Steal Your Customers from Your Competitors (the Easy Way)

Summary

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Brain Driven Brands — Episode 99: "Steal Your Customers from Your Competitors (the Easy Way)"

Host: Sarah Levinger
Date: August 28, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this milestone 99th episode, Sarah Levinger (with co-host Nate Lagos) explores neuromarketing strategies used by powerhouse brands to ethically "steal" customers from competitors. Leaning into behavioral psychology (with heavy emphasis on the BJ Fogg Behavior Model), the hosts walk through real-world tactics—using personal anecdotes and client examples (including True Classic, Spotify, and Plants vs. Zombies)—to equip e-commerce brands with practical, psychology-driven marketing prompts that seamlessly fit into customers’ lives and motivate them to switch brands.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Psychology of Brand Naming and Social Norms

 • Lighthearted banter opens the episode, analyzing why law firms and agencies use “and Son,” never “and Daughter,” and how women seldom get team camaraderie via surnames (00:09-03:48).
 • Notable moment: Sarah urges listeners to try calling female colleagues by their last name to foster inclusion.

“Here’s what I want all the dudes who are listening… go out and call one of your female compatriots by their last name and just say, I want you to be part of the team.” — Sarah [03:07]
 • Reflections on gendered naming conventions highlight unconscious biases and the cultural signals encoded in business identity.

2. Milestone Banter: Episode 99 Achievement

 • Celebrating reaching episode 99, the hosts remark on podcasting statistics—most shows “don’t get past 12 episodes.”

“Moment of loudness for episode 99, everybody. We did it, actually. This is really hard.” — Sarah [04:03]
 • Underlines the commitment required to maintain audience engagement in branded content.

3. Case Study: The Consumer Decision-Making Process for Rings

 • Sarah shares a personal anecdote—her husband Casey is deciding between brands (Original Grain vs. Ridge) for a new ring.
 • The discussion shifts to real-time brand battle:

• Brand Attachment: Original Grain’s rings are purpose-built to match their watches, appealing to loyalists but potentially narrowing the customer base.
• Material Matters: Ridge wins Casey over not by style, but by offering a Damascus steel ring, a unique material with storytelling power [09:30-10:34].

“He said it was not the look, it was the material.” — Sarah [09:27]

4. Category Expansion and Material Storytelling

 • Ridge’s success in rings is noted as an “amazing category expansion” for a wallet-first brand (09:41).
 • Damascus steel—a high-quality, visually distinct metal—becomes a talking point for how brands can leverage unique materials and origin stories to prompt purchase consideration.

5. Breakdown: The BJ Fogg Behavior Model Applied to E-commerce

 • Model Elements
1. Motivation: The drive to change or make a purchase
2. Ability: The means (cash, access, competence) to act
3. Prompt: The trigger that turns intention into action ([11:41]-[13:03])
 • Importance of aligning marketing prompts with customer behavior (“Date night,” material preferences, recurring rituals).

“You have to have all three of these in play… Motivation, ability, and prompt.” — Sarah [12:59]
“The prompt that he sees is going to be critical… it really has to match who he is as a person.” — Sarah [14:00]

6. How to Craft Effective Prompts for Stealing Customers

 • Generic prompts (ads) aren’t enough. To “steal” a customer, the brand must insert itself into moments the buyer already values—like date nights or recognizing preferred materials.
 • Examples Discussed:

• Targeting ads to married men (“Men who carve out time for their marriage wear our rings”) [15:16-15:25]
• Prompting around “when” (e.g., special occasions, life milestones) and “what” (material or design preferences) [16:29-17:09]
• Making the ring relevant to hobbies—e.g., Sarah’s husband links the ring’s material to his paramotoring passion (carbon fiber and Damascus associations)

“You want them to go out and get their carbon fiber freaking paramotor ready to go… and say, ah, Original Grain still has those rings.” — Sarah [20:37]

7. Testing & Iteration: Reframing Product Prompts

 • The hosts resolve to experiment with new prompts for ring ads, personalized to common life moments and passions (22:17).

“How can you frame your products to exist in what they already do?” — Nate [20:28]
“You don’t convince him to buy anything. You’re just reminding him that that was something he already wanted.” — Sarah [20:53]

8. Tactile Cues & Quality Signaling

 • Product “weight” and material feel—heavier products signal higher quality [18:33].
 • Close-up visuals of materials can strengthen the mental association and consumer recall.

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Necessity of Prompts:
  “Even though motivation and ability are there, the prompt isn’t there, so you don’t do it.” — Nate [13:53]
• On Brand Storytelling:
  “Ridge… fantastic case study in, like, category expansion.” — Nate [09:45]
• On Building Reminders into Life:
  “You want [your customer] to go out... look at that material and say, ah, Original Grain still has those rings. I need to go back and take a look at those. That’s why you advertise in the first place.” — Sarah [20:37]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:07] — Sarah’s call-to-action: Surnames and inclusion
• [04:03] — Episode 99 celebration & podcasting persistence
• [06:00] — Case Study: Deciding between Ridge & Original Grain rings
• [09:27] — “It was not the look, it was the material.” — Why Casey chose Ridge
• [11:41] — Introduction to BJ Fogg Behavior Model
• [14:00] — The critical moment: Prompts must fit customer identity
• [15:16-15:25] — “Men who carve out time for their marriage wear our rings.”
• [20:28] — “How can you frame your products to exist in what they already do?”
• [20:53] — The real purpose of advertising: prompting recall, not creating desire

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Actionable Takeaways from the Episode

• Analyze what naturally prompts your audience, then match your product messaging to fit those lived moments.
• Use unique materials and sensory cues (like weight, texture, color associations) to create memorable product prompts.
• Don’t neglect emotional or event-based triggers—plan campaigns for “life moments” like date nights, anniversaries, or achievements.
• Iterate on prompts—use testing and customer feedback to find what resonates and breaks habitual loyalty to competitors.
• Brand storytelling isn’t just about your company; it’s about embedding your product in the customer’s ongoing story and rituals.

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The Episode’s Core Message

To ethically steal customers from your competitors, your brand’s prompts must align seamlessly with real needs, routines, and moments already present in your customer’s life. Recognize and reinforce what they value, and you’ll become the brand they recall—and switch to—when it matters.

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For more, find Sarah on Twitter or LinkedIn (@Sir Levenger), and stay tuned for episode 100!

Transcript

[A]

Welcome back to Brain Driven Brands, hosted by Levenger and Legos.

[B]

Hello. Hey. You used my last name. Thank you. We were just talking before we got on this recording. Why is it that only men use each other's last names as, like, a point of camaraderie? Women would never. I've never had that happen to me in my life, ever.

[A]

Because we're different.

[B]

Thanks for that. A great observation. Jesus.

[A]

Yeah, I don't know. If we had a law firm, it'd be called Levinger and Lagos.

[B]

Legos. Why not Legos and Leverager?

[A]

I think you always put the longer one first, don't you?

[B]

Well, that's a good question. How do they decide which name goes first in a law firm? I don't know.

[A]

That is probably, like, seniority and, like, who started first?

[B]

And I guess so. But some of it also I find funny because it's almost like Backus and Backus. It's like the same last name. Like, why do you have them both on there if both of your last names is Bacchus?

[A]

Right? Just name it that.

[B]

Just name it. Bacchus Law Firm. Kill me.

[A]

I think it's so funny how many companies are named like Johnson and Son. It's just like this dude. Like this dude's kid.

[B]

It's just dude and child. Yeah, we don't do that in other places. This is. This might be an episode of just like all the weird societal things that we don't do and we do do that just don't make much sense.

[A]

Like, I would love to see a marketing agency that's called, like, Smith and Son. I think that'd be fun.

[B]

Me the marketer and my child.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, I'm currently just training to take over this because I'm burnt out.

[A]

Speaking of men and women, no one does Johnson and Daughter, you know?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What is that?

[B]

Kill me. Like, just tell me, people, why is this a thing? Like, our society is the strangest society and I understand the reasons why all this happened, blah, blah, blah, like Puritan risk, whatever. I understand the history. Don't lecture me on history. Tell me the psychology of why we're still doing it. Why nobody calls me Levenger. It makes me upset. It makes me feel like I'm not a part of the team and I would like to be a part of the team.

[A]

Do you think it's because, I mean, let's be honest, that's only been your last name for like a third of your life.

[B]

I know, but. Okay, get this at a different one. Like, just. Just assume For a second, like, step into the female world. I've never had a last name. That's mine. Never.

[A]

Well, you can't say that like the one. No. Because you will. You can say it's your dad's, but, like, mine's my dad's too.

[B]

I know, but that's just it. Yours just, like, lineage gets down because you'll. You'll have it forever. You never have to change it. That's just the one you get. Mine is, like, okay, I started with my father's. I get it. Whatever. Hierarchies of things, like patriarchy, whatever you want to call it. But then I have to change it, and I have. I've had to change mine three times.

[A]

Do you know that I had a girl tell me on a first date that she was not gonna take the last name of whoever she married on a first date?

[B]

Yeah, that seems abrupt. Yeah, I understand the sentiment, but, like, honey, that's a lot for a first.

[A]

We didn't go on a second date, so.

[B]

Really? Why is that?

[A]

It's a bunch of other things she brought up. I was like, I can't understand why the appetizer. I was like, let's wrap this up.

[B]

Oh, man. All right, so here's what I want all the dudes who are listening to the show to do this week, go out and call one of your female compatriots by their last name and just say, I want you to be a part of the team. Like, just do that for me and see what you're. I might get a lot of people in trouble.

[A]

I think you should do it, but not address it.

[B]

Just, like, say it.

[A]

Just do it. Yeah.

[B]

Come up and be like, what's up, lavender? Like, how those reports doing? Yeah, I don't know.

[A]

I'll do that in our slack next week.

[B]

Do you have any females working for you? You other than me. Other than me. Like, you guys contract with Sarah a lot, but I'm just. Yeah, we might have to cut this out of the.

[A]

Yeah, there's two more. Yeah, let's not get into the. My demographic hiring choices, actually.

[B]

Okay. I do have a topic for you today, which we're gonna.

[A]

By the way. Hold on. Before this episode 99 it is.

[B]

Guys, we should take a minute. Everybody, moment of silence. Or not silence, because we don't not talk on the show. Moment of loudness for episode 99, everybody. We did it, actually. This is really hard. Scotty apparently told me that. What did you say? I think Scotty, you said, like, people don't get past 12 episodes. Is that right? You gave me a number that was really low. 7 to 12. I was like, that is not that many. I just did this because I thought it was fun. I didn't realize that, like, people put effort.

[A]

It is more work than we thought. I think we're both willing to admit that.

[B]

No. You have two podcasts as well. Like, this is not your only gig.

[A]

Yeah, I do. Four podcast episodes a week.

[B]

Ridiculous. I was promised exclusivity in our contract, so we're have to talk about it.

[A]

I was promised K. So how's that true?

[B]

We're both disappointed. Okay. Episode 99. You guys are great. If you've been following us since, like, the very beginning, I appreciate you listening to us banter. This is literally just an excuse so that, like, Nate, Scotty, and I can hang out. That's the only reason that happens. So thank you so much. You guys are amazing. We're gonna make it to 100. I don't know what the hell we're doing for 100. Do you want the topic for today?

[A]

Yeah, hit me. What? You got lavender.

[B]

Thank you. Now I feel like I'm part of the team. All right. Yes. So Levenger, my husband and I, we're getting new rings. Don't ask us why. It's just because we feel like it basically more than anything else. So we're getting a rings this year because next year is going to be our 15th anniversary. Like, we've been married a long time. So it was like, ooh, this is the year, like, we got to commemorate because, hey, psychology and numbers. Go back and listen to that episode. Because numbers do weird things in the brain. So he's coming to me, asking me, poor consumer Casey. I'm, like, outing him on the Internet which ring he should get. And he goes, babe, I found one. I found one from a company that's amazing. He wants to get a ridge ring. That's the reaction. I was hoping you would.

[A]

Does he know that original grand sales rings?

[B]

He does. And so he. Okay. And again, to. To his credit, like, my husband is very kind to me, and I always ask him, like, can I use you for content? He's like, I don't care. So he's not gonna be too upset about this. But now I want to talk about from a marketer who's trying to get a customer in at the point of, like, ooh, you're getting to the point of, like, breaking off into a pattern. He's motivated to get a ring, which we can talk about the bj Fog model if you want. Motivated to get a ring. He has the ability and the cash to get one. How are you going to persuade consumer Casey to get a ring from you guys and not from Ridge?

[A]

It depends. How much. How often does he wear an original grain watch?

[B]

He wears your watch once a week? Twice a week? Maybe.

[A]

Yeah, that's. That's. That's not enough.

[B]

That's why really, yours is on brand?

[A]

Yeah. Like, I don't think.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

I don't think we're stealing a customer who's not wearing our watch more often.

[B]

Really? Are you sure?

[A]

No, no. But I think.

[B]

Interesting. Okay. And the only reason I asked you.

[A]

That, because here's why I think. What's he wear the other days? His Omega.

[B]

Yeah, Omega. Or he'll flip between Omega or brightly.

[A]

So, like, here's the thing. Our ring is designed to match one of our watches. It will clash with all other watches. He can get a more kind of generic, boring ring from a different company.

[B]

The boring one.

[A]

But it'll never clash no matter what watch he's wearing.

[B]

Yeah, I guess. So are you kind of more. They're all made of wood or do you have any metal ones?

[A]

They're all inlaid in tungsten. So, like, they're like, they're good quality. We. We make them in the same spot. Every other ring company you can think of makes theirs.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah. But they all have wood in them. They're the same color tungsten as our watches are. So like, they're. They're just purpose built to match our watches, which maybe is a mistake on our end because I do think it. It. It limits us to like, guys who buy our rings wear our watches five days a week.

[B]

Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. So you guys actually have a different psychological. Yeah, you've all. You've actually encouraged a very different psychological behavioral process.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Just because it matches. I would propose to original brain to make two types of rings that don't match any of your watches. One basic gold, one basic silver. Mostly because you have them and they're not selling.

[A]

I know. I said, like, just to have them.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 100. Just to have them. Mostly because I. I mean, this is anecdotal, but I've never met a dude that was like, I want a green and gold and red ring.

[A]

Right? Yeah.

[B]

Well, most of them are like, I want silver or I want gold. That's it. Some of them nowadays are wanting, like a rubber ring, which I find really interesting.

[A]

Rubber ring?

[B]

Yeah. This is like a thing with weightlifting and farming and like, all kinds of crazy stuff. Outside of that, though, the basic rings that my husband's looking for, which, again, he's in your clientele, he's in your market because he wears your watches and he's, like, interested in getting more. And I keep telling him, like, slow down. And you have like five watches. You can't even wear them all. Whatever. Anyways, so he's interested in the rings, and so I told him you need to go look on original grain and take a look at theirs and see if you like theirs better. Do you want to know the reason why he's getting a ridge ring? Yeah, he. He said it was not the look, it was the material. He loved the way your guys has looked, but they have a specific material that he was looking for.

[A]

What do they have?

[B]

Ridge. Shout out to Sean, too. I know he doesn't listen to this podcast, but, like, shout out to you because, man, my husband went like, deep into the rabbit hole. So he was looking at.

[A]

They've crushed rings. I mean, they have.

[B]

Which I'm like, shocked because they sell wallets, which is similar to what you guys.

[A]

I mean, fantastic case study in, like, category expansion.

[B]

I need to go do some digging on those. You know what Damascus is?

[A]

I do know what Damascus is, yes.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

This is working on some Damascus watches.

[B]

What is Damascus?

[A]

So it's this process of making steel where you get it super hot and then you fold it over like a million times. It's how they made, like samurai swords and stuff.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Super tough, super strong. And then it has this like really cool, like, layered kind of look to it.

[B]

It looks like wood. Yeah, it does looks like wood.

[A]

I was like, we should put a Damascus ring on the board.

[B]

Yeah. Okay. So that was the only reason why is because he was like, I actually really like the way this looks because it's black. It kind of looks a little bit like carbon fiber, he said, which is like really into carbon fiber. But it looks a little bit like that wood tone to it. But it's just. It's a very distinct looking ring.

[A]

Yeah, that's fair.

[B]

That was the only reason why he didn't choose you guys. He was. It was the. What it's, like, made of. And that's I find really interesting. That's just around rings. It seems like you guys have actually taken that need from a behavioral standpoint of like, I need it made of something in particular and applied it to watches. I haven't seen this almost anywhere else. People typically want gold, platinum, titanium. Those are normal materials that people look for in the buying process when it comes to jewelry, very rarely do they look for that in watches. Usually in watches it's filtered. Meaning when people look for watches, I want a silver one or I want a gold one, they usually are talking about the color.

[A]

Yeah. Not what the brand that they can afford. Yeah, that's it. Yeah.

[B]

This is the only time I'm like, you looked at what it was made.

[A]

I'm not going to look at what good consumer. Consumerism from. From Casey right there. He's consuming hard.

[B]

He's consuming. So he always consumes art consumer. Casey goes hard at it, people. And that's which is funny because they actually had a carbon fiber one on there. And I think he was kind of like, I like the black Damascus one more. So. Okay, so we'll talk about this a little bit because this is something that I'm studying heavily right now, which is the BJ Fogg model. Have we talked about that before?

[A]

I don't think so.

[B]

Okay. BJ Fog is a behavioral scientist psychologist that basically studied a whole bunch of humans in like different areas of their life and watched people behave all over the world. Like all over the place. Right. He was basically just trying to figure out how do decisions and behaviors get made with humans. So it's not specifically for marketing, but his model is interesting because it basically says you have to have three things to elicit any behavior from any human on the planet. First thing you have to have is motivation. Like they have to want it obviously, and it's got to be pretty high for people to go and actually actively seek it out. The second thing you have to have is like ability. So you got to be capable of getting it. Right. So you might want to work for like a Fortune 500 company, but before you do that, you have to have like at least a four year degree. That's the ability part. Right.

[A]

Could ability be like they have to have the cash for it. It also has to be sold in their area. They have to like, okay, exactly.

[B]

It comes. Ability comes in in all sorts of weird ways. It's not just about like, are you mentally able to do it? It's like, can you physically go get it?

[A]

So motivation, motivation, ability, ability.

[B]

And then the last thing is the prompt. Now marketers assume that prompt means they saw an ad that's a type of a prompt. But it's not the only type of prompt.

[A]

Right. That's when we would go back to like the moment in their lives, how they feeling?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So this all goes into like, you have to have all three of these in play. You often see this, like, great example, brushing your teeth in the morning, right? So that's the prompt. You walk into the bathroom. It's early in the morning. You see your toothbrush prompting comes in. Your brain goes, ah, crap, I forgot I have to, you know, do that this morning. You're only motivated because it's the morning. And your motivation is like, I need to, like, get rid of the nasty smell of, like. Like sleep breath. You have an ability to do it, obviously, because you've been brushing since you were, like, three. So very quickly, you just get that done, Right? The brain doesn't have to think about teeth brushing anymore. But if you happen to get out of bed and possibly, like, get on a phone call real quick and then walk out of your room into a different room because you didn't see the prompt of seeing the toothbrush, you wouldn't go brush your teeth. You would forget to do it that day.

[A]

Even though the motivation and the ability are there, the prompt isn't there, so you don't do it.

[B]

Exactly. The prompt isn't there. So it's like, like, well, like, when it comes to selling rings, how do we get somebody to come over to us using the BJ Fogg model and not, like, go to our competitors? Casey's very motivated because he's like, I'm ready. Like, we're getting new rings. Like, I've had this one for 15 years. We're just kind of, like, celebrating being together for this long. It's time for me to get something special. So he's looking for commemorative. Very common in your industry. He has the ability because he's got the cash flow and he's got, like, you know, I can go and search. I can order this today. I have no barriers because I can order it online and they'll just, like, deliver to my house. The prompt that he sees is going to be critical. Critical, because whatever that prompt is, it really has to match who he. We talk about this a lot. Has to match who he is as a person to be able to prompt him in the right direction. You don't want him to take a phone call and go this way and forget about you. So whatever that prompt is, whatever your ad is, whatever, like, whatever advertising you have in place needs to prompt around a behavior that he already does prompt around a behavior he already elicits.

[A]

So I would immediately think, like, we need to start marketing our rings, like, around date nights.

[B]

Like, interesting.

[A]

Like, around, like, hey, like, we know your Marriage is something you value because you carve right this time for it. Men who carve out time for their marriage wear our rings.

[B]

Oh, I love that.

[A]

I was gonna just freestyle the copy. I'm really talented.

[B]

No, but, like, try.

[A]

So. So I. I fully agree with you that I think a prompt is very rarely an ad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, to me, like, my ads try to capitalize on the individual prompts people are having in their lives, and I think we do that really well with watches. Like, we talk to guys who just accomplished something who just hit a. We talk to women who have a reason to buy a gift right now for their man. Not doing that with rings right now. Damn. Two episodes in a row, we discover something I'm not doing. Well, don't like that. Don't like podcast is headed. But yeah, I would market it towards, like, it's the same guy who spying our watches, who works hard and sacrifices for his. His family.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, guy who values his marriage and time with his. His wife. Like, I think we can definitely prompt harder in that direction.

[B]

Yes. Yeah, I think it'd be interesting to prompt around the date night experience because that's a when. So you prompt around a when. The other prompt that you could do, though, especially for my husband, we just talked about this, like, he really loves this black Damascus thing because of the way it looks and because of what it's made of. So it's very possible that you can start to put in prompts around the materials that he likes. So when he sees those materials in real life, he'll be prompted to remember the ring.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Now for you, that's kind of hard because it's like, how the hell would we know what kind of, like, materials he's around? But for him, just knowing my husband, he loves carbon fiber things because carbon fiber is what his paramotor is made of.

[A]

Hold on.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Casey does the same for that anti your backpack in.

[B]

Yes. He flies on literally like a trash bag attached to a ceiling fan.

[A]

And I think I finally found the perfect paramoter for me.

[B]

In the air.

[A]

Casey is so much cooler than I thought.

[B]

He is bonkers. And that's why I married him, because it was like, sir, I don't know.

[A]

That, you know, so funny that you thought you could mention that on minute 18 of episode 99 of this podcast. And I wasn't gonna stop the episode in its tracks.

[B]

I didn't know. You didn't know it. I thought we already talked about this, like, many times. Yeah, he's a paramotorist. Is that what? That. It sounds like a terrorist, A paramotorist.

[A]

Dang. That's wild. Good for him.

[B]

Yeah. You know, it's great for him. It's not lovely for the people who are on the ground, like, waiting for him to just come back down. But, yeah, you know, it's an interesting sport. It's made of freaking carbon fiber. And he just. We take it out in my Tacoma in this big field, and he just straps it on and then runs like a duck.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then, like, me up in the air.

[A]

So then interesting that he went with Damascus and not the carbon fiber, because Damascus is super heavy. They couldn't make that thing out of Damascus.

[B]

Yeah. That's why he liked it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because he. He's had carbon fiber rings before that. He was like, it just feels like I'm going to break it. Because it's light. It's very lightweight. He likes the heavy feeling of the weight of the ring, because psychology. The heavier your products are, the more quality they're gonna feel. So that's why he liked the Damascus one, because it was like, it looks like carbon fiber, but it feels like it's made of freaking steel.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

I'm telling you. I'm like, this was a good episode, and I just came up with this off top of my head, like, three minutes in. I was like, oh, we should talk about Casey.

[A]

That's super interesting.

[B]

Yeah. So your prompt. Your next prompt. Interesting. About date night. I would test that one for sure.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But the next one I would do is carbon fiber. Right. Looks like carbon fiber, feels like steel. That's the intersection. And then. You guys are so great at this. Make sure you put the pattern of the material that it's made of.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Real close up so that people can tell what it is, what it looks like.

[A]

Yeah. We've got great photography of the rings. And I wonder if we should go in the direction, because what people ask us a lot is, like, they want to make sure the rings are, like, solid and built to last so we can do, like, hey, like it. You know, it looks like. Or it has inlaid in it whiskey barrel wood. But, like, it's completely sealed in tungsten. That's indestructible.

[B]

Yeah. Tungsten is also one of those things that people look for. Yours are interesting, though, because they don't look like tungsten.

[A]

Right.

[B]

They feel like it because they're heavy, but they're made of wood and tungsten.

[A]

Interesting. Well, it looks like we've got some work to do on. On ring sales.

[B]

Yeah. Well. And I know you guys have been working on that for a while. So I was like, this might be an interesting episode because rings is a totally different behavioral process for the brain.

[A]

I wouldn't say a while. About three weeks ago, I decided we should show Rings.

[B]

Okay. Three weeks ago we started working on rings. Yeah. So this will be really interesting to see. What kind of prop can you put in place that will help people recognize you in their own life? Right. Recognize you in their own life.

[A]

Oh, that's such a good way to frame advertising. That should be the entire episode. Is that sentence. How can you frame your products to exist in, like, what they already do?

[B]

Yeah, what they're already doing. How they're already looking at stuff. Because what you want them to do is you want him to go out and like, get his carbon fiber freaking paramoter ready to go, and he's gonna go on a flight, look at that material and say, ah, ah. Original grain still has those rings. I need to go back and take a look at those. Yeah, that's what you want him to do. That's why you advertise in the first place. You don't convince him to buy anything. You're just reminding him that that was something he already wanted.

[A]

Yeah. I'm a big believer. We've talked about it like, we have no control over making someone buy or not. But what we can do is I think we can increase their motivation. We can't create it, but I think we can, like, increase the intensity of it. We can't control ability at all. And I think we can increase the frequency of how often they're being prompted. And we can make our prompts look like it fits in their life already. But yes, so much of that process has to happen in the individual consumer.

[B]

And it's got to happen pretty much weekly. Like, this is the reason why the toothpaste example is pretty poignant. For this is it's got to be something that reminds them of you all the time. This happens when you date people a lot where it's like, oh, that was his, like, favorite place to get, like, spaghetti or whatever it is. Or it's like he uses the same sponge to clean his dishes. Ridiculous. But it's like it's brain associations is all it's doing is it reminds you of him because you've chosen to make that a very critical part of your life, not because his dish sponge is interesting.

[A]

Yeah, you lost me on that example. I haven't watched a dish in years. But sure, whatever you say, Lenger.

[B]

All right. So now I need you to go test this and see what comes out of it.

[A]

We definitely will reframe ring ads. I'm so excited. Yeah, that's. That's how we should be talking about it. And then I'm gonna send Casey an email.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Like, not an email campaign. I'm gonna send him personally an email from me.

[B]

That's like. Dude, you're like, are you not one of you?

[A]

What the hell, bro?

[B]

Dude, what the hell? I thought we were bros. That's so funny. You absolutely should. That would crack him up for weeks. He would laugh so hard.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay, where can people find you if they want to see what you're doing?

[A]

You follow me on Twitter or whatever and listen to a podcast. I don't know. I don't know. It's fine.

[B]

You're gonna have to go search. If you really want to find Nate, you'll find him. He's out there.

[A]

Figured out.

[B]

Okay. Follow me at Sir Levenger everywhere you could zoom. Content. Although I'm slowing down on content for a second. My brain is real tired. My guys. So you'll see me on Twitter a lot and on LinkedIn a lot. I don't know about Tick Tock. I get a weird vibe over there. Not sure it's a lot. So I think I'm gonna just let them do what they do over on the Tick Tockers. Yeah.

[A]

I'm so out on short form content. Consuming it, creating it. I don't respect people who spend time on it.

[B]

Hey, that's me. Or it was earlier this summer. I haven't done it a while.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

I actually really love the long form stuff. Like, that's where my jam is. I just want to sit here and talk your face off for 17 hours is really what Sarah wants to do. Anyways, thanks for 99. I like the episode. 99. Done.

[A]

See you in triple digits.

[B]

Brain Driven Brands is part of the Learn and Laugh series on the Quickfire podcast network and is presented by Tether Insights. For more information, go to Tether Insights. IO.