Books (and True Crime) With Your Besties: Episode Summary

Episode Title: Celisia Stanton sits down with Emily and Ashley
Release Date: February 21, 2025

In this compelling episode of Books (and True Crime) With Your Besties, hosts Emily and Ashley welcome Celisia Stanton, the host and creator of the true crime podcast True or Crime. Through an engaging conversation, Celisia delves into her journey into podcasting, the ethos behind her show, and the broader implications of true crime storytelling in today’s society. This summary captures the essence of their discussion, highlighting key topics, insightful observations, and memorable quotes from the episode.

1. Introduction and Celisia’s Background

Emily and Ashley open the episode by introducing Celisia Stanton, inviting her to share about herself.

• Celisia Stanton: “[...] I live in Minneapolis, Minnesota. I'm a really big fan of Minneapolis and the Twin Cities in general...” (00:22)

Celisia elaborates on her role as the host of True or Crime, a podcast dedicated to exploring true crime cases with depth, nuance, and critical analysis. She also mentions her profession as a wedding and portrait photographer.

2. Personal Preferences and Get-to-Know Questions

To build rapport, Emily and Ashley pose a series of light-hearted questions to Celisia, revealing personal tastes and interests.

• Favorite Beverage:

  • Celisia: “I feel like I'm a big juice person. I really love soda too... I also love, like, non-water beverages.” (01:27)

• Best Vacation Spot:

  • Celisia: “One of my favorites is Copenhagen, Denmark... I loved the fashion, the food scene, the great bakeries...” (02:03)

• Favorite Book:

  • Celisia: “Right now I'm listening to Ina Garten's memoir... I also read Katie Couric's memoir...” (02:40)
  • Ashley: “Katie… was kind of loud about things when women weren't really loud about them... (03:24)

Celisia expresses her appreciation for books that explore themes of feminism, gender roles, and personal authenticity.

3. The Genesis of 'True or Crime'

Emily and Ashley steer the conversation towards Celisia's foray into podcasting, uncovering the motivations and circumstances that led her to create True or Crime.

• Celisia’s Journey:
  • “Going into 2020, not a great time to be working in events... I started sharing about racial and social justice issues...” (07:40)
  • “I complained enough to my husband that he was like, you should start your own podcast. So that's what I did.” (11:XX)

Celisia recounts how the COVID-19 pandemic and the societal upheaval following George Floyd’s murder inspired her to shift from photography to podcasting. She aimed to provide a platform that blends true crime storytelling with critical social commentary.

4. Selecting Unique Cases for True or Crime

A significant portion of the discussion centers on how Celisia selects cases for her podcast, striving to offer diverse and underrepresented stories.

• Celisia on Case Selection:
  • “I always wanted True or Crime to be a true crime podcast. I didn't want it to be the social justice podcast... So I have several categories...” (16:40)

She categorizes her episodes into:

1. Infamous Cases: Well-known stories with deeper, often overlooked facets.

   • Example: Jonestown – Highlighting the predominantly Black female victims and the civil rights veneer of Jim Jones' People's Temple.

2. Historical True Crime: Cases typically treated in historical contexts but explored with true crime depth.

   • Example: The untold story of Martin Luther King Jr.’s assassination and the ensuing conspiracy theories.

3. Systemic Failures: Cases that reveal systemic issues protecting certain demographics while failing others.

   • Example: Lauren McCluskey’s case – A seemingly protected individual still fell victim to systemic failures.

4. Blurred Lines of Culpability: Stories where the distinction between victim and perpetrator is murky.

   • Example: Alice Sebold and Anthony Broadwater – Exploring wrongful convictions and the impact on both victim and innocent perpetrator.

5. Ethical Responsibility in True Crime Storytelling

Celisia and the hosts engage in a thoughtful discussion about the ethical implications of true crime media, particularly concerning whose stories are told and how they are presented.

• Celisia on Ethical Storytelling:
  • “We have some sort of obligation to direct resources and support to those who are most directly affected... individual stories inspire people.” (15:34)

She emphasizes the balance between respecting the victims and their communities while also recognizing the power of individual stories to catalyze broader social change. Celisia advocates for a nuanced approach that does not exploit but rather elevates unheard voices.

6. Emotional Impact and Self-Care

The hosts inquire about the emotional toll of delving into harrowing cases, to which Celisia shares her coping mechanisms.

• Celisia on Managing Emotional Strain:
  • “I always try to think about things from the perspective of, like, what is my lane... telling these stories is the way that I'm dealing with all the other inputs I'm getting.” (23:04)
  • “If I was going to tell a true crime story, I want the listener to really be brought on a real emotional journey...” (24:XX)

Celisia underscores the importance of staying within her comfort zone and using storytelling as a therapeutic outlet. She acknowledges the necessity of engaging with difficult emotions to authentically convey each narrative.

7. Live Events and Future Plans

The conversation shifts to Celisia's experiences with live events and her aspirations for expanding her podcast's reach.

• Celisia on Live Events:
  • “I would love to do more live events... Highlight true crime stories at the actual event and make it more interactive.” (25:27)

She expresses enthusiasm for future tours and interactive shows that could deepen listener engagement and bring the podcast community together in meaningful ways.

8. The Realities of Podcasting

Emily and Ashley explore the behind-the-scenes efforts required to produce a successful podcast, with Celisia shedding light on the often overlooked aspects.

• Celisia on Podcast Production:
  • “Each season is like, I wrote a book... It has to sound like creative nonfiction. It has to sound pretty clean.” (26:43)
  • “It's a lot of resources. So I think it's such a cool thing that podcasts are free... but it costs a lot to make them and it's a lot of time.” (26:43)

She highlights the intensive research, writing, and technical efforts involved in crafting each episode, advocating for listener support through reviews and sharing to sustain and grow the podcast.

9. Final Reflections and Conclusions

As the episode wraps up, Celisia and the hosts reflect on the cyclical nature of social issues and the role of media in addressing them.

• Celisia on Repeating History:
  • “I was like, what would it look like if we gave those stories the true crime treatment... similar things just keep happening over and over again in society.” (29:33)
  • Emily: “We are so bad about repeating history... recognizing and scaling back on those things.” (29:56)

The discussion underscores the importance of awareness and proactive engagement in social justice, using true crime as a lens to understand and combat recurring societal problems.

Key Takeaways

• Integration of Social Issues in True Crime: Celisia’s podcast serves as a bridge between engaging true crime stories and critical social commentary, fostering deeper understanding and empathy among listeners.

• Ethical Storytelling: There's a responsibility to portray true crime stories with respect and depth, ensuring that marginalized voices are heard without exploitation.

• Emotional Resilience: Engaging with true crime requires self-care and emotional boundaries to maintain personal well-being while telling others' stories.

• Support for Podcast Creators: The behind-the-scenes efforts in podcasting demand recognition and support from listeners to sustain high-quality, impactful content.

Notable Quotes

• Celisia Stanton on Favorite Beverage:
  “I really love soda too. I love, like, any like, non water beverages.” (01:27)

• Celisia on Creating Conversations:
  “These podcasts can be a way for us to have hard conversations with people that we might not otherwise have.” (15:50)

• Celisia Discussing Podcast Impact:
  “If that's a format that people are interested in and is accessible to folks, then you can see it through that lens and then trust you will start seeing it everywhere.” (31:07)

Conclusion

This episode provides a profound insight into Celisia Stanton's vision and the meticulous effort behind True or Crime. By intertwining true crime narratives with social justice themes, Celisia creates a platform that not only entertains but also educates and inspires action. Emily and Ashley’s engaging interviewing style allows listeners to connect deeply with Celisia’s mission, fostering a greater appreciation for the complexities of true crime storytelling.

For those passionate about true crime, social justice, or insightful discussions, this episode is a must-listen. It exemplifies how podcasts can be powerful tools for change, offering both compelling content and meaningful dialogue.