Tell-Alls, Tea and Twin Flames with Chelsea Devantez & Jeff Hiller

Summary

Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club

“Tell-Alls, Tea and Twin Flames with Chelsea Devantez & Jeff Hiller”

Date: August 19, 2025
Host: Danielle Robay
Guests: Chelsea Devantez (writer, comedian, host of Glamorous Trash), Jeff Hiller (actor, comedian, Emmy nominee)

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Episode Overview

This lively episode delves deep into the world of celebrity memoirs, unpacking why they matter, what sets great ones apart, and the secrets, revelations, and ripple effects they generate for both readers and writers. Host Danielle Robay kiki’s with self-professed celebrity memoir superfans (and recent memoirists themselves), Chelsea Devantez and Jeff Hiller, as they explore genre tropes, memorable “tell-alls,” what makes a life story worth reading, and how telling your own story can be life-changing. Expect a balance of humor, personal reflection, and sharp cultural commentary.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Magic (and Misunderstanding) of Celebrity Memoirs

• Danielle opens on the underestimated value of celebrity memoirs, referencing a formative Will Smith quote: “There were two keys to life, running and reading... Every answer is in a book.” (03:23)
• Both guests argue for the genre’s underappreciated substance, especially regarding women’s experiences.

Why Are Celebrity Memoirs Powerful?

• Chelsea: They’re packed with honest, often dark stories women face behind the scenes, countering the notion that celebrity lives are all glamour. “To realize that all the body shaming Delta Burke went through ... I was thinking it was just happening to us regular degulars.” (09:42)
• Jeff: Reads them for hope as an actor facing setbacks: “There is something about reading an actor's memoir where you're like, where'd you get the part where you can get a book deal? ... it gives me inspiration.” (08:17)

Why Are They Dismissed?

• Chelsea: Sees their dismissal as intentional: “Anytime something comes specifically feminine, it immediately must be trashed so that its power is removed.” (10:20)

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2. What Makes a Great Celebrity Memoir?

Chelsea’s “Booktol Test” (11:25):

1. The author is vulnerable and honest.
2. The book is entertaining—“I ain't here to read a boring book.”
3. The story elevates your life in some way: “If I don’t walk away with something, why did you write it?”

The Bechdel Test Reference

Chelsea defines it for context: “Are there two women... do they talk to each other... was it about anything other than a man?” (12:27)

When’s the Best Time to Write a Memoir?

• Jeff: No set age—just “Do you have a story to tell?” and are you being authentic? (13:21)
• Chelsea: Praises young memoirists like Madison Beer for capturing the immediacy of experience: “If she had waited to write this, I bet some of these stories wouldn't have made it in.” (13:48)

Multiple Memoirs: How Many Are Too Many?

• Chelsea: “Tori Spelling... but I want to tell you, Shirley MacLaine has 17.” (14:26)

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3. Pitfalls and Tropes of the Genre

Common Pitfalls

• Jeff: “Sometimes people can be too interested in themselves, a little too navel-gazy... if you can't explain why it's powerful and meaningful to you, it just feels a little self-indulgent.” (16:12)
• Chelsea: Lack of conclusion or “thesis”: “You get to the end and you're just robbed ... there is no ending.” (16:43)
• Also, “The worst pitfall... they introduce a new love interest in the last few chapters, and you're like, they're in your memoir forever.” (17:19)

Beloved Tropes (and Trope-Tracking)

• “Psychic moments” are everywhere—guests joke about women being more open to the “woo.” (18:13)
• Chelsea: “…at some point they tell you their exact weight. And sometimes it happens a lot.” (18:27)
• Jeff: Highlights patriarchal themes: “The misogyny of our world is that... that is where you hold value and how your body can appear to men, right?” (18:50)
• Chelsea: Praises Demi Moore’s vulnerability: “All of my journals are just talking about how much I weigh... I thought that was vulnerable.” (19:07)

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4. Fun Segment: “What Have You Bookmarked?”

• Chelsea: A chicken Caesar smash taco recipe—“that I will never make but really wanted to eat.” (20:53)
• Jeff: Fun ties for his Emmys outfit—“I'm trying to find something to wear to the Emmys. So I'm looking at fun, weird gay clothing.” (19:55)

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5. The Best (and Messiest) Memoir Moments

Favorite Reveals

• Jeff: “Brooke Shields said that Liam Neeson proposed to her and then said, I'll be right back, I have to go on this trip to LA, and then he never spoke to her again.” (24:50)
• “Rue McClanahan confesses that she had sex with Robert Guillaume, who played Benson.” (25:22)
• Chelsea: “Celine Dion... lost her virginity the night that she won Eurovision...to her manager, who signed her when she was 12 years old. So it's dark.” (25:31)

Messy versus Not-Messy Enough

• Too messy? “No such thing. What a gift.” (26:07)
• Not messy enough: Tina Knowles and Linda Ronstadt, for omitting fascinating details.
  • Jeff: “She doesn't even talk about her... she says something about her kids and I was like, that's the only information we’re getting?” (26:17)

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6. Mount Rushmore of Celebrity Memoirs (Game)

Collaborative picks, with a rule—everyone gets one veto:

• Jane Fonda – My Life So Far (suggested as foundational and formative) (27:06)
• Tina Fey – Bossypants (created a sub-genre and inspired a wave of comedic memoirs) (27:33)
  • Jeff: “She is the reason every publishing house has to find their comedian who's going to save their life through essays…” (27:39)
• Ronnie Spector’s memoir (about her marriage to Phil Spector, escape, and resilience—the Zendaya-starring film highlights its importance) (28:22)
• Jessica Simpson – Open Book (credited with reviving the whole genre in 2020; admired for raw honesty; “I think there must be something cosmic keeping the book from you until the time is right.” – Chelsea, about Danielle’s struggle to finish it) (30:31 to 31:32)
• “Mommie Dearest” by Christina Crawford (genre-defining “tell-all”; possibly the top pick in the end) (32:26)

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7. Writing Their Own Memoirs – Author Experiences

• Jeff: Found self-compassion in processing childhood bullying: “I learned a little self compassion for myself.” (33:05)
• Chelsea: New empathy for memoirists; struggled between personal inclusion and narrative clarity. “There were really tiny little things where it's like, I need to talk about this night before I got married...” (33:44)
• The challenge of telling stories involving real people, balancing truth and sensitivity: “If you're not lighting them on fire, you gotta be able to stand there and look them in the eyes... it can make your relationships a lot stronger.” (37:34)

Choosing How Candid to Be

• Chelsea: “I think I went Jessica Simpson and a quarter.” (39:33)
• Jeff: “All I wanted to be was truthful. ... And funny.” (39:52)

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8. The Memoir vs. Celebrity Memoir Debate

• Dismissal (and sexism) revealed: “There's this idea that a book with photos in the middle is less of a book... or like, if it's a celebrity memoir, it's not a real memoir... I just so fully disagree.” – Chelsea (44:33)
• Jeff: The only real difference is marketing, not content or writing: “There's a built in fan base for a celebrity memoir.” (45:46)

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9. Universal Truths from Memoir-Reading

• Jeff: Most people, even the famous, see themselves as outsiders or underdogs. “No one ever is like, I was super popular in high school, everybody loved me.” (46:08)
• Chelsea: “Telling your own story will set you free. ... You will be free after that.” (46:41)
• Empowerment for women: Taking their story back after years of it being filtered by media. “For her to be like, actually I was a size 4 at that time...” (47:28)

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10. Rapid-Fire “Speed Read” Game (50:58)

• Chelsea: Best memoir if you just got dumped? “Gabrielle Union's first memoir.” (51:07)
• Jeff: Just got fired? “Patti LuPone, A Memoir.” (51:12)
• Best coming-of-age/influential reads:
  • Chelsea: “Delta Burke’s memoir, Delta Style... such a big handhold [as a teen].” (52:21)
  • Jeff: Cites Paul Monette’s Becoming a Man and A Place at the Table by Mel White: “...helped me come out.” (52:40)

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11. Wisdom from Older Women

• Danielle: Memoirs allow readers to learn from women in their 70s, 80s, or 90s, a unique literary privilege. (48:44)
• Jeff: Highlights the “wisdom of age,” quoting Cher: “If you're not going to be worried about this in three years, you shouldn't be worried about it now.” (49:21)
• Recommends Lee Grant’s and Janice Ian’s memoirs for their lyricism and vulnerability. (50:28)

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Notable Quotes

• Chelsea Devantez:
  • “I came to realize it was this genre that has all the deepest, darkest details... especially a woman's journey in life.” (09:42)
  • “Anytime something comes specifically feminine, it immediately must be trashed so that its power is removed.” (10:20)
  • “There is something in that book you don't want to face.” (30:31, on Jessica Simpson’s memoir)
  • “Telling your own story will set you free.” (46:41)
• Jeff Hiller:
  • “I want to feel like you're being authentic... Every once in a while, you can sniff someone trying to pretend to be vulnerable.” (13:21)
  • “I learned a little self compassion for myself.” (33:05)
  • “Most people see themselves as outsiders ... that's the universal truth. I guess we don't all have it together.” (46:08)
• Danielle Robay:
  • “Memoirs let you learn about women in their 70s, 80s, 90s—something you hardly ever get to do in daily life.” (48:44)

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Timestamps of Key Moments

• [03:23] Danielle’s Will Smith reading/running reference and intro to the episode's focus
• [05:55] Chelsea and Jeff banter about being “twin flames”—brunch, karaoke favorites, shared life purposes
• [08:17] Why memoirs matter to Jeff as an actor
• [11:25] Chelsea's “booktol test” for great memoirs
• [14:26] How many memoirs is too many? Tori Spelling/Shirley MacLaine
• [16:12] Memoir pitfalls—navel-gazing and lack of story arc
• [18:27] Memoir tropes: “telling your exact weight”
• [24:50] Favorite revelations—Brooke Shields and Liam Neeson; Celine Dion’s first time
• [27:06] Mount Rushmore game: Jane Fonda, Tina Fey, Ronnie Spector, Jessica Simpson, Mommie Dearest
• [33:05] Jeff and Chelsea on writing their own memoirs
• [44:33] Celebrity memoir vs. memoir debate
• [46:08] Universal truths from hundreds of memoirs
• [50:58] Speed read/rapid fire segment

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Final Thoughts & Takeaways

• Celebrity memoirs are often dismissed due to gendered biases, but, as the guests illustrate, they deliver powerful life lessons, raw honesty, and a sense of collective experience.
• The best memoirs balance vulnerability, entertainment, and insight, whether the author is a superstar or “not famous.”
• Both Chelsea and Jeff advocate for courage and compassion—whether writing your own memoir or reading others’—reminding listeners that storytelling (especially women telling their own stories) is inherently liberating.

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For Newcomers

This episode is a goldmine for anyone fascinated by pop culture, literary trends, or the mechanics of memoir writing—packed with behind-the-scenes dish, heartfelt testimony, and practical wisdom. Expect candid humor, cultural analysis, and a ride through the celebrity memoir hall of fame (and infamy).

Transcript

[Danielle Robaix]

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[Danielle Robaix]

Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club is presented by Apple Book. Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club. I'm your host, Danielle Robaix, and this week we're having a little. Kiki. Do you think everybody has a book in them?

[Chelsea Devontes]

No. Because I've read some of them and I said this shouldn't have been a book. Sheena Shay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, I feel like everybody probably does have a book in them. But are people willing to to put the thing out there? I don't know.

[Danielle Robaix]

Now, before I introduce you to our pop culture savants, I have a little story. It'll be quick, I promise. So picture this. It's 2010. I'm wearing a choker necklace and Uggs, you know, the kind with the fur on the outside. And I'm obsessed with watching award show speeches on YouTube. There was this one speech in particular that struck me. It was Will Smith at the Teen Choice Awards. And he said something that I've never forgotten. He said there were two keys to life, running and reading. And since 2010, I found that to be so true. Every answer is in a book. And for me and for our guest today, we found a lot of those answers in celebrity memoirs. Now, if you're thinking, Danielle, this is silly. What am I going to learn from Joan Rivers or Joan Collins that pertains to my life? This episode might just change your mind. Today I've brought in two experts in the field. My friend Chelsea Devontes is a writer, comedian, and host of the podcast Glamorous Trash, where she recaps celebrity memoirs with the same enthusiasm that people recap Real Housewives. She is brilliant, hilarious, and a true scholar of the genre. Joining her is Jeff Hiller, a writer, comedian, actor and brand new Emmy nominee for his role in Somebody Somewhere. He's also a devoted, like truly devoted celebrity memoir reader with the kind of sharp wit and big hearted perspective that makes every conversation brighter. And here's the plot twist. Both of them published their own memoirs over the last year. So yes, they are celebrity memoir superfans and authors themselves. Today's show is all about celebrity memoirs and what we can learn from them. Trust me, you are in the right place. And usually I say it's time to turn the page, but today I think we gotta roll out the Red carpet for Chelsea Devontes and Jeff Hiller. Chelsea, Jeff, welcome to the club.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I'm so happy to be in the club. You know, I don't get to the club these days very often, so if it's through a podcast, it's probably the only way I'm going clubbing.

[Jeff Hiller]

Me too.

[Danielle Robaix]

It's the only club I can be a part of.

[Jeff Hiller]

I could be in the club before.

[Danielle Robaix]

6:00Pm so, Jeff, you were recently on Chelsea's podcast, and the two of you self identified as twin Flames.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Well, I would say it was more something I thrust upon Jeff and forced him to accept. And then I also invited him to join the Twin Flames cult I've heard about, but he hasn't responded.

[Danielle Robaix]

I will. I haven't been aware of the cult, but I do know what a twin flame is, and I think twins sort of have some esp. So I want to test your connection. The first question is, what does your twin flame order for brunch?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Okay. I know from Jeff's book that he likes avocado, but it also made him sick, so maybe he's not going for an avocado filled brunch. I'm gonna go with Belgian waffles with a side of eggs and a side of hash browns.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's actually kind of true. I do like to have a protein, and then I like to have a little sweet something. Yeah, that's really true.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, a little combo.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Okay, so she wasn't so off.

[Jeff Hiller]

No, not at all. I'm gonna go Eggs Florentine.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, my gosh, Jeff, thank you for the fanciness. Unfortunately, the income bracket I grew up in does not allow me to know what Florentine is, but I would say I would order eggs, so we're half there.

[Jeff Hiller]

Okay.

[Danielle Robaix]

I'm gonna move on to something we know a little bit better, which is music. What song does your twin flame kill at? Karaoke?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Mm, I'm gonna guess I can't make you love me by Bonnie Raitt.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, what a banger that is. But my go to is not your go to. No, my go to is yous oughta know by Alanis Morissette.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Shut up. That is my number one listen to song this week. Yes.

[Danielle Robaix]

Anyways, what do you think that your twin flame is here on earth to do?

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think it is to make other people feel seen and treasured.

[Jeff Hiller]

I was kind of gonna say the same thing. I think it's about creating a space where you feel safe to tell the.

[Danielle Robaix]

Truth, in a funny way.

[Jeff Hiller]

In a funny way? Yeah. Well, sure.

[Danielle Robaix]

Yeah, I have to add the funny.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I love that.

[Danielle Robaix]

Well, you're both here because you are voracious readers and true connoisseurs of celebrity memoirs.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And.

[Danielle Robaix]

And out of all the literary genres out there, what is it about celebrity memoirs that had such a big impact on you? Jeff, I'd love to hear yours first.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I am an actor, and I tried to be an actor for a good couple decades before I had any sort of success. And so I really found a lot of hope in celebrity memoir. I think in memoir, just in general, I love hearing people's stories. I love listening to people. I love meeting people, getting to know them and stuff. But there is something about reading an actor's memoir where you're like, where'd you get the part where you can get a book deal? And I find that very thrilling and also hopeful. Yeah. Gives me a little inspiration.

[Danielle Robaix]

Definitely.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I totally agree with that. I mean, Carol Burnett's memoir talks about how she got an agent. Jeff is nodding because, you know the story. She talks about how she got an agent. And I, with one of my best friends, Ashley, was like, this is how Carol Burnett did it. This is how we're gonna get agents. And so I learned a lot of tips and tricks, was always looking in the nooks and crannies for, like, how to survive. And then I think what surprised me is how much darkness is in celebrity memoirs. And I say that as a compliment. As someone who has lived a dark life, you sort of celebrity memoirs were thought of as, like, these trashy, throwaway books. Right? But in every story of our most popular, most successful woman succeeding, there's so much insanity she goes through. And I was thinking it was just happening to us regular degulars. And to realize that, like, all the body shaming Delta Burke went through or, you know, all of the horrors that happened to Jane Fondo for standing up for, like, what she believed in, or like all of the horrible bosses they had to survive. Ashley Judd, you know, just to get a role. And so, to me, I came to realize it was this genre that has all the deepest, darkest details of a human, especially a woman's journey in life. And they were the books that were talking most honestly about this thing that society was trying to throw away or tell us not to talk about.

[Danielle Robaix]

Why do you think they get written off as frivolous?

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think it's absolutely on purpose. I think they wanted us to ignore how powerful these books are. And I think anytime something comes specifically feminine, it immediately must be trashed. So that its power is removed. Because when something is extremely feminine, it's Taylor Swift bringing back the economy with a tour. It's Beyonce bringing back it with a tour. It's the Barbie movie. It's like, it's the romance genre as something we read in literature. It's all of these things that have so much power, and so they try and culturally downplay them so that the feminine cannot take over. That's how I feel.

[Danielle Robaix]

Interesting.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is true.

[Danielle Robaix]

Well, Chelsea, on your podcast, you talk about one memoir a week, basically. And we met because I was a fan.

[Chelsea Devontes]

You're also on the podcast Hot Plug.

[Danielle Robaix]

True. But it started because I was a fan, genuinely. And one of the reasons I was a fan is you break down these memoirs, and you're really honest. You're honest about what makes a good memoir. What makes a memoir that you could kind of pass reading. What do you think is the secret sauce to a great celebrity memoir?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Well, I have questions at the end of my podcast. This little test that I came up with myself, which is why it has the terrible name of the booktol Test. It's my take on the Bechdel test. And I realized that when I love a memoir, it always has three qualities, which is, one, the author was vulnerable in telling the truth. So they didn't just come here to be like, and here's how I did it. And you could too. Or, like, and everything was fine. They really gave something as they told their story. The second question is, was it entertaining to read? Because I ain't here to read a boring book.

[Danielle Robaix]

Right.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And then the third question I ask is, did it elevate your life in some way? Because I also don't care if we're just, like. If it's just, like, gossip and trash. Like, I want to get something every time I devote reading an entire book, even if it's Sheena Shay's memoir, which was little less than 200 pages, big fonts. But it's like, if I'm gonna read a book, I'd like to walk away with something. And if I don't walk away with something, why did you write it?

[Danielle Robaix]

Chelsea, for anybody out there who doesn't know, what's the Bechdel test?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, the Bechdel test is a test that Alison Bechdel, comic artist, came up with. It started as, like, a funny observation that then became this very true test, because so many movies failed the Bechdel test, which is in a movie. Are there two women in the movie? Okay, that's one of the questions Second question. Do they talk to each other? This could also be a TV show. Are there two women? Do they talk to each other? Third thing, was it about anything other than a man? And it's a really sad game to play because a lot of things you love are gonna fail the test.

[Danielle Robaix]

It's shocking. When I was in college, I learned about this, and basically the only thing at that point is the Gilmore Girls was the only thing that passed.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Wow.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, my gosh. And also, gosh, what a great show.

[Danielle Robaix]

Jeff, when is the best time for someone to write a memoir?

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, I don't think that there is necessarily. Like, you have to be over X number years. I think it's just, do you have a story to tell? Because I completely agree with all of Chelsea's points. The only thing I would add is I want to feel like you're being authentic, which I think is kind of what you were saying with being vulnerable. Every once in a while, you can sniff someone trying to, like, I don't know, pretend to be vulnerable. Yes. And I don't like that, but.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, and Madison Beer wrote a memoir at 24, which people were making fun of, and I think it's one of the best because she talks about a lot of horrible things that teenage girls are going through, but she's writing it at 24, and I just thought, like, oh, if she had waited to write this, I bet some of these stories wouldn't have made it in, and they wouldn't feel so present with what it's like to be a teenager and have nude photos of you shared online, and then you become a global superstar. And I just thought that was. I loved that she wrote it so young.

[Danielle Robaix]

That is really well said. How many memoirs do you get? I'm not going to name names, but there's an actress who has, like, five memoirs, and I was thinking to myself, I don't know if you get five.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes. I think you're talking about Tori Spelling, but I want to tell you, Shirley MacLaine has 17. Whoa.

[Danielle Robaix]

17.

[Jeff Hiller]

But aren't a lot of them about, like, this is when I was really into this particular thing. Like, you know, like, I'm. This is when I was in New Mexico and really into crystals, and this is when I was really into past lives. You know, it's kind of like it's a snapshot of her life along the way.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, it's. It's almost as if she, like. Yeah, she journals for three months, and she's like, send it to print. It's perfect.

[Jeff Hiller]

Another Memoir like David Sedaris. You could call his books memoirs. They're really probably more essay collections. But I think, like, he has enough to say, and he's got a lot of books, and I'll read all of them. So I don't know.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I also think when someone writes another memoir, it is a lot like movie sequels, where if it's amazing, you're so nervous that they're doing this second one. And some people know names. Michelle Obama. They wait like eight months, and you're like, that wasn't enough time to memoir again. You know, we went too fast. And so.

[Danielle Robaix]

Because the first one was so good.

[Jeff Hiller]

But then you have like, Cher, and you're like, she's got enough life for a second memoir.

[Chelsea Devontes]

This is what's so funny about Cher. She already had a memoir. And then she was like, announcement, I'm writing my memoir for the first time. And I was like, are we just gonna pretend you don't already have a memoir called My First Time? This is just a fun fact. I don't know why it's in my brain. Her editor for this memoir had to come and live with her for an entire week to get that first memoir out. So I can't even imagine what's going on to get us the second memoir.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's so fun.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is fun.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I mean, just think of Cher tweeting. That's where Cher starts. That's how the transcript comes in. Ugh.

[Danielle Robaix]

I love her. What are some of the pitfalls that you see in celebrity memoirs?

[Jeff Hiller]

I think sometimes people can be too interested in themselves, a little too navel gazy. And you have to realize that just because a story is really powerful and meaningful to you, if you can't explain why it's powerful and meaningful to you, it just feels a little self indulgent.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And.

[Jeff Hiller]

And yes, I'm sure it's fascinating for you that your great grandmother carried a sewing machine across a country, but I don't care. I don't know your great grandma.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I was going to say, I would ask them sort of the thesis of their life or the thesis of their core pain, because I feel like sometimes someone has a lot of, like, stories to tell, and you're like, wow. But then you get to the end and you're just robbed of the literary experience because their life is still going. There is no ending, Right? And so you're just sort of like. And then it's over. And you're like, what? And so I really like an emotional journey in a book, but in order to do that, like Jeff said, you have to know what your life has meant. You have to distill meaning from the events, especially if you're writing it, like, before 70. You know what I mean?

[Ad Read Voice]

I need a little thesis.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Cause we're not gonna have an ending or the worst pitfall. Oh, my gosh. I've started clocking it as a curse, which is that they introduce a new love interest in the last few chapters.

[Danielle Robaix]

Oh, that's the worst.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And you're like, not. Because they're trying to find an ending.

[Ad Read Voice]

Right.

[Chelsea Devontes]

So it's like, and then I met so and so who is always gone by the time the book is published. And you're like, they're in your memoir forever. So I feel like if you don't really know what you're trying to pass on, you are going to end up, like, going on a date and writing them into your final chapter.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's such a good one. Chelsea. I've learned from your podcast that there is always a psychic moment, which you had. And that is sort of like a. I guess we could call it like a trope. Are there any other celebrity memoir tropes that you actually really love?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, my gosh. It's so funny, because I can now I can only think of the ones I hate. But, Jeff, have you also noticed there's so many psychic moments in memoirs, which I think speaks more to, again, people tapped into the feminine. We're open to being, like, maybe a witch knows, right?

[Jeff Hiller]

The woo. We're not afraid to go woo, woo.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. So there's a lot of psychic moments. The one moment that shows up the most across all celebrity memoirs ever. And we have a game we play called Dringo, where I call them. I say dringo, and you drink. Cause it's a bingo. The number one thing that happens in almost every single celebrity memoir is that they, at some point, they tell you their exact weight. And sometimes it happens a lot.

[Jeff Hiller]

The. The misogyny of our world is that. That that is where you hold value and how your body looks and how your body can appear to men, right?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes, exactly. And like. Or like, and then I had no value because this was my way. And it's just like the amount of times.

[Jeff Hiller]

But I love when Demi Moore said in her. In her book, when she said, I don't want to think about how much I weigh anymore. All of my journals are just talking about how much I weigh. And I thought that was. I thought that was vulnerable.

[Danielle Robaix]

And in her memoir, it makes sense, too, because she talks so much about her journey of beauty and now she's a career.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's just objectification.

[Danielle Robaix]

So I love asking our guests what they've bookmarked this week. It can be a weird fact, a fun quote, something you've saved on Instagram, something you've texted your husband or your best friend. What have each of you bookmarked?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Let me go look. Let me go live on the scene to my own Instagram and see what I be bookmarking.

[Jeff Hiller]

I bookmarked fun ties.

[Danielle Robaix]

Because I'm like neckties.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'm trying to find something to wear to the Emmys. So I'm looking at fun, weird gay clothing.

[Danielle Robaix]

Chelsea likes original clothing. She made a very cool dress for her book launch. And so I like this whole original tie idea. Jeff.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yes, Chelsea, we are twin Flames.

[Danielle Robaix]

Thank you.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I've been trying to tell you this. I was trying to let Jeff know.

[Danielle Robaix]

Chels, I think you let him know.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think it finally. It took two podcasts, but we're here. I believe Jeff is a believer now. It's just goddamn. Listen, I get it. He's like, who is this lady stalking me on my book tour? I saved a chicken Caesar smash taco recipe using pita bread that I will never make but really wanted to eat.

[Danielle Robaix]

That doesn't even sound good.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Really? A smash taco with Caesar salad in it.

[Danielle Robaix]

Apple Books is the best place to read, listen to, or discover the books you love without a subscription right on your iPhone. And now there's a very exciting heads up for listeners. Apple Books is the official audiobook and ebook home for Reese's Book Club, so it's easier than ever to explore each monthly book pick, plus author curated collections and more all in one place. Open the Apple Books app to explore a world of books and audiobooks. You can set goals and track your reading progress. Get great recommendations for your next read, or listen and enjoy it all on the go, wherever you are. You can even share your books with up to five family members at no cost. Again, no subscription required. Visit Apple co reeseapplebooks to find out more. That's Apple co reeseapplebooks and read or listen to Reese's current pick and browse past selections today on Apple Books. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton. We spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and with characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands, but also in the world around you, in the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for lazy weekend mornings with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. It's about ease, comfort and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like the books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into our everyday moments. Moments like following four adult daughters as they navigate love, loss and the legacy in the Most Fun We Ever had by Claire Lombardo, all while curled up in soft cotton joggers or sinking into the island of Missing Trees by Elif Shafak. A story that spans generations, Forbidden love and a fig tree that remembers everything, wrapped in a hand stitched quilt, each thread holding its own kind of memory. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton the fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com hey, it's Ryan.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Now through August 26th. It's back to Deals time, where you can enjoy storewide deals and earn four times points. Look for in store tags to earn on eligible items from Lindor, Oreo, Lays, Celsius, Cottonelle and Snapple. Then clip the offer in the app for automatic event long savings. Shop in store or online for easy drive up and go pickup or delivery. Subject to availability restrictions. Apply. Visit Albertsons or Safeway.com for more details.

[Ad Read Voice]

This Labor Day, say goodbye to spills, stains and overpriced furniture with washablesofas.com featuring Annabe, the only machine washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing. Sofas start at just $6.99, making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Anibay's Pet Friendly Stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic high resilience foam that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time with modular pieces. You can rearrange any anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your life. Now through Labor Day. Get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees, every penny back. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Danielle Robaix]

I need you guys to name names. What is your favorite? Reveal that you've read in a memoir.

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, I've said this one so many times, but it is my favorite, bar none. Brooke Shields said that Liam Neeson proposed to her and then said, I'll be right back. I have to go on this trip to la. And then he never spoke to her again. And when that happened, I gasped, I was gagged, I was gooped. I was flabbergasted. Also, Rue McClanahan confesses that she had sex with Robert Guillaume, who played Benson.

[Danielle Robaix]

Whoa.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I thought that was pretty amazing.

[Chelsea Devontes]

She really pulled him.

[Danielle Robaix]

I didn't know about the Brooke Shields one. She also has, like, four or five memoirs.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes, she does.

[Jeff Hiller]

She does.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Two of my favorite reveals come from the same book. It is Celine Dion revealing that she lost her virginity the night that she won Eurovision. And then when you, like, read deeper, it's like she's losing it to her manager, who signed her when she was 12 years old. So it's dark. It's really dark. But then the other reveal is that she'd never taken the subway before, and it's so intense for her that it is a chapter in the memoir of, like, the night she had to take the subway in Montreal to get to a concert, and, like, how scary it was.

[Danielle Robaix]

Who do you think got too messy in their memoir? Is there a thing as too.

[Chelsea Devontes]

No such thing. No such thing. What a gift.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Who didn't get messy enough?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Tina Knowles.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's what I was gonna say.

[Jeff Hiller]

I'd say Linda Ronstadt, who. Who only mentions that she was dating Governor Jerry Brown because it. It has to do with a story about her house. I was like, that's the only information we're getting about the fact that you're dating the governor of California. She doesn't even talk about her. And then at one point, she says something about her kids, and I was like, you.

[Chelsea Devontes]

So true.

[Danielle Robaix]

So funny. Okay. If we had to do a celebrity memoir, Mount Rushmore, I want to play a game, and here. Here's, like, a rule I'm throwing in. Everybody can. Can veto one person from our celebrity memoir, Mount Rushmore.

[Chelsea Devontes]

We're making the mountain together.

[Danielle Robaix]

We're making the mountain together.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I gotta put Jane Fonda up there.

[Danielle Robaix]

Yes.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think it's just such a. It was 2005, right? In a time when they really were not delivering on good celebrity memoirs. And she still did it. You know what I mean? And it was just so formative for me personally. And I think she still continues to form Hollywood culture in such a positive direction that I'd put Her up there.

[Danielle Robaix]

My life so far. Jane Fonda, I would say.

[Jeff Hiller]

Bossypants by Tina Fey.

[Danielle Robaix]

Interesting. Make your case, Jeff.

[Jeff Hiller]

I think that she is the reason that every publishing house now has to find their comedian who's going to save their life through essays, because it was such a monumental book. Like that is why Lena Dunham's book happened. That's how Mindy Kalin got her books, and she went off and everything. That's how Phoebe Robinson got her books. That's how I think that she made the case that this is a marketable subgenre of the genre.

[Danielle Robaix]

Yes. And.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I think it's also a really good book. I really like the book, too.

[Danielle Robaix]

Okay. I think you won me over. I agree. She's on the mountain.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I love that. Get her on that mountain.

[Danielle Robaix]

Chelsea, one more.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Can I bring to the council some options?

[Danielle Robaix]

Yes, please.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Ronnie Spector's memoir, it's actually being made into a movie.

[Danielle Robaix]

Really?

[Chelsea Devontes]

With Zendaya playing Ronnie Spector, and she is. So the book talks about her marriage to Phil Spector, and she was pretty much his wife prisoner after she sing My Little Baby with the Ronettes, which is like this huge song. But basically, she's, like, imprisoned in his house. And so a lot of Hollywood tales come through the book as she's breaking free, and she truly runs out of the house barefoot, with no belongings, nothing on, in order to escape and continue to live her life. And as we know, Phil Spector will be imprisoned for murder later. And so it's just this crazy, unbelievable tale of a book from someone I think doesn't get enough attention in history. But the book is so good, and the book is messy.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's a good one.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I'm thinking about Leah Remini's memoir where she went all in. She gave us from J. Lo to Tom Cruise to Scientology, T. And that one was formative. And then I also think Jessica Simpson fully brought back the entire genre in 2020, which led to things like my podcast. And so those are the three I'm thinking of.

[Jeff Hiller]

And Jessica Simpsons was the first one that was like, I'm gonna really be vulnerable and raw.

[Danielle Robaix]

Yes.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Jeff Hiller]

And that. And that. Like, I would say Paris Hiltons came from that and Demi Moore's. And all of those people, 100% Brittany. They all have, like, a black and white photo on the COVID Yeah.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think if you're like, why are there more celebrity memoirs now? It is Jessica Simpson.

[Danielle Robaix]

Interesting. Guys, I did not foresee this happening. I did not foresee Jessica Simpson being on Mount Rushmore.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Wait, have you not read it?

[Danielle Robaix]

Okay, can I admit something? Yeah. I can't get through it. I was on a plane. Okay. Yeah. And a woman sitting next to me was reading it, and she was crying, and she loved it so much, and she finished it, and she looked at me, and we hadn't spoken the whole flight, and she said, I don't know why, but I think I need to give you this book. You have. Someone should read this besides me. Like, you have to read this. I have been trying to get past the first five pages for two years.

[Chelsea Devontes]

What? Yes. Okay. I'm gonna make a psychic moment claim here, which is that there is something in that book you don't want to face.

[Danielle Robaix]

Oh, Chelsea.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Because it is just such a fun, delicious, psychotic read that just throws John Mayer under a bus. We run him over. We run over Nick Lachey. We revisit Tony Romo. We revisit the fat jeans. We reveal they were size four. Like, it is.

[Jeff Hiller]

She talks all about the Mickey Mouse and all of the. Like, the. How difficult it is to be a child and be sort of, like, put out there. And it is.

[Chelsea Devontes]

She gives on Johnny Knoxville. She gives on her dad kind of coming out by bringing a date to her wedding, but then also forgetting his Bible on purpose, like, so, anyways, I'm just saying there is no reason why you can't. I'm actually agraged. I'm. Is that a word? I am aggrieved that you have not made it past five pages. And I think there must be something cosmic keeping the book from you until the time is right.

[Danielle Robaix]

Okay. Also, maybe I need to now. I feel like I need to dig in.

[Chelsea Devontes]

You know, books find you at the right time. I'm a really firm believer in that. You are supposed to read certain books in certain moments, and if you can't read it right now, it's for a reason, and it'll find you another time.

[Danielle Robaix]

I actually really, really agree with that. Okay, so we have Jane Fonda. We have Jessica Simpson. We have Ronnie Spector. Do we have a fourth?

[Jeff Hiller]

Oh, well, I had already said Tina Fey, but. Oh, Tina Fey. Maybe you're right. We need to go.

[Danielle Robaix]

I actually. Jeff, I think. I think Tina Fey has to be up there. Cause I agree with you. It's like, what changed the genre? That's a great question to answer.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Then I'm going to veto Jane, because I don't know if she was a genre. I think she just did it really well. And I think you could reread it and you would learn something. New every time. Cause it's so goddamn long and she's an icon. But maybe we remove her.

[Danielle Robaix]

I don't know if I feel right about removing her.

[Jeff Hiller]

Chelsea.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I'm just saying, listen, we need more. We need more Heads on the Mountain, Mommie Dearest. That was genre changing. That actually is maybe the book that started the term tell all memoir.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's it. Done.

[Jeff Hiller]

That is it.

[Danielle Robaix]

That's it. Wow, great call. We have talked so much about other people's memoirs, but I'd be remiss not to talk about the fact that both of you have written your own memoir. I love both of the titles. Chelsea's is I shouldn't be telling you this, but I'm going to anyway. And Jeff's is actress of a certain age. My 20 year trail to overnight success. What did you learn from writing your own memoir?

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, I think for me it was sort of personal. Like I don't know that I learned anything about the genre per se, but I definitely learned. I learned a little self compassion for myself. Like I wrote a lot about my childhood, which was. And I know this is going to be shocking, but I was quite bullied as a gay child in 1980s Texas. Can you believe that? Anyway, I gained a lot of compassion for myself and I also really did a lot to challenge myself to be completely honest and not to sort of make myself look better or sound better. And I thought that was something I.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Learned, you know, specifically about the genre. I have so much. I hope I had always approached these books with some level of compassion, but I have even so much more compassion for when the writing doesn't hold up. Like there's certain books where you'll read a paragraph and you're like, I don't know who she's talking to, but it's not me. Like we're settling a score with like some random lady through this channel generic paragraph where you're like, you've lost the plot because you're just kind of settling scores from your life. And coming to my own memoir, there were really tiny little things where it's like, I need to talk about this night before I got married, where these four family members of mine jumped in this pool and after maybe having a lot of crazy stuff happening, it was this beautiful moment, right? And I had never talked about my God sister who was there that night and jumped in the pool with me, right? But to bring it up in the chapter and be like, you know, and Noe was there. The reader's like, who Noe? But for me, in the text of my life and the offering of my life. It was like, I can't not include this person who I actually haven't written very well into the book because of whatever, whatever, whatever. And so I think you're always in this struggle when you are putting your life down. Of, like Jeff said, it's like, I don't care what your grandpa did. But then there's also times where, like, if this is your memoir, you're making certain literary decisions that's like, for four people. And as the reader, you have to suffer through it. And I think that's something really interesting. I think about now with those books.

[Danielle Robaix]

I would not have thought about that. That's a great point.

[Ad Read Voice]

But that's also why I love the.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Books, because they're so weird and distinct. Things can happen in memoir that just, like, don't happen in fiction, you know, or biography or things like that. And then I would say, like, what did I learn about myself? Oh, God. I mean, I don't know if you had this, Jeff, but, like, when you write it down, I just had times where I'm like, and I'm alive. Like, this is crazy.

[Jeff Hiller]

I totally had that, but kind of in a different way where it was like, I actually. I did do that. That's impressive that I did that.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I can't believe I did that.

[Jeff Hiller]

I can't believe I moved across the country or whatever.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Jeff, you introduce your book as a book by an actor who is not famous. And I would like to say that after your Eminem, we all beg to differ. But given that idea, I'm curious why you decided that was the moment to publish.

[Jeff Hiller]

Well, Cause they'd let me is the main reason. But I think because I have read so many actor things where they're like, I loved all those days of waiting tables, and then it was all over when I was 25 and I had to go be a movie star. And I just wanted to shout out to all the people who are just toiling, trying, and wanting to live their dream, and even though people keep telling them over and over again that this is a dumb dream and that you don't deserve to have it, and I just. Yeah. So I wanted to have that as my inspiration and also to say, like, we're worth it. We do deserve to have that dream.

[Chelsea Devontes]

It's beautiful.

[Danielle Robaix]

Really beautiful. Chelsea, each of your chapters are named after a woman who played a big role in your life. And to me, that gets to the point of memory when writing a memoir, and you cover a lot of trauma in your book, you kind of joked around at the beginning of our conversation that you've lived a dark life. You make light of it a lot, but you've gone through some really tough things and you're sharing stories that are not exclusively your own. What considerations do you have to make for real life people that you portray in your story?

[Chelsea Devontes]

What I tried to do, even though I was telling other women's stories in many times, because I also wanted to not just talk about me, but talk about all these formative women and just sort of center these main characters. And I don't think I told any story in that book that was not mine to tell. And in the few moments when I did where I was like, hey, mom, can I talk about your first marriage? Or like, hey, my godmother, like, can I talk about your first three marriages? I had express permission, and they loved it. And they were always like, we wanna write this book, so put it in there. You know, in places where I felt like this actually isn't my story to tell in a way where it needs to be protected, and yet I don't even know how to write my story without it. I went through hoops to not write that story. And only sometimes will a reader pop up and be like, he. How come this? And it's like, oh, it's because I was fully cutting around a thing that's not mine to tell in order to tell the story I have to tell. So I thought about it a lot and listen, I have to. A memoir is crazy because your main characters are alive still. You gotta see them the next day. You sometimes see them at the book launch. And so, you know, if you're not lighting them on fire, you gotta be able to stand there and look them in the eyes. And so I took a lot of consideration with it. And also, I. I don't know if it was on purpose, but in hindsight, used it for healing in the way of, like, sometimes when you've lived through dark stuff together, you can't stand in that truth together. It's too hard. But when someone has written it down and you can both face it through the page and then come together, it can make your relationships a lot stronger. And there were a lot of relationships I thought I was going to ruin with my book that really, surprisingly, only got better and stronger and more beautiful because I named a thing we both that we were just too afraid to admit to. And then that can allow more intimacy.

[Danielle Robaix]

Where on the spectrum of Jessica Simpson to Tina Knowles did you guys want to land.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I'm going to say confidently that people would be like, maybe say less after reading my I think they're like, actually you gave it too much and you didn't need to. I think I went. I think I went Jessica Simpson and a quarter.

[Jeff Hiller]

All I wanted to be was truthful. That's all I wanted to be. Oh, and funny. I also really wanted to be funny. So that's.

[Danielle Robaix]

Those were my two goals I think you achieved. So congrats. Thank you. Apple Books is the best place to read, listen to or discover the books to you love without a subscription right on your iPhone. And now there's a very exciting heads up for listeners. Apple Books is the official audiobook and ebook home for Reese's Book Club, so it's easier than ever to explore each monthly book pick, plus author curated collections and more all in one place. Open the Apple Books app to explore a world of books and audiobooks. You can set goals and track your reading progress. Get great recommendations for your next read, or listen and enjoy it all on the go, wherever you are. You can even share your books with up to five family members at no cost. Again, no subscription required. Visit Apple co reeseapplebooks to find out more. That's Apple co reeseapplebooks and read or listen to Reese's current Pick and browse past selections today on Apple Books. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton. We spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and with characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands, but also in the world around you, in the fabric that's holding you close? Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for lazy weekend mornings with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. It's about ease, comfort, and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like the books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into our everyday moments. Moments like following four adult daughters as they navigate love, loss, and the Legacy in the Most Fun We Ever had by Claire Lombardo, all while curled up in soft cotton joggers or Sinking into the island of Missing Trees by Elif Shafak, a story that spans generations, forbidden love and a fig tree that remembers everything wrapped in a hand stitched quilt, each thread holding its own kind of memory. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton. Not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton the fabric of our lives.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Learn [e-mail] hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Now through August 26th, it's back to Deals time, where you can enjoy storewide deals and earn four times points. Look for in store tags to earn on eligible items from Black Label Bacon Pop Tarts, Quaker Activia, Lunchables, Frito Lay, Goldfish and Jack Links. Then clip the offer in the app for automatic event long savings. Shop in store or online for easy drive up and go pickup or delivery subject to availability restrictions apply. Visit Albertsons or Safeway.com for more details.

[Ad Read Voice]

This Labor Day, say goodbye to spills, stains and overpriced furniture with washablesofas.com featuring Anabe, the only machine washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing. Sofas start at just $6.99, making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Anibe's Pet Friendly Stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic high resilience foam that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time with modular pieces you can rearrange anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your life. Now through Labor Day, get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees. Every penny back. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Danielle Robaix]

I was on the phone with a book agent about a month ago and we were talking about memoir. And she was like, well, what are your favorite memoirs? And I start answering, well, Jane Fonda and Gloria Steinem and Diane von Furstenberg. I'm naming all these names and she goes, danielle, it sounds like you like celebrity memoir. There's a difference.

[Chelsea Devontes]

How dare? How dare. I will fight this agent. Get her on the line. Rude. Rude.

[Danielle Robaix]

So my question to the two experts on the line is, what is the difference between a celebrity memoir and a memoir? Is there one?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Here's what I'm gonna say. The judgment on them is an unfair judgment. When I went to write my memoir, I was like, ugh. And then how many photos do I get to put in that big fat photo section in the middle? And they were like, none. Because this is a real book and a real memoir. Also, you're not famous so we don't have the ink budget for you. But there is this idea that like a book with photos in the middle is like less of a book. Right. Or like, if it's a celebrity memoir, it's not a real memoir. It can't be like a Crying in H Mart or whatever. And I just so fully disagree. Are there a lot of really bad celebrity memoirs? Yes, and the bad ones are so bad. But I think there's bad, quote unquote literary memoirs. And so I just think there's so many good books in this genre and I think it really unfairly gets put down. And I think it especially happens to women's memoirs. I bet if you would have said Andre Agassi, they would have been like, oh, that's one of the best. Because his co author is like real literary. And so I just. Yeah, I think it's unfair. I think it's untrue. And they are also my favorite memoirs because I like to have fun when I read.

[Jeff Hiller]

I would say the only difference is the way you market them.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Exactly.

[Jeff Hiller]

Because there's a built in fan base for a celebrity memoir.

[Chelsea Devontes]

If you're not a celebrity, you have to be speaking about something that speaks beyond yourself. Whereas if you are a celebrity and you just want to tell us like five events from your life, you could, you know, they'll buy that book.

[Jeff Hiller]

That's true.

[Danielle Robaix]

Have you guys discovered any universal truths in reading all these memoirs?

[Jeff Hiller]

I think for the most part people see themselves as nobody ever is. Like, I was super popular in high school, everybody loved me. Everyone sees themselves as, you know what, I don't know. There's no universal truth. We're all different. We're snowflakes.

[Chelsea Devontes]

I think you're right though, that everyone, everyone is sort of like, oh, I was going through such a hard time and no one liked me. Not everyone, but the good memoirs. And you're like, oh, everyone thinks that. I think that's right.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. That's the universal truth. I guess we don't all have it together.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. And I would say one thing that has really a truth that I noticed and then have now lived is that telling your own story will set you free. And if you really dare to tell your own story and tell the truth and tell it authentically, no matter the consequences, you will be free after that. And that happens so often because. Well, I know that that's true now because I've done it. But so many people even write in their memoirs, like, the process of doing this freed me. You should do it too.

[Danielle Robaix]

There's something so interesting about that because particularly in celebrity memoir, oftentimes they don't have to write the book. And so the fact that they do and they spill the message is so admirable.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah. I also think especially with female memoirs and female celebrities, most of their lives, their story has been told through the press and the media, which is still very male led. And especially if you live through the 2000s, that was very paparazzi. TMZ. And so to tell your story in your own words of a thing that we have all been following for so long and knew the worst version of like Jessica Simpson being, quote, fat, you know, at the barbecue Chili Bake off concert where she sang. And for her to be like, actually I was a size 4 at that time. I just think it's so powerful for them to take back their story and then for us to actually like read the real story.

[Danielle Robaix]

Well said.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Do you think everybody has a book in them?

[Chelsea Devontes]

No, because I've read some of them and I said this shouldn't have been a book. Sheena Shay.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, I feel like everybody probably does have a book in them, but are people willing to put the thing out there? I don't know. I don't know that everybody is brave enough to put a real book out there.

[Chelsea Devontes]

And I would say we shouldn't look down on co authors. Get the help. Books are hard. Totally.

[Danielle Robaix]

There's one other thing that I feel like I'd be remiss, not to mention about the genre that I love. And Jeff, you probably, I think like you've touched on it a little bit in this conversation. I don't get to speak to a lot of 70, 80 or 90 year old women in my day to day life. And to open a book and get to learn about how they're thinking and what they're thinking is so cool. Like you don't get that otherwise 100% agree.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah. Except unless they're on that Julia Louis Dreyfus podcast. But yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Good point.

[Jeff Hiller]

But I completely agree and I think there is something which, you know, I'm speaking to you as someone who's not in my 70s, 80s or 90s, I mean, not that far. But I think that, I think that that wisdom is also empowering. What does Cher say? Like, if you don't, if you're not going to be worried about this in three years, you shouldn't be worried about it now. It's like, it's really good advice and something to really take from. And there's a great one by Lee Grant called. I said yes to everything, and she won an Oscar, but nobody remembers Lee Grant. But she is this incredible. She talks about, like, how she got a facelift at 30, and she was like, I don't know why I got a facelift at 30. It's. It's so good. Adrienne Barbeau has this incredible one where. And she's like, very poetic. Oh, you know who else? Janice Ian, who know the song. She wrote the song I Learned the truth at 17.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Wow.

[Jeff Hiller]

It's called Society's Child. It's great. It's really. And it's beautifully written. I don't think she even had a co author. And it's. And she's so vulnerable. And she's also so wise. I think that's the word I'm looking for. The wisdom of age.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yes.

[Danielle Robaix]

We're coming up on the end of our conversation, which means it's time for the speed read. Here's how it works. We're going to put 120 seconds on the clock, 60 seconds for each of you, and we're going to see how many rapid fire literary questions we can get through.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Whoa.

[Danielle Robaix]

Are you ready?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Yeah.

[Danielle Robaix]

Okay. Three, two. Chelsea, the best memoir if you just got dumped.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Gabrielle Union's first memoir.

[Danielle Robaix]

Jeff, you just got fired. What are you reading?

[Jeff Hiller]

Patti LuPone Colon, A Memoir.

[Danielle Robaix]

Chelsea, you just got your big break. What are you reading?

[Chelsea Devontes]

I am reading Rosie Perez's handbook for a really messed up life. I'm getting this out of wrong, but you gotta read that.

[Jeff Hiller]

Yeah, and how I had good hair.

[Danielle Robaix]

This is definitely your big break. What now?

[Jeff Hiller]

I want to be Chelsea and write my own show.

[Danielle Robaix]

Ooh, Chelsea, you're alone for the holidays. What are you reading?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Ione Skye's memoir. Say anything. I would say a definitive 90s memoir.

[Danielle Robaix]

Great one. Jeff, you're on a beach vacay.

[Jeff Hiller]

My first five husbands and the ones that got away for a beach read. To be honest, it's a great one.

[Danielle Robaix]

Chelsea, you're turning 30. What are you reading?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Oh, now I'm reading, like, Jane Fonda, Barbra Streisand, Jennifer Lewis. Yeah. Looking back on it of, like, what I should really be doing.

[Danielle Robaix]

Someone else is narrating your memoir. Who's narrating?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Betty Gilpin?

[Jeff Hiller]

It'd probably be Michael Urie. He gets all the jobs I auditioned for.

[Danielle Robaix]

What book shaped the way you see the world?

[Chelsea Devontes]

Delta Burke's memoir, Delta Style. I read it when I was 16 and she was thrown out of Hollywood for the atrocious crime of being a size 10. And reading that as a 16 year old in the early aughts when double zero had just been introduced was actually such a big, such a big handhold.

[Jeff Hiller]

I would say he's not really a celebrity, unless you count poets as celebrities. But there's a book called Becoming a Man by Paul Monette. It, like, helps me come out. Also a book called A Place at the Table by Mel White, who's not a celebrity, but is the father of Mike White, who created White Lotus. So.

[Danielle Robaix]

You guys, because of these books, I think know celebrity genealogy better than anybody. Like, I imagine you having really creepy whiteboards with like all the lines and everything.

[Jeff Hiller]

There's this big Nepo baby up at the top.

[Danielle Robaix]

My cheeks hurt. So it's time to go. But thank you both so much. You're so, you're so funny, but you also really have so much wisdom and depth. So thank you.

[Chelsea Devontes]

Thank you. This was my dream podcast and I got Jeff to admit the truth and it means a lot to me.

[Jeff Hiller]

And I found my twin flame and.

[Danielle Robaix]

I can't wait to join your cult. We'll figure out what to name it. Before we wrap today's episode. I want to introduce you to a brand new monthly segment brought to you by Cotton. You know, cotton is a part of so many of life's everyday comforts, from what we wear to what we wrap ourselves in. And it's especially present in the quiet, cozy moments, like reading a book you can't put down. Which brings me to our new segment, the Book Nook, where we explore the rituals that make reading feel just right. For me, that means Cotton Everything. I live in la. It's summer, and even when it's warm, I want to feel wrapped up and relaxed. When I'm home, I curl up with this super soft cotton blanket. It's lightweight and breathable and perfect for long reading stretches. I've got my favorite matching cotton lounge set on too. It's basically my reading uniform and I'm nestled on my couch by the window, iced coffee clinking, book in hand. It's truly my ideal reading setup. Now I want to hear yours. What are you wearing? What's around you? Are you out in the world or you tucked away at home? Take me into your perfect reading ritual. Leave me a voicemail at 5012-9133-7950-1291-3379 or email me a voice memo to bookmarkedresebookclub.com thanks to Cotton for bringing this segment to life and reminding us that comfort and style can go hand in hand. Don't forget to check the tag for cotton. And if you want to learn more, head to thefabricofarlives.com and if you want a little bit more from us, come hang with us on socials. We're at Reese's Book Club on Instagram serving up books, vibes and behind the scenes magic. And I'm R O B A Y. Come say hi and DM me. And if you want to go 90s on us, call us. Okay, Our phone line is open so call now at 1-501-291-3379. That's 1-501291-3379. Share your literary hot takes, book recommendations, questions about the monthly pick, or let us know what you think about the episode you just heard. And who knows, you might just hear yourself in our next episode. So don't be shy, give us a ring. And of course, make sure to follow Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your shows. Until then, see you in the next chapter. Bookmarked is a production of hello Sunshine and iheart Podcast Acast. It's executive produced by Reese Witherspoon and me, Danielle Roubaix. Production is by Acast Creative Studios. Our producers are Maddie Foley, Brittany Martinez, Sarah Schleed and Darby Masters. Our production assistant is Avery Loftus. Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rutter are the executive producers for Acast Creative Studios. Maureen Polo and Reese Witherspoon are the executive producers for hello Sunshine. Olga Kaminwa, Kristin Perla and Ashley Rapoport are associate producers for Reese's Book Club. Ally Perry and Lauren Hanson are the executive producers for iHeart podcasts and Tim Palazzola is our showrunner. Apple Books is the best way to read or listen to the books you love without a subscription right on your iPhone and a heads up for listeners. Apple Books is the official audiobook and ebook home for Reese's Book Club so you can discover every exciting pick, plus author curated collections and more all in one place. Open the Apple Books app to explore a world of books and audiobooks. You can set and track your reading goals and get great recommendations for your next read or listen again. No subscription required. Visit Apple Co Reese that's R E E S E Applebooks to find out more. Today's episode is brought to you by Cotton. We spend a lot of time with stories, hours curled up with dynamic plots and characters who feel like friends. What if the story isn't just in your hands but also in the world around you, in the fabric that's holding you close. Cotton is that timeless companion. Soft sheets for a lazy weekend morning with a book. Breezy dresses for afternoons spent reading in the backyard. It's the fabric that can be tossed in the wash without fuss. It's about ease, comfort, and caring for yourself and the planet. Just like books we cherish, cotton weaves meaning into everyday moments. Next time you settle in for a chapter, slip into something cotton not just to read the story, but to feel it. Cotton the fabric of our lives. Learn more at thefabricofourlives.com hey, it's Ryan.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Danielle Robaix]

This is an iHeart podcast.