The Uncomfortable Awakening: Redefining Worldviews with Monte Mader Part 2

Summary

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Cate & Ty Break It Down

The Uncomfortable Awakening: Redefining Worldviews with Monte Mader (Part 2)

Date: November 19, 2025 | Host: PodcastOne
Guests: Monte Mader with Catelynn & Tyler Baltierra

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Episode Overview

In this honest, wide-ranging conversation, Catelynn and Tyler are joined by writer and educator Monte Mader (returning from Part 1) for a deep dive into deconstructing fundamentalist worldviews, especially those shaped by religion and nationalism. The trio explores the discomfort—and liberation—of challenging inherited beliefs, the rise of political and religious activism in younger generations, and the hard but healing work of personal transformation. The episode moves fluidly between political trends, intergenerational trauma, spiritual curiosity, and practical advice for listeners daring to question their own worldviews.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Deconstruct Worldviews?

• Monte’s Approach: She avoids talking about her personal faith on her public platform, instead encouraging curiosity:
  • “Let’s just look at the information. What do you think? Can you be curious? Can you sit with the question even if it makes you uncomfortable?” — Monte (01:14)
• Fundamentalism & Control: All fundamentalist groups, regardless of religion, share the subjugation of women as a core trait.
  • “The only common element that every single fundamentalist group has...is the subjugation of women.” — Monte (01:32)
• Danger of Apathy: Monte stresses that apathy, particularly in democracies threatened by theocratic or nationalistic movements, is extremely dangerous.

2. The Rise of Youth Participation & Faith-Driven Progressives

• Recent elections have seen increased youth turnout and participation, with younger candidates and progressives gaining ground—a hopeful sign for guests.
• James Talarico (Texas) & Zohran Mamdani (New York): Both highlighted as examples of faith-based progressives resisting culture war baiting (03:32–06:23).
• “He refuses to be baited into, like, culture war topics...We should be mad at the top 1%.” — Monte (05:19, 06:06)

3. Deconstructing "Scapegoat Anger" & Economic Injustice

• Redirecting Anger: Conservative anger over “scammers” is righteous, but misdirected toward poor/vulnerable people instead of billionaires/corporations.
  • “The biggest welfare queen in this country is Elon Musk…Walmart has the most people on SNAP benefits because it does not pay a livable wage.” — Monte (06:48–07:02)
• SNAP statistics: Over 70% of beneficiaries work; some are active military.

4. Historical Context: Lessons from Economic History

• Guests discuss the “golden era” myth (11:21–12:38), highlighting real economic drivers—strong unions; high tax rates on the wealthy; redistribution.
• Trickle-down economics and large wealth transfers are dissected as failed policies repeatedly tried.

5. Religion, Gaslighting, and the Cost of Worldview Change

• Religion as a Weapon: Panelists describe being told by fundamentalists, “I only tell you this because I love you”—Monte likens this to emotional manipulation.
  • “You’re gaslighting me…If your lifestyle was as compelling as you say it is, you wouldn’t have to enact it by force.” — Monte (17:39, 19:32)
• Fear at the Root: People unwilling to question their beliefs are often driven by existential fear.

6. The Power—and Challenge—of Curiosity

• Monte encourages sitting with uncomfortable questions as central to deconstruction and spiritual maturity.
  • “Curiosity is important. I have ‘curious’ tattooed on my arm…Don’t believe me because I say it. Fact check me.” — Monte (23:50–24:07)
• “Organized religion has caused us to outsource our faith to another person instead of developing it…and that's why so many people that deconstruct from religion are still very spiritual.” — Monte (24:18)

7. Healing, Forgiveness, and Boundaries

• Monte shares about reconciling complicated family relationships, especially with her late father:
  • “It’s like I can hold him accountable for his behavior and also see his humanity.” — Monte (33:23)
  • Forgiveness requires anger and accountability first:
    • “Forgiveness does not mean tolerance. I can forgive you and also want nothing to do with you.” — Monte (36:08)

8. Practical Deconstruction & Community

• “Sitting with the Question” as Practice: Monte’s “Coven of Curiosity” community encourages questioning over blind belief.
• Building New Communities: Emphasis on local, real-life connection; Monte is working with the American Humanist Organization to organize support events (44:49).

9. Social Media, Information, and Staying Informed

• Monte recommends the Ground News app for bias-checked news curation:
  • “Go to sources. Social media is not governed by laws of factuality…Fox News reclassified as entertainment, so they're not accountable.” — Monte (51:00–52:18)

10. Resources & Where to Find Monte

• Podcast: “Flipping Tables” — covers American history, deconstruction, theology.
• Scholarly Bible Studies: Free, live, via Crowdcast (link in Monte’s Instagram/linktree).
• Newsletter: Weekly, actionable items for civic engagement.
• Social: @montemader on all platforms.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Participation:
  • “Participate in the system because democracy falls when we agree to cede it.” — Monte (02:01)
• On Hope:
  • “The win was important because people needed to see that there’s hope.” — Monte (08:36)
• On Deconstruction:
  • “Deconstruction is simply breaking down an ideology or worldview into its pieces and seeing if they hold up to the truth.” — Monte (25:46)
• On Self-Love After Deconstruction:
  • “My body’s not a sin…If I could gift that healing to people, oh my god…It’s totally different now.” — Monte (39:48)
• On Advice for Deconstructing Listeners:
  • “Wherever you’re at on the spectrum, we can sit with each other in real time with real humanity.” — Monte (44:49)
  • “You will know the truth and the truth will set you free. Man, am I so much more free than I was.” — Monte (42:51)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:10] — Monte’s approach to discussing faith and the importance of curiosity
• [02:22] — Generational shifts in activism; youth voting and protests
• [03:32] — Progressive younger faith leaders as political models
• [06:06] — Discussing anger/focus on economic exploitation over culture wars
• [11:21] — The economic reality of the “golden era” and why unions mattered
• [17:39] — Gaslighting and emotional manipulation in religious contexts
• [24:07] — Curiosity, questioning, and the problem with outsourcing faith
• [33:23] — Monte on her father, generational trauma, and forgiveness
• [44:49] — How to build new community and support around deconstruction
• [51:00] — Media bias, social media, and fact-checking news
• [53:54] — Where to find Monte’s resources, studies, and podcast

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Tone & Takeaways

Cate, Ty, and Monte’s discussion leans candid, empathetic, and often blunt, but never hopeless. Monte embodies “tough love” for institutions and deep compassion for individuals wrestling with change. The conversation presses listeners to be uncomfortable, to be curious, to channel righteous anger into useful directions, and to remember that “sitting with the question” is itself transformative.

Final Thought

This episode will resonate with anyone questioning what they’ve inherited—be it faith, politics, or traditions. With practical advice, personal stories, and an invitation to community, it sparks both thought and hope for the “uncomfortable awakening.”

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Transcript

[Adam Rippon]

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[Ty]

Hey guys. Welcome back to Kate and Ty Break It Down.

[Kate]

Last week, we left off with Monty.

[Ty]

Talking about her fundamentalist upbringing and how she has seen an increase of Christ followers finally questioning Christian nationalism. So nice to have you back, Monty.

[Monty Mater]

So what I've tried to do with my platform and that's why I don't talk about my faith on my page.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

Because I'm like, no, no, no, no. Let's just look at the information. What do you think? Can you be curious? Can you sit with the question even if it makes you uncomfortable? Because what else? What else is happening is as they've taken the hoods off and they've revealed they've kind of exposed their underbelly, we're seeing people wake up.

[Kate]

I'm so glad.

[Monty Mater]

Dangerous thing when it comes to fundamentalists and especially theocracies, which is what Christian nationalism is, and. And fundamentalism, the only common element that every single fundamentalist group has in every single religion is the. Is the subjugation of women.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, right.

[Monty Mater]

Any fundamentalist group across the world, that is the only common thread they all have, regardless of what the religion is. But the most dangerous thing in the face of a theocracy or a nationalistic movement is apathy.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Oh, right.

[Monty Mater]

People not choosing to get involved. Now it's getting bad enough. People are like, I don't know what to do. But we have people who've never voted before who are voting. We have people who are coming to their first protest. That's my other favorite message I'll get. I'm 67 years old and I just went to my first protest. I'm like, yes, like, participate in the system because democracy falls when we agree to cede it.

[Adam Rippon]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

We've seen that, and we're seeing that with Zohran Momdani's campaign.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I was just thinking the whole sweep this, this Last Tuesday. Yeah, Yeah. I mean, it's.

[Monty Mater]

And I mean, like, they poured millions and billions of dollars into opposition against him, and he still won because we can outwork them. Big money is lazy.

[Kate]

Yeah. And one of the creators that I follow on TikTok, he pulled up the statistics about, like, it was a huge number. It was mostly young voters coming in and voting for these people. And I'm like, which is.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

We need that. We need the young.

[Monty Mater]

Because as young people, we can't be angry about not being represented by these old, you know, white guys.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

If we're not out representing ourselves. And it's time, especially for millennials to be taking office and running for office. Because after that sweep, Nancy Pelosi announced her retirement.

[Kate]

Good.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yes. Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

Good.

[Kate]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

You're about a decade past due because, I mean, the median age is 38. That's not represented in our government.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And. And on. In contrast with that, because you have Zoron, who is, is openly Muslim, who is. His policies are very in alignment with the teachings of Christ.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, very.

[Monty Mater]

I'm like, oh, interesting, interesting. And then you see James Talarico in Texas.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Oh, love James.

[Monty Mater]

Seminary student, deeply religious, family of pastors, former middle school teacher, running for Senate, who's like, it is because of my Christian faith that I am opposing all these things. And he's. He, to me, is really giving Christ's followers an example of.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Oh, oh, yeah.

[Monty Mater]

That's why what I was in felt so wrong. This is what. And so we're seeing this huge dynamic shift of young people coming out, getting involved, believing in something. We've got the Afton Bain election in Tennessee coming up. Same thing where, where people are overcoming apathy and especially young people who have felt more. Part of the reason that insole culture and red pill culture has been so powerful for young men is because young men have felt completely unrepresented and lost. Which is true.

[Kate]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

They've been told their whole life, you know, you're going to get married and you're going to buy a house and, like, nobody can afford to buy houses right now.

[Kate]

Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

So they're, they're trying. And again, it's easy to scapegoat anger.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

Instead of they're now saying, oh, I can get out and do something about this. I can get out. And they're seeing young men who are not hateful pieces of shit.

[Kate]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Do some good in the world. And there's, there's a huge temperature shift that's happening that I think is really good. I think it is going to get messy. I think our economy's going to be in for a rough ride.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

Because they are enacting all of the same policies that they did in the 1920s.

[Ty]

Weird.

[Monty Mater]

It's like, dude, historically, not great.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

No, not great.

[Kate]

Right, right.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

But. But there's a hope when you have people like James Talarico who are. They're. He's on the rise. And I. I even said this, like, probably last year. I was like, listen, I would vote for this guy for president in a heartbeat.

[Monty Mater]

In a heartbeat.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

This guy, he knows exactly. He gets it. And I always share his videos on my Facebook because I think a lot of people that I'm friends with, they believe certain things or whatever. So I'm like, listen, like, you guys, there's another.

[Monty Mater]

And I love that he refuses to be baited into, like, culture war topics. And that, I think, is what the young progressives. Because it's not even the young Democratic Party. The Democratic Party is the reason we're here.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Like, let's be so for real. They have fumbled the football at every turn. They have boxed into special interest. They have been. They have been GOP light for a long time. So this new Progressive party, they have been able to. Not that one. They're not shying away from faith. The Democrats made a mistake by. By shying away from faith and spirituality. Because regardless of what you practice, it's really important for people.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

It is.

[Kate]

It is.

[Monty Mater]

And so the young progressives are not shying away from that. And they're also getting back to the meat and potatoes of affordability, education, healthcare, which is what everybody wants.

[Kate]

The things that really matter.

[Monty Mater]

The things that matter.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

You know, and. And because these. These, like, external social issues, you know, and one of the things, I love that Talarico says, because it's so true, he was like, you know, trans people make up 1% of the population. He was like, you're mad at the wrong 1%. We should be mad at the top 1%. Because this is a top versus bottom issue, which is 100% correct.

[Ty]

Yes.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

The top 10% of people in this nation control 38% of the economy, which is. It's crazy. The trans kid is not your problem.

[Kate]

Yeah, right. Because if you don't believe that, that's wrong. But the trans kids are.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. Like, come on. Now, what I. What. And what I will say to conservatives is that they have the right energy. Their anger is justified because someone is scamming the system. They're just mad at the Wrong people.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

The biggest welfare queen in this country is Elon Musk.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah. Right.

[Monty Mater]

Because how are you going to take all of these tax funded government subsidies, all these different companies, Amazon, Walmart, and then let's use Walmart as an example because I'm mad at them today.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Oh, I know Walmart. Jesus. Oh Lord.

[Monty Mater]

So Walmart has the. Is the top company that has the most people on SNAP benefits because it does not pay a livable wage. But guess who makes the most money from people spending SNAP benefits at their stores? Walmart. Yeah. People are scamming the system. It's not the single mother who's working two jobs.

[Ty]

No.

[Monty Mater]

Because over 70% of SNAP beneficiaries are working.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Some of them are active military, which blows my mind.

[Monty Mater]

Which is crazy, crazy, crazy.

[Kate]

And now we have people literally starving.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And so what I would say to like, conservatives who like hold these beliefs of like, yeah, I don't want this, the people scamming the system either. But it's not poor people.

[Kate]

No, it's not.

[Monty Mater]

Right. It's not poor people that are. We are the wealthiest nation that has ever existed in human history. There is no reason people should not be eating and not be able to go to the doctor. The only reason for that is greedy. So any conservatives that are listening, take that energy, keep that energy, stay mad, Be mad at the right people.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Shift it over.

[Kate]

Yeah. We shouldn't have anybody starving. No kids starving, people being homeless and.

[Monty Mater]

People being online mocking people who can't eat. Are you joking? You get no moral high ground. Sit down and shut up.

[Kate]

I've seen some of those people. It's backfired on a few handfuls. Those people were like, they've gotten fired from their jobs. And I'm like, yeah, yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Because it's, it's. And it's also weird. Kind of pull the hoods off too fast.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And they're, and, and so when they pull them off.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

They expose themselves to this. It's like, whoa, dude. And I think that is what's shifting kind of this younger generation to be like, whoa, like I don't, I don't have to follow this kind of extreme.

[Monty Mater]

And it was, it was so important for Zoron to win.

[Kate]

I know.

[Monty Mater]

Not because of his. I mean I, I love his policies and I hope that he can get it done. I really do. I think he's going to have a little bit of issue with Governor Kathy Hochul, but I hope he can do it. But the win was important because people needed to see that there's hope.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

They needed to see that we can get out and move the needle. We can get out and we can make change. His entire campaign was so life giving and that for me, it's like, you know, I go back to the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control. What campaigns make you feel that?

[Kate]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Because when we see people out here creating those fruits of the spirit, the Bible says, you know, like, again, a good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. What is the fruit? And I'm looking at the fruit of that campaign. I'm like, I see a lot of people with hope. I see a lot of people with joy. I see a lot of caring for the poor. I see a lot of feeding people baby baskets for young mothers. That's pro life.

[Kate]

Yes, it is.

[Monty Mater]

Free childcare so that people can afford to have children. That's pro life. Those are pro life policies. So for me, the importance was the win, so that people had hope to understand. You can outwork big money.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And people didn't have a lot of hope for a while.

[Monty Mater]

I think they did important well.

[Kate]

And that's why I think it's important. And, you know, we tell people and on our platforms, a lot, like, midterms are going to be coming up soon and we have to go out and.

[Monty Mater]

Vote because, like, we saw and work with campaign canvas, we. The other shift that I'm seeing is, and this is even happening for me as my life has become more digital, I crave human connection.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Which is why I was so excited to fly up here and sit with you in the same room. But, like, I want to hug people, I want to sit dinner with them, I want to look them in the face, I want to talk to them. And I think everyone's feeling that. Yeah. And so what I'm telling people is find local communities, join the campaign canvas. Like, push yourself outside of your comfort zone. Because we have so much more in common than we have indifference.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And it's just being demonstrated over and over that these. These political issues are being used to divide us so that they can rob us.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

You know, and it's a plan. Exactly. I'm going to probably going to get the quote a little bit wrong, but Lyndon B. Johnson said, if you can convince the poorest white man that he is better than the poorest colored man, he will not notice when you pick his pockets.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

That's true. Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

That, like all of this, this has been going on since the Revolts in the colonial era, where rich aristocrats realized that if poor white people and poor black people realized how much in common they had, that they could take over the communities. And so what they did was they gave the poor white people a little bit more.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

A little bit more.

[Monty Mater]

Just a little bit. Just enough.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Just enough.

[Monty Mater]

You're not starving.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, right, right.

[Monty Mater]

Not starving anymore. And it established this idea of white supremacy. It's just a tool.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

When I hear a lot of them say, too, like, oh, we need to get back to this golden era. The golden era.

[Monty Mater]

And I talked and I. I've been through the Vanderbilts.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah. I was like, I'll say, the golden era of what? What? And they talk about, oh, like the. The 40s and the 50s. I mean, oh, well, look at the. What was the tax rate during those times when everyone. When we had one house with one salary and we could stay in there? Like, what was the tax rate?

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. Because at that time, it was the top 1% of the top 10%. I can't remember. Only controlled 8% of the economy.

[Ty]

Interesting.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. Yeah. Which is still a lot, because from 1948 to 1972, when Nixon shut that shit down to give tax breaks to his wealthy donors, we had the fastest growing, largest economy that has ever existed in human history.

[Ty]

Wow.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which I think that's what they're talking about when they say, oh, we need to get back to the golden era. I'm like, you're talking about.

[Monty Mater]

So, yeah, so you have to. You have to change the tax law. You can't keep doing the same thing and expecting it to be any different.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You know, we all know trickle down does not.

[Monty Mater]

The big ugly bill was the largest transfer of wealth from the lowest financial class to the upper class in history.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which is crazy, because that's not going to.

[Monty Mater]

You know, and Reagan was the second biggest. But they also had a major transfer of wealth like that in the 20s as well, because the roaring 20s is a bit of a misnomer. It was great. Like, we're in Detroit. It was great if you were a Whitney.

[Adam Rippon]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

If you were a Vanderbilt or a Carnegie. It was not great for everyone else.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And we haven't been taught that portion of history, like, how important. There's a reason that conservative groups demonize labor unions. Labor unions are the reason you have sick leave, are the reason you can sue for wrongful termination. They're the reason that there are standards about how someone can treat you or. Or safe working environments, many of which have now been gutted, thanks to Doge. Because there was a bunch of lawsuits against Elon Musk for how he was treating his workers. But they. We forget that those are. Those things are the reasons that we have any protections at all. And there's been a intentional push to push all of that back, pretending it's some golden era. Like even the Gatsby party that Trump just threw while people are not eating. And now today he came out telling states. States that have said, hey, we have funds that we can put to fund snap benefits to feed people. Trump has now told states they can'. Do that and will penalize states that try to penalize people.

[Kate]

Yeah, Saw that.

[Monty Mater]

While he has nude Gatsby in a martini glass party for all his rich buddies. Who needs a $300 billion ballroom? Nobody asked for that.

[Ty]

No.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

All I think about when I hear and see how this all made, this is like the Hunger Games. Like, literally, it.

[Kate]

This is like, literally and like Hand man's the handmaid.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

It's the craziest thing how you can look at life that's imitating art, which is like the book of Hammond, you know, it's like, dude, this is getting insane also.

[Kate]

It's like, you know, what is. What is his reasoning? Like, why the. Does it matter to you if states are saying, hey, we have this, we can feed our people?

[Monty Mater]

Why does to use starvation to end the shutdown so they can get health care and privatize it further?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, it's. It's. Which obviously is a whole. Another healthcare in this versus every other wealthy country in the world is a whole different.

[Monty Mater]

It's insane.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, it's. It's crazy.

[Monty Mater]

And sometimes I sit down in the corner and I'm like, what is going on?

[Ty]

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[Monty Mater]

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[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Like literally it's crazy. But I will say I feel like, like when it comes to that kind of stuff, like I I hear like as far as the, the recent pushback I've been getting just from and like I'm very much like you. I'm not talking about my religion beliefs or anything or I just show my spiritual practice or I show my this is what I do. And the pushback is so intense and most of it comes from well they yell at me or criticize me and then say well I only tell you this because I love you and I want you to go to heaven. And in my head I'm like I don't think you understand how that comes across. And I feel like you're do like it's like you're doing. You're like you said you have the right energy. Just you're just doing it in the wrong way.

[Monty Mater]

And it's their own fear about their own eternity. That's what they're projecting on when I.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Respond to them and say, I do not fear what you fear. And it's like, so saying these words to me literally just fall flat. And so. And they get in. They get very frustrated and mad that I'm pretty much. I think I'm calling out. You're gaslighting me. You're saying, you know. No, no, no, because I love you, though. You're. You're gonna burn hell.

[Monty Mater]

Right?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And I'm telling you this because I.

[Monty Mater]

Love that little boy. Only hits you because he likes you.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, right. It's the same concept.

[Monty Mater]

It's insane. It's insane. And it's. It's just an excuse for cruelty and fear because there's a. There's a huge amount of fear and again, instability if your worldview changes. Because for them, it's like, what if I'm wrong?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Everything that they've built their entire world around collapses. And that is a terrifying thought. It's very destabilizing because for me, my deconstruction really hit full form the same year my dad died. Oh, wow. So his control and his power in my life and his influence is suddenly gone. I'm also realizing the whole worldview I had built my life on. Not true. Very destabilizing. Very terrifying. Like, very. Like, that was a period of time, not just because, despite my dad's faults, like, I deeply loved my father, was very close to my dad. Still am. And it was the loss and the grief and the anger, and trying to. It is a difficult. It would have been so much easier to just bury myself in the rhetoric. Way easier. But I had to make active decisions not to do that, because I'm like, I don't. I want to know what's true, even if it hurts and even if it's uncomfortable.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Maybe that's what they're doing. They're kind of diving deeper in the rhetoric and holding on really tight. Even though it's like. Because you're afraid.

[Monty Mater]

They're afraid of losing it. It's. It's what. It's what they've defined them their whole life with.

[Adam Rippon]

Which is.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which is crazy because. But you. But they're projecting that fear on people who may have a little different. Of belief or whatever. And it's like, that is so, like, I always. I always. I said at my last video, I was like, you know, if you're trying to get me to. Because, like, oh, my job is to spread the word of God and get you to, you know, follow him, or whatever. I'm like, well, you're doing a really bad Job of it.

[Monty Mater]

I'm not doing this at all.

[Kate]

You're not selling it.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I'm like, you are not a good salesperson for this. You're not doing a very good job. It's insane. So.

[Monty Mater]

Well, and that's the other thing about it is that, you know, and, and I also clearly get a lot of enraged Christians on my page. But my thing is, is I was like, if your lifestyle was as compelling as you say it is, you wouldn't have to enact it by force.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

It's true, very true.

[Monty Mater]

Like it, it should be compelling in and of itself.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You shouldn't need to scream at me about it.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah, well, it's the same thing. It's the same thing again with like these gender, gender norms, quotation marks where they're like, well, a woman's natural role. If it's natural, she'll do it naturally.

[Kate]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

He got to you.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, right.

[Monty Mater]

That's what natural means.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And it's just really, it is a fear response. It's, it's fear, it's projection. And thankfully a lot of people are waking up to it. And I think that it's important that people see people like us with different spiritual practices or talking about these issues because we have to keep chipping away at the veneer. Because for me, there were several moments in my teens and early 20s where people planted a seed I wasn't ready for.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

But what do you mean?

[Monty Mater]

So like would have an argument with me about my brand of Christianity and my fundamentalism or my nationalism. They would challenge me on a topic and I'd eviscerate them with my apologetics training.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

But then later I'd be like, huh? It would, it would eat at me.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

A little bit, bother me.

[Monty Mater]

Like, that's weird. Why am I thinking about that Bothers me. And then when I started to deconstruct, I was able to go back to those topics and recognize that those people were part of my journey to deconstruct how hateful and vicious I was. Because I was very hateful and very vicious and I was really good at it, which made it really dangerous. And I think that we're seeing a awakening.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And that awakening is really uncomfortable because we're in a period of time very similar to the early 20th century where things are being redefined. You can look at masculinity, early 19th century, or sorry, early 20th century, men are going from these traditional kind of labor driven jobs to working for someone, working in an office. Here we're seeing where the Provider role is changing because families can't live on one income.

[Ty]

No.

[Monty Mater]

So that definition doesn't exist anymore. So we're getting a new definition of what that looks like. And obviously women are like, you know, this is the first 50 years that women have been able to have financial autonomy. So where it's this huge conflict because it's an awakening, because it's a change. Change is always uncomfortable. And these worldviews are so integral to people's identities that disagreeing with their worldview is an attack on their identity in their.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

So if we could separate. If people could just separate that.

[Monty Mater]

Go and separate it.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Not as an attack, which I don't look at as attack. I mean, I feel like, yeah, I mean, kind of you're attacking me, but.

[Monty Mater]

Well, if you're calling me names, it is then.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right. Like, if we could just separate that, I mean, we could have a lot more constructive, you know.

[Ty]

And it's crazy.

[Kate]

And it's crazy because, like, how when you post things or like, for instance, when you do and you have like, the Christians or whatever coming in and like, berating you and stuff, it's mind blowing because to me, it's like, you know, no, I might not be a Christian or a very religious person, but I'm telling.

[Ty]

I.

[Kate]

Sometimes I feel like I am more. I have more empathy and more kindness, and you probably do.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You know what I mean?

[Kate]

I'm willing to help my community and help anybody I can more than even they would like.

[Ty]

That's crazy.

[Monty Mater]

Well, and what's. What cracks me up because I'm. I'm a salty individual. I'm pretty sexy. And so I do a lot of educational work on my platforms, but I also do a lot of, like, rebuttals, if you will. And it'll be so funny because people be like, I just. You're just so angry. You're so. I should be angry. You're advocating for, like, starving kids, number one. But also, how dare you come on my page, insult me, call me names, send me rape and death threats. I'm supposed to be.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

No, no, no.

[Monty Mater]

We're going to use this opportunity to flip a table and you're going to be embarrassed.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You should be.

[Monty Mater]

You should be embarrassed for your behavior. I'm not going to coddle bad behavior. And I'm always. I love, like, genuine questions. And I'll get those sometimes in my inbox or send people some emails saying, I'm. I really just want to know. And they'll. They're wrestling with an ideology. Love it.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Love it.

[Monty Mater]

Like, let me sit down and, like, let's talk about it.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

You're going to come at me talking sideways out of your mouth. Your mom's going to be embarrassed for you.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Like, yeah. So that's kind of why I want to have this conversation, because I want. I want to show people that this is. This is possible, that you can have these conversations and not.

[Kate]

And that it's okay to ask questions.

[Monty Mater]

And it's okay to disagree. Right. To be curious.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Curiosity is important. Very important.

[Monty Mater]

I have curious tattooed on my arm for that reason. And I call my followers the Coven of Curiosity. Because I'm like, don't believe me because I say it. Fact check me. Here's my sources, please. Fact check, please. Also, if you don't agree with me. Great. Did you sit with the question? Sit with the question.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And that is really the most important thing to me is for people, we organized religion has caused us to outsource our faith to another person instead of developing it and studying it and learning it for ourselves.

[Kate]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And so. And that's why I think so many people that deconstruct from religion are still very spiritual. Yeah, very spiritual. Because it's an integral part of who they are, but they're getting a chance to build it in a different way. And that's just so important to me. But also not just the freedom to have the conversations and the freedom to be curious and ask questions, but the freedom to be angry. Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Because in, again, in fundamentalist cultures, especially. Especially towards women, but a little bit towards everyone is, well, you just need to be, you know, sit there and smile and be quiet. Well, just don't react. Just don't know. The reason that people get away with abuse and harmful ideas is because we don't check them. So. No, like, be angry at the right things.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Channel that is simply an emotion telling me that a boundary has been crossed.

[Kate]

Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

Fix the boundary.

[Kate]

Yeah. And it's. And it reminds me, like, when you say, like, they tell the women mostly to sit down, smile, and be quiet. It's like that documentary we watched. What was that one?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Oh. Oh, my gosh. It was about the, the all the.

[Monty Mater]

God.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

What was it called?

[Kate]

It was something about, like, I can't remember now. I have to Google it, but God, that reminds me so much.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Girls, they were, they were raised in the. With their father in this community. I can't remember what it was called. Anyway, it was about. Yeah, very much Google it, though. Fundamentalist women and. And what it was and how kind of how they were raised. But I was going to ask you, because I think people who don't know what, like, deconstruction means, what would you define deconstruction to be?

[Monty Mater]

Like, deconstruction. And you can do this. Deconstruction is simply breaking down an ideology or a worldview into its pieces and see if they hold up to the truth. You can deconstruct, construct anything.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Break it down to the pieces. Does it hold up to scrutiny? Because the truth is never afraid of questions, and the truth will always hold up to scrutiny. Yeah, it's just about taking a worldview, breaking it down into its pieces and seeing does it hold up?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah. A lot of people come to me and they're in that, you know, a lot of the comments were just so, like, well, I'm supposed to do this. I'm supposed to call you here. I'm supposed to call out this heresy or this witchcraft or whatever. And I'm like.

[Monty Mater]

I'm like, guys, I didn't burn witches. They burned women.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, yeah, Right, right.

[Monty Mater]

So women who owned property or didn't want to get married or who knew how to heal with plant medicine or were midwives.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And then I get. Then I get a little, like. I get a little satire because I'm like, there you are, decorating your Yule tree pentagram on top of it.

[Kate]

People wanted to know the documentary I was talking about. It's keeps Keep Sweet, Pray and Obey church and stuff. And. Because that brought me back, too. But when you were. I know I'm kind of backtracking, but when you talked about being in that room with all those young girls being pregnant, that's it. That documentary popped in my head because so many of those young women being forced to marry old men, like, it's. It was disturbing, but.

[Monty Mater]

And it's just. And they're just. It's always cycles of abuse. And honestly, because speaking of the Mormon Church, the Book of Mormon was a big deconstruction moment for me. So I. When I was like, I just. Was like, I just want to know the truth. I'm like, I did a study on world religions. I read the Quran. I was reading the Book of Mormon, and I had studied who John Smith was. And I was like, this man is a con artist.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yes.

[Monty Mater]

Like, I'm reading the Book of Mormon, and some of this stuff is just so. I'm like, people can't possibly believe this. And the first thought that zipped right into my brain was, this is how people feel about the story of Jonah when they've never read the Bible. And I was like.

[Kate]

Oh no.

[Monty Mater]

Because it's just about like challenging these ideas. Can you sit with the question? But it was the Book of Mormon was a big moment for me where I was like, this seems incorrect.

[Ty]

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[Kate]

I have a question too. I just want us and I mean about your dad. So like for him to have a daughter and you're like learning and growing and changing your views and stuff on these things. Did it, did, did he ever change his views before he died?

[Monty Mater]

So my dad softened a lot the older he got. He really started to, especially around like LGBTQ rights and like not so much to the point where he was like, he would still do the whole like, I don't support your lifestyle, but I love you. But he was starting to realize like, oh, maybe people should just have the right to make their own decisions regardless of if you believe in it or not. But. And I had had questions, I had had talks with him about some of these social issues. To my dad's credit, because my dad died this the summer of 2016, and he was diametrically opposed to Trump. Oh. Was not having it. He was enraged, which is surprising, because what.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You know.

[Monty Mater]

But my dad was consistent in the sense of believe in a moral standard for leadership. And my dad always had a consistent view about adultery. He was not. That was like a thing with my dad, but he was like, how in the world is this serial adulterer scumbag calling himself a Christian? Like, my dad recognized the hijacking and he wanted a different candidate. So to his credit was never on the Trump train. But it was that summer. He and I had been fighting a lot. His. So the summer of 2016, my uncle died, his brother. And then two weeks later, my dad died. And then a month later, my grandmother and a close friend of mine died on the same day. So it was just this huge loss, amount of loss in a short period of time. But my dad and his brother had been feuding for 25 years, in large part because my grandfather kind of pit them against each other. But I was the only person from my side of the family that went to my uncle's funeral. Wow.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Wow.

[Monty Mater]

And my uncle's side of the family hadn't seen me in 20 years, but I just felt that it was the right thing to do. So my dad and I were having kind of a couple weeks of argument over that. I'm like, dad, that's not right. Don't you think that when he dies, it's time to bury the hatchet?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

And went back and forth with him. And he. His argument was. And I understand where he was coming from was he was like, I was concerned that my presence there would cause conflict and would be deemed disrespectful.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

I'm like, you know what?

[Kate]

I can see that where you're going.

[Monty Mater]

I can see where you're coming from. I still think you're wrong, but I can see where you're coming from. But after that conversation where he and I really kind of hashed it out, our disagreement, and my dad said, you know, I understand that we disagree, and I appreciate you confronting me. I just want us to make sure that we end every conversation like that we love each other, that we support each other. And he was talking about, I was getting ready to release music for the first time and really establishing that belief of, it's okay to have these conflicts, but let's establish that we love and respect each other. And I realized in that moment that I really have to have a sit down with dad and address that. My belief system is completely different now, especially with social issues. He died that night.

[Kate]

Oh, no.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Never got a chance. But I think. I mean, he already knew. Cause I had already kind of challenged him on a lot of those issues. But I never got to have that conversation of dad. This is not. And this is not what I believe is right anymore. And here's why I never got to have the conversation.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

But. But do you feel like. I mean, I feel like him. I mean, he's. You think he's proud of you? I would.

[Monty Mater]

I know he's proud of you.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Okay. I was gonna say. But without, like, I. Yeah, I. I would feel like he's very, very proud of you. And I think my belief is that when souls pass on, they elevate and they. You know, all the spiritual wisdom, they go boom.

[Monty Mater]

Oh, he's learning, too.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah. Right. Right. And I think I want to say it's beautiful that you give him such grace.

[Adam Rippon]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Considering, like, how you were raised. Because it's not easy to do, especially, you know, with being a kid and stuff. I mean, it's hard.

[Monty Mater]

It's. It's like I can hold him accountable for his behavior and also see his humanity.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

My dad. As violent as my upbringing was, my dad's was infinitely worse.

[Ty]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And so my dad and I. I can look now and I can see my dad's fear, his depression, his unhappiness with his life. My dad was an incredible musician, and all he wanted to do was music and write books. That's all he wanted to do. My grandfather guilted him with, well, good sons. Come home and take care of the ranch. My dad hated it, but he spent his whole life trying to earn his father's love that he never got.

[Kate]

That's sad.

[Monty Mater]

And then when he passed away, my stepmom had him erased within a month.

[Kate]

Really?

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. And so I not only learned from his life based on the choices he did and did not make, where I realized after his death, man, life is short. I have to make decisions based on what I believe in and what I dream about doing. And it changed the trajectory of my life, but I can also look at him in this beautiful, broken humanness and kind of hold my dad as a kid and say, buddy, this was never supposed to happen to you, and I'm really sorry that it did. And I'm really sorry that you carried that pain your whole life because you didn't know what to do with it.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And so I've been able to, like, forgive my father. And I went through a period of time really angry at my dad. I felt lied to, I felt deceived. I was angry about the abuse. I was angry about how he treated my siblings and my birth mother. And I was then able to forgive it. But I think that that's such an important step of forgiveness that we kind of leapfrog over. Sometimes people are like, oh, you need to forgive. You need to be angry first.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, right?

[Monty Mater]

Be angry first. Give that energy right back where it came from. And someone taught me recently just a form of meditation where if you're dealing with hurt like that, they said, sit down, sit in a room, give yourself two minutes to kind of get in the zone and imagine confronting this person. Like, give all of the pain and the energy back to them. It is not yours to carry. Call them out, curse at them. And it's all in your mind. You're not doing this. Whatever you gotta do, scream at Em, yell. And he told me, he was like, keep doing that until you're ready to forgive and you'll know, should I need to do.

[Kate]

I need to do that with a couple people in my life?

[Monty Mater]

Because it's a process. He's like, because when you have given all that rage and that pain back to them, then you can forgive. And then it's true forgiveness.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

True forgiveness.

[Monty Mater]

Because you're not carrying the damage of it anymore.

[Kate]

And I was like, that's actually great advice.

[Monty Mater]

It's really good advice. And I skipped that. That forgiveness requires accountability.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Otherwise I'm just enabling you.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

Oh, it's fine. It's fine. No, it's not fine.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And a lot of times forgiveness is just like a word to people. It's like. Or, oh, just choose it. It's like, no, it's a process. It's like a grieving pro. Same thing. Grieving is a problem. Like, forgiveness is a process. That.

[Monty Mater]

And forgiveness does not mean tolerance.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right, Right.

[Monty Mater]

I can forgive you and also want nothing to do with you. Those can both exist at the same time. And I think that's such a. The anger and the hurt is part of the process. And for people who are dealing with what's going on currently politically, or you're leaving the church or you're. Whatever process you're in, that anger. Anger is not a sin.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right?

[Monty Mater]

It's not. Again, it is an indication that a boundary has been crossed. Fix the boundary, sit with the anger. Because only when you've processed that anger can you actually forgive someone.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Without bringing up no. Right. And especially when, even when it comes to the Bible, I'm pretty sure Jesus was angry.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. I mean, he represents flipping tables.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Flipping table. Yeah, exactly.

[Kate]

But I do state one thing I thought was so funny. When he started like educating me about the young child Jesus and the stuff he would do, I was like in awe.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Well, people don't know, so I thought that was interesting about.

[Kate]

Yeah, cuz we would. He would like tell me some things and I'm like, what the. He was a little demon.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Funny. And this is like off topic. We'll see. Say I always thought in my head, I'm like, well, I know people like don't want to talk about that stuff or whatever. They don't. Or they don't believe it happened or whatever the case is. But like, what a humanizing, what a way to humanize Jesus.

[Ty]

He was a.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Could perform miracles as a child needs. Uncontrollable child.

[Monty Mater]

What do you mean? I can't have more cookies. Magic.

[Kate]

Right? He would start telling me things and I'm like, this is like so intriguing to me.

[Monty Mater]

For those of you like, what are they talking about? It's. It's from the Quran.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, yeah. And that's why when you said that I read it, I was like, all right, you'll get it, you'll understand that reference or whatever. But yeah, I always thought that was interesting. I'm like, well, I feel like they should probably introduce that because what a way to humanize. Could you imagine being Joseph? Be like, yo, listen, you can't be blinding these people. Listen, it's okay. Mess with your puddle, it's fine.

[Kate]

It is, yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

At the end of it, he brings everyone back to life and he's a good, you know, but like, if I.

[Monty Mater]

Had the power to smite people.

[Kate]

Yeah, I know, right?

[Monty Mater]

Seriously, he couldn't tell me anything. But it is, it's really, it's like the process of healing, though that comes with deconstruction is so beautiful. I'm so much more and my process is constantly ongoing and I.

[Kate]

But it probably is like a life, a lifetime.

[Monty Mater]

It's a lifetime of, of unpacking, of healing the wounds and learning. Because as I learn new things, my opinion changes. Why? I've just, I've gained new information. You know, I'm taking Hebrew courses starting in the spring because I'm like, I want to know more and I wish that more. I wish that I could gift what I've been given in my change. Like the happiness, the freedom, the joy, the peace, the Compassion, the empathy. If I could bottle that and give it to people. And even the self acceptance.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Because growing up in these cycles of abuse, but also the demonization of my weight and my looks and, you know, this is the only important thing about you. Destroys your sense of self worth. There's a reason that so many deeply religious women really struggle with, like, their sex life and marriages. Because they've been taught their whole life, your virginity is the only thing that matters. That you're not gonna like it, but you have to do it for your husband. They haven't been taught any form of, like, self love, self care, self respect, and then they're supposed to flip a switch the night they get married. That's not how reality works. And if I could even package the healing I've had when it comes to myself and my body, like, finally living life, not hating my body every single second. Hello. Like, 90s heroin chic propaganda, like is. Is. Is life altering.

[Kate]

I'm so glad you have that now.

[Adam Rippon]

Right.

[Kate]

Like, to be able to love yourself in your body.

[Monty Mater]

Yeah. And that's one of the reasons, like, fashion is so important to me, because it was. That was part of my healing process. Was like, my body's not a sin.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

My body's not a sin. My body's not ugly. My body's not defective. My body's not all of these things because I have five extra pounds.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Like, yeah.

[Monty Mater]

You know.

[Adam Rippon]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And to be able to go through that process, if I could gift that healing to people, oh, my God. Like, if I could just. It's totally different now.

[Kate]

Well, and I think what you are doing is on, like, your social media and stuff too. I think you are. I think you are definitely helping and healing people for sure. Was that?

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Kate]

I'm like, you are making an impact. You are making a difference. You're not people.

[Ty]

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[Monty Mater]

And that's my hope is just to get like, I just want to open the door.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Just like show people the way of like, hey, there's light out here.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, come on in.

[Monty Mater]

What if there's. What? What if there's a better answer to the question?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And the question is, what if? Maybe there isn't, but what if there is?

[Ty]

Right?

[Monty Mater]

And I mean, I would love to see people free from these systems because, I mean, when I was doing. And I was very good at the game, I was. I was really smart. I could defend the faith. I knew all the scripture, I knew all the study. I checked all the boxes. I did everything right. And I hated myself and I hated my life. And I was miserable all the time because nothing was good enough. Nothing was worthy enough. Everything was always, you're never going to be good enough. And I don't feel any of those things anymore. Wow.

[Kate]

Isn't that something?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

That's a hallelujah.

[Monty Mater]

You will know the truth and the truth will set you free. Man, am I so much more free than I was. And it's made me a better human. The older I get, the more I think that. And I think that Paul believed this too, because Paul believed that Jesus was coming back in his lifetime. I think that when Jesus was talking about the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of hell, he was talking about right now.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

That my decisions, I reap what I sow. I can choose to create heaven on earth or I can choose to create hell on earth by the choices I make right now. Because when you outsource eternity to, the only thing that matters is after I die. It gives you an excuse for cruelty and apathy right now. And I don't think that's in alignment with the gospel at all.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I don't either. I don't. That's what confuses me so much. That's why I was like, I need. After my video and all that stuff, I'm like, I gotta. I didn't wanna talk about this really. I was kind of. But now I was like, no, I cannot. I have to. Because it's, it's almost like. And I, I'm a very big, like, I don't question my intuition at all if I feel that I need to. You know?

[Monty Mater]

I mean, when you've retrained your intuition, you can't ignore it anymore.

[Ty]

Dang.

[Monty Mater]

It's.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

It's almost annoying. I was like, I have to do the next right thing today. Can I just, like, please let me be complacent say. But I can't. And so, like, I, I, you know, the older I get, the more I'm like, I don't even question it at all. I, I sensed it. I was like, listen, this is a conversation that's important. And I think it's one of those things where people are afraid to talk about it because it sparks so much, I mean, hate and so much just. But it's important to, like you said, chip away slowly. And we have to do it. And I feel like if people are deconstructing, what would be your advice to them on how to do it or what to focus on?

[Kate]

Because is there, like, support systems for people?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah, I'm like, construction that.

[Monty Mater]

Not really. It's starting.

[Kate]

Like, how do they get support?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

We need to start some kind of, like, there's, there's communities.

[Monty Mater]

There's communities popping up now. And, and that's part of my goal with my platform is to give people a space that they can process all of this.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

And I'm actually teaming up with, getting ready to team up with the American Humanist Organization to start, like, in person events to get people connected with each other, to understand that, hey, there's a space for you. Wherever you're at on this trajectory, wherever you're at on the spectrum, we can sit with each other in real time with real humanity. Because I think that is one of the things that's hardest for people.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Is again, the loss of community.

[Kate]

That's what I was thinking. Like, yeah. They need support in some aspects of this.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

If you wanted to leave this one or get out of. Then they need something of this.

[Monty Mater]

And I think that, you know, that's one of the things I want to. And I want to commend you for making the video of like, oh, I don't want to talk about this. But it's important because when people see people like you leading the way in those conversations, it enables them and encourages them. Literally giving courage to. Oh, I can ask these questions. Okay. You know what My intuition was telling me things should be a little different. Maybe I can ask that. And that's what I hope that my. My reputation and my legacy is, is that it encourages and empowers people to ask. Ask the question.

[Kate]

That's awesome.

[Monty Mater]

Is really like, I'm not here to. To tell you what to believe or to build faith for you. Can you. I'm here to let you know that you can ask the question. And it allows me to talk about the questions and my journey and take all that backlash and hate, which does not bother me at all.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

It doesn't.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Honestly, it's.

[Monty Mater]

It tickles me quite a lot. That's like, in our life, with things.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Kate]

I'm like, honestly, you guys make me laugh a lot.

[Monty Mater]

You wouldn't even know it. And to people who are like, oh, I'm afraid of backlash, understand that people will hate what you do no matter what you do.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

Because if you try to outsource your happiness to pleasing other people, the only person who will be miserable is you.

[Kate]

Y.

[Monty Mater]

And. But I can. I can kind of stand in the wave and take the brunt.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

And allow the people, like the little. Little baby questioners behind me to start asking questions without having to take the full weight of that. And that's another part of my purpose is like, let them talk. Let them call me. I get called trans. I get called, you know, all kinds of names. It's the nose ring, it's the earrings. It's. You're the old hag. You're washed up. I get rape and death threats all the time. I'm like, oh, look at you being such a good Christian with the Bible.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Verse.

[Kate]

In there and stuff, you know?

[Monty Mater]

But for me, it's about being a bastion, because I can. I can take it. I can take the heat. So I'm going to. So that people behind me can get stronger, so that we can all stand together in. In front of the wave and say, no. Like, we're not gonna tolerate that. But I think it takes people in these very visible roles. To stand up like that and take that.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

So that other people can be. Can feel safe enough to ask those.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Questions for their own curiosities. I feel like we talked about, like, you know, we got a lot of backlash for. For kind of exposing the adoption industry. And I said. I said, I will stand on the stage and I will take every single arrow, and it's fine. My arms will be wide and I.

[Kate]

Will give it to me.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I will gladly take every single arrow if that means that a couple people behind me are scared.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

But still be able to come from the sides and explore their own curiosity. It's super and super important. I think it takes a special type of person, and also it takes a specific vigor and tenacity to kind of stand there and take the arrows and.

[Kate]

To be able to take it.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

And I think it's important that people like us who have. We're so blessed with this platform and just even have people listening, that we don't take it for granted and we don't waste it, you know? And so I feel like. I don't know. I just feel like I'm so grateful that you came here.

[Monty Mater]

I'm so happy. Me too.

[Kate]

And I want to know, like, so, say for people that are listening, maybe they don't know where to find you and they are wanting to find you where kind of lead them in the direction where can they find you?

[Monty Mater]

So there's a. Depending on your interest, there's a bunch of things. So all of my social media platforms are Monty Mater, M O N nte M A D E R. And if you're just looking for kind of a lot of more current events and Christian nationalism, how it relates to that. Instagram is really the baby for that. But I have a podcast all about American history, deconstruction, really. I bring in theologians, I bring in authors, doctors of history, and it's called Flipping tables. And it's really about, can we sit with the question. I also teach, and these are my gift. I wanted to have something that I always did for free that was my gift to people. And I teach scholarly Bible studies where I just present information and we deal with questions. So we deal with like the Bible and the lgbtq. Well, what does it actually say? What's the historical context? We talk about the Bible in women. We've talked about the divinity of Jesus and the history of the church in that way. And I just present information, and I take a Q and A and I just say, hey, I'm not asking you to change your belief. Here's the information. How do you feel about that? And those are always free. So where can people get that out? So if you go to my Instagram, it's. It's on my website, but it's also. If you go to my link tree, it's a crowd cast, but it's live. We do two a month, always free. And the replays are up for 24 hours so people can watch them if they can't attend. And it's just my gift to people because I always want to. It's very easy. And I've been a small business owner before this and I've been a musician for a long time that it gets easy to get egocentric when you're doing your own business. Right, Right. It's like my stuff, my stuff, my bills, my this. So for me I was like, okay, how do I make sure that I'm always de centering myself and giving back? And that was. That's my thing is those studies to just.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which is so important.

[Monty Mater]

So important. And I mean we. I did a two part series on what I called the making of Biblical womanhood. Really talking about scripture in women. The second study I had 3, 000 people attend.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

You did?

[Kate]

Wow, that's awesome. Wow, that is awesome.

[Monty Mater]

My community is just incredible and it's just this huge mix of people where I'm like, can we sit with the question?

[Kate]

That is awesome.

[Monty Mater]

So those are, those are really my babies. I also do a weekly newsletter you can find on my website about current events, current action items. Because a lot of people are like, I want to help. I don't know what to do. Yeah, I try to lay that out in a newsletter.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Say, hey, you also do really good at saying how to get information, which I like. There's a code. There's a code. It's. Can you tell people about that? Because I.

[Monty Mater]

Which code?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which one? The one that, where you get all the news and it's like, oh, ground News. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, so that is, that is.

[Monty Mater]

I'll just, I'll share it here for sure. So Ground News is an app that I use. Obviously the news is so overwhelming right now. There's 18,000 horrific headlines every day. So what Ground News does, it's an app that assembles all of the news sources on a particular story and combines them so you can find them in one place. You can also go to each source. It tells you what the bias rating of the source is, who owns the source, and what their, their factuality rating is. So you can get really accurate information quickly. Good. And you can also build a for you page there where you can customize what topics you really want to be following. So you'll still get the breaking news page but then you have a for you page where you can follow these. Because things get buried in the news cycle, especially in this day and age.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

With so much misinformation.

[Monty Mater]

So much misinformation.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I thought that was super important.

[Monty Mater]

And because so many people are getting their information on social media, which I'm participating in as well.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

Always, always go to sources. Because social media is not governed by laws of factuality. The way that media is the reason that Fox News, after they had their 787 billion dollar lawsuit.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

The reason they reclassified themselves as entertainment noticed that is so that they're not accountable to the legal laws that bind news sources to report factual information.

[Ty]

Wow.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Which is the reason get away with so many.

[Monty Mater]

The reason, the reason they got fined that much was because when they pushed the stolen election narrat knew it wasn't true. And when discovery for that court case happened, they found out that top executives knew it was false and decided to push it anyway, which violated those news laws. So then Fox reclassified themselves as an entertainment channel so that they're not beholden to those laws, but other news sources are still beholden to those laws. So when you hear something on social media, go to a place like ground news or go to a news source and check it. Because social media has no legal accountability to tell you the truth.

[Kate]

Yeah. They can say what?

[Monty Mater]

As we can see, I didn't know.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

About ground News until I saw you post it by like oh my gosh, this people should be screaming about this ground news thing.

[Monty Mater]

And you can go if you want to use my discount code. It's ground news.com Monty. You'll get 40% off their vantage plan. It's five bucks a month. It's so worth it. It's so, so worth it. Like my favorite thing is being able to see the bias distribution and I can immediately see who's reporting it. They also have a feature called blind spot where you can find articles that are or stories that are either getting just not reported or they're not being reported by left leaning sources or they're not being reported by right leaning sources. So a lot of things I would have no knowledge about unless I went to the blind spot feature I find interesting.

[Kate]

Well, that's good. Yeah, that's very good to know a.

[Monty Mater]

Lot of sneaky news. So always Always, always fact check. Always go to a news source. I know that there's a lot of distrust in legacy media, and I don't blame people.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yeah.

[Monty Mater]

But they are still bound by those laws, which gives you a little bit of a buffer that they. They can only sell you so much misinformation without getting a lawsuit.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Right.

[Monty Mater]

So that's important.

[Kate]

And then one more thing to your podcast. Can your podcast. Flipping tables.

[Ty]

Can every.

[Kate]

Is it available on all platforms?

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Yep.

[Monty Mater]

Everywhere. Everywhere. You listen to podcasts.

[Kate]

That is awesome. Monty, I want to thank you so much.

[Monty Mater]

Thank you.

[Kate]

Tyler was, like, over the moon excited.

[Monty Mater]

Thank you. And thank you for being girl over here.

[Kate]

So excited.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

I saw you on Instagram. I was like, she's never going to answer me. She got so many people that are going to.

[Monty Mater]

But I do need to get better about my message request. But thank you for having me, and thank you for having it in person. Like, not just flying me up here and putting me up in a great hotel, but, like, just having the conversation, like, oh, my goodness, this is food for my soul. But it's also so important that people, like, sit with each other and you're doing it. You're facilitating that with what you do, and I'm really appreciative of that.

[Kate]

Thank you so much. Yeah. I. I just want to let you know that I definitely learned a lot from you today, and it was very intriguing and I hope that everybody listen.

[Ty]

I love it.

[Kate]

I love it. And I hope that, you know, you guys can follow Monty and reach out to her if you're curious. And I hope somebody learned something today. That's what's important. And make sure you guys follow, like, and review our show, and we will catch you guys again next week.

[Ty]

Yeah.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

Love you guys.

[Adam Rippon]

This November, action is free on Pluto tv. Go on the run with Jack Reacher.

[Monty Mater]

Every suspect was a train killer.

[Adam Rippon]

Then buckle up for drive. World War Z.

[Monty Mater]

Every human being we save Just one.

[Adam Rippon]

Less fight and Charlie's Angels.

[Monty Mater]

Damn, I hate to fly.

[Adam Rippon]

Launch into Sci Fi Adventure with the fifth Element and laugh through the mayhem in Tropic Thunder.

[Guest or Co-host (possibly a friend or collaborator of Monty)]

What is going on here?

[Adam Rippon]

All the thrills, all for free. Pluto TV stream now pay never. Hi, I'm Adam Rippon, and this is Intrusive Thoughts, the podcast where I finally say the stuff out loud that's been living rent free in my head for years. From dumb decisions to awkward moments I probably should have kept to myself. Nothing's off limits. Yes. I'm talking about the time I lost my phone mid flight and still haven't truly emotionally recovered from that. There might be too many sound effects. I've been told to chill. Will I? Unclear, but if you've ever laid awake at night cringing at something you said five years ago, congratulations. You found your people. Intrusive Thoughts with Adam Rippon is available now wherever you get your podcasts.