St. Polycarp

Summary

Catholic Saints Podcast – St. Polycarp

Host: Mary McGeehan
Guest: Dr. Ben Akers, Chief Content Officer at the Augustine Institute
Release Date: February 23, 2026
Episode Theme:
This episode explores the life, teachings, and martyrdom of St. Polycarp, Bishop of Smyrna. Dr. Ben Akers and Mary McGeehan discuss Polycarp's unique position as a bridge between the apostolic age and the second-century Church, his important role in fighting heresies, and his enduring legacy of faithfulness, humility, and courage.

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Overview:

In this dynamic conversation, Dr. Akers leads listeners through the fascinating world of the early Church, focusing on St. Polycarp—a disciple of St. John the Apostle, friend of St. Ignatius of Antioch, and a crucial Apostolic Father. The episode covers Polycarp's connection to the apostles, the major theological and pastoral challenges of his time, his fierce defense of Church doctrine, the moving details of his martyrdom, and the deep Eucharistic and Christ-like themes within his life and death.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Polycarp as Apostolic Father (00:39–03:32)

• Biography in Brief: Born c. 70 AD, martyred 155/156 AD; feast day is February 23 (the date of his martyrdom).
• Apostolic Connections: Polycarp was a disciple of St. John the Apostle.
  • “He studied under…John the Apostle, the beloved disciple who laid his head on the heart of Christ.” (00:38, Dr. Akers)
• Bridge Figure: He connects the apostolic era directly with second-century Christianity.

2. Polycarp’s Relationships and Legacy (03:05–05:16)

• Close Discipleship: Mentored by St. John, friends with St. Ignatius of Antioch.
• Disciple Chain: John ➔ Polycarp ➔ Irenaeus.
  • “That’s a cool discipleship chain.” (04:49, Mary)
• Appointment as Bishop: Was appointed bishop of Smyrna (modern-day Izmir, Turkey) by John himself.

3. Challenging Heresies and Doctrinal Clarity (03:56–09:13)

• Combatting Gnosticism: Faced Gnostic heresies, particularly those propagated by Marcion and Valentinus.
  • Polycarp leveraged his direct apostolic teaching to refute heresies:
    “No, I actually heard from John who heard from Jesus. This is the teaching.” (04:12, Dr. Akers)
• Defending Orthodox Doctrine: Polycarp called Marcion “the firstborn of Satan” for distorting the faith (09:14–10:30).
  • “Doctrine is not just a mind game...Marcion is distorting that in a heresy.” (09:31, Dr. Akers)
• Significance of Doctrine: Doctrines are “lights along the path of the Christian life.”

4. Polycarp as Bridge in Liturgical Debates (06:19–08:48)

• Quartodeciman Controversy: Negotiated the date of Easter's celebration (on 14th of Nisan per the Eastern tradition, or on Sunday per Rome).
• Journey to Rome: Traveled to meet Pope Anicetus and, though the question was unresolved at the time, departed “in peace,” showing unity amid disagreement.
• Early Papal Primacy: Highlights the Roman See's early centrality in Church matters.

5. Polycarp’s Letters and Their Preservation (12:45–16:41)

• Polycarp’s Letter to the Philippians: Emphasized humility and practical Christian virtues.
  • “I have no authority to be writing to you, unlike St. Paul…but because you ask me, I will write…” (13:13, Mary)
• Legacy of Letters: Early church communities treasured these, copying and preserving them despite persecutions.
• Content of Teaching: Affirmed the real resurrection, prayer for friends and enemies, and clear doctrinal instruction—“It sounds like the Apostles Creed.” (16:31, Dr. Akers)

6. Polycarp and the Book of Revelation (10:49–12:37)

• Reference in Revelation: The message to the Church in Smyrna in Revelation 2:8–11 is likely addressed to Polycarp as bishop.
  • Quote: “Do not fear what you are about to suffer...Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of life.” (12:21, cited from Revelation)

7. The Martyrdom of Polycarp (16:44–24:10)

• First Eyewitness Martyr Narrative after St. Stephen: Detailed, near-contemporary account survives.
• Christ-Like Martyrdom: Many deliberate parallels to the Passion of Jesus:
  • Betrayed by someone close (“Herod”), captured on a Friday, prays for all before his death, tried before authorities, tied (not nailed) to the stake, prays a long high-priestly prayer, dies in a manner echoing Christ’s crucifixion.
  • “He was like a noble ram…a goodly burnt offering, all ready for God.” (23:00, Dr. Akers)
• Eucharistic Imagery:
  • Fire doesn’t harm Polycarp; his body appears as “like a loaf baking in the oven,” echoing the bread of the Eucharist.
  • “So just as bread is transformed by his hands into Christ…so his life is being transformed in an imitation of Christ, offering sacrifice.” (24:04, Dr. Akers)

8. Theme of Faithfulness and Perseverance (19:00–27:20)

• Enduring Witness: Polycarp’s resolve:
  • “Eighty and six years have I served him, and he has done me no wrong. How then can I blaspheme my king and my savior?” (24:45, Polycarp’s answer in trial)
• Hospitality to Captors: Even as he was arrested, Polycarp welcomed and fed his captors, exemplifying charity. (25:23)
• Daily Faithfulness, Not Just Martyrdom by Blood:
  • “We could say we’re probably not going to be called to martyrdom of blood, but daily sacrifices…is that not worth eternity?” (19:00, Dr. Akers)
• Lasting Legacy: His faithful example continues to inspire centuries later.
  • “If we allow Christ to be king of our lives…he’ll be your sure guide in life.” (26:30, Dr. Akers)
• Name's Meaning: Polycarp means “much fruit,” tying to Jesus’ words: “You are my disciple if you bear much fruit.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On proximity to Christ:
  “He was taught by the Apostle—not just like, hey, that’s John over there, but he actually was taught by John, mentored by John.” (03:05, Dr. Akers)
• On the seriousness of heresy:
  “Doctrine is not just a mind game that we do…this is serious. Lives depend on it.” (09:31, Dr. Akers)
• On suffering and hope:
  “The cost of a single hour purchased for themselves life everlasting…an hour of suffering is nothing compared to eternity.” (18:35, Dr. Akers)
• Polycarp’s martyrdom response:
  “Eighty and six years have I served him, and he has done me no wrong. How then can I blaspheme my king and my savior?” (24:45, Polycarp)
• On the meaning of Polycarp’s name:
  “It means much fruit. So it’s a very Christian name because Christ says, ‘You are my disciple if you bear much fruit.’” (27:09, Dr. Akers)

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Suggested Readings/Resources

• Early Christian Writings (Penguin Classics)
• Polycarp’s Letter to the Philippians and The Martyrdom of Polycarp at newadvent.org
• Revelation 2:8–11 ("Letter to the Church in Smyrna")

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Takeaways for Today (25:49–27:22)

• Faithfulness and Fruit: Polycarp’s example calls all Christians to daily fidelity, authentic witness, and hospitality, even to enemies.
• Doctrinal Clarity: His life underlines the necessity of cherishing and defending true doctrine for the health of the Church.
• Eucharistic Living: Everyone is called to self-offering, patterned on Christ, in daily sacrifices and acts of love.

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“Saint Polycarp, pray for us!”

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Transcript

[A]

You're listening to a podcast on Catholic Saints. This podcast is produced by the Augustine Institute, an apostolate helping Catholics understand, live, and share their faith. Hi. Welcome to Catholic Saints. My name is Mary McGeehan, and today I'm joined with Dr. Ben Akers. I work here at the Augustin Institute. Dr. Akers here is the Chief Content Officer at the Augustine Institute. Thank you for joining. Today we're going to dive into the life of Saint Polycarp. Ben, tell us, what do we need to know about Saint Polycarp?

[B]

There is wonderful things to know about Saint Polycarp. He, first and foremost. It's not a name that you hear often. No, not a lot of little boys running around Saint Polycarp, but he's one of the great heroes of the early Church. He is a. I'll give you his dates. We celebrate his feast day, February 23rd. So if you want to mark your calendars, February 23rd is his feast day. It's actually the day that he dies. And we have words of Saint Polycarp. We have the account of his martyrdom. We have letters that he received from a saint. So he is an incredible gift that we have to the church. So he's a bridge between the apostles, the apostolic age, and then kind of the second century. So he was born around 70 A.D. and then is martyred 155. 156 A.D. okay, so you would call.

[A]

Could you call him an Apostolic Father? Would that be a proper title?

[B]

Yeah, that's great. And by Apostolic Father. Yeah, exactly. These are the men that knew the apostles. So he knew an apostle. Do you remember which one?

[A]

From St. John.

[B]

Great, good. Yeah. So Mary is a proud grad. We're very proud of her as a graduate of the Augustine Institute. And. Yes, that's right. He studied under. He knew John the Apostle, the beloved disciple who laid his head on the heart of Christ.

[A]

I just think that's mind blowing, though, to be 2 degrees away from Jesus, you know, to be discipled by the man who's reclined his head on Jesus chest. That's incredible.

[B]

I know. Exactly. So he would have known. He could think of the stories that he knew about Christ that we don't have recounted in the Gospels for us. Yeah, right. Cause John says, I can't write it all down because it would fill all the books of the world. And so he knew stories about Jesus that we don't know.

[A]

Okay, but fun question. If you were Polycarp, what would you ask St. John?

[B]

If I was Saint Polycarp, what would I ask John.

[A]

Yep. About Jesus, about the early Christian fathers, the apostles?

[B]

Yeah, that's a good question. Yeah, I would probably say what was. Tell me a story about Jesus that you haven't told me before. Yeah, that's what I actually like to do when I meet like for example, the Missionaries of Charity. The Missionaries of Charity, most of them living now would have met Mother Teresa and tell me a story about Mother Teresa. Oh, I remember. And they immediately tell me a story about Mother Angelica. If you meet one of the mother. The EWTN brothers. So these people that are in our living memory, holy men and women and to get stories that you don't always get to see written down or hear told.

[A]

No, I agree. I appreciate these first second century saints just for the humanity too, that they remind us of Jesus and the apostles as well.

[B]

Yeah. So I mean, it was amazing to think that he knew the apostles. He at least the apostle John, he was taught by the apostle. Not just like, hey, that's John over there, but he actually was taught by John, mentored by John. He was a disciple of John and He's friends with St. Ignatius of Antioch. We have a foreign Catholic saints on him as well. And he was appointed by John, an apostle, to be a bishop of the church of Smyrna.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So he was very in with John

[A]

in particular, that inner crowd. Interesting. And where is Smyrna?

[B]

It's in Asia Minor. Okay, so kind of where? Turkey, if you're thinking of modern map now.

[A]

Turkey. Thank you. So when I think of Saint Polycarp, I think of his martyrdom is what comes to mind first. But before his martyrdom, was there anything he was known for? What were the obstacles of his time when he was bishop?

[B]

Yes, so he had a couple obstacles that he faced. You know, just living as a Christian in the world is difficult today as it was in the second century. And a couple of things come to mind is the Gnostic heresies. So Gnostic heresies, we have a trend of those in the early church. Sometimes we even have them with us today. This kind of secret knowledge we have something that's not accounted for in the gospels or in tradition, you know, come to us to find out. So in particular, Marcion and Valentine are the kind of the Gnostics that he is facing. And the way that he combated them was. No, I actually heard from John who heard from Jesus. This is the teaching. And so he would just go over and over again. And we have an account of from Irenaeus who. So he disciples St. Irenaeus another great early church father.

[A]

Polycarp disciples.

[B]

Thank you. Yes. Polycarp. So John Polycarp, Irenaeus.

[A]

Okay. That's a cool discipleship chain.

[B]

Is that neat? Yeah. And then Polycarp and Ignatius are friends. They're both discipled by John.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And both. Both are martyred. Ignatius was also.

[B]

Ignatius is martyred. Yeah. Ignatius actually has these incredible seven letters that. That he writes to the churches as he's going to Rome to be martyred. He's martyred in Rome. And one of the Church. Actually, one of his seven letters is a letter to Polycarp as a friend.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[B]

It's like saying, keep the faith.

[A]

Yeah, Encouragement.

[B]

Yeah, encouragement.

[A]

Bishop to bishop.

[B]

Bishop to bishop. Yeah.

[A]

Would you say if you were a bishop in these early first centuries after Jesus, death. It was basically a sentence to death if you held any hierarchy in the Church.

[B]

I think that early, yeah. So for every Christian, not only is the bishop and the Pope, like, even the Christians, you know, when Jesus says, if you will be my disciple, you must take up your cross daily. And Luke, it says, daily and follow me. The cross is an instrument of execution. The cross is the instrument by which people die. So just by being a follower, a student of Jesus, you know that this is a possible consequence.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Is to die. But definitely bishops serving as a head. You know, you strike the head of the snake, you know, the kind of it keeps. You know, that's how you kill it. That's the idea in a lot of the practices in the early Church's persecution is strike the head. The bishop and the Church they imagine would scatter, but it actually keeps growing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

As Tertullian says, the. The blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church.

[A]

Amen. Yeah.

[B]

So another thing, if I say another thing, what he's known for before his martyrdom, Polycarp is actually represents the other bishops that are in Asia Minor, and he's sent to Rome to the Pope. So it's interesting. This is so theology in the early Church is that you have a bishop in Asia going to Rome to ask a question, a theological, liturgical question. So it's not the bishop of Rome going to other churches to find out answers. So it already kind of. Even in the early. So this is second century, mid second century. We have bishops from other countries, other parts of the world coming to Rome to ask questions. The question at hand is, in Asia, they are celebrating Passover. Sorry. They're celebrating Easter, the resurrection of Christ on the 14th day of Nisan.

[A]

What's Nisan?

[B]

So the month of which Jesus celebrates the Passover, So it's a Jewish feast day. So it's called the Quattro Decima. So if you're in Catholic trivia, Catra de Sama, the 14th day controversy. So the Eastern church says, hey, we got this. We have this tradition from John and the apostles. So this is when we celebrate Easter. But in Rome, they celebrate Easter on Sunday, right? On the Sabbath. Yeah. So on this. So Sabbath becomes transferred to Sunday. So they always celebrate, you know, after the first full moon, after the first vernal equinox. And that was kind of that. So. And they claim the church in Rome, Latin Church, claims that this feast day, so the Easter celebrated on a Sunday comes from apostolic origin as well, Peter.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

So you have both churches claiming is that the 14th day of Nisan. So no matter what day, so you celebrate Easter on Tuesday, if it falls on Tuesday, because it's the 14th day of Nisan, or is it the Easter Sunday?

[A]

And how did they reconcile? They didn't.

[B]

Yeah. So. No, they didn't. So Polycarp goes and makes his claim. He says we claim apostle apostolic origin. The Pope at the time in Aecitus says, we also claim apostolic origin and they depart in peace.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And so the idea is that they don't settle it. They don't. They've said, yep, you keep practicing. We'll keep practicing. It will be celebrated by Pope Victor, solved by Pope Victor in 190 AD. So within 40 something years, the church settles on the Sunday salvation. But it's kind of an interesting thing. Then soon after, he goes back to his church and he's arrested Polycarpes and put on trial.

[A]

Okay. And it also just points to the priority of the See of Rome as well from the early Church for their evidence for the seat of St. Peter. That's right, in Rome. Thank you. Interesting. Well, I appreciate Polycarp for safeguarding the Church from these heresies. You were mentioning Gnosticism. Was there another one of that time period I kind of cut you off earlier?

[B]

No, no, it was just kind of the question about whether or not when Easter should be celebrated in the Easter.

[A]

Okay, very good. Well, I heard he had told. Is it Marcion, that he is the first son of Satan in quick suppression of his teachings as being not true. Not the faith from Jesus.

[B]

No, that's right. And so we have. These are harsh words. And that we're like, oh, how could he say that? This is how serious doctrine is. Doctrine is not just a mind game that we do of you Know, debating about, you know, does this. This letter or this word, you know, to describe Christ? No, this is using words to describe the reality of who God is, and God revealed himself. And Marcion is distorting that in a heresy. So heresy is, you know, to take some teaching of the Church and to. To distort it in a incorrect way. And what. Polycarp is so strong in his words because he's like, this is serious. Lives depend on it. As the Catechism of the Catholic Church says that doctrines are lights along the path of our Christian life. If it's dark outside, and it's definitely dark in the world in which we live, we need doctrines to light our path. And so if you skew the doctrine and say, oh, it's not a big deal, you go off the path, and that leads to death, spiritual death. And so this is why this strong. Yes. I recognize you. You're a firstborn of Satan.

[A]

Yeah. No, I think that helps me appreciate doctrine truly, as more of a gift from the Church. And even when we say the Apostles Creed at Mass, like how much battle, how much discuss, much wars, you know, were fought, to be able to uphold those doctrines of our church and truly see them as a gift preserved from these Apostolic fathers so passionate about the teachings of Christ.

[B]

Yeah, Well, I. I opened up my Bible. Tell me my. Because I think it's interesting because many biblical scholars, Scripture scholars, will think that Polycarp's referred to or addressed by Christ in John the Apostle in the Book of Revelation. So we know that Polycarp is a disciple of John, that John handpicks Polycarp to be the bishop of Smyrna. And in the Book of Revelation, written by John. Written by John. In the Letter to the Churches, there's seven churches that Christ addresses in the Book of Revelation. In chapter two, starting in verse eight, there's a message to the Church of Smyrna.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah. So this is probably Polycarp's message that he's receiving from John.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And it begins to the angel of the Church in Smyrna. Right. So angel just is the word for messenger. So the messenger is the bishop. The words of the first and last who died and came to life. And he goes through some recommendation or some, you know, recognition and then a challenge. I know your tribulation, your poverty, you are rich. The slander of those who say that they are Jews and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. So it sounds like a Marcion, the firstborn of Satan. It also sounds like when we get to the Martyrdom of Polycarp. He's not only killed by the Gentiles, so the non Christians, but he's also the Jews contribute to the crowd. We're in the crowd. Yeah. So it seems to be an echo here. Do not fear what you're about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison that you may be tested for 10 days. You will have tribulation. Be faithful unto death and I will give you the crown of life. He who has an ear, let him hear. The Spirit says to the churches, the one who conquers will not hurt by the second death.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So this challenge of, hey, in the Church of Smyrna, you're going to have a persecution, but persevere, be faithful and you'll receive the crown of life.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Very beautiful. Yeah, we see that in the life of Polycarp.

[A]

Yes. Wow. I had no clue that that was referenced in Revelation.

[B]

Isn't that interesting?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yes. So lots of fun things in the Bible. Another thing that we see before we get to his martyrdom is we have a letter from Ignatius of Antioch. We talked about him to Polycarp and it's a beautiful letter of friendship where he's encouraging him to, hey, can you check in on my church of Antioch? I trust you. You're a man of God. We both know John. We both know the Lord. Deeply persist in unity. We also have a letter of Polycarp to the Church in Philippians. That's right, the Philippians.

[A]

I read it yesterday. You did?

[B]

Yeah. Isn't it great? I read these last night too, when I was. The letter. What was your impression of the letter?

[A]

My favorite part was when he mentioned St. Paul, actually. It just seemed very practical and trying to encourage the lay Christian to live their life virtuously, moment by moment. And I just remember a sense of humility at the beginning where he said, I have no authority to be writing to you, unlike St. Paul or I have no clout, but because you ask me, I will write a letter to you. Just that level of humility that he started off his letter with. Stuck out to me.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. What struck me at the very beginning of the letter when he says that humility. Greetings. It sounds like a Pauline epistle he's writing in a church that Paul would have wrote a letter to. When you're welcomed, these copies of the True Love, you took the opportunity of setting them forward on the road. It made me happy in Jesus Christ. You did so. And I was like, copies of the True Love. He's referring To Ignatius and his companions who are on their way to martyrdom.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[B]

So Polycarp, in humanly saying, it moved me to see how you welcomed those martyrs on the way to their death. But I love that phrase, copies of true love. They were imitators. We're all the image and likeness of God, but in a particular way, they're the image in Christ and they're going to image him in their death.

[A]

Yeah. No, that is beautiful. Whether we're called to martyrdom or not, that gift of self is something we, in carrying our cross is that copy of love we all are called and invited into.

[B]

That's right. So when you read the letter, it's very short. I encourage you. You can find these letters. We both have the same copy of a Penguin classic. Early Christian Writings was a compilation of these early church writers. But newadvent.org has all these fathers of the Church free. You can look that. It's a great website that encourage you to if you want to read these.

[A]

And one more quick question before we dive into the martyrdom. I just find the letters as the form of preservation about the life of these saints very fascinating. Why were letters the main mode of communication? The main mode of preserving the doctrine, the teachings? Yeah. Could you shed some insight on why were the letters. So how were they safeguarded as well

[B]

in this time period? Well, they didn't have cell phones. No. Right. It's the way that they communicated. And, you know, like this is a special message, just like, you know, inspired Epistles of St. Paul. The Letters of St. Paul, you're writing to the church and they recognize, this is gold, this is good. I want to keep this and preserve it. And they did their best to preserve it. You know, we do know that Clement. So we all do know that Polycarp wrote other letters. Some of the early church writers wrote other letters, but we don't have. They were destroyed. So in persecution, that would be. Part of the goal would be to destroy some of these letters. But they were so revered in their own lifetime as holy men and women that they kept these, they copied them as quickly as they could. And that's actually the reason why Polycarp writes to the Philippians, is they've requested something from him. They requested the letters of Ignatius that he had copies of, said, can you send us copies of these and can you just give us a word of encouragement? And so that's why he goes to that teaching of, yeah, tradition's important. I heard it from John. John heard it from Jesus. I'm Handing it on to be faithful to this. Jesus is both God and man. So he's. He's going to be very firm on that as well. You need to pray for your friends, but you also need to pray for your enemies. You will die, you will be judged, but you will get your bodies back because the resurrection is real. Do you see how it sounds? Like the Apostles Creed. It's very clear. Like these are foundations of the faith that you need to hold to.

[A]

Wow. Beautiful. Thank you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What is significant about Polycarp's martyrdom?

[B]

So one of the biggest significances, the most significant thing about his death is that he's the first martyrs account that we have outside of St Stephen's account in Acts of the Apostles.

[A]

Okay. So very ancient.

[B]

Yes. So this is amazing. We think of the early church martyrs, but they actually have a written account of someone who was there and describes a voice coming from the heavens. We have what Polycarp was asked on trial and what he says in response to that. We have his last prayer before he passes away. We have an eyewitness kind of what happens when he's actually killed and what happens to his body and his bones. So we actually have so many details about his death. What's fascinating is that St. Stephen in Acts of the Apostles, he's the first account that we have of a martyr. He's the first martyr out after Christ's death and resurrection. And his is known for being pattern on Christ. He looks up to heaven, he forgives them. They don't know what they do. Father, forgive them. He sounds like Christ. It looks like Christ. Polycarp's martyrdom, if you notice that it looks a lot like Christ. It's very, very much patterned on Christ's martyrdom. Christ's death.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah. So that's one of the themes. As you go through the short. Again, short letter. I encourage you to read it.

[A]

Yeah. And the Christocentric imitation is beautiful. What specifically was similar to Christ's death and Polycarp's?

[B]

Yeah. If I could for a moment. One of the things about just martyrdom in general is, and it's the very beginning of the martyrdom account is the author goes through people who have been martyred and people who were pretended to be martyred but chickened out. But I love it. He says that some of these martyrs look as if they don't suffer at all. And he says it's as if Christ is standing next to them and talking to them as a friend.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Like with them, with them in the moment. Of death. And it says the cost of a single hour purchase for themselves life everlasting. So he made light of this world. So, like, an hour of suffering is nothing compared to eternity. I just love that exhortation to begin that you imagine you die, and then you close your eyes in death, you open them, you see God forever face to face.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Like, everything changes.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And so is that hour not enough to suffer? And we could say that we're probably not going to be called to martyrdom in our own life of a blood martyrdom, but daily sacrifices, 70, 80 years of making sacrifices and fasting, praying, almsgiving. Is that not worth eternity?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

To do.

[A]

Yes. That greater perspective is often forgotten.

[B]

Well, one of the things that he gives two examples, and this is helpful for us, is he gives example of Germanicus, who is one of the early martyrs. So this is before we get to Polycarp, but in the martyrdom of Polycarp. And he's so intense. He just. He pulls the beast upon himself. He's like, yeah, bring it on. You know, like this kind of. Yeah. This incredible intensity of his desire.

[A]

I don't think I would do that. Yeah.

[B]

Well, it's interesting because you're like, well, like, is that normal? Is that okay? And he's just so convinced that this is. He's already gonna die. He's being killed. He's being eaten by the lion, you know, the animals. He's like, just bring it. Like, bring my reward even more quickly. But he also gives, in the very next paragraph, the example of Quintus, who volunteered, I'll be a martyr, and then chickened out and ran away.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And there's a commentary in the text that says, and that is the reason, brothers, that while we do not approve of men offering themselves spontaneously, we are not taught anything of that in the gospel. So we have this early Christian writing saying, look, we're not taught to go and seek martyrdom. If it comes, say yes, but don't go out of your way to go and seek martyrdom. And that's just good. He's like, it's not even in the Gospel, because you don't know you're gonna get the grace to do it. If you're asked to do it by the Lord, he'll give you the grace, right?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Because don't presume on the grace that you're gonna get it.

[A]

It's clear with these depictions there with Jesus very closely in this martyrdom, you don't throw yourself in the ring without Jesus to overcome this.

[B]

Right. So Some of the things, when you read the story, and I encourage you to read it, and is, you know, he's praying, he's. He's betrayed by someone in his own household. The guy's name was Herod. The author makes sure, like, remember Herod from the New Testament? That was an enemy. Yeah, this guy's an enemy. They come on to him on a Friday. They, the guards come to him with weapons. Sounds like Christ in the agony in the garden. He says, Polycarp says God's will be done. He's so old, he's so saintly. He asked to pray. So we think of John 17, that, that high priestly prayer of Christ. The author of this text says he prayed at length. It took two hours. Whom Chance. He prayed for everyone whom chance had brought him in contact with. Small, great, known and unknown, as well as the entire worldwide Catholic Church prays for everybody.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Anyone who had ever met, great or small, he thinks of all before he dies. Just as Christ on the cross, you know, remembers every single one of us, keeps us in mind. He. They put him on a donkey, like Christ rides a donkey. They took him into the city. He's put on trial by Herod and a father. So you think of Annas and Caiaphas, the father, the Father in law, he's examined. He's, you know, he's. He's put on trial, he's found guilty. They nail him to the wood, and then he expires. And a dove, the form of the dove comes out like the Spirit comes out. So there's lots of parallels in the text that the author notes between Polycarp's death and Christ's death.

[A]

Thank you. That is beautiful. And then I remember there's a Eucharistic theme as well. Towards the end, for some reason, they weren't going to put the beast on him, so instead they decided to light him on fire and. But the fire couldn't touch them or touch him.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

And then how did. Where's the Eucharist?

[B]

Yeah. No, so that's great. So I just think, like, it's such a great story because he's. They, they, they, they. They tie him to the tree. They tie him. They were going to nail him and they tie him to the stake instead. Bound with that, with his hands behind him. He was like a noble ram taken out of some great flock for sacrifice. A goodly burnt offering, all ready for God. Then he cast his eyes up to heaven and said. And he has this beautiful prayer. It sounds like the Roman Canon, it sounds like the Eucharistic prayer at Mass. Eucharistic prayer at Mass. So how many Sundays has he, how many days that he celebrated the Mass, the liturgy, and said these words over and over again? But the author wants us to show that he himself is the sacrifice. So he's the burnt offering, he's the ram. And he has this beautiful prayer of, you know, he offers himself and his anointing is long. I encourage you to read it. He says, I glorify you, the eternal High Priest in heaven, the beloved Son, Jesus Christ, through the Holy Spirit, now the ages of ages. Amen. And then, as you said, the kind of fire is forming an arc over him like a ship sail. And he looked not like a. There was in the center of it, not like a human being in flames, but like a loaf baking in the oven. Okay, so Ignatius of Antioch said, I want, when, you know, when it's his friend, when I die, I want them to be ground in the teeth of the beasts so I can turn into the wheat of God. Some very eucharistic images here. It's like he's baking in an oven and he's the bread that's being offered. So just as bread is transformed by his hands into Christ, or was, so his life is being transformed into an imitation of Christ, offering sacrifice.

[A]

Very eucharistic.

[B]

Very eucharistic. Yep.

[A]

Very practical for us as well in our day today. Not that we're going to be burned at the stake, I hope not. But like you were saying, how can we give of ourselves every day, you know, in those moment to moment sacrifices.

[B]

One of the most moving passages for me is how simply he shows up in the arena and a voice comes from heaven to him. Be strong, Polycarp. Play the man, be a man. And then he's put on trial. He's. He's in the trial and the governor says, just a little oath, not a big deal, just, you know, just sacrifice to the pagan gods. Not a big deal. And one of my favorite lines of all of like early Christian writing, Polycarp's reply was 8 and 6 years. So 86 years have I served him and he has done me no wrong. How then can I blaspheme my king and my savior? Wow, 86 years. He's only been done good. Yeah, Faithfulness to me. How can I at this moment be unfaithful to him?

[A]

That is beautiful.

[B]

And so an 86 year old man, you know, when he's trying to untie, he's trying to put his Slippers on, even the store, his sandals. He's too weak to do that. So think of an 86 year old man that's old even by today's standards. And he gives this beautiful witness of strength and vitality and courage. And his martyrdom.

[A]

That is beautiful. Thank you. My last favorite detail about his martyrdom is at the very beginning actually where his captors come to him and he gives them food and drink and he is hospitable to the men who are about to bring to his death. So that was really striking to me as we just look at the lives of the Apostolic Fathers. We are in that apostolic times today of what can we learn from these men and women that we can apply to our lives today as well?

[B]

Yeah, I think the thing that we can learn is faithfulness to God will be honored and God honors that. And it's a witness today we are, this is 155, 156ad we in the years 2000s, you know that the decade we're in now, we're still remembering this story. And one of the last lines of the letter is like, Share this letter, Share the story of Polycarp, Share the story of the martyrs so you can learn from the people that lived and followed in the footsteps of Christ. And so I think that's if we allow Christ to be king of our lives. We don't know the age in which we live. There's a saying that's ascribed to St. Thomas More. The times are never so bad that a good man or woman can't live in them. That no matter what challenges we face, he was facing persecution. It was illegal to be a Christian. They were hunting Christians down. And they not only had that, they had challenges of teachings within the church that were unclear and bishops that contradicted bishops and it was confusing. And he says, be faithful to the words of Christ. I know Christ. I know John, who knew Christ personally, and I know Christ personally in my own life. If you're faithful to him, he'll be faithful to you. He'll be your sure guide in life. And so that's, I think, one of the lessons we can learn from the martyrs.

[A]

Be faithful to the words of Christ. Thank you. Anything else you'd like to share about Saint Polycarp?

[B]

No, I read it. So Polycarp's name, I know it's not a name that we often hear. We don't name our kids. It means much fruit. So it's very Christian name because Christ says, you are my disciple if you bear much fruit. So you're my disciple? If you're Polycarp, I love it. Yeah.

[A]

Very, very beautiful. And the fruit he did bear as a martyr for the Church.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

We were so grateful. Well, Saint Polycarp, we asked for your intercession. Saint Polycarp, pray for us. Pray for us. Thanks for watching. You can watch these interviews in video format by visiting formed.org formed is an online Catholic streaming service created by the Augustine Institute and Ignatius Press with award winning studies and parish programs, inspiring audio content, movies, ebooks and family friendly kids programming to support the mission of the Augustan Institute. Please visit missioncircle.org. Imagine an audio drama that brings the whole family together, filled with adventure, heart and surprising twists and turns. Introducing welcome to Hope Springs, the new audio drama from the Augustin Institute. Here's a place for you to turn off the screen screen. Turn on your imagination and join a group of young friends whose adventures lead to times of laughter, courage and faith. Ready for the fun? Follow welcome to Hope Springs on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you're listening now.