Podcast Summary: Called to Unify

Podcast: Called (with Fr. Mike Schmitz)
Host: Ascension
Episode: Called to Unify w/ Fr. Mike Schmitz and Dave Arnold
Date: November 14, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode explores the power and process of unity, reconciliation, and healing—personally, in communities, and across entire nations. Fr. Mike Schmitz sits down with Dave Arnold, a business leader turned pastor and strategic director at Saddleback Church, to discuss his experience with the transformative Peace Plan in post-genocide Rwanda. Their conversation covers the heart behind Dave's vocational shift, the practical outworking of faith in service, and lessons for listeners seeking to answer God's call in their own lives.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dave Arnold’s Journey from Business to Ministry

• Background: Dave spent 25 years in the medical device business, even taking a company public ([03:54]).
• Calling: Inspired by Rick Warren’s “Purpose Driven” vision, Dave felt a personal call to shift from donating to directly participating in ministry ([06:11]).
  • "He talked about the layperson, he was going to turn the audience into an army... It busted the paradigm I had and made me feel like I could do it, but should do it." – Dave Arnold [06:11]
• Vocation Decision: With his wife's crucial encouragement, Dave volunteered at Saddleback, even when his business board thought it was a “midlife crisis” ([09:29]).
  • "They said, okay, Dave, this is a midlife crisis. We've all had them—do what we all do, get a sports car, get a girlfriend...this is bad pizza." – Dave Arnold [09:29]

2. The Peace Plan – Vision, Goals, and Origins

• Concept: Local churches are empowered to address the world's five major problems: poverty, disease, illiteracy, spiritual emptiness, and corrupt leadership ([01:01], [14:19]).
• Roles: Rick Warren provided the vision; Dave oversaw operations, leveraging his business background ([14:19]).
• Lay Leadership: Emphasis on equipping ordinary people (the laity) to be active agents of change, not just spectators or check-writers ([06:11]; [11:49]).

3. Rwandan Genocide – Context & Aftermath

• Background: Rwanda, a densely populated, landlocked African country, suffered a 100-day genocide in 1994; nearly 1 in 10 people were murdered—mostly by neighbors ([15:00] through [18:46]).
  • "These were neighbors, these were people your kids went to school with... Pastors, the local... There was horrific. Nobody was untouched." – Dave Arnold [18:46]
• Aftermath: Three groups left—perpetrators, victims, and witnesses—all traumatized; over a million orphans in a population of 10 million ([15:00]).

4. The Peace Plan in Rwanda – Implementation and Impact

• Invitation: Rwandan President Paul Kagame, after reading “Purpose Driven Life”, invited Rick Warren to help unify and rebuild Rwanda ([19:13]):

  • "He called Rick and said, ‘I would like you to help me make us a purpose driven country.’” – Dave Arnold [19:13]

• 3-Legged Stool Model: Government, business, and church must work together for lasting change ([19:13]).

• First Steps:

  • Removed Hutu/Tutsi labels from IDs—"we're all Rwandan" ([21:54]).
  • Prosecuted perpetrators (orange jumpsuits as accountability and public contrition) ([21:54], [27:06]).
  • Pastoral Apology & Unity: Brought together 40 denominations, fostering relationships between Catholic, Anglican, Presbyterian, and other church leaders ([23:11]).
    • "I like my Catholic brother, I like my Anglican brother... we agreed the church had to step up..." – Dave Arnold [23:11]

• Justice & Forgiveness: The process included accountability (justice), public contrition, and an invitation to forgiveness.

  • "You cannot not resent, you can forgive and not forget... someone has to absorb the pain." – Dave Arnold [25:02], [26:05]

5. Revival, Transformation, and Local Empowerment

• Role of the Church: Shifted from political/tribal leadership to true spiritual leadership—restoring trust and rebuilding community ([29:14]).
• Tangible Impacts:
  • Over a million Rwandans moved above the poverty line.
  • Drastic improvements in public health, education, community life ([30:25]).
    • "We literally moved over a million people above the poverty line financially because of the businesses and things that were developed through the peace plan..." – Dave Arnold [30:25]
  • Focused on equipping locals, not outsiders, to be the ongoing protagonists in their context ([33:11]).
    • "We wanted to have the local pastor be the hero, not so Saddleback Church came... But now he's the hero because he's going to be there marrying and burying and counseling long after I go home." – Dave Arnold [33:11]

6. Principles for Global Application

• Subsidiarity: If a problem can be solved at the local level, it should be ([32:28]).
• Man of Peace: For the Peace Plan to work elsewhere, it needs a “man (or woman) of peace”—local leadership open to partnership ([40:38]).
  • "Go into the town, find a person who's going to listen to you and work with that person. And if you don't find the man of peace, dust off your shoes and keep moving." – Dave Arnold [40:38]
• Listening over Dictating: True impact starts with listening to local needs, not importing foreign solutions ([42:54]).

7. Personal Transformation and Call for Listeners

• Transformation: Dave recounts how ministry softened and deepened him, and “made [his] wife like [him] more.” He credits the Bible’s principles with guiding true relief and transformation ([44:06]).
  • "My heart's been softened, my worldview's been widened... I feel incredibly blessed that I had a front Row seat to see some incredible things that God clearly did..." – Dave Arnold [44:06]
• Practical Advice:
  • Love God. Love people.
  • Begin with simple, daily acts of availability and help ([47:45]).
  • “If we all just did one more of those a day... we would move it forward.” – Dave Arnold [47:45]
  • When in doubt, “Tag, you’re it.” ([49:07])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "He was going to turn the audience into an army." – Dave Arnold [06:11]
• "The Holy Spirit speaks very often through other people and very, very often to your wife." – Dave Arnold [08:54]
• "This is a midlife crisis... this ain't going to last. This is bad pizza." – Dave Arnold quoting his board [09:29]
• "God doesn't waste a drop of you. He may not use it all every single day, but..." – Dave Arnold [13:46]
• "We want to eliminate the Hutu/Tutsi distinction... we’re all Rwandan. Hard to do, but brilliant." – Dave Arnold [21:54]
• "You cannot not resent, you can forgive and not forget. So they knew someone had to absorb the pain." – Dave Arnold [25:02]
• "People that stay angry are drinking poison, hoping the other person dies." – Dave Arnold [28:12]
• "We did 40 days of purpose... as a country, so anyone could participate." – Dave Arnold [30:25]
• "It was the power of God with the collective work of churches, plural, 40 denominations coming together." – Dave Arnold [30:25]
• "The price of admission of being a member of a church is also being on mission." – Dave Arnold [38:27]

Important Timestamps

• Dave Arnold’s Call & Shift from Business to Ministry – [03:54] to [09:29]
• The Peace Plan Explained – [11:49], [14:19]
• Rwandan Genocide and Aftermath – [15:00] to [19:13]
• How Peace Plan Addressed Rwandan Wounds – [19:13] to [30:25]
• Practical Principles (Subsidiarity, Man of Peace) – [32:28], [40:38]
• Personal Transformation Reflections – [44:06]
• Advice for Listeners: “Love God, Love People. Tag, you’re it.” – [47:45] to [49:12]

Takeaways for Listeners

• Service is for everyone. Ordinary people can make extraordinary, lasting changes.
• Reconciliation is both justice and healing. Real unity requires accountability, forgiveness, and sometimes painful honesty.
• Transformation starts locally. Solutions must be homegrown, empowering local leaders and communities.
• Being available and attentive to needs is powerful. Big change often begins with one person being willing to listen, love, and act.
• You are called. If you see a need near you, “Tag, you’re it!”—step up, love God, love people, and be the answer to someone’s prayer.

“Remember, the gospel is more than words. It's a way of life.” – Fr. Mike Schmitz [49:12]