The Ultimate Sensitive Skin Girls’ Guide: Transitioning to a Winter Skincare Routine, “Barrier Bulking” and The Ingredients That *Really* Make a Difference with First Aid Beauty’s Jenna Haley

Summary

Breaking Beauty Podcast Summary
Episode: The Ultimate Sensitive Skin Girls’ Guide: Transitioning to a Winter Skincare Routine, “Barrier Bulking” and The Ingredients That Really Make a Difference with First Aid Beauty’s Jenna Haley
Release Date: December 6, 2024

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I. Introduction

In this special December episode of the Breaking Beauty Podcast, hosts Jill Dunn and Carlene Higgins delve deep into the intricacies of managing sensitive skin, especially as the colder months approach. Collaborating with First Aid Beauty, they are joined by Jenna Haley, First Aid Beauty’s esteemed Global Brand Educator, to unpack effective skincare strategies tailored for sensitive skin types.

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II. Guest Background

Jenna Haley brings a wealth of experience to the table, having worked with beauty giants like Birchbox and Estee Lauder before her current role at First Aid Beauty. Her personal journey with rosacea and eczema since childhood provides her with both professional insight and lived experience, making her a credible authority on sensitive skin care.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (04:24): “I am so honored to be here, and I am so excited to talk all things beauty with you and prepping our sensitive skin girlies. I mean, it's a sisterhood, right?”

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III. Understanding Sensitive Skin and Barrier Health

The conversation kicks off with a discussion on the importance of the skin barrier. Jenna emphasizes that sensitive skin often correlates with a compromised skin barrier, which requires specific care to restore and maintain.

Key Points:

• Barrier Building: Ingredients like colloidal oatmeal and dimethicone are essential for protecting and repairing the skin barrier.
• Resilience: A strong barrier enhances the skin’s ability to withstand daily environmental stressors.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (07:59): “I think when it comes to sensitive skin, something I'm super passionate about is talking about building up the barrier.”

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IV. Essential Ingredients for Sensitive Skin

Jenna highlights several powerhouse ingredients that are beneficial for sensitive skin, explaining their roles and benefits.

Key Ingredients:

• Colloidal Oatmeal (08:07): Acts as a skin protectant, soothing irritation and locking in hydration. Jenna likens it to “your cozy, comfiest blanket” for the skin.
• Dimethicone (09:10): Contrary to popular belief, it’s an occlusive agent that seals in moisture without clogging pores or causing breakouts.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (09:26): “They grind it finer than you could ever grind it in your own kitchen. You boil it, and when you're able to add it to product, it makes that product a skin protectant.”

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V. Building a Gentle Skincare Routine

Jenna introduces the concept of treating the skincare regimen as a "first aid kit” rather than a rigid routine, allowing for flexibility based on the skin’s needs each day.

Routine Components:

• Cleanser: A reliable, gentle cleanser that effectively removes impurities without stripping the skin.
• Moisturizer: A powerful, soothing moisturizer that hydrates and repairs the skin barrier.
• Flexible Treatment Application: Depending on the day’s needs, treatments like hyaluronic acid or tretinoin can be incorporated judiciously.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (13:54): “When you have sensitive skin, you have to get rid of the idea of a routine... you have to listen to what your skin needs.”

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VI. Exfoliation Strategies for Sensitive Skin

Exfoliation is essential but must be approached cautiously to avoid irritation. Jenna advocates for daily gentle exfoliation using low concentrations of acids.

Recommendations:

• Daily Use of Glycolic and Lactic Acids: In low percentages to ensure gentle exfoliation without over-irritation.
• Pre-Dosed Exfoliating Pads: Such as those from First Aid Beauty, which provide controlled application and dosage.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (20:00): “We always talk about first aid beauty. It's like you really do want that daily gentle exfoliation to see those results.”

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VII. Managing Acne and Hyperpigmentation

Balancing acne treatment with sensitive skin care requires a nuanced approach. Jenna dispels the myth that hydration is the enemy of acne, emphasizing its role in soothing inflamed skin.

Strategies:

• Hydration: Using non-comedogenic, soothing moisturizers to calm inflamed acne.
• Consistent Use of Low-Acid Treatments: For hyperpigmentation, focusing on gentle, consistent application rather than high concentrations.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (22:02): “I think a lot of acne sufferers stay away from anything that looks creamy and luxurious. Peel back the label.”

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VIII. Anti-Aging Tips for Sensitive Skin

Addressing signs of aging without compromising sensitive skin involves selecting appropriate formulations and gradual integration of active ingredients.

Suggestions:

• Retinol Propionate: A slow-release form of retinol that minimizes irritation while promoting collagen production.
• Barrier Bulking: Strengthening the skin barrier to enhance resilience against aging signs.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (25:33): “Retinol propionate is a slow release. So what's nice about that is you're not getting that potent hit on the skin.”

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IX. Adjusting Skincare for Winter

Winter poses unique challenges for sensitive skin. Jenna advises on enhancing hydration and protecting the skin from harsh environmental factors.

Winter Strategies:

• Immediate Hydration Post-Shower: Applying moisturizers or oils on damp skin to lock in moisture.
• Thicker Creams and Body Oils: Utilizing richer formulations to combat dryness caused by cold weather and indoor heating.
• Layering Products: Implementing the “sandwich method” of hydration, application of actives, followed by additional hydration.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (28:49): “Another thing I like to do in the winter is that's when you can go into your stash... cranking that up.”

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X. Sensitive Skin vs. Broken Skin Barrier

Understanding the distinction and overlap between inherently sensitive skin and a compromised skin barrier is crucial for effective care.

Insights:

• Signs of a Broken Barrier: Flakiness, redness, and increased reactivity to products.
• Healing Philosophy: Focus on repairing the barrier to reduce sensitivity and improve skin health.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (30:29): “If you're using a product and it says safe for sensitive skin, or you've always used it and suddenly it reacts, maybe your skin barrier is broken.”

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XI. Practical Hacks and Final Tips

Jenna shares actionable tips to enhance skincare routines and protect sensitive skin during winter.

Tips:

• Barrier Creation Before Actives: Applying balms to sensitive areas before using potent treatments like retinol.
• Sunscreen Optimization: Using mineral sunscreens with zinc for added anti-inflammatory benefits.
• Listening to Your Skin: Being attuned to your skin's needs and adjusting products accordingly.

Notable Quote:
Jenna Haley (36:46): “Trusting your instinct, listening to your skin, and knowing that being super delicate with your skin, building that barrier over time is the best thing you can do for your skin long term.”

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XII. Conclusion and Promotion

The episode wraps up with Jill and Carlene promoting an exclusive offer for listeners. By visiting FirstAidBeauty.com/beauty and using the promo code BEAUTY, listeners can receive a 20% discount on First Aid Beauty’s Ultra Repair Cream, a favorite among the hosts for its efficacy in caring for sensitive skin.

Closing Remark:
Jill Dunn (37:29): “FirstAidBeauty.com/beauty use our promo code BEAUTY to get 20% off all of our favorites.”

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Additional Information:
For more details on the products discussed and to access the exclusive promo code, listeners are encouraged to visit the Breaking Beauty Podcast blog and follow the podcast on social media platforms such as Instagram and Facebook.

Transcript

[Jill Dunn]

The following podcast is a dear media.

[Carlene Higgins]

Production Attention New York City based listeners. Carlene and I are hosting a live podcast event. It's coming up so soon. It's on Monday, December 9th. It's in the evening in Soho. And we really hope that you can join us because we're going to be speaking with two inspiring women. The founder of Jenny Bird Jewelry. So that's Jenny Bird herself, as well as the founder of say Beauty, Laney Crowell. So we have so much to learn from both of them and we'll be chatting all about beauty style, entrepreneurship, holiday gifting and much more. Plus, there's a great gift bag and an exclusive discount to shop from Jenny Bird. So to find out more and to rsvp, click the link in our show notes or the link in our Instagram bio. Space is limited, so don't delay and we can't wait to see you there. Welcome to Breaking Beauty the podcast.

[Jill Dunn]

All about the breakthrough people, products and moments in beauty.

[Carlene Higgins]

We're your host, Jill Dunn and Carlene Higgins.

[Jill Dunn]

Hello and welcome back to Breaking Beauty Podcast. Hello, Jill.

[Carlene Higgins]

Hey, Carlene, how are you?

[Jill Dunn]

I am wonderful.

[Carlene Higgins]

Well, I have to stop you right away cuz you have a little green something in your tube.

[Jill Dunn]

Oh, perfect. Friends can tell each other when they have spinach in their teeth.

[Jenna Haley]

We're.

[Jill Dunn]

We're taking a flossing break. Hang on for a second.

[Carlene Higgins]

You're clear. Yay, lunch. We just had lunch, everybody.

[Jill Dunn]

And we're back. Okay, so roll on.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yes. Okay. Well, we are two former beauty editors turned beauty podcasters. If you've been tuning in for the last seven years, you know that at this point and today, we're coming in hot this first week of December with a very special uninterrupted bonus episode in partnership with our friends at First Aid Beauty.

[Jill Dunn]

That's right. We've recruited their number one gal, fabs global brand educator Jenna Haley, who travels the world educ on head to toe skin care solutions.

[Carlene Higgins]

And prior to First Aid Beauty, Jenna worked side by side with product developers and dermatologists at beauty powerhouses like Birchbox and Estee Lauder.

[Jill Dunn]

That's right. And I'll never forget sitting down with First Aid Beauty's founder, Lily Gordon at a press trip in New York. It was at Apotheke in Chinatown. I don't know if you've been there before. Very deep red velvet Victorian sofas like Gucci jewel box wallpaper vibes. And Lily was telling me how she really set out to create an elevated beauty brand for people who suffered from sensitive Skin conditions, because at the time, you could only find that in the drugstore. And we all want options. We all want to feel fancy.

[Carlene Higgins]

Absolutely. And I think with Jenna here, she's going to chat with us a lot more. And we were talking off mic, but she is struggled with rosacea, fellow rosacea girly here and eczema since childhood. So it's safe to say that she's not only a bona fide beauty insider, but she definitely knows a thing or two when it comes to sensitive skin having that lived experience.

[Jill Dunn]

So today, we're going to find out the ideal skincare routine that's best for the sensitive girlies club. Plus, we'll find out which treatments are going to be powerful enough to address acne, hyperpigmentation, and signs of aging while being gentle enough for use on sensitive skin.

[Carlene Higgins]

We'll also learn how to decipher between sensitive skin and a damaged skin barrier. We all want to know this, and really, any of us can suffer from that, especially in the winter months and how to kind of, like, claw your way back from that uncomfortable skin situation.

[Jill Dunn]

And finally, we're going to find out how we can make our skin care work better for us in the throws of winter. How do we need to transition our routine and any other tips and tricks that Jenna may have up her sleeve?

[Carlene Higgins]

And because this is a partnered episode, that means we have a very special promo code just for Breaking Beauty listeners. So stay tuned until the very end, when we will share our exclusive promo code to get 20% off one of our personal favorite skincare lines for sensitive skin first aid beauty.

[Jill Dunn]

Welcome to Breaking Beauty. Jenna. Hello.

[Jenna Haley]

I am so honored to be here, and I am so excited to talk all things beauty with you and prepping our sensitive Skin girlies. I mean, it's a sisterhood, right?

[Jill Dunn]

It is.

[Jenna Haley]

Absolutely. It is.

[Carlene Higgins]

We just lowered the shades in here in honor of not getting our rosacea wash. That's right. So we are already at a team.

[Jenna Haley]

You get me? You get me?

[Jill Dunn]

So, as we mentioned, you've worked everywhere from Birchbox to Estee Lauder, now at First Aid Beauty. So you're officially a beauty insider. And I understand that your mother was a facialist as well.

[Jenna Haley]

Yes, she retired when she had kids, but she did for about 20 years.

[Jill Dunn]

Oh, my goodness. The ultimate sacrifice. Do you remember any treatments or remedies that she used to kind of put together for you as a child?

[Jenna Haley]

Absolutely. So. Well, first of all, I think I was the only kid on the basketball court whose mom brushed her eyebrows before she went to a Gig truly, like beauty was an everyday ritual, even when I was a kid.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

And when I love to pick her brain about. Because this was like the 70s and the 80s and facials. I mean, she always says, like, there was none of this. And she'll go to like all the products we have now.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah, right.

[Jenna Haley]

Essentially a facial then was like cleansing. Maybe had a fruit enzyme mask, and then it was massage and hydration.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah, that's right.

[Jenna Haley]

As the products kind of change. I remember growing up, me, my brother, my sister, when there were all these products at the drugstore or the beauty counter. I remember when the first thing she would do is. Because in her day it was the cold cream. Right. There was that, like, thicker cream. So when these products and I think of beauty counter and cleanser became like fairly thin. My mom used to always put like a dollop of cream in every cleanser.

[Carlene Higgins]

Interesting.

[Jenna Haley]

And it was her way. I think she, like saw that, like, she wanted to thicken it up. And she was like, but it's still.

[Jill Dunn]

Not a cold cream.

[Jenna Haley]

Exactly. And so I remember that distinctly. I also know that it was always hydration second we got out of the bath.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Always cleansing the skin after a day at school, like the second we got home. I still do that now, knowing the second you walk in the door, bra off, wash the face, like that is the routine. Wow. And so always cleansing, just like getting that dirt and grime off the face immediately. Yes, exactly. And go ahead.

[Jill Dunn]

I was going to say, you know what, when you were. When you were talking about this nostalgia and I'm picturing, you know, the. The heavy cold creams and stuff, I had a flashback of this product we had in our bathroom at one point. I don't even know how it got there because my mom wasn't a huge skin enthusiast. But it was kind of a device like a clarisonic, where you would take the heads off and put on different heads and it was for your face and it would kind of spin around and it was almost like a little sandpaper.

[Carlene Higgins]

Oh, my God.

[Jill Dunn]

And you would do it around your. Do you know what I'm talking about?

[Jenna Haley]

I've seen it before.

[Jill Dunn]

It was like, had different fine grains on it that would help. It was kind of, I guess, meant to be like a early manual microdermabrasion or something.

[Jenna Haley]

It was a resurfacer.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yes.

[Jenna Haley]

This is. There are YouTube videos about this, by the way. Into it.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

And it was all of these things. There was kind of that swing from like super clean skin to like, be super Delicate. But then people would feel that rough and dryness of these devices.

[Jill Dunn]

So at the time, that's what you did. And God knows how many layers you took off. I mean, that walked out and put the baby oil on anyway.

[Carlene Higgins]

Definitely not sensitive skin friendly. Everybody, everybody, psa. So, as a sensitive skin girl yourself, Jenna, let's talk a little bit about ingredients and, like, what you tend to look for on a skincare label. Because we've all heard different things, but let's talk about what you can shop for.

[Jenna Haley]

I think when it comes to sensitive skin, something I'm super passionate about is talking about building up the barrier.

[Jill Dunn]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

And that is because. Have you ever been talking to someone? I mean, maybe only you both would understand this, but I'll be talking to someone. I'll be like, damn, that's a strong dermis. Like, I can just tell. There are certain people born with what feels like more layers of skin than some of us with sensitive skin.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

So when I.

[Carlene Higgins]

Barrier privilege.

[Jenna Haley]

Yes. Seriously. Exactly. And like, you know, myself, I was born with eczema rosacea. I was born with a more delicate barrier. So taking care of that, to me is about barrier building ingredients. So first aid, beauty, we always talk about, demand more from your moisturizer. And that's because there are powerhouse ingredients like colloidal oatmeal, even dimethicone things that are going to help protect but also builds back that barrier.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

So I'm always looking for ingredients like that. They'll give you that stronger. And it's about resilience.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

It's about being able to kind of take on the day with your skin getting stronger.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Carlene Higgins]

But what is colloidal oatmeal exactly? We all know what oatmeal is, and I just learned how to pronounce colloidal. Oatmeal. Colloidal.

[Jill Dunn]

Oatmeal, colloidal. Everyone together. 3, 2, 1.

[Jenna Haley]

Colloidal oatmeal.

[Jill Dunn]

I feel like colloidal colloidal oatmeal, in my mind, thinks that it has extra, like, minerals or metals in it.

[Carlene Higgins]

I think it's less processed. That's my guess.

[Jenna Haley]

They take very good.

[Carlene Higgins]

So you're both right.

[Jenna Haley]

They basically take. Instead of just the oat, they take like the oat, plant husk and almond, and then they grind it in a machine finer than you could ever grind it in your own kitchen.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

You boil it, and when you're able to add it to product, it makes that product a skin protectant. Because what the colloidal oatmeal is Doing is it's wrapping your skin. I say, when you think of colloidal oatmeal, think of like your cozy, comfiest blanket. Going to wrap your skin, keep that hydration locked in. But also it's soothing on contact and to help with itch irritation, help with that red, reactive skin and it actually clings to you. So colloidal oatmeal is going to stay with your skin when you apply it. And that's why it's instant and long term relief when you have that compromised skin.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay, that makes sense.

[Jill Dunn]

I thought it was interesting that you also noted dimethicone, because that is not something I've ever heard before as a powerhouse ingredient to help with sensitive skin. But I recently had blepharoplasty about five months ago or so, and they wanted me to buy. The doctor's office wanted me to buy, to put on my scars. This, this product that I hadn't heard of. I'm like, I have so many products at home. Really? I was like, okay, this is really important to me. And I actually spent the money, but I was like, okay, what's actually in this, though? And like, it was like water, Dimethicone, whatever.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jill Dunn]

And I noticed with another product too, where you know when you get the lasers in the office and they're like, you have to use this. This is the best. It's over $100. Second ingredient, dimethicone. I'm like, this is silicone. Right.

[Jenna Haley]

Unbelievable. First of all, I'm so thrilled to hear that, because it is, we joke. Dimethicone needs a new publicist.

[Jill Dunn]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

Because we have always been told, like, it causes acne, it's clogging our pores. Actually, it's an occlusive. So it's a skin protectant. Derms will tell you that. And it is going to help seal.

[Jill Dunn]

The skin, locking it in.

[Jenna Haley]

Lock it in, build up that barrier. And when it's formulated is when it's included in this really gorgeous formula, it's not going to feel like that gross sticky that the old dimethicone used to.

[Jill Dunn]

Right, right. It's become more sophisticated. Are there any other powerhouse ingredients or ingredients you would avoid as a sensitive skin person?

[Jenna Haley]

So I always look for it. There's a skin protecting. There's also that soothing.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

When it comes to avoiding. First, I'm very proud of our industry for making like tons of changes that we've seen just in kind of the clean beauty space. Space. But always things that are like a no, no for me. And I say this not from a. Like, don't you touch it. Sensitive skin girls. But from a. It kind of helps us cut through the clutter of all these choices. So avoid anything. We know this now. Fragrance. Fragrance doesn't belong on your face. Specifically, though artificial fragrance that we know is like that black box in beauty. There can be tons of irritants in there. So avoiding that, but also knowing the difference. You know, there's good alcohols and there's bad alcohols in skin care, right? So really, that education some that I think of, if you see SD alcohol, that's a no, no.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

I can remember by saying, so damaging SD alcohol. There are ways to get it away from me. There's denatured alcohol. That's another. No, no. Easy to remember. Like, denature devalues the product. So really getting and similar. Like we talked about, if dimethicone was something you always thought was, oh, this isn't good for my skin. No, that's something that'll really help your skin. So that kind of education and checking that ingredient for those irritants, right?

[Jill Dunn]

I like those little memory triggers because my memory is terrible. So it's good to have those.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah, it's locked in now. Yeah, it's locked in. And what. Can you walk us through what a gentle skincare routine looks like for sensitive skin types? I imagining. Imagine we're not doing 12 steps.

[Jenna Haley]

Well, what I learned about this, maybe I'm wrong. Well, here's what I say. When you have sensitive skin, you have to get rid of the idea of a routine, okay. And I say that because you have to think of your beauty kit as more of, like, your first aid kit. Because our. I always say sensitive skin, like, has its own personality, Right? If you did the same thing every single day to sensitive skin, you would be potentially damaging and irritating because you have to listen to what your skin needs, right? So when I think of that first aid kit, I say, okay, first I'm gonna have the Old Faithfuls. I'm gonna have the cleanser that never does me wrong. And I'm gonna have a powerful moisturizer that's always going to soothe and hydrate my skin.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right?

[Jenna Haley]

Now in the kit, I can also have those treatments, but that's what I'm gonna really listen to, my skin. If I was on a long flight all day, I'm not gonna go home and do my tretinoin that night. I'm gon. Okay, tonight is the hyaluronic acid. Okay. Maybe tomorrow I'll do my tretinoin, listen to Your skin. And that to me is more like, you have to get out of that every day, the same product routine and have that toolkit ready.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah. So you're still skin cycling, which we've talked about on the show before, even though you have sensitive skin. And for myself, I have rosacea, and I've been to a dermatologist, and I was actually prescribed azelaic acid, and that's supposed to help for the redness. Is there anything over the counter in terms of an ingredient that, you know, that you can use that would give you a similar type of result from your experience?

[Jenna Haley]

Can I ask you, how do you use that in your routine?

[Jill Dunn]

So it is a cream. So I would use it kind of like a skin cycling idea. And I would like. I wouldn't use it if I'm using a retinol or something like that, even though I'm supposed to use it every night. So I don't really.

[Carlene Higgins]

How's that thing going, by the way? What are you using it?

[Jill Dunn]

The acelic acid.

[Carlene Higgins]

Are you.

[Jill Dunn]

Sometimes sensitive skin sisters are a little too like sisters, you know what I mean?

[Jenna Haley]

Yeah, I totally get it.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

And some of them are more sensitive than others.

[Carlene Higgins]

That's it, too.

[Jenna Haley]

Right, Right.

[Carlene Higgins]

Oh, yes. So only once a week. Got it.

[Jill Dunn]

So the answer is over to you, Jenna.

[Jenna Haley]

You know, I asked because for me, I've always gone to derms as the experts, right?

[Jill Dunn]

Yes.

[Jenna Haley]

But I think. And a lot of people, I think, can relate to this. The TikTok derms are not the norm.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

I remember. You know, you go to most dermatologists, they're not going to sit you down and be like, well, first of all, girl, what are you cleansing with? Because that's drying out your skin. Most derms are going to say, okay, this the solution. And they're brilliant at that. Right. They know skin. But when we look at kind of how those things fit into our lives. You've heard so many people on this show say the best treatment is the one you'll actually use. Right?

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

So I've always thought of if you have something maybe from the derm, that's like your potent hit. Right. That's going to get to that targeted solution. But for something over the counter, specifically for redness or sensitive skin, that colloidal oatmeal is really going to help not only build that barrier, but soothe the redness.

[Jill Dunn]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

In my personal story with really having rosacea, I used to always be terrified of blush. I was like, get away from me. I do bronzer only when I Use soothing ingredients like colloidal oatmeal and hydrating spf. We can't say it enough.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right, Right.

[Jenna Haley]

I saw that barrier build back to a point I can finally reach for blush again. So there are ways to get those gentle results. I think something, like I said, locking in that hydration with something protecting like a colloidal oatmeal. Wearing spf. And I mean, my favorite thing. Have you gotten into red light therapy yet?

[Jill Dunn]

Yes.

[Jenna Haley]

Tell me your experience.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. Love it. Yeah.

[Jill Dunn]

I mean, I love to use it again. Somebody's going to bust me over here. I do think that you need to use it every night.

[Carlene Higgins]

She likes skin cycling, everyone. What can I say?

[Jill Dunn]

It's a low. Yeah, it's skin cycling. I do whatever I want whenever I want.

[Carlene Higgins]

Programming reminders into your phone. Now it's time for red light.

[Jill Dunn]

But it is, it is something that from my understanding, you really do need to use it consistently to have to make a difference. Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

I found that's something that I discovered this year that I really loved. Like adding it onto a facial and then putting on my hydration. That's soothing. That's been a two in one that I. I've really, really loved the men.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. That's interesting. I will just give a little tip. When we talked to Dr. Gross, I asked him about red light and when's the best time to do it and he said to do it like on a naked face on freshly cleansed skin. That is when you get the best results. Because I think we see them on social media and you think I'm just gonna do my whole nighttime routine and then put it up before bed. So it's actually more beneficial.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah. It's not as neat as that. You've got to do it on clean skin, then go back and put on your cream.

[Jenna Haley]

A little bit of a commitment.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Carlene Higgins]

But I'm glad you brought that up because I do think though, those types of masks are an investment and not everybody is willing to go there, but they do really help with redness.

[Jenna Haley]

Absolutely. And I. That's one of those. The few. You know, there are so many devices see out there and for as sensitive skin, I'm like, avoid, avoid avoiding that one. I was like, oh, wait a minute. So that's been something I love to recommend.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. Is there any true. Is there a brand you can share that you like For Omnilux was the.

[Jenna Haley]

One I went with higher doses, so. Great.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

I mean, we're hitting the holidays too. That is like get on those. Yes.

[Jill Dunn]

Black Friday Exactly.

[Jenna Haley]

That's like your big. If that's your big purchase of the year, that to me has been totally worth it.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. Okay, now, how often should someone with sensitive skin be exfoliating and what method do you like to recommend?

[Jenna Haley]

Exfoliation. I mean, you guys, you've been doing this for a long time, right? You've heard, remember it was like 10% every night. Then I was like, no, you should only exfoliate once a month. No other exfoliants for us. We always talk about first aid beauty. It's like you really do want that daily gentle exfoliation to see those results. And because someone's sensitive skin, a 10% peel on me, not gonna work. Right. So we see exfoliation as almost like the way you floss and brush your teeth every day. And if a peel is like going to the dentist, you want something that's daily upkeep so your skin can stay ready instead of, instead of having to get ready, which is what usually causes that irritation. So daily look for like glycolic and lactic acids, low percentages that you can use every day, slow and steady, so you see the results without the irritation.

[Carlene Higgins]

So first aid beauty has the pads, right?

[Jenna Haley]

Yes.

[Carlene Higgins]

Do you think what's smart about those is that they're pre dosed so that if you're looking for a way to like tiptoe into exfoliating, I think an application like that is actually really smart.

[Jenna Haley]

Yes.

[Carlene Higgins]

And you'll do it because it's right there, it's pre dosed and easy travel.

[Jenna Haley]

Yeah, you're exactly right.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Micro dosing is a way of thinking about it.

[Jill Dunn]

And I imagine that they are gentler than some of the other kind of exfoliating pads on the market.

[Jenna Haley]

Exactly. Because they were made for daily use, something super gentle. I tell my friends it's almost like your dry shampoo. Like this is really just is keeping the skin upkeep shedding. Exactly. It's the upkeep.

[Jill Dunn]

Right.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jill Dunn]

And what about for acne? We talked about this before. You can have sensitive skin but have other things going on.

[Jenna Haley]

Always.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jill Dunn]

What is the best kind of strategy to treat acne but manage your sensitive skin at the same time?

[Jenna Haley]

I feel like, have you ever met someone with acne that doesn't say they have sensitive skin?

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah, it's true.

[Jenna Haley]

There are a few people. I'll get the people that are like, throw every acid you have on my face. But then what happens is they become part of our sensitive skin sisterhood because now their skin is sensitized yes. So that, to me is the most interesting thing when it comes to pesky acne. I think there is the idea for a lot of people who have struggled with acne is that hydration is the enemy. Whereas we've talked to so many derms who say actually a lot of. And it depends what's causing your acne. But there is some acne that is inflamed acne, and you need something to soothe the skin to help with that inflamed acne. So I would say similar to what we talked about before, dimethicone might be your friend when it comes to really helping with that inflammation. Try that oatmeal. And I always talk to acne people who struggle with acne to think about creams and hydration options that you may think you can't use. Check the label. If it says non comedogenic, give that a try. I think a lot of acne sufferers stay away from anything that looks creamy and luxurious. Yeah, but peel back the label. Take a look. Something your skin may really benefit from.

[Carlene Higgins]

What about sensitive skin with hyperpigmentation? Because this is just so stubborn and so really it's so hard to deal with and get rid of. So if you're sensitive, what are your tips?

[Jenna Haley]

I think of it as when we're toning our muscles, we do low weights, more reps.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

Same thing with the acids. When it comes to hyperpigmentation, do something with low acids, but use it consistently.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

So even if you're thinking of like a dark spot serum, make sure it's made for sensitive skin and use it more consistently. And that's how you can get the same benefits that you would in something a bit more harsh. But use it consistently. Follow up with that hydration. So that's how I think of that hyperpigmentation.

[Carlene Higgins]

Is it like Kojic acid or is there an ingredient to look for?

[Jenna Haley]

I think so. It really comes down to, to me, the overall formula.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

With sensitive skin, it's like a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down. So I know there are so many great dark spot serums out there, things that are going to help. But look at the formula and make sure there's something soothing along with the active.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

So that you see the results without irritation.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay. Makes sense.

[Jill Dunn]

And what about aging and signs of aging? You know, we. You have sensitive skin, but you also are trying to ward off, like wrinkles, sagging. What would be your strategy for that?

[Jenna Haley]

I'm curious. Have you guys, have you had any times where You've tried a product. Product and had your skin freak out after.

[Jill Dunn]

Well, retinol for sure. I think that's the thing for me, like ascorbic acid is my skin just freaks out.

[Jenna Haley]

So for you, it's like instead SPF is really your protection factor for the treatment.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah, I mean, for sure. I use SPF every day. And retinol, it's hard to find one that my skin jives with because. Because of the. Yeah. The rosacea and the reaction that I get. So. So that's why I'm curious, like, aside from moisturizing and wearing spf, like, what would be a good tactic?

[Jenna Haley]

There is. Well, when it comes to retinol now there's like, oh, thank goodness for science.

[Jill Dunn]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

You heard of retinol propionate?

[Carlene Higgins]

Probably somewhere in the recesses of my. But refresh my memory.

[Jenna Haley]

So it's basically, it's like taking the back roads instead of the highway.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

Retinol propionate is a slow release. Release. So what's nice about that is you're not getting that potent hit on the skin. It's a slow release. So that's a new technology that you really don't have to be scared of retinol like we used to be. I take the three, two, one approach. When you start using it every third night.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

And go to every second night. And then you could do every night if you'd like.

[Jill Dunn]

Right, right.

[Jenna Haley]

And there are some. Like our retinol has a clinical trial that had 24 hours of hydration on the skin. And seeing something like that for a retinol, like, the technology is better and better.

[Jill Dunn]

Absolutely.

[Jenna Haley]

And of course, like we talked about, if we're thinking of the skin as these layers of sheets, aging is going to be more apparent on the skin when you have that weakened skin barrier. So looking for those barrier building ingredients, the skin becomes more resilient. And of course, always following up with the spf.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right. If you are someone who's kind of a bit of a bit at a crossroads and you're like, do I treat the wrinkles first or the sensitivity first? Like, should you get your sensitivity under control and then try to address these, you know, lines, wrinkles, all of that.

[Jenna Haley]

That'S such a great question.

[Carlene Higgins]

Because we do.

[Jenna Haley]

Right. We have our list of everything we want in the world. Get the sensitivity.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right. Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

And it's really like we're going into winter. So I call it, this is barrier bulking season. So like we can really start building up that barrier. We're not in the sun as much. But I also. This is where the best time of year to introduce something like a retinol start to introduce those things that typically the sun just ruins everything. But really, really, that barrier bulking and making sure you can start to try those things. Ease into it. You were alluding to, like that barrier method. We call it the sandwich method. To maybe put hydration, then your retinol and more hydration and I'll do the trick.

[Carlene Higgins]

That's never a bad thing.

[Jill Dunn]

Little sandwich.

[Jenna Haley]

Exactly.

[Jill Dunn]

Yep. And what about. How would you recommend for someone with sensitive skin to adjust or. Or like, bump up their skincare routine for winter?

[Jenna Haley]

Okay. So key for winter are you. I'm guilty of long, hot showers in the winter. Like, once I'm in, I'm like, ooh, this is the dream. Right. So really making sure that we are repairing the skin. I love to apply any type of hydration when the skin is damp. Do you apply hydration on the body right after the shower?

[Carlene Higgins]

Definitely.

[Jill Dunn]

I'm too lazy, but, yeah, I know.

[Carlene Higgins]

I'm addicted. Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

What were you putting. Do you use lotion oil?

[Carlene Higgins]

What's your go to lotion? And then like, I use Elizabeth Arden eight hour cream all over my feet.

[Jenna Haley]

Oh, my God. Immediately.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. No, it's so good.

[Jenna Haley]

Oh, that's incredible.

[Carlene Higgins]

In the winter, when you start wearing socks, I get excited. I'm like, my fresh tube. It's. It's the best.

[Jenna Haley]

Yeah. And it's that mask, right?

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

That's a big thing for winter. I say always putting on, like, that type of hydration when the skin's damp.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Crucial is really that skin protecting hydration because of the heat being cranked up. All of these things are really exasperating our skin issues.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Another thing I like to do in the winter is that's when you can go into your stash. I feel like, oh, my goodness, I would love to see your stash. I've seen when you record at home and. But so that's when I go into. I'm like, where's the thickest of the thickest? Where are my sluggers? Where are my bombs? Like, come on out. It's our show time. So really cranking that up. And like I said, this is that time of year that, like, if you've been peeking at that 10% or that something that you've wanted to try, that might be a little more intense.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Give it a try. Ease into it. But definitely, to me, it's like the showers and that cold air Making sure your demand more from your moisturizer. Get something that is going to protect the skin from that harsh climate.

[Carlene Higgins]

And do you use the same body moisturizer from head to toe or what do you do?

[Jenna Haley]

I use the Ultra repair cream. Head to toe, face and body.

[Carlene Higgins]

Wow. Okay.

[Jenna Haley]

But we also. I love body oils right outside the shower and it's just so quick and easy. So much of skincare, we're just habit building.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

Just trying to get ourselves into. I enjoy doing this. This is great for my skin. And it feels good.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah. Lock it in. Which is nice. So you can switch from a cream to an oil even if you're. If it's too heavy for summer, which is nice. What about how do you know when you have sensitive skin versus a broken skin barrier? Which we hear a lot about these days.

[Jenna Haley]

Right. So the thing is, they're kind of one in the same, because if you have sensitive skin, you probably have a broken skin barrier. But something that I find happens, especially in this world of skincare fanatics like ourselves, is we're using products that are sensitizing our skin. So a trick for this and it could just be lifestyle. So allergy season. The cream I put on my face every day that I love all of a sudden will start stinging and burning around my nose. And that's my trigger. I'm like, oh, I've been rubbing my nose with a tissue and now the barrier's broken around my nose. So a lot of times if you're using a product and and it says safe for sensitive skin, or you've already always used it and all of a sudden you feel like it's reacting. Maybe something's kind of broken that skin barrier. It's really common for me. I switched to tubing mascara because I would notice that when I was cleansing, if I had to wear waterproof makeup, I would be cleansing and rubbing my eyes at night to get it off. Then I put my eye cream and it would sting and I said, okay, I'm damaging that barrier every time I'm trying to cleanse this. So pay attention to, oh, we're sensitizing the skin. Or if you just have that sensitive skin. When we think about the barrier, we know, right? It's that brick and mortar. We have the skin cells as the bricks and then that cement in between those are the ceramides and the lipids. We really want to build back that barrier. When you have that strong barrier, you're going to have less sensitive skin.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right. So when do you look in the mirror and Say my barrier is juicy and she's good. Like, like, how do you know you have achieved opt skin barrier health?

[Jenna Haley]

So what a broken barrier may look like is really, it's like the system's broken. You see the flaky skin, you see the redness. So when I love that juicy skin, that's the best. Right. When you know you're in a good place, you've seen kind of, kind of the redness fade.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

You really see that. I truly think of it as resilience. You see that the skin is less reactive, it feels less warm to the touch and you want that balance. So if you have those spots of flakiness, maybe from like a healing blemish, that really stands out because it's that one spot that has that flakiness as opposed to having that always like that snake feel to the skin. So that hydration is a good test. Great. If I forget you had a derm on here. Who talked about where after you wash your face, your skin might look like shiny and tight and that's a sign of that dehydration. A good test could be after your cleansing, once in a while, do a check in when your skin's dry, they feel super tight. Then you need to kind of bulk up those barriers.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

If after you cleanse and you haven't put on something right away you're like, I feel like we're in a good place, then you're really building back that barrier.

[Jill Dunn]

Yeah. Do you have any other hacks for fixing a damaged skin barrier?

[Jenna Haley]

I think there's staying out of the sun. I tell people, like, sunscreen alone isn't enough.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah.

[Jenna Haley]

They have the sun done. I mean, a benefit. Growing up, my mom was a firm believer in this. And now research shows wearing makeup is helping to protect our skin. So embracing that, like a really great foundation that feels good on your skin, that's helping protect that skin. I think it really is kind of that mixing and matching. I'm using more face oils in the winter time. Right. Like just adding and boosting that hydration. And like I said before, having that toolkit, having your first aid kit of these are my reliables I'm going to use all the time and then listening to what your skin needs.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jill Dunn]

And zinc is probably a better ingredient to look for in sunscreen as well, right?

[Jenna Haley]

Absolutely.

[Jill Dunn]

Zinc is anti inflammatory.

[Jenna Haley]

Exactly.

[Jill Dunn]

Like a mineral sunscreen. And I was just always in the habit again because I'm lazy slash busy of like putting on a serum and then putting on on the sunscreen and Just going. And that was my day. But I have realized as I get older and my skin's getting drier that like sometimes I do need to actually do a moisturizer and then the sunscreen over top. So that's my, that's gonna be my plan for. I love protecting my barrier. This winter is actually doing more layering and just, just. I wouldn't do that in the summer, but just transitioning to winter as a sensitive skin. Girly. I'm using the mineral sunscreen with a moisturizer underneath. Underneath and a serum underneath. Yeah. Any other last tips for winter skin and sensitive skin?

[Jenna Haley]

I'll kind of create my own barrier on the skin. So I'll take like a balm and say where I know I'm sensitive. For me it's the under eye. Put that on before your treatment. So you're making sure that your retinol meant for face isn't going on those sensitive areas.

[Jill Dunn]

Oh, that's smart.

[Jenna Haley]

I have a super reactive. Like the skin on the neck is so delicate.

[Jill Dunn]

Yes, it's true.

[Jenna Haley]

If I go too far, like with the tretinoin, I can react. So I'll put that barrier on before. So you're kind of switching. You're doing your hydration barrier and then your actives and then you do your all over hydration. But kind of smart building those spots where you don't want any of those potent acids to be on any parts.

[Jill Dunn]

Well, it's kind of like when you go to a hair colorist and they put the Vaseline all around your hairline so it doesn't drip into. Into your face. And I think that's also like sunscreen sticks are smart around the eye area because so many people are so sensitive to the sunscreen getting in their eyes. I've never heard that about retinol or tretinoin, but I did have a friend say to me the other day that she's very sensitive to retinol around the eyes. So I'm gonna give her that tip. And you're right about the neck because I've also put on retinol before. And then in the morning it's like. Cause you forget to wash that area. This like you wash your face but. And then it's. It's like I get itchy, you know.

[Jenna Haley]

And it's almost like heat rash too when we're bundled up in our blankets. So it's really. I use that to create that barrier so anything sensitizing isn't hitting it.

[Carlene Higgins]

Yeah, I love that. Any, any last tips that you might want to share.

[Jenna Haley]

I think the biggest thing is listening to your skin. We are all, you know, doing that scrolling all day and saying like, oh, I'm gonna try that. I'm gonna try that. Yeah, it might not be for you. And being kind of having sensitive skin. The best news is we become kind of the experts because we've had to do a lot of the research and the trials ourselves.

[Carlene Higgins]

Right.

[Jenna Haley]

So trusting your instinct, listening to your skin and knowing that being super delicate in with your skin, building that barrier over time is the best thing you can do for your skin long term.

[Carlene Higgins]

Okay. All right, well, well, thank you so much, Jenna. And with all of that being said, we have a very special you get the cookie.

[Jill Dunn]

If you're still listening, you get the cookie.

[Carlene Higgins]

It's an exclusive promo offer for all of our faithful listeners. So you can upgrade your moisturizer with First Aid Beauty's iconic Ultra repair cream. You can shop online and learn more about all of their products made for sensitive skin. So Visit our exclusive URL, which is first aid beauty.com beauty and use our promo code beauty to get 20% off off and we'll link to this offer in our show notes and on our website. Once again, FirstAid Beauty.com Beauty use our pro promo code BEAUTY to get 20% off like all of our favorites. So thank you once again. Jenna, you're a delight. Thank you so much.

[Jill Dunn]

Thank you so much all day.

[Carlene Higgins]

Thank you so much.

[Jenna Haley]

Thank you for having me.

[Carlene Higgins]

So great.

[Jill Dunn]

Thanks for listening. You can find details on every product mentioned in today's episode, along with our exclusive, exclusive promo codes on our blog @breaking beauty podcast.com.

[Carlene Higgins]

While you're there, be sure to sign up for our newsletter. Every episode will be delivered directly to your inbox, so you won't miss a.

[Jill Dunn]

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[Carlene Higgins]

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[Jill Dunn]

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[Carlene Higgins]

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[Jill Dunn]

See you. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.