Podcast Summary
Business Daily (BBC World Service)
Episode: Can global shipping go green?
Date: November 17, 2025
Host: Will Bain
Overview
This episode explores the immense challenge of decarbonizing the global shipping industry, a key player in international trade and a significant contributor to greenhouse gas emissions. While world leaders gather at the COP30 climate summit in Brazil, the shipping sector stands at a crossroads after a hard-fought international emissions deal failed to be ratified. Through interviews with industry leaders and experts, the podcast investigates why agreement remains elusive, the obstacles facing shipping’s green transition, and possible pathways forward.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. Background: Shipping and Emissions
- Industry Scope: Shipping is responsible for moving 80% of global trade, valued at over $14 trillion per year, but contributes 2–3% of global greenhouse gas emissions.
- “Shipping ranks as a top 10 contributor to greenhouse gas emissions…” — Will Bain [01:09]
- Missed Opportunity: Delegates at the International Maritime Organization (IMO) had the chance to set the first global, industry-wide, emissions reduction targets, but the agreement was delayed by at least a year.
2. Failure to Reach Agreement at the IMO
- The Stalled Deal:
- A plan to mandate cleaner fuels and introduce a carbon tax intended to fund green technology failed.
- Saudi Arabia led a motion to adjourn, supported by oil-dependent nations (UAE, Venezuela, Oman, Bahrain), delaying action.
- “Saudi Arabia moved a motion to adjourn talks on how to implement the plans for a year. The motion passed by just eight votes.” — Will Bain [03:23]
- Geopolitical Tension:
- Particularly strong opposition from the US, with President Trump condemning the proposal and threatening trade tariffs on participant countries.
- “President Trump...denounce[d] the plans as a green scam that would increase prices of goods being shipped for consumers.” — Will Bain [04:24]
3. Industry Perspectives on the Delay
- Need for Clarity to Invest:
- “We were hoping to have some clarity. To have the whole conversation torpedoed is deeply disappointing.” — Diane Gilpin, Smart Green Shipping [01:31, 10:50]
- Shipowners and companies require regulatory certainty to make large-scale investments in new technology.
- Economic Concerns:
- The likely increase in shipping costs would be passed on to the end consumer, causing concern among both industry and governments.
- “The increased cost in shipping goods, it would likely be passed to the end consumer…” — James Helliwell, VGroup [11:43; 12:38]
4. Three Pathways to Decarbonization
- Vincent Clerc, CEO of Maersk, outlines three avenues:
- Consumer Willingness to Pay for Green Shipping
- Currently insufficient at a global scale.
- Effective International Regulation and Incentives
- Stalled by IMO’s delayed action.
- Technological Innovation to Reduce Green Premiums
- Investment and innovation may continue, but at slower pace without the stimulus of regulation.
- “There are three ways... One is to rely on a high willingness to pay from the end consumer… second is to have a regulatory framework… and then the third one is… technological innovation.” — Vincent Clerc [06:03]
- Consumer Willingness to Pay for Green Shipping
- Risks of Delay:
- Slower scaling of technology and increased uncertainty, but possible opportunity for new solutions to surface.
- “It will delay the scaling of the technologies we’ve been talking about... The opportunity is that it will foster more innovation.” — Vincent Clerc [06:54]
- Optimistic Outlook:
- “You have to believe that there is a path. If you don't think that there is a path, then it's time to stop and do something else.” — Vincent Clerc [08:08]
5. Industry Panel: Tackling the Hurdles
Panelists:
- Diane Gilpin (Smart Green Shipping)
- Tim Wilkins (Intertanko)
- James Helliwell (VGroup)
Key Themes:
- Disappointment and Uncertainty
- “Absolutely, it was a disappointment... to have the whole conversation torpedoed is deeply disappointing.” — Diane Gilpin [10:50]
- “It really was a shock… we were hopeful that this vote would have been positive and that we'd continue on that pathway.” — James Helliwell [11:11]
- Complexity of Fuel and Technology Choices
- Safety, cost, and training for new fuels remain major concerns.
- Uncertainty in regulatory support delays adoption and complicates investment.
- “Which fuel do you train them on? There's still a lot of uncertainty about the safety of those fuels and what that means operationally.” — James Helliwell [12:38]
- Cost Passed to Consumers
- “The increased cost in shipping goods… always going to [be] passed to that end user.” — James Helliwell [12:38; 13:05]
- Delay Increases Long-term Costs
- “The reality of delay means that the costs will increase… Kicking the can down the road...will make things much, much more expensive.” — Diane Gilpin [13:55]
- Regulatory Framework Needed
- “Any business… wants a clear regulatory framework in which to operate.” — Diane Gilpin [14:34]
- Industry Has Not Been Idle
- The sector has already achieved a 29% emissions reduction since 2008.
- “The industry has reduced its net emissions by 29% compared to 2008 in 2023. Now if we look at the target for 2030, then we are getting closer and closer…” — Tim Wilkins [15:00]
- Technological Innovation: Wind-Assisted Propulsion
- Companies like Smart Green Shipping are developing digitally enabled wing sails, providing a modern take on wind power for retrofitting ships.
- “We're developing wing sails which are effectively digitally enabled wind powered devices... using lightweight long life technology. And it's easy to retrofit and it's being put onto ships.” — Diane Gilpin [15:57]
6. Pathways Forward Despite Uncertainty
- Regional Regulation:
- Even in absence of a global framework, regional actions (e.g., EU), and incremental steps can accelerate change.
- “More regional regulation is still going to help drive and accelerate the pace of change, even with some uncertainty.” — James Helliwell [17:26]
- Focus on Efficiency Gains:
- Encouragement for companies to push for energy efficiency with existing technology, which offers immediate cost and emission reductions.
- “You can still reduce your emissions by 10, 20% just by trying to consume less amount of the fuel that we have today.” — James Helliwell [17:50]
- Resilience Through Diversification:
- Reducing dependence on conventional fuels increases resilience in face of regulatory and political uncertainty.
- “The more that the addiction to fuel can be decoupled, the more resilient the industry can be…” — Diane Gilpin [19:01]
- Optimism for a Return to the Table:
- “Absolutely, it has to come back. The question, I guess, is [in] shape and form…” — Tim Wilkins [18:49]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “To have the whole conversation torpedoed is deeply disappointing.”
— Diane Gilpin, on the IMO deal delay [01:31, 10:50] - “You have to believe that there is a path. If you don’t think that there is a path, then it’s time to stop and do something else.”
— Vincent Clerc, Maersk CEO [08:08] - “Any business… wants a clear regulatory framework in which to operate.”
— Diane Gilpin [14:34] - “More regional regulation is still going to help drive and accelerate the pace of change…”
— James Helliwell [17:26] - “The industry has reduced its net emissions by 29% compared to 2008 in 2023.”
— Tim Wilkins [15:00]
Key Timestamps
| Timestamp | Segment & Highlight | |-----------|---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:09 | Setting the episode’s main focus: shipping’s contribution to global emissions | | 03:23 | The adjournment of emissions deal at the IMO, Saudi Arabia’s motion | | 04:24 | Breakdown of political and economic opposition (including US stance) | | 06:03 | Vincent Clerc’s three paths to decarbonization | | 08:08 | Maersk CEO on optimism and continued commitment | | 10:29 | Introduction of industry panel | | 10:50 | Diane Gilpin laments the lack of clarity, disappointment in stalling progress | | 11:43 | Concerns about increased shipping cost for consumers (James Helliwell) | | 12:38 | Helliwell: Concerns for crew training, safety, and operational impact | | 13:55 | Gilpin: Delay will only raise long-term costs due to the climate crisis | | 15:00 | Wilkins: Industry has already cut 29% of emissions since 2008 | | 15:57 | Gilpin explains practical wind-assisted propulsion technology | | 17:26 | Regional regulation’s potential (Helliwell) | | 18:49 | Wilkins: The efforts to green shipping “have to come back” | | 19:01 | Gilpin: Reducing dependence on fuel strengthens industry resilience |
Tone and Language
The episode carries a balanced but urgent tone, juxtaposing cautious optimism with the frustration of delayed action. Speakers highlight both technical and political complexity, stressing a pragmatic blend of regulatory support, technological innovation, and industry self-motivation.
Conclusion
The episode underscores the global shipping industry’s critical junction — with delays on an international emissions deal leaving the sector in regulatory limbo even as climate change effects intensify. Industry leaders believe solutions are within reach but require clarity, investment, and multi-sector cooperation. Despite the setback, ongoing innovation and regional measures keep hope alive for shipping’s green transition.
For those seeking an intelligent take on the state of play in global shipping’s decarbonization journey, this episode offers sobering reality balanced with practical perspectives and optimism for what’s ahead.