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Email Marketing Strategy for Online Sellers: Automations That Convert | ft. Asad Kanaan
00:35:00
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- [00:00]
A
Of course, with a T shirt, if it's print on demand, always better to have a mock up of someone wearing that T shirt so the people can visualize themselves in that T shirt. And same thing for jewelry is what I used to do all the time is, you know, have real people put them on and then I look at the product description itself and you'd be surprised how often, you know, people forget about that. They list what the T shirt is made of or the sizes, the colors and you know, like these things. I can see them in the product selector, the sizes and the, and the colors. A lot of time people don't care care about percentage cotton in the T shirt. What they care about is what I feel when I put this on. Hey there.
- [00:39]
B
I'm Cody McGuffey. I'm a husband dad of three and I'm the founder of Ever Be Everbee. Ever Be Everbee, where we serve over a million creators across the globe, helping them grow thriving online businesses. I believe every single human is a creator and I believe every single creator should own a business. It isn't that gives them the freedom to build the life that they dream of. Built online is where creators, entrepreneurs and leaders get real insights, real stories and the edge to build something that actually lasts. This is where the next generation builders get built. Assad, what's up man? How are you?
- [01:14]
A
I'm doing great. How about you? Very good.
- [01:18]
B
Thank you for coming on. For anyone that doesn't know, I'm excited for. For anyone that doesn't know who Assad is, I'll give you my quick little introduction. My personal induction is I've been on Assad for over four years and we've got the pleasure of working together in various ways from a freelancer to contractor to employee to to referring business to each other. And it I've learned so much from Assad and that's why I was really excited to have you on is Assad because I'm sure you have so much value that you can share with our audience today. So I'm excited to dive in what we're going to talk about today.
- [01:55]
A
Yeah. And I'm excited to be here. Excited to. I've always learned so many things from you as well and happy to add value to the listeners.
- [02:05]
B
Let's do it. Let's jump right into it.
- [02:07]
A
A special place for ever be.
- [02:09]
B
I know you do a lot of so fun fact. A lot of ever actually the majority of Everbee email was built with Assad and of course team and a lot of that vision was Coming from you and your email marketing experience, which we'll dive into today. But I really want to understand, or what other people to understand, Asad, your brief history. I know you as copywriter, expert. I know you as email marketing expert and I also know you as e commerce expert too. And I say those things and I say expert. I don't say that lightly. I've seen your work, I've used your work, I've paid for your work and I value your work. And I've also referred people to your work. So I really trust it. Uh, but also I've, you have the credibility of. You've built standalone stores in the past two through Shopify in the past, and you've actually sold one of those brands, is that correct?
- [03:08]
A
I, I, I sold two of them actually over, over time. That was in 2018 and 2019.
- [03:16]
B
And those are things that are hard to do for any, like I would say an average person. And so it's remarkable. And that's why I really wanted to have you on to share that expertise with the world. Um. Cause I know there's a lot of things we can pull out.
- [03:30]
A
Absolutely, absolutely. So my journey with e commerce and online marketing starts in 2015. Before that I was working in engineering. Not so much fun, but lots of analytics and lots of building systems if you want. But in 2015, that's when I started building my own e commerce stores. And at that point I used to focus more on selling jewelry online because jewelry has an emotional connection to the, to the buyer. Whether it's an emotional connection, whether it's what they want to show off to the world through the piece that they're wearing. And I did that, I want to say, from 2015 all the way to 2020, just focusing on my own e commerce stores. And as you said, I, I sold and made an exit on two of them. And when it comes down to mainly like the three main skills that I learned through that, through that period of my life, is three main things you need to focus on. One being is how you're going to drive traffic to your store, to your products, which in my case was paid ads. Of course you can do organic traffic, but I want the paid ad routes, then the copywriting, how you're presenting this product in words so that people can see themselves interacting with it, whether they're putting it on, putting it on their finger or necklace, conveying these words and emotions. And then finally email marketing to follow up with people who don't buy or with people who buy when you have something new that you're introducing into your store. So these three skills, the paid traffic, copywriting and email marketing is what I've been focusing on and that's what I've been helping my clients do over the, over the years do to do.
- [05:34]
B
Typically do you have a. Just so we can kind of get this out of the way. So that way people listening to this can really understand who you help. Who do you help like primarily with this. Is it in the E commerce space? Is it course creators? Is it email marketing? Like what, what specifically? That way we understand fully from that lens.
- [05:53]
A
Sure. So I do work with, with e commerce stores whether they're selling on their own stores or selling on Marketplace like Etsy for example. I also work with people who are selling physical products or people who are selling digital products including planners, courses, memberships. And it varies between you know, e commerce sellers, coaches and consultants and even SaaS companies like Everbee.
- [06:26]
B
So it seems. Yeah, in my experience too it makes sense why you have like kind of like that broad, I want to say kind of broad customer base. Because email marketing and copywriting is like it is true for every single one of those things and they all need to be have persuasive copy relationship building has, has to have email follow ups systems all built in. They also need to talk to each other as far as the systems of where they are in the funnel. Like there's a lot of things that need to happen for each one of those. Each one of those things.
- [06:55]
A
Exactly, exactly. And you know, whereas with, with E commerce the email marketing side of things is more visual, you know, adding images of the products and having more colors versus you know, promoting with you know, a course where it's more text heavy, where it ends as somewhere in between where you're possibly putting screenshots of how to use the product in the middle. So all of these different styles varies. But then you know, designing an email system you need the copywriting and you need the triggers in place when to send out the email. What happens after they open this email? What happens after they click it and you know, the sequence of events that that take place.
- [07:43]
B
Can we talk to a certain segment today? Maybe the folks that sell, let's just say products online that could be digital or physical and maybe hope we probably won't have time. I already know we won't if I want to. I was going to say if we have time, but I know we won't. I want to touch on courses, course kind of people that are selling courses and things like that and memberships so maybe we could sprinkle some of that in there. But mostly if we can focus on like the product sellers, digital or physical, which is print on demand also included, for example, the T shirt seller or maybe the digital planner seller. What are some things, what are some things that they just need to have like as a baseline, like you just be like, you'd come in today, I'm client, my name's Sally. And you're just like, hey, Sally, what do you need? And you're just like, I don't know what I need. And you're, and what would you do? What would you set me up with?
- [08:32]
A
Right. So the first thing I would look at is the product pages, the landing pages where people go to, you know, buy the product. And there are four or five different elements that I would look at. The first one is the title of the product. What does it say about the product? Does it invoke any kind of emotion or curiosity in this product? The other thing I would look at is the product image. And of course with a T shirt, if it's print on demand, always better to have a mock up of someone wearing that T shirt so the people can visualize themselves in that T shirt. And same thing for jewelry is what I used to do all the time is, you know, have real people put them on and then I look at the product description itself and you'll be surprised how often, you know, people forget about that. They list, you know, like what the T shirt is made of or the sizes, the colors and you know, like these things I can, you know, I can see them in the, you know, product selector, the sizes and the, and the colors. A lot of time people don't care about, you know, percentage cotton in the T shirt. What they care about is what would I feel when I put this on or what would someone see me wearing this shirt get the impression of or the feeling of. And translating that into copy is absolutely amazing. It automatically bumps up the conversion rates that have seen, you know, so for.
- [10:24]
B
Example, like let's say that I have a friend that he used to own a history history T shirt company. And it was basically like for history buffs and like they were kind of like humorous history things and it'd be like Abraham Lincoln and they have some like funny quote or something like that. And so you would, what you wouldn't want to see, you personally Assad wouldn't want to see on that product description is like made of 100 cotton.
- [10:51]
A
Exactly. Polyester, eco friendly, you know, like ethically sourced. I mean all of these are good things, but these are features more or less. And you know, because you said it's, it's a history T shirt, like I wouldn't go into the history of Abraham Lincoln, but if it's like a quote from him, you know, like I would mention, like either, either framing. Now of course, it depends on the seller themselves. Like do they want to go the fundy route, the serious route, which way they're going to. But add a story in there, like this phrase. Abe Lincoln mentioned it on the event of this and make it something visual that they can see themselves in the crowd when he mentioned that phrase.
- [11:42]
B
Oh, interesting.
- [11:42]
A
That would invoke that feeling. And now they have a story when they're wearing it and someone says, you know, like, hey, I like this shirt.
- [11:50]
B
Oh, very interesting. It's very true. I could totally see a human doing that. Like if someone asks me to, if I'm wearing a, a blinking shirt, not something I would wear, but let's say I did. I would almost like want someone. I'm wearing that shirt because I want someone to ask me like, oh, you big Abe Lincoln fan. I'm like, oh yeah. Did you know this quote was actually said on this day and this day and this day, right before I went to battle with this, this, this.
- [12:10]
A
Exactly.
- [12:11]
B
It makes, makes me feel smart, probably. So I'm feeling emotion, I'm feeling like, oh, I'm feeling like smart. Maybe I'm feeling impressive to this person who also appreciates history. Maybe I just attracted somebody that was interested in history. Now I'm potentially a friend because that's what I was doing is I'm attracting people to come and have a conversation with me about Abe Lincoln.
- [12:32]
A
Exactly. Here you go. Or you know, if, if the, if the intent of it is to gift it to someone, then, you know, you can talk about how they're going to feel once they receive it, the look on their face and how much, you know, your relationship to them would mean once they receive this gift from, from you. Or it could be, you know, like the results that would happen after you use this product.
- [13:00]
B
Now can we move kind of into the email marketing segment too? Because I know that so, so you would start with landing page. I'm sorry, on product.
- [13:07]
A
With the product page.
- [13:09]
B
Okay, now let's, let's go to the next segment, which I know is very, very important.
- [13:15]
A
Right. And you know, with email there are mainly two routes. There's the automatic sequences, things that happen with you in the background. You don't do anything. You set them up once and you just let them run. And some of these include, you know, when someone starts the buying of a product but they don't continue with the process. So you want that triggers sending out different emails. Hey, you forgot something in your cart, you know, come back. Here's 10% discount to complete your order and so on. Although I wouldn't start with a discount from day one. Gentle reminder at first, by the third email I would introduce a discount. There's also the emails for when someone joins the email list for the first time, you want to welcome them into your store, talk about what makes it special. And when I say what makes it special, it's not why this story is special to you as a seller, but why it's special for them as a buyer, even on any website. This is a side note, the about us section on any website shouldn't really be about us, it should be about them, about our customers. We're just saying it's about us, but we're here for you. How do you.
- [14:39]
B
One question I've always wondered and I think is important, but no one really has really talked to me about it in this way is how do you kind of take the general voice, let's just say the history as an example and kind of like push it and sprinkle it into all your automations and sequences. What's a good way to do that? Or is that even needed in the in the e commerce world? Or is it just like the sequences.
- [15:04]
A
Automations enough now as a good. Any good marketer would say it depends. So it depends on if the store is general, if it sells history with space and NASA, these are completely different things. So one way of doing that would be to have multiple email sequences that are doing the same purpose. So if a person starts the checkout with this or with an item from the history collection, it triggers out the history abandoned cart sequences and it talks about history and that's a good way of segmenting the audience. It's always good to have different buckets of the audiences within your email tool to be able to speak to them in their own language and their own interests.
- [16:05]
B
So there's like for example a general store would be a funny tease, funny tees, funny T shirt store. That's pretty general probably, right? Like yes, it's product but it's not a specific niche you can talk to all the same. You can kind of talk in a funny tone, but that's pretty much it.
- [16:24]
A
Exactly. Because you know someone who's interested in finding T shirt might get you Know, a funny history T shirt but not a funny dad T shirt or something like that. But if the whole store for example is about history or about selling, you know, to moms or selling to dad or you know, a very specific group of people, then you know, you can have that one sequence that talks specifically about the store and the audience.
- [16:52]
B
Okay, what are some of the basic things that for someone doesn't. This is like an intro to email marketing. They're just like not even sure which automations they should have set up. Like what are the just checklist things that they should have set up just because they're leaving money on the table.
- [17:08]
A
Perfect. So for, for E commerce in general the the first one you need to have is the cart abandonment which you know, basically these are people who started checking out for some reason or other they didn't continue. It could be that, you know, when they started this process they were laying on the couch and life happened. The credit card was far away from them, they got busy, they were on a bus and didn't continue. So that's number one. The second one is what for how you have an email list. You need to keep growing this email list. And one way for E commerce stores is to give a discount for new customers. So you know, a pop up would appear get 10% off with your first purchase. Enter your email now there you want to deliver that 10% discount, the coupon code. But you also want to start establishing this relationship with them. You want to tell them what kind of products they can find in your store. You know, if they don't buy immediately, which is what's going to happen. You want to give them, you know, time to build this relationship and showcase what you have in store. So these are two of the most important automations that you have in the store. You would also have, you know, an automation after someone buys from the store. So it's not only you know, just delivering. Here's your invoice. Thank you for purchasing. But making it over a number of days your order has been shipped, it's on the way. And that would also trigger, you know, you want people to. The hardest part in E commerce is getting someone to pay you that first dollar. But once they do, you've overcome a big hurdle and now it's a matter of getting them to buy more and more and more. And it's easier if you know, if you're selling good quality products, it's easier to resell to your customers. They bought a history shirt. Hey, how about this other history short that you Know we just launched and.
- [19:19]
B
That obviously increases your repeat, repeat customers one which also increases your lifetime value of that customer. So that's just for. I know it's a little bit of a nerdy term for those that are just beginners, but it's important for commerce.
- [19:31]
A
Exactly, exactly. And you know there are like two, two situations for people buying online. Like this is kind of like the way I look at it, there are people who know what they want. So they go would probably go into a marketplace and say I'm searching for this. What are the different options available right now? The other way is if you're not selling on a marketplace and you want to stand out is you cater to this audience and you need to communicate to them every new item that you have or every new collection that you have because they bought from you once, they're not going to keep coming back to the store every time you need to keep to be inviting them to come.
- [20:16]
B
I was making, I was looking at my list here of I, I feel like the checklist I would say that are important to me as an E Commerce. E commerce seller. Somebody building a brand is abandoned cart. Like you said welcome series, which is kind of what you were alluding to. Which is like for me in my world it's like probably four or five emails of welcome and the main objective, this is when someone first comes, comes into, puts their email in your world.
- [20:41]
A
Exactly.
- [20:42]
B
And this is your chance to really establish a relationship, introduce who you are, talk about why you started. Maybe introduce maybe something about maybe introduce a product. What would you say about Wacom series and how important are they?
- [20:58]
A
Right. That's exactly what they are and except that I wouldn't talk about like introducing myself. I wouldn't talk about you know like the whole entire history. I would make it focused more on what the customer wants. People are selfish. They, they like to hear about themselves. They about their own problems and solutions to their problems and what could make them feel better. So if you're sending out an email and you're talking about yourself, people are not going to continue reading it. They want to hear more about what you can do for them. So again, the about us email is not about us. It's about how we're here to tell them. Exactly. Stand out or feel better.
- [21:44]
B
I think we both, we both read that same book. I think it was story brand, right?
- [21:49]
A
Could be, yeah.
- [21:50]
B
Yeah. You read that book though, right? The story brand.
- [21:52]
A
I did, yep.
- [21:53]
B
I forget what it's called.
- [21:54]
A
I read the story brand.
- [21:56]
B
Yeah. And pretty much like the Biggest takeaway that I, I pulled from this. I'm hoping it's the same book is as your brand. You are not the hero. The customer is the hero. You are the guide and you're.
- [22:11]
A
You're Exactly.
- [22:12]
B
That's. They're Luke Skywalker in Star wars and you're Yoda.
- [22:15]
A
That's the way I was exactly 100. They're Harry Potter and you're dumb and door. You're.
- [22:24]
B
You're the guy, you're the guide. You're. What's. We're stretching it. Never mind. I'll leave it there. Those are two great examples, but I think that's really important that you called that out because I think I see a lot of. I still get a lot of emails from brands that are talking about their founding story and how important they are and how amazing they are and how all the stuff they had to overcome. Cool, cool stuff. But you need to reposition this in a way that's more for me.
- [22:50]
A
I'm the reader.
- [22:51]
B
Yeah, exactly. Okay, what are some interesting. Like I was pulling up some interesting, like email marketing facts like statistics, but in your experience, how much revenue percentage should actually be coming from email? Like off the top of your head. I know this can all vary, but.
- [23:12]
A
So kind of like a rule of thumb is for every person on your email list, you should be able to generate $1 per month on average.
- [23:21]
B
Yeah, that's a lot. So it seems like a lot to me. I don't know if. I don't know if that's. If it is, but it just seems like a lot.
- [23:26]
A
A lot. Like in a good way.
- [23:31]
B
It seems like in a good way. It also seems. Yeah, if I'm thinking about the person listening to this, they're probably like, okay, so I have a thousand people on my list. That means I should.
- [23:40]
A
A thousand dollars per month.
- [23:41]
B
Thousand dollars per month seems very exciting. Is it possible? Is that realistic? Is that actually attainable?
- [23:49]
A
100%. 100%. Now, we only, we only talked about the automations. The, the, the, the ones that work in the background. What really helps in pushing these numbers is the emails that you actually send on regular basis, the newsletters or the campaigns. And these are, I don't want to say like typically tied to a special occasion. You know, like when it not, not only whenever you're having a discount or promotion or Memorial Day is coming or Labor Day, it's whenever you want to. And typically these get sales because they're geared towards getting sales. It could be. We just released this new collection. Here's why this new collection is so cool. You know, you bought from us before. How about you complement your T shirt with this other one? You know, things, things like that.
- [24:54]
B
What are some I want to hit. I want to ask you some, like some, some maybe more statistic questions just so people. Because again, people listening to this are very likely brand new to email marketing, so they don't know what is what. And I want to give them some benchmarks that they can look up online too. But I want to be able to. We can discuss it too. Typical open rate percentage, what should somebody be targeting?
- [25:20]
A
Anything above 20% is considered good. If you're doing 30, 40%, that's amazing. And that's actually, you know, open rate is the first important thing people need to look at because if the email is not being opened, it means no one is reading. It means it's not doing its purpose. So it's one of the things to really focus on in email marketing. The first thing to look at before you even look at revenue per email or the click rate or any of that, just focus on the open rate. And there are two main factors that affect that. One of them is your relationship with them. So, for example, I know that when I receive an email in my inbox that says Cody from Everbee, I immediately open it because there's this trust factor. So that's number one. And that's something you build through time. The other part of it is the subject line is. Imagine this. You know, you open your, your inbox, you see all of these different messages. You're probably just skimming through them, deciding which ones to delete or archive or look at them later. And then few ones are the ones that you actually open them. And that's what happens with every single person. So the subject line is what gets your email opened or the second part of what gets your email open. And there are different tricks of doing that.
- [27:02]
B
There are, yeah. And I, and I love this because the purpose of this is to make it very simple. And that's very simple to. Very simple to me. Like target 20% and above. If you're getting less than 20%, play with your subject line and probably don't get overwhelmed with split testing and a B testing. And don't really worry about all that stuff quite yet. That can be later on optimized. Like, don't need to worry about that so much. Yet. People get messed up in the complexity of that. How about Click through Rate CTR Click Rates or Click Rate Click through Rate. Which one you want to talk about.
- [27:34]
A
Click rate which is how many percentage of times the link within the email has been clicked. And if you're in E commerce you probably have images within the email product images. So anytime someone clicks on that product image, it's going to take them to that product page. Anyone in one of these is considered a click. Different platforms measure it differently. Some of them, you know a click means there has been a click in the email. Others will measure it, you know like you click two different products so that it counts them as two different clicks within the email. So percentages difference. But anything between 1 to 2% is considered great.
- [28:18]
B
So if you have a thousand people on your list, you sent out a thousand emails, let's say that 20% of those opened. So 2200.
- [28:28]
A
200. So now you look at if you're looking at 2% click rate from the 200, that's 4.
- [28:37]
B
4. So it's off of the 200 is.
- [28:39]
A
The click rate right? Right. That's the click to open ratio. Okay.
- [28:46]
B
And beautiful. I was looking at the time. I think it's a perfect time to transition over to rapid fire. Questions. Are you ready?
- [28:54]
A
Yep.
- [28:55]
B
What's your favorite business book?
- [28:58]
A
Building a story brand. Is it just because I've read it recently.
- [29:02]
B
I love that. By the way, who wrote that book? I just want to make sure that I remember who.
- [29:08]
A
Donald Miller.
- [29:09]
B
What's the one thing that you wish that you knew before starting your businesses?
- [29:14]
A
The amount of time it's going to take building them.
- [29:20]
B
What do you mean by that?
- [29:22]
A
I thought it's going to take so I was looking far ahead into the future by working less that I thought that I could work less now and have and build a business. It's the opposite way.
- [29:35]
B
Explain more. What do you mean by that? I'm not sure if I fully grasped.
- [29:38]
A
Sure. So a lot of when I first started my own business I was looking to work less time and be able to make a living that that's what I want to be in the future. I started applying it early on. I see or getting the results. But yeah, it takes time initially but once you get through that phase, the initial phase, you'll be able to get to what you want.
- [30:04]
B
It does take time. You're right. It takes time and, and it's front loaded. The way I think about it it's. It's heavily front loaded. It's probably takes more time, more energy, more stress, more work, more uncertainty and it's so much, it's front loaded so heavy on the front end. But it as you Learn more and you learn more skills and you memorize relationships. It kind of eases up a little bit. It doesn't really get easier, probably, but it. It feels easier because you get so much better.
- [30:33]
A
Right, Right. And to be honest, it was more about the journey than actually getting there.
- [30:41]
B
What's the worst advice that you've ever received about business?
- [30:44]
A
Don't do it.
- [30:46]
B
You heard that before.
- [30:48]
A
Yeah. It was probably an unsolicited advice. Either.
- [30:51]
B
Always is.
- [30:52]
A
Yeah. Those are the ones you. You have to ignore.
- [30:55]
B
Do you remember who said it?
- [30:57]
A
A lot of people, actually. A lot of people. But then, you know, like, you ignore these, you know, these advice, and you just keep going through.
- [31:06]
B
I'm curious how this conversation is, because I have. I'm sure I've had those conversations too. I'm sure people told me, don't do it. They don't come, though, in those words, though. They don't come and don't do it words. That's how we take it. But there's usually they come in different forms of language, like.
- [31:23]
A
Right. Some of.
- [31:24]
B
You sure you want to do that? Are you. You know, do you. You know, what do you know about that business? Like, what do you know about that? That's basically the same kind of saying the same thing. But did yours actually get don't do it?
- [31:36]
A
Not. Not in that directness. But you know me, I'm direct. But it could be sometimes coming from someone very close, a loved one, someone who cares about you, that they're worried that you might be going, you know, to make a decision that's going to have some hardship come with it, and are you sure that's where you want to go? Just don't do it.
- [31:59]
B
Yeah.
- [32:00]
A
Stay on the safe side.
- [32:01]
B
A lot of times, what I'm. What I feel. And I think this is super relevant for people listening to this too, that are thinking about wanting. Maybe they're. They're starting their business, obviously, or they're watching. This is. That's very normal. It'd be weird if everyone cheered you on, probably, wouldn't it?
- [32:17]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [32:18]
B
It'd be kind of weird because you're kind of going into the uncertainty and you're going into. You're betting fully more. More definitely on yourself, and it's scary. And a lot of times people that love you, they. They love you so much that they want to protect you, and they know that starting a business is going to have pain and it's gonna have sleepless nights and it's gonna probably. They're probably gonna miss you A little bit more because your time is gonna be more focused on that versus maybe spending time with them. It'd be kind of weird if they didn't protect you from, try to protect you from that, wouldn't it?
- [32:53]
A
A hundred percent. One hundred percent.
- [32:56]
B
And that's why, if you really feel the calling, then do it. If you don't feel that calling, then you don't have to do it. It's. That's totally okay too. Yeah, thanks for sharing that. Who do you think should actually own a business? And who do you think shouldn't?
- [33:11]
A
I'm sorry?
- [33:12]
B
Who do you think should own a business?
- [33:14]
A
Anyone who's responsible enough to, to own a business and anyone with good intentions. Also, you know, my, my focus has always been on relationships more than transactions. So even though a business is a way to, to make money, but I always like to, you know, advise people that, you know, do something that benefits others for just solely doing it for your own good and not benefiting others around you. You probably, you should probably have a business.
- [33:53]
B
Yeah, I'd prefer those people don't have a business as well. I mean scammers and the quick. Make money. Shut up. Set up a, set up a store and then make money and then don't ship the product.
- [34:04]
A
Right.
- [34:04]
B
Or ship the product, but don't really care about the quality. I prefer if those guys don't own businesses as well.
- [34:10]
A
Yep, yep, exactly.
- [34:13]
B
Assad, where can people find you, follow you, learn more from you, connect with you.
- [34:18]
A
So LinkedIn is a great place. I'm there. They can check out my website funneledforward.com.
- [34:28]
B
Beautiful. And guys, for anyone listening to this, we will share Assad's links in the description in the show notes below. Assad, thank you so much for coming on.
- [34:37]
A
Really appreciate it. Thank you for having me.
- [34:39]
B
Totally. We'll have to get you back on again in the future and get an update on kind of where you are and, and what the email marketing and copywriting and what has changed with AI and AI landscape and I'm sure that's all changed.
- [34:50]
A
That's a whole different story. Yeah.
- [34:52]
B
Have you. Next time. Thanks, Azad.
- [34:54]
A
Definitely. Take care.