What Makes a Viral Perfume? Tips for Long-Lasting Scent, Perfume Layering and an In-Person, Custom Fragrance Atelier with The 7 Virtues’ Barb Stegemann

Summary

Breaking Beauty Podcast Episode Summary

Episode: What Makes a Viral Perfume? Tips for Long-Lasting Scent, Perfume Layering, and an In-Person, Custom Fragrance Atelier with The 7 Virtues’ Barb Stegemann
Hosts: Jill Dunn (B), Carlene Higgins (C)
Guest: Barb Stegemann (A), Founder of The 7 Virtues
Date: May 6, 2026

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Overview

In this engaging episode, Jill and Carlene catch up with Barb Stegemann, founder of the social impact fragrance brand The 7 Virtues. The discussion covers everything from perfume’s viral journey on social media to the art of layering fragrances, what “clean” really means in the perfume world, perfume longevity, and the philosophy and purpose rooted in The 7 Virtues. Barb also shares exclusive news about her new, in-person, custom fragrance atelier and opens up about the evolution of her brand’s social mission. The episode is rich with industry insights for anyone interested in fragrance trends, scent creation, and the intersection of beauty and activism.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Barb Stegemann’s Journey & The 7 Virtues’ Social Mission

[00:56–04:41]

• Barb founded The 7 Virtues out of her garage in Halifax in 2010, inspired by her friend Captain Trevor Green’s injury in Afghanistan and a desire to create “perfumes for peace.”
• Original model sourced essential oils from farmers in war-torn regions (initially Afghanistan and Haiti), supporting local economies and encouraging peace.
• Evolution: Security and corruption made Afghan sourcing impossible—Barb pivoted to other regions and shifted focus toward ending period poverty (partnering with Days for Girls), while keeping sustainability and impact at the core.
• “When women, young girls can go to school and learn to read, they can run for office, they can decide how many babies they want, and that’s how we’re gonna end war.” (A, 09:12)
• Barb’s experience as a flight attendant shaped her philosophy of treating everyone equally—“The way we treat one another is our altitude, you know?” (A, 08:05)

2. Navigating Challenges and Major Pivots

[13:44–15:08]

• Barb discusses the necessity of adapting her business for survival and social good and shares her personal mantra:
  “Get mad, take a bath, have a nap. Get mad, let it out. Take a bath, turn off your mind, and then take a nap. Let your subconscious mind give you the answers.” (A, 14:19)
• Hints at future plans to channel her passion for change—possibly entering politics to fight corruption.

3. Perfume Trends and Going Viral on TikTok

[16:03–18:09]

• Scents like Santal Vanille and Amber Vanilla have gone viral on TikTok, transforming fragrances with a deeper mission into social media “aesthetics.”
• Barb shares touching stories of customers experiencing renewed joy through perfume—such as people recovering their sense of smell post-COVID using The 7 Virtues scents:
  “She could smell only ours out of the whole place ... you’re the only perfume I could smell.” (A, 17:04)
• Reflection on beauty’s emotional power and product longevity—including behind-the-scenes (but skipped here) about their suffragette lipstick.

4. The Secret Sauce: Clean, Long-Lasting Perfume

[18:29–22:44]

• Vanilla Woods, the brand’s best-seller, was the first “clean” vanilla scent at Sephora, launching before the gourmand trend.
• “Clean” perfume at 7 Virtues means:
  • No phthalates, parabens, formaldehyde
  • Doubled fragrance oils (22%) and organic sugarcane alcohol as a carrier
  • “We cracked the code in how to make a long-lasting clean perfume.” (A, 21:02)
• Perfume lasts 24 hours or more depending on skin type—moisturized skin prolongs wear:
  “If you’re dry, hit the body cream first, then put your got to be moisturized and that’ll make it last.” (A, 22:38)

5. The Art and Science of Layering Perfumes

[27:11–31:06]

• Inspired by training in Grasse, France, all 7 Virtues perfumes contain a “harmony molecule” (trademarked) to ensure any combination will layer beautifully.
• Barb demystifies layering with their “Layer Cake” collection:
  “If you can make a layer cake, you can layer perfume. I love to demystify it ... it’s not that serious.” (A, 28:13)
• Surprising combos: Lotus Pear with Santal Vanille, or Barb’s favorite: Santal Vanilla, Cherry Ambition, and Buttercream together:
  “I smell like a really expensive hotel.” (A, 29:19)
• Tip for choosing a scent: Close your eyes when smelling perfumes—removes sensory distractions and enhances your ability to discern notes (A, 29:48).

6. Perfume Dupes and Industry Ethics

[31:40–33:37]

• The 7 Virtues scents can’t be truly duplicated (“duped”), thanks to an exclusive “aroma fusion” molecule from their partner, CPL Aromas.
• Barb’s take: Dupes aren’t always negative—they can make luxury accessible and inspire people to invest in “the real thing” later:
  “It was so you could visualize having the real one, and it gives everybody access ... I don’t think it’s a bad thing.” (A, 32:49)

7. Fragrance Trends & Scents of the Moment

[33:41–36:25]

• Gourmand fragrances (“dessert-like,” sweet, edible notes) dominate and will continue to. Barb predicts a return of warm florals is coming.
• Emotional, nostalgic scents (like their new Strawberry Jam) tap into a desire for comfort during unstable times.

8. Inside The 7 Virtues Atelier: A ‘Perfume for the People’ Experience

[41:24–46:34]

• Atelier in Halifax: Interactive, hands-on experience where customers create a custom scent using traditional perfumery tools.
• “It’s one of the first times in our lives as adults we get to create again ... this is kind of the adult version of spray painting macaroni with gold.” (A, 42:13)
• Accessible pricing: The custom experience costs the same as buying a bottle at Sephora.
• Exclusive: Atelier expansion to Fairmont Royal York, Toronto, October 22, 2026.
  “I want everyone to have come to the banquet, and that’s my philosophy ... as soon as you walk into our place, bright smiles. Welcome.” (A, 45:07)

9. Dragon’s Den Full Circle

[46:42–52:29]

• Barb shares how she pitched 7 Virtues on Dragon’s Den after banks refused her a loan—despite skepticism and intimidation, she secured investment.
• Returns as a guest Dragon for the 20th anniversary, investing in two businesses and providing mentorship:
  “Unless you’ve lived on assisted living and watched your family’s business go under twice, you’re extra sensitive about the people’s stories.” (A, 51:18)
• Core philosophy: “Your attitude is your altitude.”

10. Stoic Wisdom and The Importance of Resilience

[52:34–54:01]

• Barb discusses her deep connection to Marcus Aurelius’ stoicism, sharing a refrain she instills in her children:
  “When you wake up, be prepared to meet the angry, the lost, the jealous, the jaded. Now lead.” (A, 53:13)
• Message: Embrace adversity as part of the journey—transform challenges into leadership and growth.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Social Impact:
  “We do have to end corruption, obviously. So we continue to sustainably source ... but really it’s going to be women and ending period poverty, in my view, and having women at the table.” (A, 10:07)

• On Clean Perfume:
  “Clean means there’s no phthalates, no parabens. ... The bad rap clean perfumes get is that, oh, they don’t last ... so we double the fragrance oils—22% rather than 10 to 15.” (A, 20:19)

• On Layering:
  “If you can make a layer cake, you can layer perfume. ... Get rid of your perfectionitis. ... It’s not that serious.” (A, 28:13)

• On Nostalgia in Scent:
  “Strawberries don’t grow in a candy store. They grow in the dirt, the earth ... it brings me back somewhere really happy.” (A, 36:01)

• On Resilience:
  “Your attitude is your altitude.” (A, 49:36)

• On Leading with Stoicism:
  “When you wake up, be prepared to meet the angry, the lost, the jealous, the jaded. Now lead.” (A, 53:13)

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Key Timestamps

• Barb’s backstory and mission: 00:56–04:41
• Social model evolution & pivot: 09:04–15:13
• Going viral/TikTok trends: 16:03–18:09
• Signature scents & clean perfume: 18:29–22:44
• Layering perfumes & discovery set: 27:11–31:06
• On dupes & industry ethics: 31:40–33:37
• Trends – gourmands & nostalgia: 33:41–37:14
• Inside the atelier experience: 41:24–46:34
• Dragon’s Den stories: 46:42–52:29
• Stoicism & daily leadership: 52:34–54:01

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a masterclass on building a meaning-driven business, perfume industry innovation, and the emotional power of scent. Barb Stegemann’s story and philosophy continue to inspire, with actionable tips for both perfume lovers and aspiring entrepreneurs. The episode blends heartfelt storytelling with practical fragrance tips, making it essential listening for anyone curious about where beauty and purpose meet.

Transcript

[A]

The following podcast is a dear media production.

[B]

Welcome to Breaking Beauty the podcast.

[C]

All about the breakthrough people, products and moments in beauty.

[B]

We're your hosts, Jill Dunn and Carlene Higgins.

[C]

Hello and welcome to Breaking Beauty podcast. I'm one of your co hosts, Carlene Higgins and I'm here with my lovely

[B]

co host Jill Dunn, that is me. And hello Carlene. Hello Pod fam. And of course we are two longtime magazine beauty editors turned beauty podcasters. We're in your feed each and every Wednesday sharing the breakthrough people, products and moments in beauty.

[C]

And this week we're thrilled to welcome back a friend of the podcast and someone who I consider to be a mentor. She's a fellow Canadian, a kick ass entrepreneur and founder of the Seven Virtues, Barb Stegman.

[A]

Yay.

[B]

Welcome back.

[A]

Thanks for having me. Of course.

[B]

And Barb was one of our earliest guests on the show, everyone. She has this phenomenally inspiring story for her brand. She is a humanitarian at heart. There's so much heart with so many Canadian brands and Barb really exemplifies that. We're going to link to the first episode that she was on. We're going to link to that in our show notes so you can hear her full backstory. But to recap, Barb launched the seven virtues out of her garage in Halifax, Nova Scotia, 2010 International Women's Day with a Visa card and a dream. And it was all in honor of her best friend, Captain Trevor Green, who was wounded in Afghanistan. Afghanistan by the Taliban while serving there.

[C]

Yes. And after that devastating and life changing incident, Barr began the seeds of what would become a historic social enterprise come commercial success story, buying fair trade essential oils from farmers in war torn regions to make perfumes for peace.

[B]

She's not just an entrepreneur, everyone. She's also produced a award winning documentary about the experiences called Perfume War. And Barb has also written the Seven Virtues of a Philosopher Queen, a women's guide to living and leading in the illogical world. And really, that book came out even before the brand. But it is all baked into the DNA of Seven Virtues. The Seven Virtues, by the way, I had to look them up. It's wonder, balance, truth, courage, justice, wisdom and beauty.

[C]

Yes. And the 7 Virtues is the only Canadian perfume featured in 170 new Sephora stores across Europe, bringing its total door count to over 2,000 worldwide.

[B]

So in today's episode, we're going to catch up with Barb. We're diving deep into fragrance. It's so hot right now, we can't deny that all the trends, the Art of layering and what clean perfume actually means. And we're going to get her thoughts on perfume dupes as well.

[C]

Yes. And stay tuned until the end for some exciting News on the 7 Virtues Perfume Atelier retail expansion.

[B]

Okay. With all of that, welcome to Breaking Beauty.

[A]

Oh, thanks for having me. I was just listening and I was like, this feels like Brian Lanahan and the. The school. Great journalism. I mean, this is. You guys are so refreshing. Like my whole life story flashed in front of me and so eloquently done. Thank you.

[C]

We remember the time that when we first spoke, we were in the Toronto Public library. It was 2017. Do you remember that? Those were humble beginnings. Let me tell you ourselves.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And now we're in a studio with lights. Everyone watch this on our YouTube channel.

[C]

Now, at that time, you had just been hand selected for the Sephora Accelerate program. Right. And I think your brand was pretty young at the time. And today, earlier today, you were helping out with the next gen of Sephora Squad Influencers.

[A]

So exciting.

[C]

Like what a full circle moment.

[A]

It, it really is. It's kind of surreal and you know what it's like to have the nerves and to be excited. There's a certain amount of relatability that you know what it feels like when the unknown and you're trying and so it always takes you back there. You never forget where you came from. So I think that's why I, I really feel like I want to be out with people that are starting up and trying to do it because I know what it's like.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So the Sephora Squad, for those that are the uninitiated, it's basically like a group of influencers that are kind of just getting some traction going and they're working with Sephora. And what were you, what was your role? You're there. You're basically a professional TED talker. We should also mention that. So were you like, motivational speaking?

[A]

I go into the motivational talk and then halfway through I'm like, were we going to talk about perfume? Oh, yeah. I better get down to business. The team will be like. But I, I do, I love to motivate people and get excited and our MO is to see people flourish.

[C]

Right.

[A]

So based on the virtues in the book. And so I kind of up to something really. I feel like the book is to empower people to live and lead in this illogical world, because it is. But I don't have the right to talk about stuff unless I'm walking on glass with you. So by Bringing the perfume, the thesis to life. I am also saying, okay, I will take risks and live these virtues with you and show that it is possible. Others were just talking. Right? So. And the Sephora squad's fascinating to me because it's been around for a long time in the States, and it just started in Canada last year. It's really nice to see this second cohort come through. I was the second cohort in Sephora Accelerate. And they're. They're kind of groundbreaking, like you are with your podcast. And I admire that. You know, I really admire people that are doing things that are still fairly new in Canada, and, you know, it's our time. Canada's cool.

[B]

It is cool. Between heated rivalry and all of our cool Olympians and cool beauty brands and cool fashion brands, it's all happening, you know, cool podcast. Cool podcast. We're trying. We're trying. In the last time that we chatted, Barb, I. I'll never forget this because you said that your makeup bag was a Sobe's bag, which, as an Atlantic Canadian, I can relate to that. I feel like it's the funniest thing ever.

[A]

Now it's a Ziploc bag anymore, but it was always reusing something, Right. Reuse. You put knitting stuff, you put your chips, your storm chips in there, your makeup, and you'd head over to someone's house with your SO bag that it's essential.

[B]

When you would go on vacation, there's always Sobeys back. That's how you knew the Canadians.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

On the beach in Mexico. Now you're get. You know, you've went from Sobeys bag, makeup bag, to getting your hair done by Chris McMillan, spritzing perfume with Monica Tan, who's like the perfume princess, everything. So how do you think this kind of perspective as an outsider helped you kind of infiltrate the beauty world? Because it's not easy, and it's cutthroat. It's still a business.

[A]

Yeah, it's well said. I think you always. I have two things. One, I'm kind of like Tigger. I kind of. Because I was raised by a single mom on assisted living in rural Nova Scotia. So you just show up, and there's a certain thing you have to do when you come from humble roots to give other people permission. You have to arrive at the banquet and know that you're allowed to be there and not have that voice that says, I'm not allowed to be here. You have to break through that daily practice. Daily practice like a muscle. And as you Age, it gets strengthened like a muscle, like a push up. You rip your muscle. And so I think for me, it's very important to show up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then swing the doors open to others. And so when I arrive at the banquet, I feel like, yeah, why not me? And I have the right to be here. And so does everybody watching you have the right to be here. And then you realize, no matter who you meet, Whether it's Chris McMillan or Monica 10, they're real people and they're kind and they're loving, and they have their challenges too, and. And they're just so gracious. And then you realize people are just people. Right. And so if one thing I learned as a flight attendant many years ago, to treat everyone the same. And one thing I noticed was that the business people, when I was pouring their coffee in business class for nine years, in between my degrees, the businessmen that were rude to us, they went out of business. And the businessmen that were kind to us, as kind as they were to the CEO beside them or the grounds handler or the flight attendant being me, they flourished. And so I learned everything. Pouring coffee in my flying boardroom as a flight attendant about business.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it still applies.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Is who people are people. And the way we treat one another is. Is our altitude, you know?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Now, I remember when we first talked and we were so blown away by your story because it was all about giving back and creating change. And you created this social impact model. It was still for profit, and I really admired that because it had a component of. Of sustainability in terms of the business and ensuring there would be longevity to it. But it did have this giving back because you were buying essential oils from these farmers in Afghanistan that would support their local economy and allow them to focus on that instead of making war or participating in war. So tell us how your model has changed now and how you are still able to stay true to your. That. That desire and that commitment to social impact.

[A]

Yeah, it's a great question. Yeah. There's been an evolution of the brand. When we started, it was Afghanistan, Haiti, and now you can't go to those countries, you can't source the corruption is very sad, very heartbreaking. We smuggled the last bit of Afghanistan orange blossom out that we could. And now, after many years, hundreds of thousands of dollars invested, many girls smuggler liberated from becoming opium brides because their fathers were going legal orange blossom and rose for us. I felt good about that. I felt like we made a difference in people's lives. And then now even my Supplier can no longer live there. He's had to escape. And so for me, when I look at this, we do have to end corruption, obviously. So we continue to sustainably source from around the world, from countries that we can get into. And we donate to days for girls to ensure that little girls are not locked in sheds when they're on their periods. Because when women, young girls can go to school and learn to read, they can run for office, they can decide how many babies they want, and that's how we're gonna end more. So really, that is the root of it, in my view. So that's the kind of the shift. Still the same philosophy, but adapting and staying true to sourcing sustainably and clean products. But really it's going to be women and ending period poverty, in my view, and having women at the table.

[C]

I love that you said that, because I've been saying for a while now, we need. We need to do like a global walkout where women walk out on Women's Day because women need to be in political power.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

Like, they really just do. It's our turn. I love that you just swap everybody out.

[A]

Can we love that? I'm with you. Let's go. Because just all walk out around the

[C]

world on Women's Day.

[A]

I don't know if you remember, the women in Iceland walked out. They weren't getting the conditions they needed for work, and they all stopped working for the day, and they had to get every demand met. Women own the buying power and the voting power. Entire governments would rise and fall at our collective vote. So you're right. Let's go take that power. You won't have corruption.

[C]

I agree.

[B]

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[A]

And After Bedtime is the podcast where

[B]

we stop pretending we've got it all

[A]

figured out and start telling the truth about parenting.

[B]

This, this show goes way beyond tantrum tips. We're talking about identity shifts, breaking cycles, screaming into a pillow, healing the parts of you that parenting cracked wide open. So come as you are, you're not

[A]

too much, you're not alone, and you're already enough.

[C]

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[B]

Real talk though, Barb, was it hard to walk away from that initial modus operandi or raison d' etre for you

[A]

to walk away for? What do you mean?

[B]

Well, I mean just pivot. Pivot?

[A]

Yeah. You have to pivot. Yeah. You've got employees, you've got supply supply chain around the world still counting on you. It's very difficult, but it's, it's seated very deep passion in me that I know that one day I will run for office.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[A]

Oh, no, no. Like there this cannot happen. The corruption that is unacceptable. So I continue to work on my business and all the things we sustainably sourcing, taking care of our employees. You know, we're the only B core certified perfume at Sephora and BCOR is hard to get, which means we take care of the planet, went through the year and a half audit, pay our people well. That's really important. So doing all the things that are meaningful in a good way and still being stand out from the other brands in terms of the footprint we leave on this earth. But more than that, it has fueled a bit of anger in me in the best of ways, because you kind of have to get a little angry about it. And I came up with my own sort of mantra during the pandemic. Get mad, take a bath, have a nap. Get mad, Let it out. Take a bath. Turn off your mind, and then take a nap. Let your subconscious mind give you the answers. And so I'm going to channel all that at some point. Go door knocking, and we will end corruption. Well, my bony little hand, whatever the year that is, I'm not going to allow for it. So it's fueled me in different ways.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

So the pivot in the business still remains true to all those principles, but there's going to be a bigger plan.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

When we lock down International Women's Day.

[C]

I'll be with you. I'll be walking with you.

[B]

Amazing.

[A]

I'll be walking with you. And we'll all be in the same caucus together. And, you know.

[C]

Yeah. Okay. Love it. I'll be there. Well, let's talk about the fragrance itself, because first, let's start with. With this going viral, which I think is just such a spin on your original, you know, mode motivation and what you were trying to achieve. And now we're just in a totally different universe where fragrances go viral and yours have. So Santel Vanille and Amber Vanilla have taken off on TikTok. So how does it feel to see your perfumes kind of. That you had, even in the creation, like, these deeply philosophical meanings, and now they're like an aesthetic for.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Or a trend.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Do you feel like the original meaning gets amplified, or does it get like. Like, lost a little?

[A]

I think this is true, but I think that the end of the day, you have to sing your story from the rooftops, which can be hard for Canadians, but you have to because you've got employees.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

You get people counting on you, and you have clients that love your products. So it's. You know, they tell us stories. We've had people that their mother's been buried with her favorite Seven Virtues perfume. I mean, we've been around that long. And these stories are so touching. Or women crying in the middle of the floor because they couldn't wear perfume because they have such allergies. And ours are clean and they can wear perfume again. After 18 years, woman happened six times. The first one was in Brooklyn on the floor just before Christmas. A woman lost her sense of smell during COVID and She could smell only ours out of the whole place. She was walking along going, please, please, please, please, please. And I was like, hey, what's going on? She told me what happened. I gave her Santal vanilla and cherry ambition, two of the strongest. And she could smell. And I was like, okay, you go smell everything. I don't want to sell you anything right now. You got to go see what is the best for you. And she came back and said, you're the only. Only perfume I could smell.

[C]

Wow.

[A]

The all the others smelled like alcohol. And we double dose the fragrance because their claims there's 22% fragrance was. And it felt like, I mean, I had to look it up. Mayo Clinic. It's called neuroplasticity. Nothing happened to their nose. It was brain patterns. It's happened six times total. We always get chills. And those are the moments that I. Okay, you know what? There's a reason why we do this. There's other beautiful ways to help people through a really high quality product. And they get attached to it. They're circumference security blanket. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

My God. Buttercream haze. The new one is my support animal.

[B]

It's there. I have it. I have it here.

[A]

Put that on. Every day I'm like, oh, thank you. Thank you, God.

[C]

You can never underestimate the power of beauty. Just look at lipstick. And you know, like feminists from history, it is beauty can pretty much change. Look at the world problem.

[B]

Yeah. Suffragette red lipstick that you launched.

[A]

Yes. Remember, that was our podcast.

[B]

Yes. You were about to.

[A]

That went in the accelerate program. So we went back to fragrance. But that was a nice moment that you experienced very few.

[C]

What about that?

[B]

It was literally called Suffragette.

[A]

Suffragette.

[B]

So bring that back when you run for office. Okay.

[C]

To fill in. So, yeah. You were gonna launch lipstick.

[A]

Yeah. I hadn't made them all. My son and I handmade everyone. And if it wasn't smooth, we heated it and melted it and made it perfect.

[C]

Like.

[B]

So I want to ask you about. About Vanilla Woods. That's your number one bestseller.

[C]

Right?

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So it features top notes of fresh pear heart, notes of rose base, notes of Madagascar vanilla, caramel and amber. And this launched in 2018, everybody. So ahead of the gourmand trend we are seeing right now. So in your opinion, what makes it a winner?

[A]

Well, it was Vanilla woods was the first clean vanilla. Now as many.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

And there's something very magical about Vanilla woods because it has the amber, the ISO E, all those comforting, you know, musks that Just make you feel safe. And I think that's why it blew up. And it's still our everything. And it's very special to us because as a little indie family from Nova Scotia had no idea what I was doing. I just wanted to help some farmers to just something put something on the shelf and go there. Yeah, what do we do now? And then it blows up and you're like, okay, thank you. Because.

[C]

Because it could go either way.

[A]

It could go anyway. And it got our family through so many rough spots. So Vanilla woods is such a special place in my heart.

[C]

And now ISO E, remind me, is that the one that kind of adapts to your.

[A]

Like a pheromone?

[C]

Yeah, yeah. Okay.

[A]

Molecule. And it, it helps vanilla to behave.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Because true vanilla, like the Madagascan villain, doesn't like to get along with other notes. So if you want to calm it down, you've got to use isoe. But why not? ISOE is calming. Although a large part of the population cannot smell ISO E, which is fascinating.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So when someone smells something very different from what I smell, I don't take that personally. Everyone's olfactory is different.

[C]

Yeah, absolutely.

[B]

That is so fascinating to me, honestly.

[C]

And what about. You mentioned it was the first clean vanilla fragrance. So what does clean mean?

[A]

Yeah, clean means there's no phthalates, no parabens. You go through serious audits with Sephora to meet the standards and all the European regulations to be deemed safe. There is no formaldehyde, none of the chemicals. And you know, it's the bad rap clean perfumes get is that, oh, they don't last because you don't have these chemicals. So we double the fragrance oils 22% rather than 10 to 15 of really high quality ingredients. And then we infuse it with organic sugarcane alcohol. The carrier. It's like biting into an organic peach or having an organic glass of wine. There's a difference. And so the scents last. They can go toe to toe with the big brands that have all the chemicals. And it just means you're conscious of people's health.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And yet you still want to get compliments from strangers. So we cracked the code and how to make a long lasting clean perfume.

[B]

I need to ask you about a stat I read and I need you to explain it because it was about the study you did on the longevity of the scent on the skin. And I think it was specific to Vanilla Woods.

[A]

Right. We've done all of them.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And they, they called us, the lab called us. They were like, we have never seen results like this. They said usually brands are upset that their perfume lasts three hours or eight hours. They said you last 24 hours and could even linger for the weekend depending on the juice. And I felt like that's another testimonial to the fact that when you double the ingredients, you can, you can be as long lasting as any chemical laden perfume and still be okay for people that get sick or want to go to work. I mean, in Canada, 40% of workplaces are sent free.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

We've been dubbed the scent you can wear to work.

[B]

Oh, that's interesting.

[A]

Right, because it doesn't walk in the room ahead of you.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And I think that's important because especially since people recently have had to go back to work.

[B]

No, this is this longevity test on the skin. Is it different for each one of your perfumes?

[A]

It varies, but it's not. There's no huge delta between them. They're all incredibly long lasting. And then of course, it depends on if you went running or got caught in the rain or washed your hands a lot, you know, depending on.

[B]

Yeah, I went deep on this because I, I appreciated that. It also said it was the longevity was different if your skin was moisturized versus not.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

So it's like it was like eight hours for this one perfume, but on moisturized skin, everybody. So if you're dry, hit the body

[A]

cream first, then put your gotta be

[B]

moisturized and that'll make it last.

[A]

Just like makeup.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

You wouldn't put makeup on a dry face.

[C]

Yeah, true.

[A]

None of us do. We're always like misting in between.

[B]

Vivier is one of our show partners this week. If you're still looking for your holy grail vitamin C, I want to introduce you to Vivier. They are a Canadian pharmaceutical grade skincare brand known for its science backed, clinically proven formulations designed to deliver real visible results. And I first learned about Vivier through a dermatologist, actually. And the brand is trusted by dermatologists, estheticians and skincare professionals and is especially well known for its vitamin C serums. They have like a whole portfolio of vitamin C serums. And so it's the perfect time to highlight why vitamin C is such a staple in skincare and why it is recommended by dermatologists so often. And that reason is because vitamin C, it's a powerful antioxidant that helps brighten the skin, support collagen production and protect against environmental stressors like pollution and UV exposure. It's just one of the most data backed ingredients out there that we know makes an impact on the skin and what sets Vivier apart is that is the form of vitamin C that they use. It's L ascorbic acid. Usp, the purest and most potent form available. But it's also one of the hardest to stabilize and where Vivier has addressed this with their proprietary IDs delivery system which helps maintain stability and allows for deeper, more effective absorption into the skin. And I like to recommend their new serum 30. I'm holding it here in my hand. This is their next generation brightening serum that's clinically proven to reduce pigmentation and improve uneven skin tone. I really like how seamless it is to work into your routine. Just a few drops in your palms. I put it on every morning. No sensitivity even though it is 30%. And it's expertly formulated with 30% vitamin C to target both surface level and deeper underlying pigmentation and damage while preventing future discoloration. So if you want to check out the new Serum 30 yourself, you can visit Vivier Skin.com to use code BEAUTY15 at checkout to receive 15 off your purchase. That's V I V I e r S-I-N.com and use code BEAUTY15 for 15 off your purchase. We'll link to the software in our show notes and on our website.

[C]

Today's episode is brought to you in part by Light Stem. All right, let's talk about the red light mask craze. Okay, I definitely got caught up in this. I've tried using a red light in the past. I used it on a fairly regular basis, but I just didn't see results fast enough. So it just ended up sitting on my bedside and collecting dust, frankly. Now I just got a new one. I'm getting ready to do a new proper test drive and I'll tell you why. The one I'm using has gotten my attention. So I'm using the light stim Ellipsa model E L I P S A. Now this one is said to be totally different because it's the same anti aging technology for at home use that your doctor uses in the office. Whereas other red light masks, they can be frankly not that different than red lights on your Christmas tree. So this one promises that you're going to see a difference and feel a difference almost immediately. I cannot wait to try this for my perimenopausal onset rosacea. It's FDA proven to reduce wrinkles on the entire face and medical grade, meaning that it works. It's Said to stimulate natural collagen and elastin the way that they're supposed to work. And it's totally affordable compared to doctors visits. So if you want the same medical grade technology at home that doctors use to treat wrinkles and slow aging, go to LightSTEM L I G H-T-S-T-I-M.com and use our code BEAUTY to save 10%. Again. That's code beautyightstem.com and now back to the show. I'm sure you've learned so much, much over the years about beauty from all of your Sephora insider friends. What have you learned about layering perfumes?

[A]

Oh, well, you know, I learned about layering way back when I went to Grass France. I love how that just rolled off my tongue. Yeah. Every so often I'm like, what? So I was in Grass France. I couldn't wait to go design a perfume in the French style with the pipettes, with the apothecary jars and name it. And while I was there, it was raw materials, so it was like jasmine rice. And I noticed the other women were didn't like their perfumes. They were pouring them down the sink. But I loved mine. And I went back to my perfumers and I said, you know what, what if we actually created like something like a unifier in every one of our perfumes to make sure you couldn't fail, like, build a perfume. And so from that day forth, every perfume which was right from the start with Vanilla woods was designed with this harmony molecule that we've trademarked. You can't fail. When you blend our perfect perfumes, they will create a brand new perfume. Like two people they're getting having a baby. There's still some DNA, but it's going to be a new person. And the, the layering thing is even now we have this trademarked layer cake collection. You have some here. And the idea is if you can make a layer cake, you can layer perfume. I love to demystify it. People get all worked up too. They're designing their perfume. Get rid of your perfectionitis. Have half as itis. Let's go, like, just go skin your knee, you know, and. And it's not that serious. It's not that serious. But you can tell by personalities that people get worked up. And I'm like, let's not hold ourselves back. Yeah, let's just go.

[B]

Let's just spritz and be happy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What's the most surprising combo that you've put together on the floor?

[A]

There's a lot Of I would say the two that people are most shocked by. One is when you put lotus pear, which is this really juicy Williams pear from the King's estate in High Grove in England. Very posh. People in London love it. With Santal Vanill, that is like this Santa, New York, cool, Soho House kid kind of vibe. And they're very, very juxtaposing. You would never expect them together. But just like when you bake, if you put salt on chocolate or like these different flavors come together. Same thing with scent. And then the other one, that is my daily everything is. I do because there's, there's sandalwood. All three is. I start with Santal Vanilla, then I put cherry ambition on, and then I put buttercream on.

[C]

Oh, wow.

[A]

I smell like a really expensive hotel. Wow.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

And are you. That's the in between or is it dry in each time? Are you like.

[A]

Oh, no.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Rhyme or reason?

[C]

Swimming.

[B]

I love that.

[C]

And what about if somebody comes in and they're testing, they want to find the one scent for them? Do you have a hack of like, how do you tell to walk around and come back? Or like, what are your tips for that?

[A]

Great questions. Well, first thing is close your eyes. When you smell perfume, the sensory of sight and hearing blocks out half of what you're smelling. You're overwhelmed. The music's playing, your friend's talking, your dog is there. And so you close your eyes and now you can really smell all the notes. And now that you've decided that put the two favorite on different wrists and walk around. See how it works with your pheromones, your body, that usually is the best way. But close your eyes. It's one of the first things I learned years ago on the floor at my first life, the first iteration, a lady that kind of took me under her wing, she was in the fragrance area. Close your eyes.

[C]

Okay, good one.

[B]

So even when, yeah. You're shopping, it's like, just stop, close

[A]

your eyes, smell it, and you'll. You'll pick up notes you would not have picked up with the distraction of lights and sound. Perfume is just immediate. And I think that's what is refreshing about it. So even the overthinker can't overthink it.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And. And by the way, everyone that's listening, Barb has this amazing discovery set. Right. There's like seven samples.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

And you. I don't know how much it is roughly, but you can get, you can try all of them and like tiny little non committal.

[A]

Yeah. That's right.

[B]

You know, and just give it a. Give it a whirl.

[A]

Totally affordable.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think it's 30 depends on U.S. or Canada. And it gives you all of them. And each little vial is like, a full weekend's worth. You can play. It's like a mini atelier, and you can start to see what blends you love. And it's. It's really cute. A lot of women tell me it's the first perfume they buy for their daughter.

[C]

Oh, cute.

[A]

Because it tells the story of the world, and it's clean and they can play. So that's become really popular for moms to be like, here's your first perfume, dear.

[B]

Yeah. You know what you need to do is, like, have that as a giftable. And then. But people can come back and, like, exchange it for a full size of the one they like.

[A]

Yeah, we're starting to work on that on the website.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

That's one of the. You're brilliant.

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

That's one thing that we're working on so that you could. Then you can just upgrade and get it.

[C]

I wonder what you think about dupes, because there are so many out there, and I don't know if your fragrances have been duped.

[A]

Yeah, I heard they were, but they can't be. Here's the cool thing. Our perfume house, CPL Aromas in London, the owner, Chris Pickville, read about me at our work in Rwanda and took me under his wing. Just angels. They're my family. And they put in all of our perfumes. Remember when he told me this when I had, like, no sales in the beginning, he was like, we're putting it's very special little note in there that is like Harry Potter's cloaking. You can't be duped. And I was like, it's called aroma fusion.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And I was like, why does that matter? Nobody knows about me. Right? And now fast forward. I was like, man, he knew. So nobody can actually dupe. Oh, our perfumes. Which is intriguing to me. Now back to dupes, though. You know, I think about the dupes in general, and I don't think they're a bad thing. And I'll tell you why. You know, you bought your first fake bracelet or fake purse.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

It was so you could visualize having the real one, and it gives everybody access to something when they don't have the means. And I loved having my fake everything. And then once I had the money, because I had visualized it, I bought the real things, and I think that that can be true of the sense. So I don't think it's a bad thing if a brand is being duped. Of course I can't be, but. So there's that. But I do think that. I don't think, think it's, it's a bad thing because a person is still wanting that real Lux bottle.

[C]

Yeah, right.

[A]

They still will one day buy that. We're just conscious luxury. So nobody's trying to get our bottle because it's. We put it in a conscious luxury bottle so the vegan girl doesn't have to give up her lunch money for my perfume.

[C]

Yeah. This is the philosopher queen. Yeah, Literally the philosopher queen's view on dupes. You will only hear this from Barb Ste.

[A]

Yeah, I like to look at things a little deeper layer.

[C]

Tell us about the fragrance trends that you're seeing right now. What's on the horizon that everybody needs to know about?

[A]

Well, I think you're seeing, you know, it used to be the warm florals. They were the highest, most popular, sought after perfume. Those gorgeous sexy patchoulis, the sexy nighttime that you could cut through a smoke laden bar and go dancing on the speakers. I'm just dating myself because that's what we did. And you're seeing a shift now. It's gourmand. And I've always been a gourmand girl. That has always been from Vanilla woods, right through of buttercream strawberry jam layer cake. I mean, how gourmand is that? I'm obsessed with the gourmands. The gourmands are because of this, you know, this illogical world. I want you to feel happy right away and then they dry down to like adult gourmand. So there's kind of two things going on. Right. But in the trends out there, you're seeing gourmand everywhere. You're also seeing people are launching perfumes like every six weeks. I think it's overwhelming for people. I won't do that. We'd launch two a year Y and I'm not going to overwhelm my team. And I think that it the world has to be sustainable. And I think people get overwhelmed if you keep throwing things at them all the time. So that's one thing I won't do. But I do think that the gourmand thing is here to stay. I think it's also because of glp. I think people want to smell like food. It's comforting. I'm not saying everyone's on glp, but there is a huge trend, for sure. I think people want to get some satisfaction. I also think you're going to see the warm floral. Come back. Come back. I'm working on one right now and looking at the modern world and that need for the ambers and the musks. So that's really important to me is I think the warm floral should have a comeback.

[C]

What about this jammy, jammy scent that I'm looking at in front of me?

[A]

Strawberry jam is our biggest launch in our history.

[C]

Tell us about it.

[A]

Strawberry jam was like paying homage to my childhood. Like I said, we're on assisted living. We didn't have much, so we picked our strawberries by the roadside. Wild strawberries. And, you know, strawberries don't grow in a candy store. They grow in the dirt, the earth. So you have to have nutty pistachio to give it that gritty, earthy. That's why it smells such a good, true strawberry. And then. And then, of course, we have Tonka bean, whipped marshmallow, sugared raspberry, all the fun things. But it really was about strawberries. When we made. When we made our cakes, there was no fancy anything. You put strawberry jam on the cake. Yeah. So for me, the layer cake was all like, well, okay, we're gonna make some strawberry jam. It was just kind of this. It's what we did. And then it resonated.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think. And a lot of people. I don't. It doesn't matter whether it's my. My friends in Paris or Canada, it doesn't matter. People always say to me, it brings me back somewhere really happy. And I'm like, good. I went to the Sephora EU Paris conference a year and a half ago, and they said, berry gourmands are coming. And I was like, berry gourmands are coming. I'm all in for it. So that was it. Strawberry jam was born.

[C]

Well, I like the BlackBerry you had as well.

[A]

BlackBerry Lily.

[C]

Really good.

[A]

Yeah, she was. She was the middle child. No one took photos of her. She was. During the pandemic. Her launch was two days before the lockdown. She never got her party.

[C]

Well, we gave her a party. Yeah.

[B]

It's funny you mentioned that, because I. I was thinking about the trends in fragrance, and I think just there's a whole nostalgia piece happening right now. People are craving that, like, safe space in the world. And so, yeah, I am. I do want it to smell like my mom's strawberry shortcake or whatever, because it's really one of the only many things you can control right now.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Even you see it in Dior's latest fragrance. It's very girly.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like all of the high end luxury ones. Niche hundreds of dollars. They are nodding to this as well. So you really do.

[A]

I think the world needs it. Happiness instantly. And nothing like scent. I mean scent, emotion are connected in the back of the brain.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So when you smell something that makes you happy, it's instant.

[C]

Today's episode is brought to you in part by Dove. Lately with summer around the corner, I've been trying to refresh my routine and turn my everyday shower into more of a self care moment. And honestly, the products that you use make such a difference. We know that around here at Breaking Beauty Podcast. And one that I've been loving is the Dove Serum plus Oil body wash. It's one of those formulas that just feels more elevated. It starts out as this, this oil, this luxurious amber oil that transforms into a light creamy foam. So it feels super luxe on my skin and it leaves it really radiant and glowing in just one shower. And there's no greasy residue even though it does start out as an oil. So it's such a practical product as well. I love to use it to shave my legs. And another thing is that it's made with 50 glycerin serum, so that's a really powerful humectant. And at 50%, that is just incredible. It was formulated with dermatologists, so that's probably why it's such a smart formulation as well. It really helps to boost hydration and leave my skin feeling soft and smooth after every shower. And it's available in this radiance formula that has notes of jojoba and Manoi flour. That's Jill's favorite. And I love the soothing with almond oil and sandalwood. I think it smells incredible, very elevated. And I actually mentioned it as one of my April faves in our newsletter. If you're not following our monthly newsletter, you need to sign up right away. It's all of the favorites of the month that don't make it into our episode. So discover the new Dove Serum Plus Oil Body Wash at www.dove.com ca. Now available on Amazon and in stores nationwide. That's www.dove.com ca.

[B]

Grateful that Nutrafol is one of our longtime show partners. We all know that unstoppable feeling of leaving the hair salon with a great blowout. I mean, we can take on the world with great hair. And I think the opposite is also true. If you're not feeling so confident in your hair. It can hold you back from day to day life, it can hold you back from showing up because you don't feel like the best version of yourself. I mean, so many of my group chats with my girlfriends now are about this very topic that they feel like their ponytail isn't as thick as it once was. And it can really be a hit to the confidence. And that's why I love talking about and recommending neutral because neutral is the number one dermatologist recommended hair growth supplement brand. And it's the number one hair growth supplement brand personally used by dermatologists, recommended many times by derms on our show as well as hairstyles stylists. And Nutrafol's hair growth supplements are peer reviewed, they're NSF certified for sport and they are clinically tested. So Nutrafol is data backed which is why you see so many dermatologists getting on board with it. And Nutrafol, I really appreciate that they're supporting your hair health from within, working overtime to deliver results you can see and feel so your hair becomes something you enjoy and not something that you are stressing about about. So let your hair be one less thing to worry about. See visibly thicker, stronger, faster. Growing hair in three to six months with Nutrif for a limited time, Neutrophil is offering our listeners $10 off your first month subscription and free shipping when you visit nutrafol.com and enter the promo code BREAKING. That's nutrafol.com spelled N U T R A F O L dot com and use promo code breaking. We'll link to the software in our show notes and on our website. Now back to the.

[C]

We need to talk about the fragrance atelier. So you open the first one in Halifax. I believe it's on the boardwalk. Right.

[A]

Right on the Halifax waterfront. The Queens mark mirror. And it looks at the famous steps coming out of the Halifax harbor. So you sit there and watch the boats go by.

[C]

I need to go to this location and check it out and get you home. I picture it kind of like a bite. Beauty like lab for fragrance.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. You can create your own fragrance, but it's hands on. You're doing it. She's building. Nobody else doing it. You are actually making the perfume.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And you trust your instincts.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

So you do a walk through. Very self guided with our alchemists. And then you take, just like in grass France, you take your blotter and you smell. I like this scent. Keep it this scent. I'm not so Much. This one at the end. So you have four or five blotters. You wave them all past your nose. That's your problem. Perfume.

[C]

Oh, wow.

[A]

And that's what they taught me in grass. Then you sit down and with pipettes you start going. And then halfway up you smell it and you can go. And this is where it gets intuitive. And I think it's like, you know, it's one of the first times in our lives as adults we get to create again. You know, when I was little, we would spray paint some macaroni and a piece of paper, gold and put it on the fridge. And my parents were like, good for you. And I was so proud of myself. And this is kind of the adult version of spray painting macaroni with gold and feeling like you've done something. And so then halfway up you smell it and it's very intuitive, you know, you need more sweet or more warm. And it's a. Trust your instincts. It's a wonderful exercise I don't think we get enough of. And then you finish it. Now you gotta name it. Oh, my God, you gotta name it. And you're basically creating a brand new perfume that never existed. And then you decorate the box. Oh, it's all in. And you get a silk twilly scarf. And you remember this day. And it costs the same as buying a perfume at Sephora. The whole experience, it's appointment only and it's a sanctuary in a safe place. And it's just a. It's a beautiful thing.

[B]

And you keep your sort of like recipe on file there for.

[A]

You don't. But we're going to start. Here's the thing. We didn't have a methodology to actually record people's formulations, so we're working on that right now. So that for the next atelier we can start all across the board and allow you to keep your formulation so we can make it for you again. And then there's different labels, different days, so you could pick the different label, maybe name it something else if you wish. Shake it up. There could be some new juice in the place. But yeah, we've never done that because I just kind of wanted everybody to have a one off and be like,

[C]

yeah, this is absolutely genius. Like, this is what Guerlain does at their ateliers in Paris.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Certain ateliers. I remember I did a story on this years ago and there's a certain. You can do it kind of like that, where there's. I think it's a similar ish type of experience. But it's in Guerlain.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

But then. And it costs, like, I don't remember how much it costs. This was probably 15, 20 years ago when I wrote the story. But then there's another one that you could do that was completely couture. It was like as if somebody was designing a couture dress for you, and it would be like you would go in and talk to the nose. And there were no. It wasn't about picking the scents. It was like, I want it to smell like when I grew up in Argentina and we had a horse and this and that. And that one cost like $80,000. So I feel like this is like the. This is, like, accessible. It is, though. And it's like, this is gonna pop off.

[A]

It's also.

[B]

You are once again, barb, ahead of your time, because literally last week there was an article about the mono movement in perfume, AKA standalone stores. If you're in Soho in New York, it's every other fragrance brand has their own standalone store. I was in Mexico City, real hotbed of perfume, fragrance ateliers and same thing. It's like popping off. And you were the first to do it because you launched that a couple years ago, did you not?

[A]

The atelier was two years ago in Canada Day. Yeah. And it's funny, too. You talked about being accessible. I'm glad you saw that, Carlene, because, you know, I. I want everyone to have come to the banquet, and that's my philosophy, and that you should be able to be a part of this. And. And I sometimes used to get intimidated when I'd go into perfume shops, you know, and. And I. As soon as you walk into our place, Bright smiles. Welcome. Let's get you all settled in to your appointment.

[C]

So where's the next atelier popping up?

[A]

Well, they told me not to tell, but as if I'm ever going to follow my rules. I'm a bit of a rule breaker. Breaking beauty.

[B]

We're breaking the news right here.

[A]

So I'm just going to tell you the Fairmont Royal York in the fall in Toronto. Toronto. Very excited. Perfect.

[B]

So fantastic.

[A]

And that's our ecosystem. Hotel, restaurant, restaurants, tourists, transportation. That's what we have in Halifax. That same ecosystem will work here. All the beauty advisors from Sephora come through on Sunday nights. We wine and dine them and spoil them and we love them. And it really is like an education place for us with our Sephora family. And then also to have our influencer events and media events and. And then. And our clients to come and. And Have a part of it. So I'm really excited.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

Yeah. It's just. It's a dream come true.

[C]

This is. Do we know approximately the date?

[A]

My goal is October 22nd. That's as long as all of the other pieces because there's a big Renault going on, so it feels pretty special.

[B]

That's fantastic.

[C]

Very exciting.

[B]

And it's like you can bring your girlfriends there. You can do like bachelorette party. Like bridal team building bridal parties.

[A]

Couples come and everybody's safe in the sanctuary.

[C]

We need to ask you about Dragon's Den.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

We talked about it the first time you were on our show because you had recalled the time that you were on Dragon's Den. There was a rejection that happened. Maybe you could retell that a little bit. And then now you were a guest Dragon full circle moment earlier this year. So tell us, like, what that felt like.

[A]

The banks wouldn't give me a loan. I had a perfect credit rating. I owned my own house. But I was gonna buy oils from farmers in Afghanistan. They judged me. I did what any Atlantic Canadian would do. When nobody wants to give you money, you go on a reality show. Of course. And I was terr. They do a countdown back then. They'd count like the walking down the plank. Ten, nine. And then you go in and you face off with the smartest richest people in Canada. And you don't want to waste their time. So I walked in, did my pitch, and then I got a little more comfortable as they asked questions. And three wanted in. Brett Wilson ended up becoming my investor. And Kevin O' Leary didn't get it.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Mr. Wonderful. And that's okay. You know, when I gave a talk to my daughter's class, it was grade five. Then when it aired and. And one of the kids said, Kevin o' Leary was so mean to you. And I said, get ready for life, kids.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Not everyone's going to like your idea. That's okay. And then I opened for him in Halifax and everyone thought we were going to duke it out. And I thanked him. You got to thank the people that underestimate you. Brett Wilson made 56 times his investment.

[C]

That's right.

[A]

So.

[C]

That's right.

[A]

125,000. That's quite a few million. It pays to stretch out of your comfort zone, but also pays to not give up on your dream dream. And also then I became friends with Kevin and his publicist, Nancy. So don't for any bridges. Someone's not going to like your idea. That's okay. Maybe not now. But maybe another time. Yes. And I feel like that that's back to the philosopher in me.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Is well, what do I need to learn from this moment? Don't take it personally.

[C]

It's not personal.

[A]

Right. Then how do I learn from this?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I can come back and be like, thank you for underestimating me.

[C]

It's so funny. I just was saying this. We, we did a live event a few weeks ago and I was saying that there was. To be underestimated can be a gift, the best gift. And I, and I have enjoyed that position on a few occasions as a woman.

[A]

It's going to happen. As Nellie McClung, who got us the vote in 1918, the Famous Five said, you have to be twice as good to be considered half as great. And that is still the case for me as a woman. And I'm sure you see it too, in many situations. It's unbelievable that it still goes on, but. But we'll keep harnessing our power together and keep, you know, walking out on International Women's Day and doing the kinds of things to, to liberate other women from this. Still in a patriarchy.

[B]

But wait, I need to go back. What did you do this year on Dragons Den? Did you invest on somebody? I need to get the full circle.

[A]

Yeah. I pitched. Twelve of us who did very well in business were asked to come back and be guest dragons for a two part episode for the 20th anniversary. And five of us made it. So I got to be a dragon. My joke was, thanks for keeping my seat warm, Kevin. So I felt kind of nice to take Kevin's chair. I was like, which one was his? I want that chair. And then I actually had dinner with his publicist, Nancy, the night before. I was like, we should do something together. She's like, yeah, we should do a stitch. I should follow back up with her. But I, I think it's that kind of attitude. Your attitude is your altitude and to be able to take everybody's thoughts and just, you know, discern between them, navigate your path, listen to your instincts. You know what's true. We all do about ourselves and our past and we find our way. And, you know, I heard a long time ago that the key to a great movie is that you're a nobody. You're a somebody. You're a nobody. You're a somebody. So if you watched a movie and the person was always up, always winning, you'd turn off the movie. Well, that's us too. We're great stories. So you're a Nobody or somebody. You're a nobody. You're somebody that's always going on. Because if it. It didn't, wouldn't it be boring?

[C]

Yeah, absolutely.

[A]

So next time it's all going to the. Or be like, mama, nobody.

[B]

And then it's like. Cut to montage scene.

[C]

You getting new wardrobe?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You got to have.

[A]

How we doing today? Nobody. Somebody for.

[C]

For the Americans listening, Dragon's Den is kind of like Shark Tank.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

It's the Canadian.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

In the uk,

[A]

I invested two businesses. Oh, wow. Okay. The behind the scenes some are still working their due diligence, so we don't know that yet, but there were two that I liked a lot.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

So, yeah, I mean, I liked all of them. Some of them, though, because my dad went out of business twice, he went bankrupt twice, and we ended up on assisted living. I'm very sensitive to the seriousness of a person's. Ability. If it's going to harm their family, I would want them to pause because of my experience. So I'm a little different than the other businesses they all came from means, did very well with their own sweat and work. But unless you've lived on assisted living and watched your family's business go under twice, you're extra sensitive about the people's stories. Right. And that, are they going to be okay and are they ready? And if they're not, in fact, every person that I said, look, I believe in you, you. You're not there yet. I had a call with them, I met them personally after to say, I mean it, like, let's get you to the next step before you're ready for investment. I know that sounds like disappointing. If a person really wanted the money but don't want you going into business, especially if it's your life and my money, I want you doing well.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So I come with a little bit of a different look at it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

You protect people.

[A]

Yes. Yes.

[C]

I appreciate that.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

You, Barb. When we first started our podcast, which was in 2017, nine years ago, everyone, congrats. Thank you. We were tripping out because as beauty journalists for many years, we had interviewed tons of people in beauty. Not one person had ever quoted Marcus Aurelius. And then I swear to God, the first three guests that we had or five guests all talked about Marcus Aurelius, you being one.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

The philosopher queen herself. So tell us, what is something that you apply daily from the Marcus Aurelius stoicism philosophy in your daily life that you feel like keeps you grounded, keeps you motivated.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That you pass on to other people.

[A]

Yeah. Something I've told my children since they were little. Marcus Aurelius said, when you wake up, be prepared to meet the angry, the lost, the jealous, the jaded. Now lead. If you don't like it, you don't want to be a leader, you can go in the fetal position of the court order. But when you wake up, be prepared to meet the angry, the lost, the jealous, the jaded. Now lead. Don't whine about it. Don't moan about it. Lead. And I think that has changed my children's lives, my life, and Aurelius. You know, no wonder so many of your esteemed guests love Aurelius. Because it's. This was the original psychology, the philosophers, Right? That's right. So you could use that stoic wisdom to navigate being a nobody and a somebody, and a nobody is somebody. And it helps you try to get back up.

[C]

I have to tell you that I gave my mother a copy of your book.

[A]

Oh, thank you.

[C]

Yes. And she. For so long, every time I went over, she's like, carlene, you have got to read this book. I'm like, I know, Mom. I gave it to you. She's like, no, Carlene, let me read this to you. Let me read this to you. She would read a passage, and I'm like, mom, I know Barb very well. I love Bar.

[B]

That's really sweet, though.

[C]

It was very sweet.

[A]

Did you tell her, though, that, I mean, we have history. Carlene, before I was even in a store, you wrote about me in Flare magazine. And I remember my friends were like, how did you get in Flare magazine? I was like, this woman, Carlene Higgins, believed in me. And for people like you, Carlene, that believe in people, early on, you don't even. I don't hope you know how huge that is, that faith you gave me and being interested in my story and sharing it with others like you do now. Yeah. You give so many people a leg up. It is well. And you're still doing it.

[C]

Your story. I loved your story, and I love to uncover the stories, the gold that's underneath, and I love to be the first. I'm obsessed with that so often. I. I do uncover great brands like yours, and it's such a pleasure to know you and to have you back on the show and be inspired by you. And I carry your beliefs and virtues, hopefully into my brand as well. I will continue to do that.

[B]

Well, Barb, you're the best. Thank you so much. And it was so great to catch up with you and I'm so proud of all of your success. It's wonderful to watch your kicking ass and you're making. You're like blazing a trail for all of Canadian brands.

[A]

Thank you for giving us a chance right from the start. Well, I think our adventures have only just begun, obviously. Businesses to do together.

[C]

Absolutely.

[A]

Let's walk out.

[B]

Let's do it.

[C]

Do businesses and roll the world.

[B]

Thank you. Thank you, Barb.

[C]

Thanks for listening. You can find details on every product mentioned in today's episode, along with our exclusive promo codes on our blog at Breaking Beauty Podcast.

[B]

While you're there, be sure to sign up for our newsletter. Every episode will be delivered directly to your inbox so you won't miss a

[C]

single thing and get social with us. Let us know what you think of the episode. You can follow us on Instagram at Breaking Beauty Podcast.

[B]

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[C]

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[B]

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[C]

See you next Wednesday.

[A]

Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products

[C]

or services referred to in this episode.

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