ENCORE Bringing The Truth To Light with Jordy Cray

Summary

Podcast Summary

Podcast: Cate & Ty Break It Down
Episode: ENCORE Bringing The Truth To Light with Jordy Cray
Host: PodcastOne
Date: November 26, 2025
Guests: Jordy Cray
Hosts: Catelynn (“Cate”) and Tyler (“Ty”) Baltierra

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Overview

This episode of “Cate & Ty Break It Down” explores the complex realities of public adoption, trauma, and internet perception through a heart-to-heart conversation with Jordy Cray, a Teen Mom historian and TikTok commentator. Cate and Ty, who documented the adoption of their daughter Carly on MTV’s "16 and Pregnant" and "Teen Mom," address longstanding controversies, misconceptions, and interpersonal tensions with Carly’s adoptive parents. Together with Jordy, they dissect the public narrative around their adoption journey, discuss boundaries, advocate for adoptees, and candidly reflect on their own mistakes, hopes, and regrets.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

Jordy’s Introduction & Social Media Background

• Jordy shares their rise on TikTok as a “Teen Mom historian” and pop culture commentator, currently with nearly 600,000 followers.
• Discusses how the platform has enabled fresh, diverse perspectives and debates on old reality TV content.
  "People got a lot of opinions on ‘Teen Mom’… now we have a whole new generation of watchers." (Ty, 03:01)

The Ethics of Sharing Their Adoption Story

• Cate & Ty respond to Jordy's criticism that their public airing of adoption struggles might be seen as seeking sympathy or manipulating public support:
  • Ty asks, “So where do we cross the line with sharing our story as reality TV people…and when does it turn into manipulation?” (Ty, 06:55)
  • Cate emphasizes their intentions: representation for birth parents, adoptive parents, and, most importantly, adoptees.
    "If Carly has a chance of being able to see that we never stop trying, she deserves to know that." (Kate, 06:00)
  • Jordy acknowledges their rights, but worries public venting provokes hostility for everyone involved.

Ongoing Conflict with Carly’s Adoptive Parents (Brandon and Teresa)

• Detailed breakdown of escalating communication breakdowns, especially after Cate pressed for updates and continued sending gifts post-blocking.
• Reveal of behind-the-scenes issues: missed visits, unreturned messages, and the recent, hard line from Carly’s adoptive parents:
  "They're no longer allowed to send gifts to our house. It is disrespectful." (Kate relaying Teresa, 15:15)

The “Sympathy Manipulation” Accusation

• Jordy clarifies their earlier criticism about Cate & Ty seeking sympathy. Ty and Cate challenge the double standard—reality TV stars are expected to be vulnerable, but get criticized for it.
• Cate reflects on the possible inherited trauma and emotional patterns from their upbringing with addicted parents.
• Ty highlights the intent: "The end goal…is truth…for Carly to know these things, and not be put in the dark." (Ty, 39:55)

Sharing on Social Media As Advocacy

• Cate shares that many adoptees and birth parents encourage her to remain public, to provide proof for Carly—now or someday—of their continued love and attempts.
• Jordy’s perspective begins to shift as Cate and Ty reveal facts unknown to the public, especially about the monetary and public relations decisions Brandon & Teresa have made over the years.
  • "When it's beneficial for them to exploit Carly...if it made the adoption look really good, they were gonna do it." (Ty, 19:36)

Hypocrisy & Boundaries

• Cate & Ty detail how Brandon & Teresa’s boundaries have shifted (ex. profiting from photos, shifting expectations about “approved” content).
  • "Why is the moral ground keep moving? (Ty, 36:11)
• Reveal Brandon & Teresa accepted magazine deals, MTV compensation, and set shifting rules over time, contradicting the perception that Cate & Ty alone exploit their story.

Reform and the Need for Adoption Transparency & Advocacy

• Emphasis on how being young and under-informed affected their choices:
  "There were only four people involved in this agreement, and two of them were children...when you find out [B&T] originally wanted closed [adoption], why did you not just say, 'we’re not a good fit'?" (Ty, 32:03)
• Cate advises: young or prospective birth parents need legal protection, thorough education—and support/adoption should be the last resort.
• Mental health and adoption trauma were never discussed with them at the time.

Adoptee-Centered Advocacy

• Ty and Cate insist the adoptee’s feelings need to come first; if they knew for sure Carly wanted distance, they would honor it.
• Fear Carly will interpret silence or lack of gifts as them “giving up.” "All we ever wanted was to know our bio parents tried...so it’s about this kid, and she deserves this." (Ty, 41:20)

The OnlyFans Controversy & Taking Accountability

• Jordy pushes on community backlash for Cate & Ty’s OnlyFans involvement, especially given prior criticism of co-star Farrah Abraham.
  • Both admit their views have evolved, accept past hypocrisy, and stress changing values and taking down their account when it might harm Carly.
• Cate and Ty reiterate: people should be allowed to change their minds, and the goal is to “take accountability for what we did wrong and own it.” (Kate, 45:31)

Regrets and Lessons Learned

• Both admit they would have done things differently, most notably with more information and support; warn others to be extremely diligent and proactive in choosing adoptive parents and legal representation.
• Advocate for adoption reform:
  “Adoption should be the very last thing that you look at as an option. There are options, there are grants, there are foundations that can help you.” (Ty, 64:17)
• Candid reflection on trauma after adoption and generational impact.

Final Reflections & Jordy’s Takeaways

• Jordy says her stance has softened:
  "Although I think venting is not a great idea just because of the negativity it attracts. But…Brandon and Theresa's hands are not clean. It's messy. It's not black and white: this whole thing is grey." (Jordy, 61:36)
• Agreement that there’s no roadmap for this unique, public adoption.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On adoption’s public impact:
  “If Carly has a chance of being able to see that we never stop trying, she deserves to know that.” (Kate, 06:00)
• On boundaries/manipulation:
  “Where does the line cross from just sharing our story…to manipulation to get sympathy or recruit people?” (Ty, 06:55)
• On the double standard of sharing pain:
  "Every time we've talked about the good, it's always praised... But the one time I say it hurts, and I'm sad, people are like, 'Sit down.'" (Kate, 37:57)
• On the shifting boundaries with adoptive parents:
  “Why is the moral ground keep moving?” (Ty, 36:11)
• On taking accountability:
  “We acknowledged we were wrong…Is it not safe that things change, your opinions change, people evolve?” (Ty, 55:23)
• On adoptee advocacy:
  “The priority needs to be the adoptees…they’re the ones most affected by this choice of adoption.” (Ty, 40:27)
• Jordy’s conclusion:
  "It's messy. It's not black and white: this whole thing is grey…there’s no roadmap for you guys." (Jordy, 61:36)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment / Topic | |-----------|----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:06 | Jordy joins, introductions, social media background (“Teen Mom historian”) | | 02:23 | How Jordy got started on TikTok, why “Teen Mom” content resonates | | 03:22 | Discussion on public perception of Cate & Ty’s adoption sharing; first debate on “manipulation” | | 04:44 | Cate explains their goal: visibility and proof for Carly | | 07:10 | “Where’s the line?”—Discussion about storytelling and sympathy | | 08:15 | Cate details timeline of being blocked by Carly’s adoptive parents | | 13:14 | Lighthearted Crumbl Cookie debate | | 15:11 | Cate reveals adoptive parents have banned gifts, impact on Carly | | 17:09 | Explaining boundary/money issues & hypocrisy of Brandon and Teresa | | 19:36 | When “exploiting” Carly benefited the adoptive family | | 21:23 | “They financially benefited…so it’s hypocritical” | | 22:08 | Last in-person visit with Carly: the Instagram “back of the head” controversy | | 23:07 | Tea spilled: MTV “exclusive photo” and compensation | | 26:04 | Cate discusses PTSD and emotional aftermath of these conflicts | | 27:20 | Ty: “If Carly asked to stop, we would—cut-off blindsides us” | | 36:11 | “Why is the moral ground keep moving?”—shifting boundaries and exposure | | 38:34 | Ty: “If you’re going to have an opinion, have all the information” | | 41:20 | “All we ever wanted was to know our bio parents tried…”—Prioritizing the adoptee | | 49:09 | Ty: “When Carly comes to us with questions, we’ll be honest”—adoptive family openness | | 54:54 | Facing OnlyFans backlash; comparison with Farrah’s experience | | 64:17 | Advice for young people considering adoption—“should be a last resort” | | 66:45 | On birth parents needing stronger legal support and mental health considerations | | 69:05 | Wrap-up—agreement on mutual understanding & advocacy moving forward |

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Tone & Takeaways

This episode is genuinely heartfelt, often raw, and sometimes confrontational but always in pursuit of clarity and accountability. Cate & Ty are candid about their emotional struggles, regrets, and evolving views; Jordy brings constructive criticism but is open to learning, ultimately shifting to a more empathetic perspective. The hosts aim to strip away tabloid narratives to reveal the complexity—and ultimate humanity—of family, loss, and public living.

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For Listeners: Why This Episode Is Essential

• Gives deep insight into realities of open adoption, manipulation narratives, and why so-called “boundaries” are rarely simple.
• Models a nuanced debate about mistakes, shifting beliefs, and the need for transparency—without shying from difficult emotions.
• Puts adoptees at the forefront of the discussion, showing how internet communities and reality TV intersect with private family grief and advocacy.

A must-listen for anyone interested in adoption ethics, social media’s impact on family, or the life-long aftermath of teenage decisions made on camera.

Transcript

[Kate]

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[Jordy]

So.

[Host]

Hi, Jordy.

[Kate]

It's nice to meet you.

[Jordy]

Thanks for having me here. I'm very excited. I was telling Kayl. I was like, this must be how Kelly Clarkson felt when she won American Idol.

[Ty]

Oh, damn. You're putting it way up there. Dang.

[Jordy]

Okay. Amazing.

[Ty]

Living large now.

[Kate]

I know.

[Jordy]

I appreciate it. So I'm excited to be here.

[Kate]

Well, I know, like, I know that you and Ty metal just a little bit.

[Jordy]

You know what I mean?

[Kate]

So. But I've never even seen you or anything until all this stuff happened. But so I was like, oh, that'll be nice. Just to talk, you know?

[Jordy]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ty]

You don't know. I don't even think you watched a live that we did.

[Kate]

No, I did not.

[Jordy]

No, you were doing a live with somebody else probably that day, I think probably with Ray. Yeah.

[Ty]

Yeah. It happened really fast. I just messaged you and was like, hey, you alive? And you're like, yeah, give me 15 minutes. I was like, oh, my God, I'm not prepared. But it was good.

[Kate]

Yeah, it was fun.

[Ty]

It was good. I mean, I felt like we had a good conversation. It was pretty civil, you know, I mean, I felt like, you know, got a little more information, you got some more context.

[Jordy]

Y. So.

[Ty]

But okay. I wanted to ask you, though. What did you. After we had our conversation, did anybody reach out to you as far as, like, adopted people on Tick Tock? Did anybody, like. Because I know TikTok's like your big. That's like, where your. All your followers are, right? How many. How many do you have? Like, where are you at now?

[Jordy]

Almost 600,000.

[Ty]

Dang. Okay. Half a mil.

[Kate]

How did you. Well, how did you even get started? Started on TikTok. Like, what made you think.

[Jordy]

So I discovered that Hilary Duff and her sister were beefing. Oh, okay. Just social media sleuth that I am. And it kind of blew up. My first video ever. And then it just kind of went on from there.

[Kate]

Oh, okay.

[Jordy]

But I consider myself a Teen mom historian, so I wanted to show, you know, different sides of my personality and, you know, things I enjoy. So when I started talking about Teen mom, that kind of blew up, too. Cause I, you know, have a lot of opinions.

[Ty]

That's why you're here.

[Jordy]

Yeah, exactly.

[Kate]

Everybody does.

[Jordy]

Somebody does.

[Ty]

No. Yeah. Especially on Tick Tock. I mean, people got a lot of opinions on Teen Mom. I feel like.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[Ty]

Because Tick Tock wasn't around when Team mom first started.

[Jordy]

No, no. So now space was still around.

[Ty]

So now here it's like, now people are going back, I feel like. And watching from the beginning. And now we have a whole new, like, yeah. Almost new generation of list or watchers that are, like, didn't know anything, and now they're all getting opinions. So, I mean, yeah, y' all have to say.

[Kate]

Yeah, 100.

[Ty]

But yeah, I thought it was interesting, though, because I was like, wow. Like, your perception of it is that we, you know, like, talking about Carly or our adoption story was. You were like, not a good. You don't think it's a good idea to do it?

[Jordy]

Mm, I would love.

[Kate]

No, I want to hear your.

[Jordy]

Yeah, no, no, it's fine. So I was just having a hard time wrapping my mind around. I know that there's contention between, you know, Brandon and Theresa, and there has been for quite some time. But venting on social media, I felt, like, hurt your guys. Cause. Because we know some of the Teen mom fans are crazy. I mean, I'm crazy, but I'm not that crazy. But it gets them all riled up, and then they start, you know, now we know everybody's involved now, so I feel like it just causes a bigger issue and would piss off Brandon and Theresa even more.

[Kate]

And so when you say, like, you think that it creates a bigger issue and once. In what sense do you mean, like, because everybody's involved.

[Jordy]

Everybody has, like, opinions now. Everybody. You know, more backlash for you guys, more backlash for Brandon and Teresa. And it's. I feel like, although it's a private matter, you guys live your life in public, so I don't know if anything's really private. So that's what's kind of, like, difficult about it.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

And I know something that you probably brought up, and we can talk about this, too, because I'm a child of addicts, too, and I know that you are, too. And I had said something that I think that you two have inherited certain traits from your parents that were like, if you don't get your way, you can use that to, like, manipulate situations or, like, you know, try to, like, get back at people. You know what I mean?

[Ty]

In, like, a vindictive way or. Yeah. So your opinion is that you are saying that we, like.

[Kate]

Okay, well, no, but. Yeah.

[Host]

What.

[Kate]

Well, what you said was, like, we manipulate to get sympathy.

[Ty]

Yeah, that's what you said. And so I want you to elaborate on why you believe that is because.

[Jordy]

I never really understood what the point of it was except to get sympathy and to try and get people to get on your side of things.

[Ty]

Okay, so you feel like we're recruiting people to, like, get our side, like.

[Kate]

From an outside perspective, looking into, like, our story, I can. I can see where you would think that. And I understand that, you know, that thought on that. But I think our main goal for putting stuff out publicly was because if Carly has a chance of being able to see that we never stop trying, she deserves to know that. In my opinion, also, it is bringing awareness to everybody that is involved in adoption. It's bringing awareness to adoptive parents that, you know, stuff like this happens. Birth parents. And also it's giving a voice for adopted kids, you know, the adoptees, which.

[Ty]

Is the main thing the adoptees need.

[Kate]

But I can see. I can see where you. Where you would think that.

[Ty]

I have a question. Do you believe. Do you. So do you believe that other people on the cast manipulate to get sympathy or to recruit people to get on their side?

[Jordy]

Sides? Yeah.

[Ty]

Okay. Okay. Because I feel like. Because I feel like. So where do we cross the line with sharing our story on a reality TV show as people? Or then it turns into manipulation for sympathy?

[Jordy]

You asked, where'd you cross?

[Ty]

Where's the line? Where's the line of, like, oh, I'm just, you know, a reality TV content person, you know, whatever. That sharing my story have been doing it 15 years. Where does the line cross from just sharing our story, being vulnerable, honest to manipulation to get sympathy or recruit people to be on our side?

[Jordy]

I mean, that's a good question. I. I just. When I talked to you on Instagram, you said that you didn't even care if Brandon and Theresa got Upset about this kind of thing. And what I still struggle with is that Carly's gonna see all of this anyway, like, when she's 18 and watches the show, hopefully, you know, in college, wherever she goes. So even though you're, like, venting and stuff on social media, which, by the way, you guys have every right. Have every right to do well, because.

[Ty]

You do the same thing, right?

[Kate]

Exactly.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

Yeah. So she's gonna see it anyway. So do you think that you putting it on social media is gonna, like, annoy her or drive her away even more?

[Kate]

You know, I mean, we don't. We don't know, obviously, because, you know, they have completely cut us off, blocked me. You know, it's. Now she's telling us that we're not allowed to even send gifts to the house anymore.

[Jordy]

When they say that this was a few months ago.

[Ty]

A few months ago.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

While everything is before the block.

[Ty]

No, no, this is after the block.

[Jordy]

Oh, wait, wait. Spill that. What happened?

[Kate]

Yes. So I want to give you a little bit of backstory.

[Jordy]

Yes, please do.

[Kate]

Okay. So what happened was. Is. So there's Carly, but they also have another adopted child. Okay. And so me and that birth mom, she lives in Michigan. She has, you know, kids she's raising and stuff. Me and her talk, and we're pretty close because we share that bond. It all started with his. It's hard. It gets confusing. But Carly's. Her brother's birth mom reached out to me and said, hey, do you think we're getting a visit this year? The kids are getting older, you know, has Theresa said anything to you? And I said, no, but I can start a group text and we can ask her, you know, so that's what we did. And so I. We sent a text in this group chat, and I just said, hey, you know, we would love to try to get together this summer. We'd be more than willing to come to North Carolina and even meet up just for dinner one day. And after I said that to her, she ghosts me for weeks, which this is typical of Theresa. I can message Carly and say. I can message Theresa and say, hey, how is Carly in school? Is she liking it? Not hear anything for weeks.

[Ty]

It's not really a shocker.

[Kate]

It's nothing new. That always happens. And then. So days go by, a week goes by, and then the birth mom messages me, hey, has she said anything? No. So I reach out in. Hey, just checking in on. On this, wondering if you and Brandon had the time to talk about it. And she was just like, you know, it's just. I know it's disappointing, but no, we're not planning to have a visit this year. And I said, I said, yeah. I said it's disappointing just because of all the kids, you know, like, all the kids, like, my kids are getting older. They know Carly, they know that's her sister, M. The other birth mom's kids, same thing. They know that their brother is out there and they ask questions. I said, so it sucks that, you know, we can't even meet up just for a dinner, you know. And then Teresa was like, yeah, I understand, you know, whatever, but just know that we love and we care about you guys so much.

[Ty]

And she also said no to the dinner because we were like, oh, we'll come to you. We'll make it really easy. I know you're busy with the kids, and if that's a problem, then we'll just come to you and make it. Meet up at a restaurant for an hour dinner. You know, make it simple. Not like a long weekend, long visit.

[Kate]

Like we usually typically how they are. Yeah. And. And then so. And she got upset with me because I said, you know, it doesn't feel like love, you know, like people that I truly love and I care about that are involved in my life, I make time for those people. I. Even if it's just an hour, like, I want to spend time with the people that I love and I care about. So she got upset with me that I said that. And then you fast forward a few weeks and it was like Carly's birthday. So of course I'm like, hey. I texted Teresa like, hey, I sent Carly gifts. Please let me know if she gets them. And she answered me on that day. But even a few days after her birthday, I checked in again, and it was like, she never responds. You know, weeks go by, then I check in again, no response. And I'm like, okay, you know, what's going on?

[Ty]

Does she like our gifts?

[Kate]

Right? You know, or whatever.

[Host]

And.

[Kate]

And then she just came back with like, you know, the way that you speak about us isn't nice, and we're not gonna be responding for a while. Which kind of blew my mind in a little bit because I was like, I've never. I mean, you can watch everything that I've shown on this journey. And I have never called them out of their names. I have never said that they were shitty ass parents, weren't doing a good job raising my child, because I believe all those things. I believe that they do. She's an amazing, well rounded k Because of them, you know? And so when she said that, I. My response to her was basically like, I get that. I get that if your feelings are hurt, and my feelings are hurt, too. And when you want to have a conversation about that, I'm here for it, and we should have that conversation. And I told her, I said, but, you know, until then, I'm going to continue to send gifts to Carly like I always have, and I'm going to continue to send updates like I always have. And so that's why when people online said, like, oh, my God, Caitlin's just blowing her up all the time, it was like, no, that all those messages were from after I got that text from her and me telling Theresa, like, okay, I get it, but I'm gonna send updates.

[Jordy]

And they were, like, once directed to Carly.

[Kate]

Not once, like, every other week. And one of the main reasons why I decided to do that also was because I had a lot of adoptees and birth parents reaching out to me and saying, don't ever stop. One day she is going to see all of those things that you tried to get give her and show her and all of the things. And so I continued to do that. Then I found out she blocked me, and I found that out through our adoption counselor, Dawn. And I was still sending gifts every once in a while, you know, or whatever. For her birthday, I sent her crumble cookies because teens are love crumble cookies. I don't know what it is.

[Jordy]

I hate them.

[Kate]

Do you?

[Jordy]

Yeah, I had them for the first time a couple months ago. Trash. It's disgusting. Yeah.

[Ty]

Did you have. Because I like the chocolate chip. What? You don't like the chocolate chip? It was too heavy.

[Jordy]

It was, like, heavy. I could have, like, knocked my husband out with it. Like, it was just ridiculous. Like, what is this cookie?

[Kate]

Yes.

[Jordy]

Yeah, sorry.

[Kate]

No, no, no. You're fine. You're totally fine.

[Ty]

Crumble.

[Host]

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[Kate]

Then, yeah, so I, and so I obviously unblocked from her phone number still. And so I sent Carly, I sent her some flowers and it had like a note on it. And so I asked dawn, can you reach out to Theresa? I just want to make sure that they got there. And then she came back to Theresa and said, you know, you can tell Kate and Ty this, but they're no longer allowed to send gifts to our house. It is disrespectful. And that really took me and Ty.

[Ty]

Back because we never thought, I mean, gifts are gifts.

[Jordy]

So not even gifts like I feel.

[Ty]

Because I feel like honestly, I would accept a gift from anyone, one for my kid. How am I going to stop and withhold an expression of love to the child when it's been happening for 15 years especially? But even just like, anyone can give my kid a gift and I'm like, awesome, that's great, right? You know, so, yeah, he doesn't love it. Yeah, it's a gift. We never thought like, okay, we get, you're, you're upset and you don't want to talk about anything and that's fine. But not to send gifts and also not to send gifts when it's been a thing for 15 years. It's all Carly's ever known. So how do you explain to the.

[Jordy]

Child now all of a sudden, the gifts Are. Stop. Yeah.

[Ty]

And. And I. And I. Since I can't talk to Carly and tell her that. What. How are you doing that? And what. You know, we. We have no say, so. And how she gets that information about not getting gifts, like, she watches the show.

[Kate]

I mean, they keep her from it.

[Jordy]

Well, when she's 18, I mean.

[Ty]

Yeah. Right.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

I thought you meant right now. Sorry. So. I mean, so it was just the whole gifting and the thing that. Yeah. Like how Ty said about, I don't understand why you would stop gifts, especially after 15 years. One of my things also, too, is, like, I sat there as a child, a literal child, and that was my main thing that I said to her. And Brandon was like, I don't. You know, above everything else, I just want to be able to send her birthday gifts and send her Christmas gifts and Easter. I. I remember telling him, I will send everything for any holiday just because I want her to know that she is loved by us and that we haven't forgotten about her. So.

[Ty]

And they agreed.

[Host]

They.

[Ty]

They're totally on board. They were.

[Kate]

Yeah. So I think there's a lot of. Underneath going on. And I know a lot of people say that we are exploiting Carly or posting stuff when we were asked not to. And part of this podcast is to also get my part out of. That's not all factual. There's a lot of things.

[Ty]

Yeah. I mean, because the fact of the matter is, we even asked before being blocked. Like, we just want to know if what we're doing is harming Carly or not. Is it her? Is she saying, hey, I don't want to see pictures of my sister, My sisters. It's hurting me, Or, I don't want to get gifts. And Teresa responded, no, she just ignored. Well, no, she told Don, we have an answer to that question, but you're forbidden to tell Tyler and Caitlin what that answer is. And so my thing is, is that, listen, you.

[Kate]

If it was Carly and you're the.

[Ty]

Parent, you should advocate for your child and tell us, hey, you're hurting my kid. Please stop. Right, so the fact that you're not willing to do that means who are you prioritizing here? Why are you not advocating for this child and saying, hey, because I'd be. If one of our kids. If someone's, like, hurt, I'd be like.

[Kate]

Hey, who it is?

[Ty]

I bet you're hurting my kids. Stop doing it. Yeah. Hey, yeah, I have an answer for you, but you're not gonna get it. It's. The power dynamic is Weird and doesn't make any sense. And I don't think that you withholding that information from us, which would help and benefit everything moving forward. All you do is communicate and say, hey, this is what's going on. It would eliminate all this. So I'm confused on why that's not happening. And I just feel like you have the opportunity to advocate for that child. So why are you not doing that? I feel like, you know, and we.

[Kate]

Want you to do that.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

Like, I want you to advocate for her.

[Ty]

And also, you know, I feel like we. You agreed on this open adoption. You agreed on all these things.

[Kate]

And so you agreed on it being filmed. You agreed to show up on reunions.

[Jordy]

I just rewatched your 16 and pregnant the other day, like, in preparation of this. And I remember, God, right after you gave birth, she gave you, like, the bracelets.

[Ty]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jordy]

Do you. And she's like, I'll never take it off. And so, like, what did she do with that? Like, where, Where. Where's all that? You know, I don't. I don't know.

[Kate]

I still have mine. It's. It mostly sits in my jewelry box because I have lost it a few times being a kid, you know, so that. So that stays. But, yeah, things like that, you know, when it's. When it's beneficial for them to exploit Carly and to.

[Jordy]

What do you mean by that?

[Ty]

I mean, that means, like, they allow that. We asked, can we post pictures? And they said, only the back of her head.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

If you can't see her face, we're fine with it.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

So that's what we did. I think people get really confused about. You keep. They keep saying, oh, well, you keep, you know, breaking the boundaries with Branch Reese. You keep disrespecting what their wishes are. And it's like, well, it happened one time where. When we were, what, 17, 18 years old. Yeah. That, you know, I posted a picture, a video or something. I can't remember what it was. And they.

[Jordy]

And we.

[Ty]

Then we had a conversation. It was filmed. You're pregnant with Nova. We hashed it all out and.

[Kate]

And we agreed from that moment forward, like, we won't post any more pictures.

[Ty]

Any unapproved.

[Kate]

Yeah, any unapproved photos.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

And then, yeah, that's when you fast forward a few years because Noble was born. And that was the other visit where they got to meet for the first time. And Teresa said, I sent pictures. Like, can I post this one and this one? And she's like, as long as you don't see her face. I'm fine with it. Just like how they've done for MTV when they cover some of our visits.

[Ty]

Like, just the back of her head.

[Kate]

Just the back of her head. Or sometimes they've used like clips of her voice, but they kind of auto.

[Jordy]

Auto.

[Kate]

I don't know, like auto tune it. So you can't really.

[Jordy]

You can't really tell.

[Kate]

Yeah, like tell what her voice sounds like and stuff. So what. I mean, as far as, like, like they have kind of. They've kind of exploited their situation too. Is. Is those things, like, people want to put all the blame on us. Like you're on a reality TV show and they didn't sign up for this.

[Jordy]

It's like, well, they did it. They did sign up for that. I will defend you guys with that. I will defend that.

[Ty]

And they also. And they also agreed on the whole thing about, yeah, mtv, you can show the back of our head and we're gonna get compensated for it. And only. And so.

[Kate]

And if you don't compensate us, then you're not allowed to use the. These pictures on tv.

[Jordy]

And so it's financially benefited from this as well?

[Ty]

Oh, yeah, hugely. Which is why I feel that it's hypocritical and I don't understand your moral. If it's a really immoral standpoint that you're taking it, I would totally get it. Yeah. But it's not, because you literally went on the magazine when she was 5 and put her face out there and that was fine and that was okay. And I really wish we had that article because in that article, that magazine that says, we are so blessed with the open adoption, we love that we can get. Have contact with them. We love it for our kids and we're going to continue to do all.

[Kate]

That, how beneficial it is for the adoptee.

[Ty]

And so. Yeah, and things like that. And then, you know, fast forward when we would post only approved pics, like she said. And then she got upset because we posted this last visit we had.

[Kate]

I don't know if you've seen.

[Jordy]

When was the last one?

[Kate]

It was two years ago. Two years ago.

[Jordy]

That's the last time you saw her?

[Kate]

Yeah, And I posted up a picture on my Instagram. It was like all of us walking.

[Jordy]

Yes, I did see that.

[Kate]

And then Tyler posted one where it was him, Carly, Nova, and it was the back of them. And then they called us and had a conversation. And the only reason why they were upset because we had the conversation. I said, you've always told me, yeah, the back of our head. It's fine.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And she goes, well, I guess I'm just. Well, it was actually Brandon who said, well, I guess we're just kind of upset about it because now MTV can't.

[Ty]

Pay us because it's not an exclusive picture.

[Kate]

Now it's not an exclusive.

[Jordy]

That's tea right there.

[Kate]

And see what I'm saying? A lot of people don't know that there's so much backstory to our story.

[Jordy]

Well, I appreciate you telling me that, because that changes a few things for me.

[Kate]

Well, I would like to know your opinion, though.

[Jordy]

I think that's bullshit. That they, you know, they. They can be so greedy in that sense and then turn around and act like they're this, you know, morally, you know, righteous Christian, you know, of people, of God, which, I mean, I'm sure they are. At the same time. Let's cut the bullshit.

[Ty]

Well, and my thing is, is that, like. And we have stayed silent on all those little details up until now because now we literally have nothing to lose.

[Kate]

But then it does make. And then. But then it does have people looking at us like, oh, my gosh, you're breaking boundaries. You're disrespecting. Which I understand why you. Nobody knows.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

Scope of things.

[Jordy]

But I'm telling you, it's not so black and white.

[Kate]

No. This whole journey, if. And it's not like they get the money and they put it in account for Carly.

[Host]

No.

[Kate]

They're using it to pay for their flights, pay for their hotel, all that stuff, which I get. But when we had that conversation with them on the phone, I said, I wish you would have told me. I said, I would have helped you.

[Ty]

I would have fought for you.

[Kate]

You ain't getting my picture on Instagram unless you help them with their travel.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

Like, I get that. But the way that they would just always, like, if it benefited them, they were going to do it, and if.

[Ty]

It made the adoption look really good.

[Kate]

They were going to do it.

[Ty]

Yeah. You expressed your feelings or anything that was negative about it. It was like, you can't do that. No. Now it's bad. Now we're mad.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Ty]

It's just a weird. It's a weird power dynamic. And it feels like for so long, we had to be silent because, like you said, I don't want to ruffle feathers.

[Jordy]

I'm.

[Ty]

I'm not in control. So we have to kind of be like, okay. Like, all right. Because I don't want you to take her away. So we didn't speak on a Lot of things that happened behind closed doors because I want to best priority number one is to be able to see her and have access to her. So now the access taken away, it's like, well then, I mean, you guys.

[Jordy]

Don'T have anything left to lose at this point.

[Kate]

I don't. Yeah, we don't have anything to lose. And also just the fact of the matter that I truly in my heart of heart do not believe that it's Carly that wants this. I.

[Jordy]

If you had a pin. Sorry, if you had a pinpoint, what it is, what do you think it is?

[Kate]

I think it is fear based. I think that.

[Ty]

I think it's parental insecurity.

[Kate]

Yes. I think there's some like infertility trauma. Because that's hard.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

You know, not being able to have your own shot, you know, like that's hard. And it's sad. And I do feel like it's gotten, it's gotten. Things have gotten more rocky as she.

[Jordy]

Has gotten older and asking questions.

[Kate]

Yeah, yes, she's been asking.

[Host]

I.

[Kate]

She's asked questions. I've been informed of these questions that she's asking. And I think it scares them, which I get that when she's older she might want everything to do with us and nothing with them.

[Ty]

And that's pretty much the main fear that we believe is driving everything.

[Kate]

And the sad thing is though, is like I have told them even face to face, like Carly could come to me and say like, oh my gosh, my mom and my dad just bugged me because they want me to do this, this, this, this. I said, I will always have your back and I will always say they're.

[Ty]

Your parents, those are your parents and.

[Kate]

They love you and they're doing those things because they want the best for you. And why I will if even I can not agree with everything that they.

[Ty]

Do and so advocate for them.

[Kate]

I will always advocate for them and have their backs because guess they raised her.

[Ty]

Yeah, they raised her.

[Kate]

And I always tell time, like those are the people who cuddled her when she scraped her knee riding her bike. Those are the ones who are cleaning up puke at two in the morning off the floor. Like they love her.

[Ty]

So they deserve that advocacy, in our opinion.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Ty]

And we will always do that.

[Kate]

And I've told him that face to face. So just the way that it's gotten is sad.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

You know, I mean, a lot of people didn't see before all this blew up on social media in the aftermath that I was physically going through it brought up a Lot of PTSD for me and for him. And it was a very hard time in my life. And just. And now that's why we're gonna put the truth out there in ways that we can. Because it's not all. There's bad things that each of us have done as people and.

[Ty]

But I think we're. We take accountability for those things. And we, I mean, we always try to put ourselves in their shoes. And that's why we did say silent for so long because it's like, I don't wanna. I'm trying to understand your perception as her parents. And I get why all these things are. You have all these fears and stuff, but I just feel like for you as a parent to allow your insecurity in this fear to trump the best interest of her doesn't make sense to me. And that's also not what we wanted and what we agreed upon 15 years ago. Like, it's. We always were supposed to be a team and to, to, you know, for her. And so when we ask you, is anything we're doing harming her, you know, is anything that we're talking about affecting her or these visits?

[Kate]

Hardly not wanting to have the visits, because I would take that and yeah, I would, I would probably cry about it, but I would respect it and.

[Ty]

Then none of this would be happening.

[Jordy]

Yeah, but they don't even want to talk to you.

[Kate]

No.

[Ty]

So it's hard to. So it's hard to like do anything or mend anything when you don't. When you just cut off communication, it's weird.

[Jordy]

You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't in this type of situation.

[Host]

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[Jordy]

One thing that shook me, Tyler, when we were on our live is when I asked you, like, what are, like, your regrets about it? And you said you wish you chose different parents for Kelly. Did dawn. Did they reach out to dawn and say anything about that? Like, did you get any response from that?

[Ty]

I mean, no, not that I know that's what we know. But I think. I think it's interesting that you bring that up because if I would have said my only regret is I wish I would have parented that is literally the same thing as saying I wish she had different parents because I would be. We would be her parents. There's no difference in me saying, and that would have been accepted by tick tock people and everyone. That would have been fine. If I would have been, oh, my biggest regrets, I wish I would have parented her and everyone would have been like, oh, wow. Yeah, of course.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

The fact that I said I regret and wish I would have picked different parents for her, everyone freaked out.

[Jordy]

And it was like, I mean, I was shook. I didn't know what the hell to say.

[Ty]

I was like, oh, but, oh, God, you've been shook. If I said I wish I would have parented her and no, I would have understood that, okay, so that there's no. So there's no difference in those two answers. So does that make sense?

[Jordy]

Do you. Do you take that back and say, I wish that we. If we knew, like, if we knew how far, like, teen mom and everything would have gone, I wish that we would have kept her.

[Kate]

You know, I always say it's hard. It's a hard thing. Yeah. I think for. Well, for me personally, I always say to myself, you know, if I could go back, there's things that I would change about my adoption. And I wish there was more things I was educated about when I was making that decision. I still think that I would have chose that option for her because all of the. That I went through and afterwards, my mental health stuff, all of it. You know what I mean? Like, I definitely still would have. I just was not ready at that time. And I didn't. You know, it just. Yeah.

[Ty]

And also the fact we didn't get to spend a lot of time with them. We only met him one time, and then we met him again when she was giving birth. So it's like, I think for sure.

[Kate]

I would change some things. Yeah. And also, we weren't educated on the fact of that they always wanted a closed adoption. I didn't find that out till way.

[Ty]

Later in life, which we thought was really weird, but we also were like, oh, that's why we don't know their last name for years. That's why we don't know their address. That's why we can't have their phone number for years. Like, because at first we were like.

[Kate]

Because I remember she was born. I was like, oh, what's her last name? And they were like, oh, we don't want to tell you.

[Ty]

So me and Carolyn.

[Jordy]

And I was like, like, okay.

[Kate]

And then we get a card on our first birthday, and it. It had their full name on it.

[Host]

Like, brand trees.

[Kate]

Cool names with their last names.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And I was just. And it didn't click at first. I'm like, what?

[Ty]

This is the.

[Kate]

What? We went a year without knowing their last name. We went multiple years without being able to send gifts. Right.

[Ty]

We had to go to dolls.

[Kate]

Yeah, we would. Like, we would go to dawn, and then dawn would ship them. They would send stuff to Dawn. And then. But it was. So Even some things came out after she was born and years down the road, like, I didn't know they always wanted a closed adoption, which that's why.

[Ty]

I want to bring up to the point that, like, there were only. There was four people involved in this agreement, and two of them were children and two of them were adults. And so when you find out that you originally wanted closed, why did you not just say, we're not a good fit. We want open.

[Jordy]

Why didn't dawn say that? She.

[Ty]

Well, she mentioned to them, she said, hey, they want. They want open.

[Jordy]

Why didn't she tell you guys that?

[Ty]

We don't know.

[Kate]

I don't know.

[Ty]

I think it's because the whole goal was to get a baby. So we're gonna mess up. It is. And then. And that's why the industry needs to kind of. We need adoption reform, period.

[Kate]

Being children, like you said, sign, like signing these. They're not legally binding in any way. So it's not like I can get a lawyer and see my kid. Like, not like I would do that anyways.

[Ty]

Right.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

But I had. We had no legal representation. We had nobody really. When you're 16, guidance either, right? No. Yeah, we didn't have any guidance. And I was going off of a verbal saying, oh, my gosh, I'm giving them my child that I want so badly. Of course they're gonna list. Of course they're gonna do everything they're gonna say they're gonna do, you know.

[Ty]

And also because we're kids and we're trusting the adults around us to try to like, okay, I'm gonna listen to you. I don't know anything about this, and you do, and you're a grown up and I'm not. And so we're gonna trust. Kind of trust your whole, you know, trust your word, and we're gonna go with that. But it's like when we. Afterwards, all these things unfolded and we also felt like, I think we were trying to kind of like, heal about what's going on. So we didn't push back at all because we're like, we never did this before. I don't know how to navigate all this.

[Jordy]

You don't even know what the questions to ask. So. Yeah.

[Ty]

And I also feel like if. If you were an adult and you knew what you wanted, I think your responsibility should have been, this isn't a good fit for us. We want clothes. The fact that you shifted your desires to get the baby is selfish to me.

[Jordy]

Yeah, I.

[Ty]

Because I feel like that automatically kind of shows that you weren't really planning on, you know, doing what we agreed upon right away. That's what it felt like, at least.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

I mean, that's what it felt like when we found all of this out. Yeah.

[Jordy]

And for dawn to not, you know, tell you guys, that is disappointing.

[Kate]

Yeah, I agree with you.

[Ty]

I agree.

[Kate]

I can look back on some things and I. I see some clips now that I'm older and I'm like, whoa.

[Jordy]

She wasn't forthcoming with certain things.

[Ty]

Yeah, it's.

[Jordy]

I wanted.

[Ty]

The whole adoption thing is just crazy. It's insane. The fact that this is such a unique story and it's been shown on TV and people Have.

[Kate]

Every journey is not the same at all.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

He was gonna ask a question, though.

[Jordy]

Yeah. I wanted to ask, have Brandon and Teresa ever said to you guys that, you know, now that she's getting older, like, does she get recognized? Do they get recognized? Like, is that a problem for them? Because Carly, I'm assuming, I don't know, looks just like your other kids. So do they get recognized in public?

[Kate]

They have never said anything to us. I feel like Brandon. I mean, I feel like they probably do. And I don't know if it's just the. The culture of t mom fans and them just. And being in the south, respecting them, or maybe people do come up to Brain and Teresa because they are very recognizable people.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

I remember we asked them at a visit, and they said, no, no, we're. Everything's. Everyone where we live is. Everything's really great. And so. So we were like, oh, okay.

[Kate]

So I don't know if it's just a Southern thing and, like, respect, because, I mean, like you said, there are weird people out there. Like, we have had people message us and be like, oh, my gosh, Carly just walked into my coffee shop today, and she was the sweetest little. Like, I'm telling.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

So people are, you know, weird, but obviously people know who she is. I just think down there, maybe it's like a respect thing because they know.

[Ty]

I'm not really sure.

[Kate]

Want to.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

But then it's weird because. But then a part of Brandon. Teresa does want to, so it's confusing.

[Ty]

Yeah. Because my whole thing is that, like, in, in, in, if, like, your moral ground can't be shaky, it's got to be firm. And I feel like they're moral ground.

[Jordy]

Like, the line is always moving with them.

[Ty]

And so it's weird. It's like, okay, if. If your concern is for her safety or her privacy, then why are you agreeing to get paid for a photo of the back of her head? And why? What. What is the point?

[Jordy]

That's crazy to me.

[Kate]

What is it seeing that stuff that people don't know? So I get why we look like.

[Ty]

Yeah, I understand.

[Kate]

We're disobeying or breaking boundaries who ask for money to.

[Jordy]

For a picture of the back of the head. Yeah, that's. That's crazy.

[Ty]

So that's what I'm saying. Why is the moral ground keep moving? What? It. You know, I don't know. It's just. It's. It's one of those things where it's like, for years, those things would be happening behind closed Doors. And obviously, we're just kind of like, don't want to, you know, shake the. Shake the basket at all. So we're like, oh, we're not going to say anything. But at this point, it's like, I. I think it's only fair that this. The full scope of the story gets put out there. And for the sake of. If Carly is the one not wanting this disconnect, if she's the one that actually wants to have access to communicate with us and they're not allowing that, then this is all I have to advocate for her as her birth parent to get this information out to her.

[Jordy]

In addition to the show.

[Ty]

Yeah. And I don't. I don't know what they're telling her. So it's just a whole thing of, like, all the years we've tried to, like, you know, get them on the phone, and they wouldn't. And it was like we would have to wait weeks, and then we'd get a response. And it's very, like, it almost sounds like a prop, like a. Like a scripted response. And we're over here, like.

[Jordy]

Like an AI kind of thing.

[Kate]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're like.

[Ty]

We're like, dude, you're not giving a presidential speech. We just want to talk. Like.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

And so then we used to. We used to kind of like be in denial or in their defense, be like, oh, well, they're Southern and we're.

[Kate]

Midwest, and maybe think we were in the fog. Like, how adoptees go through fog. I swear, I think there's a birth parent fog.

[Jordy]

I mean, I never really thought about where.

[Kate]

I think there is one. Like how you said you go through life being like, I did the best thing, and no, I'm so happy because.

[Host]

Look at her life.

[Kate]

And I did the best thing for her, and I gave her life and I gave this couple of kids. And I'm not gonna say my feelings, because they could take my. I swear I think it's a whole fog. And then eventually you get older and you're like, whoa, no, wait, this is hard.

[Ty]

Yeah, it hurts. And we also deserve to share, express our feelings. But it's like every time we do, we get shame for it.

[Kate]

Well, it's weird. Only when we've shared the hurt feelings, we've gotten shame for it. You know, like, if that makes sense. Like, every time we've talked about the good, it's always praised, and you did such an amazing thing and all of that, but the one time I come out and say, it doesn't feel like love it hurts. And I'm sad. People are like, sit down.

[Host]

That's not correct.

[Ty]

You know, look, how dare you.

[Kate]

Yeah. Be saved her. And it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa. I'm just saying.

[Jordy]

You're not saying that they didn't save her.

[Kate]

Yeah, I'm just saying that it. Sometimes it's hurts.

[Ty]

I wanted to, like, make sure that you got the full story, because on your TikToks, you're really passionate, and you're very spicy, and, like, you have a lot of opinions, and there are strong opinions, which is cool.

[Jordy]

Great.

[Ty]

But if you're gonna have an opinion, have all the information, and then you can cast it. You know what I mean? Which I feel like that's kind of the whole purpose of this, and that's why me and her were like, listen, we want to make this podcast be an open platform for people who don't agree with us, who have opposing viewpoints or whatever, because I think it's important to have. How boring would it be to conversate with someone who agrees with you all the time?

[Jordy]

That's stupid, right? Yeah, exactly.

[Ty]

And I feel like it's. It can be constructive and help people. So, I mean, that's the only reason why we're like, yeah, yeah.

[Jordy]

And the whole, like, when I was making the videos and our discussion, I was having a hard time finding, like, what the end goal was for both of you. But you both have made it pretty clear that, like, you don't care what happens with Brandon and Theresa now. So for that, I mean, might as well just keep, you know, airing it out, because bridges have been burned at this point, and there's never gonna be. I mean, I don't think civil relationship again. I think too much has gone down, unfortunately. Do you think that Carly's friends have told her about the show?

[Ty]

I have no idea. She goes a very, very conservative, you know, private Christian school. And I feel like a lot of their, you know, they're not into, like, no social media.

[Kate]

Her phone, you know, it's very, like, monitored, which is a good thing.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

That's how they live their life. But, I mean, I'm not really sure.

[Jordy]

My.

[Ty]

I guess when you say the end goal. My end goal with this is truth. And I feel like with the truth, people can form their own opinion better in a more educated opinion. And so it's like, the end goal with this is just the truth, and that is a truth for Carly to. To know these things and to not be put in the dark, which a lot of adoptees are, and they're lied to and they're, you know, told things that aren't true about their bio parents. And. And we, after kind of coming out with it, it's like we've kind of seen that.

[Kate]

That priority of adoptee.

[Ty]

Yeah. The priority needs to be the adoptees. Like, they're the ones that are most affected by this choice of adoption.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Ty]

And they deserve to be, you know, represented and that we should prioritize their experience and their feelings about being an adoption. And so that's the whole goal with this, is to advocate for Carly and this only way that we really can. I wish we could just talk to her ourselves and ask these questions, or her parents would be more, you know, transparent with us. But unfortunately, this is like, where we're at. Like, what else are we supposed to do? And I think a lot of people are like, oh, well, just wait till she's 18 and stop. And all the adoptees that have reached out and said, do not do that, because you. We. All we ever wanted was to know that our bio parents tried. Tried and kept fighting for us. And so I feel like, like, with that being said, it's like, I don't care about Brand Teresa right now. It's about this kid, and she deserves this.

[Jordy]

True.

[Host]

And like I said, unless they said.

[Kate]

Unless they told us and said it's hard for her to see you raising her sisters or whatever it is.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

I understand that and get it. So I would be like, hey, we'll step back and we'll be here if she ever has any questions or wants to.

[Ty]

And we also say, like, we almost, in a way, wish it was her because then all this would be not happening. Oh, so much easier. All right, cool.

[Jordy]

Cool.

[Ty]

We can just forget about this.

[Kate]

And it would be hard. I get it.

[Ty]

Yeah. But the fact of the matter is we don't know that. And so with those two scenarios that are possibilities, I feel a duty to do this.

[Jordy]

Yeah. And I want to circle back on what you said about, you know, the adoptees community and everybody that were telling you, never stop, never stop. Do you think that they kind of gassed you up, so to speak, to the point where you. It made you want to vent even more on social media, which is what ended up getting you blocked.

[Ty]

No, I think. I think it confirms that what we were doing was what we needed to do, because I feel like we. That didn't happen until after we said what we said and, you know, pretty much announced that we were blocked and we were. They closed adoption, and then they were like, all right, well, this is what, as an adoptee community, this is what we feel you should. You know, what you should do. And so, if anything, it just kind of confirmed for us. All right, all right, here we go. Let's get into this, because I feel like the reason why we were blocked, it wasn't because Kate expressed her feelings online. It was the fact that her expressing her feelings online put adoption in a bad light and a bad light.

[Kate]

Yeah, it was starting to show. I was starting to show a little bit more of the true side of our adoption journey with them. And I think, like, them being super conservative and in the south, like you, they don't want people to look at them in a negative way. Like, for instance, when. When Teresa told Dawn to tell us, like, don't be sending any more gifts, it's uncalled for. She also told dawn to tell us that you can't send any more gifts or anything. It's uncalled for and disrespectful. But don't tell anybody that I said that.

[Ty]

So we were like, does that make.

[Kate]

Sense almost in the fact of, like, you don't want the full truth out? Because then it's actually showing how you really. Our being is an adoptive family. And then you're telling me that I can't say that, though. So in turn, it's making me look like the bad guy all over.

[Ty]

Or also trying to, like, control the whole narrative of our story, which, as you said, what's a sign of manipulation?

[Jordy]

Right. That's what I was. Okay. See, See, on social media, that's all I saw.

[Kate]

I get it.

[Ty]

Right. Which is why that's. Yeah, I get it. Right.

[Jordy]

Which was my whole point of everything. But hearing your side, it does change certain things for me because there is a lot that we do not see behind the scenes that, I guess your goal is to get it out on social media. Yeah. I mean, it's a. It's tough. And all the comments that I had in, like, my TikTok and Instagram section, very mixed. I would say it's 50. 50. Half.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

People support you. Half the people want you to shut up.

[Kate]

Right.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

You know, and I will say, even though I came in pretty hot and heavy and everything, I'm glad I did because I was educated by people in the adoptee community. They. They messaged me. They're like, hey, stop saying giving up for adoption.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Kate]

Yeah, right. They tell you about the wording.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[Ty]

Or the savior complex and the gifting thing.

[Jordy]

They hate. Yes. They were like, Say placed for adoption. And this is why, because, you know, and they explained it to me and I'm open to learning about that stuff because I've never had to think about that because I wasn't adopted and I've never given a child or placed a child up for adoption. See there. But I'm learning.

[Kate]

You know what I mean? Yeah.

[Jordy]

So I'm glad I did because I'm, you know, and I've made friends with people on social media and everything. So it's, it's. It has been beneficial.

[Kate]

Yeah, no, and I'm glad you did too, because I think brought the discussion even further, you know, and more just education about it and different sides of it and things like that, which is.

[Ty]

Kind of the whole point of us doing this.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

Let's get the conversation going. Like you said, came in hot and heavy, you know, now it's getting this community to be, hey, this is what we like. This is what's respectful for us and whatever. Then you learn and it's like, you know, you mean, you take accountability and here I am and you're learning and it's great. And that's the whole point of all this.

[Kate]

For what we did wrong and own it, you know, And I think too, like through this whole journey and, and everything now, and it's still about Carly and I, but I think it's also shifted and it's made me learn even more as a birth mom I've just been talking to.

[Host]

It's just shifted for me in the.

[Kate]

Sense of just listening to adoptees and all of their stories and what they wish they, their birth parents would have done, what they wish their adoptive parents would have done. And so it's. Now it's more or less like a lot of them feel silenced. They feel like they have to protect their adoptive parents feelings. They feel like their stories are always told for them when it's their story to tell. And so now it's kind of shifted where it's like they need to have a voice, because I feel if you're hearing it from the mouths of the people that are the most affected by it, maybe there can be changes. Change. Maybe there's better understanding. You know, maybe there can be some things that are reformed with adoption that only benefits the child who's the most affected by it all. So it's kind of shifted now. It's like. And that still in turn will help Carly in the future because she will see us advocating for people who are just like her to have a voice. And yeah, I mean, that's the whole.

[Ty]

That's pretty much the whole main goal of all this. It's not to, you know, try to get sympathy from people. It's not to try to, you know, control and get. Recruit people to be on our side. Like I said, we invited you because you're. You have a couple opposing viewpoints I want to hear. Yeah, I love the criticism. Let's hear it. Let's get into it. Let's talk about it.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

And I think it's just a good way, the only way, really, we have. I wish, like I said, I wish we could just talk to them and call her ourselves, but we can't. So here we are.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

You know, I mean, there's no other way to get the voices heard. And.

[Kate]

And since we're not, like, you know, we're not allowed to call them or text them or send gifts anymore either. The reason why we are still talking about it and filming about it for our show and everything, too, is because, you know, she's 15 years old. What's going to happen when she wakes up on Christmas and her adopted. Her brother, who's also adopted, is opening all these gifts from his birth family, and she's sitting there with nothing from.

[Ty]

The first time in 15 years for.

[Kate]

Her birthdays and Christmas, Easter, you know, stuff like that.

[Ty]

And how are they gonna explain that?

[Jordy]

So Brandon and Teresa are still in communication with her brother's birth mom.

[Ty]

Oh, yeah, right.

[Jordy]

Because I know that you said in the beginning that.

[Host]

Yeah, she's very much like them, though.

[Kate]

As far as, like, being conservative, Christian and like, you know, like that.

[Host]

That kind of stuff.

[Ty]

Never ask questions or.

[Jordy]

But she's not blocked from. No, no.

[Kate]

And I. And I feel like, in a sense, she would always come to me and ask if we're gonna give visits, things like that, because she knew, like, okay, we'll ask the question. You know, she'll actually.

[Ty]

Hey, will you ask them?

[Kate]

But I think that's one of my fears is like, is, you know, is Carly sitting there wondering, like, wow, after 15 years, 16 years, I'm getting nothing. And why. Why am I not getting anything? And are they telling her the truth of it all? Are they telling her that they are the ones that said you can't send.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

Are you the one. Are you telling her all of these things? You know, and so that's why I feel so passionate about it. Because, like you said, her friends. What if her friends come across something and they say, look, they're still trying because she's going to talk to her peers more than she is going to be. Like, her parents, her. Her friends probably know on a deeper level what she feels and wants, you know?

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And so that's. That's. That's a thing. Like, I. It's just. I don't want her sitting there thinking, like, wow, after 15 years, they just stopped and they folded and they listened and didn't try.

[Ty]

So I think it's honestly one thing that Branch Reese are gonna have to answer.

[Kate]

They will.

[Ty]

And I think the difference between me and Kate and Branch Reese is that I'm an open book. I have nothing to hide. I have no shame. And so when she comes to me and asks these questions, I will.

[Kate]

I'll be honest.

[Ty]

I'll be honest. And I. Hopefully you're doing the same thing. So when she does pick up on Christmas morning and for the first time in 15 years, not have a present from us, I hope you're explaining it to her. I hope you're, you know, in the.

[Jordy]

Right way and not saying, oh, I don't know. Yeah, maybe they skipped you this year. Like, I hope that.

[Host]

Yeah, not either.

[Ty]

And I hope that they're telling her that we reach out every year for a visit and they say, no, next year. And so all those kind of things, I. I just.

[Kate]

I do.

[Host]

I reach out every year. I would.

[Kate]

Well, did.

[Jordy]

Yeah. Well, this will be the first Christmas.

[Kate]

You'Re not sending gifts.

[Ty]

Yeah, because I think in this. In this regard, it's like, okay, fine, we. And everyone's. It's funny because people respect them, respect them. Okay, I respect them. No, I won't send gifts.

[Kate]

But who's that harm?

[Ty]

Who's that harming? I'm making sure Branch Reese are good. But what about Carly? Who's not gonna have a present?

[Kate]

Especially when adoption's supposed to. Supposed to be centered around the adoptee. Yeah, Right.

[Jordy]

And it's not legally binding either. So it's not like there's anything that you could even do. Your hands are kind of tied in that sense where it's like.

[Kate]

And I noticed a lot of people saying that. Get a lawyer. Get on.

[Jordy]

I'm like, you guys can't do anything.

[Kate]

Adoption is not legally binding.

[Ty]

Which honestly, doesn't that kind of prove the point of. Of the intention of doing this? Because people still like, we'll just get a lawyer. It's like, you guys don't even know how adoption works. Like, there's nothing legally binding at all. It's a verbal agreement with this adoption agency, and that's it. And so. And I think it's interesting because people will bring up the. The contract that we signed at 16 that said like the first five years or something like that. But does precedence not matter? I know you said for the first five years, but you continued to have this pattern in. In ritual and tradition. And so it's like, it's like people like, we'll go back to the contract. You'd never. It's like what guys they. The ones that did it.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

It changed. It changed. Which we always say we're really thankful that the fact that it's a double edged sword.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

Like we're glad that you want to close and you chose to kind of vulnerably open it up more than you ever wanted to. Yeah. But at the same time, like it just doesn't make any sense that now you take it away without really a good enough reason.

[Kate]

Well, and now the fact of the matter too, of Carly being 14, it's not like she doesn't remember all those memories.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

You know, time our kids and they talk. So it's like just cut it all off and pretend nothing happened.

[Jordy]

I watched an episode recently where they said it would have to be really bad to cut you both off.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

But they're not giving you a reason of as to what it is. Yeah.

[Kate]

I'm like, we were literally left in.

[Ty]

The dark and that's funny. Oh, you're talking about the clip that we had.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[Ty]

I think it's really interesting to bring that up because I. We don't watch the show. We don't really.

[Kate]

Some stuff too hard for me.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

Yeah. But.

[Ty]

But I have gotten clips from that. People have sent it to me.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

And I think if you pay attention to her demeanor in her. She's spicy in her delivery in her. In her respect or empathy. It's like, it's, it's. That is what we have dealt with the last 15 years. Is it kind of like when I'm expressing a vulnerability, you're like, like it's like a. No. It comes across really like.

[Kate]

Yeah, like our feelings don't matter. That's what it's felt like almost most.

[Jordy]

It's very. She comes across very passive aggressive at certain points.

[Host]

She can be very.

[Jordy]

Bless her heart. Yeah.

[Kate]

Kind of spicy. Yeah. Yeah. So.

[Ty]

But she doesn't like when, you know, I don't think she wants to be kind of painted in that light. So. So I guess we're the ones that get in trouble for that.

[Jordy]

And I mean you're an easier target because you guys are on national television.

[Kate]

Yeah, right, exactly.

[Ty]

But. But I also feel like, what a missed opportunity. You're an adoptive parent. You could have really helped the community in adoption. You could have really been a voice for adoptive parents. You could have taken this opportunity and really just put a different light on it, but you didn't. And. And you're okay with it sometimes and not okay with it other times, and it's just.

[Jordy]

Yeah, it's inconsistent.

[Kate]

Like, wishy washy. It's like, oh, whoa. But you. We were fine with it last year.

[Ty]

But, okay, now we're in trouble. And now. And we were able to say the word sisters for years, and now we're not allowed to say that word because you don't like it. And it's just.

[Jordy]

So there's.

[Kate]

So, like you said, there's way more. You know, and I'm sure they have a whole nother side too.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

And I would be down to hear it.

[Jordy]

Yeah. And I.

[Kate]

And have a conversation, you know, like, I would.

[Jordy]

Yeah, yeah. And I asked you, Tyler, about, like, your only fans. Like, is that the thing that, like, really did it for them? They're like, oh, no, we can't have this because she's tattooed on you. Yeah, I think her name.

[Ty]

I think it's interesting, too, because all this stuff happened so much.

[Jordy]

Not. Not the.

[Ty]

Considering closing completely. But she's had issues before that ever happened.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

So was that the cherry on top? I have no idea. I. I'm not. I don't know.

[Jordy]

And you said that you had asked her on the live. Like, how did. Please tell me how that conversation went on the live. What do you mean? Yeah, I was like, did. Was the only fans that did it. And you're like, I've asked. Like, who did you ask? Because I would love to hear that conversation. Well, no, I didn't. Theresa. Like, did you see my.

[Ty]

No, no, no. I asked Dawn. I was like, is anything that I've done online, if anything, any new things that I've done, like, you know, I didn't say outright say it.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Ty]

But I was like, yeah, if she.

[Kate]

Would have told on that, that would have, you know, triggered Dawn's brain. Like, oh, yeah, this.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

But no, and. And honestly.

[Kate]

And we shut it down. I shut it down.

[Ty]

I said, justin, you know, because that's a good point. Okay, I get it. You know, we live a different. Very, very different lifestyle than they do, and I think that's okay to have different morals and ethics and what's good and what's not. And so if that Even if that was the case. Fine, take it down.

[Jordy]

We took it down.

[Ty]

Shut it down. Shut it down.

[Jordy]

Yeah. And I did. You got. You got a lot of backlash for your. Only because, you know, you guys gave Farah a bunch of crap about, you know, being, you know, what. Doing what she did. But what people. Yeah. Yes, you did. And I think a lot of people forget that because I went back and re. Watched and you guys admitted that you were wrong for that.

[Ty]

Yeah. I mean, so I. I mean, I've done what I could in that actually.

[Kate]

Like parents now, you know.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

You have daughters and stuff like that. Like, obviously what I want them going. Doing porn or, you know, but no, if they want to take spicy photos or they feel really good about themselves, then they want. With our girls, we talk about body parts all the time. Sexual, like talking about sex and stuff like that shouldn't be looked down upon, like, because it's a natural thing.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Kate]

So there are certain things. Yeah.

[Ty]

Where it's like, what?

[Kate]

Yeah, we did give her a hard time, but I would.

[Jordy]

But you acknowledge you're wrong.

[Ty]

And also. And also I think, is it not safe that things change, your opinions change, people evolve.

[Jordy]

Like, people.

[Ty]

10 years ago are not taboo now we have more information on it. And. And so I think. Think people should not be so concrete. Like, oh, my God. It's like, no, no, wait. We are allowed to shift.

[Jordy]

Our.

[Ty]

Our values are allowed to shift and change and move with new information and new data, and that's what's happening. So I feel like all I can do is say I'm sorry for the way that she was treated.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

Am I. Do I feel she's very. Not a nice person.

[Jordy]

Right. You can dislike her for a couple other things.

[Ty]

I think people get it confused that that's why she was. Was fired. And it wasn't. She used Teen mom in the title. It was a whole produced film versus.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

A paid paywall 18 older website which is blocked. But, you know, so. Yeah, there's a difference. There's a difference. I'm not saying that like, it justifies anything.

[Kate]

You've gotten a bunch of hate for it. I mean, no. I mean, there's porn stars, there's sex workers.

[Jordy]

Well, it's because she said it was a home video.

[Kate]

Like, yeah. Don't lie. Just. I did it.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

I'm on Team Mom. I want to capitalize on my. And this is.

[Jordy]

I'm like, girl. Yes.

[Ty]

Yeah. I follow Kim K's thing and you did that.

[Jordy]

It's fine.

[Ty]

I think the approach was really weird because you're, like, trying to pretend. It's just.

[Kate]

Yeah, there is a little bit of that where it's like, I would, you know, I would apologize to Farah and tell her that, you know, I. I.

[Ty]

Don'T think she would hear it, but.

[Kate]

No, I'm. Maybe not. But, you know, but we do.

[Jordy]

She might hear that now.

[Kate]

Yeah, she might.

[Ty]

Maybe. I don't know. I'm not really sure, but guess that's all I can do. Right.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

Take accountability. Okay. Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Kate]

We took the only fans down just.

[Ty]

In case, if that was a thing. I think it's really clear, though, do I agree that that is not morally correct? It's like. No, I. I have. We have freedom.

[Jordy]

And everyone does, according to them, though, because they're super, super religious.

[Ty]

Right, Right. But I think it's one of those things where it's like, we're allowed to live different lives and have different religious.

[Kate]

And then it brings up the question, too, like, so, you know, just if this was the case, it's like, you know, you have people that work at strip clubs and they're strippers and they dance and they show their tits and some can be fully nude. You know, billboards. Right. But like, you know, our strippers not allowed to have children. Or does that hurt their children? I don't know. Does. Yeah. Calvin Klein models and their underwear, Are they not allowed to have children? You know, so it's a hard thing to balance, but that's why we just said, well, we'll take it down. If that's their reasoning.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

That we don't know if it is or not.

[Ty]

Just in case. Do we think we're morally wrong? No, not really. I think it's empowering and it's freedom, and that's what it is. And I think anyone. Pamela Anderson, she's allowed to have kids. Just because she did her thing doesn't mean she's not allowed to be a parent. I think people, the backlash is like, you have children. It's like, well, yeah. And how do you get children? You have sex.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And.

[Ty]

And. And, you know, how do you. Like, you know, and eventually those children are going to be adults and do the same thing.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

And what's the difference between a model on a billboard in Times Square or a bathing suit guy in a bathing suit at the beach, like your children? So it's like, like, it's a.

[Jordy]

It's.

[Ty]

I think it brings up an interesting topic. Yeah.

[Jordy]

I think that's the only reason why you got backlash was because of what you guys said to Farah, but like you said you guys did, people need to re watch the episodes because I think all of you, Macy included.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

Acknowledge you were wrong.

[Ty]

So, I mean, that's all I can do. Right.

[Jordy]

Right.

[Ty]

That's all I can do.

[Jordy]

I can't.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Kate]

Accountable. I can say, oh, yeah, that wasn't really good. And I'm sorry.

[Ty]

They have changed. They shift.

[Kate]

My beliefs have changed.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

I have more understanding or whatever the case is. Yeah. I mean, so this whole thing is just messy.

[Kate]

It is.

[Ty]

And it's gotten to a point where it's like I have. I only have control of what I have control of, which is us sharing our story. And so that's what we're gonna do. And I feel like if people are gonna go online and have strong opinions, just I want you to have all the information. And so that's the whole. The whole. The whole goal, really. I mean, it's not our job to protect brain frees. And I think people even kind of deem that as controversial, but when, you know, their operation, how they've handled this for the 15 years, it's like it. It's hypocritical to think that they're, you know, we're not protecting them. They're not even doing the things that they said, you know, they would do.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

So it's. It's just. The whole thing is. It's just messy.

[Jordy]

It's not here. Pretty behind the scenes and everything.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

Which is why I'm glad that we had this conversation and everything. Because we don't know the full story until we ask the right. Like ask the questions from people directly. Because. Yeah.

[Kate]

And that's why I thought it was important to talk to you. Because, I mean, you know, it's just.

[Host]

Important for people to know there's two.

[Kate]

Sides to every story.

[Ty]

Yeah. And you're. And you said you also, you're the child of an addict. You're an addict yourself. We talked about this on Instagram, which I commend your sobriety. I think it's amazing and great. You got me Googling like, how do I become a. Yeah, yeah. But. So I think that's really great.

[Jordy]

And.

[Ty]

But I wondered. I'm like, I wonder if that is why your opinion was so strong about, oh, they're manipulating for sympathy. And I was like, oh, it's kind of interesting because I wonder if you are almost saying that because you. You're. You've done that.

[Jordy]

You spot it. You got it. You got it.

[Ty]

You've Done that as an addict.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[Ty]

I've never been an addict.

[Jordy]

Yep. But you have parents that have taught you certain behaviors that you've inherited, whether, you know, you guys are aware of it or not. You guys. By the way, you guys are not your parents. I just want to clarify that you are not your parents, but, I mean, when you're the child of an addict, like, they teach you.

[Host]

Oh, yeah.

[Kate]

I mean, I would. I would be lying if I say that the way that my mother was growing up didn't. It didn't affect me in negative ways. It has.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And I've had to do lots of therapies to re. To rewrite those ways. You know, mine's more or less like social monitoring and monitoring and creating or controlling emotions when I walk into a room of other people. And so I. You know what? I get what you're saying.

[Ty]

Yeah. But I get your perception. I just feel like, you know, that's why I asked about the whole thing of where's the line of me sharing my story versus now manipulating for sympathy. This is kind of a. Yeah. You know what I mean?

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Kate]

So I don't know after all of that, I don't really know what your updated version of thinking is or not. If we changed anything, if we brought awareness.

[Ty]

It wasn't the goal.

[Kate]

Not that it was a goal.

[Ty]

That's not.

[Jordy]

So I'll tell you what. I.

[Kate]

And be upfront, honest.

[Jordy]

I'll be upfront and honest. Okay. I still think that venting is not a great idea just because of. Of the negativity that it attracts. But at the same time, Brandon and Theresa's hands are not clean.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

So I think that there is blame on both sides. I think that it's messy. It's not black and white. This whole thing is gray. And I don't think there's a right or wrong way to go about this, because I feel like it's very unprecedented. You know, nobody has ever had an adoption story on national TV in this way.

[Host]

Right.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

And it's continued on 15, you know, or so years later. So I feel like there's no roadmap for you guys to go off of. There's nobody that has walked in your shoes before. This is a very unique situation. So I don't know. Although, I mean, we judge it on TV and everything, but I don't know if I can judge completely because I don't know all the facts about things that have happened behind the scenes. But I'm glad that you guys share that, because when you Reveal certain things about Brandon and Theresa and how, you know, they're not doing their end of the bargain. It does make me look at them differently. I'm like, yeah, I would probably vent.

[Ty]

Yeah, I was gonna say too, because I wonder if now, with that understanding, do you think that some of your opinions on other reality TV or anyone that you talk about, pop culture wise, it's. You should try to just. I mean, as much as you can, try to, like, dig into that.

[Host]

Try to.

[Kate]

What you do even better.

[Ty]

Yeah. It makes you better at your job or what your job is just to.

[Jordy]

Yeah. When I do deep dives, I try to show all sides. I did one on the Chrisley family. I'm very interested in Meet Lindsay because I've talked about her on there too. But I do try to show all sides because there are all different sides to different story. So. Yeah. So now that Carly is about the same age of being 16 you were when you got pregnant and the start of the show, what would you guys say to two 16 year olds that were going through the same thing and thinking about placing their child up for adoption?

[Kate]

I think my biggest thing would be. You have to. I would. I'm gonna help you with research. Yeah, we're gonna research this together. Because I'm an adult and I can.

[Ty]

Help you and you deserve resources.

[Kate]

Yeah. I think also I would give the advice of, like, really get to know these people. Don't only just meet them once. You know, get. Find somebody who wants what you want. If you want an open adoption, let's look at all the couples that want really open adoption. Meet with them more than once. Let's go to barbecues. You can talk to the. Just talk and talk and talk and talk as much as you want. For. I would do my whole pregnancy, you know, as soon as I knew I was gonna make that decision, I would have continuously done that.

[Ty]

But I also feel like making the decision of placing your child for adoption, I think it should be, like, really talked about that. That should be the last resort. The first resort you should have is support, resources. Being a young child in a crisis situation. And adoption should be the very last thing that you look at as an option. There are options. There are grants, There are. There are foundations that can help you. Like, I. So I feel like.

[Kate]

And we were never told.

[Ty]

We were. Yeah, it was pretty much. We were pretty much told that the best thing for you to do is let go and. And do this sacrifice for her. And so. So of course we're like, okay, and we have, like, I said, we have adults telling us this thing. So we don't have adults saying, hey, you know, there's someone who will help you get an apartment, and there's someone who will get you a crib, and.

[Kate]

This company will help you get a job and get on your feet.

[Ty]

Yeah, like, that wasn't.

[Jordy]

You know, that was for you. It was like, it was this or nothing.

[Ty]

Yeah, it was this. Or go home to drug addicts and.

[Kate]

Be stuck in chaos. That's pretty much what it was. Like, you take her home and you're struggling, or you place her and she's gonna be completely great.

[Ty]

And there were times when we going through the adoption where it was told to us, like, well, what's best for her? Are you gonna take her back to your bedroom and have a crib in your bedroom with your alcoholic and drug addict parents? And we were like, oh, my God. So in a way, it's like you. They make you. It makes you feel like not doing the adoption is wrong and you're a bad parent already and you haven't even birthed this child out in the world yet.

[Kate]

So I feel like, yeah, I feel like kids who find themselves in situations, but also you can find yourself in this type of situation at any age. It's not. It doesn't just happen, you know, to young kids. I feel like being educated about all of the resources that there are in the world that can help you if this. If you decide to parent. Also if, say, you choose that adoption is what you want to do, get legal representation for yourself and learn about.

[Ty]

Adopt adoption, trauma and what that means, because all adoptees inevitably face it.

[Kate]

And we were never told any of that. I wasn't told the statistics that my adopted child would be way high. Higher likelihood of drug addiction, of suicide, of mental health issues, especially, because, I.

[Jordy]

Mean, addiction runs in your family too.

[Kate]

So even mental health does. Yeah, mental health does. So now she's even double dose, triple dose, because then she's placed like, they don't tell you none of these things, right? So I think that's why when I say there needs to be some sort of reform and there needs to be deeper things talked about, because then we can make the best decisions for our children.

[Jordy]

Right? You needed an advocate watching your 16 and pregnant. I was like, my God, 100. Like, you needed somebody truly on your side. That was.

[Kate]

And his mom most recently just, like, got really upset. Like, we're super close with Ty's mom, and she got super upset and she just apologized and she said, I am so sorry that I wasn't educated enough.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Kate]

To not know that adoption wasn't the only choice either. And she's. She, she. You can tell she's regretful about that.

[Ty]

I can see it. Yeah. In her face and stuff.

[Kate]

Because we're all years out of it now. We know. It's almost like if we would have known. Not what we know, you know, and so you're right. We did. We deserved to have adults, you know, looking out for me. After we gave.

[Ty]

We never even watched it. So we can't. I don't even know.

[Jordy]

We never watched it.

[Ty]

The 16 year prank. We only watched it once when we were young.

[Jordy]

Oh, I can understand.

[Ty]

And we never watched it ever again. So I can only imagine. Imagine what it's like after knowing everything now, going back and watching, it's probably a whole different.

[Jordy]

It's hard. It's hard to. I mean, it's hard for me to watch.

[Ty]

Well, yeah. Now, you know, you're right, Team I'm historian. So now you're going back. Right. You know, it's like, it's wild. Yeah. It gives it.

[Kate]

And the fact of the matter, she was like, literally after placing Carly for adoption, everybody saw what I was going back home to. All the adults in my life saw what I was going back. When you were a child, there needs to be more resources for the birth parents and education because I was just sent back into the chaos and actually it was ten times worse than what it was.

[Ty]

Worse because now they're all attacking you and it's like it was.

[Kate]

So I think that's what I would just. Yeah, I would love to just talk and educate them and give them all the facts and they'd probably think I'm annoying after a while because I'd be like this, this.

[Jordy]

Read this book.

[Ty]

Yeah, but.

[Jordy]

No, but good for you for using your platform for the good. Because people need it. Yeah.

[Host]

Trying.

[Ty]

Well, I hopefully now that you have a platform too, so hopefully now with new information, you go on your platform and say, hey, adopt, adoptees. Like, this is what, you know, I.

[Kate]

Learned more or, you know, I heard more or. And this is what I still believe. And this is what I changed opinions.

[Ty]

Yeah. The whole goal is not to persuade you differently.

[Jordy]

No, I get it.

[Ty]

I just wanted to hear opposing viewpoints. And then obviously the information.

[Jordy]

I think we both were able to see where each other were coming from. Yeah, absolutely.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Kate]

And so, you know, I just really thank you for taking the time.

[Jordy]

Thank you for having me. This is great.

[Host]

Great.

[Jordy]

No, no, great for you.

[Ty]

You're about to blow up now.

[Kate]

But I think, but I think even in the future, I think there's other conversations we could have about different things too.

[Jordy]

Yeah. I mean, addiction.

[Ty]

I mean, I really want to have you back on that.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[Ty]

I would love to have you back on and kind of dive deeper into.

[Kate]

We could even do it via like a zoom type of app from home. And I just really appreciate your, you know, your opinions and your thoughts and your inputs on the situation and just thank you for coming.

[Ty]

Yeah, thanks for coming on Cake and tide. Break it down.

[Jordy]

Thank you.

[Kate]

And remember to stay curious.

[Ty]

Yeah. And where can we, where can everybody like, where can they find you?

[Jordy]

What's your Jordy Cray on all social media?

[Kate]

Awesome. Perfect.

[Jordy]

Awesome. Great.

[Host]

Thank you.

[Jordy]

Thank you, Jordy. Great.

[Kate]

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[Host]

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