Kerry Sullivan of Versed: Scaling Indie Beauty with Big Brand Expertise

Summary

Brave Commerce Episode Summary: Carrie Sullivan of Versed – Scaling Indie Beauty with Big Brand Expertise

Released on October 8, 2024, on Adweek’s "Brave Commerce," this episode features an insightful conversation with Carrie Sullivan, CEO of Versed. Hosts Rachel Tipograph and Sarah Hofstetter delve into Carrie’s journey from leading marketing at global giants like Neutrogena and Dollar Shave Club to steering an indie beauty brand. The discussion uncovers valuable lessons on scaling, marketing strategies, and navigating the evolving eCommerce landscape.

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1. Introduction

The episode kicks off with Rachel Tipograph introducing Carrie Sullivan, highlighting her impressive resume, including leadership roles at Johnson & Johnson’s Neutrogena and Unilever’s Dollar Shave Club. Rachel expresses excitement about Carrie’s transition to Versed, an emerging skincare brand poised for significant growth.

Notable Quote:

Rachel Tipograph [04:26]: "Carrie, thanks for joining us. We are very excited to have you onto the show, who you might not know of this brand yet, but you soon will."

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2. Career Journey: From Big Brands to Indie Beauty

Carrie shares her enthusiasm for her current role, emphasizing the agility and fast-paced environment of smaller brands compared to the structured settings of multinational corporations. She discusses how her experience with established brands provided her with best practices and deep retail relationships, which she now leverages to accelerate Versed's growth.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [05:12]: "Being able to bring both together, I think is my secret sauce. Because I've spent so much time with founders that I can walk the talk."

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3. Lessons Learned as CEO of Versed

Transitioning from CMO to CEO, Carrie highlights the importance of versatility and broad operational knowledge. She underscores the necessity of understanding various business aspects beyond marketing, such as logistics and finance, to effectively lead a growing company.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [09:23]: "I need to find contract manufacturers that are really interesting to work with. I don't have a big R&D team that can tell me where we're going to go source this from."

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4. Marketing Strategies for Modern Consumer Brands

Carrie outlines the contemporary playbook for building consumer brands, emphasizing a deep understanding of the target audience's needs and behaviors. She advocates for a full-funnel marketing approach that balances top-of-funnel awareness tactics with bottom-of-funnel conversion strategies.

Key Points:

• Consumer Insight: Knowing the "sweet spot" consumer, understanding their daily lives, and addressing their pain points.
• Full-Funnel Marketing: Combining creator work for awareness with retargeting efforts to capture conversions.
• Authenticity and Human Connection: Building genuine relationships with consumers rather than relying solely on data-driven tactics.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [14:08]: "You want to do lower funnel meta retargeting if you want to talk to new people. And so a full funnel approach being willing to do creator work that's much more top of funnel."

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5. The Role of TikTok and Social Media

Discussing the significance of platforms like TikTok, Carrie emphasizes the necessity for brands to maintain a presence wherever their consumers are. She highlights TikTok’s role beyond being a trend-driven platform, stressing its value for authentic creator engagement and storytelling.

Key Points:

• Multi-Generational Appeal: TikTok attracts not just Gen Z but also upper Millennials and Gen X.
• Authentic Storytelling: Leveraging creators who share genuine experiences and endorsements.
• Emerging Features: Excitement around TikTok Shop and its potential impact on eCommerce.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [16:28]: "TikTok is a platform for authentic creators to share their stories, share their endorsements."

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6. Industry Headwinds and Tailwinds

Carrie provides an analysis of current trends shaping the beauty industry. She identifies multiple factors influencing brand strategies, including economic resilience, consumer behavior shifts, and the influx of new innovations. She also warns against market saturation and stresses the importance of meaningful product differentiation.

Key Points:

• Economic Resilience: Beauty products often remain recession-proof, adapting to changing consumer needs.
• Innovation Overload: Caution against launching products without clear differentiation to avoid consumer confusion.
• Global Awareness: Navigating the complexities of the global marketplace, including supply chain challenges and international consumer trends.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [18:02]: "Beauty is largely economy and recession-proof. It's just that different habits and practices change in the context of different stages."

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7. Building Relationships with Retail Partners

Carrie discusses her approach to fostering strong relationships with retail partners, transitioning from interactions at large corporations to more collaborative engagements with smaller brands. She emphasizes the value of being creative, transparent, and actively involved in the day-to-day processes to build trust and drive mutual success.

Key Points:

• Collaborative Engagement: Working closely with retailers to understand and influence cultural trends.
• Beyond Formal Pitches: Focusing on creativity and relationship-building rather than just polished presentations.
• Empowering Retail Partners: Helping retailers become 'famous' within their circles by providing valuable insights and trends.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [23:29]: "It's less about the PowerPoint deck and the final sell in and the pitch. It's about being in the mix and in the day to day."

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8. Personal Insights: The Bravest Action

In response to the final question, Carrie recounts her bold decision to relocate to Asia with her family to expand her professional horizons. Despite uncertainties, this move profoundly shaped her perspective on global business operations and cross-cultural communication.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [23:35]: "The best thing I've ever done in my life, in my career was taking a big risk and a big chance at a much more disruptive, immersive experience."

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9. Conclusion

The episode wraps up with Rachel and Sarah thanking Carrie for her invaluable insights. Carrie shares where listeners can find Versed products, emphasizing availability both online and at major retailers like Target.

Notable Quote:

Carrie Sullivan [26:02]: "Versed.com is there for you too. So is target.com, which is a really a really big piece of business for us."

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Final Thoughts

Carrie Sullivan’s journey from leading marketing roles at industry giants to spearheading an indie beauty brand offers a compelling narrative on adaptability, comprehensive leadership, and strategic marketing. Her emphasis on authenticity, deep consumer understanding, and versatile operational skills provides actionable insights for brands aiming to thrive in the dynamic eCommerce and beauty landscapes.

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Additional Resources

Listeners interested in similar stories can explore episodes featuring Tia Mowry with her hair care line at Walmart or Osh from Mesa in a PE roll-up and innovation portfolio.

Transcript

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[Rachel Tippograph]

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[Carrie Sullivan]

On a small brand, you don't have a big media study to tell you exactly what to do. So really understanding the different levers that will reach or have reached our target audience, they capture their whole heart. They see it then multiple times and you're really following through a much more complex journey. Now, people aren't just clicking because you served them an ad. To your point. The D2C brands, I think, have learned that quickly and over time. You need to be able to hear it from a friend, see it in a store, catch a glance of an ad, hear a creator you trust and care about, talk about it, and then be in the store or online at the right time that it's time to replenish. And that's, you know, that's a multifaceted journey that you have to build a marketing funnel for.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Welcome to today's episode of Brave Commerce.

[Rachel Tippograph]

I'm Rachel Tippograph, the founder and CEO of Micmac.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I'm Sarah Hofstetter, president of Profitero, and.

[Rachel Tippograph]

This is a show that talks about what's relevant in E commerce for the world's biggest brands. Sarah, if you could spend your work hours doing any particular task or role, where do you naturally go? Executive assistant, meaning just like getting tasks done or.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

I love the Tetris of scheduling. It's terrible. Oh, it's like me loving to organize my fridge. I just like things, you know, being very neat and stuff. I have rarely done well with assistance in the past because I think I just enjoy it. I enjoy doing that work. I think if I'm like done working, but I Don't want my brain to just deteriorate. I might just be somebody's executive assistant. Okay, that's.

[Carrie Sullivan]

That's good to know.

[Rachel Tippograph]

All right.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Yeah.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Yeah.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

How about you?

[Rachel Tippograph]

Me, it's marketing. I just naturally lean there. I love to pontificate every which way for us to dominate the market and steal share from competitors. And if I could just do that all day long, I would be happy to do it.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

That's fair. That's probably a better answer. And actually one I wouldn't even realize that I'm naturally gravitating into. And it's. It's very hard. It's very, very hard because I come from the world of PR and then marketing. And so I remember when I got to Profitero, my immediate instinct was, let me dive into the marketing and see what's going on there. And I immediately drove Mike Black crazy because he was. I got this. You go run the company. We lean into a muscle that is not just familiar, but where you feel you can be super helpful and you feel like you can have immediate impact.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Yeah. And, I mean, there is the saying, strengthen your strengths. But I do think as a, like a full PNL owner, you got to be able to operate the entire thing and not just where you gravitate towards. On that note, there's an amazing marketer who's been a part of my and Mick Mac's life through a few of her roles where she led marketing for Neutrogena, then Dollar Shave Club, but she now finds herself in the seat as the CEO of Versed Skincare, which is a disruptive skincare brand. And we learned from Kerry on kind of her first year, the lessons that she learned in terms of moving from the CMO role to the CEO role. So on that note, let's bring Carrie onto the show and learn from her. Today, we are very excited to have Carrie Sullivan, the CEO of Verse, onto the show, who you might not know of this brand yet, but you soon will. And so, Carrie, thanks for joining us.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Thank you. Thank you for having me. Happy to talk all things beauty commerce.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Well, I was so excited when you said yes, because many of our listeners have a similar resume to you but have not taken the leap of faith to go to small or Challenger brand. And you and I met when you were at jj now known as Ken View, and you were running the Neutrogena business. And then we met again when you went to Dollar Shave Club, which at this point was owned by Unilever. And now you're adversed, which you know is a brand that's rising but might not be known to all. And so based on your bigger company experience, how do you feel like that's given you a competitive advantage in your current role and where do you have to get upskill?

[Carrie Sullivan]

I'm really enjoying this next chapter of my career and smaller, smaller brands, I would argue faster moving brands, which has been really, really fun. And the two entities that you mentioned, I think an important note, great big brands that I learned a lot from obviously many, many years working on the J and J beauty portfolio, Neutrogena specifically, where I can bring a lot of best practices, retail relationships, all the things that I learned to smaller brands. And I'm so excited to be doing that in this next kind of era of my career. And obviously dollar shave club, just such a privilege to do some of the same with Unilever, but on a really digitally native brand, which is just a whole other skill set that now I have that I can bring to again, these newer beauty brands. The first one I'm really excited to work with a founder directly on the part of my resume that you don't see as much on LinkedIn is that I actually spent many, many years on merger and acquisition committees meeting with founders, looking at brands that bigger companies might be able to help scale to the next level. And I just fell in love with talking to founders and I loved that part of my job so much because I could think about how these brands could be the next Neutrogena or the next Aveeno, or do something really different in the market than some of the legacy brands have done. And I just loved founders. They thought differently, they moved fast, they were demanding in a really unique way. And I just had this moment where I wanted to go actually work side by side with a founder, not be on the other side of the table, but be with them to bring the expertise, but also learn the unique way these smaller, more indie, more upstart brands were building a brand new playbook. And being able to bring both together, I think is my secret sauce. Because I've spent so much time with founders that I can walk the talk. I can gonna go founder mode, scrappy, always have even on bigger brands. But then when I need to go more like manager mode and big company process and get a big deck together for Target, I can do that too. And so I love flexing both. And I actually have realized upon reflection, I've been doing both for a long time.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Loved pulling on all of the muscles because you kind of don't know from a career Perspective where your story is going to end up leading to. So the things that become part of your unique arsenal is what makes you where you are. But nobody would have written that job description until you've had all of those different kinds of experiences. So I'm sure that when this opportunity presented itself, you're like, oh my gosh, I was totally born for this.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Yeah, I wanted to find the right founders to work with. Katherine Power, who founded Verse Skin, is certainly one of those prolific visionary founders, but very business minded founders. And finding that right founder where you could see eye to eye or if and when you disagree, you do so on the basis of really great dialogue is exactly the name of the game to find kind of your right match. The one thing that I've really learned a lot about in this kind of earlier stage growth company is actually staffing and recruiting. When I was at bigger brands, people always would say, and I think it was right, hire kind of a complimentary team around you. You know, you grow up as a marketer, make sure you have a good salesperson. And I think that that can be true depending on the situation. I've actually found in this earlier growth stage hiring people that already have your skill set so you don't gravitate there and actually digging in in the beginning and learning the things you're not as good at so that you then when you go higher for it permanently, you know exactly what you're looking for because you've done the work, you know. So it'd be so easy for me to as a brand manager, marketer, retail marketer, to want to gravitate toward those activities disproportionately. But one thing I had to learn as a smaller company was go to the warehouse first, understand who the consumer, what consumer comments were coming in through cx, get into the balance sheet, understand the cash position, not outsource that to a big finance team just because you're marked as a marketer in a big company. So I actually have done the opposite so far. And eventually you hire complimentary skills, but if you hire people who have the skill set you do, then you don't have to worry about gravitating toward the things you're just going to naturally spend time on. You're going to learn new things and get sharper at the other parts of your business, which being part of an end to end P and L leader, you have to understand everything and you have to know exactly how to recruit. Even if you didn't grow up with exactly that skill set at what point.

[Rachel Tippograph]

In your journey with first did you realize that?

[Carrie Sullivan]

I think six months in knowing I wanted to move fast and we had a lot of growth opportunity ahead and as a fast moving brand, a lot we wanted to go chase in a short order and lots of market opportunities. And my reflection was I'll spend all my time doing marketing and retail meetings if I'm not careful. And I need to know that the warehouse is prepared for this expansion. I need to find contract manufacturers that are really interesting to work with. I don't have a big R and D team that can tell me where we're going to go source this from. And as soon as I saw the plethora of market opportunities and the pace we were meant to move at, I started to think really differently about how I could approach this challenge.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

Really interesting, especially in the context of your experience and almost like not leaning into the muscle you're used to. When I think about, you know, dollar shave club, there's so many immediate things that you say, oh yeah, I've used that, that trick before or you know, I know this works. Although the market's always changing, influencer marketing is changing direct to consumer has become challenged in different ways. So now you've got both of these different experiences. You've got the bigger company experience, you've got what it's looking like at first. You've advised founders before. You talked about upskilling in different ways. What was the biggest unlock as you've thought through that, you've talked about finance teams going to the warehouse. What's the thing that surprised you the most?

[Carrie Sullivan]

What surprised me the most was how quickly you can kind of assess what you, what you need. The clearer you, not that you're going to do the job perfectly as well as an expert or a specialist, but getting in there and getting a little bit getting pretty dirty and understanding the space and the skill sets that's needed, the success factors and benchmarking to different people in the space that have those experiences. It also really pushed me to network in a really different, more disruptive way because I wanted to compare notes, I wanted best practices, I wanted to be at industry events. Is that even you know the right, the right vendor to partner with what are other brands that are non competitive learning and seeing in a big company you also network a lot within your own company because there's a lot of resources to do so. There's a big bad world out there of people who are doing really cool, smart things that don't have your company letterhead that are really fun to compare notes with. The second that that started to happen, I started to get a lot of connections going and learning a ton from different business operators, other heads of marketing, general managers, what they were seeing, what they were doing. I was able to really compare notes a lot faster and it's thrilling to be able to network in that way.

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[Carrie Sullivan]

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[Rachel Tippograph]

So your founder of Verse, Catherine, she was kind of one of the first millennial influencers. Now she's turned that into a lot of different businesses. One being Verse Skin the Playbook in terms of influencer marketing, creator marketing, whatever word you choose to use has evolved and direct to consumer brands that used to be built in. The backbone of Instagram and Shopify have also been challenged in recent years. Now that you've been in this seat leading verse, what do you feel is the Playbook to build modern day consumer brands?

[Carrie Sullivan]

Yeah, the playbook first is know where the sweet spot consumer is and I don't mean demographically but just really get in her head, his head, their head of who they are, what their day to day world is and what their pain points are. Make sure your brand and your top products have a market fit to address that and are going to solve a real problem and not just add more problems or complications, but really you're going to go after the bigger insights or pain points or difficulties in their day to day or routine and from there figure out how they're going to see a lot of you. You can't just do lower funnel meta retargeting if you want to talk to new people. And so a full funnel approach being willing to do creator work that's much more top of funnel, much more awareness driving which is harder to measure. And so you know, as a business operator, as a former cmo, you always have a finance team wanting to understand the ROI of everything. A real robust full marketing plan that's really going to make a brand sing is going to have very, very strong top and bottom funnel bets, even within creators and influencers. So sometimes you'll want to measure them based on roi, but sometimes you're doing them for a longer, longer vision on the brand and who you want to be working with and showing up with and being willing to take risks and have. That full funnel approach has been a huge unlock. I think just in the industry in general where you know, everyone was looking at last click and talking about attribution on a small brand, you don't have a big media study to tell you exactly what to do. So really understanding the different levers that will reach or have reached our target audience, they capture their whole heart. They see it then multiple times and you're really following them through a much more complex journey now of people aren't just clicking because you served them an ad to your point. The D2C brands I think have learned that quickly and over time. You need to be able to hear it from a friend, see it in a store, catch a glance of an ad, hear a creator you trust and care about, talk about it and then be in the store or online at the right time that it's time to replenish. And that's, you know, that's a multifaceted journey that you have to build a.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Marketing funnel for in all of that. Given how loud the media can be, what's the role of TikTok in building an emerging brand?

[Carrie Sullivan]

We have to be everywhere our consumer is. We don't get to decide that we'd rather be in one place or another. TikTok is my belief, not just Gen Alpha, Gen Z. We're very squarely and a lot of Katherine Powers brands are very much multi generational but definitely sweet spot upper millennial Gen x. They're on TikTok I look at all of our own behavior. That's not just a viral, trend driven platform. It's a platform for authentic creators to share their stories, share their endorsements. TikTok Shop is incredibly exciting because of that. I think that will be very interesting to watch over the next year, year and a half and where that goes. But that is not just a Gen Alpha, Gen Z playground at all. There are real authentic creators that are connecting with their audiences. And as a brand, if that's where your audience is, ours is upper Millennial, Gen X, that's where we'll be. And those are the creators we'll build relationships with across whether it's YouTube, TikTok, Meta, Pinterest, you name it. We want to be with the creators that matter most to our consumer because.

[Sarah Hofstetter]

It'S always so changing. What do you think are the big headwinds and tailwinds as you. I mean, TikTok is a very good point, but whatever, you know, the marketing darling du jour is it's more than just marketing to your point. So what do you see as the bigger headwinds and tailwinds? Even if we look the past five years in the world of beauty, you know, skincare was up during COVID Then cosmetics came back in when we started coming out again and there were supply issues and there are pricing issues. There's always a thing. What do you think of the future? Things that are going to be big swings.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Yeah, well, I think we all know that lipstick will keep enduring. That's not going anywhere. All joking aside, I think as we think about the next year or two, there's, there's been a real frenzy around beauty in the US in particular. That's been exciting for brands and it's brought in the next generation of consumers. It's made consumers who maybe had legacy routines really reconsider them and reevaluate and change up their routine, try some new products. Because they've heard about the rampant enthusiasm in skincare, body, hair, color, you name it. And I always say that beauty is largely economy and recession proof. It's just that different habits and practices change in the context of different stages. So beauty's not going, going anywhere. The question is just what do people need in the next year, year and a half? For us, it's really about a human touch, authenticity, a bit of reality. You don't need the next viral thing that your 10 friends said if it doesn't work for your skin. We want to be talking authentically and I really believe brands will win the day if they really understand what you need. Right, Sarah, what you need versus Rachel, what you need is, is different. You can trade notes, but your skin is very different. Your lives are different, the conditions you exist in are different, the beauty look you want is different. And so really understanding people at a much more human level. And while I love data and I love tech and I love all of the things we have to enable our plans and brands now, talking to consumers is going to win the day. Right now when people want a much more humble, authentic take on a brand. They want to see the people on the brand and know that they're real. They want to hear directly from somebody that doesn't sound like a consumer service rep. They want real advice and then be able to show off and talk about the results that they're actually getting in their skin. And to me that's a big important one on the horizon to recognize the authenticity piece. I think a headwind to that is obviously AI is super tempting and exciting and I think when used in the right way, it will bring a lot of good to brands. And what we can do in terms of the future of marketing, how it can help you crowdsource ideas, write some early taglines. But if we're solely relying on AI, we lose that human touch as brands. And so balancing the new and shiny tech with what is the tried and true, which is people just want to hear from you and know that you're going to make a difference in their lives. And not forgetting that in a world that's becoming ever more advanced, the other headwind is there's a prolific number of innovations and molecules and new vendors coming out to bring new scale skincare to the market. I think a headwind is we, we could all add way too much into the category and confuse the consumer even further. So being really judicious about why are you launching a new product, is it really different than what's on the market or what you offer today? And is it going to make a meaningful difference and are people going to love using it, like not just to launch it, to launch it because it has the next trending ingredient, but you know, there are many, many more options for us as product developers and really being thoughtful about which ones so that we don't contribute to continued category proliferation is a big one. And then my last one is just global marketplace. We started in the US in a really big way. But even a brand that is largely US based, we're in Canada, we're in the uk, continuing to be globally aware is so, so important. The Trends that are influencing the US beauty consumer, how the US dermatology practice is now influencing the global marketplace and then even just supply chain. I mean there are container ships backed up in every port right now in the country. And you know, that's because you have to understand that to run a business because the world is changing and the global marketplace means that you have to really understand what's happening outside of the boundaries of the countries you choose to compete in.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Perfectly well articulated. You know, when you think about headwinds and tailwinds as it applies to channel distribution, especially maybe not having the leverage of Neutrogena or Unilever behind you. How have those conversations evolved with your.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Retail partners going from big to small? Yeah, it's been exciting for me to be able to bring a lifetime of relationships to some of the smaller brands, you know, some of the, the buyer merchant partners I've called on for many, many years and have great friendships and relationships and know what they're looking for at the same time on a smaller brand, what's been just a breath of fresh air is they just want to know what's happening out there in the world. They want interesting new perspectives on trends, they want to ideate with you. We talk about being in the kitchen and bringing some early formulas. Even if we don't think they're perfect, we want their input. There's both being buttoned up when it's time for the final sell and pitch, but also just being real in the day to day and bringing them things that bigger companies aren't necessarily wanting or able to bring, which is a real pulse on culture, interesting new trends, a vision into where the category might be headed. Frankly, just having a lot of fun in the meeting and being creative together to build the business. You can get the formal pitch together when it's time for the big line review, etc. But just being really close with them and make your merchant or your buyer famous. Like what's it going to take to make them super, super famous within their own walls? Because you made them smarter, more inspired, brought them the best trends. It's less about the PowerPoint deck and the final sell in and the pitch. It's about being in the mix and in the day to day so you can keep bringing them what can be really disruptive to their categories.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Love that. We have to ask you our famous last question, which is what's the bravest thing you've ever done?

[Carrie Sullivan]

I love that. And you said personal or professional, right? So I have a range of options which is Very exciting. Yes. I think the biggest. The biggest. Biggest risk I ever took, scariest thing I ever did, was both personal and professional. I had a great Neutrogena career family nearby in the U.S. personally, two very little kids, very busy career, two career household. And I woke up one day and was like, I want to go work in Asia. And I didn't know how I was going to do it. I didn't know if it was possible. I just knew I was ready. I had learned every U.S. retailer. I had worked in every category in beauty. I still loved Neutrogena and wanted to do more for Neutrogena, but knew that something was happening in beauty in Asia that was really important and in commerce, and I wanted to be part of that future. And I also wanted the personal challenge of being able to work in different cultures in a more immersive way. And I raised my hand to be moved to Asia, and the company said yes. We were on a plane two months later, moving two little kids and two careers and a life before I even had a chance to think about it. To be honest, I'd never been to Singapore, I'd never been to Asia. I'd never worked in these cultures. And suddenly I'm repping this brand in a really new area. I did have doubts of, what the heck have I just done? Honestly, the best thing I've ever done in my life, in my career was taking a big risk and a big chance at a much more disruptive, immersive experience.

[Rachel Tippograph]

How long did you stay?

[Carrie Sullivan]

I told my father we'd stay 18 months, pro grandpa. And we stayed for four years, and we resisted even leaving as early as we did. Wow. Because it was so additive to my perspective, it's permanently formed my view on how you build businesses, how consumer trends, travel, how you should push your comfort zone personally to travel in places that you feel you have no business being. And also really taught me to listen in new, unique situations, like really listen to different cultures and understand the context and perspective in a much richer way.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Well, Carrie, it's clear that you're listening. In your new role at Verse, you talked about listening in the warehouse to your consumers, to your retail partner. So it's really amazing to see how that experience has shaped you.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Thank you. Thank you for having me. A lot of things to come unversed ahead and so just so, so excited to see both of you and connect again. And, Rachel, it's been fun to have you in the mix on every brand I've been on in the recent history.

[Rachel Tippograph]

So, Carrie, if people want to check out verse, where should they go? They go to Target.

[Carrie Sullivan]

They go, yeah, run, don't walk to Target. It's all there. And if you're you're sitting on your couch, versuskin.com is there for you too. So is target.com, which is a really a really big piece of business for us. So absolutely we're where you need to shop for a great under 25 masstige high efficacy product line.

[Rachel Tippograph]

Sarah's on it, so am I and thanks for your time.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Thank you.

[Rachel Tippograph]

If you enjoyed hearing about a disruptive skincare brand and you want to hear from other recent disruptors that we've had on the show, you can go check out Tia Mowry who has the hair care line for you at Walmart. Or go listen to our friend Osh who's at Mesa in a PE roll up and innovation portfolio. If you like what you hear, tell a friend. Write a review. Thanks for listening.

[Carrie Sullivan]

Foreign.

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[Jackie Cooper]

Hi, I'm Jackie Cooper, Global Chief Brand Officer at Edelman and the host of Touch of Truth, a new podcast launching on the Adweek Podcast Network. My dad gave me this incredibly smart piece of advice. Meet everyone once. As a result, I've met some of the most fascinating and inspiring people on the planet. Now on Touch of Truth, we're coming center stage and sharing the mic to experience stories of truth, insights and visions for the future that will challenge your way of thinking. Touch of Truth is available wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out every Tuesday. I do hope to see you there.