Business Daily – “Is France failing its older workers?”
Podcast: BBC World Service – Business Daily
Host: John Laurenson
Date: September 28, 2025
Episode Overview
This episode investigates the challenges faced by older workers in France, a country with some of the worst employment statistics for older age groups in the developed world. The episode delves into systemic ageism in employment, the personal stories of jobseekers, and innovative approaches by employers and government initiatives to combat age discrimination. The show combines personal testimony, expert advice, and best-practice examples to paint a detailed picture of the landscape for workers aged 50 and over in France.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. The Scope of the Problem: Statistical and Cultural Context
[02:24 – 03:11]
- France has particularly poor employment rates for older workers. Only 60% of those aged 55-64 are employed (vs. 71% in the UK), and just 39% in the 60-64 range (vs. 57% in the UK).
- The societal view of aging and work has shifted: “We are a long way from ancient Greece where the senior was a wise person, a knowledgeable person.” (C, 02:55)
- Employers and society often view older workers as less flexible, more costly, and incompatible with younger teams.
2. Lived Experiences: Geraldine’s Job Search
[04:32 – 09:04]
- Geraldine Cocon, 55, has an extensive career in marketing and communication, but after returning to France in 2020, she has been unable to secure a position.
- Barriers she identified:
- Perceived inflexibility and salary expectations
- Discomfort from having a younger boss: “Most of them are not confident with working with somebody older than they are. And I should say I was the same when I used to work abroad. So now I can see the problem.” (B, 05:21)
- Thousands of applications with very few interviews, often filtered out by recruitment algorithms based on age.
- “You have the first selection, which is the AI... you can't get the interview because the AI just don’t show up your CV.” (B, 07:08)
- Emotional impact: “So bad. I’m sorry. Of course, each time you have to overcome this kind of rejection. I mean, one month you are 55 and you don’t fit with the team for one month.” (B, 08:50)
3. Systemic Age Discrimination and Public Policy Response
[09:04 – 12:38]
- Age discrimination is technically illegal, but a government study found applicants aged 48-55 were three times less likely to be called back than those aged 23-30.
- Language matters: Minister of Work Astrid Panosyan-Bouvet prefers “experienced worker” or “50 plus” to “senior.”
- Patrice de Boisien (Oazis consultancy): Discrimination is so widespread “it’s almost the norm.”
- “We are seeing this silent discrimination based on the idea that seniors are too expensive. They are old, they’ve outlived their usefulness, they are difficult to manage, they are completely false assumptions. But because of these assumptions we don’t hire them.” (C, 10:24)
- Many companies’ only measures for older workers are exit options, not retention.
4. The Value of Older Workers and Intergenerational Synergy
[11:40 – 12:38]
- “A 45 year old senior or a future senior is not a has been; on the contrary, the study we conducted shows that they are more motivated, that they perform better in a company because they have more time... When you bring a senior into a project team, it's motivating for them, but it also motivates younger people.” (C, 11:40)
- Seniors bring experience, pragmatism, and perspective that complements the theoretical knowledge of younger colleagues.
5. Overcoming Job Search Hurdles: Advice from a Career Consultant
[12:42 – 14:18]
- Most online applications for older jobseekers are filtered out by job board algorithms, often without a clear rejection.
- Patrice de Boisien advises jobseekers to rely on “physical encounters”—networking and meeting employers face-to-face.
- “If you know how to meet the company's needs, regardless of your age, you're useful. And in fact, the face-to-face, this networking approach, as we often say, really helps combat these stereotypes.” (C, 13:58)
6. Company Case Study: Schneider Electric’s Approach
[16:06 – 18:59]
- At Schneider Electric, 42% of the workforce in France is over 50.
- Comprehensive policy: All older workers are asked to identify their professional aspirations via role models (Claire—continue; Thierry—train; Alba—ambitious; Pierre—prepare for retirement).
- Proposals for support are tailored to each profile.
- Motivation: “Because in fact, you don’t have any other options because of the demography… you must do that, otherwise you are going to lose a kind of competitive [edge].” (G, 18:41)
7. The Employee Experience: Adapting and Thriving Over 50
[19:09 – 21:17]
- Helene Peison Serval, 55, from Schneider Electric, found that transitioning to project work and regularly updating her skills helped her continue to thrive.
- “When you get to a certain age, you feel uncomfortable saying, maybe they want to replace me, maybe I’m not useful anymore. ... The key thing is to adapt and to follow the changes in the organization. ... You have to challenge yourself to take new opportunities and adapt.” (D, 20:14)
- Early retirement initiatives in the past were misguided: “Now that I come to the age and I say, oh my God, I could, could not stop. ... between 50 and 60, this is where you have the best experience. You can be very useful for the group.” (D, 20:51)
- Stage fright about age remains: “It’s an issue that nobody wants to discuss. We prefer hiding it... When you are overseas, you don’t want to mention that because you think you would be discriminated.” (D, 21:36)
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “When we meet a senior, the best thing we can think of to say is that they don’t look their age, which shows immediately that we have a problem with age.” (C, 02:55)
- “The AI says no. Because of age?” (A, 07:22), “Because of age.” (B, 07:25)
- “We conducted a study in 2023 on the employment of seniors... the response was generally we’re going to put exit measures in place. In other words, we’re going to help them leave.” (C, 10:24)
- “A younger person has done advanced studies... but the senior person has experience... they will bring a certain perspective to juniors in approaching situations.” (C, 12:09)
- “You have to bypass the job offer robots that operate the job boards... It is not to try to find a permanent position or sell yourself at all costs. It’s to listen to the company’s needs.” (C, 13:06)
- “Because of the demography, you will have less young generation entering the market... you must do that, otherwise you are going to lose a kind of competitive [edge].” (G, 18:41)
- “Between 50 and 60, this is where you have the best experience. You can be very useful for the group.” (D, 20:51)
Important Timestamps for Key Segments
- [02:24] – Episode setup on France’s view and treatment of older workers.
- [04:32] – Geraldine’s story: a personal account of jobseeking after 50.
- [09:04] – Comparison of French and UK stats for employment rates over 55.
- [10:24] – Patrice de Boisien on the systemic nature of age discrimination.
- [12:38] – Why age diversity helps companies and teams.
- [13:06] – Job search advice for older workers.
- [16:06] – Company case study: Schneider Electric’s policy for older workers.
- [19:09] – Helene Peison Serval: Facing fears and adapting at 55.
- [21:17] – Reflections on reluctance to disclose age at work.
Conclusion
France’s battle with workplace ageism is both urgent and nuanced. With significant numbers of talented, experienced workers sidelined due to pervasive prejudice—often abetted by AI hiring filters—companies, government, and individuals all have roles to play in breaking these patterns. As the case of Schneider Electric shows, retaining and developing older employees isn’t just a social good, it’s a business imperative in a country with an aging population. The episode underscores the untapped potential and resilience of workers over 50, while offering practical advice both for jobseekers and for those who can change workplace cultures from within.