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Business of Home Podcast
West Elm president Day Kornbluth is quietly transforming the brand
00:52:50
West Elm president Day Kornbluth shares lessons from her career and the thinking behind the changes she's made at the brand
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- [00:04]
Dennis Scully
This is Business of Home. I'm your host Dennis Scully. Every week I'll be speaking with leaders and innovators from all corners of the home industry. My guest this week is Day Kornbluth, President of West Elm. A veteran of One Kings Lane, R.H. and Ralph Lauren Home, Day stepped into the top job at West Elm in 2023. Since then she's been leading a quiet transform, retooling the brand's product mix, sharpening its visual identity and rethinking how it shows up both online and off. That behind the scenes work came into full view this month with the launch of a sweeping collaboration with LA design duo Pearson Ward. I spoke with Day about striking the right balance between mass appeal and design credibility, why AI might become a surprisingly useful tool for creatives, and how the meaning of home has evolved from utility to something far more personal. This podcast is sponsored by Ernesta. Lay the foundation to a beautiful home with Ernesta's high quality custom size rugs. Featuring an array of refined colors and patterns, Ernesta's custom size rugs are made to fit every space and arrive in only two to four weeks. And with Ernesta's exclusive trade member benefits, you can get dedicated Support, free unlimited 12x12 samples and exclusive discounts to help achieve your clients design goals. To learn more about Ernesto's trade program, visit ernesta.com boh this podcast is also sponsored by Harpin and Forbes, a family owned company that for nearly three decades has delighted the design community with its versatile collections of hand woven natural window coverings. Committed to sustainability, Harpan and Forbes utilizes natural fibers meticulously hand weaving each piece to the exact dimensions of your windows for a perfect fit. Beyond window coverings, they also design an exquisite range of statement wall coverings and Belgian linens. Planning a visit to High Point for Spring market? Be sure to experience the Latest Spring Summer 2025 creations from Hartman and Forbes at the Wesley hall showroom, including a new collaboration with renowned designer Barbara berry. Or visit hartmanforbes.com to find a luxury showroom near you.
- [02:53]
Day Kornbluth
And now on with the show. We probably should tell People Day since this is going to sound different right? So we probably should tell where we are. Yeah, but you tell us where we are exactly.
- [03:07]
Laura Albert
We are in Dumbo, Brooklyn. We're looking at the East River.
- [03:12]
Day Kornbluth
Luckiest spectacular view out this window.
- [03:15]
Laura Albert
To look at the bridge, we're in DUMBO headquarters. Dumbo West Elm was founded in Brooklyn. Brooklyn is a part of the brand DNA. That view between the Manhattan and the Brooklyn Bridge. If you land on that street, you're going to be elbowing selfie takers out of the way. So you just know to take another route to work.
- [03:38]
Day Kornbluth
So how long ago did West Elm first begin here? And I was trying to remember sort of what the idea was. It was this really this incubator little brand, right in the beginning.
- [03:49]
Laura Albert
Yeah, I think it was. The idea was it was going to be a modern brand, lowercase M, you know, and it was going to be a democratic brand, a brand that was maybe aiming for people who weren't yet in their forever home, you know, and it was a New York based brand from the beginning. And so that sort of sense of actually this neighborhood has changed. West ELM will be 25 years old in another two years. This neighborhood has changed sort of right along with the brand in the last 20 plus years.
- [04:25]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah. And exploded in much the same way. Right. That West Elm exactly did. So there are remarkable parallels to be drawn there. So before we talk more about West Elm, I wanted to spend a little bit of time talking about the really remarkable career that you had in this industry for many years, working for some big brands that we, that we talk about all the time, including Monking's Lane and R.H. and Ralph Lauren. So take me all the way back and tell me how you even got on a path that took you to all of those brands and companies.
- [05:08]
Laura Albert
I guess the way that it started is that I was obsessed with home. And that was a personal passion that then led me to beg for a job at One Kings Lane. That's the beginning.
- [05:23]
Day Kornbluth
That's the beginning.
- [05:23]
Laura Albert
The beginning is I was the high schooler who was saving up for high thread count sheets. And then One Kings Lane was being founded. It was in its most early stages by two wonderful women, Susan Feldman and Ally Pincus. And I knew Susan Feldman through my mother in law. And actually I am from California, but I went to college on the east coast. And my mother in law I would see on the weekends because I was dating her son at the time. And so it was sort of her friends like kind of knew me as I was growing up, to be honest. And one of her friends is the founder of One Kingslane, Susan. And so I was out in LA running a trunk show for a wonderful jewelry company that I worked for at the time. And I was staying at Susan's house because I couldn't afford a hotel room. And I woke up really early because I was on east coast time. And she was sitting at her kitchen table building, I think a business plan for One Kings Lane. And I asked her about it and she told me all about it and I sort of processed that, went off to my work for the day, ran the trunk show and got up the nerve to then come back at night and beg her to let me work on whatever it was that she was doing. I don't know whether it had a name yet. So I was the first employee of One Kings Lane. I started out of my apartment in the West Village. Apartment is a generous term. And so. And I was essentially the first buyer, which at that time was about running around trying to convince brands to sell online and home. Many of them, it was actually about convincing them of the Internet. But that really felt like the argument we were making. But it was a moment of financial unrest. So I started in January of 2009 and we actually launched the website in April of 2009. So it was a. My first day was walking the gift show in New York with Susan, who is a great merchant. And then there was this rush of setting up a third party shipping and fulfillment partner and getting a website designed. And then we went live in April.
- [07:32]
Day Kornbluth
Of 2009 and remind people of what One Kings Lane was presenting itself as. What was the business model that you were going around and explaining people that were.
- [07:45]
Laura Albert
We were known as a flash sale. So you would have a sale on a Monday for a great candle brand and then on Tuesday we would launch a sale for beautiful throws and on and on and on and they would each last a couple of days and then they would be gone. So there was a limited time and there was some great deals to be had. We sort of found our way into the business through the flash sale model. But over the next 10 years it evolved into something that was not only a flash sale, but model, but really just a place to see great home product online. It sort of positioned home as. As something that you wanted to discover, you wanted to learn about new brands and maybe you should just make an impulse purchase. It sort of positioned home as apparel or as fashion.
- [08:32]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah.
- [08:32]
Laura Albert
Because I think home has been on sort of a long, long journey of becoming less about need and more about self expression. But this certainly made people lean in and think about home as like a fun purchase.
- [08:47]
Day Kornbluth
There was so much excitement around it. Yes. And then, I mean it flew so high, it got so close to the sun. What happened? Why did it all. I mean, it's so poignant because it was so spectacular. So many great names in our industry today are from that team.
- [09:05]
Laura Albert
Yes.
- [09:06]
Day Kornbluth
And then the wheels came off. I mean, and what, what happened?
- [09:11]
Laura Albert
I think I would say a few things. One is there was the dynamic around VCs and startups and fundraising and valuations and it was a heady time, let's say. And I think there's a sort of chicken and egg dynamic around how much those two parties want to believe amazing things about growth and valuation and then you make choices sort of about those beliefs. And maybe it should be the other way around, if I'm being clear at all.
- [09:44]
Day Kornbluth
No, absolutely. I think this audience is familiar with what VC has done too.
- [09:50]
Laura Albert
To many brands and many wonderful people in the VC world, to be sure. I think it sometimes pushes companies to be something that they aren't yet. And then I would say there was also a bit of model confusion, honestly, because we started as a Flash sale and there was also just a big robust world of marketplaces out there. There was Amazon and there was ebay and there was first dibs. And so marketplaces have a specific set of things that sort of make them function. And we were sort of somewhere between a marketplace, which is not really an editor, a marketplace doesn't edit, you know, it just welcomes all the, all the supply in the world and then all the eyeballs and sort of is like a loose hands off aggregator. And so I think there was some tension there between, you know, what we would have had to do. Some of our modeling was built on being a marketplace, but we were operating like a retailer.
- [10:53]
Day Kornbluth
So it was heartbreaking. As you say you had, you had already left prior to that and where did you, where did you go when you left One Kings Lane?
- [11:01]
Laura Albert
I went to Restoration Hardware, although I took a brief pause between the two. So I went to RH as the Chief Digital Officer which was such an interesting cool experience, even though it looked like a logical step from a home business to a home business. I was going from a digital only business to an omnichannel business, from a, let's call it, pre profitable business to a publicly traded business. And I was going to work for the first true merchant leader of my career. First, but not last. You know, I was working for a merchant CEO and my two years there were also like rich, rich learning because Gary is a really brilliant merchant and also a really brilliant just brand builder because he does nothing, nothing. In small measure, he's like a lesson in if you're going to do it, do it. And I got to lead a digital team, which is functionally not what I'd done before. So I was coming at it as a digitally native merchant, but actually I think there was something to that because if I couldn't have explained the difference between an English roll arm sofa and a shelter arm sofa in that company, I would have been kicked out.
- [12:15]
Day Kornbluth
When you think about what you really did learn from that experience, I'm fascinated to know what you really took away with you.
- [12:25]
Laura Albert
I would say that one of the things was the singularity of focus. And his preference and belief is that everybody needs to be looking at this thing. And so it was a lesson in what can come from undivided attention and a bunch of people all hanging in there to get through the deep thinking or the problem solving that a big, big project takes. I'd never seen that actually before or since that kind of like, we are doing this one thing today and we're all gonna do it.
- [13:09]
Day Kornbluth
So what pulled you away from that?
- [13:10]
Laura Albert
Well, I lived in New York and I was commuting, which was challenging. And this is pre Covid. And I knew it wasn't sustainable long term for me to commute. So that was sort of the initial impetus. I think I missed product and being a merchant. Honestly too, I don't know that I had that thought in the front of my brain at the time, but I think it's something I can look back and see.
- [13:35]
Day Kornbluth
So you end up going to Ralph.
- [13:39]
Laura Albert
Which is really like a advanced degree in brand. I mean, that's what anyone who has Bennett Ralph will tell you. And it is a bit of a badge of honor in New York. Talk about a rich alumni network. You know, it's a training ground for unbelievable creatives and just brand integrity, I think. And again, I was sort of this small, small player, right? Ralph Lauren home. So I went and I ran Ralph Lauren home for four and a half years, which is just an incredible opportunity also. Amazing people. But then I got the experience of being the home business inside the big apparel business. And so you got to see. It was actually really interesting to see the way a different retail vertical functions. The other thing that that time at Ralph did for me is it was a fully international business. So it was like really amazing to see how a brand that is that strong can actually stay that strong everywhere in the world. You know, it's like you go and you see how Ralph Lauren shows up in London and then you go to South Korea and it's like the same thing. And that was amazing.
- [14:54]
Day Kornbluth
So you have this incredible experience working at Ralph's and how do you end up where we are now?
- [15:02]
Laura Albert
Well, I had actually known. I had known Laura Albert since 20, 2015. I think. Okay, so I met her when I was a dmm, a director of merchandising at One Kings Lane. The circumstances around how that happened are fuzzy to me because now that I understand her schedule, I can't imagine why she would have taken that meeting. But I met her and was really impressed. So it was like in my fantasy, there was this home business that was operating at scale but was also a startup. And I could have that kind of entrepreneurial energy, but that was a fantasy mostly. And then I got the call, or it was actually a text to sort of reconnect with Laura after eight. This is two years ago. So after eight years. And it was just like an amazing meeting. And we took our time making sure that it was right, but it felt right to me right away to get to be in this sort of creative, democratic, like, cool brand that also happened to be in my borough and in the industry that I am clearly obsessed with. And there was like, I walked in the door, either I knew half the people or I had gotten a text from someone saying, oh, you're gonna love so and so because it's a small world and because I've been working in home since 2009, so it's felt like a sort of a homecoming.
- [16:41]
Dennis Scully
We're taking a quick break to remind you about Hartman and Forbes. This spring, Hartman and Forbes unveiled a new collaboration with internationally renowned designer Barbara Berry, celebrating the artistry of light texture and the timeless beauty of nature in a collection of hand woven window coverings and natural wall coverings. If you're attending High Point Spring Market, experience this collection in person along with their latest spring summer 2025 designs at the Wesley hall showroom. To discover other unique collaborations by Hartman and Forbes and register for your Trade account, visit hartmanforbes.com and now back to the show.
- [17:26]
Day Kornbluth
Well, and at the time that you start this conversation, and so there's a position available. Let's explore. Right. All of that. What was your perception of what West Elm was? How did you see it? And obviously savvy merchant yourself and having years of experience. What, what did you think this brand was? What did you think it needed? Or what? You know, like, oh, if I could get in there, I could just bring them this. Like, how did you.
- [17:57]
Laura Albert
Yeah, you know, so one of the things that I noticed is when I started telling people I was going to West Elm, like anyone on the street, they would always smile, you know, like, oh, I love West Elm, which I was just clocking, like, wow, this is great. You know, like, how does a brand engender that kind of like enthusiasm. It wasn't just like a passive, like, oh, yeah, you know, it was like, oh, I love West Elm. I also felt like the sort of original product that was iconic at West Elm that I, you know, I thought of like the parson's desk at West Elm was one of those products that just like broke through. Everybody kind of. Everyone had it at one point, everybody knew about it. And I hadn't seen one of those in a while. And so I think I probably was like eager to get my hands on product. And I knew that it had 100 stores in North America and I knew that. So I knew that it was operating at some scale that would be. Would mean that like when, when you can kick into like the right mode, it's exciting. You know, it's a big enough business that the moves you make matter and, and you have the scale to like, make some. Make some real. Make some big moves.
- [19:14]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah.
- [19:14]
Laura Albert
And I didn't know that this like supply chain was the most killer, you know, that we can. Being part of the Williams Sonoma family of brands is like, you just have unbelievable, best in class, fill in the blank. All of the things. I don't think I knew how great the people were. I don't think I knew how great the product was, frankly, until I got inside.
- [19:35]
Day Kornbluth
Well, and the. So for many years, Laura Albert's always saying on the call, West Elm, it's going to be this huge thing. Wait till you see, this is going to be multibillion dollar brand and off we go. And it did have this incredible growth spurt and then it sort of stumbled a little bit and some of that momentum kind of came out of it. And I don't know what was conveyed to you when you first got here. Look, here's what we need you to do. I don't know if you got any kind of really specific marching orders about like, this is a great brand. Help us out. Let's get it back on track and have it be all it can be with, as you say, this incredible team, this incredible. Right. All this history.
- [20:21]
Laura Albert
Well, I think that timing is important because we were all in our post pandemic hangover. So it's tough to know the macro was tough for home and still is. Yeah, I know we're so eager to be in the past tense, but to be honest, I really don't think about it like that on a daily basis. I just think about.
- [20:44]
Day Kornbluth
You don't think about those big macro challenges.
- [20:47]
Laura Albert
I do, but it's pretty compartmentalized Right. Because I'm wired and my boss is wired to focus on what you control. And there's so much good stuff to do. So you focus on the macro such that you have an intelligent plan around it, but if you start giving it too much brain space, then you don't be a follower. No, no, no. But anyway, so that was the moment. I think there was a. There was a context around, like we had this unbelievable couple of years. But to be fair, West Elm had had growth every single year since its founding.
- [21:26]
Day Kornbluth
Unbelievable.
- [21:27]
Laura Albert
And real growth, like strong growth. Yeah. So it was sort of this like, lightning situation. And I think the truth is Laura, so I think she was like, go do a good job. You know, she's like, make the product better, make the images better, make the stores better. You know, it's like, go get in there and figure out what people are loving and take some bets on some things that you think the data isn't telling you yet. That that's cool, but you know it's cool and make it beautiful. So I think she has had, frankly, more wise counsel than I've ever gotten from anyone, which is a funny thing to say at this point in your career. And also we walked through a store together and she said, which do you think is the best selling bed? She's so, like, in it herself. She is so. She is such a, like an Olympian at this that she's more than equipped to, like, assess whether someone can do this. And so once I was, once I was in, it was like, please run the play. You know, go after it. Like, get. It was kind of the energy, which was amazing because it ended up being a startup, a $2 billion startup. Like, it was the thing that I thought was probably a fantasy, but it is not.
- [22:52]
Day Kornbluth
When you looked around, what did you immediately know you wanted to start to focus on? Because you've really taken your time and it's been more than two years, right?
- [23:03]
Laura Albert
Yeah. It's like the very simple thing is product first and product has a lead time, a development lead time. So you come in, you know, in April of 2023, and the first time you can have real impact is, you know, something like 12 months later. And that's like the dive in, you know, in the shallow end. And then 18 months later, you really start to see it. And then, you know, two years later you feel like you've like, gotten to impact the product with a little. With a little bit of a learning curve too. Like you take. You take some bets in the first season and you watch and you Lear. And so I was really clear with my team that we were just going to focus on the product first. And then I would say the next thing was creative. Right? Creative meaning photography and our stores. So first you focus on the product, and then you focus on where the product lives and how it's seen. And then you really start talking about the work that hopefully at that point, you're really proud of. And the timing. The timing is really fun because we launched our collaboration with Pearson Ward this week, which is, like, the biggest, funnest, you know, bet that we've taken. And so it's something I'm really excited to talk about now. You know, it's like, yeah, now that it's here, now that it's here, now.
- [24:31]
Day Kornbluth
That it's selling out, and it's not even in stores.
- [24:33]
Laura Albert
Yes, exactly.
- [24:34]
Day Kornbluth
Right.
- [24:35]
Laura Albert
Exactly. Yeah. And so the partnership, the product is really good and the creative is really good. And, you know, so you're kind of like, this is. And it's a real bet. Like, we went after it. We went for it because we just saw it.
- [24:47]
Day Kornbluth
So tell me what that means, because I love that, even that expression, like, we really went after it. Like, what does that mean to you?
- [24:54]
Laura Albert
As we were in the product development process, I think we went in with some, like, idea about what this product plan was going to be. And as you go through the product development process, you're like, oh, this is really good. You know, maybe we should do. We should maybe do more. Like, maybe. Maybe we buy both. You know, like, you. You go through this where there's an editing, a natural editing and attrition process that happens through product development, and then sometimes you just trust your gut. So we knew. We knew we wanted to work with them, and we were really excited to work with them. But then once we met them and then once we started actually seeing the product come together, I think it was like, okay, everybody, just let this flow. Let's just do the. Let's see how big this thing can be. And we didn't buy enough. The answer is we weren't. I was feeling very proud of us for being bold, and we did not buy enough. We could have bought more, and we will, and it's so good.
- [25:46]
Day Kornbluth
Well, I mean, it sounds like really some things are sold out already.
- [25:50]
Laura Albert
Yes, unfortunately. I mean, I don't know. It's good news.
- [25:53]
Day Kornbluth
That's a nice problem.
- [25:54]
Laura Albert
A wonderful problem to have.
- [25:56]
Day Kornbluth
I'd rather have that than. Nobody likes it, nobody's excited.
- [26:00]
Laura Albert
And also, just, like, the buzz about it is so Real like there's just, you know, you can feel it when a bunch of people are texting you and emailing you and you're kind of seeing it pop up different places. And it's really like, this product is so good, you know, that's kind of the headline distilled down well.
- [26:20]
Day Kornbluth
And did that make you think, great, because I'm gonna change whatever your perception might be about West Elm. I'm gonna change it up. And here you go. And this is part of that. And you already knew that people were well disposed to it, as you were saying earlier, right? People were like, oh, yeah, yeah, right. But now you feel like you're showing, like you're just bringing it up another level, it sounds like.
- [26:42]
Laura Albert
I mean, I think the thing about West Elm is that it was so great at a particular time that sometimes when that happens, it came out of the gate so, so, so strong. And so sometimes brands sort of like you, you have this really strong visual for it. So for me, it was the parson's desk. For some people, it's whatever, but they're like, I knew and that was the thing. When I would talk to people about West Elm, they would be like, you know what I got from West Elm? And I loved that because it was like everybody gets to, everyone gets to get involved with this brand. I think the reality is, even if brands have really, really strong points of view and that point of view doesn't change at all, the way that they show up in like one decade to another is slightly different because the trend, like the people who are like their people, their customers and what they're responding to are they're getting different inputs, they're seeing different. They're like, they're following different trends. And so I really believe that the like and the vibe of West Elm is exactly the same. But the trend isn't, you know, it's not, it's not the year that the parson's desk was brought out anymore. And so we get to let that vibe or DNA of West Elm show up in this moment and be really thoughtful and careful about what that means. We are not anyone other than West Elm. And yeah, I hope people sort of look at it now and it feels like what they love and know about West Elm and also makes them maybe double take a little bit.
- [28:18]
Dennis Scully
Well, so to that point, help me.
- [28:20]
Day Kornbluth
Understand the core tenants of the West Elm brand. Tell me how you think about that. How do you articulate that to a team that's working, even collaboration partners? How do you say, like, here are the elements that West Elm stands for. And it's all about.
- [28:40]
Laura Albert
Yeah, it's really clear to me. Like, the West Elm brand, first and foremost is about home being a place that you can express yourself. It is not just function, it's a style statement. You know, those are sort of the ones that jump to mind. Right. It's like the joy of making your space something that has, like a point of view. And we want everyone to participate. So we're gonna do it at incredible value. And it's like modern. And what I've said to the team, modern refers to some very specific eras in design. And it's also just a general term about putting yourself in the present moment and being forward thinking. It's about product design. Certainly aesthetically, this is a modern brand, but also it's a young brand. It's a forward looking brand. It's modern in ways that are not just about product style.
- [29:39]
Day Kornbluth
Well, I mean, the whole notion of accessibility, I think that always has been part of the brand. It always felt like you could take that risk buying that chair or buying that piece.
- [29:51]
Laura Albert
Right. That's part of like, these all roll into one another, right?
- [29:55]
Day Kornbluth
Yes.
- [29:56]
Laura Albert
It's like, yeah, try it, go for it, do it.
- [30:01]
Day Kornbluth
Well, so I'm curious and thinking back to what you were saying earlier about Gary Friedman and how when, whether it was some great big story you were working on or whatever the project was, the source book had to get out. Everyone's working on the thing. So everyone's working on the Pierce Award collection. Right. And the whole team knows this is it. This is like the biggest thing that certainly you've done in your tenure here. This is like, we're all in on this. Take me through a little bit of a day in the life. So you're working on this giant project and going from meeting to meeting, like, what's a day? What are these meetings for me or for me? Yeah, for you. For you. What's a day in your busy, busy life?
- [30:48]
Laura Albert
I spend a lot of my time looking at product. So we are working four seasons at a time. And then we have these sort of stretch assignments running alongside, like a collab or there are some new categories and businesses that we're like, incubating right now and getting excited to share.
- [31:13]
Day Kornbluth
Not yet, but I understand you've got some big ones, so.
- [31:17]
Laura Albert
Yeah, right, yeah.
- [31:19]
Day Kornbluth
Okay. But.
- [31:20]
Laura Albert
So, you know, much of my day is if you think about, like, we're working spring, summer, fall, holiday, you know, at a time, and there are moments like in each of those seasons that where people get together and they look at a thing and they're like, do we love it? And so that happens when we're first just pulling concept together. It happens when we're looking at sketch like we're looking at early designs. It happens when we see the first samples. It happens when we pull all the samples together and we decide whether this space is amazing. And then it happens when we take images of the product and it happens when we think about how we're going to launch it in the store. So really a large part of my time is like participating at those moments and asking the questions in the group because there's always a group of tasteful, opinionated people. I want to just be surrounded by tasteful, opinionated people basically is my happy place. So that's a large part of my job. I would also say WSI is just like an unbelievably well run company. And so in my role I'm also, you know, a big portion of my time is also like sitting in the seat of brand president as part of the WSI leadership team. And there are similarly like moments in time when we come together around things both left brain and right brain, you know. Sure. And there's a lot of like just idea sharing and casual interaction. I am texting with Laura and I am texting with my team and we are sharing things that we're seeing that we think are amazing and we're admitting if we think something is not that great and we're moving on and we're like having ideas and we're getting excited in watching the numbers. So I have been in positions where like you look back at your day and you're like what did that, what happened? You know, did I do anything that like really impacted the work? And, and that is just not this place. And so every day is about like making the product that's coming or the images that are coming or the or or like making really smart choices around inventory and, and looking at our sourcing strategy. All of it like the left brain and the right brain. But it is, it's like the work work. It's a really growth minded WSI is growth minded which is like how you more than how you double the value of a company, you know, which is what Laura's done. So like doing the like looking at the business every day and getting, and that's what's fun about retail is you kind of like every day you get new information and then you get to put that information into your decision making calculus for like the Many decisions you make every day.
- [34:18]
Day Kornbluth
Foreign.
- [34:22]
Dennis Scully
We'Re taking a quick break from the show to remind you about Ernesta. Elevate your clients, homes and your business with Ernesta's custom size rugs. From soft 100% New Zealand wool and lattice pattern handmade styles to UV protected outdoor rugs and playful family friendly options. Ernesta's new spring arrivals are available and ready to deliver in as little as two to four weeks. Join Ernesta's trade program today to explore all of these new arrivals and more. Apply now@ernesta.com BOH that's ernesta.com BOH and now back to the show.
- [35:10]
Day Kornbluth
It's a fascinating time, challenging though it is. We had notions about retail stores and we thought they were losing some of their impact for a time or they weren't as meaningful to people and then suddenly post Covid. Oh, no, no. We actually, we love stores and we do want to show up and we do want community and we do want to participate and we do want to see and touch and all of that. And so we collectively as an industry are. Oh, okay. So we need to rethink that or you know, or catalogs have gone away. Oh, no, wait a sec. Catalogs are incredible way to reach and get people, you know, so I mean all of these things that it's so fluid. Right. And, and we have to be open mind and, and Laura is always, we're digital first and we're, you know, all of that and putting that messaging forward. But we're at this time where like all of the channels could be working.
- [36:00]
Laura Albert
Yes, right.
- [36:01]
Day Kornbluth
Any one of them could be leading the way.
- [36:05]
Laura Albert
Well, also, I think the biggest miss is to think of them as separate at all. Because one of the things that I think is so interesting about the home industry is it's a decision sometimes it's a decision that's kind of a consequential decision. So if you really think about how you've made a decision to buy a big piece of furniture, you probably did all sorts of funny things when you think about it. You probably went to the store, you probably sent it to a few people, you probably like saved it somewhere, you know, and you probably went back to that page like many times, you know, and like you probably stood in your space and kind of like tried to imagine there's so many things that actually people do on their way to making a consequential home purchase that the interesting thing is to think about how these channels are likely all on that journey and everyone kind of does it in A different order or way. But there's a lot coming, I think, with technology aiding in that process and understanding that process. Most digital experiences originally were built for like, cheap commodity things, right? It was like, how do we make people not have to go to the store to buy a book or something? And you're just not thinking that hard about that decision and. Or you're choosing whether to get the medium or the large or the red or the white T shirt. Again, like, that's a decision making process that's just like, not that complicated. And deciding like what length, width, depth, color, foot, plinth, stretcher, all of the things that you can decide to buy. A sofa that's made in this country is a totally different decision making process. So, like really wrapping your head around how you can help people in that with both amazing stores and store associates. And the power of the way digital is evolving right now is like, that's way more. That's super interesting, actually, because we're selling things that are hard to buy and highly customizable and really big.
- [38:16]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah, the interesting thing about technology. And again, for a hot minute, we thought that augmented reality was going to help us sell sofas better. People could see them in the room, but, oh, it's kind of awkward and it's right. Didn't really deliver on the, on the promise. And now we think, you know, AI is going to generate all these elaborate images for us to give us inspiration. And most of them are horrifying. And, you know, this, this term AI slop is one of my new favorite terms now that there's just all these horrible AI generated images. But it does feel as if there is an opportunity in all of this technology that's going to really transform. I mean, I was talking to the founder of a company that is doing digital sampling, and it's fascinating to see how that has transformed an entire process and creating mood boards now that you can create digitally. And then you decide, do I actually want the physical this or that? So it's getting better and it's getting better quickly. And I think for designers especially, there's an opportunity for all of this inspiration, but also efficiency. And I wonder how you're thinking, but it sounds like your parent company is thinking about AI a lot in terms of efficiency.
- [39:38]
Laura Albert
I think that actually we're about to unlock a lot. And actually there are some really great images created by AI that I have seen recently. And I think the number of ways that it's applicable can sort of make your head spin. But I think the challenge is to think about, actually pause and ask the question and think about it and be curious and be on the front foot. Which is why, I mean, I'm ultimately a digital nerd still. And so I'm so glad that that is our orientation and that there's like a lean in, like, curious. What could this mean? Let's try, let's learn, let's. Because I actually think we're on the verge of it being pretty meaningful and.
- [40:30]
Day Kornbluth
Oh, I agree.
- [40:31]
Laura Albert
And like AI, I mean that's sort of like obvious, but I think AI being able to understand the visuals of a thing is like what all of the things that could mean. I mean, I have noticed that five years ago when I'm shopping online and they tell me like, you may also like, I would get to the bottom of the page and be like, please, you do not know me. I do not. Also like. And you know, and now like, I'm like, yeah, I kind of also like that. So all of that is like AI understanding how the physical attributes of one thing might kind of make it appealing. There's just like a million ways that AI knowing what looks like what and what looks good is like a crazy unlock. And that's only one piece of it, as you know.
- [41:18]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah, no, no, it's, as I say, it's getting better rapidly and it is going to be transformational in so many ways. I mentioned designers earlier and I'm curious and here you are partnering with some AD100 designers on this huge collaboration. I'm guessing you've probably got some other AD100 designers in your future. Perhaps with that in mind, how, even with this collection, how did you think about it from a designer perspective? How do you think about the designer customer base? Do you have a big designer customer base? How do you think about it?
- [41:54]
Laura Albert
I mean, we do have a big designer customer base. And I think that is the joke is Most people buy one sofa every 10 years, but the designers, they're really excellent customers. And I also think a designer again is the person who helps the panic stricken and frozen maybe very tasteful person who doesn't know how to put that room together. There's a reason that the design trade is healthy and well right now and is actually more widely. It's been sort of democratized because it exists in a million different forms and levels and is not actually being replaced by technology right now. And so this is maybe a strange thing to say, but it's sort of fun to build product for designers, right? Because you know they're going to get why that thing is cool and how to use it. And they're going to. They're gonna pull it together in a way that's amazing. So, yeah, we think about the design community quite a bit also, though, we just sort of think of them all as customers. They're ultimately customers. We just need to try to give them great product that will arrive on time and be a great value. Because I think the division between the designer and the customer is almost harder and harder to tell at this point because they are working in some sort of creative, like, soup together, aided by digital. And so. So we think about designers a lot. And then I am just like a fan girl of lots of designers, you know, many of whom you've interviewed on your podcast. You know, so, like, I have my personal favorites, and then I have others who I think will be, like, perfect for this brand. And sometimes those things overlap, and sometimes I just. My goal is to be a patron. I want to just hire these people to make beautiful spaces someday. But, yeah, I also like giving a platform to designers because it's a very bespoke, project by project kind of business. And so it's really fun to see someone's exquisite taste made available to a whole big group of people. We had a collab with Billy Cotton, who's a personal favorite of mine, insanely talented and. And like a nice. A nice roster of. Of designers. So I hope. I hope it's just the beginning.
- [44:22]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah, no, no. I mean, and Billy Cotton, I mean, is. Is a deep intellect as well as a talent. And there's a. I mean, there's. There's a lot of layers to.
- [44:31]
Laura Albert
Oh, to Billy Cotton. Unbelievable.
- [44:33]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, that's a. That's a great collaborator. I mean, and it's been fascinating to watch the High Point furniture market change its perception about designers. And now 60% of the attendance at the markets are designers. And all these companies are tripping over themselves to figure out how do we work with these. Yeah, yeah, right. How do we.
- [44:53]
Laura Albert
They're sort of the retailers now, I mean.
- [44:55]
Day Kornbluth
Well, exactly.
- [44:55]
Laura Albert
Yeah.
- [44:56]
Day Kornbluth
Because so many of these retailers have gone away. And as we were saying earlier, the shift has been quite dramatic. And so the designer collaborations, I think, can only help bring more attention. And Pierce and Ward have been sharing it sort of a great deal. So it's out there. And so it sounds like it's.
- [45:17]
Laura Albert
And I do think that the designers shop the designer product. There is a little bit of game recognizes game going on.
- [45:23]
Day Kornbluth
Absolutely. And I think everybody, all designers are thinking about, oh, how did you get that partnership? How should I be positioning myself for something like that? And I'm curious, when you think about great collaboration partners, what comes to mind? Again, if there is a criteria in your head or if there is a.
- [45:45]
Dennis Scully
Well, I want them to be this.
- [45:46]
Day Kornbluth
Or I want them to be that. Like, what is it that you think makes a great partner?
- [45:52]
Laura Albert
The first thing that comes to mind is a little bit hard to explain because it's just like, it's about looking at their aesthetic and having a sense, a gut, that their aesthetic will translate into product that is a great representation of their taste and personality and point of view and also will just, like, make lots of people, you know, like, dying to. Dying to step up and buy it. And that was the gut I had around Louisa and Emily. Like, their taste is actually, like, they have such a point of view. And also, I just knew people would, would, like, be into it. I knew I would. I knew it would translate into great product. And then the second thing is, frankly, people who are good partners and get behind things. I mean, I think sometimes people, like, get a little twisted and overcomplicated around where am I putting my posts and how, you know, who's. It's like, if you're going to do it, do it and go all in and be generous and be. Because that sort of feeds on itself, right? Like this. The collaborators who have just like, really thrown themselves behind the partnerships have been the ones that are amazing and then. And we do too, right? And that's just like a wonderful feeling to have. I mean, I'm like, texting with Emily and Louisa all day, every day. We're like, oh, my God, did you see this? It's sold out. Don't worry. We're chasing more units. Like, you know that. So that enthusiasm and generosity and like, and like, bring your full, like, be picky about things, have a high bar. That's why what I want from you, I want you to, like, love. I want you to do the work, to love what you're making, right? And we will meet you in that work and then I want you to love it and, like, be so behind it and we will be there with you.
- [47:51]
Day Kornbluth
I see very clearly the brand partners who show up to the markets, who show up to all the events, who, who participate, who are working. They didn't just phone it in. You've got my stuff and yeah, yeah, good luck and I'll see you, you know, next, next check. And I think it's so hard to know, are you going to be that partner? It's so like, with so many things.
- [48:13]
Laura Albert
Yeah.
- [48:13]
Day Kornbluth
It's like person.
- [48:15]
Laura Albert
Well, I also think that, you know, it's a question for like, the 80, 100 designers are working with like, unbelievable sort of caliber of budget and project and architecture. And like, I just went through telling you how important and like, cool it is that this is a brand that's accessible to everyone. And so I think, like, designers have to sort of. I think sometimes people need to have gotten to a point where they understand, like, I actually want to play at this price point, you know, but I think the people who have done it with us are like, amazed at how good the product is. You know, they're like, oh, my God, you know, how did you vaccine is nice. Like, how is that the price? And I'm like, well, yeah, that's what we're good at. So I think that's the, like, you know, way people get sort of tripping over themselves. And actually, I think, like, again, Pierce and Warren has just done such an amazing job. Like, they are posting about their, their West Elm collection and then they're posting these, like, unreal projects. And these things sit actually really nicely together. It's like letting the people who follow them, like, get involved.
- [49:25]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah. And look at how lovely it is to see that product elevated by that association. Right. I mean, who could want for more than that? All right, I've got to get you out of here. I know we didn't want to talk about tariffs, obviously, because what's to say? But I mean, here we are two days into a much more intense environment than we thought we mentioned. Gary Friedman, poor Gary Friedman. Had to hop on an analyst call right after the announcement. All heck is breaking loose. Everyone's just trying to sort of catch their breath and figure out, what do we do here? You've got to reorder product for this hot selling new collaboration. I mean, again, knowing that we have no idea what's going to happen next, how are you thinking just in the short term, how are you trying to process all of this?
- [50:15]
Laura Albert
Yeah, I mean, I think that the rapid rate at which we're learning new information is a crash course and just sort of like, don't overreact. Just sit back and have a really strong plan and a really effective agile supply chain and run your business well so that you can make the wise pivot if you need to make the pivot. But also every day just pause and do the analysis and take the thoughtful approach. Also, I mean, we are again, just so high, high operating like such, such operators that whatever the thing is that, that, like, we land on here in terms of how this, the tariffs will. Will settle and net out, like we'll be fully equipped to make the right decision. So I feel confident about us, you know, in the market and in this industry. But I also feel like what I'm leaning toward on a Friday might not be the same thing I'm leaning toward on Monday. So it's like actually a waste of oxygen.
- [51:28]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah.
- [51:29]
Laura Albert
No, no to Opine, really. Right.
- [51:31]
Day Kornbluth
No, no. And as you were saying earlier, I mean, there's only so much you can focus on the Mac Pro. Right. Or you get too caught up in that. Well, it's. I'm sorry. I'm sorry that, that in any way has to rain on the parade.
- [51:43]
Laura Albert
Don't worry. Of everything else, I'm doing great, feeling good about, about that product. So.
- [51:49]
Day Kornbluth
Yeah, I'm glad. Well, I'm, I'm thrilled to get to talk to you. Yeah.
- [51:52]
Laura Albert
Thank you.
- [51:53]
Day Kornbluth
And I'm so, I appreciate so much you making the time with everything else.
- [51:57]
Laura Albert
Likewise.
- [51:58]
Day Kornbluth
It's. It's a pleasure.
- [51:59]
Laura Albert
So then, great. Better late than never. Thank you so much.
- [52:03]
Dennis Scully
No, absolutely.
- [52:04]
Day Kornbluth
Thank you.
- [52:06]
Dennis Scully
Thanks for listening. If you'd like to keep up with the latest design industry news, visit us online@businessofhome.com where you can sign up for for our newsletter, browse job listings and join our BoH Insider community for access to online workshops, a free print subscription, and much more. If you have a note for the podcast, drop us a line@podcastbusinessofhome.com if you're.
- [52:29]
Day Kornbluth
Enjoying these conversations, please leave us a.
- [52:31]
Dennis Scully
Review on Apple Podcasts.
- [52:33]
Day Kornbluth
It helps others to discover the show. This show was produced by Fred Nicholas.
- [52:37]
Dennis Scully
And edited by Michael Castaneda. That I'm Dennis Scully. Thanks again for listening and I'll see you next week.