The Power of Taking Action: Insights From the Zero-to-One Entrepreneur with Jay Sapovits | Ep.98

Summary

Built Online Podcast Summary: Episode 98 – "The Power of Taking Action: Insights From the Zero-to-One Entrepreneur with Jay Sapovits"

Introduction

In Episode 98 of Built Online, host Cody McGuffey engages in a profound conversation with Jay Sapovitz, a seasoned entrepreneur renowned for his "zero-to-one" ventures. The episode delves into Jay's extensive experience in building businesses from the ground up, his strategic decision-making processes, and his unwavering commitment to action over motivation. Listeners gain valuable insights into the entrepreneurial journey, the challenges of scaling a business, and the importance of defining success beyond mere financial metrics.

Jay Sapovitz's Entrepreneurial Journey: Zero to One

Jay introduces himself as the "best zero-to-one entrepreneur," explaining that zero-to-one signifies his expertise in identifying market gaps and creating solutions where none existed. He recounts his diverse ventures, highlighting his ability to enter unfamiliar markets and establish successful businesses. From organizing a PGA Tour event in partnership with Jim Furyk despite having no pro golf experience to selling private jets without prior knowledge, Jay exemplifies adaptability and relentless action.

“Zero to one is I'm great at identifying where there's gaps and then building something to fill those gaps that doesn't exist.” – Jay Sapovitz [01:41]

Jay emphasizes his optimistic outlook, stating, “I wake up every day optimistic... I attack the day” [03:18]. This mindset has been pivotal in navigating the highs and lows of entrepreneurship.

Building and Scaling Inked Stores

Currently, Jay is focused on Inked Stores, a company specializing in on-demand company swag stores. With nearly 30 full-time employees and generating just under $5 million in revenue, Inked Stores exemplifies Jay's strategic approach to business growth.

“We own the embroidery machines, we own the screen print presses... we do it because we want to control the timing and the quality.” – Jay Sapovitz [05:17]

Jay explains the strategic decision to produce everything in-house, balancing asset-heavy operations to ensure quality and control over the product. This approach contrasts with competitors who might outsource production, highlighting Jay's commitment to maintaining high standards.

Defining Success Beyond Revenue

Jay challenges the conventional metrics of success, advocating for a broader definition that includes company culture, employee satisfaction, and personal fulfillment. He shares his contentment with maintaining a stable business rather than aggressively scaling to become the largest in the market.

“I live with them and I like them because I like the company that I like the company we have, I like the culture that we have and I like the people that we have.” – Jay Sapovitz [07:47]

Jay finds greater meaning in fostering strong relationships with his employees and ensuring their well-being, rather than solely focusing on financial growth. This perspective aligns with the second group of listeners who prioritize time freedom, financial stability, and personal fulfillment over massive revenue targets.

The Art of Decision Making in Entrepreneurship

A significant portion of the conversation centers on decision-making—a critical skill for any entrepreneur. Jay outlines his framework for making swift yet informed decisions, emphasizing the categorization of decisions based on their short-term and long-term impacts.

“If you're going to be an entrepreneur, you have to be a decision maker. Not everyone's going to be right. You have to be willing to cut your losses and make mistakes fast or else you burn money.” – Jay Sapovitz [08:45]

He discusses the importance of evaluating the nature of each decision, consulting various resources, and relying on gut instincts informed by past experiences. This methodical yet agile approach allows Jay to navigate complex business challenges effectively.

Overcoming Limiting Beliefs Through Action

Jay confronts the mental barriers that many entrepreneurs face, advocating for an action-driven approach to dispel limiting beliefs. He shares personal anecdotes of rejection and failure, illustrating how persistent action leads to breakthroughs.

“Limiting beliefs gets you. You make limiting beliefs extinct by taking action.” – Jay Sapovitz [24:08]

Jay emphasizes that success often requires stepping outside one's comfort zone and taking decisive actions, even in the face of uncertainty and discomfort.

Action vs. Motivation: Jay's Formula for Success

A recurring theme in the episode is the distinction between action and motivation. Jay asserts that relying solely on motivation is ineffective, as it is fleeting and unreliable. Instead, he advocates for an "action bias"—taking deliberate steps regardless of one's motivational state.

“I used to believe that you needed to be motivated to do something. It's a lie. You don't need motivation... you just do it anyway because that's what the job calls for.” – Jay Sapovitz [31:40]

Jay shares his personal strategy of initiating tasks without waiting for motivation, leading to substantial progress and productivity. This practical approach resonates with entrepreneurs seeking sustainable ways to overcome inertia and achieve their goals.

Future Plans and Reflections

Looking ahead, Jay discusses his plans for Inked Stores, focusing on scaling the business while maintaining operational excellence and supporting his long-term employees. He underscores the importance of mental health and a positive mindset in making informed decisions and sustaining business growth.

“The constant nature of being an entrepreneur is just, it's just constant learning and evolving.” – Jay Sapovitz [28:38]

Jay also reflects on the evolution of his entrepreneurial mindset, moving away from the pursuit of exits and financial milestones to valuing personal fulfillment and the well-being of his team.

Conclusion

Episode 98 of Built Online offers a rich tapestry of insights from Jay Sapovitz, a master of turning zero into one in the entrepreneurial landscape. Jay's emphasis on action, strategic decision-making, and redefining success provides listeners with actionable takeaways to navigate their own business journeys. His authentic storytelling and practical advice make this episode an invaluable resource for both aspiring and seasoned entrepreneurs seeking to build sustainable and fulfilling businesses.

Notable Quotes:

• “Zero to one is I'm great at identifying where there's gaps and then building something to fill those gaps that doesn't exist.” – Jay Sapovitz [01:41]
• “If you're going to be an entrepreneur, you have to be a decision maker. Not everyone's going to be right. You have to be willing to cut your losses and make mistakes fast or else you burn money.” – Jay Sapovitz [08:45]
• “Limiting beliefs gets you. You make limiting beliefs extinct by taking action.” – Jay Sapovitz [24:08]
• “I used to believe that you needed to be motivated to do something. It's a lie. You don't need motivation.” – Jay Sapovitz [31:40]
• “The constant nature of being an entrepreneur is just, it's just constant learning and evolving.” – Jay Sapovitz [28:38]

Connect with Jay Sapovitz:

• LinkedIn: Jay Sapovitz
• Website: Inked Stores

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Note: For further details and full transcript, refer to the show notes accompanying Episode 98 of Built Online.

Transcript

[Jay Sapovitz]

And I don't know what your experience is with this. If you're counting on family and friends and the people that are closest to you to support you and to get you where you're going to go from zero to one, like you don't have a business.

[Cody McGuffey]

Welcome to Built online. I'm Cody McGuffey, and this podcast is all about one thing. Building the business of your dreams. Selling art, teaching classes, starting a blog, launching a brand. Whatever your passion is, we show you how to turn it into real income. I created Everbee to help anyone with a dream start and scale business.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Ever be, ever be, ever be, ever be, ever be, ever be.

[Cody McGuffey]

We now serve over 800,000 creators all across the globe. On this show, we bring on real entrepreneurs who've done it. They share their secrets, they share their failures, the exact steps that you can take to get started. What if you can get one golden nugget out of today's episode? And it's the breakthrough that takes. Takes you from just dreaming to actually living a life on your terms. At Everbee, we believe that every human is a creator, and every creator should own a business. Jay, we're here. Welcome, man.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Cody. Thanks.

[Cody McGuffey]

Super happy to have you, man. How's your day so far?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, really good. Really good. Appreciate it.

[Cody McGuffey]

Beautiful. You have an interesting story. I want to dive in. Straight in, really. But specifically, you told me, when we were just now starting this, before we hit record, you said that you are the best zero to one entrepreneur. Why do you say that?

[Jay Sapovitz]

I don't know. Maybe because I'm an action junkie and that's where all the action is.

[Cody McGuffey]

What does zero to one mean? Just for anybody?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Look, zero to one is I'm great at identifying where there's gaps and then building something to fill those gaps that doesn't exist. It's how I got my start. It's how I began being an entrepreneur. I really, you know, every market I've ever entered, I haven't had experience in that market. So I created a PGA Tour event in partnership with Jim Furyk and was a 30 handicap that had never been involved in pro golf or sponsorship sales. I started selling private jets, and at Marquee Jet, I. I didn't know what a private jet was until I took the position, you know, top 15 employee at a company that went from zero to a billion dollars. I'd never been to St. Bart's I built a business on St. Barts. I. I'm just someone who doesn't want to hear about why you can't do something. And I have this incredible ability to drown out the noise of can't and march forward. I, so I like to say I wake up every day optimistic. Now the day beats it out of me and I go to sleep every day, you know, broken and beaten. Like not every day but a lot. You know, things that happen and business is hard and people are hard and all that happens. But every morning I wake up full of hope and I attack, I attack the day. And that, that's why I believe I, I've been such a great zero to one entrepreneur, a starter and you know, that's. Yeah, that's how it's been.

[Cody McGuffey]

You built a special life for yourself and it's been on, it's been through business, I think 18, 18 years of starting businesses or starting from zero doing that, zero to one, being involved with them. What do you. Let's fast forward to today. What is primarily your project for today?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, well, today's a little different for me because I've got a, an ongoing business that's relatively stable. And you were really at a, at a kind of position where we're, do we grow? Do we stay where we're at? If we grow, how do we grow? And you know, for the last few years I've, I've been, I've been kind of operating the business as steady as she goes and you know, not really trying to drive aggressive growth. And I made the decision this year that we wanted to try to grow a little more aggressively over the next two years. You know, really I did that because I felt like I've had a lot of long term employees with me and I felt like it was at least for them, more important that we grow so for they can start to accumulate in their business worlds as well. And I'm doing things today that I've not had either a great deal of success with in the past or I find challenging or difficult that really push me to get me out of my comfort zone and that are hard. Right. Because I'm not in that excitement stage. I'm in the process stage. I'm in the people stage.

[Cody McGuffey]

Wait, can I pause you there for a second to, to help set the context for, for anybody listening. Your main business is inked right now, right?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah.

[Cody McGuffey]

Beautiful.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah.

[Cody McGuffey]

Can you give us an, an understanding, anything that you're willing to share revenue or whatever it is that you can share?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, happy to. So we're, so we're just under 30 full time. We've got, we're under 5 million in revenue and we build Host, manage and fulfill on demand company swag stores and obviously do bulk orders for our clients. Right. And we made the strategic decision a few years back that we were going to produce everything in house. So we actually own the embroidery machines, we own the screen print presses, direct to garment machines, heat presses. We do the work for our online stores right here where I'm speaking to you. Right. I, I get off this call, I go out of my office, I take a left hand turn and I'm met by a bay of embroidery machines and a staff that's working on them. And you know, same thing's true for our, our screen print department. That's complex, that's not easy, but we do it because we want to control the timing and the quality. Right. So there's others in the marketplace that don't do their own work, but you know, maybe they're a little more forward relative to their tech on the front side. So you know, these are all decisions that you have to make as a leader, like which direction are you going to go? Are you going to go asset light and just play offense? Are you going to go asset heavy? And that limits your ability to play offense and it affects how, how fast you grow. Right. I mean it's as imperative as do you take capital? Don't you take capital? Right. And so along the way we've made the decisions we've made and I live with them and I like them because I like the company that I like the company we have, I like the culture that we have and I like the people that we have. And are we the biggest? No. You know, have I watched Companies build to 20 times my size or 30 times my size or exit that launched after me? Yes. It's not how I define success and it's for me, not all about a financial scorecard. And you know, that would be really difficult to tell the 20 year ago version of me, but it's not really difficult to tell the version of me that's lived the last 10 years and had just this incredible relationship with my kids, my wife, my staff, my friends. Like I, you know, I feel like, I feel like the luckiest person in the world.

[Cody McGuffey]

I have a question. There a lot of people listening to this are, There's a couple different groups of people that listen to this. There's the one that's probably the 20 year old self that was highly ambitious because I'm gonna go build a 100 million dollar company, 200 million dollar company, billion dollar company, whatever it is. And then there's, there's the other person who listens to this, which is probably the majority of like hey, I don't necessarily, that dollar figure doesn't necessarily matter as much. It's more about the freedom that I'm going after here. Like time freedom, the financial freedom, the location freedom, the ability to serve my, maybe my community or my, my kids, my, my wife, my, my husband. And they just want to live like a great life. And they have a different definition of great life. Everyone has a little bit different definition, but theirs is like optimized for, for time typically in freedom. And it seems like that's kind of how you define success in, in your, in your current stage. Is that, is that true?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Well, yeah, Cody, that's, I mean that's a, it's a, it's a good analysis. But, but let me just go back and, and speak to the first group of folks if you don't mind and then I'll speak to the second because the second is where I'm living now. But the first is where I used to live, right? And I don't think that's wrong. I've got a daughter, 24, she's doing great in business. I've got a 22 year old about to graduate college. He's launching a company and we'll see where that goes. And he has a full time job lined up in addition to it. So to me the sooner and earlier in life you can make those sacrifices and I'm a full believer in that. I do believe that as a young person driving through and getting success early can set up a great 30 to 40 to 50 years of, of your life. So I'm not against that at all. I'm totally pro sacrifice early. Listen, I was fortunate. I had success. I didn't have, you know, buy an island success, but I've had success and you know, that's afforded me the ability to be in a business now and not have that pressure to scale and exit immediately. Right? We can scale and we can as I see it, you know, make some decisions along the way that don't put us in peril. So I manage this business in, in kind of a twofold way, right? The first way is we're going to be in business, right? And then the second way is we take calculated, we take calculated risks, you know, as, as we are able to take them. And as a business owner, you know, like there it. Money's not endless. Every bill that seems to come is for thousands, not hundreds. Decisions you make when you're younger are not the same as when you're older, when you're, you know, like I, I can look at a decision now and say, okay, I mean, good example is, you know, do you hire an agency or do you hire an employee? It's always, that's always a struggle for someone who's in that mid range like us. Right? Because an agency might bring greater skills, but you're going to get less time and attention. An employee is going to bring more time and attention, but you might get less skills. An employee is infinitely harder to unwind than an agency because they're more human than an agency. So you know, how do you approach those types of difficult situations? And to your point, bringing this back in a full circle, optimizing your life for time, optimizing it for freedom, these are things that you've got to figure out like when do you bring someone onto the business, do you outsource it or do you bring someone in full time and thinking through those decisions, making the pro list, making the con list and moreover making a decision. Right. So that's really zero to one. Entrepreneur. I'm a great decision maker, not because I make the right decision, but because I make decisions. And to me, if you're going to be an entrepreneur, you have to be a decision maker. Not everyone's going to be right. You have to be willing to cut your losses and make mistakes fast or else you burn money. I always haven't been. I mean, I look back on a business that wasn't successful, that I had, had I made the decisions I made nine months prior, I'd still be running that business instead.

[Cody McGuffey]

It doesn't exist for decisions that you for. For people that are listening to this are trying to go to 01, 0 to 1 for the first time. They probably don't even realize that decisions are what you just mentioned. Like they didn't realize it. They probably aren't even grasping fully like how important that actual concept is. So if you were to share with them like a framework or some way that you how do they make fast decisions but also don't make them in a way that it crushes their business if they're wrong?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Well, you have to put every decision, Cody, into a bucket, right? I mean decisions are, this is going to affect me short term, this is going to affect me long term. This is existential. And if it fails, we're going to be out of business. Right? So the business, the one that puts you out of business, you probably should talk to more people than the one that is going to affect you short term. So Every decision is invariably different. And when you say, do I have a process in which I go through? Or that mean the process is to first understand the nature of the decision that I'm making and its effects and impacts. And again, positive and negative. I'm a pro con guy. That's how I like to look at things. What's the short term effect? What's the long term effect? And you know, what happens if it's successful? What happens if it fails? I put all that into the mixer, you know, and I gather information from a lot of different sources. I might spend time reading blogs, I might, you know, go on chat GPT. I talk to industry experts. I could scroll LinkedIn expertise. You know, there's so many resources out there now that you should be able to get a good picture, but nobody's. Look, I, you got to take everything you read with a grain of salt and you have to have a relatively good gut instinct and you have to draw on your, and you have to draw on your past experiences. And I think if you, if you do that and make decisions and, and keep, keep those decisions close and monitor them, you should be in good shape. If. Yeah, there's no free lunch, right? You can't, you, you can't earn a light. You earn a lifestyle business. You earn time off and free time like you, no, you can't. There's no putting, you know, they, I put in five hours a week and make 4 million a year. Like, don't watch that video, like move on from that person. That's.

[Cody McGuffey]

I agree with you. Yeah, it, there has to be. So there's, there's, there is a association like, between, like sacrifice and reward or risk and reward is a real thing. It is probably smaller now that we have the Internet and we have democratization of like, you know, starting businesses and things like this. But it still requires, it's going to require way more than just your four hour work week.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Somebody out there, somebody out there can work four hours and make a million dollars a year. Somebody can. Okay, that's not been my experience relative to your audience. It's probably not going to be your Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, you know, Kobe Bryant, you know, these are, these are, these are generational life to be comparing yourself to these folks or, you know, trying to take that the chances are that you're not that person. And I, I'm okay with that. And I'm.

[Cody McGuffey]

And they also didn't work for hours, those guys world.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, right. But I'm putting that person who works four hours a week and makes a million dollars a year on that pedestrian. They might be special. Like, most of the time, it takes an intense amount of effort and supreme sacrifice to get yourself to where you have the ability to make decisions.

[Cody McGuffey]

I have a question for you. You mentioned zero. Zero to one, right? We've talked about that. Getting from zero to one is arguably probably the hardest thing to do.

[Jay Sapovitz]

You think so?

[Cody McGuffey]

I think I do. I. I do think, personally, I think so. I think making your first $1,000 for yourself is way harder than making your, like, next million dollars after you've made a million. That first zero to $1,000 or first zero to a hundred thousand dollars. There's so many. We need to overcome so many barriers in our head. There's so many, like, limiting beliefs we have to overcome.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Well, but that's the issue, right? It's the beliefs, Cody, isn't it?

[Cody McGuffey]

Absolutely. Believes. Yeah.

[Jay Sapovitz]

It's not the idea. I mean, when I started the Exelon Invitational, hosted by Jim Furyk, I had a million dollars of expenses and no revenue, and that's what it was. I was down a million dollars to start, and I had nine months to sell the event. We were in Southern Chester County, 50 miles away from center city, Philadelphia, and that's the mushroom capital of the world. There's got to be 40 mushroom farms inside of that specific area. To me, it was natural to go to those mushrooms. Like the idea. I knocked on every mushroom farmer's door and asked them to sponsor a golf tournament. And my buddy said to me, why would you ask a mushroom farmer to sponsor a golf tournament? I said, because the golf tournament is in their backyard, and they love where they live because they've built their life here. Why wouldn't they want to support the area in which they love? To me, that seemed natural. So if you're doing something you love, right, when I'm talking about 0 to 1, like, if I tried to start a company in something I. I didn't love, right. Or couldn't. Couldn't love, at least grow to love, then I wouldn't know where to go. But a lot of times people are starting things that solve a problem for themselves. Well, so if it's a problem for you, it's a problem for somebody else. So figure out what that problem is and then just run to it. By the way, I took a $13,000 sponsorship of a mushroom farm down inside of two weeks. So, I mean, that's just by knocking on doors. So when you talk about limiting beliefs, limiting beliefs gets you. You make limiting beliefs Extinct by taking action. And to me, that again, I know, I know. You said it's hard. I guess it's weird, right? Like, so some people could kind of sit on top of my business and say, I could take this business, triple it, and a year and a half, and that'd be easy for me. And yet for me, that's hard.

[Cody McGuffey]

Interesting. Yeah. And that's, that's the nature of, we all have different gifts. We all have different things. We, we all have different skill sets and in order. So my point with that is going from zero to one and then there's going from one to two.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah.

[Cody McGuffey]

And then two to three and then three to four. And you. Sounds like the way that you defined it is you guys have gone from 0 to 1 in your business and now you're going from 1 to 2. Strategically, you decided to do that recently, is that correct?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, I think that, I think that's fair. I, I, we're probably three to four. I mean, realistically, right. I mean, these numbers met are metaphorical. Absolutely. They're not 1 million to 2 million or 2 million to 3 million, just to be clear. But yeah, we've, well, we've, you know, we won. 0 to 1 is the proof stage and the adoption stage. And oh my gosh, I really have a business and this is what I'm going to do for a while stage. Right. The one to two stage is, okay, now that I have a business, can I acquire bigger clients? Can I refine my processes? Can I operate on an ongoing basis? And what do they say most businesses don't last how long? What, it's a couple years?

[Cody McGuffey]

Yeah, something like that. A couple years, Five years past? Something like that.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah. So, you know, we've definitely gotten past that phase. So the kind of next stage is that can we scale the business to where, as the CEO, if I didn't exist or the founder, the business would exist. And it probably, Ken, is the reality without me. But I'm not sure anybody in this building wants to try to find out anytime soon. So that's sort of the, you know, the institutionalization of the business is where I think our phase is at right now. And am I enjoying it? I mean, it's less fun than, it's less fun than zero to one. I mean, it just, for me, it, it is. But, you know, ironically, some people might hate the 0 to 1 face and the 1 to 2 face. Right. Because they don't want the action and they want the stability and they want the instant on and, and that's why, you know, look, that's why people buy businesses, right? I mean, that's why people step in and say, you know, I'm great at, you know, I have a body.

[Cody McGuffey]

Hues.

[Jay Sapovitz]

He owns franchises. And I asked him one time, I said, why do you buy franchises? He said, because I'm a great operator and I'm a tolerable marketer. So, I mean, that makes complete sense to me. Right?

[Cody McGuffey]

Absolutely. Does it? Maybe. Maybe even hard. When I mentioned zero to one hard, I almost. Almost using hard and replacement of it's typically longer. I think it's almost. In my experience, going from zero to one typically always takes longer.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yes.

[Cody McGuffey]

Because you have to set up, you have to learn. You have to figure out who your customer is, who's going to buy that. First thing you're learning about yourself. You're learning about, like, your, you know, your unique perspective on. On in the niche. And that stuff does take, I would arguably, I would say, years to do this, typically. Has that been true for your. Your businesses in the past? You've done this numerous times?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Oh, sure. I mean, this business, it took me three years before we hit a million dollars in sales. I mean, I mean, that's zero to one, right? And I think I was amazed. You know what I was amazed at? Because we were. Because I was in my community for as long as I was. We had a retail shop when we opened, which you could walk through the door. I was always amazed at how few of the people who I knew and my acquaintances along the way were, would just offer to help or would walk through or would be there. Right. Everything was. Everything was outbound, everything was a push, everything was hard. There were a few people, don't get me wrong, you know, I. One in mind, that gave me my biggest order to start the business. And then when Covid hit, gave me an order right when it hit, to make sure that we were like, you know, I'll. I'll go to my. I'll go to my grave with that. With. With that guy in my heart, like, I love him, but. And I don't know what your experience is with this. If you're counting on family and friends and the people that are closest to you to support you and to get you where you're gonna go from zero to one like you don't have a business. Really, really hard advice to hear. Really hard advice to hear.

[Cody McGuffey]

It is hard. It is really hard advice to hear. I see that a lot too. I've always had this mindset of I never want to have I don't want, I never want to have to rely on my, like my mom buying my product and my sisters buy my product and my. For me to like be successful. I just feel like that would be a false, it'd be a false start. It'd be like, of course you're gonna buy your stuff probably, you know, but that's not the point. I'm trying to like prove that other people would buy my stuff or buy the thing. Strangers. It's very important to have strangers buy your thing or, or reject your thing.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yes.

[Cody McGuffey]

I'm curious of why you say that though. I want to hear like your backstory there and why, why you think that's so hard.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Well, my backstory there is when I left Marquis Jet to create a company in the villa rental space, I had a hundred names on a sheet of paper that of folks I had been, you know, their direct contact with, selling time in private jets. And you know, we had had amazing experiences together. And you know, that's a really high end, soft touch, but velvet glove type sales environment. And I had 100 names on a sheet of paper of people that I went to raise money from, from an angel perspective. And one out of that first hundred said yes.

[Cody McGuffey]

Were they family members?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Left. I left a. I left an extremely lucrative high six figure role to start my own business again. I saw myself as a CEO. I was very early with Marquee, so, you know, was part of the entrepreneurial push. As it grew, we started layering in management. I got pushed down to the sales level because no one, you know, you know, you're not looking to promote somebody who's doing 50 million, 60 million in business every year, if that makes sense. Right. You're not looking to lose a great. I had great relationships, super deep relationships with people, by the way. Even though they didn't invest in my business, I still felt like I had deep relationships with them. You know, some people just don't do that. Some people put their money in different places. How people put their money and where is very personal. But that was a lived experience that I had, Cody, is you dial the phone and you get rejected as much as I got rejected from people extremely close to me over the previous four plus years. And you learn real quick like you're in a different ball game, you know, and that was my experience. And from that point forward it hit me that you better figure out how to talk to people who don't know you or you have to meet, you know, otherwise. Right. Referrals, networking to tell your story. Because you just don't know inside of your own. Inside of your own world who's going to be there and who isn't.

[Cody McGuffey]

What's next for. For Inked and. Or for you? Maybe. Maybe. What's next for Jay in your business, business career? Is this like, is Inked going to be your baby for the rest of rest of time? Or what is. How does. Should somebody look at. You've been operating this thing for 13 years?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, we. We've been at Inked. I mean, we pivoted from a. A failed retail direct to consumer business in 2000 and beginning end of 2015. So really, we've been at Inked. This will be our 10th full year come October. Yeah. Yeah. The first three were spent batting my head up against the wall trying to figure out how to. How to sell a product that doesn't. Didn't have velocity.

[Cody McGuffey]

What's the plan now?

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, the plan is, I mean, I'm. I'm in a good spot mentally, which is, by the way, incredibly important. Like, mental health is immeasurable as an entrepreneur. Right. You do not make good decisions when you're in a bad frame of mind. So mentally, I'm in an extremely strong place. We have, over the last two years, solidified our operations and service to where I believe that we're giving our clients exceptional customer service, product ideation. And I'm pushing myself to do things that are extremely uncomfortable for me, make some investments into the business and graduate to that, to that next level of scale, which I think is going to be very rewarding for the handful of employees that have been with me for an extremely long time. And, you know, I have one woman who's been with me 10 years. I have someone, you know, another has been with me eight. Another has been with me six, five, and down the run. So, you know, I just, I feel a little indebted to make sure that they're in a good, positive position.

[Cody McGuffey]

Take care of that.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think so. And, you know, there's always consolidation in this business. So, you know, the bigger you are, the more of an opportunity that could exist. But, yeah, I don't focus on it. You know, that's a, that's that's a luxury of a younger entrepreneur. Right. When I was younger, it was, I'm gonna have the exit. And, you know, I don't, I don't dream of the exit anymore. I, I just kind of put my head down and do my job every day and, and try to make the best decisions possible. And then at the other side of it, I, I look to see whether or not I was right or wrong. Record the, record the outcome and, and use it to make better decisions the next time. So it, it all sounds a little cliche, but it's really, the constant nature of being an entrepreneur is just, it's just constant learning and evolving and you know, number one thing, number one tip for people who have money in the bank and they're running a company, don't let your company not be in business. The number one thing, the number one tip for people who don't have a company and are doing it out of their own bank account and they're trying to grow a business themselves is break through your own barriers and don't be afraid to knock on doors or do things that you have no idea about. And I know you sell to a lot of people who sell on Amazon and I was recently discussing an Amazon issue with a quote unquote Amazon expert and he was telling me it takes years to start a brand on Amazon, right? And you know how hard it is to start and, and I actually feel like I could do it tomorrow now. Could I do it successful tomorrow? Yeah, I'm not gonna, I'm, you know, like I'm not going to be that, I'm not gonna be like comfort, right? Who's a multi million dollar brand right after multiple years and influencers yet. No, but like I could start tomorrow. So like start, analyze, like go, you gotta go, you gotta go.

[Cody McGuffey]

Jay. It seems like the, it's super inspiring because it seems like everything that you've built is, and your entire mindset has all been built around this recurring thing of just like taking extreme action all times when it comes to over overcoming your, you know, we all have mental, mental struggles constantly. We're humans, of course we're gonna have breakdowns or, or struggles and trials. You overcome it with, typically with action. You have struggles in your business, you overcome it with action. You wanna scale your business, you overcome it with action. Your business fails. Fails. Guess what? You just, you have one thing to do. You have take action somehow, one way or another. And it seems like that's the over. It's, it's the recurring theme in your business career.

[Jay Sapovitz]

It seems like at a 1210 and when I failed the business, I had a 1210 and I had a 1210 and 7 year old 1210 and 7, 1210 and 6. What was I supposed to do Cody? Sit around and start applying for your job? I mean I had to, I had to, I had to go to Work every. I had to dial the phone. I had to. I had. And. And by the way, financially, okay. You know, we were. Not, again, not terrible. My wife saved us, God bless her. Right? So she made sure I didn't invest everything. So we were like. We had some buffer. But what was I going to show my kids that their dad puts his tail between his legs and runs like that is just. Was not feasible for me. And then from there, I just kind of recrafted my life to figure out what was important to me. And you know what? I've had more success in the last 10 years because I've been happy and my mindset's been great. But it all has been action bias. I used to believe that you needed to be motivated to do something. It's a lie. You don't need motivation. I mean, I can't tell you how many times in the morning, again, I wake up with hope, but that doesn't mean I wake up motivated. I wake up with hope, but I can't tell you how many times I've been. I wake up, I'm hopeful, I get to the office, I'm like, you know, you got a big pile in front of you. You don't know what to start on. You don't know what to do. Right. So I'll just start doing one thing. The next thing you know, it's three hours later, and you've checked off nine things on your list and you didn't want to start working in the first place.

[Cody McGuffey]

I completely agree with that. It's. I mean, how do you do bias towards that? Same. Yeah, same. You. You can't rely on motivation. I've realized, like, it's. In fact, that's. That's if. If you did rely on motivation, then you'd only be working one hour out of the entire week, probably because that's just typically how it works. It's like, you know, you can't. It's impossible to be motivated all the time. Now, I do think we can, like, pull from. You said hope. Inspiration. Like, I'm inspired. That's not deeper. It's probably a deeper layer. But no, you don't feel like typically doing. You don't feel like firing that person or interviewing that person or feel like doing that customer interview that you've done 10,000 of them. Right. You don't, you know, but, like, you just do it anyway because that's what the job calls for. And so some. We've somehow got into this idea as a society that we're only supposed to do things that make us feel good and that's fine. We should try to do as many good things that makes us feel good as possible. But that's not how we're going to do hard things. Hard things are hard because they're hard and they're uncomfortable and you don't want to do them. So very similar to the way that you think on that. I completely agree.

[Jay Sapovitz]

I was going to say you want to feel good. Yeah. It's really simple. I'll give you the, I'll give you the exact formula. If you want to feel good, take action against something you don't want to take action against. Do exactly opposite what you want to. You want to feel good. Yeah. Look where to find me LinkedIn is, is where I'm finding myself these days. A lot. JSAPovitz JSAP. It's JSAP is my endearing name. That's. You know, when I give you a Cody, when I see in person, I give you a hug because I've known you a long time. Then it's sappy. So that's what my dear, dear friends know me as. Sappy. Right. But yeah, LinkedIn is where you can find me ink stores. I'm not a, I'm not. I, I try not to make it difficult to find myself. I mean, ultimately I am in sales, so we, we do acquire clients. I do want people to come to my business.

[Cody McGuffey]

We all are. I will link for anyone listening and watching this too. I'll link to all of Jay's links, his LinkedIn, his inked stores, everything, all in the bio or show notes, wherever you watch this. But Jay, thank you very much for coming on and sharing a snippet of your story. I know there's a lot more to uncover, but we'll have to have you on again, Cody.

[Jay Sapovitz]

Thanks.

[Cody McGuffey]

Thanks, Jay.