, let's get into the news of the week after we take a quick break.

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[Jeff O'Neill]

we're still waiting on the Pulitzer Prizes, Vanessa to come out here, but I think this is actually kind of caging time in for the women's short list because they don't have the prize. But we're getting very close to my patients being over for shortlists for 2025.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It's we're pretty.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And maybe we've passed that meridian because I was like, whoa, we're still talking about Flashlight by Susan Joy, which I read a million years ago when it came out. I guess Heart, the Lover and the Correspondent I read later though they've been out for a while. So the full shortlist here is Flashlight by Shuzan Choi, Dominion by Addie E. Kitchens, a book I know nothing about Europa Editions title the Correspondent by Virginia Evans, the Mercy Step by Marcia Hutchinson, Kingfisher by Rosie Kelly and Heart the Lover by Lily King. Do you have any skin in the game for these books? Do you care about one of these books? Did one of these come close to your Heart the Lover here at any point?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Vanessa, I am trying to play a game that so far I'm winning in strides and that is will I go an entire at this point, it's like five year run without having read a single book on a GD Award list. And I mean five years is probably excessive, but like I opened this list like maybe this year and no, I have not read a single one of these. I own three of them.

[Jeff O'Neill]

But like, which, which, let me guess, go ahead. You own Heart the Lover.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do.

[Jeff O'Neill]

You own the Correspondent. You own Flashlight.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do. Yep. Those are the ones.

[Jeff O'Neill]

The Correspondent Gift American.

[Vanessa Diaz]

And then yeah, the other two I actually like went and got.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Wait, can you. Who gave you the, who had the temerity to give an A literary book editor a book A and B the Correspondent? Do you need to out these people or do we need.

[Vanessa Diaz]

No, it was like a, like a newer friend and was like, I heard this book is Everywhere. And I was like, you know, because I know that's so sweet. Almost given like not jokingly, but I said something about like it's got to be really intimidating to purchase like books for people who work in books and like I'm an editor, etc. So it was kind of like a look, this book is everywhere. It might not even be your thing, but like here you go. And I was like, you know what? It is everywhere. And I do like an epistolary something. So like, yes, this is one of those books that we occasionally talk about on Book Riot where as much as we think we know about books, when it first popped up on the best selling list, I was like, what's that?

[Jeff O'Neill]

What is that?

[Vanessa Diaz]

So I do do want to read it for those reasons, but haven't. And then Flashlight was just everybody, you know, Liberty was, I think Liberty Hardy is one of her best books of the last year. So I too, you know, deep into. It's almost May, I'm like, oh, we're still, we're still talking about. But yeah, sure, sure, like cool.

[Jeff O'Neill]

SRIF and I book clubbed it for this show in the spring when it came out. I. So here's anecdote about the Correspondent market penetration into its target demo. Both of my parents have now read the Correspondent. So check that for what you will at this point. I think at this point if those are the three I have read Flashlight, Correspondent, Heart the Lover. I think I'm pulling for Heart the Lover.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I actually didn't really know too much about the premise until like semi recently when I was like looking at it because I've owned it for some time. I was like, oh, I actually do really want to read this.

[Jeff O'Neill]

You like a camp? You like a campus novel?

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do, exactly. So it's is probably something I'll read like this week. I want to be shady for one second just because it's funny to me. If you actually look up the link that we are going to put in the show notes about the description of the judging panel for this prize.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Oh yes.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It is just funny to me that it lists everybody by their accolades and everybody's like they're a poet, they're a novelist, they're an essay. And then at the very end it's NDJ, Annie McManus, which apparently like she is a broadcaster but also a writer and an essayist, all these other things. And for some reason it just really reads funny to me that it's like ndj. It's like, yes, that is what she Is. But is many other things, but very tricky.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah. So if you got strong feelings there, we're gonna have to wait till June 11. So midway through 2026. Will we get the. The winner there? It's a quite lucrative prize, £30,000 at this point. Sponsored by Audible and Bailey's, which actually sounds like a nice Friday night. Audible and Bailey's at the same time, if you think about.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Not a bad way to spend a day.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes. Let's see. So anything else to say there? We can kind of move along because

[Vanessa Diaz]

we just made her, you know, like to see a prize that dedicates itself to women's fiction. So that's great. It's all my snark about the timing of the year aside, I again hope someone gets that lovely 30K audible subscription and a big old bottle of Baileys. Why not?

[Jeff O'Neill]

Speaking of Audible, this is a good time to insert some listener feedback that I wanted to relay when I was both jokingly and me and honestly critiquing Audible Story House. I think that was last week before I said something to the effect of no one sits around and just puts their headphones on and listens to an audiobook, which I both was sincere about, but I didn't mean to be everyone. And someone wrote in to say, you know, there are people who sit around and listen to audiobooks that way and that's the blind. And you should think about those kinds of blanket statements that you make. And I agree completely. I will say this, that I should have thought about this. The intent of that is to think this is not a market moving segment of the population for something like Storyhouse, but especially when it comes to audiobooks, ebooks, other kinds of things, AI and some other kinds of things. I think a lot of us, and I am now patient zero for this, should think about the accessibility ramifications for some of these. Amia culpa. And also I want to say thank you so much for writing in. I know sometimes people are nervous when they write in to say hey, you may be being a jerk about this. I hope this inclusion in the main show will show how open we are to that sensibility. For thanks for that person for writing in on that side World Book Day study. I put this in. I think you copy edited me when I put this in the headed to the Book Book Rap flagship newsletter the other day. This is. I don't know these companies that do these surveys and they want us to link to them and so congratulations, it worked headway. I guess I should say too. The key Takeaway at the top of this survey about how people think about reading is this. Some 30% of respondents believe reading makes them better than others, which is funny and we could talk about that sentence in a moment. Likewise, 82% says not reading regularly is intellectually limiting. So my comment, Vanessa, I think was something the effect of. So that suggests to me there's 50% of people that know reading is good for you and makes them better than others and yet still don't do it. That was my takeover that that 30, 80, because it feels like it should line them up right? Like if you think it makes you better and it's intellect limiting, then why isn't lining up that way in my sense is that, well, people know better than they do. Am I right? What do you think you are?

[Vanessa Diaz]

And also I, I went way into this just because I found it. Yes, comic. There's parts of this that are just hilarious, which we can get into. But if you actually look at the question itself, the little pie chart about that question says that the answer is actually the percent of people think it's intellectually limiting. And the other 44 say somewhat. And they just combine those numbers because the way some of these questions are phrased, I feel like even I would have been like, okay, you're doing too much. Because like the one that straight up, like, do you think this makes you better than other people? Like is quite the way to phrase some of this questioning. So that one, while I do still think the overall sentiment is at apparently 82% of, I should say a sample size of 2,000 people on a very specific app like they this is an app that does like 15 minute, I think audio or both digital and audio summaries of non fiction bestsellers. So super hyper specific they tout themselves as being the most downloaded book summary app, which like sure, question mark. And then it's 2,000 of those users that they pull, they're like yes, here's the super extractable data and then came up with this 82% people think it's intellectually limiting. Like okay, like sure, very strange.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Well, this is a somewhat discomforting realization. I don't think of my reading as the goal of it is not to make me better than others, but I do think I am better for having read seriously and deeply. So ergo, does that not by extension mean I think I guess, I don't know, I guess I'm flawed in other ways. Maybe I'm just trying to get to par with my reading and other people already ahead. Par. I don't like to think in those terms. But there is sort of an inexorable logic to that. Whereas if I think books make me a better person, then by to some degree, I think that if I didn't read, I'd be a worse person. I guess I just am trying not to extrapolate to other people. Other than that.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah, my general vibe is like, I think I'm better for reading. I try not to apply snobbery. There is some inherently in there. It's just who I am as a person, I'm sure. But ultimately, I try to look at it as, like, if somebody says, hey, I just. I'm not into reading. I look at that super different from someone who category because, like, I don't read. And even then I'm like, that's your life. Like, you have one precious life. Go do with it what you want. So again, some of this phrasing to me is a little like, okay, sure. I guess that's the conclusion. I personally found the question of, have you ever been invited. Have you ever invited a date over under the pretext of them of showing them your bookshelf in the hopes it will lead to something more? That is specifically the question they asked. And I'm like, who is out here playing Careless Whisper when you walk through

[Jeff O'Neill]

the door and chill? I don't know. I don't think that's.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

I don't know.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Look at my boy bookshelf, like, okay, sure.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And does that work on people?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Does it?

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes. I don't know. I really should have tried this when I was single.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I guess maybe this is why I'm single, Jeff, Because I'm bringing people over to see this. Like three shelves worth of Agatha Christie.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Well, I mean, this may. This may tail into 24. Say they're unwilling to date someone whose reading habits don't match. Align with their own. I guess a line is doing a lot of work there.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It is. Yeah. Because. What does that mean? Does that mean I don't like fantasy? Does that mean I'm reading Mein Kampf? Like, right, There's a.

[Jeff O'Neill]

There's. You can be out of alignment a little bit or a whole lot. That's pretty interesting there. I'm not just taking this with the grain of salt. This is made of salt. This is a study made of salt.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It's a salt lick. Yeah, agreed.

[Jeff O'Neill]

It's pretty interesting. Anyway, people, I guess it's more line than what we. With what we know of doing this over time is that people believe books are good for them more than they read.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah. Which that is a tale as old as time.

[Jeff O'Neill]

As old. It's like eating. Eating and exercise and volunteerism. I guess all those things kind of go into that same bucket here. Hugo Award finalists. We don't talk about too many genre specific ones, but we do talk about some. The Hugo is of course, science fiction and fantasy. The six finalists for best novel. One thing that's cool about the Hugo's is there's novel, novella and novelette. I can't tell you what a novelette is. I guess it's smaller than a novella but longer than a short story. Because there's a short story category.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Here at the same time, we're going to stick with just novels here. Quickly. Death Drop of Corruption by Robert Jackson Bennett, Death of the Author by Nnedi Okorafor, which we've talked about on this show. Shroud by Adrian Tchaikovsky, the Everlasting by Alex E. Harrow, the Incandescent by Emily Tesh and the Raven Scholar by Antonia Hodgson, which I've heard all sorts of secondary market things about. I gave the Raven Scholar to my brother who likes to read fantasy. Page unturned. Those are up there. I'm not sure. Vanessa, anything jump out to you?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Raven Scholar has been recommended to me by lots of people, including like book riot people. So I downloaded the audiobook like two days ago. I haven't started it yet. Adrian Tchaikovsky is one of those writers that I feel like I see everywhere and I just haven't yet picked up.

[Jeff O'Neill]

But whenever I like the Alex E. Harrow, I was like, I hear this book. I'm like, oh, I should try one of those. I just never.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do like her a lot and I think I also have like the, the galley of that hanging around somewhere. And it sounds interesting, everything here does. But yeah, I just like to kind of shine a light on genre awards because they're important. But there's so much here that I'm like, oh great again my streak is strong. I'm like, I haven't read one of these.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah. In the novella category I did read the River Has Roots by Amal El Mohtar and she came on First Edition and I had a really good. I love that book and I recommend an audio and apparently there's some singing in that book and Amal and her sister do the singing in the audiobook. So that's enough to get people over the edge. I just want to shout that out real quick. Also in a U2 can make a difference. I don't know what the membership into the Hugo voting body is. But some of these categories have like 300 votes, which could matter. So if this is something you're interested in, you might. You might see what it takes to get into the voting body for the Hugo Awards. This is sort of like run for school board from people who sit in chairs and read all day.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yep. Boy, I wanted to bring it up. That was like, hey, this is the thing you can actually make an impact on.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Could actually do.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

All right. Moving right along. The top 11 most challenged books of 2025. ALA has presented us this list. Vanessa, why don't you go first? What would you like to say about this list? Anything come up other let's get their rage and frustration. Take that as the rstle and e of the wheel of fortune of these kinds of news stories. What beyond this would you like to mention?

[Vanessa Diaz]

The stories or the books themselves are ones that, if you've been paying any kind of attention, are not like, particularly surprising. Like without. I closed my eyes and didn't even read the list and I came up with, I think three of them.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Because I was like, okay, cool. Like fairies having sexy times. Bad, bad to book banners.

[Jeff O'Neill]

That's Sarah J. Maas's Empire of storms. Yes.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Looking for Alaska or yeah. By John Green was on here. My account. Bobby's genderqueer is like one of the most banned titles.

[Jeff O'Neill]

The statistics that two years ago was the most.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It was the most something. Yeah. I don't remember what year it was, but it was the most banned and just is reliably like always on the band booked lists.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Right.

[Vanessa Diaz]

The statistic that is part of the RSTL and E of it all, but that just remains important to me is that a. Like, we've been in this giant spike of book censorship since 2021. But 2025 was like high tide. Like it. It was a significant increase. Over 4,000 titles, I think were challenged in 2025, which is the second highest number that the ALA has seen. And that notably this is the part that really infuriates me is that 92% of those book challenges are initiated and have been by non parents. They are pressure groups. They're government officials. Like decision makers, I think is the other word they use. But it's not by parents. It's not by a concerned parent. Parents show up to these things. They're like, no, no, no, we don't want this. Not to say that no parents disagree. But that's not where these challenges. 92%. That is an overwhelming amount. Which is where we do that tie in of like how important it is to, you know, as we kind of tease her, like show up to these meetings and like vote for your school boards etc because wow, the voices in the room that are the loudest are like the most giant case so she doesn't even go here I've ever heard of in my life. Yeah. So that's the standout stuff. I mean the numbers are staggering. You know it's Almost I think 5,5600 books that were banned, 66% of the total challenged. Most of the titles are some kind of diverse. Right. Either queer or by authors of color. It's like not new but still staggering to see. And then again the challenge part just really, really gets at me in a way that makes my face do things right.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah, I was thinking about this. 3% of challenges originated from parents. I wonder if that'd be a useful force function to. To. To require that a parent is the only. Is the only kind of person that can challenge a book.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Karen. A parent or guardian. Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah. I'm guessing what would happen then is that these organizations would then sort of find parents to act on their behalf.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Mom.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Make them jump through another hoop.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah, right. Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

You know that make them sort of filter and find maybe some of these could be screened out that way. I will say so the top. I'll just do the top books here mentioned so people know those are link in the show notes bookright.com listen sold by Patricia McCormick. The perks of Being a Wallflower by Stephen Chbosky. Ginger Queer by Maya Kobabe. Empire Storms by Sarah J. Maas. Last Night at the Telegraph Club by Melinda Lowe. Tricks by Helen Hopkins. A Court of Thorn and Roses by Sarah J. Maas. A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess. Identical by Ellen Hopkins. Looking for Alaska by John Green. Storm and Fury by Jennifer L. Arman Trout. I will say this coming to a zero to well read feed near you. One of these books will be appearing. It's one of these books is in the can. I'll let people guess when people could figure it out. There's not that there's not too many

[Vanessa Diaz]

contenders at this point.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Contenders. You could probably narrow it down to a few from there. Yeah. Show up your school board meetings run for school board support your libraries. I don't think there's anything else you could do. You could bring your crystal light if you wanted to. The school board meeting. Vanessa, was this your block or did Kelly do this?

[Vanessa Diaz]

I think Kelly ended up doing it.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes. So we here at Book Riot sort of keep an eye on interesting, shall we say, bookish collaborations. And finally we had enough to make a list. And the list for this was four categories. Where would you like to begin? Let's. Let's talk about all four of them. Let's do them. Let's do a quick draft. An ascending order of ridiculousness. Let's take five minutes ourselves to think of this.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I think that least ridiculous is obvious at least to me.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yankee Candle. Let me guess. Yeah, okay, like candles. What's their collab there?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Somewhat of a. Right, like people. People do that. Like bookish candles are a thing. So there is a partnership. And of course I closed the window I was looking at. But between, I think, is it Reese Witherspoon that was doing the collab, right, with a Yankee Candle so specifically to make like these, you know, themed candle sets, which again, that to me is the least outlandish. The theme here just being like, interesting and Shing is doing a lot of work there, like non book and book collaborations out there with like random products. And the candle went to me is like, okay, fine, I'll give it to you. But you know, that's, that's, that's my one feeling.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I think I know what the most ridiculous we're going to. So as I've decided between the two, I guess maybe I'll go crystal light next as the second least ridiculous. Or what? Or did you have something else?

[Vanessa Diaz]

No, I think I can go with that. It's still a little bit silly to me, but so, yeah, it's. It's still like, okay, sure, go.

[Jeff O'Neill]

A prickly pear lemonade for history and passion fruit for fantasy and hibiscus lemonade for romance. I mean, like, if I squint, I feel like I can see it a little bit.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I think that the passion fruit was lazy. That was somebody just being like, passion. Yeah, there's a fruit named passion.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Go with it. Summer reads like, sure, Mr. Tiki over here. So that's like beach reads 100% prickly pear.

[Vanessa Diaz]

The only thing I could think of it is like, were you going for like prickly like they described it in here?

[Jeff O'Neill]

Could you murder someone with a prickly pear? I don't think so.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I would like to give a shout out to Danica Ellis, our editor who wrote so wrote this up for our newsletter today and books suggesting like, what's next? And then gave three ridiculous examples that I don't have.

[Jeff O'Neill]

One of them was like, I forgot

[Vanessa Diaz]

those Frida McFadden kitchen knives.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Amazing.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Something about Eggos and oh, I have to pull this up because I was like, you know what? Those collaborations, while like ridiculous sounding, make more sense to me.

[Jeff O'Neill]

We're giving out free gold here to marketers. So I. Yeah, I don't know, we should keep like a finder's fee for something. But.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah. And then what was the fantasy one? Hibiscus lemonade. Which I'm like, yeah, sure. But these all feel like an absolute stretch. Oh, Hunger Games pool inflatables was the other example.

[Jeff O'Neill]

That's too funny.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So anywho, that's great. Sure. Though.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And then in the number two hole, Prego with a pasta sauce and team up with storycord to capture your dinner table conversations.

[Vanessa Diaz]

What did I write this.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Okay.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah. They have like a name. They gave it. It was like the Connection Kitchen bundle or something. Connection Maker Bundle. And it's like you literally like go get. Because it's. Storycore is a non profit that.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes.

[Vanessa Diaz]

You upload like these stories that eventually go into like the Library of Congress.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah. Like a big oral history project. Essentially.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Essentially. Yeah. Oh, the Connection Keeper bundle is what you can go get. Maybe it cost $20. I. I have don't have that portion of this in front of me, but. So you do that. And the idea is that you put this screen free device down while you slurp on your noodles and you tell stories and then someone gets them. That's cute. Sure.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Do you think one person will do this while eating Prego? Is there one? Cuz there's like this ad. There's this ad campaign for Miller Light, I think I'll bet you a Miller Light that I'll beat you at pickleball. And I was telling my. My brother and I were sitting around watching sports. I was like, do you think one person is going to bet each other a Miller?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Like somebody will for funsies. I got to tell you, in the long line of the canned pasta sauces that I try to like make my own these days, but if there's one, I'm probably not reaching for. So sorry to the good people at Prego Story Bundle or dessert pasta sauce. My dad like hates this sauce so bad. He says it reminds him of the spaghetti they used to give him in the Marine Corps. That was like too sweet. And I'm like, yeah, that's all I think of. It's just sweet. So sweet concept. No, but let's talk about the most ridiculous.

[Jeff O'Neill]

The most ridiculous. And we've had this in our back pocket for a while because this is not a new collaboration. But speaking of Jennifer, she's banned but also teaming up with Hellman's Mayonnaise. And I'm going to pause there just to let the reader try to guess. If you haven't heard of this, do you have any idea. Jennifer L. Armad, who writes Romance is and now sort of a Roman, has moved into Romantasy a little bit. I think the Mayo brand. Your time's up. Has created a one of a kind garlic aioli inspired by the author's latest release, the Primal of Blood and Bone. There's a disclaimer because I think it's about vampires.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Is that what it's ultimately about? I think I've forgotten this.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So again, garlic aioli.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Ooh, I do like a garlic.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do as well. But that made me laugh. I did want to bring up that somebody actually tried to do this a while ago. This was like 2024, I think that Walmart introduced like that list of like, hot sauces for romance books.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah, that's right. Like spice levels.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

So somebody tried this on the show.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah. And then it just didn't maybe take off in the way. So now we've got all kinds of other versions. So it's not exactly a new idea. But yeah, I just. I personally would for, like. Yeah. Just love to sit on one of these board meetings. Everyone's like, what are we gonna do, guys?

[Jeff O'Neill]

And what do they tell themselves after the fact? I mean.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Crushed it, I guess.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Here's a problem. We just gave a bunch of free ads to Crystalite Almonds. Garlic aioli, I guess is what they. They're trying to do.

[Vanessa Diaz]

It's working, really.

[Jeff O'Neill]

These are for TikTok. That's my understanding. Like, this is supposed to appear on social videos. People go and buy those instead of their cups or whatever they're gonna buy. Go forth. It's lucky. Were you sitting down when you saw this? Did you know this was happening? Next news story.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I almost passed out. I say that half jokingly, but so initially. And the reason Jeff is saying that is because my news is that the practical witch. Practical witch. She. Look at me. Practical Magic 2 trailer is out. And I first got the teaser. That was nothing because Rebecca was like, oh, The Practical Magic 2 trailer's up. But it's because it had gotten announced at Cinemacon. So those people saw it, but the

[Jeff O'Neill]

rest of us didn't.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So I went on, you know, to search for it forever and didn't find it because it wasn't out to the public, but it now is. This movies and book are just giant favorites of mine. And I'M what it.

[Jeff O'Neill]

So, okay, let's do a confidence index here. You like the first movie. I assume you like the book.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do.

[Jeff O'Neill]

You see this trailer? Are. Do you feel like you, Vanessa Diaz, are going to enjoy this?

[Vanessa Diaz]

Oh, I have booked a plane ticket to go see it with a member of the staff.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Wow.

[Vanessa Diaz]

For a reason. Yeah. But, yeah, it looks like it. So do you know anything about where this takes place in the timeline of like, the Practical.

[Jeff O'Neill]

No. I saw the original movie, I think, kind of when it came outish, when

[Vanessa Diaz]

it wasn't even like really that liked at the time. It's become kind of a cult classic

[Jeff O'Neill]

film, like literal occult classic, literally.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So that book and movie came out in the 90s and then the next book in the. Because no one, I don't think knew there was going to be more practical magic books.

[Jeff O'Neill]

But it's not a series. Right. It's like Alice Hoffman, who writes these commercial literary things. It wasn't like a cliffhanger or something,

[Vanessa Diaz]

but a lot of readers apparently over the years have apparently been like, so what happened to their stories? Kind of thing. And so 20, 22 years, I think after the publication of Practical Magic came the second book. But it has nothing to do with this, this film. Like the books, there are four in total and they don't go in that order. So, like, if you go out and read Rules of Magic because you're like, oh, this is going to prepare me for this book, that's actually not the case. Rules of Magic is.

[Jeff O'Neill]

So is this movie based on a book?

[Vanessa Diaz]

It is, but it's the fourth book, which is why I wanted to bring that up. If you do want to, like, go do that. It's the one that's called the Book of Magic, I think. Yeah, it's Rules of Magic, Magic Lessons, Book of Magic. And this is the one that the film is based on, which does still have what folks will recognize as Sandra Bullock and Nicole Kidman as the two sisters. But it also has the aunts who are played by the iconic stalker Channing and Diane Wiest. They are replacing their roles. But it's about Sandra Bullock's character's daughters as well. So you've got Maisie Williams playing one of them and Joey King playing the other.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Arya Stark herself. I don't think I've seen anything.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Me neither. At Arya Stark, if I remember the character she plays like a doctor. Like she's a full blown, like, you know, she's out of grass. I'm like, but it's Aria. It's little Baby Aria. But she's.

[Jeff O'Neill]

She's going to be young forever. Those people that gets that. What do you think impractical magic would be like? You can warm up your coffee by like one degree. Just like does no good.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Probably. Yeah. It's like just little insignificant like. Oh great. Because practical magic is of course like doing.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I can change my eye color a slightly different shade of blue, but it's temporary, it's impractical. You know, something like that. Well, I'm so excited for you. I hope you have a great time to.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Thank you.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Looking at over there, Shawna Tosi, who had a seat.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Pardon me.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I learned that that's one of those. I have to. I'm not gonna. It's gonna take me a while. Who himself is a reader. I think I linked in today in book that he himself is a. Is a serious reader. Is smartly jumping on the Dr. Abbott fan train himself and he's going to be voicing some erotica on the Quinn app. I hope you got the bag, Vanessa. I hope this is gonna matter.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So too. This has been like. They've been on a roll. I don't know how much you know about the Quinn app, but it's.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I don't know. Nothing.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah. So it's an audio erotica app like they do and erotica is maybe just it. Like it's. It's just sexy stories and it seems a little bit of a fan made or. I think they have actual creators they work with, but it's very, you know. Etc and. But they've been on a kick and it's. It's been working to get a bunch of celebrity voices on it. They most recently got the stars of heated rivalry. Is it Connor story? I forget the other guy's name right now. Hudson Williams. They got Andrew Scott, hot priest of, you know, fleabag fame. The Thomas Dougherty. I don't know if you're a person who watched paradise, but the guy who played the son. Oh, fantastic show. I feel like you would like that Jesse Williams. That may be the one to get me. I don't know. But yeah. So now they've got. Apparently he is their most requested of all time person to come narrate sexy stories. Because the pit just really like took off and his specific character has a very, very fervent following online. So yeah, they essentially were like, can you come do this? And he was like, yeah, absolutely, why not? And the story is called yes, Chef.

[Jeff O'Neill]

It looks like it's a series. So the episode one is out now. The first series is 28 minutes. Grant Riley, voiced by Sean Hadassi, meets his match in Iris Adams, the rising culinary star brought in to take his restaurant from classic to relevant. Episode one is live. Now. They have a play count which is take with a grain of salt, but it says266,000 plays of episode one of right now. Is this paid? Is it ads? Do you know?

[Vanessa Diaz]

I actually don't know about the ads. No, I want to say it might be paid. You know, I should know more about this, but I don't. I just know that when I went on there people were clamoring. It's like, oh yeah, okay, cool.

[Jeff O'Neill]

So if that's something you're into, go forth and enjoy that. At the same time. Thinking of things that we've enjoyed recently, it's time for frontlist for you brought to you by thriftbooks.com where you can find more than 19 million new and used books, including everything we're probably ever going to talk about because they carry the new and old and maybe some additions that you can't get anywhere else. Free shipping on orders in the US of over 15 bucks and each purchase gets you closer to a free book reward through the reading rewards program. Thanks to Thriftbooks.com for spotting fruitless foyer. I saw a familiar title on your list here, Vanessa. Are you a PRK guy? Did Rebecca and I convince you?

[Vanessa Diaz]

How did you Hot take or not hot take? Breaking news. I'm going to see a sold out event of his tonight. Like I'm going to show my computer. Well, not really. It's several hours from now but I'm going and I cannot wait. Yes, I read his. Not his first book, it's actually his like third or fourth I think. But the big book say nothing.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Later than like a whole year I think after it was published. But like absolutely devoured it. I've told this story now a few times. I did that one on audio which is fantastic. It's a story that or not story. It's you know, investigative reporting into the troubles in Ireland. Fantastic work of non fiction. But because I just tend to assume authors narrate their own work on audio. I thought he read that. And so I was like, this is a lovely Irish gentleman. And then I start listening to my actual pick for frontless boy which is London Falling. My Redding Patrick Radden Keefe just came out and this American voice comes out of my, you know, phone. I'm like, that's weird that they got someone non Irish to read this. You know, whatever. Nope, Nope. Patrick Radkeep is an American journalist. Great one in his own right. But do you know what this one's about? Have you like pictures?

[Jeff O'Neill]

I read this.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Oh, you've read it.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Rebecca and I have talked about it.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Oh, that's right, you did.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I'm sorry, I forgot. That's what I was saying. If you.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I thought you meant say.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Nothing led you to.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yes, no, you. Absolutely.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I've read them before. Both.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah, yeah, this one's fantastic. It's, you know, story of a. A family in London and you know from the beginning that their young son died and you're not entirely sure why. And it turns out that this is a story that was told to him kind of at a party. Like he was hanging out with friends and somebody was like, hey, there's this suspicious death that you should look into. Looks like it's got some weird ramifications. And he starts looking into it and finds out that this kid was leading the mother of all double lives. Again, y' all have talked about it, so I won't go on too much more. But that involving like Russian mafia and big money and just woo, like wealth disparity, it can really get to people and the, you know, hustle, culture etc. So anyway, it's. It's fantastic. It's everything we've come to know from Patrick Rattencute and I loved it. So that's my.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I'm trying to think of one group I'd be interested in prevaricating my identity to less than expatriate Russian oligarchs.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah, that's a. It's a hefty one.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And that high risk, high reward I guess is the way of thinking about that.

[Vanessa Diaz]

So good though. So, so good.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I don't know. Yeah, it's terrific. I did on audio as well. On my side, the aforementioned middlemen by Laura McGrath I took down this week. I read it in one sitting. I'm not ashamed to say I would be telling all the anecdotes that from it that I could if I didn't want to protect the whatever book sales I would be cannibalizing from the good doctor over there. I recommend that on audio this week we're getting a flood of America 250th stuff coming out. This one I actually don't know if this is. Yes, I believe it's out. This land is your land by Beverly Gage. She's a historian and she went on a series of road trips to American historical sites and wrote about them sort of in a more not an academic way, but a more of a enthusiast way. She's interested in these places. I thought it was cool. I really liked it. The thing I realized I was the itch I'm trying to scratch, I think is hard is Beverly Gage is too normal. Weirdly normal from what I'm looking for. Like, she's a nerd. She's like a nerd nerd. And she's a historian. She cares about, like, you know, what's on the path on the. As you're from the parking lot to Colonial Williamsburg. But I am really looking for Sarah Vowell or Bill Bryson or David Sedaris or, like, just someone who's odd, who sees things from an odder perspective. Like, Beverly Gage is too normal for what I'm looking for.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Like, you are talented, but.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yes. And you know a lot, and I learned a lot, and I'm glad I read it.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

But I realized at the end is, like, I want a weirdo. I want. I don't. I don't want a stunt memoir necessarily, because this is also kind of a stunt. I don't need, like, the AJ Jacobs style, though. I would enjoy that. But I want someone who's like, you know, they're gonna eat all the bad food at the roadside attractions at these places, or they're gonna go the 13 weirdest places on the National Historic Register, or the 13 least visited places.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Like, I just want, like, Bourdain and Bryson and, like, one other person.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah, maybe. But I just found myself wanting more, I don't know, of a writerly kind of. And she's a good writer. I'm trying not to denigrate it because it's good. I think it'll be great for a lot of people. But it was missing that, like, ingredient that would move it from a B plus kind of, which is a good grade. Absolutely, to an A or an A minus. But that's this land is your land by Beverly Gage. So if you know something like that, shoot me an email podcast, bookriot.com that come. What happened to Sarah Val's books? What is she doing now? Did you do the Cyril Val Experience? Did you like to do those?

[Narrator/Storyteller]

Yeah.

[Jeff O'Neill]

You did Assassination Vacation. That's there. That's the one. I guess that immediately came to mind. I miss her.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Me too.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Wherefore out there, Sarah Val? I don't know the answer to that.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Please come back.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I was reading a profile of David's Darius because apparently he has a new collection coming out soon in which he includes his longtime partner, which I Didn't really know he's. He's not written about him, but he gets to be a character included in this book. So I'm very much looking forward to the new David Sedaris. I read all of them and I forget the specific ones, but I remember the specific stories such as this.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Oh, my gosh. I was just telling somebody about that story from Calypso where he talks about wearing, like the oversized T shirt, like at a Paris, like, dressing room or something. And I can't even recall the fineries of it, but I know I like Snort laughed milk, the one.

[Jeff O'Neill]

And. And I think I have it bookmarked, the YouTube reading of him doing the one about the stadium, which is a boy. I don't know how to do this carefully. It is a bag that you wear on your leg that's attached. I think it only works for guys. I don't know how the mechanics would work for the ladies, but you put something on your situation penis and a tube goes down to a bag attached to your leg. And it's overtly for going to a sporting event so that you don't have to go to the bathroom. But he just wears it on the plane. He wears it at a book signing. And I just. How if I. If I give myself like six months between listening, like, my tank literally refills, I guess here and I'm ready to laugh about it again. But my family and I will, on a hard day, will listen to David Sedaris reading stadium pallets.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Unbelievably, such a weirdo. The idea that I could have around the time he wrote, I think it was maybe Calypso. I have. I was on like a sojourn in like, the English countryside. And the idea that I could have, if I had just been a few towns over on a lovely morning, just seen him say, well, I wouldn't have believed it was him. I would have been like, there's a little weirdo using one of those little tools picking up trash on the side of the road. That surely is not David Sed. It would have been.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Yeah. I don't know how you'd approach him. That doesn't put you in serious jeopardy of being a character in one of his stories. Because that's not what I'm looking for.

[Vanessa Diaz]

No, no, I'm good. I'm good.

[Jeff O'Neill]

But anyway, so that's what I'm looking at. David Sedaris's American History road trip. That is. That's what I'm really. I've got a Jones for. I've Got a taste for that flavor, but I don't know where to get. But this land is really quite good, I guess, for as a Father's Day, Mother's Day. If you've got a history fan in your extended family, it would be very, like, recommendable in that way because maybe they don't want Stadium Pal at Mount Rushmore, which I absolutely want, like right now, as I said. Please, something I really need. Our letter writing happen. Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. That's out there there. I guess that's really James. Did we say that James, isn't it? Yeah, we did say that's in the feed now. Coming up. You know, it's almost time for. It's almost time for summer draft, I think that is coming. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Yes, that'll be coming. March. Excuse me. May 1st in the Patreon feed. If you haven't had a chance to listen or you're interested in Rebecca and I book clubbed transcription by Ben Lerner, I will spoil nothing about it, except I will be shocked if it's not amongst my favorite books of the year. But that's also the kind of guy I am. We also will begin. Laura and I were just talking about it. It'll be time for our Fantasy League draft in mid May over on the Patreon. At the same time, we're going to be book clubbing Jesmyn Ward's new book on Witness and Respair, which I do not deign to tell Jesmyn Ward how to do anything, but I think that Respair would be a candidate for what we were just talking about in the Roald Dahlia. Can we just call it repair, please?

[Vanessa Diaz]

I don't know if you know about my most commonly flubbed word ever. I say resply all the time and it's because I'm saying repair and reply and like. Or like respond to reply and spare is going to mess with me.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Like, I'm never going to get that right. Nope, I'm never going to get it right.

[Vanessa Diaz]

But it's just word. So, like, what am I?

[Jeff O'Neill]

The word I cannot spell. That's what I thought you were going. The one I cannot get my hands around is inconvenient. I've tried mnemonics.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Mine's really.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I'm around the bend where even the right way I think might be wrong, because I know I spell it wrong. There's no way I do monic.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I do a dance when I spell rhythm. Yeah. I'm like, R, H, Y, T, H, Y. And even then I'm like, no, that doesn't look right. It still doesn't.

[Jeff O'Neill]

That's a real rhythm, is a very good one. My son trying to write about the word rhythm and it's sort of like banana. It just kept going. You didn't have any idea where.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Mn mn mn Y M H M

[Jeff O'Neill]

r. It's like it just looks.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Oh, sweet names.

[Jeff O'Neill]

That's. That's very tough there. Vanessa, thank you for joining me today. That's our show. You can find the show notesbookright.com listen shoot us an email podcastookriot.com you can find the [e-mail] book riot podcast next week. Yeah, next time Rebecca and I are talking, we're recording new release draft summer new releases it books of May, Mom's dad, the summertime, the heat. It's this kind of peak br Pod coming up here pretty quick. It's going to be a lot of good stuff coming up. Vanessa, thank you as always. I'll talk to you later. Enjoy. Enjoy. PK or well, last thing I saw. That was cool. I was gonna tell the listeners about though. It's sold out at my local Baghdad here over on Hawthorne. Don't be creepy. Chuck Palaniak is doing a pre screening talk of Fight Club because I think it's the third anniversary or something and it's all sold out, so I missed the tickets.

[Vanessa Diaz]

Have you been to one of his events before?

[Jeff O'Neill]

No. I know the people at palace tell me they sell out in the raucous and they're hilarious.

[Vanessa Diaz]

I have been to one. It was a pajama party. It got real weird.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I was gonna say, I don't think you expect a normal time when you go to a Czech polania, so that's cool to see over there. All right, Vanessa, thank you so much. A pleasure as always.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Thanks so much for listening today. We hope you'll enjoy this excerpt from the audiobook edition of Our Perfect Storm by Carly Fortune, read by A.J. burdell and Jack Copland, thanks to sponsors at Penguin Random House Audio.

[Narrator/Storyteller]

I met George St. James the day my mom vanished. The night before, I fell asleep the same way I always did, wishing for something extraordinary to happen. At eight years old, I was certain of one thing. I was destined for great adventures. In the morning, a heavy spring rain attacked the last of the snow, liberating purple and white crocus blossoms from their icy beds. My older brothers and I knelt by the window, watching tire grooves fill with heaven sent tears. Mom's station wagon was missing. Our dad barely spoke when we roused him, but as he sipped his first cup of coffee, he told us our mother had gone home. Only Darwin, who was 12, seemed to understand what that meant. Moby was 10, and I could tell he was as confused as me. This was our house. Wasn't this home? Dad couldn't say how long mom would be gone, but he assured us she'd come back, and we had no choice but to believe him. As soon as the rain tapered to a drizzle, we were kicked outside. Without mom to patiently comb out the tangles, my hair was a ratty mass. I was still wearing my nightgown, but Darwin made sure I put on my rubber boots and yellow raincoat. Moby fetched the basketball. I wanted to play, but my brothers wouldn't pass to me. They never passed to me. I yelled and stomped in puddles, but they kept chucking the ball over my head. Fed up, I grabbed the green butterfly net from the mudroom and set about trying to capture a creature in the thicket at the edge of the field. A worm, a grasshopper, maybe even a frog. Instead, I found something far more exciting. A pale brown rabbit sitting in the fresh blades of grass. It had long, velvety ears and a twitching pink nose. I was going to catch it, and oh, how jealous Darwin and Moby would be. But patience had always eluded me. I charged after the rabbit, twigs cracking beneath my feet, and off it went, bounding across the field. I chased it all the way to the cedar hedge that bordered the neighboring property. The rabbit didn't know what I did. The woman who lived in the big house next door was a witch, and witches had all sorts of uses for rabbits. I had to save it. I followed the dense wall of evergreen to a gap wide enough to slip through. I peered through the branches and gasped when I saw a pair of dark blue eyes squinting at me from the other side. I'd never seen the boy before. He was winter pale, with round, rosy cheeks and dark eyelashes. His hair was buzzed, short freckles dotted his little nose, and he was the same height as me. He was nothing to be afraid of. Hello. I'm Francesca. I stuck out my palm like dad taught me. But you can call me Frankie. The boy blinked, and I wondered if he might run away. But then his hand shot out suddenly, and he took mine in his.

[Jeff O'Neill]

I'm George.

[Narrator/Storyteller]

Hands on hips, I gave him a thorough inspection. He had no rubber boots, no raincoat, and his pants had a hole in the knee. All he had to keep him warm was a hooded sweatshirt with a stain on the sleeve. Were you watching me? I asked.

[Jeff O'Neill]

No.

[Narrator/Storyteller]

He blushed.

[Jeff O'Neill]

Well, not for long.

[Narrator/Storyteller]

What are you doing over there? The big house was no place for a boy, especially one as soft looking as George. He'd need defending, maybe even rescuing. My toes curled at the thrill of it. I live here now, he said, sounding resigned. I gaped at him. You live there? I pointed at the imposing stone house behind him. With the witch?

[Jeff O'Neill]

She's not a witch. She's my grandmother.

[Narrator/Storyteller]

I hate to tell you this, George, I said, relishing the moment, but your grandmother is definitely a witch.