2023 Tony Predictions (Part 4): FINAL Predictions (w/ The Theatre Lovers)!

Summary

Broadway Breakdown – 2023 Tony Predictions (Part 4): FINAL Predictions (w/ The Theatre Lovers) Host: Matt Koplik
Guests: Will & Rachel Anderson (aka The Theatre Lovers)
Date: April 28, 2023

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Overview

In this finale to the Tony Awards predictions series, host Matt Koplik and returning guests, Will and Rachel Anderson (The Theatre Lovers), dive deep into their final picks and personal favorites for Broadway's 2023 Tony Award nominations. With characteristic irreverence, camp, and passionate geekery, they debate who will get nominated, who should be recognized, and the wild cards they're rooting for. The episode is heavy on opinion, Broadway lore, and playful banter—perfect for hardcore theater fans tracking the season’s competitive races.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Season Recap & Contextual Notes

[02:02] – The trio share what they've seen since the last episode, including A Doll’s House, Broadway Barbara (“A joke, a punchline every 15 seconds… expertly done." – Will, [02:45]), Shucked, New York, New York, Thanksgiving Play, Good Night, Oscar, Prima Facie, and Life of Pi.
[05:51] – Matt summarizes the Tony nomination landscape after a busy month of Drama Desk, Outer Critics Circle, and Drama League announcements, reminding listeners that these nominations don’t always predict Tony outcomes (“…they can help with momentum, but totally different nominating bodies… sometimes shows do really well at Outer Critics Circle and then shit the bed at the Tonys. Young Frankenstein, Anastasia, American Psycho.”).

2. Category-by-Category Predictions

Orchestrations

[08:23-12:15]

• Agreement on front-runners: Some Like It Hot, Kimberly Akimbo, New York, New York, Shucked, and & Juliet.
• Notable Advocacy: Jonathan Tunick for Sweeney Todd—for the overdue recognition ("He should have won in 1979. He did win in 1997. Yeah, yeah. It's all interconnected…” – Matt, [09:48]).
• Fun Fact: Original Sweeney orchestrations were never eligible for a Tony.

Score

[12:25-16:29]

• Consensus: Kimberly Akimbo, Some Like It Hot, Shucked, likely New York, New York (if eligible), or Life of Pi/KPOP as the longshot.
• Matt pushes back on the idea “Kimberly has no bops” (“First of all, it has bops. But then everybody’s like, I don’t know, I feel like the score is unnecessary…” – Matt, [13:02]).
• Runners-up: Play scores (e.g., Prima Facie, Leopoldstadt) may sneak in, as could Bad Cinderella.

Book of a Musical

[16:29-19:33]

• Top picks: Kimberly Akimbo (David Lindsay–Abaire), Some Like It Hot, Shucked, & Juliet.
• Wildcard: Almost Famous, New York, New York (dubious prospects: “The one thing everyone’s in agreement on is that the book is bad, bad, bad…” – Matt, [18:54]).
• Off-Broadway Shoulda-Been: Titanique is praised for its writing.

Choreography

[21:55-28:20]

• Clear favorites: New York, New York (Stroman), Some Like It Hot (Casey Nicholaw), & Juliet (Jennifer Weber), KPOP, with Beautiful Noise and Sweeney Todd as possible nominations due to choreographer popularity.
• Lively banter about the merits and excesses of modern Broadway choreography ("Since Mormon, I feel like [Casey Nicholaw’s] shows have gotten more dancey, but less specific…” – Matt, [24:42]).
• Life of Pi floated as a movement-based dark horse.

Costume Design (Musical & Play)

[28:27-34:29]

• Musicals: Some Like It Hot, Camelot, Sweeney Todd, New York, New York, & Juliet (w/ Bad Cinderella as potential spoiler).
• Plays: Piano Lesson, Leopoldstadt, Peter Pan Goes Wrong, Christmas Carol, Ain’t No Mo’. Special mention to Fat Ham for integrating drag and contemporary costumes.

Lighting Design (Musical & Play)

[37:43-47:17]

• Musicals: New York, New York, Sweeney Todd, Shucked, & Juliet, with a nod to KPOP for its concert vibe.
• Plays: Life of Pi, Fat Ham, Christmas Carol, Piano Lesson, noting an affinity for shows with “ghostly” lighting (Ohio State Murders, Doll’s House, and Leopoldstadt also discussed).

Featured Acting Categories

• Featured Actress in a Musical ([49:59-53:00]): Locks for Bonnie Milligan (Kimberly Akimbo), Ali Mozzie (Kimberly Akimbo), Betsy Wolfe (& Juliet), Ruthie Ann Miles (Sweeney Todd), and range of others with Robin Herter flagged as a long-shot.
• Featured Actor in a Musical ([53:21-58:41]): Alex Newell (Shucked), Jordan Donica (Camelot), Justin Cooley and Steven Boyer (Kimberly Akimbo), Alex Joseph Grayson (Parade), with Gaten Matarazzo (Sweeney Todd) and Kevin Del Aguila (Some Like It Hot) close contenders.
• Featured Actress in a Play ([71:14-74:07]): Crystal Lucas Perry (Ain't No Mo’), Sharon D. Clark (Death of a Salesman), Faye Castellow (Leopoldstadt), Darcy Carden (Thanksgiving Play), plus wildcards including Nikki Crawford (Fat Ham) and Nancy Zamit (Peter Pan Goes Wrong).
• Featured Actor in a Play ([74:07-77:23]): Brandon Uranowitz (Leopoldstadt), Dave Krumholtz (Leopoldstadt), Chris Sullivan (Thanksgiving Play), Billy Eugene Jones (Fat Ham), Arian Moayed (A Doll’s House).

Leading Acting Categories

• Actress in a Musical ([58:47-64:11]):

  • Locks: Victoria Clark (Kimberly Akimbo), Annaleigh Ashford (Sweeney Todd), Micaela Diamond (Parade), Phillipa Soo (Camelot), Sara Bareilles (Into the Woods).
  • Lorna Courtney (& Juliet) considered but not favored.

• Actor in a Musical ([77:23-79:23]):

  • Predicted: J. Harrison Ghee (Some Like It Hot), Ben Platt (Parade), Josh Groban (Sweeney Todd), Christian Borle (Some Like It Hot) or Colton Ryan (New York, New York), Andrew Burnap (Camelot).
  • No clear favorite: “There’s no lock in this category.” – Matt, [79:13].

• Actress in a Play ([65:11-65:54]):

  • Jodie Comer (Prima Facie), Jessica Chastain (A Doll’s House), Audra McDonald (Ohio State Murders), Laura Linney (Summer 1976).

• Actor in a Play ([66:03-70:44]):

  • Sean Hayes (Good Night, Oscar), Marcel Spears (Fat Ham), Wendell Pierce (Death of a Salesman), Hiran Abeysekera (Life of Pi), Corey Hawkins (Topdog/Underdog), Oscar Isaac (Sign in Sidney Brustein’s Window) all serious contenders—truly “stacked.”

Direction & Design

• Director of a Musical ([79:24-82:48]):
  • Michael Arden (Parade), Jessica Stone (Kimberly Akimbo), Casey Nicholaw (Some Like It Hot), Thomas Kail (Sweeney Todd), with toss-ups among Brian Jack O’Brien (Shucked), Susan Stroman (New York, New York), and Lear deBessonet (Into the Woods).
• Director of a Play ([82:49-83:29]):
  • Sam Gold (Leopoldstadt), Saheem Ali (Fat Ham), Justin Martin (Prima Facie), Jamie Lloyd (Doll’s House), with Topdog/Underdog and Life of Pi as alternates.

Scenic & Sound Design

• Scenic Design Musical: New York, New York, Sweeney Todd, Some Like It Hot, Camelot, Shucked, potential surprise from & Juliet ([88:04]).
• Scenic Design Play: Leopoldstadt, Life of Pi, Christmas Carol, Peter Pan Goes Wrong, Piano Lesson ([87:14-87:48]).
• Sound Design Musical: Kimberly Akimbo, New York, New York, & Juliet, Shucked, Parade, possible Some Like It Hot ([85:59-86:41]).
• Sound Design Play: A Doll’s House, Prima Facie, Christmas Carol, Peter Pan Goes Wrong, Fat Ham ([85:32]).

Best Musical & Best Play

• Best Musical ([94:28-95:25]): Kimberly Akimbo, Shucked, & Juliet, Some Like It Hot, New York, New York (despite “Beautiful Noise” prediction rumors).
• Best Play ([93:25-94:28]): Fat Ham, Leopoldstadt, Prima Facie, Cost of Living, Between Riverside and Crazy—runners-up could include Life of Pi and Good Night, Oscar.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Matt:
  “How is one to vote if you can’t totally hear [Sweeney Todd’s orchestrations]? But that’s where we’re going to get to sound design in a second.” [11:54]

• Rachel:
  “If you can get there next weekend, just go. Such a good time… a joke, a punchline, every 15 seconds, but it didn’t feel like too much. It was really, really expertly done.” – re: “Broadway Barbara” [02:34, 02:45]

• Will:
  “She’s sort of like if Elaine Stritch and Roger from American Dad had a baby. That’s Broadway Barbara… Jerry Herman meets Jerry Blank.” [03:14, 03:27]

• Matt (re: New York, New York’s book):
  “…it's too much. Too little, too unfocused, too everywhere all at once, and yet nothing at the same time… I’m not trying to trash the writing… but so much of New York, New York is just, like, fully expressing it is not a good libretto.” [18:57]

• On Fandom:
  “You come on this podcast every time as full blown allies and I am here for it... this is supposed to be my house, my podcast, and yet my guests come in and call me trash, and I let them stay. And that, Rachel, is feminism.” – Matt [07:41, 08:03]

• Meta-Tony Mythbusting:
  “…people say ‘oh, what’s best to tour that will win’…that’s a total myth that started with Avenue Q. That’s not really true.” – Matt [06:18]

• On Choreography:
  “I feel like [Casey Nicholaw’s] shows have gotten more dancey, but less specific and less structured. So it’s just a lot of dance all the time. And it frustrates me...” – Matt [24:42]

• Wild Card Wish:
  “If I could, I would put in Marla Mindelle for Titanique. That icon is delivering. She is serving. She is a finalist on every cylinder.” – Matt [59:42]

• On ‘Into the Woods’ Hype:
  “...I feel like personally, Juliet is the least interesting role in that show, which is not what you want for a show that has a title character that you've made... the least interesting.” – Matt [59:58]

• Banter About the Tony Process:
  “This is all just my universe, this is my Barbie world, and Barbie says that I’m going to include for my fifth nominee for best book, Titanique. Because that show—” [17:16]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Introduction and Season Recap: [00:00]–[05:51]
• Award Category Deep Dives Start: [08:21]
• Orchestrations Predictions: [08:21]–[12:15]
• Score: [12:25]–[16:29]
• Book: [16:29]–[19:33]
• Choreography: [21:55]–[28:20]
• Costume Design: [28:27]–[34:29]
• Lighting Design: [37:43]–[47:17]
• Featured Acting Categories: [49:59]–[58:41]
• Lead Acting Categories: [58:47]–[64:11]
• Director Categories: [79:24]–[83:29]
• Scenic & Sound Design: [85:32]–[88:46]
• Best Play, Musical, Revivals: [89:22]–[95:57]
• Listener Questions/Outro: [97:38]–[99:00]

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Tone, Takeaways, and Overall Vibe

Matt, Will, and Rachel’s conversation is passionate, unfiltered, and suffused with deep knowledge, inside jokes, and fierce affection for theater—peppered with playful shade and signature “foul-mouthed” asides. Their Tony predictions smartly distinguish between “what will” and “what should” happen, offering both fan fantasy and cold-eyed analysis. The episode is aimed at theater insiders and deep-dish fans, brimming with references, meta-predictions, and callbacks to previous seasons. For listeners tracking the Tony race, it’s a rich, rapid-fire, and highly opinionated summary of where things stand—and what could surprise us on Tony nomination day.

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Notable: See episode [09:48], [13:02], [18:54], [24:42], [59:42] for key quotes and memorable rants.

Transcript

[A]

Think of the prestige. No. Think of the respect. No, no, no. Think of the Tony. Hello, all you theater lovers both out and proud and on the DL. Welcome back to Broadway Breakdown, a podcast discussing the history and legacy of American theater's most exclusive address, Broadway. Fun fact. That's the first time I've done this introduction without reading the text. I officially have it memorized. It took me two years, but I did it. We are doing off book. She off book. Honey, call me Donna Murphy In Act 2 of Dear World, because I am off book. We. We allow it. We allow it. It's encores. And she had coveted. I'm sorry, you two are the maestro and maestro of niche. And so this is the world in which we live.

[B]

Yeah, we are. We are the encores audience. And we're like, I bet more people would like to see stuff about Cabin in the Sky.

[A]

Yeah, when are we doing Pickwick? But as you can hear, my guests today are returning from the first prediction episode to our final prediction slash. We're just picking some of our own damn nominees. Episode Will and Rachel Anderson, AKA the theater Lovers. Welcome back, guys.

[C]

Oh, thank you for having us. It's a. It's an honor. We're bookending.

[A]

Yeah. You guys are bookending. I. I was going to make another reference, but I can't think of anything right now. I've only had one coffee. I was gonna be like, oh, call me Mark Jacoby and Beautiful Noise because we're with his therapy sessions because you two are bookending this series. But that's not a. That's. That's not a good one. No, it's just clunky enough Alert Neil Diamond. Like the finale of New York, New York. It's a bit of a reach.

[C]

So we will get to it.

[A]

We'll get to it. We listen. She just posted her review last night after having just seen it two weeks prior. We've seen a lot of stuff since the last time we recorded. I know. I've seen a lot more. Uh, what. What have you guys seen since we recorded the end of March. April. What did we see in April?

[C]

Um, I saw A Doll's House, but Will. Will was working that evening.

[B]

Um, saw Broadway Barbara, which isn't eligible for anything, but oh my goodness, what a fantastic one person show.

[A]

Yeah, I love that.

[C]

She should be taught me of our hearts. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. The funniest. It was just like I was texting everybody I knew. Like, if you can get there next weekend, just go. Such a good time.

[B]

A joke, a punchline. Every 15 seconds. But it didn't feel like it was too much. It was really, really expertly done.

[A]

She has a joke in one of her videos about her car. It's like people ask me all the time, Barbara, how do you ever get stage fright? And by the way, is that your car that's in. That's going downhill in reverse? To which I say how I park my car is my damn business. And I. For some reason.

[C]

That's right, Barbara.

[A]

Yeah, she's sort of like, yeah, she's like, if Elaine Stritch and Roger from American dad had a baby, that's Broadway, Barbara. And that is very niche for me. And so I am here for her. Yeah.

[C]

How did you describe her? It was Jerry.

[B]

Oh, Jerry Herman meets Jerry Blank.

[A]

Oh, that's great. I love that there's a lot of.

[B]

Strangers with candy in that.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Very Amy Sedaris. And we are here for all of it. I. So since we last recorded, I have seen Shucked, New York, New York, the Thanksgiving play. I think I already saw Parade. I think when we spoke. And I think I already saw Sweeney when we spoke. Maybe.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. I. I'm seeing Camelot in four days. I'm seeing sign and Sidney Brustein's window today. Last time we recorded, they hadn't even announced that sign in Sydney Brustein's window was coming in. So that was like the last.

[C]

Right.

[A]

Yeah, that was the last shakeup of the year. Yep. What else?

[C]

Wait, are you seeing Camelot on Tuesday, May 2nd? The 2nd?

[A]

Yes, I am.

[C]

We're seeing Camelot on Tuesday, May 2nd. Yay. Oh, I'm so glad you said that.

[A]

You're gonna meet my dad and my grandma. It'll be wonderful.

[C]

Oh, wait.

[A]

Okay, wait.

[C]

Yeah, I'm very.

[A]

That shows at 7. It's gonna get out 9:45. I'm putting you guys on the spot right now as we record this, but if you.

[C]

Whatever you want to do, we're doing it.

[A]

If you are feeling still a bit more energy, I will put my damn 99 year old grandma and dad in a cab and we will get a drink and discuss Camelot and the Tony nominees that day. Great. I've already signed.

[C]

Oh, my God. Wait. That's so perfect. Wow. I wish we could take this whole audience with us.

[A]

Maybe we will.

[C]

Maybe.

[A]

Maybe we'll go live on Instagram for it and discuss it like in a booth somewhere and. And I'm not.

[C]

That's actually a really cute idea. Yep. It's a date.

[A]

It's a date. I'm not mad about it. Okay? You guys heard it here first. This is coming out literally Friday, April 28th. So get, get ready, guys. Get looped and gooped. Oh, I also saw A Doll's House.

[C]

Talk about Camelot in extension.

[A]

Camel toe in extension. I'm. I just hope that Andrew Burnap is in. He is pretty much my sole reason for seeing that production. I call him Daddy to myself every day. But that said, yeah, I saw Doll's House. I just saw Goodnight Oscar last night. I saw Thanksgiving Play. I feel like I saw one other thing. Shucked fat him. I saw Fatim the day we recorded. I saw. Yeah, I. I feel like I saw some other stuff. Prima Face, Prima Facie, Life of PI. And I guess that's it.

[C]

That's. I mean, that's a lot.

[A]

It is a lot. She's a lot. That's to say, because Tony nominations come out in a few days. Today, the drama desk nominations come out yesterday with the outer critics circle and a few days before that the Drama League. I think it's great that we take this moment to do some sort of last ride or die predictions as well as just throwing out who we would nominate if we had, you know, total leverage in this situation. You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah, yeah. Putting it on the record.

[A]

Exactly. Now, the thing that I want listeners to know because people love to sort of talk about this, there are a lot of myths with Broadway when things happen. So like, you know, people say, oh, what's best to tour that will win whatever. That's total myth that started with Avenue Q. That's not really true. People will look at nominations for the Drama league and the outer critic circle and the drama desk and they'll go, oh, well, clearly such and such is the front runner. This is also a myth. Totally different nominating bodies. There's some overlap with voting, but the nominating committees are all very different. What they can do is they can sort of help with momentum. And then also some things just are ineligible due to transfers. Like Kimberly Akimbo is ineligible for all the awards this year. Some off Broadway stuff gets mixed in there as well. So things get shuffled around and just, you know, sometimes shows will do really well at outer Critics Circle and then shit the bed at the Tonys. Young Frankenstein, Anastasia, American Psycho. You know, these things do happen. And I say this looking at Rachel in her full on French Phantom T shirt and then Will in his legs diamond T shirt. Y' all come on this podcast every time as full blown allies and I am here for it.

[C]

Well, you know what? It's like. We love an excuse to get dressed up.

[B]

And this is formal wear.

[A]

I am in the. The wrinkliest of.

[C]

You're in your Shucked best.

[A]

Okay, great. Yes. I'm on theme in that way. I was going to say, like, I'm supposed to be the gay one here, and I look like I got cut from the first line of auditions of shucked. So I. This is supposed to be my house, my podcast, and yet my guests come in, piss all over the floor, and call me trash, and I let them stay. And that, Rachel, is feminism.

[C]

It's feminism.

[A]

Yeah. Wait, Speaking of feminism. Speaking of feminism. Saw a whole bunch of feminism works this year, and we will get into all of them. Okay, so, Will, pick a category. Let's get into her. Which one do you want to do first?

[C]

Pick a card. Any card.

[B]

Yeah, let's do My nerdy brain wants to go orchestrations. Yeah, I think that's a fun way to talk about the types of scores that are out there and kind of the shape of the season musically.

[A]

Totally, totally, totally. So let's do down the Line. Just, like, knock it out the five that we think are gonna get it, and then, like, if there's any alterations to who we would like to see get in there. We'll do that after. So will down the line go.

[B]

I think it's Charlie Rosen and Brian Carter for Some Like It Hot. Kimberly Akimbo's John Clancy, New York New York's Daryl Waters and Sam Davis. And the one that I want to win because of a technicality, Sweeney Todd's Jonathan Tunick. Because Sweeney Todd In 1979, the best orchestration, Tony, didn't exist. It didn't exist until 1997, and that's when Jonathan Tunick won for Titanic, which incredible orchestrations. It kind of also feels like a lifetime Tony, where it's like, sorry that this didn't exist. You'd have 10 Tonys by now. So I want Sweeney Todd to be an upset and be like, the greatest orchestrations of all time. Finally get there. Tony.

[A]

I also have that dyslexia bookend. He should have won in 1979. He did win in 1997. Yeah, yeah. It's all interconnected. It's very Charlie and it's always sunny in Philadelphia Conspiracy theory wall. It's the Claire Danes Homeland wall. It's all. It's all connected. Yeah, I'm down for that. Rachel, you're five.

[C]

Oh, we did this together.

[A]

Group effort.

[C]

There's very few things. I mean, I guess like when you've been together for as long as we have, there's very few things that we don't come to like some sort of agreement on, but I'll point them out when they come up.

[A]

Yeah, sounds good. Yeah. Interesting. When they do. Yeah, I have some like at Hot Kimberly, New York, New York for sure. I. And then in terms of reality, because I don't. Because obviously Tuna can't get in there. I have shucked and end Juliet I. They have yet to determine the eligibility of the Parade orchestrations because JRB is listed as a co orchestrator, which he wasn't the first time because I believe he's taking the original charts and he brought them down by like four musicians. So I don't know if that can technically. Yeah, I don't know if that can technically count as new orchestrations, but if it do, I like it to get in there and I would like it to win. Uh, but if not, if not, great orchestrations. Oh yeah. First of all, the 90s there, there's like a five year window in the 90s where it was just like banger orchestrations back to back. You know, you go from Titanic into Scishow into Ragtime into Parade and it's just, you know, me sideways. And Parade didn't win Orchestrations the first time. It lost to Fosse of all things.

[C]

That's right, yeah. Surprisingly so this year it loses to Danson. Right. That's the. Honestly, the obvious trajectory.

[B]

I mean if we're going like dancing.

[A]

If we're going like for wild predictions out here, it could like, that's one of those categories where it could sneak in. Like Danson could either get four nominations or totally zero in the same way that like that Cinderella could get three or zero. It's, you know, there's.

[C]

Yeah, we talked about that for a long time last night.

[A]

Yeah, I, I feel you though. The only reason why I wouldn't give Sweeney the honorary orchestrations is because depending on where you sit in 85% of that theater, you can't hear the orchestration. Super great. So how is one to vote for it if you can't totally hear it? But that's where we're going to get to sound design in a second.

[C]

That's a sound design. Yeah, that's a sound design error.

[A]

Yeah, no, totally Sound design error. I will say if there's one thing about New York, New York that I appreciated, it's that the orchestra sounded great. Rachel, Rachel, pick a card. Any card.

[C]

We. Let's go. Well since we're talking music, why don't we go score?

[A]

Phenomenal. I'm gonna do my five.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

This is what I'm predicting. And then I'm gonna go with what I would like to see.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Kimberly at the Top followed by Some Like It Hot and Shucked. I have a listener who's convinced that Some Like It Hot is going to win score, even though they admitted that every song sounds the same. To which I said, that is why it may not win score. But people that were like, we're going, oh, well, Kimberly has no bops, which is first of all a full blown lie.

[C]

Sorry. I listen to Skater Planet every day of my GD life time for Skater Planet.

[A]

First of all, it has bops. But then everybody's like, I don't know, like, I feel like the score is unnecessary. Like, how do you listen to Victoria Clarke's Make a Wish and tell me that that song is not important to the show? I'm just saying.

[C]

And how would you know how to wash a check otherwise? You know what I mean? Hello.

[A]

Oh, that reminds me.

[B]

So much extra.

[A]

Yes, please. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[C]

What is this?

[A]

First of all, this reminds me, I do have to read two new reviews by when we get to the end. And also remind me in like 15 minutes we have to do an ad break and then another one 40 minutes after that. Yes. How are you to know how to wash a check? How else would we know about Father Time or what it is to be the good boy? But yes, Kimberly at the top followed by Someone Could Hot Then Shucked. Those are obviously three super super locks. If New York, New York is eligible, I do think it's gonna slip in there just for the John Kander and Lynn of it all. Even though I think that the new. Yeah, the new songs are just sort of there for me. They're not bad. They're just there. And then if New York, New York is not eligible, Life of PI. And then I'm gonna throw a huge whop of spaghetti at the wall and call out K Pop.

[C]

It's our exact list. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Beat for beat. Our exact lists. I was actually very excited when you were winding up. I was like, I really hope this is game up.

[A]

A perfect game. I pitched a perfect game. Yeah.

[C]

I mean, wow. We. Wow.

[A]

Let me also be honest. Like, if we're talking what I would put in, I probably would just limit it to 4 because like, k Pop, I've listened to the tracks since they've been like, released and it does, it does fully Blow. Fully blow. It doesn't. It doesn't fully blow. It sounds like K Pop, like actual K Pop. But I do remember in the theater just kind of going. But it does have some tight harmonies. Almost as tight as Kimberly Akimbo's harmonies, but not quite as tight.

[C]

Yeah, it's another where, like, I'll find myself hyper fixating on a song and then playing it on repeat for, like a day.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And then I.

[A]

Are you still gonna. Are you still gonna bring up Almost Famous?

[C]

No, drag him.

[A]

Drag her for fail.

[C]

And no, no, no. Hate for anybody who loves Almost.

[A]

Well, we have. We have a lot of plays this year that are actually eligible for original score like Life of Pie. I think Prima Facie is going to be eligible. Leopold, I think will be. Is eligible. So, like, all those could sneak in there and fill out the category because again, people could go, oh, well, you know, they might throw a bone to Bat Cinderella with Angela Webber. But also, like, they might make a statement and say, no, Andy, we got.

[C]

It in parentheses at the very bottom it says, I wouldn't count it out, but. And. And it's sort of similar to your New York, New York point. It's like for the Andrew Lloyd cover of it all.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Will it. Will it be in there? It's. We'll see.

[A]

Well, we should. We. We will see. I mean, there are. There have been just as bad scores as Batsinderella nominated for best score. So some I could. But for the sake of trigger warnings for myself and my listeners, I shan't. And I might have name dropped one or two in the last episode.

[C]

No, no.

[A]

Many times. It's fine. Let's go on to the next writing category, Best book. All right, theater lovers, give me your books.

[B]

I think we go David Lindsay Abayer, Kimberly Akimbo, for sure.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

But also Matthew Lopez, Andrew Ruffin, and Christian Borrell with Some Like It Hot. Robert Horn for Shucked and David West Reed for Angelia.

[A]

And there's four. We just have four. Yeah, you just have four. Okay. Yeah, that's. That's my four. Two. Unfortunately, there does have to be a fifth slot. Now, if I were totally in charge of the Tony Awards and there was. And I was allowed to do, you know, like, when the New York Times will do their. Who will win, who should win, who should have been nominated, and they'll, like, they'll include off Broadway stuff in this category. I'm like, you know what? Fuck it. This is my universe. This is my Barbie world. And Barbie says that I'm going to include for my fifth nominee for best book, Titanique. Because that show.

[C]

I knew you were going to say that. I don't know why you and I were on the same. I could have said it at the same time as you. And then I said, that would have been so rude.

[A]

Rachel, you and I are flying over sunset together, baby. Lying over sunset of a hottest kaleidoscope Robert seller.

[C]

I did leave Flying over Sunset, combining it with if I Were a Rich man. And I said, that's probably not good.

[A]

That's like, no, I'm. That's. That's. That's a Glee mashup if ever there was one. Robert Sala follows me on Instagram. And, like, every couple of months, I will post something about flying over sunset. And it's always just back to. I'll never forget where I was when I watched Carmen Cusack hold the severed leg of her dead mom on the Vivian Beaumont stage. And he'll always be like, yep, that happened. Like, and you were in it, baby. And you were grand.

[C]

Eight times a week.

[A]

Eight times a week. He was my second favorite performance after Carmen in that show. So we love it. But if we're talking realsies, because there does have to be a fifth one. Will and Rachel. Correct. This is where I do think actually Almost Famous could get in possibly a beautiful noise for its supportive therapy. But sure, I think. I mean, New York, New York, again, this could be, like, the paradise square of the season where, like, it gets trashed by critics and then goes on to get a bunch of nominations and then win, like, two. But I think if there's one category that I just can't imagine Tony Nominators nominating for its book because the one thing everyone's in agreement on is that the book is bad, bad, bad, bad.

[C]

Yeah, it's too much.

[A]

It's too much. Too little, too unfocused, too everywhere all at once, and yet nothing at the same time. And as someone who understands how difficult it is to write and to put something up, I'm not trying to trash the writing. So much of New York, New York is just, like, fully expressing it is not a good libretto. But there have been bad librettos nominated before. But I think Almost Famous, well, I wouldn't say it's a great script. At the very least, it follows the blueprint of the movie. And so it's a coherent script. And for that, I think it could get nominated.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I could see that.

[A]

Okay, well, then on that note. On that note, let's move on. Will Card Any card.

[B]

Jerry Springer just died.

[C]

Oh, no, not on the podcast.

[A]

Not on the podcast. Right in front of my salad. Will, he's. I've killed Rachel, everybody.

[B]

Of Jerry Springer the Opera.

[C]

Oh, God. For a real.

[A]

Now is the time to bring back Jerry Springer the Opera, which, by the way, is a really good score.

[B]

I listen to. I just want to dance somewhat regularly. It's. It's great.

[A]

That's a song that I am not embarrassed to say makes me cry and fully makes me cry. The. I'm tired of. I'm tired of wishing. I'm tired of crying. Something like that, right? I'm tired of wishing. I'm tired of crying. I'm tired. I haven't. Tired of living, and I'm tired of almost. I'm tired of almost dying. I think that's the lyrics. Yeah, but that. Like that section.

[C]

Showboat. That's Showboat.

[A]

It is. With a stripper pole. Rachel. And that is feminism.

[C]

And. Yes. Well, that's just good theater is what that is.

[A]

Oh, it sure is good theater. But it's. Yeah, it. I love that score. I think it's such a good score. I mean, it falls apart in Act 3, but the fir. The first two thirds are great. Sorry that he's dead.

[C]

Like, that's what you get for having an Act 3, you know, like, you're tempting. Fade at that point.

[A]

Truly Will category. We didn't get a card. You were too busy with Jerry.

[C]

Yeah, sorry. This is what. See, and this is why I don't get, like, Times notifications on my phone. Because this. That's.

[B]

I'm the Times notifications.

[A]

Yeah, you are the Times notification. I don't get the notifications. I just get the. The breaking news emails. So I have to, like, go into my email to find it. Yeah, but no. Oh, yeah. Died at 79. Couldn't even do 80 years old. Jerry. God. We'll.

[B]

We'll round up.

[A]

Yeah. What. What Privilege.

[B]

Change the Wikipedia.

[C]

That's how age works.

[A]

For sure. Yeah, that is absolutely how age works. All right, Will Card. Let's do.

[B]

Let's do choreography.

[A]

Okay. We've come to yet another category where Bad Cinderella could just sneak in there because you know, why the. Not.

[B]

I think Susan Stroman, New York, New York. I think she takes it. But we've also got Casey Nicholas on Like It Hot, Jennifer Weber for. And Juliet. You know, now that I'm looking at this, I might have written the wrong name twice because I also have Jennifer Weber for K Pop, and I don't know that she She.

[A]

I think she did do K Pop. Yeah, I think she did do K Pop. Wow.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

I have the unfortunate, bold choice of Stephen Hoggett twice in this category of. For Beautiful Noise and Sweeney Todd. Not that I thought the choreo Sweeney Todd was good, but again, I can see a world where this production gets a whole bunch of nominations, some of which I don't. I wouldn't put it in for. And he's well liked, and his choreography for Beautiful Noise is fine. I've K Pop. It's. I mean, it's similar for me, a Sweeney Todd. Like, it's that slot where it's like, well, we need something. And there was movement. I think Weber's choreography for and Juliet is much better and much crisper, honestly.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

Yeah. Bats Cinderella could get in there, but I. I hope not. I mean, this could. This could be Nick Lazier. He could finally get it.

[C]

Yeah. I feel like that there's, like, a part of him going in for the show that, like. I don't know, it's almost like stunt cast. I mean, I understand that it happened out of necessity, but it's like that sort of Broadway story of, like. And. And then he went into his own show and. And look at how good he did. And he. Razzmatan.

[A]

Put his hoofer shoes back on for one night. Yeah, no, it's definitely. It's definitely a publicity thing for sure. But, yeah, I don't know, the. The thing that's, like, where I think he'll get double nominated again because of that, but he won't actually win. The thing about Casey, and I've talked about this before, like, since Mormon, I feel like he's been trying to grab the brass ring of choreography like that Tony win just, like, just once. And so his shows post Mormon have gotten more dancey, but also less specific and less structured. So it's just like, a lot of dance all the time. And it frustrates me because back when he did Mormon and drowsy Chaperone, I found his choreography to be so smart and so structured. And so it's, like, kind of bothering me that it's become so, like, all the things all the time. 11, 11, 11, bud.

[C]

Super athletic.

[A]

Athletic, for sure. It's like he learned all the wrong lessons from Tuck Everlasting when he didn't get nominated for that. I'm like, no, Casey, not more choreography. Put it in places where it makes sense. Put it in places where it makes sense. Don't have your ensemble do a pas de deux to represent the passing of the salt shaker from one family member to the other. Like, that's not where dance comes in.

[B]

Talking role everlasting. It should have had more cartwheels, more somersaults, more trampolines. Trampolines.

[A]

More. Yeah, I think that would have.

[C]

No, he got it in Mean Girls.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[C]

He said trampolines.

[A]

Bet there was a trampoline in Mean Girls.

[C]

Yeah, in the. The house party, there were like trampolines in the couch.

[A]

That's right.

[C]

That's one of the things that's one of the moments that actually sticks out to me the most from Mean Girls, which is kind of wild. I just remember being like. I remember being like, are. Are these characters five years old? And I get that it's a house party they're letting loose, but it's just sort of like. It was kind of goofy. Silly, goofy fun.

[A]

I liked his work. In the first 20 minutes of mean Girls, it was post plastic's entrance that it kind of got. Not bad. Just like, I was like, oh, and now we're in the let's throw everything on the stage all the time stuff.

[B]

Crossing the threshold of the hero's journey.

[A]

Yeah, but she's closed now, so let's not kick a puppy while she's down.

[C]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[A]

She's on tour.

[C]

She's doing just fine.

[A]

Yeah. So we said New York, New York, Some Like It Hot and Juliet. I have beautiful noise in Sweeney Todd, you said K Pop. And there's one more. Who is. Who is your fifth?

[B]

I'm curious. I don't know if there's a fifth exactly, but I'm curious about how they're viewing Wayne Cilento setting the Fosse choreography in Dance in because it is. So much of it is recontextualized and restructured. And in a show that is entirely dance, as it so proudly tells us at the start, there will be only dance in. Also, I'm speaking that, not dancing it.

[A]

And then there's more speaking after that.

[B]

I. I do wonder how they're gonna categorize Wayne Cilento.

[A]

I think he's not eligible. Sure, they. I. I'm pretty sure he's not. Because the only thing they announced with dancing was that Colton Krause was gonna be considered for featured actor in a musical because Colton was the only non binary member of the company. But I don't know, maybe. Maybe they didn't say anything in their press release because, like. But of course Wayne Cilento's eligible. But I guess we'll Find out on Tuesday because if. If he is, then yes, I think he will get in again just because of the most. So much dance. And we need that fifth slot. But yeah, I don't know someone.

[C]

My. I have a wild card.

[A]

Ish.

[C]

Life of PI.

[A]

We had mentioned that in your last episode. I wonder if that's. If that's possible because the movement in that show is choreography. But it's like. Yeah, you. You ask. It's not the same kind of choreography that it was in Curious Incident or Harry Potter, but it is still movement. I mean, if it's eligible and. And, and whatnot, I would love to see it get in there. I did not love that show, but there were technical elements that I would like to give them their. Their due.

[C]

Yep. We feel very similarly.

[A]

Yes. And I don't know if I can thank the choreographer of Bad Cinderella for giving me the hunks shirtless and oiled up. I don't think that's a chore, but it happened during dancing. So.

[C]

Yeah, I guess we have to go back to. We have to get to costume.

[B]

Yeah, that's lack of costume design, actually.

[A]

But that's. But that's a decision. Will showing me almost peen is a costume design that I am here for. On that note, why don't we do costume design and then Rachel, you can pick the next category. Actually, we'll do costume design of a musical and play. We'll do a break and then Rachel will pick our next two cards. Costumes out of a musical. So much pressure. Costumes out of a musical. I've got some lickin hot. Camelot, Sweeney Todd, New York, New York. And then. And Juliet. Those are my five. With bad Cinderella possibly squeezing out Sweeney Todd or and Juliet just because there's a lot of color on that stage. But I don't know. I mean, I know I'm a Kimberly akimbo butt boy, but I would love to see it get nominated for costume design because I know it's, you know, 90s modern and the Tonys a hard time recognizing modern costume design, but that costume design is so damn accurate. Yeah, I just. I just would love to see it eligible.

[C]

But everything Stephen Boyer wore, I think they pulled out of my dad's closet.

[A]

Everything Kimberly wore. I was like, I've seen all of my sister's friends in middle school where exactly that.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

Candy necklace and all. All right, who are your five?

[C]

Yeah, same. Same list. We didn't have Sweeney on there.

[A]

We have that we put in. Is that where you put in that Cinderella? Okay.

[C]

Yeah. And sort of like you said, it's like, typically, I feel like they. They'll skew, period. I mean, even if it's like a fantastical period.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Like, costume, they'll. They'll do a hoop skirt over anything any day.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But, yeah, we haven't seen Sweeney yet. I just. From the images that I've seen of Sweeney, it all feels, like, too clean.

[A]

I don't know if it's.

[C]

It reads that way in person, but I'm just like, these people are poor, poor. These people are poor, poor, poor.

[A]

When we had Gunkle Adam Ellsbury on, he noted, like, everyone in the ensemble looks middle class. And so there's. There's just no diversity in the ensemble of Sweeney Todd. Like, first of all, it's the industrial age of London. Everything is dirty everywhere. Even if you're wealthy, like, there's. There's dirt around or you're covering up with a whole lot of makeup. So everyone is middle class. Everyone is squeaky clean. I don't. So, like, I would not personally nominate the costumes of Sweeney Todd, but again, it's always, you know, period, and there they are. And I know a lot of people have enjoyed this Sweeney, so whatever. But, like, that Sweeney Todd is where I would put in Kimberly Akimbo or even Parade, if I'm being honest, because I thought the costumes, Parade, while not, like, necessarily flashy, were very appropriate to the show.

[C]

Sure, yeah. Yeah, I agree with that.

[A]

And Some Like It Hot mostly has really beautiful costumes. Ironically, I think, like, the biggest flaw in the costumes is for Sugar. I don't think they costume Adriana super well, but they costume Jay incredibly well.

[C]

Yeah, it looks very sharp.

[A]

Yeah. I was like, can we. Can we be as curated with Adriana because Jay looks, like, ready for the Runway. Yeah.

[C]

Paul's drag race season 16 plus with.

[B]

Adriana, you have the. You're competing with the memory of Marilyn Monroe's costumes from the film, which are some of her most iconic visual moments.

[A]

1,000%.

[B]

It's a tough thing to compete with the idea of something, even if it's not a realistic, direct comparison. It's like people always say, like, SNL used to be better. It's like it used to be better when you were watching it the most. It's not that it was any. There's always good, there's always bad, but it can't compete. The thing you're seeing right now can't compete with the highlighted memories.

[A]

Oh, absolutely, absolutely. You're. You're. And also, like, your emotional connection to that memory makes it. Yes. Better than it actually was. Yeah. No, I think that's all super fair costume design of a play. Okay.

[C]

Yes. I have to find.

[A]

As you find. I have Piano Lesson, Leopoldstadt, Peter Pan Goes Wrong, A Christmas Carol and Ain't no Mo with a possible switch out of sinus any brustein's window. And if I were on the nominating committee and I could switch one out, I would probably switch out Piano Lesson 4 Fat Ham. Because again, we have the modern day costumes in the beginning which are super accurate. And then we've got our drag excellence at the end, which is that alone. I'm like, yes. Bring her to light.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Imagine if I was like. And then also pictures from home. Just.

[C]

Just a pair of khakis gets you.

[A]

Across the line for the Florida realness of it all.

[C]

Yeah. I mean, very green. Very green.

[A]

So green.

[C]

It's like the greenest set I've ever seen.

[A]

Or summer 1976. For all of those scarves. I. And.

[C]

And we haven't seen it yet. But. But if you had to. If you had guessed me or guess me. If you had made me guess. Wow, dyslexic is. If you had made me guess, I would have said scarves all the way.

[B]

I think scarf for life.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, when I tell you it's exactly what you think it is. It's exactly what you think it is. It's just. It's a chardonnay of a play. Two ladies. It's a chardonnay of a play. It is pinot Grigio in 90 minutes. It's just there. It's not like. Not bad. Yeah. It's Lenny and Hecht. They're lovely actresses. The play itself is like not the dullest. It's just sort of. It just sits there. It's similar to pictures from home. You're like, well, that happened. But this one's just so curated to Manhattan theater club audiences that it's like, oh my God, this was made in a lab. Anyway.

[B]

It feels from. I. I honestly know very little about the play, but it sounds very beach ready to me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's very. Your mom. You know who.

[B]

Yeah, the. You know who I saw in the store of plays.

[A]

You know. You know who I saw in the store of plays? That is so specific. All right, you're five. Go.

[B]

Oh, of. Of me or Rachel?

[C]

Both of us, my love.

[A]

Both of you.

[B]

Costume design of a play. I really like Emilio Sosa for Ain't no Mo. I think that there's a lot of. So with Fat Ham, Dominique Funhill, there's the contemporary costume, and then there's the fanciful, you know, surprise ending elements. I think that Ain't no Mo sustained that successfully through the entire play. Do it. Giving fantasy and reality and heightened the reality, and it grounded the fantasy totally.

[C]

And I think, too, just in, like, sheer number of. Of characters existing in different worlds. And I feel like it knocked it out of the park stylistically each time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, you. You were meeting new people constantly, and you had an immediate visual first impression of them that was different from the last five minutes.

[A]

Yeah. I would love to have Aino Mo's costumes in there, and I think it has a very good shot. Of all the design elements of Aino Mo, I think that is the one that it's most likely to get in for. But, yeah, I think the cost for all the notes I have on that show, and I do think it is more flawed than some of my millennial contemporaries are willing to admit. I think the costumes in that show were quite spot on and very inventive and creative. I mean, I think Leopolstadt is the front runner for, you know, covering 80 years of Vienna and probably Piano Lesson. Peter Pan goes wrong. It's just. It's very clever costumes. And also it's Peter Pan stuff. So, like, there's that period element to it. I mean, Christmas Carol, I think that's me kind of throwing spaghetti at the wall. I think it could get in. I think of all the design elements, that's the weakest one in terms of what they were most vulnerable at. Yeah, most vulnerable there. And Sin and C Bruin's window could get in just because it's the 60s. It's currently running. I have. I'm seeing it today, so I'll let you know. But I think a no Mo has a really good shot. And, you know, Fat Ham is a good shot, I would say.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. All right, I'm with you.

[B]

This old man in the pool for.

[C]

Costumes, he had that great bracelet. He had.

[B]

He had a great bracelet. He had a great shirt.

[A]

Well, he nailed it. Yeah, we'll take a good bracelet. All right. Is that your five? Have we done your five for that?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay, great. So on that note, let's take a break.

[C]

Really, I beg to differ with you.

[A]

How do you mean?

[C]

You're the top. Yeah. You're an arrow collar. You're the top. You're a Coolidge dollar. You're the nimble tread of the feet.

[A]

And we're back. All Right. Rachel, you got the next two cards? Pick them, Pick them. Good.

[C]

Okay, we're gonna go. Let's go. Lighting design of a musical.

[A]

Love it. Love to see it and play. Love. Both. Give me your lighting.

[C]

Ken Billington, New York, New York, for, like, Manhattan Hedge Alone.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Listen, if you're gonna make it, the. The pivotal moment where everybody decides everything's cool, I think you get a nomination.

[A]

Yeah, 1,000%.

[C]

It's solved. The sun solved everything. Natasha.

[A]

Tomorrow.

[C]

Yeah, it did come out tomorrow after all. Natasha Katz. Sweeney Todd. Jaffe Wiedman shucked. And that's kind of all we have written down.

[B]

I thought we talked about another one, but maybe I. I would assume.

[C]

Yeah, we. We did this pretty late last night, so I think we probably just went off on a tangent and we were like, yeah, we got it. So I don't know who did Some Like It Hot, but probably Some Like It Hot. And then we're missing. I wouldn't. I keep going back to K pop. I wouldn't be surprised if it was K pop. I wouldn't be surprised. Oh, and Juliet, probably. And Juliet. I don't know this. I. I picked a category for which I was ill equipped to talk about, and that's on me. Feminism. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What did I do? I was gonna say I unplugged myself.

[A]

Oh, no. You still sound great.

[C]

That's good.

[A]

Yeah. Can you hear?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So, yeah, we overlap with New York, New York, and Sweeney Todd, for sure. New York, New York. I mean, the design of the show is definitely the best thing about it. It is for everything about the show that doesn't work. The design is 90% great. There are a couple. I wrote in my review last night, like, there are a couple of set pieces that look borrowed from Roundabout, but for the most part, the set design is great. The lighting is consistently lovely, and, yeah, if you're gonna have manhattanhenge be the third act, you know, pivotal moment, you better do it justice. And it's like the one thing in the show where I'm like, yes, this is what it feels like to be in New York during this moment. Everything else, I'm like, I know you're trying to be Central park, but you're on the same James stage. Like, it's just what you. You can't actually be Central Park. I'm so sorry. I don't know.

[C]

I love. I love that moment where the shovels turn into the bridge. Spoiler alert. I don't know. That's just. That's for me. It hit for Me.

[A]

It would have hit for me if they hadn't done the same exact thing in Grand Central Station 10 minutes earlier. It would have hit it a little better for me, but.

[C]

Yeah, I hear you, but I. I don't know. I just. It. It did it for me.

[A]

Yeah. No, listen, it's just, like, myself.

[C]

Because of feminism.

[A]

Feminism. No, it's my. It's just my pet peeve. Like, it's the reason why, as lovely as. As the design was for An American in Paris, you know, you watch it and you're like, I. You're doing as well a job as you can. It's just. There's no way to truly be a love letter to a city in a theatrical show because you're not able to actually show the city. But that aside, yeah, New York, New York. Sweeney Todd for sure. The. The gobos in Sweeney Todd are the only thing about it that gives Thriller realness. I have Parade, which I think the lighting in Parade is really fantastic. They're not going to get a set design nomination, even though I think the set is actually quite effective. But the lighting is really great in that and really makes you feel like you're in the south, which is hard to do mostly. Like, only George C. Wolfe productions are able to make you actually feel like you're in the South. So this was the first time since the original Carolina change where I was like, oh, yes. No, this is where we're at. I also have and Juliet, and then I have Camelot and Kimberly Akimbo as a possible fifth slot. Whereas I don't think Kimberly's gonna get a lot of design nominations. I think that lighting is a good spot for it to get one. It's really well done. And Camelot, you know, we'll be seeing it on the second, but for a production that, you know, where everyone has kind of said the set is, you know, very simplistic and curated. It's like, it's a showcase for the lighting. I'm like, okay, well, then I'm sure the lighting is really neat. So, yeah, here's hoping you're. Here's hoping people talk about.

[B]

About it.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, K Pop. I could see the thing about it's. It's always just really hard for closed shows to get recognized. And when they do, it's sort of, you know, either it has to be super, super memorable and make an impression, or it has to sort of be like, I don't know, we need something to fill in this last slot, and you were pretty solid. Here you go. Which is like, why I feel like Almost Famous could sneak in there. Why K Pop could sneak in for score. But, yeah, I don't know if lighting I would put in K Pop. I also doesn't think the lighting was very good. Girl in K Pop. But that's me being me. So I'm sure. I'm sure someone, Rachel, will agree with you and say, no, no, no. That lighting was neat.

[C]

I just felt like I was at a concert. And maybe that's more scenic design than lighting. But I feel like concert lighting is so specific. But maybe I'm misremembering it because I had such a good time. You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Maybe my brain is filling in a blank that didn't exist.

[B]

I think there's something to be said in Circle in the Square that depending on where you sit, you see different parts of the lighting in different ways. We were pretty close to upstage, right? So, like, almost along that upstage wall that because the lights were coming from the back of the house forward onto the performers, we had a way better sense of, like, the arc through the room. And I think that's a big part. So you had that concert lighting. But also, it's like watching something from the wings and you see the. The hems.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You see the seams.

[C]

Yeah. But in a fun way.

[B]

But, yeah, it worked.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, if it. If it happens, I will not be super thrown and I will not, like, call foul. But I do think it's one of the longer shots. I think that is. I think that is.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the spaghetti kind of. It was my. My wild card, baby.

[A]

Yeah. And listen, we love a wild card. I. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Lightning design of a play. Give me your five kids.

[C]

Okay. Here, I'll let you read it. I got it. Jason.

[B]

Lighting design of a play. I think we go. I think Life of Pies. Tim Lutkin takes it. But also Bradley King and Fat Ham. Christmas Carol. Ben Stanton and Ken Elliott and Jaffe Wiedman. Again with the piano lesson. We were always Team Jaffe Weidman.

[C]

Yeah, We're Jaff heads.

[A]

Yeah. Okay, so Christmas Carol. It's. It's. Listen, listen. There's no judgment on this podcast. He said fully winking at the screen. Yeah.

[C]

When's Jaffe Wiedman gonna get his day in the sun? That's all.

[A]

Well, it'll happen one day. Maybe if he had designed manhattanhenge, it would have happened for him, but.

[C]

That's right. Yeah, that's right.

[A]

The thing about the Design for Piano Lesson for me is like, yeah, I found it impressive in the sense of, like, ooh. Like, this is a. Like, a very intricately designed show. But I also thought that kind of went against what makes that play work. But that's not the design team's fault. That was very clearly the director's point. Like, she, latonya, really wanted to make this Piano Lesson theatrical and ghostly. And I've always found with Piano Lesson, it works best when you can't tell what's real and what's imaginary. When they're talking about ghosts, you're like, is that like, I don't think there's a ghost. I think you're just very paranoid. But when the set comes, when the curtain comes up on that set for the first time, you're like, oh, that's a haunted house. And so there's no tension of, like, is the ghost real? Like, the first thing that happens is you see Danielle Brooks be like, I'm being haunted. But again, that's a director moment. I mean, it is, like, objectively, really intricate, cool lighting. I have Life of Pie for sure Christmas Carol. I actually have Doll's House and Prima Facie in there as well. I don't know how you felt about Doll's House, Rachel. I went in fully expecting to hate it, because I am. I am ready to cast Eva Van Hoffe onto a raft into the middle of the Atlantic Ocean and leave him out there to dry. So any directors. Any directors out there like him, like, Jamie Lloyd? I'm like, can you get the fuck off my stage? But I actually found this Doll's House super compelling. And part of it was that it was just 100 minutes of pure tension that I. And I thought that the intimacy of the sound design, which we'll get to, was really integral to that. And I thought the lighting was really interesting how they, like, would make it make certain scenes feel like you were almost trapped in a cage or, like, in a narrow hallway. And it was just very specific, and I really appreciated that. Will the nominators feel the same way? Probably not. But alas, I have Leopoldstadt in there for lighting as well, because the whole thing just looked like an oil painting. And that's really impressive. I have, like, Peter Pan goes Wrong as a possibility. The whole design of Peter Pan goes wrong. I'm like, I feel like it could just go down the line and get nominated for all four design categories or just two. But alas, a lack. What was the other one you guys had? You had fat ham.

[B]

We had yeah, now I'm looking at it. We had all Plays with Ghosts, all.

[A]

The plays with Ghosts.

[B]

Life of Pie, Fat Ham, Christmas Carol, Piano Lesson.

[C]

We love a ghost.

[A]

Yeah, well, you don't have Walking with Ghosts in there and that is a razor, so. No, that's. Those are all solid.

[C]

We missed that one.

[A]

You know, you and 7 billion other people. The. I, I think your list is super solid. I, I'm kind of throwing out some last minute ones in there. After having seen Prima Facie, like, I think that that production is so much more theatrical than I think people realize it is because the headline is Jody and she's incredible and we'll get to her in a second. But like, it is staged really well. It's designed really well. The play is actually a lot stronger than I thought it would be. It has its hiccups, but like most of the plays this season do. I feel like there's something else. I mean, Sign and Cindy Bruce Window is like that big sort of curveball of like. I don't know what the design of that show is really like. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

I didn't see it at bam.

[A]

No, no, I didn't see it at BAM tonight. Today will be my, my intro to it. I keep going back to Ohio State Murders on lighting as well because like.

[C]

Yeah, we talked about that. We talked about that. That was impressive.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, I did not enjoy myself at that show. But you know Audra, when do you not bend over for her? And the lighting was very effective. This, this set was not for me, but that is a different story. So you got, you had Life of PI Christmas Carol, Fat Ham, Piano Lesson, and then did you put in a fifth?

[C]

No, no.

[A]

You think the Tonys are going to say. The Tonys are going to flop. Garbage. Trash. We only do four for this one.

[C]

No, it's because we're, we're under educated on our plays really. And like, I guess for something like some of the technical categories, we're just like. We haven't seen it. So it's really hard to say who did it the best.

[A]

Say it with me. All Will and Rachel are uncultured fucks there.

[C]

That's right. We're frauds. Theater lovers. What?

[A]

I've never been to Tennessee Williams. I've never. I don't go to the southern states. That is what you two say. Who? Oh my God.

[B]

You go to Tennessee Williams in August Wilson.

[A]

Oh, my. Go to Tennessee Williams and August Wilson. It's a great time to see the Magnolias in bloom. All right, let's Go out of. Let's do an act. I reckon we haven't done an acting category yet, so I'm gonna pick no featured actress in a musical.

[C]

Oh, my.

[A]

I'm. I'm gonna go for broke here with my final five, please. Bonnie Milligan.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

Ali Mozzie. Because Kimberly Akimbo has really upped their promotion of her in this last month, which I think has been very strategic on their part, because Bonnie has been pretty much a lock since previews, and, like, they've put her on all social media. She's been on these podcasts. And now in the last, like, five weeks, they've really been promoting Ally and having, like, Vicki talk about her and Bonnie talk about her, and Ali just sang Father Time on Playbill. And so I think they're really trying to drive home that, like, yes, Bonnie is a crowd pleaser and she's great in the role of. But, like, Ally's doing some really incredible work in that show, both she and Steven, for roles that are really tricky, really fucking tricky that I think they both nail. So I do think Allie's gonna get in there. Betsy Wolf will get in, I'm pretty sure. And then the final two comes down to four women for me that I think it could happen with. I see it happening with either Natasha, Yvette Williams for Some Like It Hot, Ruthie Ann Miles for Sweeney Todd, Lilia Lester for Into the woods, and Melanie La Barrie for and Juliet. If I had my druthers, I would put in Julia and Melanie over Betsy and Ruthie, but I don't get my druthers. So I will say my final like, here it is, boys. Here it is, world. Betsy and Ruthie and Natasha are the other three. Someone DM'd me and said that they were pretty sure Robin Herder was going to get in for Beautiful Noise. And I said, well, have you seen A Beautiful Noise? And they said, no, but I love Robin Herder. And I said, yeah, so do I. That's why I saw A Beautiful Noise. And that's why I don't think she's going to get in, because it is a quote unquote beautiful waste of Robin Herder. That is my take. All right, married people, give me your five.

[C]

Bonnie Milligan, Betsy Wolf, Natasha Williams, Ruthie and Miles. Robin Herder. And we haven't seen a beautiful.

[A]

We got us reading for filth. I guess I'm a. I'm a soothsayer. It's amazing. Yeah.

[C]

You actually didn't even need us on the podcast today. You could have Just said your own opinions and been like. And Rachel and will have the worst version of this.

[A]

I mean, even when I have guests, I really am just doing this alone. As far as I'm concerned, I'm sim. It is like I am Audra in Ohio State Murders. There are other people on stage, but it's pretty much just me monologuing.

[C]

Yeah, they're just there to play the violin.

[A]

And like Audra.

[C]

Listen, listen, listen.

[A]

What?

[C]

Played it very well. She played it very well.

[A]

She did. There's been a lot of violin playing this season. 1776, New York, New York. Yeah, this. This season loves a violin. Maybe that'll be supporting actor in a musical.

[C]

1776.

[A]

Yeah, the violin.

[C]

Did you say 1776? I missed it.

[A]

No, well, 70. 70, 76, I mentioned is a violin player. I feel like there's one other song about it. Yeah, there. There sure is a whole song about it that this recent revival misunderstands did something with. Yeah, they made a choice. Listen, we respect choices, but not that one. All right, well, category, Category.

[B]

Let's go. Supporting actor in a musical.

[A]

Oh, Ker.

[B]

We've got Alex Newell, Jordan Donica, and Camelot, which we have not seen.

[C]

But I'm a. I'm a Jordan Donica fan girl, so.

[A]

Yeah, no. Break my arm, daddy. Yeah, along with.

[C]

Sorry, I went somewhere else for a second.

[B]

Went off to Camelot by way of Brigadoon.

[C]

See you in 100 years, Camel.

[A]

Top me, Cord and Danica. What? What? Too blue. Too blue. Humor. I say the things that no one's willing to say on air, and that is why I am the number one Broadway podcast in my head. All right.

[C]

Three figures, baby.

[A]

What is this world? Okay, you said Alex, Jordan. Who are Alex and Jordan?

[B]

Justin Cooley and Stephen Boyer, both from Kimberly Akimbo and Alex Joseph Grayson in Parade for. For Jim Conley.

[C]

Yeah, that's. That's what he said.

[A]

That is. That is sure what he said. So I have four of your five. I currently have Gaten in there for Sweeney because Alex does a wonderful job in Parade and could totally get in there. It's one of those things where it's like Sweeney and Parade. I talked about this in last week's episode. It's just a matter of how hard are the Tony nominators going to be for either revival? Because there's a world in which one of them, like, one of them is going to get a lot. It's just a matter of which one or maybe both. It's hard for me to imagine that Both Prade and Sweeney come in with, like, 11 nominations together. I feel like it can't really go that way, but who knows? The world is weird. But, yeah, I mean, I. To be honest, if I were picking someone from Parade for featured actor in a musical that I would nominate, it would be Daddy Paul Alexander Nolan, who has yet to be nominated for a Tony Award at all, which is a crime. It's a crime against my body, because that man has delivered some incredible performances. He has been the best thing in bad shows, and he has been an asset to good shows. And I'm like, what? He sang Jesus Christ Superstar effortlessly. He. He and Carmen Cusack were kept. Were the ones who kept bright star afloat. And he hung dong in Slave Play and has yet to be nominated. I'm like, what does the man have to do?

[C]

That's right.

[A]

Make out with me, please. That'll. If that can get him a Tony nomination, please do it.

[B]

There's only one way to find out.

[C]

Yeah, there's the only one way to find out.

[A]

There's only one way to find out. Paul Alexander Nolan. Make out with me and then sing into my mouth, and maybe that'll happen. I think we'll see. But, yes, he won't get nominated because it's just not. That's not the kind of role it is. But I think he is so incredible in that show. I also would love it if we could expand it a bit and include Kevin Cahoon in Shucked, who is given. He and Gray Henson are given some major groaners in that show, and they sell it like it's a diamond. And I want to applaud both of them. Won't happen, but I want to apply both of them.

[C]

That's a skill.

[B]

Tis a skill under appreciated skill.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That was like, some of our favorite stuff about disaster. When we saw it was like, we first off, we loved disaster.

[C]

That's the best.

[B]

But the. The moments that were. There's something very entertaining and very, very showbiz about selling a groaner.

[C]

Well, that's like your 90 of your personality.

[B]

True, true. I'm a groaner salesman.

[A]

Let's. Let's leave what you two do in the bedroom out of this, please. It's only. We can only talk about what I would theoretically do in the bedroom with Paula Alexander Nolan on this podcast. This is not a safe space for heteronormativity.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

This is a safe space for gay fantasia, Broadway breakdown, a gay fantasia on Paul Alexander Nolan themes. Not. Whatever. You two are so moving.

[C]

Yeah. The middle of this episode is the theater lovers are homophobic.

[A]

Wait, is that feminism?

[C]

It is, but white feminism.

[A]

White feminism in Danger. That is the sequel to White Girl in Danger, baby. Wait. Oh, you know what?

[C]

I don't have it.

[A]

I haven't. I would like to.

[C]

Yeah, I'm friends when you do.

[A]

Yeah, I'm friends with Natalie Walker and I want to go when she's on. She was on for a few days and I couldn't go. So I'd like to. I'm hoping she can goes back on again. That said, you know who I don't have in here and I forgot and I don't know, he probably would replace Stephen Boyer is Kevin Del Aguila for Some Like It Hot. I would like. I would very much like him to get nominated. He's my favorite performance in that show. But now, I mean, featured actor in musical now is just so stacked. It's like, do we get six nominees? Does it. Like, who gets left out? I don't know. I think. Yeah, I think Alex Gaten and Steven are all. And honestly, Jordan, probably, because again, I don't know how the nominators are going to go for Camelot, but yeah, I think. I mean, it's one of those things where it's like, Kevin could replace any of them or they could all just kick him out of bed. Who's to say? All right, Rachel. Card. Any card.

[C]

Let's go. Best actress in a musical.

[A]

Love it. All right.

[C]

The big one.

[A]

The big cajones I have. Yeah, no, you go.

[C]

It's your show.

[A]

Yes, I. I realized. I realized there's a bit of a delay again. So, like, I'll start talking and then you'll start talking. And I'm like, oh, no, I don't want them to think I'm interrupting them. Just there's a bit of delay.

[C]

You can interrupt me. That's fine. That's. That's me being a good feminist. So we have best actress in a musical. Victoria Clark is our pick. For sure. For sure. And then we have Annaleigh Ashford for Sweeney, Michella diamond for Parade. Philippa Sue Camelot, Sara Bareilles. Into the Woods.

[A]

That is exactly my five. And then again, if I were doing my whole, I would include off Broadway. If I could, I would put in Marla Mandel for Titanique. That that icon is delivering. She is serving. She is a finalist on every cylinder.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

But if we're talking realistic Broadway five. That is my five. There was a time when people were talking about Anna for New York. New York. Having seen it now I don't see it happening. She sings the title song and world goes around really well. But.

[C]

Yeah, agreed.

[A]

Yeah. I have other issues with her performance as well as Colton's, but also that stems from the book. So it's partly that they're. I feel like they're acting in two very different musicals, but also the book doesn't help them at all. So it's like, what are they to do? Yeah. I mean, Lorna Courtney could get in there over Philippa just because, you know, I don't know how people are going to go for and Juliet. But I've talked about this before. I feel like, personally, Juliet is the least interesting role in that show, which is not what you want for a show that has a title character that you've made the least interesting. But I don't know. She. She sings her, you know, nose off, so that could go. But I think. Yeah, I think that's the five. Any caveats for you, too?

[C]

We had debated whether or not Sarah Bareilles for the, you know, closed show of it all, but I think just to get her in the room.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, to be able to say, like, oh, and. And Sara Bareilles will be here.

[A]

Yeah. I think it's partly the star factor, but also I do think there will want to be some acknowledgments of into the woods in the. In this Tonys. And. Yeah, I. I mean, I have. I've had some listeners tell me that they think is the woods is actually going to get way more nominations than I think it is. Like, I see it getting two or three, whereas I think people who.

[C]

Who love a story about a fairy tale believe fairy tales. Is that what we're saying, Rachel?

[A]

Coming in with the hot poker, pegging my listeners for their beliefs. I love it.

[C]

Just, I'm making a lot of enemies today, and I don't know.

[A]

I. I am agreement with you. I just. I.

[C]

No, I mean, we listen, we loved it, but I don't. I think, realistically, this, like, sparsely staged reading of into the Woods, I mean, outside of performance categories, what are we really talking about here?

[A]

I mean, also, I mean, I put this on my. I put this on my close friends on Instagram because sometimes I'll have really, really salty opinions that I'm like, I don't want listeners to see this, but I'm willing to accept. Say this a little louder this time.

[C]

If you've gotten this far into this podcast, you get the steak.

[A]

You. You. You get it. You get. You get to be salty. Now, but when the Drama League G announced that Lear was getting, like, their Founder's Excellence Award for directing, I said, call me Michael Bluth, honey. Because her. It's just her.

[C]

Her funny or something.

[A]

Is she funny or something? You wouldn't know it from how she staged into the Woods. The. The thing is, like, her crowning achievement in the last year was into the woods, which I think was a good production for the most part, just because she left it the alone, which I don't. Which, sure, that's a directorial choice. I mean, Tommy Kail is kind of getting lauded for doing the same thing with Sweeney Todd, but. But, I mean, I think that the actors of into the woods are really what kind of made that production soar, not her. And we just seen so many other issues this year and beginning of last year that proved to us, like, she's not the most incredible director. If she were, she wouldn't have been fired from Hercules, and she wouldn't, you know, have had Encores. Have to, like, rein her in on her season this year, which is not me spilling tea that shouldn't be spilled. Everyone knows it. It's out there. It's.

[C]

I. I kept it, America.

[A]

I. I kept it very quiet in last week's episode because it wasn't public knowledge. But now that it's public knowledge, I'm like, okay, we can say it. You know, she got fired from Hercules, and Encores has her on a very tight leash now as artistic director. So it's just. That is not someone you give Founders Excellence Award. You know, that's something like, you give that to Michael Arden for Parade. You give that to Stroman for being a woman in this industry and still coming out on top. You know, like, that is. That is where you go, you did it, Joe. Not. Not this.

[B]

It wasn't that they gave her the Founders Award. It's that they reigned her in and were like, oh, Founder.

[A]

It's a good thing I'm not wearing shoes, Will, because I would throw it at my screen. And on that note, let's take one last break.

[C]

Really, I beg to differ with you.

[A]

How do you mean?

[C]

You're the top. Yeah. You're an arrow collar. You're the top. You're a Coolidge dollar. You're the nimble thread of the feet.

[A]

And we back. Okay, so, yeah, Someone also tried to tell me that they think Patina will get in there for actress. Sure, anything's possible. I just. I find it hard to believe that into the woods will get four acting nominations. I think Best case scenario, we've got two. We've got Sarah and maybe Gavin or maybe Julia. But I don't. I think it's really just Sarah. I think there are too many.

[C]

I think so, too.

[A]

There are too many performances that are eligible this year in shows that are still running that have a lot of passion behind them. It's really hard to get excited about a closed show where most of those actors aren't even on the national tour with it. You know, it's like, what do we do anyway? Yeah, right. Wait, who. Who did this one or Rachel did you pick?

[C]

I did. Best actress.

[A]

Okay. So on that note, let's do actress in a play because we can knock this one super easy. I have Jody. Jody Comer, who'll be winning. Jessica Chastain, who upset Audra, and then Laura Linney. I think it's going to be those four if we get five. I mean, honestly, we're knocking it out between Jessica Hecht and Rachel Brosnahan. Have not seen Rachel yet in Sign in Sydney Brustein's window. I hear she's quite good. Zoe Wanamaker is technically eligible for leading actress for pictures from home, which is a total what the fuck? From me. But also she's not going to get in because if you saw pictures from home, you would understand. But yeah, I think that's our four. I think it's Jody, Jessica, Audra, Laura.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And we've got Rachel Brosnahan.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I think our exact list pretty much in the same order.

[A]

Yeah. Yas Queen work. Will next one.

[B]

Go? Best actor in a musical.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Oh, no. Best actor to play.

[A]

We'll.

[B]

We'll stay in place.

[A]

Okay. This one's actually harder because it's so fucking packed. Sean Hayes I have in there and probably gonna win. It's not my pick. I would probably pick Corey Hawkins for top dog underdog to win, but I recognize sort of what Sean's performance in this season is, how it's being viewed. And he is. He's good. I just don't think he's as good as people were saying. That's beside the point. I have Sean Hayes, Marcel Spears, Wendell Pierce, and then my final two. It's tricky. I have the lead actor from Life of PI and Corey Hawkins, knowing that either could get kicked out or Wendell could get kicked out. Like, I think the only two locks we have here are Sean and Marcel because we have Oscar Isaac for sign and Sidney Brustein's window, which again, like, he's supposed to be very good in It. They'll want to recognize sign and Sidney Brustein's window, as you mentioned, Rachel. There's the star fuckery of it all. But then we also have Yaya getting them in the room. We have Yaya as well for Top Dog, Underdog, and we have Nathan Lane for Pictures from Home, which, like, while that play is a total. You know, that show happened. Nathan is very good in it and he has announced that he intends for this to be his last Broadway show. It won't. He will do another one. I know. But, like, it's the whole. Yeah, it's a very candor and ebb of like, last chance to vote for a Kander and EB score. And it's like there's always one down the line that comes out in like five years.

[B]

But yeah, show.

[C]

Wow. But we have him in. In supporting. Is.

[A]

He's the Lane for. Yeah, he's in lead. All three of them are in.

[C]

He's in lead. Yeah. Wow. That's a choice.

[A]

It is a choice. It's stupid, but it's a choice.

[C]

Yeah. Well, what are you gonna do?

[A]

What are you gonna do? Okay, so you guys have.

[B]

I wanted to be Marcel Spears for Fat Ham. I thought that he gave something. It was just so lovely and I. I just want it to. To do well.

[A]

Yes, I. Listen, I would not be mad at that. I loved Marcel as well. I mean, I just loved Fathom. I thought it was so good.

[C]

Yeah, we loved it too.

[B]

Life of PI here. I'm so sorry, I've only read the name and we. So it's a herein, obviously. Oh, goodness.

[A]

Is that. Yeah. Or Huron, obviously. Cara. Yeah. I'm sorry for butchering the name, but yes, him. He. I will say I. Having seen Life of Pie, I thought I found him very compelling in a play that I did not think was compelling, so.

[C]

And what a beast of a role.

[A]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[B]

It literally.

[C]

Well, it's absolutely not. Well, literally. It's like. Well, everyone around him. But that's, I guess, another story for another day.

[B]

David Krumholtz in Leopoldstadt.

[A]

Who.

[B]

In my note, I've just got Leopoldstadt guy.

[A]

I think he's in. I think he's put in featured. I think. I think everyone in Leopoldstadt is. Is a feature.

[C]

Well, we'll just swap him and Nathan Lane.

[A]

Okay, then.

[B]

Congrats, Nathan Lane.

[C]

This is. This is on us for not being like big play people this year. We just didn't have the time.

[A]

I wanted to see.

[B]

Just.

[A]

Just get cultured, you two. So you have Marcel, you have her on Nathan. And then who are your others?

[C]

Jess, Jefferson, Ma, Sean Hayes.

[A]

I'm not even including Stephen McKinley Henderson. Like, this is this. This category is either going to be like, last year, where randomly we get seven, or it's just a bloodbath. And, like, some truly iconic performances just don't make the cut. Yeah, it's like, I would love to put Jefferson Mason.

[C]

There's another one, like, for Top Dog, Underdog. We wrote both names. It was just like, I. I don't even. I don't even know.

[A]

Yeah, I was like, Corey's role is the role that has gotten recognized in the past, which is why I would put him, like, with a slight edge. But they both are great. And I do think Top Dog is going to get a couple more nominations than people realize. Like, if you go on Gold Derby, everyone's just convinced that Piano Lesson is going to win Revival. I'm like, I don't even think it's going to get nominated, but a lasso lack. Yeah, I don't know. So if I'm, like, going super hard and I'm just saying, okay, I'm going to commit to this. I'm going to commit to this. I'm going to say Sean Hayes, Marcel Spears, Corey Hawkins, Oscar Isaac, and Huron from Life of PI. And then if like a six happens, I would say Stephen McKinley Henderson. But I mean, truly, who the fuck knows? It's going to be a wild west out here, y'.

[C]

All. Yeah, it's. It's so stacked.

[A]

It is.

[C]

Would we say this is the most stacked of all the. I think it's probably the most stacked of all the acting categories.

[A]

Oh, yeah, this one is.

[C]

This one is a very male. Male centric play year.

[A]

Yeah, there have been a lot of roles for women in plays this year, but none of them super meaty, unfortunately. Yeah, like. Like, ain't no Mo, you know, has so many actresses in it, but really only Crystal Lucas Perry was the one who stood out for me.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. And same thing with Leopoldshad. Like, there are tons of female roles, but Fake Castello is the only one who. I'm like, you. It's. It's you. You're the one who's got the role. And on that note, let's do featured actress in a play. I have Crystal Lucas Perry, Sharon D. Clark, Faye Castello, Darcy Cardin, and then I'm gonna throw a curveball out here because I haven't seen it yet, but Miriam Silverman in Sign and Sydney Brustein's Window has the role that has been nominated every time that show has been on Broadway and it even won a Tony for the original actress. What I would love, I would love to get either Nikki Crawford in there for Fat Ham or Nancy Zamit for Peter Pan goes wrong. Nikki is doing some wild shit and it's all landing, which is so hard to do. And then Nancy is in a, you know, super light, not serious show, but making the best impression of the entire company, which is a strong company of actors. Just for breakdancing is Tinkerbell alone. I'm like, give. Give her a nomination. And then like her doubling as Liza and Mrs. Darling, I'm just, I'm very into her. I think she's so good in it. I think there could be a surprise. If they end up liking Goodnight Oscar more than I did, they could maybe throw in Emily Burgle who's like the suffering wife role, whatever, but she does a good job with it. Or Katie Sullivan in Cost of Living. Like, like. And I think Darcy Carden is very vulnerable. I think Faye Castle is vulnerable. I'd even argue Sharon D. Clark is vulnerable. Like, I think Death of a Salesman could just get a revival nomination and that will be it. But that's my hot take. That's my hot take.

[C]

Yeah. No, I mean, very, very similar list.

[B]

Yeah. We've got Krista Lucas Perry and Aunt no Mo. Sharon D. Clark and Death of a Salesman. We've got Casey Levi in Leopoldstadt, but.

[C]

We haven't seen it.

[A]

So that's why she's. I mean, listen, Casey. Casey's great. Her role is not a role. So I would buck her out of there. Sure, sure.

[C]

Her time will come legacy. We were like, she's always great.

[A]

Yes. No, on good faith. It's Casey. She's great. No, she.

[B]

And she's.

[A]

She. She was lovely in it, but she's. Her role was not a role. Anyone else.

[C]

Card and Thanksgiving play.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And then we, we threw in Danielle Brooks for the piano lesson. But like I said, we didn't see it. So. So it was just kind of a wild card.

[B]

But we lost lighting stop.

[A]

Danielle could absolutely get in there for sure. It's. Again, I would say this is another one where it's. It's not that it's so much. It's super stacked so much as a lead actor in a play. But it is a bit of a free for all. So, like, it's, it's. It's less of like we've got 15 super eligible people and more of like we've got 10 people who are all doing solid work, and none of them are like, such a front runner that they're a sure thing. Like, I would say, Crystal, who's your.

[C]

Who's your hope to win?

[A]

My hope to win. I mean, if I were like, I. I would. I would vote for Nikki in In Fathom. I was so impressed with her because I'd never seen her on stage before. And then after, I would say if I had to go in order would be Nikki, followed by Crystal, Lucas Perry followed by obviously Nancy Zammit, and then fake Castello, and then Darcy just, you know, Darcy did a good job. I just found I wanted Thanksgiving play to be funnier. I wanted to be like a woke God of carnage, and it wasn't for me, but alas, a lack. But I will go into featured actor in a play now because we got to start plowing through these. We've only got, like 20 minutes left. Yeah. Feature action to play. I have Brandon Uranowitz, Dave Krumholtz, Chris Sullivan for Thanksgiving play, Billy Eugene Jones for Fat Ham, and then Arian Moid. That's how you say his name for Dollhouse. I would love to see either Michael Potts get in there for a piano lesson, Jordan Cooper get in there for Ain't no Mo, or Oak for Doll's House, who I did not want to like because of his history, but he is very good in Doll's House.

[C]

Yeah, I really. Yeah, we have him down. I really enjoyed that performance.

[A]

Yeah, I did, too. I mean, it's. You know, he's. He's so good. I mean, I think of anyone in this category, I think Brandon is the only lock. And I much as I want Billy in there and he is who I would vote for, I'm not sure he's a lock because I don't know how the Tony nominators are going to go for Fat Ham. Like, I know that it's going to get a play nomination and an actor nomination. Then I'm like, anywhere else you want to throw them A couple of bones that I personally would.

[C]

Yeah, you want to run through it?

[B]

What up? But we've also got Kavalon Smith in Fat Ham, Jeremy Pope in the collaboration. We have Nathan Lane, but we're taking him out. We also have Brandon Uranowitz and Leopold Stadt and Andre de Shields in Death of a Salesman. Is that kind of more of the same? Like Hermes in like He. The role of Ben is kind of treading similar ground, but Andrea Shields is so good at it.

[A]

He is. He is it is very. Yeah, yeah. He's a very powerful presence on stage. I think it is a little bit of more of the same. And again, I'm not sure how people are going to feel about this revival, but it's because it got well reviewed but no one's really talking about it anymore. And I know a lot of us were a little underwhelmed because it came in with the feeling of like, oh, you've never seen Death of a Salesman like this before. And in a way we hadn't. But it wasn't quite the revelation on Broadway that I think people were hoping for. But now he could get in there. But, yeah, I'm going to stick with my original five of Brandon, Dave, Chris, Billy and Arian with a possible upset of Oak. And, I mean, if I'm being honest, Samuel L. Jackson for Piano Lesson could get in there. He's not who I would nominate from that show. I would nominate Michael Potts, who was giving the best performance in that production, in my opinion. But alas, a lack. Okay, next category will best actor in a musical. Let's do it. Yeah.

[B]

Are we up to actor in a musical?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I think. Yeah. This is our last acting category. Actor in a musical.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Gotcha. Jay Harrison G in Some like it Hot. Ben Platt Parade. Josh Groban, Sweeney Todd. Colton Ryan, New York New York and Andrew Burn up Camelot.

[A]

Un Understandable. I have Christian Borrell in there over Colton again. This is the. This is the paradise square of it all, where it's like, do the nominators just fall in love with this show no matter what the critics say? And that could happen. And if that happens, I think Colton is absolutely that production's best shot at an acting nomination. He's. He is doing a lot, and he is very.

[C]

I was literally going to say he's doing the most.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, he's doing the most. Christian could get in there, just, you know, very well liked. He's doing a good job. That show is very much about the, like, relationship between him and Jay, and that could help them a lot. And I know that there's a lot of community support for some like it Hot, but it also could seem a little Paddington to. To put two actors from that show in that category when there are other shows we could recognize. So do we like that one for anything?

[C]

You're so goofy. Who's your. Who's your pick to win or who would you like to win?

[A]

I guess if I were to vote, I would vote for Ben. Having not seen Andrew yet in his supposedly very tight pants and Camelot. But Ben is my pick. I think it's probably between him and Josh. Realistically, I found Ben far more compelling. But again, Sweeney is such a role. What about you guys? Who's your pick to win?

[C]

I feel like Jay Harrison, geek. But I could. I could so easily see it going to Ben.

[A]

Yeah, it makes sense. Yeah. There's no lock in this category. It's. I think it really is among those three. It's just. We'll see where. We'll see where the momentum goes, you know? Okay.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Director of a musical. I have Michael Arden for Parade, Jessica Stone for Kimberly Akimbo, Casey Nicholaw for Some Like It Hot. If I had my druthers, I would throw Titanique in there because I loved that production just so much. But because I can't do that, I do think Thomas Kail for Sweeney Todd will get in there. And then the fifth slot is among Lear for Into the Woods, Stroman for New York, New York, and Jack o' Brien for Shucked for me. And I think I would. Of those three, I would pick Jack o'. Brien. Realistically, I think it would be Stroman for New York, New York.

[C]

Yeah. We have Jessica Stone, Kimberly Akimbo, Casey Nicholson, Like It Hot, Stroman, New York, New York, Jack o' Brien shucked with like a fifth empty slot. And I probably.

[B]

Michael Arden, Parade.

[A]

Yeah. He. First of all, he's who I would vote to win. And I do think he has a shot at it because this. If he gets nominated, this will be his third nomination as a director.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And he has first win. Yeah. And. And each Tony's. He's had more success. We had Spring Awakening where he was nominated at the show was nominated. Nothing won once on this island. He was nominated and the show won. And I think this time he and the show could both win. And this is definitely his, like, best. His most critically acclaimed production to date. And it's doing well at the box office. It's got a lot of heat. I think this could be it for him.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Who do you guys have to win?

[B]

I. I loved Jessica Stone for Kimberly Akimbo. We've just been. It's also the thing of, like, when we saw it Atlantic, we were like, oh, my gosh. Like, we. We just want everything for this show. It's special and lovely and it's not flashy, but it is memorable and deeply affecting. And that's all cultivated by someone steering off screen.

[C]

Yeah. Do I think it will win? Probably Not. But it would be my pick.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think Jessica does a lovely job in that show. Her work with the actors is really what makes that show click. And it's all the changes they made from off Broadway to Broadway were the right ones. I know some people who are underwhelmed with her literal, physical staging. I think the staging is just fine and works for the tone of the show. But again, I think sometimes people think of director as like, what's the most inventive staging? And I'm like, it's that. But it's also just keeping the whole ship afloat and going in the right direction. Like, if you see a Broadway musical.

[C]

You mean having a song called the Inevitable Turn and making it the only number on a turntable is not enough for these people?

[A]

Yes.

[C]

Is that not enough for you?

[A]

God damn it. What's enough for you? What does Jessica like? Paul Alexander Nolan? What does Jessica Stone have to do but to do?

[C]

I don't know. That was. That was Chef's Kiss in my book.

[A]

Oh, no. Yeah. It wasn't on a turn. It wasn't on a turntable off Broadway. And so it. It was just so good. And I mean, again, again, I'm sounding like a butt boy for this show because I would also give them a choreography nomination in a category that's a little light. I think all the show choir stuff is good. The way they have the show ch. Framing them in the Inevitable Turn and what they do on certain lyrics is just so. Again, Chef's Kiss. But whatever. Yes. I think. I think we have good vibes.

[C]

Just good theater.

[A]

Yeah. Director of a play. I'm not even going to bother with the names. Leopoldstadt, Fatham, Prima Facie, Doll's House. And then I have as a thrown out there, top dog, underdog. But if I'm being honest, I think Life of PI will probably be in there for realsies just because it's the most. But those are the five that I think have a good shot. Also the five I would like. Someone tried to convince me cost of living might get in there. I don't see it. But that's my five.

[B]

We've got Peter Pan Goes Wrong because it's just like so much maneuvering. Fat Ham, Leopoldstadt, Life of PI. We just. We just kind of did four.

[A]

Okay. I mean, it's. You have to also think about, like, what's. What's a front runner for play? What's a front runner for revival of a play? So, like, that's why I have Leia Post and Fat Hammer definitely front runners. Prime is not going to win play, but it is a very directory show. And then I think Top Dogs and Doll's House are both strong contenders for revival. But yeah, no, that's. If I'm gonna make my actual 555 and make a bold choice, I will say Leia Polstad, Fat Hand, Doll's House, Prima, Top Dog, and Life of PI doesn't get in. But if I'm being a little more cynical, I think Gretchen Wieners. Not for Gretchen Wieners by. But if I'm being cynical, I would put in Life of PI over Top Dog just in terms of, like, it's currently running and it's very overly stagey. Okay, let's. Let's knock out our last two design categories. Scenic design of both. Scenic design and sound design of both. Sound design we can do pretty quickly. I know you guys haven't seen a lot of play, so let me do sound of design play for you, shall I? Yes, please. I would do. I. I think Doll's House and Prima Facie are both locks. Christmas Carol is probably a lock. Peter Pan goes wrong. I would throw in there because they do a lot of interesting stuff with sound design. And Fat Ham does a lot of great stuff with sound design. Yeah. After that, Life of PI might get in there again. It's very designy. Maybe Silent Cindy Bruste's window, but I think those are the five. Doll's House. I mean, if you see it, you understand why Doll's House will get a sound design nomination. If you see Prima Facie, you'll understand. If you see Peter Pan goes wrong, you will understand Christmas Carol. Same thing. Like what they do with Jefferson Mays voice and then Fat Ham. Just like how they use the different microphone settings for, like, Juicy's monologues for the karaoke stuff. Like, it's. It's a more sound designy show than I think people realize. Sound design of a musical. Sure. Yeah. Sound. I'm. I'm gonna just keep you guys out of sound design. Let's go, let's go, let's go. Sound designing, musical. I have Kimberly, New York, New York, and Juliet shucked and parade with a possible Some like it Hot in there. If they dare to give Sweeney Todd a sound design nomination, I will go to the podium. I will find where they're at. I will go to that podium and I will throw my shoe at whoever announces the nominations. Because whether you like survivalist, probably Michelle. Listen, she'll catch that shoe like she cat like she Caught that production to Funny Girl and carried it on her tiny little back. But the one thing about Sweeney Todd, like the Book of New York, New York, they're all in agreement. The sound design of Sweeney Todd is bad. And I don't want to throw the sound designer under the bus. He's a good sound designer. But Thomas Kail's desire for the sound design of that show is not it. Because you want to be drowning in that music. You want to be just drenched in it. And you are lucky if you get a mist if you're in the first four rows. What do you have for sound design of a musical? You two.

[B]

Where's Aunt Juliet? I think that it.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

I think with shows that are more like contemporary and more synthesizer, drum machine, all of that, that the nominators kind of have a struggle to see that as orchestration, but they think of it as sound design instead.

[A]

Yeah, no, it's true. It's true. I think. And Juliet has a good shot at sound design as well. But there's like a fit slot that it could really go anywhere. But, yeah, I think that's a solid one. So you have angel yet. Anything else?

[C]

Our list mirrors your list. Yeah.

[A]

Amazing. It was the same scenic design of a play. I have Leopoldstadt, Life of Pie, Christmas Carol, Peter Pan Goes Wrong and Piano Lesson. I think there could be a surprise with Prima Facie. If you see the show, the set design is actually. It's not elaborate. Elaborate, but it's more than just like a unit set. Surprisingly, it has a couple of surprises in there. Sign in Sydney Brustein's window, I understand, has a very nice design. I haven't seen it yet. Imagine if pictures from home got in just for the green of it all.

[C]

But the green of it all.

[A]

The green of it all.

[C]

The Oz. Oztopia of it all.

[A]

Yep. Yeah. But I doubt it. What do you guys have for your five?

[C]

We literally just wrote down Life of PI and called it a day.

[A]

Yep. Life of Pie, Holiday.

[C]

So rude. It's so rude.

[A]

But I could. I think Peter Pan Goes Wrong could actually win set design. Because the thing about Life of PI, and I know that the. The projections are a part of the set design. That's what's making it eligible. But like, Peter Pan Goes Wrong does some. They do a lot of similar things to play that goes wrong of just, like how that set falls apart and all the tricks up. It's really clever. I don't know.

[C]

The boat coming out of the ground. I just.

[A]

It's just jumping into the stage. Girl. Girl, I'm telling you. You're. You are probably right. I am just. I'm throwing it out there. Like.

[C]

I hear you.

[A]

Yeah. Bob Crowley winning set design for once. Like, anything is possible. You know, sometimes they go certain ways. No, I. And I like that set design. And we all know that I'm a for Bob.

[C]

Oh, I know, I know.

[A]

But that, like, he was.

[C]

Something surprises you. It really surprises you.

[A]

Yeah. Everyone was really surprised that he won for that same design of a musical. New York, New York, which is our front runner, probably Sweeney Todd, which I disagree with, but whatever. Some like it Hot. Totally fine. I understand. Camelot is very simple, but it's the Beaumont and it's Cher. They tend to nominate that. And then I have shocked with and Juliet possibly getting in there. That is my five. With the. With the upset of and Juliet. What do we think?

[B]

I think.

[C]

If somebody could have. New York, New York, and Juliet. We wrote down K Pop. We were so K pop heavy last night.

[A]

You two love your K Pop.

[C]

We must have been drunk. No, no, no, no, no. Well, I mean, we just really enjoyed it, and. I don't know. I. I don't know.

[B]

And we had a great time. It's. It's like the. You know, the Sondheim quote where, like, they asked him, like, what's your favorite musical? And he would always say the whiz. And you'd be like, what? And it's like, we felt good after the show.

[A]

Yeah, no, I totally get that. It was like. It was a high. You would get a high from it. I get that. I get that. I feel you, Joanna. I feel you. I'm just. I'm just telling you. All right. Okay. We've got. Let's do revivals and then plays. Which do we want to do first? Revival of a musical or revival of a play?

[C]

Let's do plays first and then musicals second.

[A]

Okay, I have Doll's House, Top Dog, Underdog, Death of a Salesman, and the sign in Sydney Brustein's Window. The only other two options are Piano Lesson and Ohio State Murders. Yeah, Ohio's not getting in there. If Piano Lesson replaces anything, I would venture to, say A Doll's House just because this production is pretty divisive, or even Death of a Salesman just because it's closed and semi forgotten. But those are my four, and I.

[C]

What? Are you gonna take it?

[A]

I think Doll's House or Sign would take it. I would vote for Top Dog with A Doll's House as a second, but, yeah, I don't know. Revival play is an interesting one. It's like, it's. How many ways can it go?

[C]

Yeah. I mean, it's like I really enjoyed At Doll's House, but it's. I get to the point where it's like, do we want to reward this kind of behavior?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Do we want every. Every play from now on to just be nothing and just good actors? I mean, which is great.

[A]

But that's the thing that was like. That's what I was expecting, was just like good acting in a nothing production. And I was surprised at how involved the production actually was. So if I.

[C]

It is dynamic.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. It's like, if I were to vote for it and give it the award, I would definitely be on that stage saying, like, and I vote for A Doll's House with the caveat of don't do this normally. This is the anomaly, folks. This is the anomaly.

[B]

It's a one time thing.

[C]

This is it. As well done as it possibly can be. And people would take the wrong lesson away from that and just be like, I don't have to do anything. And I think that's bad.

[B]

Like, what happened with Ain't Misbehavin? And then it's like, oh, cool. We don't have to do new scores. We can just dig up old, old music and stick it all together. It's like, no, no, no, no. This is done so well.

[A]

Yeah. Here.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Exactly one time.

[B]

I think that we could do best scenic design for whoever designed Best scenic design goes to A Doll's House.

[A]

We.

[B]

It could be for whoever did the loading door in the Hudson Theater.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Or that was a good design.

[A]

Or the set design of the Doll's House. And the winner is the Lazy Susan for A Doll's House. Because of that turn. Honestly, a chair. Turntables are getting a workout this season. There are so many turntables on Broadway this year. All right, revival of a musical go.

[B]

We got Sweeney, Parade, Camelot, into the Woods.

[C]

And then it's just a coin flip between Sweeney and Parade. It just depends on the tastes and preferences of the powers that be.

[A]

It's true. I would vote for Parade. And I have a sneaking suspicion that's what's going to win. In a similar vibe of the Once on this island year where everyone was going, well, you know, My Fair lady, you know, it's Lincoln center and it's this. And it's this acclaimed revival. And everyone's like, but I secretly liked Once on this island more. And so everybody voted for Once on this island thinking that My Fair lady had it in the bag and then once on this island won. So that could happen with Parade. I also. I have the same four. If I had my druthers, I would probably replace Camelot just because I haven't seen it yet with Dear World from Encores, which was not a perfect revival, but it was the first show at Encores in years where I was like, this is what Encores should be a mess of, a show where I get to hear the full orchestra and Donna is giving like. I was so pleased with my time there. Yeah, yeah.

[C]

How chaotic. Chaotic. Good.

[A]

Chaotic. Good. Best play I have Fathom, Leopoldstadt, Prima Facie Cost of Living and then between Riverside and Crazy, Cost of Living could get thrown out by Life of PI. But again, if I had my druthers, I would throw them all out and just give it to Downstate, which is the best American play in years, what have you. And I would have thrown out some of my acting nominations for the people of Downstate, but alas, I forgot to do that because I was so worried about making this ton on time. Who do we have for our five? You uncultured fox.

[C]

Yeah, bummer. Fat Ham, Life of PI, Leopoldstadt, Prima, and Goodnight Oscar.

[A]

Okay, you haven't.

[C]

We haven't. We haven't seen Goodnight Oscar. It was just. We. It sounded good at the time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It has good in the title.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Good night, Oscar. Good things. Yeah. You hear good things about the Good Night for the. For that Oscar band. Yeah. It's just not a strong enough play. And I know that some people have said the same thing of Prima, but Prima is far more of an engaging and entertaining evening, whereas Goodnight Oscar, you're like, you're basically waiting for Sean Hayes and then you're waiting for him to do the TV show and you're waiting for him to play the piano. And there are pockets of good moments and there are some actually other good performances in there besides Sean. Like Alex Weiss is doing a lovely job. Ben Rapoport's doing a lovely job. But it is the Sean Hayes show for the most part. Yeah. I'll be interested to see if Cost of Living and between Riverside and Crazy get in there. Because until now it's been extraordinarily rare for a Pulitzer winner to not get nominated for play.

[C]

Right. But that was that ham of it all.

[A]

The fat ham of it all. That's. That's three out of five. Unless we get a sixth. And Leopoldstadt is absolutely getting in. It's between Leopoldshad and Fat Ham. For the actual award, I would give it to fat Ham. I think Leopoldstadt with Tom Stoppard and whatnot. They're like, just give it to him. But alas, okay, Musical Kimberly, numero uno, closest thing to a sure thing. Shucked. And Juliet sunlike it hot Titanique, although she's not actually eligible, so we let it go. The question is New York, New York, or A Beautiful Noise? After last night, a lot of people have been like, oh, shit, is A Beautiful Noise going to be our fifth musical nominee? I say, no. I say, even though it got maybe like 5% better reviews than New York, New York, nominators can't bring themselves to do it. They're just going to go for the pedigree of New York, New York, slightly more originality, grandeur, and just go for it. Go, go. Full fat ham.

[C]

Totally, totally agree with you. Yep. That's our list to a T. Yep.

[A]

And I look forward to the Tonys when Kimberly wins and Sara Bareilles drunkenly gets on stage and she's like, I'm going to let you y' all finish with your. With your speeches in just a second, but can I just say, Titanique was the best musical of the year and they're not getting nominated as a crime. And someone has to come on st and inform Sara Bareilles that it wasn't eligible as it was off Broadway. And then Sara Bareilles goes off stage crying and then writes another beautiful score for me to cry to in the bathtub.

[C]

Yeah, that all sounds like it's absolutely going to happen for you.

[A]

Listen, after the year I've had, anything can happen this year. Will, Rachel, this has been a delight. Thank you so much for.

[C]

Oh, my God, it's such a pleasure. Thank you for your being so generous with your time.

[A]

Thank you. I mean, do you really think this is your last time on this podcast? This is not even your last time on this podcast. Before I finish this Tony series, you're going to come back on as we do. You know, like one last reaction before the actual ceremony. Or you might be my episode of reactions to the ceremony itself. I'm going to get into your socials in a second. I want to do a quick shout out to my listeners. If you like the podcast five stars or a nice little review. I've got two, and I'm going to plow through them. The Light in the Piazza Overture music, five stars. Lets me pretend that I'm there. Fabulous show. I've been enjoying it since I got back from my last trip. To New York. A question. I've been listening to the Sondheim series and during the Sweeney Todd episode, you said you would do a roundup episode of your final opinions and list your favorite Sondheim musicals. I didn't see that episode anywhere. Did I miss it? No, you did not. I do that roundup at the end of the roadshow episode when I was do my rankings of the shows. I do it in the final episode. So roadshow is where at the end I list my rankings of Sondheim musicals. Fun Home is where I rank the Tesori musicals. Six is where I rank the British imports and so on and so forth. Next one. Five stars. The Kimberly Akimbo of podcasts. I would Give this podcast 5 out of 5 checks washed by Bonnie Milligan. Great insight and humor. Love the Tony predictions and can't wait to listen to more awesome content. Thank you so much, guys. Will and Rachel. What? Oh, I thought you were pointing at your mug, Will. You were just getting something off of it. Will and Rachel, where can people find you if you want them to find you?

[C]

We are at the theater lovers on Instagram and TikTok. That's t h e underscore T h e a t e r underscore L o v e r s and we are just at at theaterlovers on Twitter spelled the same way. Theater er lover er.

[A]

Perfect. We love to see it. If you want to find me on Instagram, I am at Matt Koplik. Usual spelling again, five star ratings if you can. We always like to boost the algorithm. We've been number one on Apple and Spotify when you search Broadway for podcasts for like three weeks now. And we want to keep that going, baby. Yeah, baby, keep that going. Let's close out with Broadway diva because she's gonna get a nomination next week and we've done her before, but I don't care. We're gonna close out with one Victoria Clark. Will and Rachel, thank you. Will and Rachel, thank you so much for doing this. Always a pledge and that's it. Thank you so much for listening, guys. We'll see you after the Tony nominations. Take us away, Vicki. Bye.

[C]

Bye. No one really knows who she is, but the newspaper says she booked the most expensive suite on the ship and travels with 14 steam. Her chunks, a medicine chest, her personal pillows, and she said four little piggy dogs. So she must be somebody. She must be somebody.