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Change Your Brain Every Day
Dr. Josh Axe: The Most Important Diet You've Never Heard Of (Biblio Diet)
00:50:05
On this week's episode of Change Your Brain Every Day podcast, NY Times Bestselling Author Dr. Josh Axe sits down with the Amens to discuss his new research and book, The Biblio Diet. For more on Dr. Josh Axe's new book, visit:
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A
What did the characters in the Bible eat? And one of our most surprising things we get into one chapter on, it's called Solomon's Provisions and it actually details in the Bible what Solomon ate. Number one thing by far was meat. And it's red meat, loads of it. And it says even the amounts that he ate, the wisest man along with Jesus ever lived.
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B
Why do you think red meat is so demonized?
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A
There definitely is an element of as you and I do in our practices. Dr. Josh Axe is a doctor of natural medicine and Johns Hopkins University graduate. He's recognized as a leader in cellular.
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B
Medicine and is the host of the.
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C
Dr. Josh Axe Show.
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B
What are things people can eat based on the Bible but also your research?
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A
I mean, the most referenced thing in the Bible is meat, mostly lamb and beef. And so I think that's sort of the foundational thing is getting more protein, getting more grass fed wild animal meats. The secondary thing though is bread. I don't recommend bread for everybody. Again, the general population bread, if it's done right, I think is a great food.
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B
Meat, sourdough bread. What else can we eat?
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A
And then I would say the big focus is there is on.
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B
Every day. You are making your brain better or you are making it worse. Stay with us to learn how you can change your brain for the better every day.
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A
Autism.
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B
What is it? How do you know if you have. Autism's not one thing. It's many different things. There's so much to know about autism. It's not hard to understand. Hi, this is Dr. Daniel. Amen. I'm so excited to tell you about our new course, Healing A New Way Forward that I did with my friend and really autism expert, Dr. Jerry Cartsinel. Completely new look at autism. This course is for parents of children or adults who have autism, but it's also for professionals. We hope you'll join us with Healing Autism A New Way Forward. Well, you're in for a treat. I am so excited. Tana is excited to have Dr. Josh Axe on who's been on before. He's a doctor of natural medicine, chiropractor, nutritionist, who's dedicated his career to helping people heal through the power of food, herbs and lifestyle medicine. He holds a Master of Science and Leadership from Johns Hopkins University and is widely recognized as a leading expert in personalized nutrition, functional medicine and cellular healing. He is also the founder of Ancient Nutrition, the Health Institute and the Longevity Club and Clinic, pioneering new approaches in regenerative medicine and longevity. I have been on his show. He has been on mine. I'm a great fan of his and he has a new book with Jordan Rubin, the Biblio Diet, and is very timely, very important. Healing secrets from the Bible, Live Longer, Master metabolism, Reduce pain, Fight Depression, and Conquer Cancer. I'm just so excited.
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C
Me too.
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A
Yeah, thanks so much.
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B
So thanks for being here, being here in person. We're not talking to each other over the Internet.
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A
It's so much better, isn't it? Doing interviews in person. I just. It is, yeah. Well, when you guys are in Nashville next time I would love to do an interview in person.
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C
Oh, for sure.
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A
Be so fun. So, yeah, we were talking about all the people from California that are in Nashville now. You know, when I first moved to Nashville, the, the food was terrible there. I mean, I'm talking about the absolute worst food ever. And then over the last 20 years, it's been so. Because of all the people from California that have moved there to open restaurants.
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C
We have so many friends that have moved to Nashville and just love it. So, yeah, it's really sort of wild.
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B
So why this book and why now?
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A
Well, I think that one of the things that's happened over the past quite a few years is Jordan and I, as we've continued to read the Bible with sort of a lens of health, we've continued to have revelations and looking at certain things such as, you know, what are the most commonly eaten foods in the Bible? What are the most referenced foods? What are, you know, I think we had this big wave of Paleo going through which is based more on evolutionary sort of thought. And Jordan and I are both more creationists and looking at, okay, well, what are the differences there? And then another thing I would just say too, in the book, we cover a lot about foods using food as medicine based on what are some of those foods in the Bible. But the other thing we really get into, and I know that this is something I so appreciate about you guys and your work, is health is body, mind and spirit. And I've had so many patients over the years where, yes, their diet is hurting their health, but I believe that what's even more important than the food you eat is your spiritual health and your mindset. You know, like I've had patients with irritable bowel disease and I remember when I was early in practice and you know, you know this because you've done this so many times. But you know, they would come in and we would get them gluten free, dairy free, eating a good diet, and then their IBD would go away. But Then they would maybe go and eat a whole pizza or tub of ice cream or whatever, and they would have a big flare up from dairy or wheat or something like that. But then sometimes I would really have their diet dialed in and they would come in with a flare up and they'd been eating perfectly. I'm like, well, what's going on? And it was stress. It was something like a divorce or loss of a loved one or work stress or something, or worrying about their kids. And that was really causing issues. So overall, I think that if people are gonna heal, one of the things that I do, and I know you do as well, is putting together a full protocol of diet supplementation, but also spiritual growth, taking care of childhood trauma. You know, those sort of things are so important. The Bible, I think, has answers to almost all of these things or can at least put you in the right position there. And I think it's the greatest health book ever written. So I really wanted to write a book about what does the Bible say about nutrition, about herbs, about, you know, lifestyle practices, even fasting when it comes to healing.
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C
Well, one of the things I was talking to you about just before we started the podcast, I found this so interesting because I went to Loma Linda. That's where went to school, and I worked there for a long time. And I thought it was the weirdest place when I first started there, the Seventh Day Adventist. I'm Christian, but not Seventh Day Adventist. And I'm like, okay, there's no meat, there's no caffeine. Like, what is wrong with these people? How am I supposed to get through nursing school without a giant. Without a giant thermos of cat, you know, my coffee every day. And it was just such a weird thing to me that these people ate, like they believe in this life of temperance is what they call it. So. And it was temperance, meaning psychosocial, you know, mind, body, spirit, and all of it together. So it's biopsychosocial, spiritual. And as I was working there, I remember I was on a trauma unit and I was took in a surgical ICU patient. Something happened in surgery, but this patient was 101 and with no significant medical history and one medication. And I'm like, okay, I have three medications, and I was 30. So I was like, I'm confused right now. No wrinkles on their face. And that's when it started to dawn on me. There's something to. So I was talking to you before we came in here because I'm like, is this similar to sort of like that idea, because the Seventh Day Adventists are very much about like sort of Old Testament, but they. Yeah, how is it different?
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A
Yes, so. So I think that one, we look at the Bible through both the lens of the New Testament and the Old Testament. We also wanted to look at kind of what, what is the progression of, of what the Bible says about food. And we wanted to kind of look at things cumulatively because one of the things that's happened with biblical diets at some point is I think a lot of times people will take one thing and focus in on it, which can be great. You know, I know that there's been a diet that's talked about the Bible that was. That's a vegan diet because it's focused on what did they eat in the Garden of Eden. And there's been sort of other things there. But we looked at number one. Okay. In the Garden of Eden, we believe that was what we'd call a perennial food forest or regenerative food forest. So they were probably eating a lot of fruit, nuts, certain vegetables. So they weren't tilling the land yet. So we know there was that after that, when they were cast out of Eden, is when they probably started doing grains. Genesis 9. 3. God tells Noah and his sons, you know, you can eat these foods that are creeping and crawling on the ground, and you can eat meat now. And then we know Moses gives out the food laws, including no pork, no shellfish, which we believe isn't healthy today either. And then there's a sort of new light, I think, that we read about in the New Testament where, you know, 1 Corinthians 10:31, where Paul says, whether you eat, drink, or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God. And I actually think that's probably the cornerstone of the biblio diet is this sort of mindset in viewing your body as a temple, doing everything you can to honor him with your body. And also, I think we believe when we talk about in the book is like, everybody's a unique individual. You know, like, I know this. Like, if I have a patient with, if I am working somebody with cancer, dietarily in somebody with inflammatory bowel disease, the diets tend to be pretty different. I mean, ibd, I have them and do almost all soup, a lot of really well cooked foods, a lot of ginger, herbal tea, those sort of things. And the person with cancer, depending on the type of its brain, maybe it's more keto, but if it's something else, we might juice vegetables, we might do Less meat, more if and if we do it, it's a lot of salmon and liver, those sort of things. So. So I think there's that element there as well. And then there's fasting. You know, today intermittent fasting is pretty popular, and I like it more for men, generally speaking. I think that some people can benefit from it. I think certain women that have, let's say, dispositions that keep their body colder or major hormone fluctuations, you know, I. I typically don't recommend it for them always. But biblical fasting, here's what's interesting. Like, if you look at the early church, they didn't do intermittent fasting as much, but what they did is they took either Wednesday or Friday or both days, and they would not do breakfast and lunch and they would eat dinner. And so for them, it was more cyclical in terms of doing it once a week, twice a week, or seasonally, like a Daniel plan like you wrote about in your book. And so anyways, but we dive into all this in the Bible and really start getting in the book and really dive into. And here's another thing that's interesting. Like, what did the characters in the Bible eat? And one of our most surprising things we get into one chapter on, it's called Solomon's Provisions. And it actually details in the Bible what Solomon and ate. And it was basically, number one thing by far was meat. And it's red meat, loads of it. And it says, even the amounts that he ate. And then he had, you know, bread and fruit and things like that, but his diet was primarily meat. The wisest man, along with Jesus, never lived. So some pretty interesting, you know, facts in the Bible when it comes to diet, nutrition and healing.
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B
So why do you think red meat is so demonized? Is it because it's commercially raised with antibiotics and hormones? I often tell my patients, if you have low ferritin or low iron, you probably should be eating healthy, healthily raised red meat. If I tend to have high ferritin, which promotes aging, and I'm like, I probably should not have a lot of it because it's so iron rich.
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A
Yeah, so. And again, I think there's this blend of, that we even get into in the book of sort of the general recommendations for the population as a whole. And then there definitely is an element of, as you and I do in our practices of really honing in based on that individual's needs. But I think that, you know, we cover certain foods in this book that are most referenced in the Bible that are also so radically different. Today than they were back then. I mean, the biggest being dairy, second biggest being grain, grain and bread specifically. And Jesus ate bread, but the grain.
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C
Was not the same.
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A
Yeah, not at all. And to your point, with red meat, I think there's several things we're looking at there. By the way, I think there's so much confusion about things like red meat and other foods because so many of these studies are not done correctly or not. They're not referencing things correctly. Like I read a study on studies and it came out and said essentially 50, 50% of studies are incorrect. Like, like grossly incorrect because they're either cherry picking data or they're funded by somebody who has just such a, a major interest in trying to, you know, lean it in one direction. But you know, people today have said, don't eat red meat. And it's like, well, what red meat are you talking about the conventional or the, or the grass fed? You know, we've all heard the principle, you are what you eat, but the reality is you are what you eat. What they ate, and even beyond what they ate, their lifestyle, were they out in the sun, were they stressed? I mean, these animals. And so, you know, we know, I mean the most, you know, basic fact, and you were one of the first people to probably ever talk about this. But These ratios of Omega 3s to Omega 6s based on if animals grass fed or grain fed, but there's a lot more that goes into it. Is it organic? You know, is there estradiol and some of these other chemicals and hormones in the meat and dairy supply? Were they fed GMO feeds? You know, this is also affecting things like cla, conjugated linoleic acid. I was writing, in writing the book, another thing I got into is it even affects the amino acid ratios per calorie. It changes things. Like red meat is higher in carnosine, taurine, CoQ10, especially in the organ meat heart, if it's grass fed versus grain fed. So there it is, just a radically different food, the commercial versus the ancient. And one thing we don't talk about much and I don't know that I have a perfect solution for this, but the Bible has biblical slaughter methods that we actually think matter as well. So there's just a, I mean, there's.
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C
A reason they documented it.
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A
Yeah, exactly.
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C
It's not in there by chance.
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A
That's right, yeah. Yeah, I totally agree. So I think for many people, red meat is a healing food. I think there's a lot of women that even though their blood work might show iron or ferritin slightly low in Chinese medicine. It's something they look at way more with women than men. Men tend to can have higher, women can tend to be lower statistically. But we call it a blood deficiency. And so, and especially a woman that's pregnant, I think some postpartum depression is a placenta is basically blood and collagen. I mean it's basically blood and collagen and breast milk. You're actually using up some blood as well. So I think there's a lot of conditions where, especially with women where they could use a lot more red meat.
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B
So talk about the foundation of the biblio diet. What are things people can eat based on the Bible but also your research?
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A
Yeah, I would say so as a food and a animal. I mean the most referenced thing in the Bible is meat and it's red meat. It's a lot of, it's, it's, it's mostly lamb and beef. So, so that's referenced the most. And so I think that's sort of the foundational thing is getting more protein, getting more grass fed wild animal meats.
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C
You're going to live forever eats lamb.
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A
Yeah, it's fantastic. We don't actually, I mean lamb is not sold that much, so. Okay. Oh, there you go. Well, that's, that answers that. So, so I think that's the biggest thing. The secondary thing though is bread. And bread is so different today versus back then and even how it's, how it's processed. One, we know ancient grains are very different. Right. I've heard you guys talk about Einkorn and there's more of the ancient barley and rye that are references grains in the Bible. But they would have harvested that when it was actually ripe. They would have then sometimes soaked it and laid it out in the sun and let it sprout. They would have then taken that which is going to, you know, kill the phytic acid, this sort of mineral binder or enzyme inhibitor that's going to then allow you to absorb more of the nutrients that are actually in it. And then, and then most often they would do a fermentation process and turning it into a sourdough bread. And so your, your absorption of everything in there is going to be incredibly high. And I think for most of us, like I, you know, I don't recommend bread for everybody. Again, if I have somebody with cancer or certain other conditions that are, we're really trying to limit any inflammation possible. I may not have them do bread. But for the most part, for the general Population bread, if it's done right, I think is a great food. And then it's so.
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B
So where do you get it done?
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A
Right, yeah, so. So my first answer is this something.
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B
You can go to Safeway and.
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A
No, no.
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C
We have a place near us that does real sourdough bread, and you watch them making it right in front of you, and it has to be bought that day. And like that I can tolerate. I can't tolerate a lot of bread other than that type.
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A
Exactly. So I think so. So my wife is friends with Carrie Underwood. You guys know, this famous musician, and she was making it in 2020 during COVID and, you know, I mean, homesteading just blew up. Then people, you know, garden now doing their own home gardens in sourdough. And Chelsea had reached out and said, hey, I saw you're doing sourdough. And she's like, oh, yeah, here's how to do it. And so my wife has started making. So she's made it a lot, but it may not be as popular. I don't know about California, but I will tell you, in the south, so many people now are making their own sourdough at home. Here's the thing. The learning to do it the first week is hard, but then after that, it's not hard at all. And then there are so many more bakeries popping up of people making sourdough bread. So I think it's a lot more readily available. Like if you go to Whole Foods Market or Sprouts or most of these stores, there's actually a brand, I think it's called, and maybe called Rudy's, but they do actually a sourdough spelt, so you can buy that there. So. So you can actually find it in the frozen bread section of certain places. So. So, I mean, there are places you can get, you know, true, true sourdough today, of course, Europe, it's everywhere.
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C
But, yeah, it's so interesting.
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A
Yeah. Yeah.
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B
Okay, so we have meat, sourdough bread.
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A
Yeah.
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B
What else can we eat?
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A
And then I would say the big focus is there is on fruits and vegetables and healthy fats. You know, two of the most referenced foods in the Bible. Olive oil is the next most popular food referenced. It's referenced over 60 times in the Bible. And then if you count something called the holy anointing oil, which they use topically, then it's over 100. So olive oil is referenced a lot. I don't need to tell you about olive oil. We'll just, you know, I'll hit on the kind of fine Points for the audience here. But I truly think it's the single best oil people can consume for longevity. I mean, it's high in polyphenols. I think generally speaking, I mean there were. I remember about 10 years ago an article came out or a study saying due to its lower smoke point, olive oil is not ideal. But then when you've looked at more, there's two studies that are more recent that have said that, well, even though it might smoke it actually because of its polyphenol and antioxidant content, it's actually one of the best oils to actually cook with on low and medium temperatures.
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C
So I've gone back to cooking with it at lower. Like as long as I'm not frying something, I use it on like every.
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B
Time you fried something.
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A
Exactly, yeah. So. So. So in our household, I mean, I think that's the best, best oil to use period for, for, for everybody. So a lot of extra virgin olive oil is a big, big part referenced throughout the Bible in terms of a diet. And then fruit wise, pomegranates are referenced the next most. And you know this as well. But there are some great studies on allegic acid and pomegranates. And some of this is based on the health of your gut microbiome, but it's conversion to urolith and A. The cool thing about it is it not only converts to urolithin A, it can convert to urolithin A, B, C, D and E. And these are really powerful compounds that support mitochondrial biogenesis, so creating more mitochondria. And those are like the batteries of your cells which then run your body. And so for a lot of people, they're sick today, especially with chronic fatigue syndrome, hypothyroidism or anybody struggling with low energy, one of the greatest things you can do is start to strengthen up your mitochondrial health.
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B
Buy new pomegranates.
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A
Yeah, yeah. And pomegranates are amazing for that. And then the next most referenced fruit are figs and they're high in an enzyme called fison, which act as an enzyme that help you break down food better, eliminates senescent cells from your body, which is great for aging as well. So that's a big part of it. And then vegetables, bitter herbs are referenced quite frequently in the Bible there as well. And so you know, those are some of the biggest. The last one to dairy, salt and honey. The Bible talks about if you are in a living in abundance, you know, living in a land flowing of milk and honey. And this is probably the food that's the most different. Grain is probably second. But dairy's number one dairy, drank during the Bible in ancient times was all a two dairy. So genetically the cows didn't have this variation today that a lot of it has, which is inflammatory. It was raw, it was organic, and in most cases, because they didn't have refrigeration, it was fermented. So you're getting loads and loads of. It's like the ultimate probiotic supplement. So it was a very, very different food then than it is today. You know, Jordan Rubin, my co author, he healed himself of ulcerative colitis and Crohn's disease. And the number one food he ate, almost the only thing he was raw goat's milk kefir. And some people will tell you, hey, if you have IBS or IBD or Crohn's or colitis, do not have any dairy. But it was literally the. About the only thing he ate that. Some carrot juice. He did. He did a little bit of fruit like blueberries and wild sockeye salmon and I think a couple other things. And that's how. That's how he reversed Crohn's and colitis.
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C
So, Josh, I'm assuming you're. You talk about personalizing some of these diets because if people have certain health issues, if they, if they've had cancer or if they have insulin resistance or diabetes or. You have to personalize this to some degree.
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A
100%. Yeah, absolutely. Again, if somebody's diabetic, they're going to be much more carb conscious. So we're going to do higher meat, higher fat, higher fiber foods. And. And that's going to be the bigger focus. And then again, depending upon. Yeah, it's going to be. It is going to vary based on the person. So I think in the book, what we really get into is, number one, here are the foods and the benefits and the diet that most people benefit from. But also, there is a level if you have a specific severe condition you do want to personalize. Absolutely.
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B
I wear a continuous glucose monitor to track how food affects my brain. When blood sugar is stable, I'm focused and clear. When it's not, I'm tired, irritable, and craving sugar. That's why I take balance my blood sugar from brain md. It supports healthy glucose levels so I can think clearly and feel my best. Try it@brainmd.com with code podcast. 20 for 20% off.
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C
And what are the things that are, would you say, when you think of foods that Are like not part of this plan. What would you say are the number one things to avoid or the top things to avoid?
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A
Well, during that time, and I do want to also say this. One of the things I've thought about, I've actually thought about this for like, so for 20 some years I've thought about if Moses were here today re giving the food laws, what would make it and what wouldn't, you know, so it's interesting to think about. I don't think food dies because they're not even a food. I don't think that high fructose corn syrup would make it. But overall the foods you want to stay away from. And again, there's some debate about this in the Christian community, but this is Jordan and I's perspective based on reading the Bible and what we think. Pork and shellfish, you know, pork is the number. I've looked this up. Pork is the number one food people get parasites from. It is, you know, they eat their own feces. They are, I mean, I had a cousin, just to tell you a quick story. He's a big time hunter, constantly hunting. And I mean, you know, I remember I was going to his house for one Thanksgiving and He had like 12 squirrels like that. He, I mean he eats squirrel. He eats everything. So, but, but he had went on a hunting trip and he was my roommate for a little bit in college and went on a hunting trip and killed a wild boar. So this is wild. Wild. It wasn't even in a farm. It was wild. He turned it into sausage, put it in the freezer. And then for every day for like a month, he was, he was cooking this up really well cooked in oil and eating it for breakfast. And then he was walking around with his shirt off and he had this like yellow lesion like all over his back like this. And I'm like, hey, what's going on there? And he's like, I don't know. It happened a few days ago. Started breaking out all over me. I'm like, I think you have a parasitic infection. And it was, and it was so bad, it was like having like things all over his skin break out. And so all that being said, I think pork is very unhealthy. I think that again, a big part of it is due to parasites. And we just know they're scavengers. Their digestive systems are actually more like humans. And so they store toxins, they have a harder time detoxifying and so they're going to hold on to that. And, and we're Going to experience that when they ate their.
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C
I've actually seen taking care of patients with parasites in their brain from improperly prepared fork.
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A
Yeah. So my cousin, who's a doctor, he. He was a missionary in India and Pakistan and he just a year ago was diagnosed with glioblastoma. I mean, you know, a glioblastoma diagnosis gives you almost no chance to live less than 1% over five years. And it's been well over a year. And he's doing incredibly well. They believe he got the brain tumor from the glioblastoma because parasitic infections from all those years doing missionary work. And so. But all that being said, it's, you know, as you said in I also this is amazing. I read a study on how if you have a parasite, your risk of cancer goes up so dramatically.
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C
Yeah, I heard that.
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A
Especially brain because your bodies have to expend so much energy dealing with the parasite and what it's doing to your. Why shellfish? And then shellfish, a very similar thing. They're bottom feeders. They're holding on to more toxins as well. There are, there's an article, I want to say it came out, it's maybe the New York Times, this is quite a few years ago, but it was referencing a study that it's the dirtiest food in the sea when they compared it to fish and all other seafood life that we consume highest in one compound called dioxins. But. But very, very high in.
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C
No more crowd shock.
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B
Bummer. So, yeah, so Jesus fed the masses fish bread. Bread, yeah. What about fish?
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A
So huge fan of fish. I mean, fish is a, you know, in the Old Testament, the most referenced food is beef and lamb. In the New Testament, the most referenced food is fish. And is fish is so, you know, constantly referenced. And so I mean, again, you've talked about this so frequently, but it's just, you know, the benefits, especially a fatty fish of the omega threes, they're just the ease of digestibility of fish is. Is just, you know, incredibly beneficial. Of course, certain fish, like salmon, there's other benefits of things like astaxanthin. But I mean, it's an incredible healing food that's definitely prioritized on that, you know, on that, on that diet. So. And I would say, you know, I mean, there, there are some crossover sort of things in terms of like a Mediterranean diet is probably the things it's closest to. Somebody asked me today, like, how's it different than a kosher diet? I think, you know, I, I know a kosher Diet really does not prioritize or look much at organic or grass fed or any of those things. So it's sort of different. And that's right. And then I think preparation, Mediterranean diet. The difference is probably there's still an emphasis on red meat where the Mediterranean diet probably wouldn't do that. And maybe even bread and even things like honey maybe to a degree there as well. Salt's referenced a lot as well. In fact, this is interesting to know when we cover this in there, like the, the word salary comes from salt. People actually used to be paid in salt. That's amazing. I mean just, you know that. Yeah.
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B
And so what's the thought on salt?
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A
You know, I, I think sprinkling salt on food has loads of benefits for, for hydration. Especially when you look at the salts that are mined from clay or from the ocean, they're going to be high in minerals. In fact, a lot of these salts have around 80 different minerals in them. Of course, sodium is by far the most, but a lot of them have, some of them have a significant amount of potassium in them. So there's, you know, so, so there are benefits of salt. I, I, I know that there are some people who are, it's like the more salt the better. Again, I think it's very personalized. If you are sweating a lot, moving a lot, you probably need more salt.
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C
But if not, I'm a person who craves salt. But I also have low blood pressure and I've often wondered if that's why.
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A
Yeah, yeah. I'm actually similar. I've had low blood pressure as well. So I think using salt wisely and I think it's very similar to honey. In the proverbs it says use a little honey, not too much. So, so, so we just abused everything. Yeah.
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C
Fermented food.
- [30:04]
A
Yeah, yeah. They recommend the yogurt's reference. Cheese curds are referenced as well. In fact, there's a time in with Abraham when two angels and then it says the angel of the Lord is visiting Abraham and what they feed these angels is lamb, fermented cheese curds and Brett.
- [30:27]
B
Saffron. Is it mentioned?
- [30:30]
A
You know, I don't think it is. And here's one other thing.
- [30:34]
B
I love saffron. It's my favorite spice.
- [30:38]
A
Saffron, you know, I mean that was used much more in ayurvedic medicine. So, so this is interesting too. I have a friend of mine who's Jewish and Jordan and I had the same experience. He went on a trip to Israel and he came back and I said, you know, I was talking to a friend of mine who's from Israel. He's an acupuncturist. And he told me that in the Bible there's this reference of Abraham sent his wife Katara east with their sons with gifts. Sent them east. And Katara, some people believe it's hagar, some of them don't. But katara actually means incense. And so many people, many people that are Jewish who have studied history believe that the gifts they gave Katara and the sons were Ayurvedic and Chinese medicine principles and in herbal medicine.
- [31:26]
C
Interesting.
- [31:27]
A
Yeah, it is pretty interesting. So the Bible references a lot more and there's a chance it's referenced once. I'm trying to think back in the Book of Proverbs, but overall they're referencing a lot more of these culinary herbs that are more you'd find in the Middle east or Italy. But. But yeah, I mean, saffron, I mean, maybe the most amazing herb for mental health and sleep.
- [31:51]
C
Yes, for sure.
- [31:52]
A
It's so incredible. But yeah. And the other thing too, I think about a biblio diet. I think the Bible gives us a framework of what's healthy. But I think that some of the superfoods in the Bible, sometimes you have to kind of look at those based on your genetic makeup and where your ancestors are from, because let's say you're in Japan. Okay. You know, somebody is going to probably do better with rather than bread. Maybe it's rice, maybe it's purple sweet potatoes for generations. That's in seaweed. Right. And so I think that you can kind of take some of that. And maybe the superfood in your area based on your genes isn't pomegranate. Maybe it's goji berries. If you grew up in.
- [32:35]
B
So my ancestry.com is right in the Middle east, dried Lebanon, North Africa, Egypt, Israel. So probably this because would be a perfect well. And that's what you like for me.
- [32:51]
A
Totally.
- [32:52]
B
And that's what I like.
- [32:53]
A
Yeah. All right.
- [32:54]
B
The big question.
- [32:55]
A
Yeah.
- [32:56]
B
What about wine?
- [32:58]
A
So. So. So wine is referenced a lot in the Bible.
- [33:02]
B
Eight times. Like 80 times for bad, 30 times for good.
- [33:09]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [33:10]
B
It's like the first mention of wine is Noah the plants a vineyard after the flood.
- [33:16]
A
Yeah.
- [33:17]
B
And then he gets drunk and then. And then causes generational destruction.
- [33:23]
A
Yeah, that's kind of like. So.
- [33:26]
C
So it seems like the theme here is when you abuse it, it's a problem.
- [33:29]
A
Yeah. I 100 think that's what it is. You know, it's Interesting.
- [33:34]
C
Don't sleep with your daughter. I think that was the thing.
- [33:36]
A
Exactly. I was going to say it's like a really very clear. Scandalous. Scandalous as you can get. So. So I think we've all experienced this. I think that that wine is, is, Is very personalized and more is not better. I think for most people, you know, they could handle doing a glass or two a week. But I think if you're going over that, I think there are some people who can't and even that. So, So I think it really depends on. You know, there's a time in the book of Timothy where Paul tells Timothy, drink a little bit of new wine, you know, for your stomach ailments and new wine. I don't know if it's just wine or if it's just a small amount. Almost like we do apple cider vinegar today. Almost like a shot glass of something like that for, for the health benefits. And so again.
- [34:19]
C
And they had so many issues with their water with heavy bacteria. And so that would make sense back then.
- [34:24]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, I mean, it's going to support stomach acid, which is also even going to help with things like parasites and microbes and creating a less friendly environment for those. So. Yeah, yeah, I think so. But yeah, I mean, the wine thing is so interesting because I, you know, Jesus took a Nazarite vow, so most of his life he never drank wine. Now I think we do see at the Last Supper, I mean, maybe he did again. I don't know that for sure. But we know all the disciples did. We know we take communion today. One other thing we talk about in the Bible or in the book here is we call communion the meal that heals in terms of. Because you're, you know, I, it. I believe that there's something that happens when we pray for our food, when we do communion to where there's a level of sort of transformation of, of our body even reacting differently. And I could even share this. So there is a, A, A professor or researcher at Stanford. Her name is Aliyah Crump, and she did a study on milkshakes. I thought this was so interesting. And basically they had two groups of people. One group, they said, okay, this thing you're getting, it's a very, very high calorie shake. And another group, she said, it's a very low calorie shake. And the group that thought it was a low calorie shake, they were eating more and more and more throughout the day. And the other group said, I'm just so full I don't need to eat. Some of them would skip lunch. And then at the end of the study, they found out that both shakes were the exact same. They just believed one way or the other. I mean, we know that.
- [35:55]
C
That reminds me of the study they did where they. That they put. They had thought. They were thinking and sort of meditating on the water. Do you know what I'm talking about? And the crystals formed. Yes, very interesting.
- [36:06]
A
Yeah. So, I mean, I think there's an element of. Now listen, I don't think we can take a Double cheeseburger from McDonald's and fries and like, you know, get rid of the acrylamide. Like turn that. Yeah, exactly. Turn that into essentially a pomegranate and a salmon fillet.
- [36:23]
C
So I don't pray away the acrylamide.
- [36:25]
A
Exactly. Yeah. I don't know that it works like that, but I do believe that something powerful and positive happens.
- [36:34]
C
Well, our thoughts are important. Our thoughts have.
- [36:37]
A
You know what's interesting too? I mean, Jesus never says, eat this or don't eat this. But he does say several times, it's your faith that's healed you. There's a woman that's bleeding for many, many years. And he says, it's your faith. And then around Lazarus during that time, after he helps resurrect him, he says, it's your belief if you believe. So I mean, that's the most powerful form of medicine. I mean, you guys have looked at so many studies around the placebo effect as well. So there's that component, but it's the belief in faith. It's a.
- [37:08]
B
So what's your hope for this book?
- [37:12]
A
My hope is that people realize that the Bible is the greatest book ever written on health. I've written books. You've written books. And by the way, your books are amazing. I mean, you've New York Times bestseller so many times, but I think the Bible still has greater wisdom and insight.
- [37:30]
C
The Bible is better than your book.
- [37:32]
A
You know, you can be. Reminds me of.
- [37:34]
C
You're not gone.
- [37:35]
A
You can be number two. Number two. So. But, but I.
- [37:39]
B
No, no. There's a funny story here. We have to say now we have.
- [37:43]
C
To like, bring it up.
- [37:44]
B
We're in Hong Kong. Some people help support our foundation. They're very wealthy family. I saw like 40 of them in their family. And so we're having dinner at the grandpa's house, and he's drunk, talking about wine. Drunk, drunk, drunk. And all of a sudden he stands up and announces, everybody, you are not.
- [38:13]
C
God for no reason. And I started laughing. I'm like, I could have told you that.
- [38:19]
B
And when we went back to the hotel, my mom, my 80 year old mother is there, she's now 93. My 80 year old mother is there and she just, she's in the elevator. She's so disappointed. She goes, my son is not gone. And it would deadband funny stairs. And so every once in a while I like to remind him I'm not God. And it's a fascinating discussion about how what was written thousands of years ago.
- [38:55]
A
Yeah.
- [38:56]
B
Still, it's still relevant to us today.
- [38:59]
A
Yeah.
- [38:59]
B
And yeah, the Daniel plan was actually not named after me. It was named after the prophet in the Old Testament who wouldn't eat the king's bad food. And his jailer is like, no, you need to eat this because you're gonna look bad. And he's go, give me 10 days. Yeah, just vegetables and water. And within those 10 days he looked better than everybody else did.
- [39:24]
A
Yeah.
- [39:25]
B
Perhaps it was because of his own metabolism.
- [39:29]
A
Yeah, yeah, it could be because a.
- [39:31]
B
Lot of people use that as.
- [39:36]
A
Story.
- [39:36]
B
That it's why you shouldn't eat meat.
- [39:38]
A
Yes.
- [39:38]
C
But I don't think that's.
- [39:39]
B
But if you, if you take the whole.
- [39:41]
C
But they were also getting bunk and.
- [39:42]
B
They were a lot of meat.
- [39:44]
A
Oh, oh, yeah. Again, I think it's the most referenced thing in, in the Bible in terms of a food. So yeah, it's very, very, very meat driven. You know, I also think there's an element of even our lifestyle today though, that people are so active and busy and stressed. And not to say there was less stress, I think stress back then, but I think there's a, there's a level of, you know, B vitamins are very high in, in meat and I think you need those to sort of deal with stress and excess toxins. So I think maybe there's even a, you know, there could be an argument for, for a greater need today. You know, another thing with the Bible, like I, with this, the reason we wrote this book is I just, I also wanted people to really understand like living by God's design. You know, God designed us to live in a certain way. We get into things in there, like when the sun goes up, we should get up. When it goes down, we should be going down. Like there's so many things that we've sort of missed in our modern world today that the Bible has really incredible answers for. Here's another one. The Bible is the greatest book ever written on agriculture. I mean, it talks about letting the land Rest every seven years. Sometimes you need to really kind of look deeper into it, but when you do, it's like, whoa, you know. And the other thing is, Jordan and I studied this. So one of the most popular types of farming today, regenerative agriculture, and along with that is called permaculture. It's creating a food forest. So rather than monocropping, where we're releasing carbon and damaging the soil and the nutrients there, perennial foods you do not have to replant. So annual crops like corn and soy and wheat, every year you have to replant them. You don't have to replant a walnut tree, an apple tree, a BlackBerry bush. And so what we believe the type of farming done back then was tending to, not digging up, because that's, that's what they talk about in Genesis is Adam was tending to the plants, shaping them, being an artist, kind of helping them grow in that way. So, so that was happening. And then you have the animals going in and out around the, these plants, defecating, urinating, building the soil so where the topsoil was thick and deep. Jordan actually did statistics of where you can feed so many more people if you're just patient and do regenerative agriculture versus the monocropping we do today. I mean, you could feed the entire world in, in, in, in a really a fairly small amount of land.
- [42:02]
B
Corn is actually not in the Bible, is it?
- [42:05]
A
I don't think it's referenced at all. It's wild, not, not that I can.
- [42:09]
C
I don't think it is either.
- [42:11]
B
And it's generally not healthy for us.
- [42:14]
C
Has the worst fatty acid profile.
- [42:15]
A
Right? Yeah, yeah, it's not great.
- [42:17]
B
So interesting.
- [42:18]
A
So, so we, we were corrected and I kind of, I, I knew this in the back of my head and it's just sort of a mind laugh. So yeah. Saffron referenced in the Song of Psalms. And so your favorite herb is referenced in the Bible.
- [42:31]
B
Love that. It is so good. We have so many great testimonials with our product, Happy Saffron.
- [42:40]
A
That's awesome.
- [42:40]
B
Saffron, zinc and curcumin. And I don't know if you know, but there's this review out on 17, 000 patients. 192 studies. What are the supplements that actually work for depression?
- [42:55]
A
I, I, I read the study. Saffron was number one.
- [42:57]
B
Saffron was number one.
- [42:59]
A
Yeah.
- [42:59]
B
And I added, so it was good intuition on my part. Zinc and curcumin. And zinc and curcumin. Independently made antidepressants. More effective.
- [43:09]
A
Wow.
- [43:10]
B
And so was great. Sammy was number two and I love Sammy. So on. So make America healthy again. I was in Washington D.C. and a month before the election speaking at the Integrative Medicine for Mental Health conference. And I never talk politics because if you're blue, I want to help you. If you're red, I want to help you. I just, they all believe the same. But, but I said publicly in front of these thousand people, I said if the current administration stays, not one good thing is going to happen for your health. Yeah, I said, but if there's a new administration, we're going to have a big discussion.
- [43:53]
A
Yeah.
- [43:54]
B
About health. And there was a new administration and I think that is in fact happening. We, I mean, I've been invited to the White House. A bunch of you are going to Washington. It's the people who believe what we believe.
- [44:11]
A
Yes, right.
- [44:12]
B
Just like in this book, that food is medicine or food is poison. That our chronic mental health, physical health epidemic is related in large part to what we put in our bodies.
- [44:29]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I absolutely agree and I know that you and I have been some of the first proponents for 20 some years. You for way longer of, of you.
- [44:38]
C
Just said you were old.
- [44:39]
A
Well, you know, I didn't, you know, but I am, you know, in Eastern cultures that's a sign of, you know, it's wisdom, it's a compliment there, so.
- [44:52]
B
But also likely going to heaven sooner, but not if I can help it.
- [44:56]
A
So all that being said, I, yeah, I'll tell you what. I was so elated when RFK Jr. Specifically was able to be the head of the HHS because I had heard him speak. We spoke together quite a few years ago at the Autism one conference and got to have some conversations with him. And I was just always so impressed and blown away that he just cared so much. I mean, he really cared and that's so rare. I mean, I'm not saying some politicians don't care, but he cared more than anyone I had ever met about autism, about adhd, about just cancer, about people getting, getting people healthy. And so, just amazing. And so, yeah, you know what? I. He has, he's got his hands full. I mean, there are so many aent things he's trying to drive forward. He's actually got some criticism over that he kind of went after food dies first, but he's just trying to get low hanging fruit or changing Coca Cola from high fructose corn syrup to cane sugar. Listen, these are worthwhile changes. Are there bigger things that need to happen. Totally. I mean, the reason why most people are so sick today, it's empty calories and it's over. Consuming sugar and inflammatory fats. I mean, those are. Those things are really processed foods. It's a processed foods. And so somehow we need to find a way to incentivize and deincentivize the level of processing of our foods today. Maybe, I mean, added sugar I think is probably the biggest problem overall. And so there's some issues there. But I mean, he wants to help regulate peptides and create a path for those, legalize raw milk stem cell therapy to where you can culture your own cells and use those as medicine here in the United States. I mean, so there are a lot of things I know that he is working on and going after, and I'm a huge fan. Yeah.
- [46:47]
B
And it's not a red or blue issue.
- [46:50]
A
No.
- [46:50]
B
I mean, you know, he tends to work, you know, for the Trump administration, but God bless them for seeing this as an important issue.
- [46:59]
A
Yeah.
- [46:59]
B
And, you know, whoever our president is, we should pray for them and root for them to do well. And all the negativity is clearly bad for your brain. It's bad for your nervous system.
- [47:14]
A
Yep.
- [47:14]
B
So thank you so much for being on our program. The new book, the Biblio, I'm looking.
- [47:20]
C
Forward to reading it.
- [47:21]
B
It is out September 16th and I think you will just love it. And we love Dr. Axe and we're just grateful that he is our friend. Thank you so much for watching Change youe Brain every day. Leave us a comment, question, or a review. Subscribe, share it with a friend. And where can people find you? I mean, you have a great website. There's so much you do.
- [47:50]
A
Yeah, I would say probably the top place is my podcast. It's the Dr. Josh Axe Show. I'm gonna have you as a guest on soon. And then if you're in Nashville in person. So that's my hope. But yeah, the Dr. Josh Ax show podcast on YouTube and where podcasts are found. And then I would say also, yeah, people can check out the book, the Biblio Diet. It's on Amazon bookstores nationwide. And then outside of that, I mean, I have a virtual practice. We focus a lot on hormone conditions in a lot of women, that sort of thing. But overall, those are probably the best social media. You know, I'm pretty active on Instagram, but just the usual places. But thanks so much. This is such an honor. I love, you know, one of the things I've always loved about talk to talking to you is that you have such a just a depth of knowledge on these topics and so I always learn from you every time we get to have a conversation too. So thanks so much for having me.
- [48:43]
B
Every thought, every decision, every success is created by your brain. And the one thing I've learned from looking at over 250,000 brain scans over the last 30 years is that you are not stuck with the brain you have have. You can make it better and I can prove it. This is why I created brain fit life 5.0 to help you assess your brain and then help you optimize it by knowing your brain type and giving you access to the tools you need to have a better brain and a better life. It includes a few 30 day happiness challenge, brain and mental health trackers, hypnosis, audios, brain enhancing music and tools to conquer stress and anxiety. You can feel better, think sharper and live happier. Go to the App Store and download brain fit life 5.0 today.