← Built Online
Built Online
How Anyone Can Develop The Mindset Of A Multi-Million Dollar Entrepreneur | ft. Jacob Hicks
00:45:23
Loading summary
Transcript99 lines
- [00:00]
A
And I feel like we can get caught up in the whirlwind or what I like to call chaos in like your day to day. But you can also get caught up in it in a larger term picture. Meaning if you have several days, several weeks in a row where all you're doing is just caught up in like the big things that are like, not really helping drive the business forward, then ultimately you're not living with intentionality.
- [00:21]
B
Welcome to Built online. I'm Cody McGuffey and this podcast is all about one thing. Building the business of your dreams. Selling art, teaching classes, starting a blog, launching a brand. Whatever your passion is, we show you how to turn it into real income. I created Ever Be to help anyone with a dream start and scale business.
- [00:42]
A
Ever Be, Ever be Ever be Ever be ever be.
- [00:45]
B
Everbee we now serve over 800,000 creators all across the globe. On this show, we bring on real entrepreneurs who done it. They share their secrets, they share their failures. The exact steps that you can take to get started. What if you can get one golden nugget out of today's episode and it's the breakthrough that takes you from just dreaming to actually living a life on your terms. At Everbee, we believe that every human is a creator, and every creator should own a business. Jacob, what's up, man? How are you?
- [01:13]
A
I'm doing great. Cody. Thanks so much for having me today. Happy to be here.
- [01:16]
B
Super happy to have you too. We've already chatted a little bit before this. Really excited about our conversation. It's going to be, I know we're going to go deep on a bunch of probably a bunch of things, but specifically, I feel like we share a lot of mindset. I just feel like that vibe for sure. Would you agree?
- [01:32]
A
Yeah, I mean, 100. We were, like I said, we were kind of talking offline and the more and more I've gotten into like just the entrepreneur game, especially the like the solopreneur kind of game, the more I've realized that obviously, I mean, you can, you know, stack skills, you can stack your attack, you can stack, you know, gain different tools, have different the right people around you, but all of it, I think all of it really comes down to your mindset and just like where you are emotionally. And you're going to have some really, really great highs, you're going to have some really, really hard lows sometimes. So just figuring out how to get through those is I think the main thing.
- [02:02]
B
I think it's completely agree. I was sharing with you earlier that some of the majority of people that listen to this are like, chapter one or chapter two of their. Of their entrepreneurial journey.
- [02:12]
A
Yeah.
- [02:12]
B
And to me, I just say those words, Chapter one, chapter two. But basically, it's like, this is your first company, maybe second company, maybe you've sold a company, but probably not. Like, this is probably your first go at this thing. And the learning curve for the first chapter is so steep, but it gets. It gets. You get better at it. Chapter two, because. Because in chapter one, everything is new. Like, resistance to your product, resistance to your service. You're battling yourself. Like, how resilient am I? Um, you're battling people around you, like, your friends and family, like, ones closest to you, like that love you. They're sharing, like that you probably shouldn't do this, or it's too risky. You're battling so many things. I'm curious, you. You coach a lot of people in this. In this world. What are some of the things that you notice amongst. What are some of the challenges that you're noticing with your students?
- [03:10]
A
So, I mean, you kind of. I mean, you really hit the nail on the head, and I think. I mean, you're gonna have. You're gonna have resistance. You're Go have, like, people that reject what you have to offer. And just. So I think the biggest thing that people are. People struggle with is that. Is. It's what I. What I kind of boil down to identity, meaning that, you know, hey, I've started this business. I really, really love this. I think this is my passion. This is what I want. This is what I wanted to do all my life sometimes, right? And you meet some people that are just nasty, just, like, treating you like crap or whatever the case might be. But the important thing. This is, like, this is kind of a sales technique, too, that I teach sometimes. It's. It's. If somebody says, you know, hey, I. You say to them, I have. I have this offer. I think it could make sense for you. And they're like, no, I don't. I. I don't think so at all. Like, I don't want to buy this thing from you. Or if they say something just, like, awful to you, I mean, that isn't them rejecting you. That is almost most of the time saying, this isn't the right time for me. And just having that kind of mindset going into all of those kind of conversations. It's.
- [04:09]
B
It's.
- [04:10]
A
I mean, it's kind of a. Like a di. A really odd dynamic that we have to walk into on some of these Conversations where we have to kind of walk in with low expectations, but we have to be prepared for the best. Right? So, like, just having all these things kind of just like, floating around in our head can be really hard sometimes. I mean, it's kind of funny. Like, I had an experience a while back where, you know, I was doing, like, I'm a sales guy, you know, at heart, so I'm okay doing some, like, cold outreach and just reaching out to people and just seeing if, you know, business makes sense or not. And if they tell me, no, you know, no big deal. But, I mean, I had a. I had a guy who, again, it was just a cold, cold touch, just saying, like, you know, hey, this is what I do. You know, I. I just want to see if we could chat and see if it made sense or not. Right. And his first response, not knowing me from Adam, was, you're an idiot. That's exactly what he said verbatim. And then he proceeded to list out all the reasons why I was an idiot and why I should give up and why I should never be doing this, the success coaching thing. And, you know, kind of knocked me for a loop for a minute because, I mean, I'm used to getting told no, but I'm not used to just that kind of vitriol. And I realized, you know, in reflecting, I mean, I came up with some strategies and stuff around this afterwards, of course, but I realized that those kind of people, that says much, much more about them than it does about me. And at the end of the day, the haters, the people that are not really not supporting you, like, they're more antagonistic than anything else. Those kind of people, they don't punch down, they only punch up. Meaning that those are the people that see what you're doing. Maybe they're intimidated by it. Maybe they are angry at themselves for not pursuing something similar in their own lives. So they want to hit you to make themselves feel better. And at the end of the day, it's not always relevant.
- [05:52]
B
I agree. I think it's interesting because I think about haters of the world, right? And us starting ever be for. And we, you know, been building ever be for three and a half years, um, you get your fair share of nasty haters. Even though you're trying to actually do something intentionally, very good for the world. It's so interesting, right? When you're building a company, like, you're going on a limb, you're building your product, your service, and you genuinely want to help people. And then when you get A hater that comes in and basically calls you, like you said, an idiot or something like this. It can. It can have an effect to the point where you're just like, huh, Am I like my properly? Is this supposed to be like this? And then, of course, just like anything, the more you pres. Like, the more you just kind of push through it, eventually you realize like, you're. That's gonna happen anyway. And that's actually part of the process in a weird way to where if you don't have haters, then. Then you're probably not even pushing hard enough.
- [06:46]
A
Honestly, um, I would hold 100% agree with you. I. I mean, I love what you're saying. Like, I mean, like, in sales, we. I grew. I came up in sales selling suits for a long time. And the way that I was taught to sell is that we go for no, meaning that I keep offering and presenting things to you until you tell me no. And that's just kind of the mindset that I came up with really early on in my sales career. And I think that's exactly what you were just saying. You got to push a little bit, and you have to. The easiest thing that the biggest mindset shift for people, especially early on in a sales career, but also in just entrepreneurship in general, is that as far as clientele goes or like selling things, we want anybody and everybody, right? Like anybody that has a dollar, that's a good dollar. But the truth is that that is not true. We don't want anybody and everybody. We want the right people at the right time. Meaning that if you are selling something for, you know, $500 and you sell it to somebody, and that guy is just a huge, huge, huge pain in the butt, and he treats you like crap, and he treats your staff like crap, and he doesn't show up on time and all this kind of stuff is really disrespectful. You would rather probably not have that guy's 500 right now. Again, early on, we have to kind of balance this out between I've gotta. I gotta pay my bills and. But I'm still trying to grow the business. But eventually we kind of hit a threshold where we can be pickier and choosier and we have to find our people. And I mean, that's a big part of the journey too.
- [08:07]
B
I completely agree. I think that the lesson here that is just continue to persist no matter what, right? And. And that's just part of the journey and get more of those haters. And it's probably. You're gonna be, you're gonna, you're callousing yourself. You're gonna get stronger every single time you get a no. And then you're gonna learn more about which person you actually want to say yes or not. And yeah, I completely agree with, with, with that it's been true in my life. I want to take a step back for a second and ask about your background. Yeah, maybe like the, you know, the short story, of course, because we all have long stories. But, but of, of who Jacob is and how'd you get to where you are today?
- [08:45]
A
Yeah. So as we're kind of talking offline, I'm a small town, Iowa guy at heart. I grew up in a, a small, small town in southwest Iowa. Moved to the quote unquote big city. After that, I lived in Des Moines for about five and a half, six years now. Came up and say, I've been selling or sales for 10, 12 years, something like that. Now I've done a, I've had a pretty eclectic working history. Um, like I said, came up selling suits, did that for a long time, did some various different things, did some outside sales gigs as well. But I realized the reason that I guess I'm at where I'm at is I realized that to some degree, I've always been coaching. Like, I was always the guy that my friends came to, like, hey, I'm thinking about starting a new job, or I'm thinking about starting a business, or, you know, I'm just working through some of these things. I was always kind of that guy that they came to, to talk about various business things. And my, the honest truth is my passion is for other people to be elevated like I want to. If, like, that's why I'm doing a podcast like yours, and that's why I do my own podcast. And that's why, you know, I'm writing stuff on my blog and putting stuff out on socials. Like, if there's something that I can do that somebody can consume in, you know, 30 seconds or whatever it is that will help to elevate them, then I will do that. It was kind of a left, you know, a curveball for me. I was, I've always been really passionate about, um, you know, improving myself and just finding new and better ways to do things just in life in general. And I sat down with a friend of mine, a guy who I've known for several years. He's a, he's a success coach as well, just to see if getting coaching personally made sense. It would help me, you know, get to where I wanted to go. And during the course of our first conversation, he's like, listen, Jacob, like, like, we can absolutely, you know, do coaching. We can definitely, you know, help you get to where you want to go, but I think you should be a coach. And again, that kind of threw me for a loop a little bit. But like, it's really kind of a sweet spot for me because I get to, I love working one on one with people. That's my favorite thing where I get to dive really, really deep into. I mean, obviously a lot of times it's sales related topics that they're trying to improve on or get better at or whatever. But a lot of the time too, it's also like, hey, yeah, I want to sell more or I want to do better in my business, but I also want to make sure that the time I am spending with my kids is really, really intentional. And like, some of those things where I think I would argue that those things might be more important all over the course of, you know, your lifetime.
- [11:12]
B
I think they all work together.
- [11:14]
A
Yeah.
- [11:14]
B
Typically, the better the, this is my experience. At least the better founder, the better business owner that you are, a lot of times it translates to the better father that you are, the better mother that you are. Little is people can throw a bunch of wrenches in that one and try to debunk it, and that's fine. They can. But I'm saying, like, if you're a great business owner, you understand how to delegate, you understand where, where your time is important, where to prioritize time, where to not prioritize time. And typically that translates right into the family household.
- [11:44]
A
Yes.
- [11:45]
B
Because like, you know that sometimes you just like shouldn't, you should be at this event and you shouldn't be doing this or you, you all of a sudden you're coaching your kids. Like, just like you would coach an employee and a team member, you're coaching them through it. You're not just telling them what to do. You're trying to teach them how to think something. Think through something.
- [12:01]
A
Yep. Critical thinking. Yeah, Yeah. I, I, I love, I love what you're saying. Because I think, and personally like what I've experienced in my own life, but then also with, you know, clientele and just in business in general is, I think it comes down to your why, like, why are you doing what you're doing? And a lot of the times, at least, you know, in the sales world, it can be like, hey, I'm trying to earn more money. And sure, like, there's not, not anything necessarily wrong with that, but I can. I call that a soft why? Meaning like I want to earn more money. I call that a soft why. Because when I mean sales is cyclical, right. Like we have really, really good highs and we have really low lows sometimes. So when you're in a low and you're not making sales or you're having just a really hard time of it is is I just want to earn more money going to get you through that kind of hard time and that suck. And I think understanding like yes, I want to earn more money but because this is going to do X, Y and Z for my kids. This is going to allow my family these kind of opportunities. This is going to allow me to take care of my mom in a better way. Like those are the harder wise that will help you get through some of the, the low valleys that we can experience.
- [13:04]
B
I agree with you. It's almost like when, when we started out, when I started out my just my career. I want to make a hundred thousand dollars a year just as a round number. It was very easy. It's very tangible. It's like that just. That equals success to me. Yeah, when you're 18 or 21 years old, which I think is, is good. At least I have a direction. At least I have a hard number that I'm chasing rather than just kind of floating through life. But it doesn't, it didn't really make a big difference until I started to attach. Why did I want a hundred thousand dollars per year? And fortunately I was always kind of. I think I was lucky to understand those things pretty early on. But I wanted to like serve my family. I wanted to take care. I wanted to pick up the lunch bills for people and then dinners. I wanted to be able to donate, you know, here and there a little bit. I wanted to do xyz. Xyz. And. And so those things actually built. They stacked the why so strong to where yes, I would probably answer like my goal is $100,000 a year. But really it was, it was backed up with so much of this emotional, emotional information that made it almost inevitable that you would hit that. And it's true. And it's exactly what happened then you, then you move the goalpost and you move on. So do you think that people struggle with that actually, like their why actually being backed up with some of that stuff?
- [14:20]
A
I really, really do. Every time that I take on a new client, I have, I have an exercise that we do. Obviously we're like they'll come to me saying, okay, I'm trying to, like you said, I'm trying to get to $100,000 a year, whatever. Like they had like some of those goals and things and we work on those things, of course. But the first exercise that I always start people off with is what I call the interview. And this is, this is a long term visioning exercise where you say like, hey, it's five years from now, somebody wants to interview you for X, Y and Z, whatever. And there's a handful of questions just to put you in the mindset of, okay, it's five years from now, what do you want life to look like? So it's not like, okay, what kind of business have you built? I mean, those are important things. But like one of the questions I always ask is, what is an ideal day for you? And it's been five years from now. What does an ideal day really look like for you? And for most people it's not like, oh my gosh, you know, an ideal day is I Woke up at 6:00, I was in the office by 6:30. I worked 15 hours. I came home exhausted. I didn't get to see my kids, I didn't get to see my wife. That's not usually what they're telling me. It's usually like I don't have to work nearly as hard as I used to. I get to spend all this, all this time, I maybe have a, you know, a vacation home in Colorado or whatever. So like, they really start to figure out like, that's really what I want. And most people just don't understand, really. I mean, saying that we're very common, saying that we have in sales is start with the end in mind. And most people aren't they, they think, okay, I mean, goals are great, but they have to be building towards something. They have to be building towards your vision of what life really should be looking like. And we talk about, you know, work life balance, right? A lot. And I mean for me, Per, I kind of, I've kind of redefined work life balance. I feel like it used to mean like I got in at 9, I left at 5. I never took work home, right? Nothing, nothing wrong with that. But I believe like there's going to be seasons in life where like you start a new business, right? And you have to, you, you got to show up and you got to grind because if you don't get it done, it doesn't get done, right. Like there's going to be seasons in life like that. There's also Going to be seasons in life where maybe you can just work your night like work at a 9 to 5. So just finding that balance I think is really, really critical and a long term vision is absolutely crucial to, to understanding what is you want to do and why you want to do it.
- [16:30]
B
Completely agree with you. The work life balance is an interesting thing too. At ever be we refuse to call it work life balance for the same reason because it's like, it's so old school and it's like this balance equals balance and things just aren't. That's not life balance. Life isn't balanced all times. And so what we call is work life integration.
- [16:49]
A
Love it.
- [16:50]
B
And you've probably heard it before and, and it, it paints the picture perfectly for, for us is like there are times, like you said, where you're starting a business and like you are not balanced and there's times where your business is, is, is cruising. And yeah, you can lean into your family even more. You know, you could lean into a passion project, a backyard project even more. And there's times where you bring work home. There's times where you actually open up the laptop in front of the Netflix show and do that. And that's completely in my eyes, it's completely okay. And it's actually expected to win.
- [17:24]
A
Yeah.
- [17:25]
B
But it's also means that like during the workday sometimes where your kid has an event, you can bail out of the office for a minute.
- [17:32]
A
Yeah. Or is sick or whatever.
- [17:33]
B
Sick. Exactly. Or if your wife needs support or your husband needs a little bit support during the day, whatever it is like you can kind of bail out for a little bit. And, and this is just ebbs and flows of life. And some people call that work life balance. I don't, I would call that work life integration. And I think it's just the new way of, of operating in 2020.
- [17:50]
A
I, I really love that because I mean it's, I mean we talk about work and life is separate and it's all life at the end of the day. Right. And if you have, if you have a job like a W2 would, I mean we've all had them. Right. If you have like your W2 job and you have like an awful, awful boss, usually that translates to my life kind of sucks in general a little bit. Right. I'm not having, I'm just stressed out all the time. I don't feel good, all that kind of stuff. But when it comes to like this, you know, work life integration as you say, which I really like that I Think it really, like, really what it comes down to is, is very. Being very intentional is. It's the intentionality around what we're doing. So if you are in a season where you have to work, you know, 10, 12, 15 hour days, I mean, do that, but do it intentionally and do it for a season. You can't do that for 10 years. Like, that'll burn you out. And it'll also burn you out if you aren't intentional around what you're doing in that time. And intentionally resting, I think that's something that we can lose sight of sometimes. And for me, intentionally resting means making sure that I am doing just that. Like, I'm taking at least like an hour or two at the end of my day to watch some stupid show on Netflix just to let my mind relax, making sure that I'm sleeping well, and then making sure that I have at least one day a week where I totally unplug. Like, obviously there's always going to be things to do, but for me, I take Sundays off as much as I possibly can, meaning that, you know, I'll go to church with my mom and the rest of the day I'm just hanging out, relaxing, you know, hanging with my friends or whatever the case might be. That way on Monday, I'm ready to go.
- [19:16]
B
I completely agree with that. I love that you mentioned intentionality. And I would consider myself if somebody asked me, one of my key things that I, I value about myself, I guess you'd say is like my intentionality, like I'm, I'm intentional with, with everything too. But I, I thought that this was like a common thing amongst people. I just thought it was like common knowledge. I realized as you get older, you're like, oh, no, it's actually not at all. The more conversations that you have with future business owners or up and coming entrepreneurs or whatever it is. Intentionality is actually something that they struggle with or they don't even know that they're struggling with it. And then it typically leads me to this question of like, what's your. What's. What are you trying to do in this life that you got here? You know, why is, why are you in this business? And they kind of like, they don't know where to go from there.
- [20:03]
A
Yeah, well, I mean, that's so, that's kind of what we were talking about before. Like, that's why I start people off with the interview exercise, because they're not intentional. Like, they have the work. Well, it's kind of. So there's, there's a really, really great book and I forget who it's by now. I have to apologize. But it's called the four Disciplines of Execution. And it's one that I read early on in my, my career. And it's really kind of changed things for me because they talk about getting caught up in the whirlwind and usually they talk about it in the sense of like day to day, meaning that, you know, you're, you have this, your day planned out, ready to go, you have certain tasks you're trying to get accomplished, and then somebody calls you with some, you know, huge problem or other that you have to deal with with some urgency, right? Like it just blows your day up. And I feel like we can get caught up in the whirlwind or what I like to call chaos in like your day to day. But you can also get caught up in it in a larger term picture. Meaning that if you have several days, several weeks in a row where all you're doing is just caught up in like the big things that are like, not really helping drive the business forward, then ultimately you're not living with intentionality and there's not going to be that intentionality in your business. So finding the purpose, finding like why you're really doing what you're doing, like I said before, it's, it's absolutely, it's hugely critical and you have to revisit it too. You can't just do it like a one off where you're saying, like, okay, well my ideal day is this, right? And then, all right, that's it. You know, you got to revisit it time and again to keep it emotionally driven because like, the mind doesn't know what's real and what's not. So if we just tell ourselves the same story, what our ideal day is over and over again, then eventually we're gonna start living it.
- [21:33]
B
I completely agree with you. I was thinking about this and I think it's important. I, I, I, I've done a lot of these vision exercises for my life and of course for the business and, but I do remember specifically at a time not that long ago, probably five years ago, where I didn't know how to have a vision. You know what I mean? Like the tactical stuff of like, okay, Jacob, Cody, like you guys are saying, like, you need to have a vision for your life. You need to have like, be intentional with what you want out of your life. But like, how do you do that and how do you know if you're doing the right things and And I remember literally googling sometimes, like, how to have a vision. You know, like, chatgpt wasn't here yet. You guys remember?
- [22:11]
A
Like, yeah, if I remember back in the day, right?
- [22:14]
B
Yeah, back in the day, you actually had to think through and like, sort through articles. And I'm like, and you read books and you. But it's not, it's not, not clear of how to have a vision for your life. So what I did personally is just through conversations with other people and like, kind of asking the same question. But what I've learned is that for me, I need quiet time. It's usually like super in the morning, 3:30, 4. 4:30 in the morning, where everything's quiet. I'm not thinking about the business. I'm not thinking about my family. They're all sleeping. And I think about what do I want in my life? Like, literally describe the ideal life and what you said is ideal day, which is even better. It's more, you know, in the greens. And I'd be like, what do I want? Oh, I want like, freedom. What does that mean? Financial freedom, location freedom, time freedom. What else does that mean? Health, happiness, love, lovely marriage, kids that are happy and healthy. A business that's thriving, doing millions of dollars per year. And then it's like, what it, what it does, it makes you put only the important things on the list. Everything else that. The chaos of life that comes in kind of like they, they, they get filtered out.
- [23:22]
A
Yeah.
- [23:22]
B
Like, and then when you get a business opportunity or you get this, this friend that wants to start a business that doesn't align with your ideal life, it's very easy to just be like, that's awesome, man, but that's, that's not the right time for me. Or if you get this job offer that you're like, I should take it next to $20,000 a year, but it doesn't align with my ideal life and doesn't fit in here. Like, it's easy to be like, no, I'm, I'm on this path over here. And that's intentionality. Um, now going back to the question here, there's a question here, believe it.
- [23:52]
A
Or not, love it.
- [23:55]
B
What do you think people should do in order to craft their ideal day or life? Whatever one you want to talk about.
- [24:02]
A
So what I always recommend to people is, is get into the weeds a little bit. So it's so easy to say, like, it's so, like, take that question like the ideal day. Right. It's so easy to take that question as, you know, kind of a throwaway question where you say, okay, well, you know, in five years, my ideal day is, you know, let's say it's a Saturday or whatever. I wake up, you know, I kiss the wife, maybe we make breakfast, we hang out with the kids all day. Like, I mean, that's a good day, right? Nothing wrong with that. But really, really get into the weeds with it. And what I always try to push people is when they're doing this exercise with me is to push people for more. So sit down and like, you know, open like a Word document or something and write like, what is my ideal day? At the very top. And then try to fill the entire page. Fill the entire page with as much as you can. Not necessarily just like, I did this and I do that, and then we do this, then we do that, don't do that, but, like, really get into the emotions of it. Say, like, okay, I wake up on a Saturday after an incredible week. I, you know, I kiss the wife good morning. And then like, what does that really feel like? Feeling like you, like, had an incredible week in your business and your work and whatever you are doing, and you get to wake up with, you know, the partner you've chosen in life. Like, what does that feel like? And then you, like, so you wake up and then, okay, what are you going to do with your morning? Maybe again, just making stuff up here. Like, maybe you guys are going to go to the park for the morning. It's a beautiful day outside, so you decide to go to the park after breakfast. Okay, so what is it like to sit on the bench with your significant other and watch your kids, you know, playing the playground? What does that really feel like? And then again, I. So th. This is part of, like, part. Part of mine. What I wrote for, because I do this exercise too, is I. I like to be really intentional with, like, my personal finances. And like, that's like. I believe personal finance is like the, the platform on which you build all wealth wherever it might come from. So, like, for me, in my ideal day, it's to like, sit down and like, maybe like once a month or whatever it is, I sit down with my wife and we talk through, like, our personal financial situation to see kind of how things are going. And like that, like, that kind of intentionality is like, really, really important to me because I know that those kind of meetings will help drive us toward forward into the future. So, like, just like, like, again, like, that's like, that's part of my, like my ideal day. But, like, really sit down and figure, like, what does it really look like for me? And like, why is it so important? It's like I said, get into the weeds as much as you possibly can. Because like we want to focus first on the what. We need to focus on the what. Like where are we really going? And like that ideal day, even though that's like a small piece, a small snapshot of own overall life, if we're driving towards that in a consistent manner, then ultimately again we're gonna probably get there. But focus on the what first and then worry about the how later. And then the, the piece that can be easy to miss here is that let's say you sit down for. Let's say it takes you a couple of hours to sit down with that one question and really flesh out what your ideal day looks like. That's fantastic. I love that kind of work. But then revisit it. Don't do it like as a one off. Like I said before, find 5, 10, 15 minutes at least once a week. If not, maybe every day if you can manage it, where you sit down and just read through it. Because feeling those emotions, putting yourself into that kind of into your own story really at the end of the day will again help you drive forward into whatever is you're doing, particularly if you're having a hard time of it.
- [27:13]
B
I completely agree with all this. And there's the cool thing is you can you ask if you're listening to this, um, and you hear Jacob here is you don't have to copy every single thing that Jacob does. Like you'll. You'll notice that you'll find your own creative way of doing this that gives you energy using this type of framework of like. Yeah, the point that, that I, I want someone listening to this, taking take away is just do it.
- [27:37]
A
Yes.
- [27:38]
B
Sit down and do take the 10 minutes to do this and it'll probably turn into an hour if you're really in a flow. And sometimes it turns into three hours for me. Like, sometimes it just literally like it. It takes three takes me and it carries me. Cause I get so excited about it. But you don't have to worry about that yet.
- [27:53]
A
Yeah, well, if I could just.
- [27:55]
B
Sorry.
- [27:55]
A
If I could just add to that, I think again, I mean we've talked about this quite a bit already, but that comes. That circles back around to the intentionality piece like we were talking about before. This is like, this is intentional work. Like this isn't something you can just throw in at the end of the day. This is something I I would have to imagine, Cody, this is probably, this would probably be something you would be doing during your quiet time, like first thing early in the morning, first thing in the morning. So you gotta, you gotta actually like, like sit down, find time either with yourself or your spouse or whatever and like find that 10, 15, 20, half an hour, whatever. Find that time in your calendar, even if it means you have to get up a little bit earlier and actually schedule it out and hold to hold yourself accountable to that appointment.
- [28:30]
B
Completely agree. And here's the thing. If you don't do this, the stakes are high. Like, people don't even realize how high these stakes are. If you don't decide which direction with clarity on what you want out of this life, guess what? Like, you're going to get pushed around in the sea. Like, picture yourself on a boat and you're the captain of the ship and you got your family and your wife next to you right on the ship and you're just kind of like out there and you're like, let's go, we're gonna get on the boat. And they're like, where are you going? There's like, find out. Like, would you ever do that? You would never do that. You'd have the map, you'd have a direction, you'd have a clarity on where you're trying to go. You'd have a compass in your hand. And if you do not, then guess what, you'll be out there drifting and drifting and eventually you're gonna get pushed around so far you're gonna end up in the rocks. And it's. The stakes are not only for you are in the rocks. Your entire family are in the rocks too.
- [29:29]
A
Yeah.
- [29:29]
B
How important I think this is, I think it's extremely important.
- [29:32]
A
I, I absolutely, absolutely agree. And if I can just like pair it off of your analogy a little bit. The analogy that I often use with, with folks when I'm talking about these kind of things is the like, like asking yourself, like, the bigger picture, the hard. Like sometimes, I mean, sometimes this kind of future visioning can be really uncomfortable because you've never done it before. And then you realize after sitting out and doing it, you're like, oh my gosh, I am way off track. Right. But it's, it's hugely important. Like the analogy that I use is asking yourself these bigger picture, these harder questions. And doing the work is building the boat. And then the work that you do in your day to day life and your day to day business is what makes the boat float. You have to have, you have to have both together. But I mean if you're not intentional about building your boat, then you're just, you know, swimming on a plank and hoping for the best.
- [30:19]
B
Love this. So the takeaways here are literally carve out five minutes today, not tomorrow. Yep, today. Get a piece of pen, get a paper out. A piece of pen or a pen and a piece of paper or your, your computer. And this is a very important. I think, I'm curious what you think about this. I think the documentation is actually one of the most important parts. Like you need to document this. Do you agree?
- [30:43]
A
Yes, a hundred percent. So, so like I said, I like this is kind of a longer exercise. There's usually about, well, 5 to 10ish questions depending on the clientele that I'm working with. But at the very end of it, once we've gone through all of the questions and we've really talked through everything, what I always have people do is, is find some way to honor it. Meaning like, and that's going to mean different things for different people. For me personally, like I went out and bought like a, like a nicer binder, little like leather bound binder and I printed everything out and then I put it in there and then I review it every, every week. But finding some way to honor in some way because, because this isn't, this isn't just an exercise to make you feel good. This isn't an exercise, you know, just to get you thinking in a larger way. It definitely can be those things. But we're talking about actually building the life that you actually say that you want. And, and if that's the truth, then why wouldn't we want to honor it in some way, particularly as we're revisiting it, you know, week in and week out.
- [31:39]
B
I agree. I was having this conversation with somebody that I love recently too. I had this conversation many, many times and. But it's always been the repeat conversation. You know, we've all had those where you like, you kind of repeat it for over 10 years, 15 years. And, and the truth is like I kind of asked again, hey, like I kind of kind of shared like did you have a direction? Like do you have an ideal life that you're trying to build to, to. Because if you don't like you have to start there. Everything else is just the how all the business everything fills, fits into like building that. What? Building that life that you want.
- [32:13]
A
Yeah.
- [32:14]
B
Nurse like, well, yeah, I think about it all the time. I'm like, ah, that's Good. But it's not good enough. You can't just think about something because our thoughts are wild. Like, our thoughts will go over here, over here, over here. They'll run you wild. So that's why it's really important, dude. Literally. And they're just like, well, I don't know what you mean. Then how. How do I write it down? I said get the pen.
- [32:35]
A
Yeah.
- [32:36]
B
Get the paper.
- [32:37]
A
Right.
- [32:38]
B
Write down what you want. Simple. Start there. You know? Start there. I. I want a healthy body. Ah, perfect. What does healthy mean to you? You know, and you start defining it.
- [32:50]
A
Yeah. And like I was gonna say, because, I mean, everything means something different to everybody else. Right. Like success. Right. Like, I mean, you know, I'm sure it's like the word success probably floats around your company as much as it floats around mine. Like, it's kind of like, it's always, like, kind of in the fringes. Right. The word success, like, what does it like? No, success. We got to get more success. Whatever. But success means a ton of different things to a ton of different people, and it will change over the course of your life. So, like, again, success, like, early on in a business will probably mean my business is still around, and it's still, you know, providing enough income for me that I can afford to live. Right. That's great. Success can also mean I've grown my business from zero to seven, eight, whatever. Figures like that absolutely can be success. Success can also be. You know, I spent 20 years building this business. It's really, really great. And now I've decided to hire a CEO so I can step back and spend a ton of time with my. My friends and my family, and I can pursue, you know, my other passions. It can absolutely mean that, too. So just being willing to allow, like, understand that these things aren't going to be set in stone, and that's why it's so important to revisit these things. Like, it's because we. We will lose sight of it if we don't stay in touch with what we're ultimately driving towards.
- [33:58]
B
Completely agree. Yeah. The way I look at it, it's like a living document.
- [34:02]
A
Yes.
- [34:03]
B
Like, it's always something that I'm changing and playing with. I break it sometimes. I put things on there that I'm like, a week later, I'm like, why the hell was that even on there? Yeah, beyond there. You know, and that's part of the process, though. It's like, you have to kind of. You have to t. You have to taste it a little bit. Of like, do I want that? Hmm. Okay. And then all of a sudden you're like, I don't want 10,000 acres. You know, it's like, you know, but somebody does. And that's cool. But, like, the point was, like, I don't even actually want that. I don't think. You know, and so it's. You kind of have to go back and forth and do this dance, and I think that's part of it. So I would say start. Start there. Write it down. And write it down for anything that you can think of. Don't put this extra amount of pressure on yourself of. It needs to be perfect. It's not perfect. It won't be perfect. Don't even worry about perfection here. Just write down what you want. It could be wrong.
- [34:49]
A
Yeah. And let. Give yourself permission to. Give yourself permission to dream. Like, say, like, hey, what. What is it? What is it that I really want? And if you don't honestly know the answer, that's okay. I mean, what. We've all gone through periods in our life where we don't know. We don't know where we want to go. So, like, give yourself permission not to know and give yourself permission to dream. And that's, again, why we need to revisit these things and why we need to honor them. Because ultimately, that is a life that we are hoping and trying to build.
- [35:17]
B
Completely agree. And this could be. We're spending way, way so much more time on this than I thought we would. But it's. I think it's well worth it. I think it's really fun, the conversation to have. And if it helps just one person, it's well worth it. I. This can mean financial stuff. It could mean health stuff we talked about. It could also mean spiritual stuff. Like, if you want to have a deep relationship with your God, with. With. With Jesus, in my case, and your God, if you're in another country or another. Another area, it can be that, like, I have a deep relationship with. With my God, right. And, like, I have a personal relationship with. With him or her. And. And it can absolutely be that. And when it comes to the finances part of the business or your personal finances, it could be very material, too. It doesn't have to be only, like, material isn't necessarily bad either. If you want to buy your wife or your husband a car, put it on the list.
- [36:09]
A
That's cool.
- [36:10]
B
Like, there's nothing wrong with having nice stuff. So that's. I would encourage people to do that.
- [36:16]
A
Yeah. So, I mean, I love that, and I Mean, we talked about it a bunch already, but I mean, it comes down to the intentionality piece of it. You know, my, my faith is like, very important to me as well said, you know, I've, you know, personal relationship with Jesus and God too. And like, it all comes down to just, I figured out, gosh, I don't know, seven, eight, whatever years ago that people have, people make time for the things they want to make time for. So whatever you, like, choose to actually spend your time on, that's, that's what you're going to be doing. And for me, it's spending, you know, a bunch of time on my business. It's having incredible conversations, you know, like, with you today, Cody. And it's also spending time with the Word and going to church and stuff. Like, that's really important to me. And like, that's part of the ideal life that I ultimately win a lead. I, I, I saw a video. You mentioned the car. I saw a video the other day of, I, I don't know what business it was, but it was like some, like, one of this guy's employees had been with the company for like, 40 years, and at some point the owner had promised him a Chevelle, and I think he was retiring this employee. And he gave him like, a little, like, you know, a nice one. Like a little like, model, you know, like metal model, metal model of a Chevelle. And then he pulled the car out of the box and underneath was a set of keys and then a Chevelle rolled in.
- [37:30]
B
Wow.
- [37:30]
A
So, like, being able to do, like, super, I mean, that's a, that's a super cool thing to be able to do in a business world. Right? Like, people don't do that anymore. They used to, I feel like they used to give cars away all the time, but they never do. So, I mean, doing that kind of stuff, obviously it's a material thing for sure, but I mean, like, is that employee ever going to forget what that guy did for him? And is everybody else that was in that room, all the other employees, they're also never going to forget it. Like, that's, I mean, that's a hugely impactful and incredible thing to do. But again, it's, it's a material world which we can look down on sometimes.
- [37:57]
B
Totally. I'm curious because I haven't had this conversation here, and I wasn't expecting to go here, but considering, like, sounds like you're Christian. Sounds like.
- [38:05]
A
Yeah.
- [38:07]
B
And we, I was just having this conversation with my nephew and my brother who were in town who were younger and we were talking about money and like, religion or, you know, Christianity and, you know, the whole adage, the old adage of like, the money is root of all evil. And what we were, we were kind of chopping that up and like, is wealth bad or wealth good or is wealth doesn't matter? Like, God doesn't care about whether you're wealthy or not. He just wants your heart. And so we were kind of chopping this up. And I'm curious, what is, what is your view on this? Because obviously you're a business person in business for yourself.
- [38:40]
A
Yeah.
- [38:40]
B
And you're also a follower of Christ. So what is your view?
- [38:44]
A
So my view. Well, first, like, the first thing I would say is that I, I don't think money is the root of all evil. I think the love of money is root of all evil. Meaning that. I mean, and I'm, I'm, I've been guilty of this before. Like, what I say often is that in my 20s, my passion was for profit. Like, whatever job I could find that would pay me, you know, an extra 10, 20, whatever grand a year, I was probably going to take that job.
- [39:07]
B
But I was curious, was that bad? Is that bad, though? Is that what, did you love money? Or is it because you had a purpose attached to that, that dollar?
- [39:14]
A
So I, I really don't think I had a purpose attached to it. Like, I mean, I came from a family. Like, we didn't have a whole, like, I don't know, we didn't have a whole, whole ton growing up and like, getting to the idea of, like, you know, making a certain amount of money and just being able to do all the stuff that I ever wanted to do was, was really what I wanted. Like, I just wanted, like, I. The older I've gotten, I've realized that when I say freedom, often what I'm really saying is discipline and, like, I feel like they're kind of synonymous. At least they are for me right now. But back then when I said freedom, it meant that I could just do whatever I wanted. I'd never had responsibilities. I didn't have to worry about stuff. And I mean, I don't know, is it necessarily a bad thing? But it wasn't good for me, is what I would say. Now I like, talk about, you know, some spiritual stuff here. I do believe that we are all given our various spiritual gifts. Right. And I do think that there are people in the world who, like, if you guys are familiar with, you know, scripture and stuff, there's a guy Called Barnabas. He was a, he was a wealthy guy and he was a wealthy guy during the early church and he would sell, I mean there's stories in the Bible where he sold off some land to support the church. And I do believe that there are people, good Christian people in the world who that is their spiritual gift. They're given the spiritual gift of earning a bunch of money. Now I also believe that, I mean, I mean it says in the, in the scriptures as well that to whom much is given, much is expected. Meaning that it can be so, so easy to realize, oh my gosh, I'm making, you know, six figures, I'm making seven figures, I'm making all of this money. We're doing so, so great. It can be so easy to lose sight of what again, what we're really trying to drive towards. So I mean, I guess they, I don't know if this is a roundabout way of saying, but I don't think that earning money is, is wrong as long as again, we are intentional with what we are doing with it.
- [41:00]
B
I agree, I agree for the most part probably I think we, we, we don't have enough time to like really chop this up in a million ways. I have a feeling that we very much see very, very eye to eye on this probably. And my view is similar to yours. My, my would say that as long as you're trying to do good with that money, you should go and get it.
- [41:19]
A
Yeah.
- [41:21]
B
And legal and like all that. Of course. Right. I'm always with, with that disclaimer. But like there is nothing wrong with going and trying to provide better for your family and for your community and for your friends and your loved ones.
- [41:33]
A
Yeah.
- [41:33]
B
Everything, everything like that is a per, that is your purpose on this, on this earth.
- [41:39]
A
Yeah.
- [41:39]
B
So if that means an extra twenty thousand dollar bump in your, in your income or you're trying to make a million dollars or ten million dollars or a billion dollars to me that's fine. Because if, when you're a great person with $10 in your bank account, dude, imagine what kind of great person you're going to be with with a billion dollars.
- [41:56]
A
Yeah. Like, and I'll say I'm a bit of a fan of, of Dave Ramsey who, I mean obviously he's a big financial guy. He talks about finance all the time. I'm not a financial coach, if anybody's listening. I'm not, that's not what I do. But I do believe that like some of the stuff I really, really like what he says where he talks about like, you know, more money you make, you just become more of the person you are.
- [42:17]
B
That's it.
- [42:18]
A
Where like, if you are a very generous person, if you have, like I said, 10 bucks in your bank account, you, you are going to be just as, if not more generous when you have a hundred or a hundred thousand or whatever else. So, I mean, I think you're absolutely right. Like, go, I mean, go earn, Go earn your money. And something else that Dave says I really, really love and I've found true in my own life is that the more money you earn, the more money you can give away. And like, if you're giving joyously, I mean, it's, it's an incredible thing because sometimes you might give somebody a grand because you had an extra grand laying around. You're like, I don't know what to do with this. And, and you just, I, it's just like I got, you know, a toss away. Like, you didn't even think about it. And that's the money that changed somebody's life. And it's so easy to forget about some of those things.
- [42:58]
B
I agree. I think it's unfortunate that I feel like in the, at least when I grew up, it was like, almost like in the religious community or the spiritual community. It's almost like people would make it feel like it's like more money is bad, is a bad thing, and you're selfish for having more money. And now that I'm older and now that I, I, I feel like I'm more wise and more, more mature, and I think the opposite, actually. I think they're actually selfish for not earning and being able to give away more. And I know that sounds bold, but, like, I think that it. Being poor and, and by choice by, like, because you think you're so righteous or like, you know what I mean? Because you, I think this, arguably, I think it's selfish. Yeah, you're not helping.
- [43:42]
A
Yeah, I, I mean, 100%, particularly because we're, whatever our spiritual gifts are, we are called to use them. So I mean, it's like, I mean, to call like some superhero movies. Like, I, like, I saw, I forget. Gosh, I forget which one I saw this in now. But it's like they said something to the effect of if you have the power to stop something and you choose not to, then it was your fault. So, I mean, like, being willing to step up and like, we're not, we're not all going to be called to step up in every, like, in the same way, we're all, we're all the body of Christ. Right. But we're. We're different parts and we're called to do different things. So. So being willing to do do the things that we're called to do, even when it's scary or intimidating or we're unsure or feel just uncertain in general, we've got to do it as much as we can.
- [44:26]
B
I agree. Totally agree. And we're all called for different things. And I agree. This has been an amazing conversation that went by way too fast. Where can people find you?
- [44:35]
A
So the easiest way to find me a couple of ways is through my website. It's just jacob picks coach.com. so I'm, I, I love the conversation. I love what you're. What you're doing here. Cody, if anybody out there listening would like to sit down with me for just like an hour of coaching just to see if anything makes sense or we can work through some things. So I would love to do that for all of your listeners. I also have my own podcast called Purpose Driven Progress. It's been out for, well, a few months now, but we've got a. I mean, a lot of great interviews, a lot of good tidbits and good nuggets on there for you guys.
- [45:05]
B
Beautiful. And by the way, if you're listening to this or watching this, it'll be. All these links will be in the show notes or in the description below. Jacob, thank you very much for coming on, man. I appreciate you.
- [45:15]
A
Yeah, Cody, thank you so much. It's been, yeah, fantastic.
- [45:17]
B
Awesome. Talk to you soon.
- [45:18]
A
Bye.