John Mayer (FBF)

Summary

Call Her Daddy – John Mayer (FBF)

Date: December 24, 2025
Host: Alex Cooper
Guest: John Mayer

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Episode Overview

This holiday special of Call Her Daddy features an honest, wide-ranging conversation between host Alex Cooper and Grammy-winning musician John Mayer. Known for his soulful songwriting and complicated public image, Mayer discusses his formative years, anxieties, growth, relationships, and the misconceptions surrounding his persona. The episode culminates with an intimate, live performance of some of his biggest hits, offering listeners a rare glimpse into both his artistry and vulnerability.

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Main Topics and Key Discussion Points

1. How the Episode Came to Be and First Impressions

• Networking and authenticity: The interview was initiated after a dinner with Alex, John, and Cassie David (02:11). John emphasizes the importance of doing something "out of character" each December, leading to his appearance on the podcast (02:26).
• John’s confidence: Alex notes John’s composure and confidence, leading to a discussion about self-assuredness and its evolution through life (03:16–04:31).

2. John Mayer’s High School Years and Early Ambitions

• Feeling out of place: John describes being invisible in high school, fixated solely on music. "My life began at 3:00... when I came home and played guitar." (04:48)
• Coping with discouragement: He discusses the struggle of pushing against naysayers and the impact on his psyche (03:30–04:31).
• Performing at graduation: Mayer reveals he played at his high school graduation, yet didn’t actually graduate then due to missing credits (08:05). The juxtaposition of soon after becoming a Grammy-winning artist is not lost on him (08:34–09:13).

3. Songwriting, Nostalgia, and Misconceptions

• Origins of "Your Body is a Wonderland": Contrary to rumors, Mayer says the song was "about the feeling" associated with his first girlfriend, not about a celebrity (09:56–10:13).
• On songwriting: "I don't write songs about people... Even if I was writing a song because of someone, that goes away and I'm left with the song." (10:34–11:32)
• Evolving purpose: Mayer reflects on the transition from proving himself to recognizing music’s deeper meaning for listeners (11:54–13:25).

4. The Rise to Fame and Personal Growth

• Being labeled ‘womanizer’: Mayer candidly addresses his reputation: "That's the role I play on the big TV show that I didn't write." (16:25)
• Women’s approval and insecurity: Discussion of childhood influences and insecurity, and how validation from women affected him (16:25–18:56).
• Relationship reflections: He values the growth from past relationships and conducting "the accounting" on his own behavior (33:23–34:33).

5. Anxiety and Creativity

• Experiencing anxiety before it was normalized: Mayer describes the isolating experience of anxiety in the pre-social media era—and how it fueled his songwriting (27:12–29:15).
• On anxiety as creative fuel: "When I would have an anxious moment, I'd be like, well, here comes a song." (28:37)
• Dating with anxiety: He shares a vulnerable story of having to leave a date due to anxiety in high school (30:45–31:53).

6. Fame, Misunderstandings, and Retreat

• Managing public perception: Mayer discusses the exhaustion of being misunderstood and the futility of trying to correct every misperception: "You're trying to eat the monster that's trying to eat you." (36:45–37:32)
• Learning to retreat: "Retreat is an option. I don’t know where this idea of stubborn fight to the death stuff came from—you’ll lose everything." (37:32–39:08)
• Advice on social media and peace: Both agree that retreating from the noise brings peace and authenticity (39:38–40:43).

7. Love, Dating, and Maturity

• Have you ever been in love? "Yes." (45:05)
• No longer drinking: Mayer has been sober for six years, changing the way he approaches dating—more honest and vulnerability-driven (46:57–47:53).
• On relationships: "Every relationship I've been in was devoted to the idea that this could go the distance." (33:23)
• Long-term connection: He admires couples who resolve conflicts and haven’t considered breaking up: "Nothing's hotter to me than conflict resolution. I am horny for conflict resolution." (50:24–50:30)

8. The Creative Process and Independence

• Releasing music independently: Questions whether to release a full album or singles (51:01–51:46).
• Studio habits: Describes a standard self-disciplined workday in the studio: "I go to a recording studio every day, 9 to 5. I have a job. Without it, I would fall apart." (53:49–53:57)
• Songwriting approach: "You write a whole song and you'll go, oh, I only needed that one verse, which is actually the chorus to this thing..." (53:09–53:46)

9. Performing Live: The Reality vs. the Myth

• The true feeling of performing: Unlike many performers, Mayer does not "feed off the energy of the crowd": "I don't feed off the energy of the crowd. It is not a drug to me." (55:12–57:09)
• Desire to please: Even while performing, he’s constantly wondering if the audience is enjoying it (55:12–57:09).

10. Special Live Performance and Song Stories (Musical Segment)

• “Slow Dancing in a Burning Room” – [62:09]: Mayer plays a raw, acoustic version with vocal emotion.
• “Why Georgia” ([65:42]), “Who Says” ([66:03]), and “Daughters” ([68:08]): He provides background stories for songs, highlighting creative inspiration, often occurring while naked or in liminal moments.
• Songwriting insights: Mayer explains the true meaning behind "Daughters," which was less about parental advice and more about frustration when love is stymied by someone's upbringing (70:22).
• “Dreaming with a Broken Heart” ([72:18]): On this piano-based song, Mayer shares how dreams and longing can inspire music.

11. Vulnerability and Humor

• On post-coital songwriting: "You should never play guitar to have sex with someone. But a little naked guitar playing after is very memorable." (66:30)
• Body image candor: Playfully remarks on everyone looking “weird” when sitting up naked; finds it cute and humanizing (67:00–67:07).
• Joining the 'Daddy Gang': John jokes about joining the community and thanks Alex for making him feel comfortable (77:17).

12. Closing & Holiday Spirit

• Personal growth and self-acceptance: John stresses the value of learning from mistakes, not viewing them as regrets but necessary phases of growth (40:19).
• New Year’s Resolution: Doing more things out of character and embracing the unknown (57:22–57:50).
• Ends with “Have Yourself A Merry Little Christmas” ([77:41]), adding a warm, festive close.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On high school alienation:
  "My life began at 3:00... when I came home and played guitar." — John Mayer (04:48)

• On rapid career ascent:
  "Chronologically speaking, this part is maybe one of the only aspects of my life that truly blows my mind." — John Mayer (08:42)

• On the meaning of his songs:
  "I don't write songs about people. ... I might use a relationship that inspires me to write something, but even that goes away and I'm left with the song." — John Mayer (10:34)

• On being misunderstood:
  "You're trying to eat the monster that's trying to eat you. ... We haven't learned that retreat is an option. Retreat is an option." — John Mayer (36:45, 37:32)

• On relationships:
  "Nothing's hotter to me than conflict resolution. I am horny for conflict resolution." — John Mayer (50:30)

• On anxiety fueling creativity:
  "When I would have an anxious moment, I'd be like, well, here comes a song." — John Mayer (28:37)

• On fame and public opinion:
  "I only need to meet one more person that I want to spend the rest of my life with. So I do not need to have this worldwide consensus that I'm an okay guy." — John Mayer (32:44)

• On being a famous man:
  "Being a famous guy is like being a hot girl." — John Mayer (32:09)

• On life perspective:
  "Your reality is stronger than their ability to distort it." — John Mayer (38:11)

• On artistic process:
  "You write a whole song and you'll go, oh, I only needed that one verse, which is actually the chorus to this thing." — John Mayer (53:09)

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Key Timestamps

• 02:10 – How Alex got John on the show (Dinner, December, pitching)
• 04:48 – John’s high school experience of invisibility and early confidence
• 09:56 – The real inspiration behind “Your Body is a Wonderland”
• 11:32 – Why Mayer doesn’t reveal who songs are about
• 16:25 – Addressing reputation as a womanizer
• 18:30 – Childhood insecurity and its effect on relationships
• 27:12 – Mayer describes living with anxiety pre-social media
• 28:37 – Anxiety as a source for songwriting
• 30:45 – The nervous first date story
• 36:45–39:08 – On public misunderstanding and learning to retreat
• 45:05 – On being in love; relationship reflections
• 46:57 – Dating sober; expressing vulnerability and anxieties
• 50:24 – Admitting turn-on for conflict resolution
• 53:49 – Mayer’s disciplined studio routine
• 55:12–57:09 – The reality of performing and striving to please the audience
• 62:09 – Live performance: “Slow Dancing in a Burning Room”
• 65:42–75:25 – Unplugged set: “Why Georgia,” “Who Says,” “Daughters,” and “Dreaming with a Broken Heart”
• 77:41 – John closes with “Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas”

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Final Thoughts

This episode blends emotional candor with levity, demystifying John Mayer’s public image while showcasing his reflective, introspective side. Mayer and Cooper make the conversation relatable regardless of fame, addressing struggles with self-image, anxiety, relationship difficulty, and the ongoing challenges of authenticity both in life and online. The intimate musical performances deliver an added bonus, making the episode a holiday treat for listeners.

“Thank you for being kind to me, good to me, and making me feel comfortable. I’m now a fan of the show.” — John Mayer (77:17)

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For fans and newcomers alike, this episode delivers both depth and entertainment, offering original insights, notable quotables, and unforgettable musical moments.

Transcript

[Alex Cooper]

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[Alex Cooper]

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With Call Her Daddy Daddy Daddy John Mayer welcome to Call Her Daddy.

[John Mayer]

Thank you Alex.

[Alex Cooper]

I am so happy you're here, John. I think we need to tell the daddy gang, who are my listeners, how did we get here? Because we went to a little dinner the other night, and I want to kind of go through what happened at that dinner, because people are probably like, h. How did you get John Mayer to come on your show?

[John Mayer]

There's only one way, which is to find me personally, have dinner with me, be cool. And you're actually an incredible pitch woman for coming on the show. And I didn't really have an intention of coming on. We had a great dinner. Cassie, David, you and me. And I think there's something to do with December where you've all year been yourself, followed your rules, done what you normally do, don't do what you don't normally do. And I think somewhere in the last couple weeks of each year, I go, like, I want to do something out of character.

[Alex Cooper]

I'm so happy. This is what you're calling out of character. And you get to sit down with me because I. Yeah, I pitched you, like, why you should come on the show. And you and I kind of, like, battled for a minute. Meanwhile, Cassie's sitting there, like, eating her chips, like, loving every second of it, just being so happy that it was a debate.

[John Mayer]

Yeah, it was a debate.

[Alex Cooper]

It was a debate. And you decided to come on. What I liked about that meeting at dinner was that you are very sure of yourself. Have you always been that confident? Like, what were you like in high school?

[John Mayer]

Oh, that's. I've had some degree of confidence. It took that to get out of my town, to get into the world, to push against the forces of people who were saying, not just not encouraging me, but actively discouraging me from doing what I ultimately have done. And so the quality of that confidence has changed from like a beat down every door, push yourself on people as much as you can all the time, to something way more relaxed. So everyone, when they first start out, is way more confident than they need to be because they don't know how confident they need to be. Right.

[Alex Cooper]

Oh, interesting.

[John Mayer]

And so it was kind of obnoxious when I was younger. I mean, if you're spending your whole youth pushing against these forces of, you can't do it, you're crazy. You're gonna end up on the street. This is a terrible idea that's gonna have a hangover effect on you for a long time where you're gonna still keep pushing.

[Alex Cooper]

That's really interesting because I can imagine, like, I was. Why I'm asking about high School is. Because I feel like we can agree that there's such formative years where peer approval socially is so important towards the way that you view yourself. How did you get along with people and how did people treat you?

[John Mayer]

I didn't and they didn't. I didn't have a presence. I went to school to get it over with and my Life began at 3:00 clock in the afternoon when I came home and played guitar. So I didn't dislike anybody. And I almost didn't even need that particular level of approval. I was kind of invisible and I just went to go. I didn't really pay attention in class. It's. It's really hard to explain. And there are people out there who I think would understand. When you're 13 years old, you got five years before you can even do anything on your own. And those are. That was the hardest part of my entire life was from 13 to getting out of high school because you already know what you know and you have to go through the rest of this kind of rote plan that's been set for everyone. And I remember sitting in class going like, I'm not supposed to be here, right?

[Alex Cooper]

Like, you, you're. So you're saying you knew what you wanted to do, you knew you were going to be a musician. You're like, why am I in social studies? Like, what the fuck am I doing here? Did people bully you? Like, were you the, like, dorky musician or.

[John Mayer]

No, I was bullied a little bit, but I was always kind of big. I was tall. I remember getting punched in the arm for flinching. I don't know if you've. If that's still a thing. This is the most butch your show has ever been. I'm talking to.

[Alex Cooper]

I love it.

[John Mayer]

Talking to you about Christmas special. Were.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay. Did you date in high school?

[John Mayer]

I had one girlfriend in high school, but I didn't really date. I had one girlfriend in high school.

[Alex Cooper]

What were you like in, like. What was John like in high school?

Dating?

[John Mayer]

Probably the best version I ever was of myself. I would like to think that was the best version and the next time is the best version. I only had one girlfriend before everything changed in my life. To me, like the truest, most innocent, realist, like, sweetest. It was high school.

[Alex Cooper]

Did you ever, through your fame, wonder if you should reach back out?

[John Mayer]

I did re. I did reach back out a few times.

[Alex Cooper]

Because you were looking for what?

[John Mayer]

Maybe to bring that part of my life into the new part of my life. But by that point she was Married and had kids. And I thought, that's a separate chapter. Or. Or that thing in my life was a separate chapter. I don't have to talk to people to know that I'm. I'm okay, that we're okay. Yeah, I think that's telepathic.

[Alex Cooper]

I liked. You said that at dinner. Just something about like, there's certain people in your life that you don't need to be in their life anymore. But it's really cool when you have a mutual understanding, whether it's an ex, whether it's someone that was your friend at some point to just be like, we don't need to talk to know, like, we're good, we're all right. We don't talk anymore for whatever reason.

[John Mayer]

But like, yeah, I mean, there are a couple little outstanding still vibrating things. I would love to get to 100% closure. I don't think that's realistic in anyone's life. Do you have someone in your life that it's always going to be incomplete? Yeah, I think everyone has a couple of those. But. But for the most part, it's been important for me to move on into my adult years in my life with the piece of like, we're cool. We don't have to talk.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay. So we're. We're about to leave high school because I'm just kind of going through the journey of. You. You performed at your high school graduation.

[John Mayer]

Yes, I did.

[Alex Cooper]

Were people nice to you then or no?

[John Mayer]

Yeah, that was right around the time where I started to reveal myself as a guitar player. And I had put. I was in a band and we'd written a couple songs and we'd written a song for graduation. I didn't actually graduate at that ceremony, so I didn't get enough credits to graduate. I had to go to summer school. And so it was a very deep moment to play that song and walk off the field while the rest of my friends graduated and I walked home.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay, but just so everyone knows how bluesy is that six years later you're a Grammy winning artist?

[John Mayer]

This part freaks me out. Chronologically speaking, this part is maybe one of the only aspects of my life that truly blows my mind.

[Alex Cooper]

Why?

[John Mayer]

Because it's such a short period of time that felt longer to me. I was. I graduated in 1995 and six years later I had. I was playing arenas, you know, at that point, I was playing clubs, but I had an album out and that would end up winning Grammys. And that was six. That was six years.

[Alex Cooper]

So it didn't really fucking matter that you had to go to summer school? You're like, I didn't even graduate.

[John Mayer]

And you know what I always think now is, like, there are people who get branded misfit, loser, you know? You know, in some way sort of developmentally disabled. No, they're not. They're on some other track that they have no school for.

[Alex Cooper]

You know, I love that you're saying that too, because it goes back to what you said of, like, I was sitting in that class and I knew I wasn't supposed to be there, but I had to be there. It's interesting to hear you say, like, it's so crazy to me that six years after I graduate college, I'm winning a Grammy for your body is a wonderland. You were dating someone at the time that you're writing this iconic song, which.

[John Mayer]

No, I wasn't.

[Alex Cooper]

You weren't?

[John Mayer]

No, that was about my first girlfriend. That was about the feeling, which I think was already sort of nostalgic. I was 21 when I wrote that song, and I was nostalgic for being 16.

[Alex Cooper]

I thought it was about a different.

[John Mayer]

No, that's. That's one of those things where people just sort of form that idea. It gets reinforced over the years. No, no, no. I had never met a celebrity when I wrote that song.

[Alex Cooper]

And did your high school girlfriend know you wrote that about her?

[John Mayer]

That's a good question. Maybe. Maybe she didn't. Maybe she didn't.

[Alex Cooper]

To this day.

[John Mayer]

To this day, maybe she didn't. Yeah. So if you were my highest. My one and only high school girlfriend, that was actually about you. And this happens a lot with songs, Right. So I've made a rule. I guess I always had a rule that I would never tell anyone what's. I don't. I don't write songs about people. I don't write them for people or about people. I might use a relationship that inspires me to write something. So, yeah, even if I was writing a song because of someone, it's like, that goes away and I'm left with the song. So I'm not. I don't like telling anyone that a song is about somebody because most of the time it's not. And it takes people away from themselves because they're just visualizing who I'm writing about. But the songs come out. They mean things to people. Sometimes people think it's about one person other. Sometimes it hurts the song.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

Sometimes the song doesn't do as well because people go, well, he's just petty. And I go, that's got Nothing to do with that. But I'd much rather keep the sanctity of these songs intact and have a couple of them kind of burn a couple of them. Because people think it's about one person and it's not. Because it's really important. The most important thing in my life now is. Are my songs.

[Alex Cooper]

Yep.

[John Mayer]

And so when I go play songs now, I'm playing songs that I see. People in the crowd are reliving their life. It ain't about anyone but the people I'm singing to. It's now about their college years. It's about their sick family member who died. It's about their fight with cancer and how they beat it. It's these songs now for people are these waypoints in their lives. It's not about any one person. You know, the first three. Three records of my life was just like proving, proving. And you should. And then you start hearing people tell you, thank you. Your music got me through a dark time that's so much deeper. I mean, I definitely think everyone should have those prove it years and enjoy them.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

Because I definitely did. Like, now do you see? Now do you see? And I had a lot of that. I had a lot that I had to get out when I first started. And it was obnoxious to them. And I get it. And I think it explains a lot of younger people who have just hit the scene, who. You're like, this person is obnoxious. I have a lot of grace for it. Because you never know how hard someone had to punch to get out of their town or their family or a relate, you know, and. And you just. I think that's where people were like, I got the douchebag title a lot. And I was trying incredibly hard, but I had been trying incredibly hard since I first played the guitar to get where I needed to get. I couldn't get the message like, John, they like you just fine.

[Alex Cooper]

You can calm down.

[John Mayer]

They like you just fine.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah. You know, I really appreciate you explaining it that way because I. I now too have a different opinion. Especially maybe in the music industry or, you know, actors and actresses. Like, the way that maybe people are being perceived online and the way they're acting probably is really not who they are. It's. They're trying to elevate, to get the attention, to get the approval and. And eventually, as you see people in their careers, and this is. You don't even have to be famous to have this. You can be doing it at your job, you can be doing it socially. You're trying to make a name for yourself. You're trying to have a presence, and it probably feels inauthentic, but you want to be seen, you want to be heard. You want to feel accepted, and that can lead to you feeling like, what am I even being myself right now? So I respect that.

[John Mayer]

That's. Thank you. I mean, that's what everyone goes through. Everyone, by the time they grow up, have grace for other people on the way up as they fight through those things. The people who are the vicious are the people who have yet to ask for grace because they don't need it yet, because they still have this view of the world. Like, they're in total control, and they're going to make all the right decisions for the rest of their lives until they don't. And I feel like that's just something everyone passes through.

[Alex Cooper]

What do you cherish the most about the rise of your career?

[John Mayer]

Oh, that's a great question. The rise or where I am now? I'll tell you. I'll answer both. The rise is that it was during a really cool time. I don't think I would have had the same success I have now if I had begun three years ago. I think I'd be trying and trying and trying on social media and trying to get things out there. I mean, there was just so fewer people doing things that you automatically had more people paying attention. So I'm really lucky that I came up when there were just fewer cars on the road in terms of, you know, making songs and having people pay attention to you and being seen. And now where I am now, the greatest thing is that any idea that I have, I can do any idea that I have, I feel like if there was a song idea that I had for any musician in the world, I'd have a pretty good chance of them at least listening to it. And that's really interesting to me. That. That, to me is the greatest thing is, like, the songs I already have that I'll take for the rest of my life, but also any idea that I have, I think any musician in the world would want to go, like, I want to hear what Mayor has for me. So I feel like that's the idea that I could bring anything to life that came to mind. That's the ultimate for me.

[Alex Cooper]

I'm interested. So as your rise to fame, how did your interactions with women change?

[John Mayer]

Oh, that's a. That's a good question. And I think I saw the approval of women as being something that was like, each time somebody liked what I Did. I felt like, because of the way that I was brought up, that that was the only time that was going to happen. And so I feel like I was made to believe growing up that if somebody liked me, that was pretty much an accident and that should be capitalized on. And so I felt very deeply when somebody liked me. Very deeply. I think, look, you know, the elephant in the room is that I'm on a show that caters to women, and I have a couple of nameplates on me like Lothario and womanizer and stuff. And. And I think, look, that is what that is. That's the role I play on the big TV show that I didn't write. That's fine. Maybe I had a hand in it or something. But I think people would be surprised to know that it was less me going, like, you know, the meme of the guy behind the tree. It was less this and more like this me. Yeah, yeah. You know, because it was. It was always set forth to me that, like, that shouldn't happen.

[Alex Cooper]

Right.

Like, without dissecting into your childhood the. A woman's approval and attention to you, clearly there was an insecurity within you that you perk up and would fight till the end to make sure that you're getting to experience that as long as they're willing to give it to you. And you're, like, waiting for someone to give you the approval and that, like, breathe. Breathe life into you, essentially. And you loved a woman giving you attention or validation.

[John Mayer]

Most of that is true. And it's so true. It's like, I can't even. I won't even flat spin about that after this is over. I won't even. That's. Some things are too true for me to get upset about. That's remarkably true, what you just said. Except it. What, it was a little less overt in terms of me being like, yeah, keep going, keep going.

[Alex Cooper]

Right?

[John Mayer]

Because I did invest myself. I. I did invest myself in relationships.

[Alex Cooper]

Well.

And I think we can also agree, and we talked about this a little bit at dinner, like, there. You have perspective now, right?

[John Mayer]

Yeah.

[Alex Cooper]

Like, we can wrap things into a bow now. It's like, oh, I see what I was doing in high school, why I was so insecure and I was looking for the guy's validation. And then, like, I can now see what I was doing in the moment. You have the feelings, but you can't put it all into a box. You now can be like, I get it now. I get what I was doing. I see the interactions. I Had. And now I see this theme. And now I'm able in later in my life to be like, whoa, that's why I did what I did.

[John Mayer]

Also known as growing up.

[Alex Cooper]

What a concept.

[John Mayer]

Also known as growing up. And like. Like I said, like, the people who are gonna understand this interview the most are the people who have had that either been on the receiving end or the giving end of that. You know, it's the people who haven't had that yet who will probably have the loudest reactions because they don't understand it yet. And we all meet up at the end of this. At the end of these crazy 20s and 30s, we all meet up, and I meet people. I can't remember if they were mad at me or if I was mad at them, because we all meet up after this craziness, and we all go through our own stuff. You know, we all meet up at the end, and I. And we go, hey, how you doing?

[Alex Cooper]

This is, I'm sure, a hard question to answer. What is it, like, try your best.

[John Mayer]

Yeah.

[Alex Cooper]

For almost everyone in the world to know who you are.

[John Mayer]

Because I don't really live exposed to all of it. I don't quite feel it, and I'm okay with it because it's linked to something that I have to do anyway. I get to do this thing. If I'm having a day where I don't like any of this stuff, I can pick up a guitar and listen to myself play and go. That's why you do it. So the fact that this is all linked to something that I do objectively well, that I can listen to, and I could write a song. I could play a song. I can play the guitar. That's what anchors me to all this stuff. All of this is happening because I play the guitar, write music, and sing in a way that people want to pay attention to. I can't imagine what this would be like if I didn't have that grounding element. And as I get older, I have so much empathy for people who are really well known but don't quite have something to hold on to, like a buoy, you know, my life gives me this buoy, which is I can write a song. I can play guitar. It's tough even that way. But it's not like I'm famous from a thing that happened to me or a thing I was a part of that I was no longer a part of because the person who hired me for the thing didn't want me anymore. So it's very stable. I've come to terms with the fact that it's never going to be another way. And most of it now, because I don't really interface with people for anything other than music. For the most part. It's like I have manufactured irrelevance in the parts of my career that I want to be irrelevant. That is really scary to do. It's really scary to come off of that loop when you're in a news cycle, news cycle, news cycle. To really go, I want to shut down this part, that part, that part, and that part. And feel like you're dying inside because those parts are going away now. All I have left is, like, people who want to talk to me want to talk to me about music I make. People aren't. I'm not trending on Twitter just because I got on a flight. And it was tough. It was tough to be like, yeah, you're gonna play music. You're gonna play music, and you're gonna put it all into that and not day trading how people feel about you.

[Alex Cooper]

So you're saying that you didn't essentially play the role of the guy in Hollywood, the singer. Everything didn't work well. That people started. Like you said, like, people started writing headlines.

[John Mayer]

I didn't deserve the role.

[Alex Cooper]

Why do you think that?

[John Mayer]

It wasn't made for me. I'm the musician guy who writes songs that are, like, kind of hits. And I thought that I was just, through my own manipulation of the thing, was an A lister, and I was going to. I'm an a. I'm an A list celebrity. No, you're not. But I had this moment in my 20s where I thought, well, this is where I belong. This is where I should be. And obviously it wasn't because I didn't really handle it very well. You know, I was like. Didn't handle it very well. And so then that all kind of shut down, and I got a chance to start it up again. And I haven't ever been happier in my life. I'm known for what I do.

[Alex Cooper]

You're kind of essentially alluding to, like, you fucked up in your 20s or that's.

[John Mayer]

Yeah, late 20s, early 30s.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay.

[John Mayer]

Yeah.

[Alex Cooper]

And that kind of set you on a different course. Yes, of. Yeah, I've got a. Okay.

[John Mayer]

But a more natural course. I'm only doing what I should be doing in. And I think there's a lot of people who are stuck in that loop of, like, not being where they want to be, but not wanting to be forgotten. And it's scary, the idea that if you pulled away. You'd be forgotten that if you. If you got off Twitter, you'd be forgotten that if you didn't throw yourself into the mix every day, you'd be forgotten. It's beautiful to be forgotten in the ways you ultimately don't want to be known.

[Alex Cooper]

You know, what is an experience that shaped who you are that very few people know about?

[John Mayer]

That's a. That's a good one.

[Alex Cooper]

Call Her. Daddy is brought to you by Airbnb. It's the holiday season, but I'm gonna be booking in there. I'm gonna be booking Airbnb through and.

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[John Mayer]

Anxiety, deep anxiety. Before, there was a social media that could tell you what anxiety was. Not to say it makes it any easier, but anxiety feeds off of feeling isolated by it. And so it's a little bit easier now when you can read other people's experiences and go, oh, okay, well, I mean, having anxiety in mid-90s, late-90s, it's like you think you're going crazy, you know, and so that to me gave me so much more depth. So much more depth. Those feelings, those, those feelings of panic, those feelings of the walls are closing in. They come with questions. They come with every question on why, why can't I sleep? What's going on in the universe, what's going on in my body turns into hypochondria. How many. Is my heart beating faster? It's my throat closing. Why do I feel my pulse in my ear? And you're on WebMD looking up everything and whatever that is also makes you super keyed in to yourself in a way that for me, I wrote a lot of, A lot of my music came from wanting answers after feeling really, really lost because I lost my weight just in my head. Like, it got to the point where when I would have an anxious moment, I'd be like, well, here comes a song. Do you ever get that?

[Alex Cooper]

Totally.

But I think there's points where I was worried that good content sometimes comes at your lowest. And it's really hard to describe unless you're a creator where you're wondering if you're self destructing to like you're gonna write a great sad song if you go through a great breakup. I'm gonna have an incredible episode if I break up with my partner. But at what cost? For you, as an individual, outside of your craft and your job, is that extremely detrimental to just your life?

[John Mayer]

I never, and I can say this with great confidence, I never tried to induce an experience just to write a song ever in my life, ever. I've never thought, if I do this, I'll get material. I promise you I would have absolutely, in those moments, as a 20, 21, 22, 23 year old guy, traded every song I was going to write to, to not have that feeling. No doubt about it, no doubt about I would have said, take all the songs I'll ever write, stop this feeling from happening right now. And for whatever that feeling was, it just focused my eyes on the important Things. What's going on in life? What is. That's where these lyrics come from. You know, that's where my first three records are from. They're about managing anxiety. Why Georgia? Why am I here? Am I living it right? Like, why am I here? You know, there's a song not myself on the first record. Would you want me one? That's all about having a panic attack in front of somebody. Suppose I said, I, you know, would you love me? I don't remember the lyrics. Like, would you want me when I'm not myself? Like, you ever have a panic attack on a date?

[Alex Cooper]

No.

[John Mayer]

Oh, man. That's. That's how you bond with someone right there.

[Alex Cooper]

John. That's how you do often have a panic.

[John Mayer]

Yes.

[Alex Cooper]

On a date.

[John Mayer]

Well, I mean, they make things you could take now for that. But I. Yeah, I'm. I wanna. Okay, so I went on a date. I was. I was going on a date. And on my. My senior year in high school with, like, one of the prettiest girls, couldn't believe that I'd gotten to the point where, like, this girl wanted to go to the movies with me. I didn't drive until I was out of high school, so I. Riding shotgun. So right there, I'm being driven by the girl I'm going on the date with. By the time we got to the movie theater and I was eating, like, Tums because I had such bad nervous stomach. This is before, like, you figured out benzodiazepines. And I was eating Tom's stomachache, and before we even got out of the car, I was like, I have a stomachache. Can you drive me home? And she drove me all the way home. And I got home, and as soon as I got home, I was like, ah, I'm deeply uncomfortable in. In. In a lot of situations. And so for a really long time, I would resist going out with anybody because it would make me so nervous that my stomach. I would just be. It would be terrible.

[Alex Cooper]

This is why I love sitting down with people. Because when you think, John Mayer, you can get any woman you want, right?

[John Mayer]

In. In media land, you could get any man you wanted.

[Alex Cooper]

Thanks, John.

[John Mayer]

I was saying being a famous guy is like being a hot girl.

[Alex Cooper]

Oh, that's so interesting.

[John Mayer]

Being a famous guy is like being a hot girl.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay, well, let me bring up my next question. Okay. People have been obsessed with who you've dated in your career. And if you're going through, like, the tabloids and everything, you. It's like, John Mayer is the IT guy.

Right.

And recently you joke that you're America's ex boyfriend. Why did America break up with you?

[John Mayer]

That's, that's my way of taking some of what I think is the air out of a, of a, you know, that's like elephant hunting in the room.

[Alex Cooper]

I, I like, I like the statement.

[John Mayer]

Yeah. I mean, that's how they see it. Bottom line, I'm one guy living one life. I don't need 300 million people in my life to agree that I'm an okay person. Most people, until the dawn of the Internet needed about eight. I've got multiples of eight, which makes me a very happy and lucky human being. I only need to meet one more person that I want to spend the rest of my life with. So I do not need to have this worldwide consensus that I'm an okay guy.

[Alex Cooper]

What is your type? Right. Hot, successful, makes more money than you.

[John Mayer]

That's really funny. Well, I mean, every relationship I've ever been in was devoted to the idea that this could go the distance. My entire life, today included. If you told me that I could have a great two months with someone but it would end on the first day of the third month, I would not be interested. I have always sought potential for long term relationship. I know what my mistakes were. Looking back, not worth talking about. We all, as long as you do the accounting, as long as you do your homework as a human being, as you stand in the shower and you waste a little water and you go, yeah, I really meant well, but I did do that, or yeah, they meant well, but they did do that. And you go, wouldn't do that again. I would approach that a different way. Maybe even from the beginning, maybe even from day one. Seeing them across the room, who knows? As long as you're aware of what those things are and how you can apply that to the next relationship, I don't see a problem with any past relationships ending badly.

[Alex Cooper]

I agree.

[John Mayer]

I just don't. Mine are different because they are well known and I have not had a relationship in a lot of years. And it's funny how I think I started to notice like people would look at pictures of hot dudes on the Internet and be like, I love this guy. I'd be like, that picture is from 2002. You know what I mean? And it helps me understand that we tend to hold on to the part of someone's history that we, that sort of revealed itself the most or was the brightest, the most easy to visualize. And so I still look, I'm still In a lot of people's minds, in a good way. Doing something I'm not doing anymore. Whether they're attached to a record or a tour I was on, they still want to share YouTube videos of a tour I did in 2014 or whatever. And there are still people who go, oh, yeah, he's the. He's. He's the man whore or whatever, you know? But it's not on each and every person to update their knowledge of me every year. You know what I mean?

[Alex Cooper]

But it's like, you haven't updated your Facebook status.

[John Mayer]

There you go.

[Alex Cooper]

So everyone's looking at you in 2009.

[John Mayer]

That's actually a brilliant observation. It's like the world creates my Facebook status. But. But. So here's. Here's why that's okay. If somebody gets you a little bit wrong, if you said something and someone recounts it and they get one word wrong and it makes something sweet sound not sweet, you're gonna jump out and go, that is not what I said. Here's how I said it. You're gonna fine tune that thing that you're being misunderstood for. There comes a point where if you're so misunderstood, it's almost like they're thinking about a different person. So the me that most people who don't know me are thinking about is so far away from me that I don't actually feel. I don't actually feel, like, disrupted in any way by it. They're talking about a character or a thing that's been like an artifact, right? Like this one little glitch that sort of grew and became this other thing. I don't feel the need. And I hope you don't think this is, like, me going, like, let me set the record straight.

[Alex Cooper]

No, no, no. I meant, you know, you're just taking us through your psyche.

[John Mayer]

I appreciate it. Being. Being. Being misunderstood at this age is nowhere near as painful as it was being misunderstood in my 20s. And a lot of the shit that I did in my 20s was an attempt to reset the misunderstanding, and I made it worse. Someone said to me years ago, you're trying to eat the monster that's trying to eat you. I've never heard a more true thing said to me. And I look at other people right now and I go, elon Musk, you're trying to eat the monster that's trying to eat you. I see it, and I have grace for other people trying to do it. We haven't learned that retreat is an option. Retreat is an option. I don't know where this idea of stubborn fight to the death stuff came from, you'll lose everything.

[Alex Cooper]

It's really interesting to hear you talk about it, because what I think we can also get to. And it's. You don't have to be famous to have this being misunderstood. There is something inside of all of us. At one point when you start to feel that, it's a really exhausting, scary feeling and you really want to fight to correct everything. If you. If there's a rumor about you in high school, if you. If something happens at your job and people see you the certain way, you start to spiral. And then there's that moment where all of a sudden, after so much fighting, so much clawing, someone trying to eat them. All right.

[John Mayer]

Yep.

[Alex Cooper]

You're, like, at peace with, like, I don't give a. Because you're good with yourself.

[John Mayer]

Your reality is stronger than their ability to distort it. And at first, when it's not, it's one of the most sickening, frightening, painful things to have your reality distorted. And if you're smart, theoretically, you start coming up with a plan to engineer how to undistort the reality that's been distorted. And that's the beginning of the failure, because your behavior stops being natural and starts being what I did. If you're going to distort me, I'm going to distort me. I lost myself in that. The idea of I'm going to be more like you think I am as a way to somehow phase cancel what it is as. As if playing into it would make everyone in the world who shares my exact thinking go, oh, he can't be that.

[Alex Cooper]

Right.

[John Mayer]

Because he's acting like that he's in on it. So that didn't work and that didn't work, and. And it was like, I look back sometimes, I go, like, you could have retreated. And nobody knows how to retreat because the stakes are so high. The stakes are so high. You've got half of the world going. You love it when you do that. And the other half of the world going, you're losing your mind. And you go, well, I know one thing. Can't give up now. And it's like. But you could, and six months from now, you would be so happy that you did.

[Alex Cooper]

I feel, especially with social media, you're trying so hard to prove yourself on this platform that's fake to begin with. And I really feel like it's helpful to talk through. Like, there is an option to retreat and you don't have to post that photo to prove you were at that place. You don't have to post this photo and edit it so you look a certain way, even though you don't look like that way in person. Like, there is just some extreme peace in allowing yourself to enjoy what's in front of you and the people that know you and care about you and your friends and your family. Like, I've been subjected to it where I'm trying to prove that I'm not this girl and I'm not this girl, and then all of a sudden I'm like, I don't even know people. Yeah, what am I doing?

[John Mayer]

And you're losing your center. Center point. And I also think that people need to go through that. A lot of times people think that the stuff that didn't go right in their life was a mistake. And I don't think it's a mistake because I don't think there's any other way around it. I don't even look at it like a problem. It's like, that's just the way it has to go.

[Alex Cooper]

Have you ever been in love?

Support for Call Her Daddy comes from Google Pixel. Okay, so I recently had one of those Sundays where I convinced myself it was a great idea to reorganize my entire closet. And of course, halfway through, I found myself sitting on the floor surrounded by clothes, completely overwhelmed. So I pulled out my Google Pixel 10 Pro because it comes with Gemini built in on the phone. I launched my camera using Gemini Live, showed it my crazy closet, and I asked for help. And immediately it hit me up with all sorts of pro organizing tips like what to hang, how to fold stuff, and even helped me decide which items to donate and where to drop them off. And it was a lifesaver. Ladies. Okay? But while I was neck deep in hoodies, I totally lost track of time until I got a text from Matt saying, hey, what is the address for dinner tonight? Fortunately, the Google Pixel has this feature called Magic Cue that just pulls up the info you need without you having to dig through old emails and stuff. It popped the address right into my text for me and tap it was sent. Daddy. Gang, we could all use a little help making Sundays less scary. So get outside of your comfort phone and try the Google Pixel 10 Pro. Check it out@google store.com. these AI features are for users 18 + check responses. Availability and results vary. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Columbia Sportswear. So cold weather is obviously quickly approaching, and that means it's time to layer up. You already think of Columbia Sportswear for winter Gear but their new Amaze Puff jacket. It is a jacket made for us girls and it's gonna be my new go to all season long. Let me tell you a little something, Daddy Gang, okay? I hate when I am out running errands and you've got this like warm, cozy winter jacket that turns into an oven the minute you step inside. But you dressed for the jacket, right? And instead of taking off your coat and lugging around, you're just sweating, babe. You're sweating inside of your jacket. But with a maze puff, you can just use the built in backpack straps and free up both your hands. It's super soft and incredibly cozy and it also just looks great. There's a length and a color for whatever, literally whatever you're looking for. And it is the perfect everyday puffer. I am such a coat girl. But I also recognize I live in Los Angeles, so I need something that is functional and can kind of go with me. I want to look cute, but sometimes it is literally so warm.

But it's fall, right?

So I want to put on a cute little coat. But boom. Amaze Puff is my go to visit Columbia.com to get your hands on an Amaze Puff jacket. It's tough on cold. Soft on you. This is an ad by Better Help. Okay, the holidays can just be a lot, right? They're exciting, but they can also just be overwhelming. Because I think balancing family expectations and travel and making things perfect, it can just be a lot. And that is why Better Help is encouraging you to rewrite your traditions this season by making time for for you Daddy Gang, incorporating therapy into your new or existing traditions can help you slow down and take care of yourself during what can be a joyful but honestly, sometimes hectic and lonely time of year. The holidays look different for everyone. Maybe it's baking your grand aunt's sweet potato pie or starting something new like a quiet night in with friends. Therapy can be one of those new traditions too. Better Help gives you space to pause, reflect and feel more grounded. They match you with a qualified therapist based on your goals and preferences. And if it's not right, Fitch, you can switch anytime. With over 30,000 therapists worldwide and more than 5 million people served, better Help helps people close the year with clarity instead of chaos. This December, start a new tradition by taking care of you. Our listeners get 10% [e-mail] Daddy that's better. H lp.com Daddy have you ever been in love?

[John Mayer]

Yes.

[Alex Cooper]

You're currently single.

[John Mayer]

Currently single.

[Alex Cooper]

Looking back at past relationship is relationships Is there anything that you have looked for, of something of like a theme of what you want to work on within yourself moving forward?

[John Mayer]

That's a hot question. I don't know yet, because I haven't gotten. I never really got to the part of relationship that was the smooth sailing part. I have a feeling when I do, I'm gonna have a lot to work on, but I'll be excited to work on it because it won't be that incredibly fundamental stuff of like, how do we. How do we stay together? You know, Like, I'm always supremely impressed by couples that I know who are having a hard time but haven't even considered breaking up. That's hot. Like, that to me is the hottest. Someone complains about their girlfriend or their wife and you're. And you're like, you start to allude to them wanting to go somewhere else and like, what are you talking about? No, I'm not going anywhere else. We're just having a hard time. And I. I have a feeling that, that I'm going to be ready to cop to a little bit of intellectual control issues on. Only on an intellectual side. Like, I can be. I can be. I'm trying to be a little more heart overhead, but I can be a little heady. And I think it's cool to say to someone, this is my thing. This is what I'm going to work on. And I love the idea of sharing that with someone and them saying, you're doing it again. And you go, I'm doing it again. Sorry.

[Alex Cooper]

What is your dating style like and how has it evolved? Like, what are you like?

[John Mayer]

I don't know. I don't date that that much. I look at it like this. Dating is no longer a codified activity for me. It doesn't exist in any kind of. It's not patterned anymore. I quit drinking like six years ago, so I don't drink anymore. I don't have the liquid courage.

[Alex Cooper]

How do you feel about that? How has that changed your dating life?

[John Mayer]

You have to be honest. You have to express yourself. You have to be really glaringly honest. Here's who I am. Here's what I like. Here's what makes me nervous. Here's what I reject as an idea in relationship I don't know about. You know, you have to express your anxieties. You can't. You can't just walk over them by drinking. You have to be like, here's what I'm anxious about. And when someone in life accommodates your anxiety, that's bonding, right?

[Alex Cooper]

Kind of cutting past the. The surface level bullshit and being like, can we connect on a way that feels cozy and like we know each other past just like, hey, so like, that's right. Where did you grow up for.

[John Mayer]

Yeah. You're done with giving the. The free trial.

[Alex Cooper]

Yes.

[John Mayer]

There comes a moment where your free trial runs out.

[Alex Cooper]

How quickly will someone know that you're into them?

[John Mayer]

It takes me a while. It takes me a while. I think the way to my heart now, as I get older is I don't know that I have like 5 hour dates in me. I don't have these deep excursions at a table that go into like this sort of job interview vibe. I would rather have someone. I'll be honest with you. I've thought about this before. I would love someone to say, hey, I'm coming over your house for an hour and a half. I'm bringing my laptop. Just need the WI fi code. I'll be on the couch. I'm not trying to take up all your space. I have a really good feeling about you. I don't want to do the thing or I start to make you feel claustrophobic. Because I really have a good feeling about you. Give me the WI FI code. I'll eat one of your yogurts. Talk to me when you want to talk to me. I'd be like, I wanted to do that.

[Alex Cooper]

Do you know how many people are going to DM you and be like, john, can I have the WI FI code? I'm going to just come over.

[John Mayer]

Maybe I said that just for that. I mean, but. But I actually think more people would find love sooner if it was less intense exposure for shorter periods of time.

[Alex Cooper]

But more frequently just settling down freak you out?

[John Mayer]

Nope. This is the part that always shocks people. They go, you don't want to get married. Of course I want to get married. I'm just. You're not going to see me go on a battery of dates with different people. I am a pocket listing. I'm not really on. What is it? The mls. All the heavy lifting is done in my learning what I need to learn. And just in terms of entering in a relationship, I can't wait for someone to be mad at me because I said that I would take the dry cleaning in. And they were going to until I said I would, but then I didn't. And if you're gonna tell me that you're gonna take the dry cleaning, you have to do that. Because I would love that. I would love that. Because that would suggest that we're into something deep, meaningful, and secure.

[Alex Cooper]

It goes back to what you said. Your friends, you're like, okay, so you're gonna leave? And they're like, fuck, no. Like, we're in this.

[John Mayer]

Nothing's hotter to me than conflict resolution. Conflict resolution. I am horny for conflict resolution. In the middle of an argument. We're having an argument, and I go, wait, I do do that. I did do that. I'm sorry. You're right. I didn't. Nope, you're right. I didn't get it. I do do that. I'm sorry.

[Alex Cooper]

What's something that is currently keeping you up at night?

[John Mayer]

What's something that is currently keeping me up at night? Metaphorically keeping me up at night.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

Whether I should put out a whole record as my next release or song at a time. Can't tell. Put a record out, you get a week, comes and goes. Put a song at a timeout, and you get repeated shots, repeated looks at the ball.

[Alex Cooper]

So I would.

[John Mayer]

But I sleep pretty. What's that?

[Alex Cooper]

So why wouldn't you do that?

[John Mayer]

I think I'd probably put a song at a timeout. I think.

[Alex Cooper]

I think that.

[John Mayer]

I think. I think song at a time is right for this next record.

[Alex Cooper]

Like, I would love a record personally, so I can just binge it like a little Netflix moment. But I get what you're saying is, like, you get to kind of.

[John Mayer]

Yeah, I'm not on a label anymore, and so that kind of keeps me up at night that the next thing I do would seem to be. Would seem to be. I hope it was small enough that a camera couldn't catch it.

[Alex Cooper]

You literally go, I'm not with a label anymore.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[John Mayer]

That was badly timed. That was badly timed.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

I'm not with the label anymore.

[John Mayer]

Can I also get a nail file? So I can. Can I get a nail file, say, I'm not with the label anymore? No, sorry. I'm deeply concerned about anything being on this dark sweater I'll look at.

[BetMGM/GameSense Announcer]

Good.

[John Mayer]

Thank you. Being not being on a label feels a little bit like the next thing I do. I have to prove myself.

[Alex Cooper]

Can you explain what are. How is your writing going? Like, you write everything?

[John Mayer]

I write everything. I mean, that part's really fun, looking back on it, to have 100% ownership of the songs I've written. But it's. I mean, it's hugely time consuming.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

Hugely time consuming. And as you get older, time gets more valuable, which makes this, you know, this deep diving that I do feel a little harder because no matter how old you get this stuff still takes a year to write.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

You know, when you're one guy and you want to sound like you're five guys, you've got to be yourself five different ways, and you can't do that all in one day. So the way you make music that sounds really complex is to hit it repeatedly on different days with different mindsets, which takes a very long time. Very long time. You write a whole song and you'll go, oh, I only needed that one verse, which is actually the chorus to this thing. And that dies, and then this moves over to here. And I would never do it any other way. I'd rather not put a record out than fall off in that way.

[Alex Cooper]

And when you're saying this like. Or do you go to a recording?

[John Mayer]

I go to a recording studio every day, 9 to 5. I have a job. Without it, I would fall apart.

[Alex Cooper]

How many people are in that studio with you?

[John Mayer]

One or two.

[Alex Cooper]

Wow.

[John Mayer]

It's just me and an engineer and an assistant. Sometimes guitar tech comes in and out, and I go home. I think about what I did that day, how I can make it better. I'm always writing. I bring a new thing in. Is this a thing? No. Is this a thing? Yes, actually. No. Is this a thing? Yes, actually. Hell, yes. They're all different experiences. And when you win, you go home feeling like a God. Did anyone see what I just brought to life today? I cannot believe I still have it. I still have it. This is incredible. This is incredible. And then you have to go write another one. You go write another one, and you're stuck in the same slog that every other song was. And you go, I'm garbage. I don't have it anymore. I'm out. I'm done. And you'll find another one. I'm on top of the world. Sometimes I'll write a song, and it'll be really good, and I'll go, just don't write another one for two or three days. Just relax, because you're gonna only be as happy as the last thing that frustrated you. Right.

[Alex Cooper]

You know, what is it like? What does it feel like to be on stage performing in front of thousands and thousands of people?

[John Mayer]

It's its own dimension. It's its own dimension. I will go on record as saying I'm really different than most musicians in that I don't. And I'm gonna have to finish this thought because it's gonna sound a little scary if I. If I don't. I don't feed off the energy. Of the crowd. It is not a drug to me. You hear people say, when the lights go down, you hear that noise, it's like. Comes in me like a drug. And I know that's how most people feel. That's not how I feel. Every night before I go on stage, I go, okay, all right, here we go. Because I'm a little nervous to do that. Not that I don't think I'm gonna be any good at it, but just the act of it is foreign. And then I'll get on stage. Okay, all right. And then somewhere in the middle of the first song, I'm gone. I'm gone. Having the time of my life. The one thing people don't understand about that job, the entire time I'm up there, I am worried that they're not having as good a time as I could give them. Not worried to the point where it's unpleasant, but it is a constant consideration. Do they want this song, or do they want a different song? Are they waiting for this song to be over, or do they want the next one? Am I playing? Like, if I had to make a set list right now, I'd hate it, because I have so much music from so many different areas of music that I don't know what anybody exactly wants. So I have to start writing a set list that would disappoint people equally and satisfy them equally. And so I only want people to go, that was great. I only want them to be happy. So I spent a lot of time while I'm playing going like, they want this one. And the answer is always, yeah, man, they want those songs. But while I'm playing, it's a very strange mix of, like, hyper confidence and, like, the person I really am, which is like, I hope you like this. As I'm, like, ascending through.

[Alex Cooper]

Through.

[John Mayer]

Through the cosmos, playing guitar, I'm like, I don't know if you like this one or not, but I hope you do.

[Alex Cooper]

It is the holidays. This is a holiday special. I've never done this before. Are you a New Year's resolution kind of guy?

[John Mayer]

Vaguely. I don't. I also think, like, I've done well enough in my life that I don't have to, like, overhaul everything as I. As I go through. Yeah, I'm a New Year's resolution guy. Are you asking me what that might be? Do you have one?

[Alex Cooper]

No, not yet. I'm gonna come up with that on vacation.

[John Mayer]

This is part maybe, of the New Year's resolution, which is to just.

[Alex Cooper]

Do.

[John Mayer]

Things that are a little uncharacteristic what you find uncharacteristic every once in a while. And so this is really me going like, okay, this is out of character. And that's okay. I know it's out of character. It's going to be okay. If I say a thing that the news cycle picks up and gives me a headache for two or three days, I know I'm going to be okay. So there might actually be something that exists that I didn't see coming that's really nice for people to go, oh, I never really heard him talking long form, you know.

[Alex Cooper]

So we're kicking off your New Year's resolution. You come in, Call her Daddy.

[John Mayer]

Yeah.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay. You're gonna kill me.

[John Mayer]

Okay.

[Alex Cooper]

I begged you.

[John Mayer]

Okay.

[Alex Cooper]

I begged John.

[John Mayer]

Yeah, all right. I know there's a guitar here on the.

[Alex Cooper]

To bring his guitar.

[John Mayer]

Yes.

[Alex Cooper]

More.

Because you know, I love the Daddy Gang. Everyone listening, watching. I love you selfishly. I need you to play just a couple things.

[John Mayer]

I get it. You want to watch. You want to watch me do the thing I just talked about for an hour?

[Alex Cooper]

Yes.

[John Mayer]

Okay.

[Alex Cooper]

Get the guitar. Let's go. Here we go.

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[John Mayer (Singing)]

It's not a silly little moment. It's not the stone before the calm. This is the deep and dying breath of this love that we've been working on. Can't seem to hold you like a water. So I can hold you in my arms. Nobody's gonna come and save us. We put too many thousand arms. We're going down and you can see it too. We're going down and you know that we're doomed. My dear. We slow dancing in a burning moon. I was the one you always dreamed of. You were the one I tried to draw. How dare you say it's nothing to me Baby, you're the only light I ever saw. I make the most of all the sadness. You know you be a bitch because you can. You try to hit me just to hurt me so you leave me feeling dirty. Cause you can't understand. We're going down, you can see it soon. We're going down. And you know that we're doomed. My dear, we're slow dancing in a burning room. Oh, go cry about it, why don't you? Go cry about it, why don't you? Yeah. Oh, go crybatic, go crybatical. Crybatic. Oh, my dear, we. We're slow dancing in a burning room. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, no, no. Don't you think we ought to know by now? Don't you Think we should have learned somehow don't you think we ought to know about now about now but you think we should have learned somehow I don't wanna burn I don't wanna. Burning, burning, burning, burning down My dear We were slow dancing in a burning room.

[John Mayer]

Thank you very much.

[Alex Cooper]

Wow.

Thank you. I have no words.

[John Mayer]

Thank you. It's not like there's like this guitar solo stuff that I do in the song, but on an acoustic, I just.

[Alex Cooper]

Have to be like, no, it's fine. Wait, can you sing that line? Georgia.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

I am driving up 85 in the kind of morning the last all afternoon I'm just stuck inside the gloomy.

[John Mayer]

Give me another. You know who says. I think I've heard it There goes that.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Who says I can't get stone Turn off the lights and the telephone Me and my house alone who says I can't kiss stone who says I can't take time and meet all the girls in the county line Wait on fate to send this.

[John Mayer]

Oh, I did it wrong.

[Alex Cooper]

It's okay.

[John Mayer]

Don't you see the cheat of.

[Alex Cooper]

Of having a guitar? Yeah.

[John Mayer]

You know, do you do this before.

[Alex Cooper]

You have sex with someone?

[John Mayer]

No, I. I do it after sometimes. No, you should never play guitar to have sex with someone. But a little naked guitar playing after is very memorable. Memorable with a little gut hanging over. Sitting on the end of the bed. Little gut hanging over. You know, it's nice.

[Alex Cooper]

I don't think anyone is staring at your gut, John.

[John Mayer]

I like the way people look when they fold all up all weird when they. When they sit up. No matter who you are, you look weird when you sit up. And it's cute. You know what I mean?

[Alex Cooper]

You look great right now.

[John Mayer]

Yeah. You sit. You know, I have a shirt on. But people, everyone, no matter who you are, you sit up.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

You're like, of course.

[John Mayer]

That's great.

[Alex Cooper]

Humans, we have skin.

[John Mayer]

Yeah. And after you're all done, and we just look sort of like dopey in a cool way.

[Alex Cooper]

Okay.

[John Mayer]

So, yeah, this is actually when I came up with.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

I came up with, who says I can't get stoned?

[John Mayer]

I think I was in bed, a little stoned on a bed. And it was after having some. Some fun. And that's when an acoustic guitar is great. It's. It's so lame to do it before.

[Alex Cooper]

So you're telling me that a special someone got to watch you create a line?

[John Mayer]

I think so.

[Alex Cooper]

In pro. Damn. Can you sing daughters?

[John Mayer]

Yes, I can sing Daughters and daughters. I think it might have been on this guitar I wrote that in 2003. I was in New Zealand or Australia, and I was in the shower when I came up with it and got out of the shower naked and skipped. The next thing I had to do, which was a radio interview, I was like, I can't do the radio interview. I have to write this song. Because it. It was the cyclical as soon as I broke. Because, you know, it's like, Fathers, be.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Good to your daughters Daughters will love like you do.

[John Mayer]

You know, that was interesting. And then when I came up with.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

The circle of girls become lovers who turn into mothers, and then I came up with so mothers, be good to your daughters, to that whole swirl, I.

[John Mayer]

Was like, that's something like the geometry of that.

[Alex Cooper]

It seems like a lot of your songwriting is happening when you're naked.

[John Mayer]

Because a lot of things. Yes, yes, in the shower a lot. I want to put a microphone in the shower. But what I like about Daughters is that for all the tracks people use for songs, and I love songs with a lot of tracks, but this is one of the songs where the whole song is on the guitar. This is. This is the whole song of Daughters. That's the song. It's like pressing play on except for the shaker.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

I know a girl she puts the color inside of my world.

[John Mayer]

But she.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Just like a maze where all of the walls I'll continually change and I done all I can to stand on the steps with my heart in my hands Now I started fantasy that maybe it's got nothing to do with me Fathers, be good to your daughters Daughters will love like you do Girls become lovers who turn into mothers so mothers, be good to your daughters too oh yeah.

[John Mayer]

Now the thing that people got wrong about that song was that I'm not really talking too far. I'm not a 24 year old guy going like, hey, older man. It was. It's about the frustration of wanting to have a relationship with someone who can't because of upbringing. So if you've ever met someone, you're like, oh, I can't. I can't fix this particular part of your operating system. And then you're so desperate because you wish you could have that person, that it really is a leap of logic to say you're so upset that you're going like, stop. You know what I'm saying? Like, I wanted this girl so badly to be. To be able to receive my love. Whose ass do I have to kick? And I think it got read. That's what happens when you work metaphorically is people misunderstand it a lot. And so I think people thought that I was just like, well, I'm 24. Let me tell dads how to raise their daughters. But it's like a big, like, first dance wedding song. And I think it works both ways. And as I get older, it works a little easier as both ways. I just didn't think a 20. It didn't make sense to some people at a 24.

[Alex Cooper]

Wait, now, I. I didn't get that, obviously. And now I completely get it where it's like, oh, you're kind of being like, hey, I love this girl so much, but she's a little fucked up because her dad did or the mom.

[John Mayer]

Yeah, it's. It's this idea that it's a little selfish, you know?

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah.

[John Mayer]

Like, hey, I kind of. I kind of wanted to love this person.

[Alex Cooper]

Right.

[John Mayer]

You know, it's. It doesn't make. It. It's emotional. It's like. It sounds logical, but it's mostly emotional.

[Alex Cooper]

What is the one? Okay, I'm gonna forget the name because it's not.

[John Mayer]

Give me keywords. It's fine.

[Alex Cooper]

Not broken heart, but it's like not dancing with a broken heart.

[John Mayer]

Dreaming with a broken.

[Alex Cooper]

Dreaming with a broken heart. Such a good one.

[John Mayer]

It's on the piano, but. It's weird to do on the guitar.

[Alex Cooper]

Sounds exactly the same.

[John Mayer]

It's up there, but it's like.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

When you're dreaming with a broken heart.

[John Mayer]

It's like, I have to really sing in.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

The waking up is the hardest part.

[John Mayer]

I figured out how to sing it.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Now you roll out a bit and down on your knees and for a moment you can hardly breathe Wondering, was she really here? Is she standing in my room? No, she's not here. Cause she's gone Gone, gone, gone, gone. When you're dreaming with a broken heart. The giving up is the hottest part. Isn't that what it is?

[Alex Cooper]

I think so.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

She takes you in with her crying eyes.

[John Mayer]

Is that giving? I don't remember.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

And all at once you start to.

[John Mayer]

Is that the same lyrics as the.

[Alex Cooper]

I don't know.

[John Mayer]

But yeah, that's right.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

All at once you start to say goodbye Wondering would he stay my love? And will you wake up by my side? No, she won't. Cause she's gone Gone, gone, gone.

[John Mayer]

And it's like, How about being old enough now that I can't remember some of those songs?

[Alex Cooper]

Picturing myself driving home from a break, I'm like, john, right?

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Do I have to fall asleep with roses in my hand?

[John Mayer]

That's right.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Do I have to fall asleep with roses in my hand.

[John Mayer]

Yeah. Then it's a way up.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Do I have to fall asleep with roses in my. Roses in my hand? And would you get them if I did? No, you won't, because you're gone. Gone, gone, gone, gone.

[John Mayer]

Right. And then it goes. Does the verse one more time.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

When you're dreaming with a broken heart, The waking up is the hardest part.

[John Mayer]

I haven't played that song in a while.

[Alex Cooper]

That song got me through so much heartbreak.

[John Mayer]

I did. I woke up one day. I was making Continuum. I woke up and I had a dream about someone and I had a crush on them the whole rest of the day because I had had a dream about them. Do you still have dreams where you wake up and you loved someone and now you have a crush and you're all emotional?

[Alex Cooper]

Oh, yeah. You're thinking about them.

[John Mayer]

It's the best feeling in the world as you get older. But I went to the studio and they were working on something else, and I went and sat in this big reverb chamber and closed the door, and I was like, I've got to work on this song. And that's all about the pain of having a dream about someone that you don't know but have a crush on or that you know and have a crush on. For me, I didn't really know this person, but just had a crush on them. I'll never say who, because it's random. It's very random. It's not.

[Alex Cooper]

Yeah, waking up is the hardest part.

Wow.

[John Mayer]

Yeah.

[Alex Cooper]

Because you're like, oh, John, I want to. I'm gonna speak for the masses that you just made a lot of people's holidays.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Oh, cool.

[Alex Cooper]

It's truly, like. It's so fucking cool to see. Huh? Oh, I mean.

[John Mayer]

Keep talking.

[Alex Cooper]

I. Yeah, this is a good way.

To end the show.

I'm really happy that you came on the show. We got deep, we had fun. We're friends now, which is fun. I have a new friend. Thank you for sharing your location with me. Kazi was like, he does that. Yeah, I'm excited. No, you brought out a side of yourself that I really appreciate you sharing because it is very cool to see someone that is so huge in their own right. But to get to sit with you and hear just a little bit of the personal side of you makes this even cooler.

[John Mayer]

Thank you. Thank you for being kind to me, good to me, and making me feel comfortable. I'm now a fan of the show. I. If you. If I don't. If there's an initiation into the daddy gang. But I will do whatever it.

[Alex Cooper]

I think you have to look into the camera to say hi, daddy gang.

[John Mayer]

Hi, daddy gang.

[Alex Cooper]

John Mayer, thank you so much for coming on Call Her Daddy.

[John Mayer]

Thank you for having me.

[Alex Cooper]

It was a pleasure.

[John Mayer]

So much fun.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Have yourself a merry little Christmas.

[John Mayer]

Let.

[John Mayer (Singing)]

Your heart be light. From now on our troubles will be out of sight? And have yourself a merry little Christmas now.

[John Mayer]

Thank you very much. You might have to edit that one. I didn't nail that bridge.

[Alex Cooper]

Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Ross offers everything you need to work your magic this holiday season. Okay, so the holidays are here. And with them come parties. We love parties. And then the gift shopping. We love gift shopping. And then you also want to make your home shine. It's a lot, right? Whether you're hosting dressing up or you're hunting for the perfect present, it can be overwhelming. But Ross has you covered. Discover surprising finds like toys, jewelry, and cozy home Decor, all at 20 to 60% off other retailers prices. From festive fashion in every style and size to unique decor that reflects your creativity, Ross is your go to for everything. Holiday daddy gang. Make your space sparkle, refresh your wardrobe, and find gifts they'll love, all while keeping your budget merry and bright. Okay. At Ross, it's easy to feel confident, creative, and totally in charge of your vibe and your wallet. Work your magic this holiday at Ross. Find your local raw store and work your magic. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Hidden Valley Ranch. Let me tell you something. When I think about the holidays, I think about my family. Yes, but also food. Right? My favorite holiday foods. And you know what? I also then think about Hidden Valley Ranch and how it has made every moment of my life so special. Hidden Valley Ranch tastes. Tastes amazing on so many of your favorite foods. Like me, you might already love Hidden Valley Ranch on your salads or for dipping in your veggies, but there's so much more to explore. Okay. Adding a ranch twist to your favorite dishes will make Hidden Valley Ranch the star of your holiday table. For example, I love a good spinach chip. Okay. Make the Hidden Valley Ranch dip mix. It's an easy to make classic that's sure to impress the guests at your holiday gathering. Okay. You'll also be so surprised by how versatile and, of course, delicious cooking with Hidden Val Valley Ranch seasoning can be. Okay, this is my go to. I have so much I'm gonna be doing this holiday, and I don't know.

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So guess what? My go to thing, my go to ingredient, my go to brand is gonna be boom. Hidden Valley, baby. Okay. Find your favorite Hidden Valley ranch [e-mail] Hidden Valley Call her Daddy is brought to you by Crime Junkie. All right, Daddy gang, If you need to find your true crime obsession, you've got to check out Crime Junkie. Every week, hosts Ashley Flowers and Brit Prewat dive into real stories of murder, disappearances, and other mysteries that will have you spiraling. It's one of those shows you'll be texting your friends about five minutes in to listen along so you can debrief. So when you're done here, go listen to Crime Junkie. New episodes drop every Monday. Wherever you get your podcasts.