3 Ways to Motivate Teens & Tweens

Summary

Calm Parenting Podcast Summary: Episode on "3 Ways to Motivate Teens & Tweens"

Host and Guest Introduction

In this engaging episode of the Calm Parenting Podcast, hosted by Dr. Cam, the spotlight is on effective strategies to motivate strong-willed teenagers and tweens. Dr. Cam welcomes Kirk Martin, the founder of CelebrateCalm.com and host of the Calm Parenting Podcast, renowned for his practical and humorous approach to transforming defiant behaviors into calm, productive interactions.

Backstory and Inspiration

Kirk Martin opens up about his personal journey, sharing how his own experiences with his strong-willed son, Casey, inspired him to develop his parenting strategies. He recounts, “Our son Casey came out of the womb with boxing gloves on” (02:27), highlighting the challenges he faced using traditional parenting methods like fear and intimidation. Realizing the ineffectiveness of these approaches, Kirk shifted his focus inward, addressing his own anxieties and perfectionism to create a more harmonious household.

Understanding Teen Behavior

Dr. Cam emphasizes the importance of self-awareness in parenting, stating, “Teens aren't going to change if we're not working with the parents” (05:05). Kirk agrees, explaining that strong-willed teens often react negatively to pressure, leading to increased defiance. He notes, “If our success as a family is dependent on changing my wife or my child, then we're in trouble” (05:52), underscoring the necessity of parents adapting their behaviors to foster positive change in their children.

Changing Parent Approach

Kirk shares transformative experiences, such as running “Lego camp” where he mentored over 1,500 challenging kids by teaching impulse control and social skills in a playful environment (03:53). This hands-on approach reinforced the idea that changing oneself can significantly influence a child’s behavior.

Strategies to Motivate Teens

Kirk outlines three core strategies to motivate teenagers:

1. Building Connection

   • Draw Them In: Instead of forcing interactions, create opportunities for meaningful connections. Kirk shares, “Any interaction that I have with a teenager that's remotely positive, I'm like, that was a win” (08:26).
   • Shared Interests: Engage in activities your teen enjoys. Kirk reminisces about taking his son to car dealerships despite his own disinterest, fostering bonding through shared experiences (19:16).

2. Affirming Positive Behavior

   • Acknowledge Their Efforts: Relentlessly affirm what your teen is doing well. Kirk advises, “For the next week, affirm literally everything good that you see, because it's there already” (25:58).
   • Specific Praise: Highlight specific actions, such as cleaning up or completing tasks, to build their confidence and reinforce positive behavior.

3. Finding Internal Motivation

   • Identify Natural Gifts and Passions: Make a list of your child’s talents and interests. Kirk explains, “Make a list of your child's natural gifts, talents, and passions” (29:07).
   • Utilize External Accountability: Encourage involvement in activities outside the home where they can use their strengths. For example, Kirk describes sending a teen to help at a soccer practice, which not only validates their skills but also motivates them through external responsibility (31:18).

Real-World Examples and Impact

Kirk shares compelling success stories, such as Rebecca, a teen who transformed her attitude by engaging with young children through soccer. By finding her passion, Rebecca developed a sense of purpose and significantly improved her behavior and academic motivation (32:03).

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Dr. Cam and Kirk conclude by reinforcing the importance of patience and consistency. Kirk emphasizes, “Enjoy your teenagers. Enjoy a little bit of that attitude. Enjoy the energy” (38:21), encouraging parents to embrace the challenging yet rewarding journey of parenting strong-willed teens. They highlight that fostering a supportive and understanding environment not only benefits the teens but also transforms the entire family dynamic.

Notable Quotes

• Kirk Martin (02:27): “Our son Casey came out of the womb with boxing gloves on.”
• Dr. Cam (05:05): “Teens aren't going to change if we're not working with the parents.”
• Kirk Martin (08:26): “Any interaction that I have with a teenager that's remotely positive, I'm like, that was a win.”
• Kirk Martin (25:58): “For the next week, affirm literally everything good that you see, because it's there already.”
• Kirk Martin (31:18): “A consequence doesn't motivate a child. You're dealing with a kid who's kind of shut down. There's no consequence that changes that.”

Final Takeaway

This episode provides valuable insights for parents struggling with motivated but strong-willed teens. By focusing on building genuine connections, consistently affirming positive behaviors, and helping teens discover their internal motivations, parents can foster a more harmonious and supportive family environment. Kirk Martin’s authentic and practical advice serves as a beacon for parents aiming to navigate the complexities of raising resilient and motivated teenagers.

Transcript

[Kirk Martin]

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[Dr. Cam]

Welcome to Parenting Teens with Dr. Cam, the podcast dedicated to helping you tackle the challenges of parenting teenagers without the drama. I'm your host, Dr. Cam. Let's get on with the show. Hey parents. If you're struggling to get through to your strong willed teenager, feeling like every conversation turns into a battle, you're not alone. Today we're diving into three ways to motivate strong willed teenagers. I'm joined by a special guest who's a game changer in this area, Kirk Martin. Kirk is the founder of Celebratecom.com and host of the Calm Parenting Podcast. Kirk has mastered the art of transforming defiance and power struggles into calm, productive conversations. Today he's going to share some practical strategies not to only get our teens to listen to us, but also build a close, trusting relationship with them. Kirk, welcome to the show.

[Kirk Martin]

Dr. Kam, I'm super excited to be here.

[Dr. Cam]

Yes, this is great. So let's start. I always like to start with a backstory. What inspired you to start working with parents and their teenagers?

[Kirk Martin]

Our own son. So our son Casey came out of the womb with boxing gloves on, right? That kind of strong little kid that fights you over everything. And Dr. Kam, I'm like most parents, like I just I parented like my dad did, right. Which was fear and intimidation, yelling and screaming. And as you know, with a strong willed child, they're Fight or flight. Kids like you double. I always tell dads, you can double down on your discipline and your strong willed child's going to like go 10 times harder back at you.

[Dr. Cam]

Exactly.

[Kirk Martin]

And so I spent basically the first seven or eight years of his life trying to change him. Right? Because I thought, well, he just needs to listen to me. He needs to be. And then I realized, no, I'm a freak. I need to change myself. Like, I'm yelling at my son, you need to calm down. And I know inside he was like, apparently you haven't mastered that skill. You're like 35. So everything changed in our home when I changed, stopped feeding off all of my. And we'll talk about like our anxiety as parents, my control issues, my perfectionism. And then we did something a little weird that my wife hated. But I said, I've got this awesome idea. Why don't we take these strong willed kids, kids on the spectrum, and invite them into our home. So we'll have like 10, 12, 15 difficult kids, and we'll call it Lego camp. Because all kids love Legos.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah.

[Kirk Martin]

And so the idea was, yeah, we would get them into our home in real life situations and then teach them impulse control, how to control their emotions, social skills. And all the kids came, they didn't know they were kind of being worked on. It was a version of like play therapy, but not in an office. Cause you know, you experience this, the kids, you ask them questions. I don't know.

[Dr. Cam]

Oh, yeah.

[Kirk Martin]

And so, so we did that for a decade and we had about 1500 kids come through our home. So that's kind of the backstory. And then we just started doing speaking and. And then I shifted Dr. Cam from working with kids, which was the easy part, to working with the parents.

[Dr. Cam]

Oh, yes. Yeah, Right.

[Kirk Martin]

Because the parents, we just have so much baggage that we bring into it. And so, yeah, that's the backstory. But it's been a cool ride.

[Dr. Cam]

I love that. And I love that it started with you and your own self awareness. Because I think that's what all parenting, the journey. Parenting journey is, is stopping in exactly what you're saying, going, wait a second, what is my part in this dynamic? Because if we're focused on changing our teen, they're not going to change if we're not willing to change.

[Kirk Martin]

Yeah, true. Go ahead.

[Dr. Cam]

No, go.

[Kirk Martin]

No. I was just thinking it's like that when you're looking at that middle school child that's been sitting in the same hoodie sweatshirt for 18 straight days playing video games. And you start to think like, who is going to marry this child? Who would possibly hire this child? Right. And you project into the future and then you start lecturing and picking out everything they're doing wrong. And they eventually either shut down or just say forgive the language. But inside they're kind of like, screw you, you're never happy with me. And the good news, Dr. Kim, as you know, is if our success as a family is dependent on changing my wife or my child, then we're in trouble because I can't change another human. But if it's dependent on changing myself, we've got a shot at this and we'll get into this. But it's so cool, like when you change yourself, it actually changes your kids reactions to you.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah. So 100%. And when you said you started talking to the parents. My whole philosophy too is teens aren't going to change if we're not working with the parents. And if we work with the parents, we don't necessarily even have to work with the teenagers because once the parents change, the teenagers do come along. So let's talk about this kid that you just mentioned, because I know many of them the wearing the sweatshirt and just kind of up in their rooms playing their games and mumbling when we ask them how their day is. And we do, I think a lot of us either take it very personally, like why are they just pushing me out of their life? And so we try to keep inserting ourselves, inserting ourselves into their lives and they push back more and try to push us out more. Or we demand that they come down and spend time with us and sit there. I don't care if you enjoy it or not, you're just sitting with us. Why do neither one of those approaches work?

[Kirk Martin]

Well, kids, I mean, you know this better than I do. But like with teenagers, they're supposed to be independent, right? Like it would be, I always like this formulation. It would be weird if a 15 year old was like, mom, I'd really rather spend time with you than my friends. Like that would be a weird. Right? They're supposed to be kind of in that stage. And especially with strong will kids, the more you push, the more they resist. And so for me it's about drawing them to me and leading. It's almost like, you know, like when our son was a teenager and he would bring something up. You know, as parents we always have these lectures in the back of our head. Oh, you brought up friends. Let me give you lecture 42B on how to choose good friends. Right. Make good choices, son. And they're like, ugh. And so occasionally I'd say, you know what, Case? My son's name was Casey and still is Casey. So I'd say, casey, hey, I've got some thoughts about that. I need to go get started on dinner. I'm going to go up to the garage if you want to come get me later. I'd love to share my thoughts with you. So I wasn't forcing it on him. Now, here's the thing is, mom and the dads, they're not going to say, come and say, dad, you have so much life wisdom. I'm ready to learn. Right? They're probably going to come in and say, okay, what are your stupid ideas?

[Dr. Cam]

Exactly.

[Kirk Martin]

And I don't take it personal. Personally. Any interaction that I have with a teenager that's remotely positive, I'm like, that was a win. Right? Like, it's resetting expectations. Like, I was just. I was just actually recording a podcast this morning, and a mom was like, I have a preteen who's sassy. I'm like, it would be weird if she wasn't sassy. Right?

[Dr. Cam]

That's a sign of healthy development. Yay.

[Kirk Martin]

Yeah. It would almost be like, uh, oh, what is she up to that she's not being a little. And, you know, there's differences between being outright defiant and, like, you're a. You know, we get that you're a B word. I hate you. Well, that's a different issue. But normal sass is like, welcome to being 13 and 12 and 16.

[Dr. Cam]

Exactly. And, Kirk, what I've seen, too, is that comes along like that other. That extreme attitude comes after a lot of time with the other attitude. That's kind of normal attitude. Not being accepted and being punished and being shot down all the time. That's when it starts getting really ugly because they've tried everything else and it doesn't work. Have you seen that?

[Kirk Martin]

Yeah. Dr. Kam, do you think that's. I'll ask, because you're an expert with teens, is once they've crossed that threshold, that really angry and really frustrated response to me, and I want to see if you agree, is it's almost like a crying out of like, look, I've been trying to tell you this, and you're not listening, but they're not mature enough to say, mother, father, you've not adjusted well to my new independence. Could we please have a discussion about this? So it just comes out. Is that kind of what you're feeling?

[Dr. Cam]

Hundred percent. And that's what the teens tell me all the time. And several of them have actually tried saying not exactly the words you've used, but have tried saying that and gotten shot down like, you're being disrespectful, telling me what I need to do. Right? And so teens don't have a voice. And even if they see this and ask for something to be changed, they don't get heard. They get shut down. And that being shut down a few times leads to this. I don't care anymore if you're gonna make my life miserable. I'm gonna make your life miserable. And I see a lot of that.

[Kirk Martin]

And don't win at that. Cause you'll. Well, the strong will kids don't care about consequences, right? So you'll be like, well, I'm gonna take away all your video games. They're like, fine. I will literally sit in my room and stare at the wall. And then the parents are gonna freak out. It's not about winning. Right. In that situation. So good. Yeah. I found. I mean, people of all ages want to be heard, and it doesn't mean we have to endlessly listen to every little complaint. Not that, but most of our teenagers, they're really bright kids, right? And if you. I always tell parents, I'm like, listen, they're trying to tell you something. It doesn't mean you give in. You don't buy them everything they want. Not that, but when they do bring something up, listen, I like the more humble approach, which is saying like, hey, I need to apologize to you because I think I've spent the last 5, 7, 13 years just lecturing you and just talking all the time, and I haven't really listened. And if you start listening, well, then they're going to come to you too, right? They might spend like seven minutes with you instead of like a minute and a half at night. And so like. Cause I'm always with teen, I'm like, take any opportunity you can. Because typical teenage life to me is, especially during the school year, they come home, they don't want to talk about school. So by the way, can I give you. Can I share this one? Kind of a cool idea. So the strong will kids that we work with, they're not always great at school. They're really smart, but they're not. So asking them after school, hey, how was your day at school? It's like, hey, how was that day at the place that you don't have a lot of friends?

[Dr. Cam]

It sucks.

[Kirk Martin]

Yeah. Yes, it sucks. Else you want to know mom, right? And Then the next is, well, do you have any homework? No, I got it all done in study hall. And they just lied to you. Yeah, but that afternoon time after school, when you ask about their day, it sounds like an interrogation to them because it's filled with our anxiety. How did you do? How did you do on that test? Because I need you to, well, do on that test so you can get a good grade, so you can get into the right college, so you can get a good job. So you get that. And so after school, sometimes one is complete silence. At times can be really wonderful. And if you want to have a conversation, this is really cool, say, hey, you know what? Something happened to me today at the post office, at work, or in the political world. I'm curious, what would you do if you were in my situation? And now you switch it from interrogating them about their day and you're listening to their ideas about your day. It's a really cool thing to get them to open up.

[Dr. Cam]

It is amazing. And I want to throw in there too, that. Because parents will listen to this and then they'll go do it and they'll ask exactly what you just said. And their kids will be like, I don't care. What are you? Right. So the reason I say this is because it's not something that you can just snap and go, okay, I'm going to change my approach today. And they're immediately going to change their response. That does not happen. Right?

[Kirk Martin]

No, it's not.

[Dr. Cam]

What can parents expect?

[Kirk Martin]

All you have to do is one time and then they shoot. I'm kidding. No, exactly.

[Dr. Cam]

And everything changes.

[Kirk Martin]

Well, because by the time you get to the teen years, you've had at least 13 years. Especially the kids we work with, I mean, they're in trouble from the time they're little. They have a defensive kind of defenses around their heart. They've been in trouble a lot. It's going to take time. And I always encourage parents like, I'm after the really long term. I'm after these kids bringing their grandkids to you. Right. Because you work with these families. I mean, sometimes the relationship has been severed and hurt for 13 or 14 years. So I play the long game. And so look, you change anyway. I want you to change not because you're hoping for a result, but just because it's the right thing to do. Right. And it will bear fruit. It sometimes just takes time. Yeah. So do it a few times. And don't be like, I tried your method. And he said, I don't Know I'm like, okay, because he's waiting for you. Because he was gonna. Because here's what he knows. He's going to say something and then your next question is going to be, so how was school today? Get your homework right.

[Dr. Cam]

Like, it's a trap. It's a trap.

[Kirk Martin]

You know what an apology I love. I've realized as I've gotten older, apologies, praising kids are all just statements of fact. Hey, I want to apologize because for the first 13 years of your life, I think I've sent the message that you're not capable of being successful. I've micromanaged you, I lecture you. I'm always on you about your room, about your hygiene, about this. And that's about my own anxiety. And I want to apologize. It's not a groveling. I don't like I've been such a bad parent. It's just an acknowledgement of truth that that's the way I've done it. And I can imagine that that has made you feel. And then you fill that in like, you could never please me. That was mine with my son. Hey, Casey. It's like, you can never please me because I'm never really happy. Right? I'll say like, hey, good job. But. And so when I started having these discussions with him, he never looked at me and said, dad, that's so meaningful to me that you would acknowledge that. Right? Not in the moment, but I could see it was like, oh, my dad's getting it now. And it was connecting with his heart and it slowly began to shift our relationship.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah, I think that is so beautiful because we need to shift our focus not from getting the ex. Getting the response we want from, from our kids because we're setting them up to fail and us to be disappointed, but setting it up so that we are showing up the way we want to show up for them consistently and without expectation of how they're going to respond. And I think that expectation's very difficult to let go of.

[Kirk Martin]

That's good, Dr. Cam. That's good. We could end it right there.

[Dr. Cam]

Right there. Mic drop, boom, boom.

[Kirk Martin]

No, that's the hard part. But that's the same as it is for a three year old. It's like, well, when's my toddler gonna start to get some self discipline? I'm like, she's not 40. Okay, like chill. They're develop. So yeah, I'm with you on that of you do the right thing. And the really great thing, which I know you found is it just changes you as a person and all that anxiety, because we bring that to all of our other relationships. And now, especially in the teen years, like moms and dads, you've done a good job with these kids. Right. If you're listening to or watching a parenting podcast, it means you're a good parent.

[Dr. Cam]

Right.

[Kirk Martin]

All the bad parents don't listen to our podcast. So you've done everything. You've given every lecture you could possibly imagine. You've hopefully modeled things pretty well. So throw that extra energy because you don't have to make them sandwiches all the time. And you've got some extra time when they're teens. Throw that into changing yourself. It will free you to enjoy the rest of your life. And your kids will watch and say, I just saw my mom or my dad change right in front of my eyes. I mean, that's the biggest lecture you could give.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah, it is absolutely amazing when we do that. Now I want to get into. Because I know there's parents still going, okay, you told me that if I listen and I have a difficult teen, you're going to tell me how to motivate them to do what I want. Because they've heard this and they're disregarding it because they still want their teen to do what they need them to do, which happens a lot, too. So let's talk about the parents who have these kids that are pushing back. And the kid. The parents. Parents have that fear, if my child doesn't get up and do something, if they stick in their room all day long and aren't motivated to do a thing, they are going to end up on the street without any relationships, struggling. How do I put fire in his belly?

[Kirk Martin]

You can't put fire in the child's belly. That's step number one is you can't do it. Look, you've moms and dads, you've tried for, like 15 years. You tried rewards and money and bribery. You've done every possible consequence and punishment, and it's like 15 years later, and it's like none of that ever worked. Right. And so I'll say step number one is just realizing that, that you can't do that for them and that building your connection with them is the most important thing you can do. And so building the connection, by the way, building connection, cool thing to do with a teenager. I'll give you two. One is to bond over something they're interested in. I know as a dad, it was always, well, let me get you to be interested in what I'm interested in. And I Used to take agenda free time with my son. And our son was super into cars. I hated cars. But every Saturday morning we went to a car dealership to look at cars and test drive them. It was agenda free time. I wasn't allowed to make dad analogies. You know, Casey, life is like a car. It has brakes and you need to. So we just enjoyed each other. Look, enjoy your teens. Enjoy. Smile at some of the attitude because you have smart kids. And even in some of their smart comments at times I would look at Casey and I'd be like, that was actually really disrespectful, but really good, well done. Now you're not going anywhere for a couple days, but really, but you're really well done. Enjoy them that way. You know, a cool one with strong will. Kids, ask them to teach you something. We have spent their entire lives, do this, do this, do it this way, do it this way. And ask them to help you with technology. Ask them to teach you something. I know, especially as a dad, when I started asking my son, hey, could you help me with that? It gave him a sense of agency that he wasn't the little boy anymore and that he had something to give. And then the other thing is, you just have to fight that anxiety. Your kids will change. Look, now some of you were ultra responsible as kids and that's why you have so much resentment now, which is your own issue. But some of us, look, I'm a guy, I was a dopey 15 year old boy. Like if you looked at me at 15, you were like, how is that kid ever going to be successful? They grow and they change. But I will promise you, the sooner that you release them, in fact, it's really powerful language. I release you to be the person you are you're supposed to be. I release you from my expectations. That's actually really powerful.

[Dr. Cam]

That's really powerful. I love that.

[Kirk Martin]

Can you talk about that for a minute? Because you, you're good at this stuff with teens. But that releasing.

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[Dr. Cam]

What I hear from teenagers is they spend most of their teen lives trying to get the approval and acceptance of their parents, which means they need to disregard who they are because they keep getting told over and over again who they authentically are and isn't okay, isn't good enough, isn't right. And so they start questioning who they are and doubting who they are and not having the confidence to make decisions or to even give their opinion because they feel like, oh my gosh, it's gonna be wrong. And I have kids that are shut down. When we release them of our expectations, we kind of cut that cord. I think a lot of parents, they are not able to separate their kids from themselves and they see their kids as an extension of themselves, which is why we Wann them because this is what we want them to do. And if we go, they're a whole nother person. Our job is not for them to adapt to our needs. We're supposed to adapt to their needs as who they are as a separate person. And I think that's a really big challenge for parents.

[Kirk Martin]

Dr. Kim, that's awesome. I mean that alone. If you do that. And then I would say the second step would be. And this would be my challenge for every parent for just the next week, affirm what your child is already doing. Well, just relentlessly, just, hey, nice job with that and with strong will. Kids, don't make a big deal out of it because when you discipline, when you praise them, it's always short and sweet. Hey, I saw how you handle that. Shows me you're growing up. Fist bump, Walk out of the room. Don't expect. Mom, thanks for affirming me. It means a lot. And I walk around and I find like, you know what? I appreciate you. You actually brought your plate back from the table to the sink. Maybe tomorrow night you'll even bring your utensils. Fist. I'm kidding. But I praise for progress. Look, even things of like, you know, typical teen is come home from school, open the refrigerator, keep the door open, let all the cold air out of the refrigerator, eat a snack, throw. Throw the paper or something down on the counter, go up to their bedroom. They come down for dinner. Can I be excused? Right after three and a half minutes to go text with their friends. They come back down at 10:30 or strong will kids like 11:30, open the fridge again, drink out of the milk jug. Right. It's all irritating. And so when they do, when they start drawing them to you and they come and sit, simple things like, you know what? I really love listening to you and getting your perspective. Like, that's it. Don't make it. You know what? It really means a lot to me when you spend time like those big mommy things are just like, yeah, they're just like, mom, come on. But so I would for the next week, affirm literally everything good that you see, because it's there already. It's just you're projecting. You want more.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah.

[Kirk Martin]

And if I could give you one, that's fantastic. Is your kids who play video games. This was a big realization for me is I hate video games. And I hated Casey playing because I was, you know, we were outside as kids and all those reasons. But I realized when he was playing video games, he was goal oriented, he was persistent, he was a Leader because he, he would, his sole goal was like win or get to the next level. And he wouldn't eat or sleep or pee or do his work or do anything. And so one day I said, casey, you know what I recognized? When you're on your video games, you're motivated, you are persistent, you're a leader, you're conscientious, you don't give up. All those qualities are there. And one day when you get a vision for your life, you're going to put all those qualities together. You're going to crush it in life. And then I gave him a fist bump and I walked out of the room and I drank. I'm kidding. But you're going to want to because it's like. But when's he going to put that into studying? Because your strong will kids are going to do the bare minimum just to get by. Resist the anxiety and affirm. And then if we have time, I'll give the final thing that I would do.

[Dr. Cam]

No, this is great.

[Kirk Martin]

You sure?

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah. Do it.

[Kirk Martin]

Okay. Because I really like listening to you. You're really smart at this. So here's my internal motivation thing. Three steps. Number one, make a list of your child's natural gifts, talents and passions. What are they just good at doing? Not the stuff you want them to do, but their natural talents. And then related to that, who do they connect well with? Strong will kids tend not to connect well with their peers, but they're really good with older people, little kids and animals. Second step, find ways for your kids to use their natural gifts, talents and passions outside the home. Because watch the neurotypical or the kind of compliant kids who do really well in school. All day at school, they're using their natural gifts. They're good at sitting still, memorizing information and writing essays. And everybody's like, you're such a good student, you're going to go to a great college. And so they have a lot of confidence. Our strong will kids, they're just not always good at the kid world and they're not good at school. So they're never getting really built their confidence. But I know moms and dads, you've seen this. Your strong willed child. For other people, they're amazing because other adults are like, your son is wonderful to be around.

[Dr. Cam]

And you're like, seriously, like, is it that same person?

[Kirk Martin]

Is it that same. Does you want to adopt him for a couple years? And so give them opportunity, use their gifts, talents and passions outside the home. And then the third thing is accountable to Another adult. Other adults can see good things in your kids that you can't, because they don't have to tell your child to study and go to school and brush their teeth and go to bed. They can also hold your kids accountable. Like, Dr. Kim, if I had, like, any of the parents, if you sent your teenager to my house, my first question isn't going to be, did you get your schoolwork done? Did you make your bed? Right. But my first question is going to be like, so what do you really love doing? I'm going to ask them about their gifts and passion. They'll be like, well, I have some things around the house. Could you help me with that? And then when they do, I'll be like, dude, you're amazing at that. And so I'll give you one example, because I don't know how we're doing on time. So I was doing this live event, and this mom said, I've got a teenage daughter and she's got a bad attitude and she doesn't do anything. What consequence can I give?

[Dr. Cam]

Yes, I get her motivated.

[Kirk Martin]

And I'm like, a consequence doesn't motivate a child. Like, you're dealing with a kid who's kind of shut down. There's no consequence that changes that. So I asked her quickly. I was like, what does she love doing? She loves soccer and she's really good with little kids. So I said, here's what I want you to do. Go in your community, you will find this. Find a coach who's coaching little kids at soccer and say, hey, I've got this teenage daughter. She's amazing with kids, amazing for other adults. Could she come and help you with your practice on Tuesday night? So this coach usually helps if it's not mommy's idea or dad's idea. So if you can arrange it so another adult says, hey, Rebecca, I've heard really good at soccer. Could you help me on Tuesday night?

[Dr. Cam]

This is true story. This is a big difference, right? That right there separates whether it's going to work or not right there.

[Kirk Martin]

So arrange that because they'll do it for someone else because they like pleasing other people, just not you. So this girl, her name was Rebecca, she goes out on Tuesday night. She's in her environment. She's around little kids. She loves soccer. At the end of that practice, she got high hugs from 12 little girls. When she came home that night, does she have attitude? No, because her gifts were drawn out of her and she had a purpose, something she was good at doing. So the coach Said, we've got a game on Saturday morning. Could you come and help out? Well, of course she's there. So after the game, two sets of parents came up to this girl and said, look, we don't know who you are, but our daughters never stop talking about you. They're struggling in school. Would you consider tutoring them? Not knowing that this girl Rebecca has not done schoolwork in years. Right. But now Rebecca has a reason to do schoolwork because she wants to help the kids, these little kids. And so the key is you have to discover what motivates your child, not what motivates you. You as moms and dads. Well, I'm motivated at being really good at school, because when I was a kid, when I was good, I got everybody's attention, and they all loved me. Right. A lot of us have that childhood stuff. And I love school. I was good at school. Well, you may have a child who's not good at school, and so you have to discover what motivates them. And the accountability part here was that coach was able to say, look, if you're going to be helping out with these little kids, I better not hear from your mother that you're mouthing off. And you better be keeping a B average if you're going to work with my kids, because I'm looking for a leader to other people. Your child will say, yes, ma'am. Yes, sir, but not to you. Now, we found something that Rebecca was motivated by. We do this a lot with kids who are really good with animals. Get them volunteering at a veterinarian's office. That veterinarian is going to look at that child and say, you've got a gift with animals. Right? Not very good with people. But you're. I'm kidding. But you're amazing with animals. You could be a vet one day. And that is the first person in that child's life who said, you could be a vet one day. Because everybody else is looking at the outward behavior and the bad grades, and that veterinarian's gonna see the gift and say, you could be a veterinarian. And that day, the daughter comes home and says, mom, I'm gonna be a veterinarian. And mom's like, I'm not even sure you're making it out of middle school.

[Dr. Cam]

Right.

[Kirk Martin]

For those grades. But now that they're motivated, so I would encourage you. Look for, look for. We call it mission and mentor, a mission that they can throw themselves into. I'll give you one more. And I'm sorry for dominating the conversation.

[Dr. Cam]

Hey, beauty of having your own podcast. You can go as long as you want.

[Kirk Martin]

You know who's really good with teenagers? Old people. They. I would find an older couple, an older man or woman in your neighborhood and just say, hey, have them reach out to your teenager and say, hey, I need your help for 30 minutes, for an hour at my house to help me with some things I'm not able to do anymore. Your teenager walks into their house, they're going to love on your teenager. Because old people, that almost made me cry. For some reason, I felt a little right. They're just going to love on your child because they don't have to tell your child to go to bed and they're going to love your child's energy and they miss having kids in their home and they're going to teach them about life. And I guarantee you, your teenagers going to come home and say, yeah, I like the Robinsons down the street. They said that I'm really good at X and then just send them down there to do their homework. And they will spend a lot of time with that old couple. But it's a really effective strategy for teenagers. Old people are very grounding for teens. They went through the depression, they've been through hard times. They don't carry all that anxiety. And they have sometimes a way of reaching into a teenager's heart and saying, I remember what that was like. It was 1947, but I remember it. And anyway, there's something beautiful about that.

[Dr. Cam]

I really, really love that. And I think, I mean, it's beneficial for both sides because the couple probably loves having that younger energy in there, too. But having somebody that just has no agenda whatsoever and it can purely see a child, you know who that child is, and see their heart and see their authenticity and just be okay with whatever that is. When teens act out and they're. They've got this attitude and they're nasty, it is a cry for exactly that. That is why they have attitude. They don't have attitude because they grow all of a sudden turned into a nasty teen. Like when people go teens these days, I'm like, there's not a conspiracy that they all meet online somewhere on TikTok and say, how are we going to be nasty today? They're reacting to their environment. That's it. And so if they're reacting poorly, that means the environment is not giving them what they need to thrive and be okay.

[Kirk Martin]

Dr. K. That's not their goal. I like it. Preach it. I love that. No, that's I can tell you're, you know, so passionate about that because it's true.

[Dr. Cam]

Yeah.

[Kirk Martin]

And then you begin to meet those. So you control your own anxiety. You affirm them for what they're doing well, and then put them in situations, working with little kids, being with animals, being around older people. And you'll see that subtle shift and just be patient with it because they're fighting 13, 15, 17 years of a different way. And so go slowly with it. But, but it's a cool, it's a, it's, it's a cool process. And I want you to my number one, enjoy your teenagers. Enjoy a little bit of that attitude. Enjoy the energy. Ask them about their friends. They're going to talk inappropriately, of course, and sometimes just laugh and you're like, that's inappropriate but really spot on.

[Dr. Cam]

Right?

[Kirk Martin]

Like, yeah, Sarah's mom is a little bit like that. You're right.

[Dr. Cam]

Well, and I think it's also just accepting the teen language, like, just because they don't use our language and they use their. Like, even I see so many people complaining about their kids, calling them bra. And I'm like, that's actually a term of endearment. So for them, like, it's not. Parents are like, that's so disrespectful. I'm like, it's actually kind of just them being chummy with you a lot of times. So I think understanding their language and.

[Kirk Martin]

You can always look if they use it in a disrespectful way. Right? And they're like, okay, bro. Well, next time they ask to be taken somewhere for money, you can just say like, hey, you know what's unfortunate is that your bro doesn't have money and can't drive, but your dad can. Like, I did that with my son. I love that. So. But you can have fun with it. Instead of being like, when I was a kid, if I would have called my dad bro. Right? Like when I was a kid. Just means you're really old.

[Dr. Cam]

It does. And I'm going to tell. I tell parents this all the time. I'm like, you are not as amazing and perfect as you're telling your kids that you were. I can guarantee you drove your parents absolutely crazy too.

[Kirk Martin]

I always tell dads, I'm like, look, you were a dopey 8 year old and 14 year old. You're just a stupid kid trying to figure. They're just trying to figure life out. It's what you find is I always want parents. I'm like, relax a little. Like it's like, but we have to train them. And like, we, you know, we do all ages. So I'm like, I get a lot of guys who are like, what about my three year old? I'm like, they're three. They're like, I once told a dad, I was like, write a job description for a three year old. It's not to wake up and put on a suit and be. It's like their job is to make messes, be curious and explore. And it's same with teenagers. They're not 35 yet. It's like the one other thing if I could throw in is normalized teen years for them. Look, this is a weird time of life. There's no other time where you're going to be grouped in classes with only kids your own age listening to people talk about stuff that you just don't care about. And there's all this social stuff going on. And when you're an adult, you get to choose so much. Right now it's hard. So if you feel awkward, you should, because you are really. I'm kidding. You don't tell them that. But normalizing it so they know. Oh, so this is normal that I'm feeling this? Absolutely. Your hormones are out of control. You're not even in control of your own body half the time and your mind and your thoughts. So it's like, well, they're distracted in class. I have no idea how a teenage boy can pay attention in class when there's Instagram out there, the images that can be seen. As a teenage boy. It's a wonder that you get up in the morning and do anything. Like, really, seriously. I mean, I didn't mean to be inappropriate, but as teenage boys, we had to go sneak around to see pictures in a magazine. And now it's like, oh, my Instagram feed is all people. Girls with no clothes on. Like, that's a hard world to navigate. We didn't have like this whole social media thing. That's hard. Yeah, it's hard for us as adults. Like, oh, our friends are there. How come we didn't take that nice vacation?

[Dr. Cam]

Right? I see, I will tell you, I see more pressure coming from parents based on what they see on Instagram and social media that they put on their kids because they're like, well, look, all my friends. Kids are doing this.

[Kirk Martin]

No, they're not.

[Dr. Cam]

You need to. And I'm like, parents, you can't use your phone to judge your kids and what you see on their phone to judge your kids. That's A hard thing. And I think the other thing, and I don't know, I'm curious what your thoughts are on this. I personally am highly annoyed with how much emphasis is being put on social media and tech as the cause of mental health issues because I see it as, as basically a symptom more than the cause of the problem, more than the problem itself.

[Kirk Martin]

I agree. I think if you. And this is. No, I really don't like doing guilt blame for parents. Right. I'm very honest with parents. I'm like, hey, you're a freak in that area. You need to stop that. Cut that out. But if you have a really good bond and a good trusting relationship with your child and they are doing some positive, constructive things, because that's kind of my goal with the mission and mentor. Let's just get them one. Let's just go 30 minutes down to the Robinsons house one day a week. Let's just start with that. If they're starting to do that, then the outside pressures of social media won't hit them. They're inoculated a little bit. But if they always feel like I can never please my parents and everybody's trying to get me to be someone I'm not, well, then I'm much more susceptible to vaping and all those other things. So if I had one, focus on the connection. Just stay close to your kids. And even if they just sit in their room and they don't get good grades, you have smart kids. Once they get a vision for their life, the strong will kids often will just do the bare minimum to get by all the way through high school. And you'd be like, oh, but you're not doing this or not. I'm like, it's strategically brilliant.

[Dr. Cam]

That's right. They're working smart.

[Kirk Martin]

Not why would you do extra work to get grades that you don't care about? We told you, in order to keep your screens, you have to have an exactly a 79.3 average. And they'll get a 79.3, not a 79.4. But why wouldn't you do your best?

[Dr. Cam]

Right?

[Kirk Martin]

Because they're not motivated by it.

[Dr. Cam]

Right.

[Kirk Martin]

And then they get a little bit older, they get a vision, some agency ownership of their lives and then they turn it on. I'll tell you, the strong will kids have harder childhoods because they're not made to be kids. But you put them in the adult world, which is where they're going to spend the rest. Look, our son, I always say Casey was horrible as a child. He was virtually useless as a child. He didn't clean his room. It was awful. But in the real world, which is what? You're raising them. You're not raising kids to be kids. You're raising them to be adults. My. Our son crushes it. In the real world, he just stinks at all the arbitrary kid stuff that we put on him. And by the way, cleaning their bedrooms. Parents, there's a reason there's a door. Just chill. You're a freak and just own that. Oh, but what if there's a fire and they. If there was a fire, they could get out of the home. That's an excuse.

[Dr. Cam]

I know.

[Kirk Martin]

Sit in the mess until it doesn't trigger you.

[Dr. Cam]

On. On here. Kirk, We're. We're right here. I'm exactly the same way. And I've got the messy room, and I'm like, do not even leave that cracked open, because, you know, it'll give me, like, heart palpitations. But it's your space. It's not my space. It's your space. You deal with it the way you want to deal with it. But I agree with so much everything you're saying, so I love that. So, Kirk, how do people find you?

[Kirk Martin]

You know, just look up. The Calm Parenting podcast would be the best. We're celebratecalm.com but the calm parenting Podcast, you know, email us if you have specific issues with teens or your kids. And some of you probably have younger kids, too. Yeah. Hopefully more compliant, easy ones, but hopefully not, because the strong will kids are going to change you and make you into a different person. It's awesome. So, yeah, just at the podcast.

[Dr. Cam]

I love it. Thank you, Kirk, so much for joining us today. I really appreciate it.

[Kirk Martin]

Dr. Cam, you're awesome. I hope. No, I. I can't wait to send, like, a lot of our teens directly to your podcast is because your approach is so great. You're chill, you're not freaking out about stuff, and you're just. You're really good at this. So thank you for what you're doing.

[Dr. Cam]

Absolutely. Thank you. Appreciate it. And that's a wrap. Thank you, parents, for taking time out of your busy day to listen in. I appreciate you. If you found the episode enlightening, please, like, review and share with a friend. Friend navigating the teen years. Until next time, stay curious. Remember, there's always more to the story than what you see.