How Homeworthy took over YouTube

Summary

Podcast Summary: “How Homeworthy Took Over YouTube”

Business of Home Podcast
Host: Dennis Scully
Guests: Alison Kenworthy & Michael Koenigs, Co-Founders of Homeworthy
Date: April 27, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Dennis Scully interviews Alison Kenworthy and Michael Koenigs, the couple behind the YouTube channel Homeworthy, which exploded in popularity by offering long-form, beautifully told home tours. The discussion covers their career pivots from network news to digital media, the unique formula behind Homeworthy's success, the evolving YouTube landscape, and insights for designers and creators thinking about content and media’s future.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Leap From Network News to YouTube

• Alison’s Career Change: After 15 years in TV (Good Morning America), Alison left to launch Homeworthy, blending her passions for storytelling and homes. The beginnings were humble, using just an iPhone, a microphone attachment, and a selfie stick.
• Quote:

  “I always had a passion for architecture and design, but never had the skills to be a designer and wanted to find a way to partner my two interests, one being journalism and storytelling and the other, this passion for homes and decor and sort of snooping around, if you will, in other people's homes.” (03:19 – Alison)

• Persistence Through Slow Growth: Early episodes saw little traction (“12 people have watched your recent episode”), but Alison kept going, driven by sheer belief and enjoyment in the process.

2. The Homeworthy Formula & Growth

• Pandemic Inflection Point: The channel’s archive was discovered during COVID lockdowns, catalyzing audience growth.
• Longer Content Works:

  “In the beginning, the episodes were 3 minutes, 4 minutes, 5 minutes max. And now the episodes are 45 minutes to an hour...the YouTube platform loves long form content and our viewers loved this, the storytelling behind the homes.” (08:11 – Alison)

• Newsroom Approach:

  “We really function almost as a news agency, but just in the lifestyle and home space...You’ve got to hook them the same way you hook somebody in news. You’ve got to hook them with a home tour.” (08:54 – Alison)

3. The YouTube Ecosystem Explained (with Michael)

• Shift in Perception: YouTube, once seen as home to low-quality “cat videos,” now “rivals networks” in polish, audience, and money.
• Monetization:
  • Creators get 55% of ad revenue. Other revenue: paid memberships, product integrations, referrals, and brand sponsorships.
  • Success is measured in minutes watched and regular uploads.

  “You have the click-through rate based on the image you project before people even start watching...The more minutes people watch, the more money you make.” (11:08 – Michael)

• Audience Discovery: Most brand deals come from “superfans”—often company CMOs—who are regular viewers.

4. Storytelling and Authenticity: What Sets Homeworthy Apart

• Intimate, Unscripted Tours: Homeworthy’s tours mimic being shown around a home at a friendly holiday party, not a glossy production.

  “We like the walkthrough to be as if you’ve shown up at somebody’s holiday party and the host says, let me just give you a quick tour of the house.” (15:23 – Alison)

• Building Trust: Small crews help subjects relax and allow for genuineness.
• Breakout Moment:
  • Bunny Williams’ episode, filmed on an iPhone, was a turning point—breaking a million views and lending credibility.

  “I'm forever grateful to Bunny for allowing us to film her home, because she really was a rite of passage for us.” (16:44 – Alison)

5. The Audience Profile and Impact

• Audience Demographics:
  • 80% watch on TV screens, not phones.
  • 75% are female.
  • Many are professional, experienced designers.

  “It’s not simply casual viewers...it’s people trying to see what their peers are doing in the design community.” (19:34 – Michael)

• Impact: Homeworthy is a source of inspiration and trend analysis for the design community.

6. Operations and Scale

• Team Structure:
  • Over 120 videographers/producers in the US and Europe.
  • Core team in NY and DC; decades of TV production experience.

  “When you find that talented person who can make a home come alive, they tend to get a lot of work from us.” (20:48 – Michael)

• Growth Metrics:
  • From “60 views per video” to “100,000 views in the first 10 days.”
  • Nearly 2 million followers across platforms.

7. What Works and What Doesn’t: Lessons in Virality

• The Formula: Maximalist, layered, “cozy and warm” homes—regardless of size—tend to perform best.

  “They love homes with layers and colors and patterns and texture.” (26:48 – Alison)

• Variety Still Matters: Modern homes underperform initially but find niche audiences over time. Homeworthy is experimenting with sub-channels.

  “For modern homes...it won’t do very well initially, but the algorithm eventually tends to find people who love looking at modern homes.” (28:09 – Michael)

8. The Power of Positivity in Community

• Supportive Comments:
  • The Homeworthy comment section is notably positive.
  • Alison attributes this to the personal connections the stories build:

  “You don’t want to attack somebody who so graciously invited you into their home...it’s really more about the person.” (30:56 – Alison)

• Comment Influence:
  • Positive core fans dissuade trolling.
  • One negative comment still stings among hundreds of positive ones.

9. The Future of Media & Design Content

• Rise of Individual Creators:
  • With AI and easy editing, individuals will rival studios in a few years.
  • Longer-form, deeper storytelling is the next wave—TV’s 22-minute limits are outdated.

  “The storytelling capabilities of individuals can rival movie studios within the next five years, thanks in part to AI.” (33:50 – Michael)

• Immersive Tech:
  • Virtual tours and augmented reality will redefine the experience for designers and clients in the next decade.

10. Advice for Creators & Designers Considering YouTube

• Just Start: No need for fancy equipment; consistency and stamina are key.

  “You don’t have to be a professional and you can create whatever you want and upload it and see what works and see what doesn’t. And you don’t need fancy equipment.” (37:53 – Alison)

• Educational Takeaways: Ensure the audience learns something.
• Long-Term Commitment:
  • Channels aren’t recommended until passing the one-year mark.

  “Unless you have Alison’s stamina...the burnout rate of superstar YouTube folks are high. And then most quit before the first year.” (40:59 – Michael)

• Don’t Chase Perfection: The path to virality is not assured—it’s about experimentation, persistence, and iterating what works.

11. Homeworthy’s Expansion Plans

• Verticals & Franchises: Launching sub-channels by region and topic (e.g. Homeworthy California, Homeworthy Gardening).
• The Worthy Media Network:
  • Strategic parent company to grow and monetize other creators’ channels, leveraging cross-promotion and synergy.
  • New partnerships (Amazon, Yahoo, airlines), live and shopping events in the works.

12. Openness & Community Engagement

• Pitching Homeworthy:

  “We always encourage people to pitch themselves, their homes...We love to discover new spaces that have not been featured before in any kind of publication.” (48:48 – Alison)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• Persistence & Growth:

  “From the 60. So that seems pretty good. From the original 60. Yeah, that seems like good growth.” (24:02 – Dennis)

• On Audience Loyalty:

  “It’s about the character of a home and it feeling lived in and feeling like it has a soul.” (26:57 – Alison)

• On Platform Differences:

  “There’s relatively little overlap in these audiences...it’s certainly our group goal to get everyone to watch on YouTube because that’s the only platform we monetize directly.” (24:27 – Michael)

• On the Surprising Kindness of the Community:

  “I've never seen anything like it. It’s fantastic...the comment section of your videos seems so much more kind and supportive and cheerleading.” (30:14 – Dennis)

• On Burnout & Consistency:

  “Most quit before the first year. And in fact, the algorithm recognized it and tends not to even suggest channels until they've passed a year mark.” (40:59 – Michael)

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Important Timestamps

• 03:19 – Alison on combining journalism and home passion
• 08:11 – Impact of the pandemic and shift to long-form
• 10:23 – Michael on YouTube’s evolution and algorithms
• 12:35 – Detailed breakdown of YouTube monetization
• 15:23 – Homeworthy’s unique, personal storytelling style
• 19:30 – Deep dive on audience demographics
• 26:48 – Discussion on what types of homes “work”
• 33:50 – The future of storytelling, AI, and immersive content
• 37:53 – Advice for creators considering YouTube
• 46:08 – Homeworthy's expansion, new verticals, and business development
• 48:48 – Call for audience pitches and the importance of community

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Final Messages

• Homeworthy’s core thesis: Authentic, human storytelling about personal spaces has massive audience appeal—especially when told with journalistic care and a small, nimble team.
• YouTube is fast becoming the platform for design and media, and creators/designers who embrace its possibilities and persist can find audiences they never imagined.
• Don’t be discouraged by slow beginnings or small view counts:

  “Just try, try, try again. And you will at some point be rewarded if your content finds its audience.” (49:56 – Alison)

Transcript

[A]

This is business of Home.

[B]

I'm your host, Dennis Scully. Every week, I'll be speaking with leaders and innovators from all corners of the home industry. My guests this week are Alison Kenworthy and Michael Koenigs, the couple behind the YouTube sensation Homeworthy. Alison and Michael both came from the world of TV news. She was a producer on Good Morning America. He worked for ABC. But in 2018. In 2019, Alison left it all behind to launch Homeworthy, starting off filming home tours on her own with an iPhone. After a slow start, it took off, and in six short years, the channel has amassed almost 800,000 followers, putting out hundreds of tours with top designers and celebrities alike. I spoke with Alison and Michael about why Homeworthy got so popular once its content got longer, the secrets of a good home Tour, and why YouTube is the future of media. This podcast is sponsored by Krypton Home Fabric. Famous for its luxury indoor performance fabrics, Crypton revolutionized the category 30 years ago by creating beautiful, easy to clean upholstery fabrics for interiors. Today, Crypton provides fabrics that meet the conscientious considerations of designers, offering performance upholstery that's beautifully designed and responsibly made, with many fabrics made right here in the US Listeners are invited to click on the Our fabric tab on krypton.com to find a fun test kit that also makes for a great client presentation tool. This podcast is sponsored by Ernesta this spring. Beautifully crafted and tailored to your client's exact dimensions, Ernesta's custom size rugs pair elevated design with premium materials. Each piece reflects thoughtful craftsmanship while still delivering when you need. In as little as two weeks, trade members enjoy one on one support from Ernesta's dedicated consultants who assist with everything from sample requests to final quotes, helping you streamline your workflow and your project management. Learn more about Ernesta's trade [e-mail] BOH that's ernesta.com BOH and now, on with the show. So, Alison and Michael, I'm delighted to

[A]

have you both here.

[B]

I want to fast forward through your very impressive resumes. You were both in TV news.

[A]

Alison, you were a producer on Good Morning America.

[B]

Michael, you worked with ABC News.

[A]

And at one point we're gonna leave

[B]

to go to YouTube, but you ended up at Disney. Let's jump over that and start with this very pivotal moment, Alison, where you

[A]

decide to leave network television behind and

[B]

start this new venture.

[A]

Walk us through that and what it was all about.

[C]

So at that point, I had been in television for 15 years and I just felt that there was something out there that was still left to be done. And I was excited by the idea of going off on my own and trying something new. And I always had a passion for architecture and design, but never had the skills to be a designer and wanted to find a way to partner my two interests, one being journalism and storytelling and the other, this passion for homes and decor and sort of snooping around, if you will, in other people's homes.

[A]

Was that something you did? A lot of you just were snooping

[C]

around with other people? I did both.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

So I grew up in Georgetown in Washington D.C. and that's where I developed this sort of love of architecture and old homes specifically, and homes with stories and a soul. And it's just sort of from being in friends houses or my father actually is an Episcopal priest and that's where what took US to Washington D.C. so we were constantly sort of, you know, he was a fairly social person. So we would, you know, spend a lot of times in other people's homes and, and that's where this kind of all developed, I think, and just a natural curiosity for how other people live. So as I was thinking about what my next step would be, career wise, Homeworthy was born. And it was a difficult decision to leave Good Morning America because I was, you know, I had a great job and one that you don't leave easily,

[A]

one that you worked so hard to get.

[C]

I worked so hard to get there. But I was there for seven years and I feel, I felt like I really did sort of accomplish so much and had incredible experiences in the field. And so Homeworthy was born.

[A]

But so when you say Homeworthy was born, what was really the idea that you had? What was the notion and what made it seem compelling enough or strong enough in your mind to leave this incredible.

[C]

I know. Cause it sort of, it does seem like, you know, like leaving. And some of it, Dennis, might have just been like pure naivete. I mean, I really believed that this idea of creating video content around homes could work. And it didn't in the beginning. You know, I, I started out on my own with, you know, an iPhone, a microphone attachment and a selfie stick. And I basically booked friends and family. And it was a real slow burn. And it was me showing up in people's houses. They would say, where's the camera crew? And I'm like, you're looking at her. And you know, here I was booking, producing, editing, doing everything. I'm what's called a one man band in the news world. You're doing everything. And I just kept doing it. It didn't even, it wasn't even doing well and I just kept doing it. And I'm like shocked that I never gave up. But I had such fun interviewing all of these people and really trying to bring their homes to life and tell their stories. And the episodes weren't really getting much traction. And you know, here I was, you know, a three time Emmy award winning producer and I come from gma where my content, where the stories I worked on were seen by 6 million people. And now people are watching YouTube but you know, it's like 12 people have watched your recent episode. So I kept doing it and you know, fast forward, I'd say a year. The pandemic hit and the channel was discovered. And that's sort of how the company then became it, you know, started to feel more like a real company. And it took off and we were able to hire people and you know, in the background, Michael had been an incredible confidant and consultant because he had all of this YouTube knowledge and expertise ease and was really sort of guiding me from, from the sidelines at that point before he ended up coming on full time a couple of years later.

[A]

So did anything change dramatically in how you were doing it when Covid created this, this boom in interest and eyeballs, were you, were you just doing the same thing you had been doing but suddenly all these people were forced to be in their homes?

[C]

No, I was suddenly doing, I was suddenly doing nothing. And the channel itself got discovered, right? The archive was discovered and the numbers started going up, subscribers started to accumulate. And then once it was safe to film again and be in people's homes is when we re engaged with it. And what happened then is that the content went from being quite short form. In the beginning the episodes were 3 minutes, 4 minutes, 5 minutes max. And now the episodes are 45 minutes to an hour, hour. And we discovered that the YouTube platform loves long form content and our viewers loved this, the storytelling behind the homes. But it was so counterintuitive to how I had created content for my entire career. Because when you work in news you have maximum two minutes to tell a story. So you really have to figure out what is the story here. And, and truthfully, my background in news has shaped homeworthy so much because we really function almost as a news agency, but just in the lifestyle and home space. You know, the way that our stories are crafted, we want the viewer to immediately care about the homeowner and about the home in the first 20 seconds. Of the episode because I know how important that is to retaining a viewer. You've really gotta hook them the same way you hook somebody in news. You've got to hook them with a home tour.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, no, it makes a lot of sense and I want to get into that more, but I want to come back to you now, Michael.

[B]

So, Michael, educate us about YouTube.

[A]

So you almost went to work there. They reached out to you, they thought, hey, you can really help us get some things going. We're in the early stages. When did YouTube start to really come on the scene and help us understand the platform? And as Alison was just alluding to what works on this platform and what tends to catch a lot of attention

[B]

and eyeballs and build the numbers.

[D]

Well, YouTube has and for such a long time been viewed as a backwater of not premium, not long form, instead clips of cats and this. And that's held it back for years in terms of that perception. And it really has just been in the last five or so years where the creator economy, both the amount of money you can make by building a successful channel as well as the caliber of storytelling has grown exponentially from what had been vloggers who were essentially uploading home videos to an ecosystem where the level of Polish rivals networks. And I think even within the past year, YouTube has now surpassed Disney plus and Netflix as the most watched platform on television devices. So it's a direct competitor to Netflix. And recently the Netflix CEO said so. So I discovered while there the types of stories that we could create. Original content that would get in some. I think my most viral interview got over 50 million views. And the storytelling techniques on YouTube have to grab that attention in the first five to 10 seconds. The thumbnail is a different attribute that you never have on television where people are just clicking through and immediately entering your ecosystem. You have the click through rate based on the image you project before people even start watching is certainly valuable. And then the last part of it is really retaining their attention. The more minutes people watch, the more money you make. And so holding their attention is vital. And why YouTubers make so much more money than TikTokers or Instagrammers are. Because TikTok is getting you to watch for 30 seconds where YouTubers are getting you to consume 20 minute videos every week. If you're Mr. Beast.

[A]

Exactly. And help me understand how the renumeration part works on YouTube. So as you say, the longer you watch, the more you're going to be making. How are you making money from all of this?

[B]

Where does that come from.

[D]

So each creator gets paid 55% of the ad revenue that's sold by Google's ad sales team. So they retain 45%. The YouTuber gets 55%. That's the baseline of the ad revenue. They've recently expanded the number of ways you can make money and we've pursued all of these avenues. You can now have paid memberships so you can create ad free paywall content and have your members pay on a monthly basis to see those exclusive videos ad free. We also have product sales and integrations where they'll have links to in our case furniture items that are seen in these homes. And when people purchase that, we get a percentage of the revenue. You see that's just about 10% or less of the sales revenue there. Third way is with thanks or super fans can occasionally just send you five bucks out of the blue. That doesn't happen a whole lot to us. And then brands too will direct once they see the success big time brands will then directly reach out to you and say hey, let's tell a custom story together. And that's the other way you leverage the audiences and the watch time.

[A]

And how are they all learning? So homeworthy. And we'll get back to Alison with some of the specifics. But homeworthy blows up in this huge way. How do all these brands learn that this is happening so they can reach out to you? How do they do they get some report that says hey, here are some of the hot channels on YouTube lately or like what's the intelligence and the data they get.

[D]

But I think it is interesting. Most of our deals have really been from super fans who are the CMOs of lots of furniture company. Yeah, they just stumble on it either on Instagram or and they think to themselves if I'm watching this and enjoying it week after week, I suspect my peers do as well. And I think that's their initial foray is almost always we enjoy this and they see us mentioning brands and they're like why can't I have my company get a little love there as well? So that's how a lot of our relationships start.

[A]

So Alison, coming back to you with great humility, you describe these videos that in the early days just weren't catching on. You were showing up at people's homes and doing, doing quick interviews and going around and it wasn't getting any traction. But at some point you start doing something that others weren't doing. Something really caught on about the formula that you started to bring to this because there were plenty of Other home tour channels that existed, but they didn't blow up in the way Homeworthy has.

[C]

I think what has separated our company from others is really the element of storytelling. And it's not just about someone's home. It's also about who they are and hearing their story and learning more about them. And we like the walkthrough to be as if you've shown up at somebody's holiday party and the host says, let me just give you a quick tour of the house. We like it to sort of feel that same way. And because we also have decided to go with sort of a small production footprint, I think that's helped us with our storytelling. Again, coming from the world of network news, I would show up with, you know, three photographers and lots of equipment and lights, and it's daunting. And we've made a conscious effort to sort of have a small footprint in people's homes so that they are immediately put at ease. And Bunny Williams was one of the first big interviews we got, and she was one filmed on an iPhone. And she, for us, was a big stamp of credibility in this world of creating content in the YouTube space. And her episode was one of our very first to hit a million views. And I think that that greatly helped us get discovered and made people think, wow, what's homeworthy? I need to. I need to look at them and see who they are, because we were largely unknown at that point. I'm forever grateful to Bunny for allowing us to film her home, because she really was a rite of passage for us.

[A]

And how did that come about? You were filming Bunny's home. Did you just reach out to her?

[C]

I think somebody from her team reached out to us, but there was a mutual connection. It wasn't like a total cold call.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And she put a lot of trust in us, and she loves the video. I've run into her many times since, and she's a big supporter of Homeworthy, which is very kind. And from there, it's always been about building blocks and, you know, going from Bunny to others. You know, we always try and keep moving forward in whatever, whether or not that's moving forward with designers or people on the lifestyle front sort of sphere, or. We last year did an interview with Amy Schumer at her home in New Orleans. So we're always trying to find the most interesting people with the most interesting stories to open up their homes to us.

[B]

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[A]

Suddenly you build this great big audience.

[B]

Who is this audience?

[A]

What have you learned about the people that are tuning into to homeworthy and to your point about where they're consuming this? I think years ago people thought, oh, everyone's just watching YouTube videos on their phone or maybe their kids are watching stuff on the computer. But it sounds like the huge majority of people that are consuming your content are watching it on the big old flat screen in the living room. I mean, these are people that are really tuning in. But tell me about that.

[D]

That's exactly right. Nearly 80% of our viewers are watching on TV. They want to see these homes on the biggest scre they have in their houses. And I think statistically far more female than male audience. It's also around 75% female audience. And we just did actually a deep brand study of professional designers. A huge percentage of them are professional designers and many with 15 plus years of experience. And so it's not simply casual viewers who are trying to kick back. It's people trying to see what their peers are doing in the design community and really understand the latest and greatest in trends. In part because we feature so many homes. I think we're one of the most prolific organizations in terms of actually capturing homes in every corner of the country and now the world.

[A]

Well, and tell me more about that and tell me Alison was just suggesting that the team has grown quite a bit. Give people a sense of how big the team now is and how big the operation has become.

[D]

So we have over 120 videographers and producers in almost every major city in the US as well as London, Paris, Milan and a handful of other cities where we're hoping to grow both our local storytelling, where we're now making sub channels for homeworthy California, Homeworthy New York. And so we really have this remote team as well as a core team of producers who Alison and I are on the phone with every day as they help book. Because, as she mentioned, the lifeblood is identifying great homes and then editing these conversations down. And that's what this core team of producers based in New York and D.C. and a few other states do. So we've been incredibly proud. And our best videographers come back again and again. And so when you find that talented person who can make a home come alive, they tend to get a lot of work from us. And that's been a great relationship as well.

[B]

And as that.

[A]

So help me understand the cost structure versus the revenue structure there for you.

[D]

So each episode we have a local crew show up at the home, and our producers are doing the interviews remotely. So we have the crew cost, and then the editing cost is where you have a lot of time where it might take just a day or even a half day. Oftentimes it's just four hours of filming, but we end up with several weeks of cutting this down so it looks as polished and beautiful as the final product does. And so we have a pretty lean team. There's about four to five people who touch each episode. But, you know, the core is we're not necessarily showing up at these homes with massive, you know, sound techs and lighting. And I think that creates the authenticity. And we realize we could do it that way because Alison filmed all the initial ones on her iPhone and edited them all herself. So when, you know, she came with the know how of exactly how long it should take to produce one of these episodes. And we figured out a way to scale that with. With a variety of people with that same kind of, like, chutzpah.

[C]

You know, we've never paid for YouTube subscribers, we've never paid for Instagram subscribers. They've all just found us organically and I think enjoy this content and share the content with their Instagram accounts, or, you know, our videos get shared quite a lot. It's just this organic discovery that happens. So we're hoping to hit a million subscribers soon.

[A]

How far away are you right now?

[C]

From about 200,000. So we've got a little work to do.

[D]

Well, we grow by easily 200,000 subscribers a year, so there's no reason we couldn't hit it later this year. And in aggregate, it's now just about 2 million followers across platforms. And that audience really did grow from that first year. We were getting averaging about 60 views per video. And now to get consistently around 100,000

[C]

is just in the first, usually in the first 10 days to two weeks.

[A]

So the first 10 days to two weeks you've got 100,000 views on the hope.

[C]

That's the hope.

[A]

From the 60. So that seems pretty good. From the original 60. Yeah, that seems like good growth. Michael, to Alison's point just there about both how the algorithms impact all of this and also help me understand the the supporting ecosystem. So does Instagram help lead a lot of Traffic over to YouTube? Does YouTube lead a lot? I mean, tell me how that all works together or does it really.

[D]

Well, it's a fascinating question which is there's relatively little overlap in these audiences. I think there are some people who simply think we have an Instagram. And even though we try to move them over, it's certainly our group goal to get everyone to watch on YouTube because that's the only platform we monetize directly. But a lot of our viewers are getting highlight reels on TikTok and elsewhere. But the key for us is how do we get more views on the long form video. And our website has become kind of a great place for people to be able to search and discover strictly our content and that's grown as well. And I think one other note is there's certainly a number of videos where we don't make money on and that's where the view count. If your break Even point is 100,000 views, you're really hoping that these folks resonate because you're going to have some misses. And that's part of our equation too. And part of the volume game is being able to tell as many stories as we do. Some are going to take off and some aren't and it's going to just like Hollywood where you really are dependent on the hits that take off. That's true of our model as well. So the Bunny Williams really. And then those videos will oftentimes require views for years that it's not a one and done. And when you air a TV special, it's the fact that the library will sometimes not do well in the first two months and then suddenly a moment of inflection will happen where the person will be in the news again or somehow catch on in the algorithm and you have a hit later on.

[A]

Well, and I'm curious about what doesn't work and what you've learned. Is it the house is a little bit more modern and they didn't love that, or is it that the storyteller was just a little too quirky or maybe not quirky enough? I'm guessing in the case of your audience, I mean, I Wonder what you've learned about what doesn't seem to resonate. And again, I'm thinking about this and I think you and I have talked about this in the past, this sort of mark intelligence that the home industry in general can be getting from all of this, because I just think there's so much to learn from what you all are doing in that capacity.

[C]

I think our viewer loves a maximalist home, if that term is still a term. They love homes with layers and colors and patterns and texture. So English homes, for example, the Cotswolds, London, Paris, can't get enough. They do incredibly well for us. And it's not about the size of the home, it's just about the character of a home and it feeling lived in and feeling like it has a soul. And it could be a 350 square foot studio apartment or it could be a sprawling estate, but there's a certain aesthetic I think that our viewers like and that is cozy and warm and homey. Those are the homes that we feel sort of. Not that we feel that we know do the best from, from data points. But it's not to say that we don't want to offer a wide variety and offering of all different kinds of homes because that may be how you meet a new audience member or a new niche of design enthusiasts. So. So we really try and be equal opportunists across the board and profile all different kinds of homes because you never know what's gonna stick and what someone might find interesting.

[D]

And just to build on that, we've done modern homes and the algorithm initially because the core audience and in part because so many of the original videos we put up were, as Alison mentioned, in that vein of the Georgetown vibes where so many of her initial episodes came from. But now when we do a modern home, for example, it won't do very well initially, but the algorithm eventually tends to find people who love looking at modern homes and there certainly is that demographic. So there's sometimes a recovery that happens and we're planning on doing more sub channels that would deliver modern homes to people who love modern architecture and that might be segmented off, homeworthy or promoted, cross promoted in different ways because YouTube certainly loves niche audiences and we find that is true in the home space as well.

[A]

And is someone else going to have to just exec produce those segments, Alison, because you're just. That's just not your. That's just not your thing. Someone else is going to have to take over the modern home part of.

[C]

Listen, I love a modern Home. I do love a modern home. I love snooping around. Anybody's home who loves, that's the thing.

[A]

If you can sleep around, Alison is here for it. If you can let us in, open those cabinets, open those drawers.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, I say, where's the powder room? And then I've somehow found myself in the bedroom. It's like that Steve Martin scene from Father of the Bride.

[A]

Well, but I am struck, and you

[B]

talked about this earlier, I am struck

[A]

by, and I don't know what explains it, but the audience or the comment section of your videos seems so much more kind and supportive and cheerleading. Recently, a well known designer had her new apartment put up on the New York Times website. And the comments were scathing, they were vicious, and every single one of them, one after another after another. And you go on the homeworthy YouTube channel and it's, oh, I love her.

[B]

I want to see more.

[A]

Oh my, look at that yellow and the green and the blue. I mean, people I've never seen seen anything like it. It's fantastic. And I mean, it was just like on and on. And so I wonder what is the disconnect? Are these real people? They are real people. I mean, are these just charm robots? Is this like chatgpt who just compliments you on every idea you've ever had? I mean, what, what is all joking aside, what is the difference between this audience and, I don't know, the people who show up to gripe, which frankly, I'm much more accustomed to. I'm much more accustomed to the edge of people because people can be, can be rough.

[D]

What have you. What do you think?

[C]

I don't, you know, I don't know the answer to that question. And Michael, I don't know if you have an answer to that question, but because so much of what we do is about the person themself and their story, you don't want to attack somebody who so graciously invited you into their home and has shared their soul with you because it's not just about the design and the style. And I got this couch here and I got this armoire here. It's really more about the person in a way. So I don't know, I mean, I always find it shocking when people are nasty online because, you know, it's like, well, what does your house look like and what's your story?

[D]

You know, and it might be too, I think a part of it is that if you see the tone of the core fan group being positive, then you're reluctant potentially to jump in with the odd man out. And what's interesting too is Alison and I have put up some. We did a tour of our apartment and people read the comments, if the hosts are reading it. So there certainly can be an insult in there every once in a while in the sense of how did it

[A]

go with your place? Were people kind? Were people nice?

[D]

They loved? Certainly there are a couple negative comments and you never forget them. You know, it's like all you have like 500 positive comments and the one negative one is the one that sticks you, the core.

[A]

That's the one you took to bed and you can't sleep.

[D]

I get you. Exactly. So negative comments are a potent thing.

[B]

We're taking a quick break to remind you about Krypton. Krypton home indoor performance fabric is easy to find, sample, and specify a trusted partner to some of the top names in design. Krypton's beautiful indoor performance fabrics can be found at Pindler, Schumacher, Fourhands, and Row, to name a few, as well as through retail furniture trade programs such as the newly relaunched our House Trade program. For inspiration and design news, follow Krypton on Instagram @kryptonfabric. And now back to the show.

[A]

So it seems as if this cord cutting movement that took hold years ago and just continues, right? And everybody is trying to figure out what's next for all these networks. They've all scrambled and everyone's moving online and changing.

[B]

What, what is the future of media in your mind? Where does this all go?

[D]

I think that we have a future where the storytelling capabilities of individuals can rival movie studios within the next five years, thanks in part to AI So you now have a whole group of creators that are going to be making very compelling animated films that are going to go direct to YouTube and then the ability of editors and the iPhone to tell stories that didn't look as cinematic as those that used to cost millions of dollars to make is going to enable a massive generation of quality content. So I think that creates a much more competitive landscape for anyone jumping in and a supply that's going to explode as it already has done as more people start learning how to edit short videos as they're doing on their phones, and they all are then trying to make the migration over to YouTube and tell longer stories. And I think that's where a lot of people get hung up. They somehow find it easier to make a short one minute video. And that making that leap to telling longer stories I think is inevitable. And it's going to be the next big phase and then the last part of it, I think, is how people consume content, where right now it's on the tv, on the wall or the phone. I do think there's going to be a moment where these Oculus and other avenues allow you to experience these homes in 3D, where you're walking in a tour and able to turn and look around the rooms in full. And that is still probably a decade away. But where things are headed.

[A]

I was surprised that Apple's Vision Pro didn't capture more audience. We went and tested it and it was pretty fun. And I thought, oh yeah, for the very thing that you were describing, I can see this audience. But the funny thing is I don't see that audience actually being the ones that buy that product and put those glasses on, which is the disconnect. And part of that might be a generational thing as much as anything. But I think you're right that that technology is going to offer so many different capabilities to go even deeper into the subject matter that they obviously already love.

[D]

Exactly. And so engrossing. And we thought about the iPhone actually has capabilities of shooting in that kind of like three dimensional aspect. And so we debated on whether to start filming in that way, but held off because there's just not enough people wearing the glasses. And that's the challenge. But you wear glasses already and that helps that hurdle of people who aren't yet as familiar or comfortable putting on glasses in the design space too. You can imagine designers as they're walking through the room, the ability to automatically see what a different color looks like on the wall while wearing those. I think the applications in this home space are enormous. Beyond the creative side.

[A]

Well, exactly. And I think designers taking clients through will just have all of this technology. The clients who perhaps can't visualize as easily or as readily as the designer can. Here, let me show you what this room's gonna look like in this color to your point. And suddenly put the glasses on. There it is. And Alison, I'm wondering, so many people are on the fence about YouTube and Amber Lewis has just created her channel and she's gonna show you her building her own home on that and that's her next big endeavor. And Corey Damon Jenkins has created a multi part series and we know that that Catherine Ireland and others are spending time and sounds like they're doing stuff with you. It seems like this is a place that designers should be in a huge way, sharing their work, telling everything that people want to know about their process, about how they do what they do. What do they need to hear to help them just take the plunge?

[C]

Well, I think every creator should be on this platform. YouTube has now surpassed Disney and Netflix in terms of viewership. The Oscars are moving over to YouTube, so it's just at the forefront of streaming. And I think the beauty of the platform is that you don't have to be a professional and you can create whatever you want and upload it and see what works and see what doesn't. And you don't need fancy equipment. You could do it with an iPhone and a microphone attachment and a gimbal the way we were doing it six years ago. And it's just about creating that relationship with an audience and building their trust and building a regular cadence of content. I think that's also an important note about the platform, is that it likes to know that you will be a regular content creator. So it might be once a week, but they know that at 11am on a Saturday, you're putting up a new video.

[A]

And what should people be mindful of in terms of how they're presenting themselves or how they're creating this content? There must be some do's and don'ts that are helpful from all you've learned.

[C]

I don't know that there are rules,

[A]

actually, because it's such a broad audience and people can catch on in so

[C]

many different broad audience. And, you know, there's something for everybody. So say Catherine Ireland wants to take you through one of the famous antique fairs that she visits in France and brings you along on that experience with her. And the episode lasts 60 minutes. It's an hour. You know, most people are probably not going to have the opportunity to go to that market in rural France. So she's giving them the opportunity to transport them to this place and feel like they're her friend shopping. And for something like that, I don't think it needs to feel heavily edited or produced. You just want to bring the person along with you and, you know, share your secrets on how you negotiate or the kinds of things that you like to look for that might be actually something that's helpful. There should be takeaway information for the viewer. They like to learn something. So, you know, somewhat educational and that was even taught to us in network news. I mean, people want to walk away from watching something feeling like they've learned something. So when you have all of these designers with incredible knowledge, well, you know, maybe Corey Damon Jenkins will do a, an episode or do a video on color selection and picking paint color or how you mix fabrics together. So I think thinking about what the viewer can walk away with and feel like they've learned something is important.

[D]

I think the stamina, though, when Disney acquired Maker Studios, it was a $900 million acquisition and we basically were working with the top YouTube creators. And what was so striking is many of them a will burn out after a few years just because it is a lot of work to edit videos, period. And so even if as they start to get momentum, it is so engrossing that, you know, unless you create a broader infrastructure, the burnout rate of superstar YouTube folks are high. And then most quit before the first year. And in fact, the algorithm recognized it and tends not to even suggest channels until they've passed a year mark. Just so they know, hey, we're going to recommend something that has staying power. So it's this thing of unless you have Allison's stamina of putting out a lot of content that doesn't really resonate. The ability to continue to push forward and iterate to find the little things that are working and then double down on that from a format approach is the key. But once you get to that point, it's certainly you're able to build a viable business.

[A]

So if you've got the stamina, if you can survive it, if you can hang in there long enough for it to get the traction. But it doesn't sound like there was any. I mean, Alison, you mentioned the Bunny Williams video that blew up, but it sounds like in general it was just sticking with it and staying at it.

[C]

And 100%, especially in the beginning, I just, for whatever reason, never gave up. I just. I truly believe there was an audience for this. And I did make a conscious effort to not insert myself into these episodes, which is why I've never been a personality in the pieces. Because I want them to be able to stand on their own, and I want to be able to tell stories in far corners of the earth where. Where I don't have to go. Not because I don't want to go, but because in order to really scale this company, I know that I can't be in all of these places. You know, we have two or three shoots a day sometimes with our producers working all over the world. And in order to scale, I knew that I couldn't be in them. And that's fine. And that's how we have managed to grow this company.

[D]

And you mentioned Catherine Ireland and now Martin Lawrence Bullard. We are so excited now to be going beyond home tours and doing what are travel shows effectively. We have Martin's show coming out in the coming weeks for our paid members, where it's almost Anthony Bourdain style adventures to Istanbul, Tangier, Paris, where he's taking us inside the homes of his closest friends and discovering how the tastes of those cities and the style behind these doors is just staggering. And you do need to have a personality on YouTube. You can't be flat. And Martin and Kathryn and others who

[A]

have personality, no problem there with the two of them.

[D]

Yeah, exactly. Can really hold folks attention. And we're excited to be telling these kind of deeper, longer stories that run over a course of multiple episodes.

[A]

Couldn't agree more. And that's, I mean, it seems like, I mean, and poor hgtv, they're on the ropes and you're just piling it on and expanding at all these different channels. And I mean, do they go away altogether now and do you just take over? And what is there like some formal ceremony where there's just a declaration that homeworthy has become hgt? What does that look like?

[D]

Well, we are thrilled that there are a number of months where we're ahead of HGTV on YouTube. And I think it is a fascinating moment where the simple formulas of a DIY look at a house is losing, I think, to this deeper personal stories that come across and what we're doing. And I think so much of the television networks were built on the backs of access on distribution side and those walls have come down entirely. And so having a cable deal is no longer going to guarantee you high viewership. And so I think, think that they're having to raise the bar of the stories they're telling and even the length where they're stuck at really 22 minute shows for the most part. And when you're able to tell longer stories, which is what we do, and we push it to 45 or even an hour and a half with some of these that the YouTube algorithm certainly rewards deeper storytelling. And that's where we're not as confined as a television network is.

[A]

Okay, so as we wrap up, where is all of this going? So we've talked about the growth, we've talked about. We've got producers all over the world, we're going into homes in all these big European cities and elsewhere. Where does this. We got partnerships with Amazon. Yes, we've got.

[C]

Right.

[A]

So where does all of this go?

[C]

Well, we've just brought on a new vice president of business development who's helping us think big about homeworthy and how we explore these avenues. And you know, I Think that there's a real appetite for shopping and for product and for live events and having in person, you know, communal experiences together. And maybe a podcast at one point. Dennis, we will not tread on your waters.

[A]

Careful, careful.

[C]

We will not come after you. Dennis, maybe I would love if you would be a guest someday, maybe a podcast. Who noticed? And I think building out these sub channels that we have so homeworthy is one vertical, but you know, we currently have Homeworthy New York, Homeworthy California, Homeworthy South, Homeworthy Gardening we just launched, so Michael can speak more to that, but really building out a more robust offering of sub channels. And Michael, do you want to talk a little bit about that?

[D]

Sure. I think the other thing we've just done this past year is built a parent company called Worthy Media Network. And that is not only going to help build up the homeworthy franchises and homeworthy owned channels, but we're identifying best in class youtubers in the home and design space and helping them grow their channels and monetize their channels at a higher rate. So we recognize the network effect and this is what Disney we did well synergy where we could promote their channels on Homeworthy and then you can jump in and see the home renovation project of another designer potentially with ad flow across both these channels. So I think that on a macro level, Worthy Media is helping designers and home builders and a variety of other channel types grow their presence and figure out YouTube. And I think that's been a broader play, but really going deep local, as Alison mentioned, in various states and even we launched a Homeworthy England recently and then also expanding that distribution. We just got a deal with Yahoo and a new airline deal so you can be flying Icelandic Air. Watching your homeworthy YouTube is only one spot, so we've been excited by it all.

[A]

Yeah, well, it sounds like a lot of incoming and it sounds like a lot of designers should be reaching out to you and saying, hey, can we partner? Yes. I mean, absolutely.

[C]

We always encourage people to pitch themselves their homes. Just send us a description of the home and a little bit about you and some photos. We love to discover new spaces that have not been featured before in any kind of publication. And I think that the supply is enormous. That's not been touched and we're always excited to see homes and be pitched.

[A]

So if you have an outdated image of YouTube, hopefully this conversation will bring people into the future with what it ought to be. And also, Alison, there's such a huge and diverse audience that your content can catch on in ways you might not realize in part because people are thinking about the very limited formats that are available to them elsewhere. YouTube sounds like it's this great sort of uncharted horizon.

[C]

Yes. And just don't quit if you're first or second or tenth.

[A]

Don't quit if you just keep getting 60 views of those early videos.

[C]

Just try, try, try again. And you will at some point be rewarded if your content finds its audience.

[A]

Yes, the audience is. That sounds like the big. The big message here, that's for sure. All right, this has been such a pleasure. Allison, Michael, thank you so much both for making the time. I'm really glad to get to speak with you and learn so much more about what you're doing.

[C]

Well, thank you so much, Dennis. We're huge fans of yours in this podcast and feel like this is a big moment for us to be on it. So thank you for having us.

[D]

You're such a charmer. I just love the way you understand this business and the sheer volume of people you've talked to has helped us really build a better company. So thanks for the work you do.

[B]

Thanks for listening. If you'd like to keep up with

[A]

the latest design industry news, visit us

[B]

[e-mail] where you can sign up for our newsletter, browse job listings, and join our BoH Insider community for access to online workshops, a free print subscription, and much more. If you have a note for the podcast, drop us a [e-mail] if you're enjoying these conversations, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. It helps others to discover the show.

[A]

This show was produced by Fred Nicholas

[B]

and edited by Michael Castaneda. I'm Dennis Scully. Thanks again for listening and I'll see you next week.