Commerce Media: Revolutionizing Consumer Engagement

Summary

BRAVE COMMERCE Podcast Summary Episode: Commerce Media: Revolutionizing Consumer Engagement
Release Date: November 26, 2024
Hosted by Rachel Tippograph and Sarah Hofstetter

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Introduction and Panelists

In this insightful episode of Brave Commerce, hosts Rachel Tippograph, Founder and CEO of Micmak, and Sarah Hofstetter, President of Profitero, engage with three distinguished marketers to explore the evolving landscape of consumer engagement in eCommerce. The panelists include:

• Marcia Resnick – Head of E-Commerce at Pernod Ricard
• Kevin Shapiro – Senior Vice President of US Consumer Beauty for Coty in North America
• Jessica Goon – Chief Marketing Officer of Tate’s Bake Shop

Moderated by Kayla Darcy, a leader within the commercial organization, the discussion delves into strategies for engaging consumers across diverse and highly regulated industries, leveraging influencer-driven content, and harmonizing creative artistry with data-driven science in marketing.

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Shifting Consumer Engagement in the Commerce Media Era

The conversation opens with Marcia Resnick highlighting the transition brands face as consumer data shifts from traditional retail environments to digital spaces.

“You probably never own much of that retailer data, which really is the customer relationship... How have your consumer engagement strategies shifted in the time that we live in now, the commerce media era?”
[03:24] Marcia Resnick

Jessica Goon elaborates on the necessity of forward-thinking strategies:

“A lot of that is using data, using everything you have... How do you take all of that data and science and then marry it with art and look forward?”
[06:09] Jessica Goon

Marcia adds that without proactive adaptation, brands risk perpetually catching up rather than leading consumer engagement.

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Internal Cultural Shifts and Organizational Changes

Sarah Hofstetter shares her experiences transitioning from fashion and beauty to the alcohol industry, emphasizing the importance of cross-functional collaboration.

“We are a team of experts across media, commerce, content, data and technology and consumer experience. We work together and collaborate to meet the consumer wherever they are on their journey.”
[07:45] Sarah Hofstetter

Kevin Shapiro discusses the internal dynamics at Coty, focusing on building a cohesive team dedicated to advocacy and consumer response:

“Bringing together one team under a dual leadership model... really changed how we operate.”
[10:12] Kevin Shapiro

He further explains the integration of individuals with diverse backgrounds to foster a data-driven yet creative approach to marketing.

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Measuring Success in Commerce Media

The panel shifts to metrics and measurement of consumer engagement effectiveness. Jessica Goon emphasizes a multifaceted approach:

“There's never a single metric that is the metric... If you can't see it in the total results, is it really working?”
[17:19] Jessica Goon

Sarah Hofstetter highlights the importance of comprehensive KPIs, such as Return on Ad Spend (ROAS) and share lift, to gauge success:

“Our success is really grounded in strong partnership across these disciplines.”
[18:12] Sarah Hofstetter

Kevin Shapiro adds that aligning KPIs with strategic objectives ensures intentional and measurable outcomes:

“Understanding what you are trying to do and what is the cost of what you're trying to do.”
[18:46] Kevin Shapiro

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The Role of Influencers and Community Engagement

Influencers and community interactions play a pivotal role in modern marketing strategies. Kevin Shapiro illustrates this with an anecdote about engaging with a non-traditional beauty creator:

“We saw that our profile views that day that we sent her the three CoverGirl yummy glosses went up over 50%...”
[22:37] Kevin Shapiro

Jessica Goon echoes the significance of leveraging consumer comments as insights for content creation:

“Comments as creative can really be the fuel... building that emotional connection with them for the brand.”
[24:37] Jessica Goon

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Industry-Specific Insights: Alcohol, Beauty, and Food

Alcohol Industry Challenges and Adaptations

Marcia Resnick probes into the unique challenges faced by the alcohol industry, particularly around regulations:

“We can't exchange anything of value with a retailer that's licensed... So the commerce media opportunities that do exist for us need to be maximized within the constraints...”
[15:03] Marcia Resnick

Sarah Hofstetter discusses how Pernod Ricard navigates these limitations by collaborating with third-party partners and unlicensed retailers to activate data-driven media strategies.

Beauty Industry Innovation

Kevin Shapiro highlights Coty's proactive approach in the beauty sector, where frequent purchases and passionate consumers drive continuous engagement:

“Are you telling an interesting story? Are you engaging in a way that makes sense?”
[20:52] Kevin Shapiro

He underscores the balance between creative storytelling and data analytics to resonate authentically with consumers.

Food Industry Consumer Connections

Jessica Goon shares Tate’s Bake Shop's strategy of using consumer comments as a foundation for broader content and influencer campaigns:

“A single comment on one of our TikToks... can build out an entire influencer subsegment.”
[24:16] Jessica Goon

This approach fosters a deeper emotional connection and leverages real-time consumer feedback for content generation.

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Conclusion

The episode concludes with a reflection on the brave steps taken by the panelists in their respective careers, underscoring the importance of intuition, adaptability, and courage in driving successful consumer engagement strategies.

Rachel Tippograph wraps up by encouraging listeners to explore more episodes featuring these leaders and to engage with the Brave Commerce community.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Marcia Resnick [03:24]: "You probably never own much of that retailer data, which really is the customer relationship."

• Jessica Goon [06:09]: "How do you take all of that data and science and then marry it with art and look forward?"

• Sarah Hofstetter [07:45]: "We are a team of experts across media, commerce, content, data and technology and consumer experience."

• Kevin Shapiro [10:12]: "Bringing together one team under a dual leadership model... really changed how we operate."

• Jessica Goon [17:19]: "If you can't see it in the total results, is it really working?"

• Kevin Shapiro [22:37]: "We saw that our profile views that day that we sent her the three CoverGirl yummy glosses went up over 50%."

• Jessica Goon [24:16]: "Building that emotional connection with them for the brand."

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This episode of Brave Commerce offers a comprehensive exploration of modern consumer engagement strategies across diverse industries, emphasizing the synergy between data-driven insights and creative execution. The panelists provide actionable insights and highlight the importance of adaptability in an ever-evolving eCommerce landscape.

Transcript

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[Jessica Goon]

How can you look ahead and constantly look ahead and constantly test and learn while also looking backwards at the data so that you evolve with the consumer?

[Sarah Hofstetter]

We are a team of experts across media, content commerce, content data and technology and consumer experience. We work together and collaborate to meet the consumer wherever they are on their journey.

[Kevin Shapiro]

For us, it's really about making sure I mentioned earlier having a new team in place when we think about advocacy and responding to the consumer. So first it's about making sure that's part of our internal culture, to be interested, to listen, to see what's out there, and to see how we can inspire.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Welcome to today's episode of Brave Commerce.

[Rachel Tippograph]

I'm Rachel Tippograph, the founder and CEO of Micmac.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I'm Sarah Hofstetter, president of Profitero, and.

[Rachel Tippograph]

This is a show that talks about what's relevant in E commerce for the world's biggest brands. So very excited to share this session from Brave Commerce live because it features three great Micmac customers. So we have Marcia Resnick, who's the head of E Commerce from Pernod Ricard. We have Kevin Shapiro, who is the SVP of US Consumer Beauty for Coty in North America. And we have Jessica Goon, the Chief Marketing Officer of Tate's Bake Shop, which was an acquisition from Mondelez a few years ago. And then who's moderating this session is a great McMacker, a leader in our commercial org, Kayla Darcy. What you're going to hear them talk about is we got one entity selling alcohol, another beauty, another cookies, and at the end of the day, everyone is in service of trying to win the hearts and minds and stomachs of these consumers. And so you're going to hear them talk strategies in terms of how to engage with consumers in a highly regulated industry, how to engage consumers in a world that's really now driven by creators, AKA influencers, and how to still balance the art and science of marketing. So on that note, let's bring three great marketers onto the show. Marcia, Kevin and Jessica.

[Marcia Resnick]

Thank you all for joining me. I am really passionate about this topic. It's commerce media, how we're revolutionizing consumer engagement at Mic Mac. We talk about this day in and day out with our customers. And so to kick off our session, let's introduce ourselves and share how you relate to this topic today.

[Jessica Goon]

Hi everyone, I'm Jess Goon, CMO at Tate's Bakeshop. We did commercialize a product in six weeks. I don't know where the Campbell's team went, but we're not at all competitive. Really excited to be here and talk about consumer engagement and how Tate's is really taking a challenger brand mindset and thinking about the consumer as we look ahead.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Hi everyone, my name is Marcia Resnick. I work for Pernod Ricard. For those that don't know Pernod Ricard as a company, you will know many of our brands. Within our portfolio we have absolute Jameson, Malibu, Kahlua along with several others, and I lead the E Commerce team. The role that I'm in involves thinking through and developing and executing strategies that are specifically tailored towards the evolving commerce landscape. And so this topic is very much near and dear as over the last three and a half years that I've been with the company, I've been working closely both with retail partners as well as internally through cross functional stakeholders on adapting to this shift in how we operate and getting closer to the consumer through the journey.

[Kevin Shapiro]

Hi, I'm Kevin Shapiro and I lead US Marketing at Coty. That was a good reminder on Pernod Ricard and Campbell's for calling out brands. So if you haven't heard Cody, you've probably heard of CoverGirl, Sally Hansen, Gucci fragrances, Hu Abasa fragrances, and many other brands in our portfolio. I'm super excited to talk about consumer engagement. It's something that we've definitely been on a journey with the consumer and we've made a lot of changes in the last six months. So I'll talk more about them and kind of weave them in as the discussion goes.

[Marcia Resnick]

Love it. My favorite things, makeup, cookies and alcohol. I like Other things too. So you all work at brands, however, that historically the majority of your sales they were not direct and they were coming from retailers. As a result, you probably never own much of that retailer data, which really is the customer relationship. And the space now has evolved and retailer data has left the shelves and it's in places where consumers spend their time, like social media or you know, when they're sitting on their couch watching TV or Hulu, whatever. How have your consumer engagement strategy shifted in the time that we live in now, the commerce media era?

[Jessica Goon]

I love the idea of a shift because a shift is really something where you can only see it's a shift when you look backwards, right? Whereas I think when we're thinking about the consumer, it's happening in real time and it's iterative and it's constantly changing. And so then all of a sudden you look back and you realize you have completely changed how you are engaging with the consumer. It's just happening slowly over time. So a lot of that is using data, using everything you have. You might have 10 different pieces of data, 20 different pieces of data, a CDE, a CRM, that's still all backwards looking. So it's how do you take all of that data and science and then marry it with art and look forward? So a lot of that is small signals. Maybe it's something that you start to see on social media, Maybe it's a TikTok trend, maybe it's something you see just in your life that you and your friends are doing differently and then you take that and you test it and you see if it works and then you keep doing it and then you look backwards at the data and then all of a sudden you look back and there's been a shift in how you engage with consumers. But I think if you don't do that over time, which is very much more of a challenger brand mindset, you will constantly be in the cycle of catching up and looking at what everyone else is doing and catching up again. So I think the way we're thinking of this at Tates is how can you look ahead and constantly look ahead and constantly test and learn while also looking backwards at the data so that you evolve with the consumer.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I started and up until joining Purno, spent most of my career in fashion and beauty, oftentimes working across own channels where I had access to lots of rich data and was much more connected to the consumer. So upon joining Pernod, that was certainly a big learning curve for me. You don't know what you have till it's gone. At Pernod, I'm part of a center of excellence been a hot topic today called Marketing Accelerator, which was created as a direct response to this shift in landscape. We are a team of experts across media, commerce, content, data and technology and consumer experience. We work together and collaborate to meet the consumer wherever they are on their journey. And our success is really grounded in strong partnership across these disciplines. As an example, when I first started at Pernod, E commerce and media sat within different pillars of the organization. And while we strive towards collaboration, it wasn't integrated in how we approached bridging those two really critical elements. Today we sit side by side, we develop our strategies holistically, and we think not just about how we're stimulating demand, but also how we're capturing demand for that full funnel approach.

[Kevin Shapiro]

Agree with what's been said so far, I feel like I probably am going to end up selling Mic Mac a little, but I would say, yeah, we're all ears. As an example, of course, the majority of our, certainly all the brands in our division that I lead, but still most of the company's brands are sold through, you know, in the wholesale channels. And so we don't have a lot of that transactional data. But it's understanding what tools are out there to be able to get insights around intentionality. So tools like Mic Mac, where you can look at, add to cart numbers and percentages and breakouts between retailers, or other tools like Edo, for example, that has grown a lot since we started working with them as announced at the upfronts last week. But they look at search volume every time you air an ad, a traditional ad on either CTV or tv. So it's understanding that you're not going to have that D2C luxury of all the transactions, but being comfortable with putting together different pieces of data that tell the story, combined with what's happening in social and other places where consumers are having dialogue and creating content in order to build what you want for. For next week, next month and the next quarter.

[Marcia Resnick]

Yeah, I want to take what you said in building and moving that forward, especially as it relates to internally. I can imagine, you know, changing a strategy doesn't happen overnight and it requires internal culture, organizational change of thinking. And so I'm curious, what shifts did Cody need to make in order to execute differently?

[Kevin Shapiro]

That's a great question. We did a few things. One is we did create a new team specifically to drive our covergirl advocacy. And so that meant bringing together a lot of different functions that might have been sitting in different parts of the organization. There's still centers of excellence that support each individual on that team. But bringing together one team under a dual leadership model between our global team and local team, looking at things that are owned like site analytics and CRM, but also paid and earned, which comes from the US team. But actually sitting and working as one team with that do a leadership model really changed. That's one. Secondly, a lot of that team were people new to the company. So we have a lot of people that came from either retail partners or just other places that had more data at their fingertips and were more native to having that constant ying and yang of data creative solutions, data creative solutions and kind of had a different approach to things. And then third, we're now in the process of scaling that to other teams in the organization and trying to bring that mindset and the results that we've seen to our broader portfolio.

[Marcia Resnick]

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[Sarah Hofstetter]

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[Marcia Resnick]

Jess Now I'm curious. I can imagine it's somewhat similar at Tate's with a shifting landscape. You know, there's so much alignment that you need to do internally with your stakeholders. So what have you learned from these experiences? And you Know what has been required for you to explain to your peers how you need to shift your go to market strategy?

[Jessica Goon]

I think it's two things. One is you just have to start doing it, doing it in small ways and then showing the proof. I think earlier in my career I spent a lot of time trying to explain things to people for a group like this, like, we get so excited about all of the data and the technology, and then you start to see people's eyes just gloss over. And so I learned sort of by trial and error to stop trying to teach people and just do it and show it to them. And that was the best way to sort of get that buy in was I produced a video once that was literally like, look at how a person would use their phone. They might see an Instagram ad and then they'd go over to the Google and then they would Google it and then they would click on this and that's how they buy it. And it just simplifying it instead of trying to explain it was the best way to get that buy in. And then when you can show people something tangible, that's enough. And then you scale it and you move on.

[Marcia Resnick]

I love that. At Mi'kmaq, we share a story. The Amazon coat of the Upper east side. Maybe you've heard it, but it's just that social recognition. So, Marcia, you have an added nuance, of course, in terms of alcohol, where you're operating in a highly regulated industry with times that are constantly changing. Can you share how commerce media manifests internally and externally in the alcohol industry?

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Yeah, the alcohol industry is both highly regulated and has many legacy practices, both of which are things that we've had to adapt for along this journey. Without going into too many legalities, the overarching principle is that we can't exchange anything of value with a retailer that's licensed. So that is a retailer that holds a liquor license which prohibits us from working directly with the likes of a Walmart Connect and accessing all of that amazing data that they have. And so the commerce media opportunities that do exist for us need to be maximized within the constraints of what we're able to do in the legal landscape internally. What this has looked like is that we have undergone a lot of education. I haven't made a video, but it's on my list of things that I intend to do, truthfully. But education upskilling. We've really had to adapt how we work together across the marketing, accelerator, team sales and marketing so that we're all benefiting from this shift that we can all do our jobs in the most effective way and it's a journey that we've been on over the last several years. It's a journey that we're still on. We've made good progress externally. What this looks like for us is that we don't have access to all of the same data and capabilities that a less regulated category would have access to. But we work with third party partners as well as with unlicensed retailers. So for example Rachel, you mentioned earlier we will work with the trade desk to access the Walmart connect data and activate it. We may work through a meta collaborative ad that would allow us to access and activate the data or we would work with unlicensed partners like Doordash or Uber Eats. So it's really just about maximizing the opportunities within the constraints that we have.

[Marcia Resnick]

Excellent. Now let's talk a little more about metrics. Emily Theo Emily Thomas Theobold from Church and Dwight mentioned it. Mike Pearson from Campbell's just mentioned it. You know there's no shortage of data but how are you measuring success of your engagement activities and commerce media?

[Jessica Goon]

It's twofold. One, there's so much you have to measure. There's never a single metric that is the metric. There's not a silver bullet data point that you can use. When 9 out of 10 of your data points are telling you the same thing, you start to build confidence in it. The other thing is if you can't see it in the total results, is it really working? You should be able to see if you're turning on a lot of stuff you might not know exactly what's driving the growth. But if you can't see it in the base numbers, I don't know that it's working. And sometimes it's that simple. It is, it's sort of back to art and science is what is all of the really rich data insights intel telling you and then do you see it in the in the total numbers? And if that's the case then great. You just have to figure out what of those things to keep doing and then do more of.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I agree. There's not just one thing that we look at for our off site media we are often looking at roas or if we're leveraging Mic Mac looking at add to cart rates for on site. We do try to look at sales and share lift. We talked about share a little bit earlier on today. For me that is my North Star KPI and I am with the data that we have available trying to assess Whether the commerce media that we're activating and really the media overall that we're activating is helping to drive the outcomes and the share growth that we're looking to achieve.

[Kevin Shapiro]

Again, I agree with both of you. What I would add to that are a couple of things. One is that what's most important, regardless of the KPIs themselves is what is your strategic objective. So one of the things and those of you in the audience who I work with know that I'm cautious about is like the dashboards and the constant like democratizing of data. Not because I want to keep things close, but because we have intentionality. Especially when it comes to the precision of retailer media and eventing and omni commerce, whether that's again online or even in store. And so is the intentionality about building penetration and the costs associated with that. Is the intentionality about building regimen and basket, Is it what's happening at the event? And so when you have kind of the data available and you look on month over month or year over year and either events might move or your objectives for an event could change, I think the most important is really understanding what are you trying to do and what is the cost of what you're trying to do. Whether it's a growth audience or a growth activity like that incremental penetration versus another repeat opportunity. The second one is that above any specific KPIs for marketing because obviously I mentioned some earlier from Edo and Big Mac. I always find that KPIs that are what Jessica referred to just like that everyone would recognize that aren't necessarily within the marketing world. So for example to me a KPI that is one that's not officially on our list but is starting to be in my mindset now is when we launch our A list priorities, are they getting an Amazon badge within like the first few months and are we ranking in the top 10 launches in beauty or at least in that segment within a few weeks of launching? Because those are things that are pretty self evident whether you're sales or our CFO or whoever. Like you don't have to go deep into marketing or media speak to say we're the number four mascara on Amazon right now, which we are props new launches.

[Marcia Resnick]

So thinking of that Kevin, you know Kody is playing in a highly innovative and competitive space of beauty and often beauty is the first in a lot of consumer movements. So how do you think COTY has infiltrated modern day culture?

[Kevin Shapiro]

Great question. Well first I agree entirely that beauty is at the forefront. We see it's just so exciting to work every day in an area that people care about and that people are passionate about. That's one. And secondly, that a purchase that's frequent, you know, there's other categories that people buy larger things once every five years or once every 10 years. But the excitement of giving yourself that little treat on a. On a weekly or, you know, you can buy beauty products as much as you want. So for us, it's really about making sure. I mentioned earlier having a new team in place when we think about advocacy and responding to the consumer. So first it's about making sure that's part of our internal culture to be interested, to listen, to see what's out there, and to see how we can inspire what stories are being told and what's that intersection between the stories being told, the products that we have, and where we can authentically be there. Because there's so many stories being told in beauty at any point in time that you need to choose the ones where you want to engage. Otherwise, people see through the bs. Like, we talk a lot about algorithms, but at the end of the day, the algorithms are just modeling what happens in our human brain. So there might be a more sophisticated algorithm on one platform for another that dictates kind of how many views or how much content gets exposed, but it comes back to like, are you telling an interesting story? Are you engaging in a way that makes sense? Like, can you really get that look effectively with Sally Hansen or with Rimmel London or with CoverGirl or that fragrance? So it's just kind of having that mindset to really listen and then also know when. When you can lead, when you might participate versus leading. So it's more than ever. With all the data available. It's still very much a combination of creativity and leading and reactivity, but also looking at hardcore metrics.

[Marcia Resnick]

Yeah, and I just want to dive into that, leaning into the community aspect. You know, Tia Mowry, she referenced that earlier. And Kevin, you said something that really resonated with me, that comments are the new content. So I once went viral with my comment on TikTok. I can tell you at the cocktail hour what the comment was. But, you know, I'm curious, how do influencers fit into that strategy?

[Kevin Shapiro]

Well, I mean, influencers, that's such a broad topic. So I would say one of the biggest unlocks around content comments or the new content that we've had is even as a big brand, the opportunity to engage in comments with creators that may not even be part of our roster. But Have a message that resonates with easy, breezy, beautiful, or resonates with little treats or little rewards or any of the roles that beauty can play for people. And so when we say comments are the new content, it's kind of. We've discovered some creators that are not traditional beauty. But, you know, we found one who is in nursing school, and every time she got an A on an exam, she would treat herself with some product. And so our team had found that and started commenting and engaging with her. And when she got her next day, she got a few CoverGirl lip glosses, and that just made everyone go wild. And so then coming back to hardcore metrics, we saw that our profile views that day that we sent her the three CoverGirl yummy glosses went up over 50% to our brand profile because everyone wanted to see, like, what else is CoverGirl about if they're engaging in people in this cool, fun, surprise and delight, authentic way. So there's many examples that's just kind of one where, where we look at the comments and see where it makes sense for us to, to jump in and give someone something special.

[Marcia Resnick]

Love that I want to shift into how this relates now to food. Jess. I. I mean, you can't necessarily get ready with me for. With cookies, right? But consumers are still, you know, they're buying CoverGirl, they're buying Absolut Vodka, they're buying Tate's cookies. So how do you see influencers fitting into this strategy when it comes to your industry?

[Jessica Goon]

I love comments as creative. It's also comments as insight. So a lot of it is we'll take a single comment on one of our TikToks and that is the new insight that then we will just expand. So my favorite this was today. Somebody commented on something we had posted about. If you are the person who keeps your household running, you deserve a little treat for yourself, which is a Tate's cookie. And somebody commented, I'm going to need a truckload then. And I love that it's this little insight of, okay, people are using the best tasting cookie in America as a little treat for themselves. And so what do you do with that? And then how do you engage influencers? How do you then create content around that comment that can be relatable to a whole cohort of people and can build out an entire influencer subsegment because one person commented that they deserve a truckload of Tate's cookies. So I think it's insight engine. Comment as creative can really be the fuel. It comes back to that consumer engagement. How are you listening to the consumer and really just reacting to them and building that emotional connection with them for the brand.

[Marcia Resnick]

Let's shift to alcohol. Marcia Curious. Can you talk about how you've seen the shift in consumer behavior, especially, especially, you know, with alcohol being regulatory, the three tier system, and how technologies have changed along the way with ways you're engaging with consumers?

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I've been at Purnow for three and a half years, so I started during the height of COVID and it has been a very interesting journey and really I've seen, I think, in the last three and a half years what in other times would take a much longer period. The transformation and the acceleration has just been unprecedented. And some of this was directly related to Covid and the acceleration of consumer behavior. People were flocking in droves to e comm solutions that could provide for their mixology hobbies that they decided to get into during COVID And it's been a really interesting transition to see. And in many ways we and technologies have had to keep up with consumer demand and with capturing that consumer demand. I spoke earlier around some of the legalities. Another legality that we have to navigate is that we are not able to show preference to a retailer from our marketing from our media. And so we leverage Micmac as a solution that allows us to drive traffic from media that we're running to our retailers in a legally compliant way. Other technology solutions have also come to market that have helped us operate in a legally compliant way and allowed for this significant shift in consumer behavior towards purchasing Bev alk online and the stickiness of it really to be supported. We're also seeing it with retailers who are rather rapidly evolving their set of capabilities to meet consumer demands too, because they don't want to be left behind. They don't want to be the last one standing either.

[Marcia Resnick]

There's so much more I want to continue to talk about and chat with, but our time is wrapping up. So with that said, our famous last question. What is the bravest thing you've ever done?

[Jessica Goon]

The bravest thing that I ever did was quit. And I was offered a really big promotion. And I think for a lot of us in the room, we're planners, we're analytical, we're data driven, always looking for the optimized next thing. And instead of doing this sort of on paper optimized next thing, I quit. I came to Tate's, which was great, but for me, quitting was really about gut and not just relying on the science and what's gonna be on the conveyor belt for the next thing. And I've talked a lot about art and science today. And so I think quitting and trusting my gut was the bravest thing I've ever done.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

When I was getting dressed this morning, I thought about how wearing white pants the day that you're gonna be on a stage is pretty brave. But I have another one. This is a two parter kind of. I moved out to Seattle for a job opportunity many years ago where I knew no one and at the same time started dating my now husband long distance for what ended up being a year. Both of those things were among the bravest things I've done.

[Kevin Shapiro]

I would say I was inspired by the quitting one because I was going to, I had a, I had one I was going to use, but I would say quitting. I also quit, actually my first job. I had no specific reason to quit, but no specific reason to stay. It ended up being a little bit longer journey until I landed the second job because 911 happened during like a couple months after I had quit. So it kind of the economy had slowed down and it extended the time that I had to myself. During that time, I moved out to the west coast and obviously built the experience and eventually got my MBA out there, which led to where I am now. So I would say if I would agree with Jessica, if something doesn't feel right, go for it. Even if it's like not necessarily a certain future because I didn't want to stay living where I was or doing that job.

[Marcia Resnick]

So, yeah, amazing. Thank you all for joining us today.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Well, guess what? We've had her. No Ricard, Cody and Tate's back. Big shop on the show. So if you want to look more into these companies, you can go check out Kevin Shapiro's original episode on Brave Commerce. You can go check out the CEO of Tate's Bake Shop, who is Jessica's leader se saying. And then you can go check out an episode with the global chief Digital officer, Pernod Ricard Pierre Yves. And if you like what you're hearing, write us a review. Thanks for listening.

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[Jackie Cooper]

Hi, I'm Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman and the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me this incredibly smart piece, Meet Everyone Once. As a result, I've met some of the most fascinating and inspiring people on the planet. Now on Touch of Truth, we're coming centre stage and sharing the mic to experience stories of truth, insights and visions for the future that will challenge your way of thinking. Touch of Truth is available wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out every Tuesday. I do hope to see you there.