Podcast Summary: Business Daily – "God in your pocket" (October 15, 2025)

Episode Overview

In this episode, host Rob Young explores the burgeoning world of religion-based apps—sometimes called "faith tech"—and examines how technology is transforming spiritual practice across the globe. With voices from developers, users, and critics, the episode delves into the promises, pitfalls, and financial realities of portable spirituality. Key questions raised include: Are these apps enhancing faith or profiting from it? Can digital devotion replace traditional worship? And what are the ethical implications of putting "God in your pocket"?

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction to Faith Tech

• Rob Young opens the episode with the central theme: the boom in religion-based smartphone apps, which offer spiritual fulfillment and convenience—but often for a fee.
  • "The faith tech industry is massive with its promise of spiritual fulfilment from your smartphone, often for a fee. But not everybody is convinced." (01:27)
• The episode sets the scene with real users sharing their experiences alongside perspectives from app creators and a theology professor.

2. User Perspective: Spiritual Practice via Apps

• Kimberly Wiltshire, UK-based hairdresser and Muslim convert, shares how the Muslim Pro app supports her new faith.
  • "Having the apps with the Adhan times and everything helped. It just made life easier because the Adhan's going off, so I know it's time to pray. The Quran's easy to access. I've always got it on me because it's always within the app." (02:43)
  • She highlights the challenge of not having a Muslim family or community, making digital tools vital.
  • On the app versus mosque: "Combination of the both helps because I do think that obviously you can't solely rely on the app. The mosque, there's community..." (03:24)

3. App Provider Insights

Muslim Pro (Bits Media)

• Nafeez Concur (CEO) describes the app's journey from basic functionality to an all-encompassing "lifestyle" app with media and educational offerings.
  • "We started with the basic utilities of prayer times and qibla direction...Then we became more of a lifestyle app. Today in our app we also have education...1100 hours of Islamic content." (04:35)
• On replacing community:
  • "We don't say that we are replacing a mosque or we are replacing the scholars...but most of the other practices actually you can do even without going to the mosque." (05:37)
• Business model and growth:
  • "Today we have about 2 billion Muslims all over the world and we have only about 170 million downloads from there...Most of our users are between 18 and 35 years of age..." (06:28)
  • "The company says the app isn't making a lot of money as it has high costs." (07:19)

Hallow (Catholic App)

• Alex Jones (CEO) explains Hallow’s ethos: supporting faith, not replacing church.
  • "Our goal is to lead you to church, to be something that you interact with outside of Sundays..." (08:04)
  • "Our lowest usage day is on Sundays. So most folks are using it throughout the week...and for Catholics, confession and all the beauty of the sacraments. And that's what happened to me." (08:21)
• Relationship between money and faith:
  • "The worship of money, putting money first is one of, if not the primary evil that infects all of our hearts...money and technology are tools. If you worship them...it's the road to hell, that's the road to destruction." (10:38)
  • "It's not a problem for me [if we never make a profit]...All I care about is trying to do God's will." (11:41)
• Hallow's financial state echoes others:
  • "Again, we're a startup, so we're burning money...we have revenue obviously...but we're still investing a lot...and so we're still very much burning money, as you would say, in the startup world." (09:46)

Srimandir (Hindu App)

• Prashant Sachan (Founder) outlines the app’s model of charging platform and convenience fees for facilitating temple offerings (up to $60).

  • "That is what we follow here. We have a platform fee, we have a convenience fee. This is what we charge...It's not a very expensive experience that you are taking from the platform and it creates this access to experiences that you might not go...at a lower frequency..." (13:41)
  • Frames the app as a consumer tech platform, not just a religious one.

• Navigating faith and profit:

  • "What is the kind of impact I am making in the lives of people? ...It makes them get this intense feeling of this well being and feeling blessed...I think I'm doing public good and I'll not be able to create this without creating an economic structure around it." (14:40)

Text with Jesus (Catloaf Software)

• Stefan Peter (President/CEO) discusses the mechanics of the AI-powered chatbot that lets users "converse" with Jesus.
  • "It's basically instructions for the AI model to tell it to act as a certain character and there's a lot of guidelines on safeguards..." (16:02)
  • On balancing realism/ethics: "At the beginning of every conversation, there's always a little disclaimer that says, this is an AI chatbot...It's kind of up to the person to stay aware of that." (16:52)
• Intended use:
  • "Really more like a tool, like an educational tool...it's a new way to interact, to learn things, to explore, an interactive way. Your faith, your scripture..." (17:35)
• Addressing the profit critique:
  • "It is a business for us. We're trying to price it in a way that's accessible...But at the same time, we do need to run the infrastructure...But we're trying to keep it to a way that it provides value...I think the basic level is enough for most people." (18:40)

4. The Critic's View: Can Apps Replace Real Faith?

• Candida Moss (Professor of Theology, University of Birmingham) offers nuance and caution:

  • On accessibility: “These apps are sort of giving people an opportunity to reconnect with their religious beliefs and that's surely a good thing. We've had books that have offered people the same thing for hundreds of years...” (19:54)
  • On limitations: "I think the problem comes when people think that it's a replacement for prayer or a replacement for sort of being part of a religious community or actually talking to God..." (20:30)
  • Money, access, and ethics:
    • "It is a little awkward to be sort of gatekeeping access to sort of a premium relationship with God in this way...There's a sense that they're kind of profiting off of people's sort of spiritual needs and getting in the way between an individual and the divine." (21:11)

• On costs and sustainability:

  • "Of course anyone building an app have to cover their costs. People need to be able to feed their families...But at the same time, presumably the plan with all of these technologies is eventually to make money. And I think that's where lots of people would have issues with that." (22:07)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Rob Young: "The faith tech industry is massive with its promise of spiritual fulfilment from your smartphone, often for a fee. But not everybody is convinced." (01:27)
• Kimberly Wiltshire: "I've just used the app like surface based, basically like tracking my fasts in Ramadan, tracking my prayers, reading Quran. I don't speak Arabic, I am learning currently try all translated into English. So yeah, it's been really helpful." (03:47)
• Nafeez Concur: "We even have AI based teaching models...to ask any questions that you would generally ask probably a scholar..." (05:59)
• Alex Jones: "Our goal is to lead you to church, to be something that you interact with outside of Sundays..." (08:04)
• Candida Moss: "It is a little awkward to be sort of gatekeeping access to sort of a premium relationship with God in this way..." (21:11)

Important Timestamps

• 01:16 – Introduction to faith tech apps and their scope
• 02:43 – Kimberly Wiltshire on how Muslim Pro supports her spiritual daily life
• 04:35 – Nafeez Concur on the evolution of Muslim Pro from a utility to a lifestyle app
• 08:04 – Hallow CEO Alex Jones on balancing technology and church attendance
• 10:38 – Alex Jones discusses the tension between profit and Christian values
• 13:41 – Srimandir’s Prashant Sachan explains charging for access to temples
• 16:02 – Catloaf Software’s Stefan Peter explains AI-powered religious conversations
• 19:54 – Professor Candida Moss on the role and risks of religious apps

Conclusion

This episode paints a complex picture of the faith tech landscape—one full of rapid innovation, real spiritual aid, and persistent ethical questions. While apps offer unprecedented convenience and access, all guests agree they are no substitute for genuine community or spiritual connection. Whether these apps ultimately deepen faith or dilute it remains an open question; as the industry grows, issues of profit, authenticity, and accessibility will only become more acute.