Mariel Hemingway: Breaking Generational Trauma Before It Breaks You

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Change Your Brain Every Day

Episode Title: Mariel Hemingway: Breaking Generational Trauma Before It Breaks You
Hosts: Dr. Daniel Amen & Tana Amen
Guest: Mariel Hemingway
Release Date: May 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features acclaimed actress, author, and mental health advocate Mariel Hemingway in a heartfelt, candid conversation with Dr. Daniel Amen. Together, they discuss breaking patterns of generational trauma, turning mental health stigma on its head, and embracing brain health as the cornerstone of a balanced and fulfilling life. The dialogue weaves through Mariel’s personal struggles, her family’s legacy of mental illness, her journey to wholeness, and Dr. Amen’s insights into brain science and meaningful healing.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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1. Mariel’s Early Life and Family Dynamics

• Observing Dysfunction: Mariel describes growing up in a house overwhelmed by alcohol abuse, mental illness, and unchecked trauma:
  • "It was like I was an observer in my own house because my parents drank and my sister did drugs. I was kind of removed from them and I loved them, but I didn't know how to fix them. And I thought it was my job to fix them." (00:00)
• Caretaker Role at a Young Age: At just 11, she became a primary caregiver after her mother’s cancer diagnosis.
• Early Notions on Health: Even as a child, Mariel questioned how lifestyle, diet, and environment affected health (07:25).

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2. Mental Health vs. Brain Health: Reframing the Narrative

• Changing the Language: Dr. Amen highlights how labeling conditions as “mental illness” is stigmatizing, framing the need for a 'brain health' approach:
  • "Nobody wants a mental illness. No one wants to be called mental. It shames people...these are brain health issues." (02:42)
• Impact on Seeking Help: Both discuss the cultural resistance to mental health interventions, especially among older generations:
  • "My family was like, we don't talk to psychiatrists. Like, they'll...what will the neighbors think?" - Mariel (05:11)
• Hope Through Brain Imaging: Dr. Amen shares his journey using brain SPECT imaging as a diagnostic tool, which revolutionized his practice (03:15).

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3. Breaking the Cycle: Trauma, Obsessiveness, and Healing

• Hypervigilance and Responsibility: Mariel traces her obsessive need for control and perfect health to traumatic childhood events, including enduring family chaos and violence (07:25; 08:37).
• Intergenerational Suffering: The conversation dives deep into her family’s mental health legacy:
  • Her oldest sister lives with schizophrenia, severely impacted by early LSD use (10:47).
  • Margo Hemingway, Mariel’s other sister, succumbed to addiction and suicide.
• Self-Determination: Mariel’s efforts not to repeat her family’s patterns sparked her commitment to wellness:
  • "Watching those family members, I thought, I do not want...to end up like them. That was how I became so obsessed with like, you know..." (12:00)

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4. The Limits of Willpower & The Power of Lifestyle

• Lifestyle Over Pills: Both highlight the over-reliance on medications and the underestimated role of daily habits:
  • "It's skills, not just pills...get your food right and your brain is happier, it's healthier. It just works better." - Dr. Amen (06:45)
• Diet Fads and Mistakes: Mariel reflects on health fads (vegan, no-fat diets) that did more harm than good:
  • "I did no fat for 20 years. Bad. My skin was dry. Probably that's probably led to some depression." (22:16)

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5. Trauma, Focus, and Neurobiological Insights

• Childhood Adversity & Cognitive Impact: Mariel left school to escape chaos at home, which affected her concentration and focus.
• Trauma, Not ADD: Dr. Amen links her struggles more to trauma than to ADHD:
  • "That's sort of not add. That's trauma." (16:11)
• Therapeutic Journeys:
  • EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) helped Mariel process trauma.
  • Brainwave technology and neurofeedback provided breakthroughs, revealing to her what happiness felt like (16:20–19:10).

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6. Breaking Down Brain Health with SPECT Imaging & ‘BRIGHT MINDS’

• Key Risk Factors: Dr. Amen applies the BRIGHT MINDS framework to Mariel's assessment.
  • Blood Flow: Early birth (premature by 3 months) and childhood stress may have subtle, lasting effects.
  • Inflammation & Gut Health: Mariel overcame gut issues through dietary changes.
  • Genetics: The Hemingway family history includes depression and suicide; genetics aren’t destiny but a wake-up call (23:20).
  • Head Trauma: Ernest Hemingway (her grandfather) and Mariel both experienced head injuries, with potential lifelong consequences (25:12).
• Notable Science:
  • "Your brain is 60% fat...low fat generally goes with more depression." - Dr. Amen (22:04)
  • "Mild traumatic brain injury ruins people's lives and no one knows about it...it's the most misunderstood thing." (26:04)

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7. Addressing Stigma, Negativity Bias, and Building Resilience

• Stigma Across Generations: Mariel recalls her mother’s panic at the thought of psychiatry, a reflection of societal shame (52:01).
• Negativity Bias: SPECT testing reveals Mariel recognizes negative faces faster, a survival adaptation from childhood chaos (33:00).
• Building Resilience: Despite a high ACE (Adverse Childhood Experiences) score, Mariel demonstrates high hope and resilience—a testament to her self-work (29:50).

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8. Daily Practices, Supplements, and Interventions

• Exercise and Brain Health:
  • Mariel’s regimen includes HIIT, hiking, walking, and weights. Coordination/racket sports recommended to further boost cerebellar function (39:02).
• Supplements and Hormones:
  • Importance of omega-3s, multivitamins, and hormone replacement therapy for women (30:43–31:18).
• Positive Framing:
  • "You already have an awesome brain, so I'm going to help you make it more awesome." - Dr. Amen (51:47)

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9. Meaning, Purpose, Spiritual Health

• Holistic Approach: Dr. Amen’s “four circles” model: brain/body, mind, relationships, soul.
• Meaning and Recovery:
  • "If we improve the spiritual circle...Does your sense of meaning and purpose go up? Everything else followed it." (45:14)
  • The importance of asking patients about meaning and purpose, not just symptoms.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "I can only work on myself. But it took me a long time." – Mariel Hemingway (09:10)
• "Denial's huge." – Dr. Amen (14:45)
• "Genes aren't a death sentence—they should be a wake up call." – Dr. Amen (22:26)
• "Let me do your drugs because I'm better at them than you are." – Dr. Amen (39:23)
• "It's nice to know that it's not that bad." – Mariel Hemingway, on her brain scan results (41:00)
• "We have to stop calling people mental. It's just demeaning. It is shaming." – Dr. Amen (43:59)
• "Every day you're remodeling [your brain]. By what we eat, by the air we breathe, by the water we drink, by the thoughts we think, by the news we watch, by the people we hang out with." – Dr. Amen (50:53)
• "The problem, I think, that people have is this separation. They think their brain is like, 'Oh, my brain's over here.' Like, it doesn't matter." – Mariel Hemingway (41:28)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:00–04:00: Mariel's background, family dysfunction, early caregiving, reframing mental health
• 06:45: Dr. Amen on skills vs. pills and impact of nutrition
• 07:25–13:00: Mariel's trauma, obsessiveness, and desire to "fix" family; impact on development
• 14:07–16:11: Denial, family loyalty, educational difficulties, leaving home
• 16:15–19:10: EMDR, brainwave therapy, and breakthroughs in mood and happiness
• 20:52–23:20: BRIGHT MINDS risk factors; genetics and family legacy of suicide/depression
• 25:12–28:50: Legacy and consequences of traumatic brain injury in the Hemingway family and Mariel
• 29:50–34:28: ACE score, resilience, cognitive testing, negativity bias
• 36:26–41:00: SPECT scan results, recommendations for brain health, encouragement
• 43:35–46:46: Societal stigma, the importance of language, and government advocacy for "Decade of Brain Health"
• 51:00–53:51: Changing generational trauma, pills vs. holistic approach, consequences of medications
• 54:01–55:53: Individual differences in medication response, Tana Amen’s story
• 50:53–51:21: The metaphor of daily brain remodeling through conscious lifestyle choices

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Tone & Style

Throughout the conversation, the tone is deeply empathetic, personal, and encouraging. Dr. Amen and Mariel blend humor with gravity, offering hope and actionable insights without glossing over life’s difficulties. Their dialogue invites listeners to rethink shame and stigma, embrace holistic brain health, and champion their own transformation.

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For New Listeners:

This episode offers not just a window into Mariel Hemingway’s life and legacy, but also a masterclass on reclaiming brain health, breaking free from generational trauma, and becoming empowered participants in your own healing journey.

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Transcript

[Mariel Hemingway]

It was like I was an observer in my own house because my parents drank and my sister did drugs. I was kind of removed from them and I loved them, but I didn't know how to fix them. And I thought it was my job to fix them.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Marielle Hemingway is an American actress, author

[Mariel Hemingway]

and mental health advocate.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

She is known for her roles in films such as Manhattan and Lipstick, as

[Mariel Hemingway]

well as her work addressing her family's complex legacy. My mother got cancer very early and I became a primary caregiver at age 11. People get cancer and they go into a chemotherapy therapy lounge and they feed them nothing but horrible food.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You're in war for the health of your brain. Everywhere you go, hospitals, elementary school. Yes sir, doctor's offices, someone's trying to give you bad food that will kill you early every day. You are making your brain better or you are making it worse. Stay with us to learn how you can change your brain for the better every day. Your brain is your most valuable asset. It controls everything from your focus and memory to your mood and energy. That's why I created Brain MD to give you science backed supplements that support your brain so you can feel and perform your best every day. If you haven't tried them yet, go to brainmd.com and use the code podcast. 20 for 20% off. Because when your brain works better, you work better. Well, I'm so excited to meet you and be with you. When they said we could have Merrill Hemingway on the podcast, I'm like, please. I was so excited.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Well, thank you.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Tell me your goal. What are you hoping to get out of this process?

[Mariel Hemingway]

To be honest, I really feel like an infant here. I feel like I'm just swimming in a sea that I don't fully know what I, I, I know what you do and yet I don't know what you do. So my, my intention is, I mean, my lifestyle is very much about health and wellness and balance. And you know, I come from a very challenged family in the mental health arena. So brain health has been a big part of my life. So anything that I can learn more about is just great, you know, so

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

that's what we do. You know, a long time ago I'm like, nobody wants a mental illness. No one wants to be called mental. It shames people. It's stigmatizing.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And it's wrong. These are brain health issues. Get your brain healthy and you're less likely to kill yourself. Get your brain healthy and you're happier, you're less anxious, you're more focused and was it 35 years ago, I started looking at the brain with the study we did with you called brain spec imaging. And it literally changed absolutely everything in my life. If you date any of my children, they're getting scanned. When I dated my wife 20 years ago, I'm like, oh, I really like you. You haven't seen the clinic. You should come get scanned. And then you live with the question, is whatever you're doing, good for your brain or bad for it? And if you love yourself, you choose good.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I've read your history. I looked at your testing. I've seen your scans. We'll talk about them.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh, okay.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So I have a good idea. And what I saw in the testing, your primary objective was to get a good evaluation of your overall brain health and function. And so we'll talk about it. There's lots of things in your history we could talk about. From depression, from family history of depression and suicide. If I understand it right, though, you didn't have depression until you had one of your kids.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I'm not sure if it coincided. You know, I've always asked myself, oh, is it. You know, was it postpartum? Did that create something? They were older. It was a time where I was deeply unhappy in my marriage. It was. It was just a time I couldn't reconcile what was going on. And I was also so incredibly obsessive about what I thought was healthy at the time, which probably wasn't as healthy things. And I created. It's almost as though I created anxiety for myself just based on my hyper vigilance trying to do things exactly right, correctly. This, and I think the overwhelming sense that I was in a marriage, that wasn't. It just wasn't healthy because there wasn't communication. But I hadn't been brought up to communicate. You know, I come from the generation nobody wants, like you or like. Not somebody we did not talk to. My family was like, we don't talk to psychiatrists. Like, they'll. What will the neighbors think? You know what I mean? So I just had a very. An odd kind of misunderstanding of what. Of. Of what mental health was. And as you just said, brain health. Brain health is a different thing. And when you. Too kind of. And when you frame it that way, it's like, oh, my gosh, I can only get better. I can only. I always have believed. And this is in my very. You know, because I'm a doctor. And I'm just kidding. Because I have such Expert. Yeah, because I have such as I love my mother. Yeah, exactly. But I Mean, the truth is, I've always believed there was a solution for. For people, and. And it's based on. For me. And you may tell me differently, but I don't think so. It's based on lifestyle. It's what you're choosing every day.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So important and so misunderstood. And there's a pill for everything. Yeah, but I. And use medicine when it's appropriate, but it's like, skills, not just pills. And the nutritionists here at Amen Clinics actually have better testimonials than almost anyone. Get your food right and your brain is happier, it's healthier. It just works better. Tell me about the obsessiveness. And you. You said you were, like, so focused on doing the right thing.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Well, I think, you know, it all comes down to extremely dysfunctional family that I loved because they were my family. I didn't know any different. So my childhood was my mother got cancer very early in my life, and I became a primary caregiver, you know, at age 11. And I would take care of her in the middle of the night, and I watch, and I remember thinking, oh, there must be something. It must have something to do with how she eats or, you know, like, I kept thinking, there must be things she doesn't get outside. And I knew this, like, at a very young age. But so anyway, my. And then because my parents drank so much and my sisters drank and did drugs, and I was much younger, so I was. It was like I was an observer in my own house. I was kind of removed from them and who. Who, who. I love them, but I didn't know how to. Well, I wanted to fix them, and I thought it was my job to fix them. Right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Where did you get that idea?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Well, when you wake up in the middle of the night and you see, you know, all this. It had been. There had been a party, right? And everybody had gone home. And I wake up and I hear that it's silent, but I heard screaming, yelling. You know, people are throwing glasses. There's. And I go downstairs and there's, you know, there's broken glass and wine everywhere, some blood because somebody got cut, right? And I clean it all up, and I'm. However old I am, that was probably before my mother got cancer. So that was the earliest memory I have of doing that is about 8 years old. And when you see that and you think, oh, my gosh, I have the ability to clean this all up. So I mentally actually turned that into, I can fix what's broken here. So I would clean it all up. They would wake up in the morning, the kitchen is clean. There's no more blood. There's no wine stains. Everything's cleaned up. And I. I really would think, you know what, we have a chance to make, to be better today, right? So that, that started this pattern of thinking, oh, I'm gonna fix. I'm gonna fix everybody. I married somebody who drank, you know, and I. I'm gonna fix that. I'm gonna. He got cancer, too. I'm gonna fix him. And then slowly you start to realize that those. You can't fix anybody. You can only. You can only work on yourself. But it took me. It took me a long time. And, you know, my oldest sister suffered from schizophrenia, so she was always super challenged, but I loved her because she was brilliant. She's still alive. And. And yet, you know, she was. She had moments of extreme violence.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

How old were you when she first started showing symptoms?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Here's what I think happened. And you can correct me. This is again, me being a doctor. She's. She started doing. We lived in Mill Valley at the time, Northern California. And she started going into. She's 11 years older than me and I was four. And she started going into San Francisco from Mill Valley into Haight Ashbury. And she was taking a lot of lsd, a lot of lsd, and hanging out with the Grateful Dead and doing whatever. But I think that that trigger. That, that drug taking triggered a predisposition for whatever mental health issues that she ended up having. Okay, so that was my clinical observation, but.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So I'm not going to correct you, do you think? Probably hanging out with David Smith, who's one of my friends. He and I wrote a book together. He founded the Hate Ashbray Free Clinic.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh, wow.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And the idea the LSD and other drugs can trigger schizophrenia, I've seen it in my career.

[Mariel Hemingway]

So I'm not crazy over and over again.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, I haven't said you're not crazy.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Okay, good. That's.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Okay, we'll get to that.

[Mariel Hemingway]

We'll get to that. Fair enough. Anyway, so that's. That's. So you're. When the hyper vigilance started. Like, I saw that. I'm four years old. I saw that. I'm like, ooh. But I loved her. She was super cool. Like, she was like a fairy. And I thought she was just so amazing. And then my other sister Margo, who took her life in 1996, she also just drank, drank, did a lot of drugs. She didn't have a diagnosed mental illness per se, but I mean, all of the. All of the alcohol and all of the drugs. Just, you know, she developed seizures, you know, from the amount of alcohol that she was consuming. And she just was on a path. It was a. It was a tough path. Anyway, watching those family members, I thought, I do not want. I love these people, but I do not want to end up like them. And so that, that was how I became so obsessed with like, you know,

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

sounds like intelligent life. You know, it's like, I mean, I was. If you're. If you're stepping back and don't go, oh, they are doing it, so I should do it.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

They're doing it and their life isn't turning out in a happy way, so maybe I shouldn't do that.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I actually, when I was a young psychiatrist, studied children and grandchildren of alcoholics because my first wife grew up in a very abusive alcoholic home. Because. And I just wondered why she didn't like me. I'm like, I married you. Why don't you like me? And then when she tried to kill herself, took her to see a wonderful psychiatrist and she wouldn't even admit her dad was an alcoholic, even though the police would come and there was domestic violence. And I'm like. And I'm just like, how do you deny that?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

That she thought she wasn't being loyal if she said that. Yeah.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I mean, there's a very complex thing that happens when you love. You know, when you love someone. Right. When you. Or they're especially a parent, because you have. In some ways, you have to. I took on the thing. I will protect them because I will fix them. And then, you know, my other sister is very similar to your ex wife, kind of very loyal. They're not, you know, there's nothing wrong with how they live. They get hammered every night. But what's wrong with that?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Denial's huge.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, it is.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And, you know, there was this one question in your history about your sort of concentration and focus and learning early on. Early on.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Thank gosh.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

But one wonders if that wasn't the chaos.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That's what I feel. It was because I. My mother being sick so terrified me that I couldn't focus. She was, you know, she had cancer and the teachers were mad. You didn't finish this. And I would read and I wouldn't. I wouldn't retain anything that I'd read it again and I wouldn't. It was just horrible. And I felt so kind of empty and lost in that. In that space of not being able to. And I. And. And I Left school at, you know, at 10th grade because of it. I mean, I left because I made a movie, Manhattan. And I wanted to move to New York and, you know, I could start a new life where nobody knew me, which I did. But I mean, the underlying thing was I need to get out of here because I can't function. I. I can't focus. And when I was. And to your point, when I was out of that stress, I could focus when I was not. No longer kind of.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. So that's sort of not add. That's trauma.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And, you know, one of the things I saw that you did is emdr.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Only did it a few times, but it was very powerful. Very powerful. I really. I was like, oh, this?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. No, I'm a huge fan.

[Mariel Hemingway]

It's amazing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It just helps you process the trauma so the past doesn't have to live in the present. And then you did something called frequency healing and brainwave technology.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Have you ever heard of that?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, I've heard about neurofeedback.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. So it's not neuro. This is what they tell you. But who knows? It no longer exists. So I'm like, was that real? But I think it was. So brainwave technology, is it. So there's electrodes on your brain and it's reading your brain. Your brain hears itself in real time. So you listen to the sounds that your brain is making when the brain hit. Apparently when the brain hears itself in real time, it can correct itself because it doesn't know that it's. It's doing a neural pathway that is, you know, flawed or inconsistent until it hears itself. And I did hundreds of sessions, and afterwards, I mean, it was. For me, it felt like a miracle because I.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Who is the doctor that did that with you? Do you remember?

[Mariel Hemingway]

He has passed. God. What's his name? But a doctor didn't do it. He had. He had people that ran his things here in la, and he was in Scottsdale. I can't believe. Oh, it almost. I almost had the name, but I. I forgot it.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, if it comes, let me know because it sounds a little bit like Nara Lee Gertis.

[Mariel Hemingway]

He wasn't a doctor, but he came up with this technology and he had doctors on his team.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And you found it.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I found it powerful. I've also done neurofeedback. Neurofeedback. You're telling the brain what to do. You kind of. You or you're guiding.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Just dancing with your brain. Right, right.

[Mariel Hemingway]

And I love that, too. That felt very. That felt. I Don't know. There was something about the brain wave and. And your brain kind of fixing itself, but because it hurt itself, if that's correct, if that's actually what was happening. But, I mean, I shifted dramatically. I had never realized that I'd been depressed most of my life until I wasn't. I mean, I literally woke up one day and went. And then the next day I was like, happy again. I was like, this is interesting. I didn't. I didn't know that you could actually be happy every day or like, at ease. Not.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. You balance your brain.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And then don't believe every stupid thing. You think people want big changes, but the brain responds to small, consistent habits. What you do every day matters. That's why I focus on daily brain support. Go to brainmd.com and use code podcast. 20 for 20% off my favorite brain first supplements. I always think of my patients in four big circles. It's like, so what's the brain and your body doing? How about your mind, your relationships and your soul? So I always think about those four all the time, and I try to optimize them. And when we think about your brain and body, this would be one of the most helpful things I say to you. If you want to keep your brain healthy or rescue it, we have to prevent or treat the 11 major risk factors. And we know what they are. And for you, the acronym is Bright minds, and the B is for blood flow. And you have a lot of healthy blood flow. And as I look at the risk factors, you were born three months premature. That can actually leave a lasting imprint. So if you had problems concentrating, you know, odds are could be the chronic stress and staying up at 2 in the morning, cleaning the kitchen. Yeah. That'll give you school problems. Right, right, right. Being premature could also gotten you a little bit of less oxygen.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

To start. Which can decrease blood flow. Retirement and aging. You're 64. The older we get, the more serious we need to be. I hate that. It's like the gravity of age. Right. As we get older, our skin starts to fall off our face. Well, that same process happens in the brain. And so being serious, I. Is inflammation. And I noticed you have some gut issues.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Not anymore.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Better.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, way better. Way better.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Good. Because if your gut's not right, your brain's not exactly. I know you talk to each other all the time.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. So I'm very aware of gut health, but that was for a long time, you know, And I did all these kinds of diets and things, and, you know, I was vegan and macrobiotic and all fruit, no fat for years.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I mean, it was just very bad for you.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh no. I was on caffeine and fruit for. Yeah,

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

yeah. It was not good.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Anyway.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. Getting your brain is 60 fat.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I know.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Low fat generally goes with more depression.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Tell that to the entire decade of the 80s because they were like, no fat, it's gonna save your life. And I did.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Which came out.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I did no fat for 20 years.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Wow.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Bad. I was, My skin was dry. Probably that's probably led to some depression.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. Because you're not getting any omega 3 fatty acids, which are so important for your brain. The G in bright minds is genetics and there's a boatload of stuff, but almost all of us have stuff. And the idea is genes aren't a death sentence. They should be a wake up call. And so if I have, I adopted three of my six kids and oh my gosh, they all had substance abuse in their genetic history. And I'm like, never use, you're never going to have a problem. You need to be on an alcohol and drug abuse prevention program your whole life. And.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

What was the lore in your family about your grandfather who is probably one of the most famous suicides in America?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, well, for years it was, they denied that it was suicide. He shot it. He by accident shot himself. You know, that was a few years. And then finally it came out, you know, it was suicide. And in my opinion, he was, he was such a great mind. This mind was so powerful and so, you know, insightful and so unique. And he came from, you know, he came from suicides, he came from depression. I finally saw his mother, his childhood home where he was born, where he and his, you know, his father had taken his life in that home. And then his mother, who I never realized had suffered from postpartum. You know, like there were all these things I was like, oh, he's all makes sense because he, I think was always struggling to handle the darkness, whatever darkness was inside him. And of course back in the day they didn't know that alcohol was probably making it worse and causing more depression and more manic. I think he probably would have been diagnosed with some, some form of manic, you know, bipolar. I don't know because he was just going up and down. But he was also drinking all the time. But I think he was self medicating. I think he was trying to suppress this, this feeling of hopelessness that would happen periodically, you know, so. But the, the also

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

had some head Injuries.

[Mariel Hemingway]

He did. I think he had a. He had a head injury when he was. He was an ambulance driver in the Spanish Civil War for a while. And shrapnel. He got hit by shrapnel there. He also got hit. But this was later on in his life. Towards the end, he. He was in like, a small plane crash and one of the propellers hit, hit his head. And that was. I think that was the beginning of him not being able to function right the way he knew his. Knew how to do. And I think that was the, you know, the very thing that he loved was the very thing that was taken away. Like his brain was functioning, that kind of trauma. And then he's still, you know, drinking. Drinking. Yeah. And not good.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. If you ask me.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Go.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Hey, Daniel, what's the single most important thing I've Learned from nearly 300,000 scans? Mild traumatic brain injury ruins people's lives and no one knows about it. It's. It's the most misunderstood thing. Damage your brand new, damage your life. And the brain is the consistency of soft butter tofu custard, somewhere between egg whites and jello. And it's housed in a very hard skull that has sharp bony ridges. And I've just seen it over and over and over again. So one of my athletes, one of my friends who I just dearly love, he's like normal, wealthy, good looking, happy, incredibly successful, and has a bike accident, but he doesn't lose consciousness, but he broke the helmet. And then he's, like, anxious, having panic attacks. His doctor puts him on an ssri, and now he has suicidal thoughts. And he called me up and you could just see the damage. And so we put him in a hyperbaric chamber, and a year later, his brain's fine, he's fine.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Amazing, amazing craziness.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And you got your head hit when you were 15?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes. Ski racing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Tell me about that.

[Mariel Hemingway]

So I was a ski racer in Sun Valley. Because that's what you did. I knew nothing about any other sport. People say, what football team do you. I didn't even know. Like, I went to a football game and said, can we leave after the first inning?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That was apparently not what you say when you go to a football game. That's baseball. Anyway, so my. So I was a ski racer, and that's all I did. So all you know, I was having a race on a weekend, which is pretty much every weekend you would have a race, and it was a dual slalom, and I was going down the course and I could see the girl that was Close to me, but I was. I was inching up. I was. I was. I was. I was gonna win. She hit a gate, and I felt her coming towards me. I was like, oh, crap. And then she hit me and her ski came up and it's. She lost her ski and it hit me in the face. So it hit me right here. And I've got a. Still got a scar. Yeah. And I was airlifted off the mountain and all that and got stitches. Did that happen? Did that affect my brain? I think probably.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Brain is soft, skull is hard.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So we'll look at your scan and see if we see it. Toxins. T is toxins. So we would put alcohol there. Living in a moldy home. Even the anesthesia from a hip replacement.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

All of those things potentially are toxic. But, you know, the first thing you do is you stop the toxin. Right. If you're in a moldy home, you re remediate it. If you're drinking, you stop. Yeah, yeah. M is mental health stuff. Your phq9 is actually a zero. So that's the depression inventory. I love that. I rarely see that. Your hope score on a scale of 0 to 64 is 63. So you live with high hope despite having an ACE score of 7. Do you know ACE?

[Mariel Hemingway]

No.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Stands for adverse childhood experiences. So on a scale of 0 to 10, how many bad things happen to you as a child? And you have seven. If you score four or more, it increases your risk of seven of the top 10 leading causes of death. And if you score six or more, you die 20 years early. Now you're not. Because the good news is, well, you can rehabilitate trauma, and you've worked really hard to get the past out of the present.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Yes. Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I love that so much. We'll talk more about it. I is immunity and infections. You were bitten by a tick, but negative for Lyme. Your brain doesn't look like you have Lyme. You've been taking hormone replacement, which I think is absolutely essential. And I'm so happy.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh, my God.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Marty Makary came out and was the head of the FDA and said that we've been getting it wrong for women for decades.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Chills. Because, you know all these women will go, oh, you know, I can't, because I had. I was like, you make hormones. This doesn't even make sense. Why would you not want to have what you make? I mean, don't go, do you know

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

why our hormones drop with age?

[Mariel Hemingway]

No. For all the other reasons that everything drops.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's the planet's way of getting rid of you. See, I'm just not okay with it.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I'm not okay either.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I want to stick around. The D is diabesity. And you're obviously not overweight. You look very healthy. How's your blood sugar?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Very good. Very good. I mean, I don't.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. Send me your recent labs. I'd love to see that.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Okay. Absolutely.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And your sleep is good. So of all of these, you actively work to stay healthy.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes. And, you know, not. They weren't always good. So I. I did have to make definitive.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And the good news is, no matter how old we are, your brain can still get better. Every day your brain makes 700 new baby stem cells, especially an area called the hippocampus.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Hippocampus.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Which is Greek for seahorse. So I tell my patients, your brain is making up 700 new baby seahorses every day. And your behavior grows them or murders them. Which brain do you want? I want the big brain.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I want the big brain.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

This is a study called Total Brain. It took you about 40 minutes to do. And it says you're not depressed or anxious or abusing substances. Do not have ptsd. And obviously not everybody who grows up and crazy develops ptsd.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Some people.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

As you answered the questions, there some evidence of adhd?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Okay.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I think it's more trauma, but we'll see.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Okay.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You're really good at recognizing faces. That's what this is. But you recognize negative faces much faster than positive faces. And this is.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That kind of makes sense. Ah, that's also a famous pattern.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Because if someone's always sort of, I, I know you, I recognize you. I love. Then pretty soon you start going, is it dangerous?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Right, right, right, right, right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You get your feelings hurt. That's this one. And sort of stick around a little bit. Not stress, not anxious. Clearly not depressed. Your long term memories, outstanding. Your short term memory is great. Focus could be better.

[Mariel Hemingway]

What is that?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Focus.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Focus could be. We're gonna work.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Planning's excellent. Processing speed, not so good. So I bet you didn't understand that when you're sort of tapping on the computer.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh, oh.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yours was slower, so these two probably go together. Flexibility is excellent. You're very positive. People who are depressed are like, over here. Right. But you tend to look for what's right rather than what's wrong. Resilience, social. So maybe I can help with these two things.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Please, please. I need to process better.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And this was the X test you did for the scan where they put the IV in your Arm. And you only had one atypical score. So this was sort of the longer it went, the slower your responses were. But it says not typical of people have add. So I think no, but let's look at your scan and your scan will give us more information. So we do a study called spect. And SPEC looks at blood flow and activity. It looks at how your brain works and it basically tells us three things. Good activities, too little or too much. And then my job becomes balancing it. So this is a healthy scan, and there are not that many healthy people in the world. We actually did a study of normal and then we realized, no, we can't call it normal. We have to call it healthy. Because normal is trouble. I guess if you just turn on or go to the mall, you realize not everybody's having a good time. So here we're looking underneath the brain. Top, bottom. This is an area called the cerebellum. Be very important for you. These are your temporal lobes, one side, the other side down from the top. So here the color doesn't matter. It's the shape. This one, the color matters. Blue is average activity, red is the top 15%, white is the top 8%. And it should be here in the back bottom part of your brain. And everything else sort of quiet. And.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh. So we were looking at mine. You were just showing me in general.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So this is what we want. This is our.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Got it, got it, got it, got it. Okay.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And then when we look at yours, you have a great looking brain. There's some aging, but that's true for all of us. But at some point, this left front temporal lobe got hurt. So that's why I was interested about the ski accident.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Because that could be it. Now, if you do what I say, this is where it is today. This is the possibility of how much better it could be.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Amazing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And so I get really hopeful. We have a follow up for one of our fun patients. His name is Tara. He has a show on HGTV called the Flipping El Mooses. They flip houses and they do home improvement. They take really terrible looking houses. Roach infested. And then they make them beautiful and then they flip them. They sell.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, his brain was really terrible. And a year later, it's dramatically better. So I call it extreme home makeover. Brain. Brain addition.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Brain addition. I love it.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Have you ever been in a hyperbaric chamber?

[Mariel Hemingway]

I have been in a hyperbaric chamber and my husband has created a hypobaric chamber, which is pretty extraordinary. It's. But it's not oxygen being pumped in. It is ambient air. And we pull it out and we push it back in. So it takes you up and down in altitude.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Oh, how interesting.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Which is really amazing. I think that's one of the reasons I've gotten a healthier brain or healthier body. I don't know.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

One of the things I would recommend, I mean, I have some supplements I like to help.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. I love hyperbaric. I just think hyperbaric, if you do too much of it can be detrimental. If you do too much, you know, like it's. It's amazing for healing, though.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And then here's your active scan. So let's go back. This is sort of what we want it to look like.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. And they're not enough.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You are a cerebellum. Could be better.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Do you. What do you do for exercise?

[Mariel Hemingway]

I do a hit. I do two days of a hit workout. I hike every day. I hike and walk every day and I do weights twice a week.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Great.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You do any racket sports or coordination exercises?

[Mariel Hemingway]

No. And I should. We've got. Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So I just want this to be.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Busy.

[Mariel Hemingway]

More.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I'm not worried about any of this.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Odds are your grandfather, his emotional brain was screaming busy and he had drank to settle it down.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And I always tell my patients, let me do your drugs because I'm better at them than you are. But I think coordination exercise could be super.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I actually know that I have to do them. And I'm. I don't know. I've never been that good, so.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

But that's even a better reason to do them.

[Mariel Hemingway]

To do that. I know.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Because then you just get better. As long as you're not criticizing.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yourself.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Exactly.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's like, you know, I'm not doing this to beat you. I'm doing this to work. A little bit of bumpiness. I think that's that past toxicity.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Right.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Mild concussion in the past. You have some increased here. So that gives you a vulnerability to depression. But you're obviously not. So I wouldn't worry about it. Question.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Oh, no. It's so clear. It's so clear. I gotta play some ping pong. No, I'm am super excited. First of all, I have to say thank you so much for making it always a positive experience because. And you said this in the beginning, but you know, because I. I actually speak about mental health and I'm now going to only call it brain health for the rest of my life, all over the world. And you making it positive. Is such a. It's. It's a gift. It's gonna make me cry because so many people just think there's something wrong with them. And I thought there was something wrong with me for a very long time. It's nice to know that it's not that bad.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

You have a great brain.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Thank you.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And the question is, well, how do I keep it that way?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And how do I make it even better?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Better. Yeah, better.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Most psychiatrists you go to, they have to find something wrong, and then the only hammer they have are medications.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Medications.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And I'm like, that's insane.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Well, I know enough about you, and it's why I admire you so much, is that your stress, you know, like walking and health and the way that you eat and all of it and water, you know, like, all of these things, they matter. They matter to the brain. And what matters to the brain then matters to the body. And what matters the body then? You know, it helps the brain. But they all. It's just like your four quadrants. Those things are what make a difference in somebody's life. But the problem, I think, that people have is this separation. They think their brain is like, oh, my brain's over here. Like, it doesn't matter. And it. You know, people get cancer and they. And you go into a chemotherapy lounge, and they feed them nothing but horrible food. And sugar is part of the reason why they have cancer. Yeah. It's like, what are you doing? And give them more chemical. It's just. I don't know. I get very frustrated. So, you know, just thinking that all of these things go together in concert. It's so beautiful. It's like a beautiful dance.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. My wife and I wrote a book together called the Brain Warriors Way, and it's got that title because you're in war for the health of your brain. Everywhere you go, hospitals, elementary schools, doctor's offices, someone's trying to give you bad food that will kill you early.

[Mariel Hemingway]

My ex husband had. Has cancer surgery. They removed a tumor or whatever. And the first meal they gave him, I was. So I started. I lost it. It was like boiled chicken jello, green jello. I was like, is that supposed to be the vegetable? Because you colored it green. It was. And a cup of coffee and a piece of chocolate cake. I was like, that's not food. It was just so annoying anyway. It's.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's so annoying.

[Mariel Hemingway]

It's so annoying. It is so annoying.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

We're actually working with the White House faith office and HHS and hopefully declare the next 10 years. The decade of brain Health. Amazing.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I just got Jills. That's amazing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

We have to stop calling people mental.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I know.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's just demeaning. It is shaming.

[Mariel Hemingway]

It is.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

No one wants it. When I told my dad I wanted to be a psychiatrist, he asked me why I didn't want to be a real doctor. Why I wanted to be a nut doctor and hang out with nuts all day long. Now he didn't get father of the year award. Oh my God. But he reflected what society believes.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Which means nobody wants to get help. But the help is not what it could be. And I think look at your brain so you know what you're dealing with. And then get it healthy. And every decision you make, you just ask yourself one question. Is what you're doing now good for your brain or bad for it? And does it make the world better? There's actually all four circles in that one question. Right? Because negativity is bad for your brain. Believing every stupid thing you think is bad for your brain. Holding on to hurts, it's bad for your brain. But having meaning and purpose. We're doing this great course. I'm so excited. It's called the Amen. Whole four and it's in. We're piloting it in a hundred faith based organizations. And I just got the first six week results on 176 people. Dramatic improvements. But what was the most interesting to me? If we improve the spiritual circle. Not with. Do you believe in God? Does your sense of meaning and purpose go up? Everything else followed it.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Amazing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And that's a question most doctors never ask their patients. Why do you care? Why do you think you're on the planet? And what is your deepest sense of meaning and purpose?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Well, that question is like the brain itself. It's like up here. Right. And. And it's goes down. It's so beautiful. It's beautiful. It makes so much sense that, that you. That you naturally would follow that. Because if you do believe in something. I don't know. I don't know what you would call it, but in that.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, we're not here by random chance. That our conversation is not random.

[Mariel Hemingway]

No.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And that it has a purpose. And the purpose is beyond ourselves to help other people be better. Are you taking a multiple vitamin?

[Mariel Hemingway]

I am. Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And do you take an omega 3 fatty acid? Because I think that's super important.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yes.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I want you to send me your lab work.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Okay.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So I can see.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I would add we. Make advanced blood flow. Could actually increase blood flow. Make something Else called brain and memory power boost. Oh, that. Those two things, I think could be super helpful.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That's interesting, because I. And blood flow would be circulation, too. Yeah. Okay. Because I've always, you know, in Chinese. Chinese medicine, I've always had, like, my circulation was always a bit of an issue, you know, which makes sense if you know, the three months premature or whatever, not getting enough blood flow. Interesting. Yeah, I love that.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Is there something I should have asked you that I didn't?

[Mariel Hemingway]

No, you asked me about all the good things. What about peptides? What are your. What's your take on peptides?

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So Wild West.

[Mariel Hemingway]

It is the wild West.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's the wild West. I'm. It's so funny with imaging, I was an early adopter and got so much grief. In fact, last week I got to talk to the CEO of the American Psychiatric association, and I've sort of been at war with them for 30 years because I'm like. They go, oh, no, you shouldn't scan your patients. And I'm like, are you insane? Like, I'm a psychiatrist. I know how to diagnose crazy. Trying to take care of homicidal or suicidal or psychotic people without knowing what's going on in their brain, that's ludicrous. But they said, no, you shouldn't do that because it doesn't fit with the current diagnostic paradigm. And so I was talking to her. I met her at this great event at hhs, and. And she said something to me I'll never forget. In fact, I may put this on my tombstone. She goes, you were just early. Like, 30 years. Seriously, right? You were just early.

[Mariel Hemingway]

You're like, yeah, I guess so.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

But, I mean, the joy that brought to me, which is instead of you were crazy or you were a charlatan,

[Mariel Hemingway]

but don't they always find out? You know, you. You start with something new. I can't remember. There's some way that it breaks down that you're. Everybody says, no, no, no. And they push you away and they push you away until finally, you know, eventually it becomes the norm. And that. And you were always right, you know, like, we. We always loved you. We always believe you're like, you didn't always.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. But I. I know why people don't want to innovate. Because hell is separation from God. Hell on earth is separation from each other. And if you innovate, they separate you. And it's. It's a painful place to be. But for me, I always had the stories of transformation that have blessed me.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And sort of Kept me going.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That. That is undeniable. Right? That's beautiful. It's so good.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah. All right. We're gonna make your brain better. I'm so excited.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I'm excited, too. And then we'll go on the brain flip show.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And for you, it's just, you know, home makeover brain edition. It's not like fructaric. It's extreme brain.

[Mariel Hemingway]

That's right. Mine. We're doing the bathroom. We're redoing the bathroom.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's okay.

[Mariel Hemingway]

I don't mind. Make it nice.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Maybe I should say, but every day you're remodeling it. Isn't that true? And we remodel it by what we eat, by the air we breathe, by the water we drink, by the thoughts we think, by the news we watch,

[Mariel Hemingway]

by the news we don't.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

We don't watch the people we hang out with.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Absolutely.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

It's remodeling your brain in a good way or in a vulnerable.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Absolutely. Absolutely.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Amen. Thank you.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Thank you. Amazing. Amazing. You just speak my language. I get so excited. I'm like, nobody talks like you but you. So thank you. Thank you.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

That's our goal. Right. And I think, as you, to make it the norm. Yes, it was. To stop calling people mental and help them have better brains.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And you already have an awesome brain, so I'm going to help you make it more awesome.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Amazing.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And who wouldn't want that?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Exactly.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Right. As opposed to. No, I'm not going to see a psychiatrist. I'm not crazy.

[Mariel Hemingway]

My mother. My mother literally, my father. Father suggested when my sister, you know, was. We moved to Idaho and she was having, you know, episodes. And my dad said, well, maybe we should take her to a psychiatrist. Maybe she should talk to somebody. She goes, oh, my God. Everybody will think we're crazy. Everybody. They'll know, you know, of course, I was like five at the time, and I just sat there listening to. I mean, you know, that. But that was the time. That's what people thought. And what generationally those thoughts keep. They keep. They keep you down. They keep generations from getting, you know,

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

people like you who've advocated for it. It's just been so helpful. We just have to change the messaging.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Right. Because there's a lot of more money for mental health. And I'm like, not as it's currently practiced. You're going to get more trouble.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Way more trouble. I'll just say a quick story. So I spoke at the suicide. American Society for Prevention of Suicide. I've spoken. I was A keynote, like, three times. And the last time, and I was like. Like, I don't think I can do this again. They were celebrating these people that were coming up with a pill to prevent suicide. And I was like, pill to prevent suicide? I just. I was like, how do you. You got to know what's going on in there. Like, not everybody's system is the same.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Well, an SSRI for the right brain will prevent suicide.

[Mariel Hemingway]

No.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And I'm not saying SSRI for the wrong brain will create suicide.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Exactly. Exactly.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

So I remember Prozac came out in 1988. And so I was practicing, and in 1991, I started scanning people. And that was the year there was a study from Harvard that said, prozac can make you kill yourself or Prozac can make you more aggressive. And of course, Eli Lilly came out and said, oh, no, it's just 30 people. And I'm like, oh, no. I absolutely saw that. That I would do just what I was taught to do. You're depressed based on this DSM criteria, and Prozac makes you want to blow your brains out. I'm like, but then what? I realized if your brain is busy, well, Prozac calms it down. Because serotonin is an inhibitory neurotransmitter. Calms things down. But if you start sleepy, Prozac can disinhibit you. And then all of a sudden, my wife wrote a book called the Relentless Courage of a Scared Child. She grew up in trauma. Her ACE score is 8, and she had thyroid cancer issues. She was 23, and then got depressed. No one told her, if we just kill your thyroid and you don't have any thyroid, you're going to be depressed.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And so she ended up going to UC Irvine, saw Resident resident, put her on Prozac, and completely disinhibited her. And she did things that are in the book, but are things she's not proud of.

[Mariel Hemingway]

And.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

And when I scanned her years later after we met, I'm like, I hope no one put you on an ssri. And she goes, it ruined my life. So interesting. How do you know unless you look?

[Mariel Hemingway]

Yeah, it just makes sense.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Yeah, most nine year olds get it.

[Mariel Hemingway]

Exactly. Aren't we all just like, let's be friends, let's be friends, let's be friends. Let's continue.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

I want to see your table tennis skills go way up.

[Mariel Hemingway]

All right, fair enough. Thank you so much.

[Dr. Daniel Amen]

Hi, I'm Dr. Daniel Amen. I've experienced firsthand the powerful impact that proper supplementation can have on your brain, your body and your mind. That's why I founded Brain md. Our formulas are scientifically created from decades of clinical research designed to help you think clearer, feel better and improve every aspect of of your health whether it's brain and body power Max, the same formula I used in the world's largest study of NFL players to optimize brain performance to Happy Saffron to boost mood and memory and Pro Brain Biotics Max to improve the gut brain connection. Brain MD delivers the highest quality science backed solutions to help you think and feel better. Tana and I take many of our products every day and as a special offer just for our listeners, you can save 20% on your next order. Visit brainmd.com and use the code PODCAST20 with a better brain always comes a better life. Well, I hope you had as much fun as I did with Mariel Hemingway and her beautiful brain. That's awesome. Only going to be better. You're listening to Change youe Brain every day. Subscribe Please Leave Us A Review A Comment A Question we are so grateful for you.