C (3:14)

You're absolutely right. When I first started to treat patients in their 70s with cognitive decline, I felt like it would take nine months or a year before I could see some changes.

A (3:25)

Right.

C (3:25)

The pleasant surprise I had was that many people started to get better within weeks. Now, it's important to keep in mind that these older adults who had mild cognitive impairment, the stage between normal and Alzheimer's disease, had objective improvements in their validated cognitive tests. It wasn't just that they felt better. They actually memorized things.

A (3:51)

What do you think is going on there? Are these people who just mastered a skill, in this case the skill of memorization, or would you say that their brains objectively improved, or were their brains healthier as a result of this program?

C (4:06)

That's an excellent question. In order to provide real heart data that we were making changes in their brain, I obtained brain MRIs. Before and after the program, we did quantitative measurement on the size of their hippocampus, the part of the brain which is roughly the size of your thumb. And it's important for learning and memory. Hippocampus is a part of brain, as you know, which shrinks and causes symptoms of Alzheimer's disease. So in our program, more than half the patients, and these are older adults, late 60s to early 80s, had 1 to 3% increase in the volume of the hippocampus. And we showed that results in our paper, which was published in the Journal of Prevention of Alzheimer's Disease, on how we can actually see the size of hippocampus growing. And you can see with naked eye that this brain has a larger hippocampus than this one.

A (5:00)

I think you and I are around the same age and probably trained around the same time. And I think that when we were in medical school, the conventional wisdom was that the brain was different somehow than other organs, that you got a certain number of neurons, and that was that. And over your life, you were gonna drain the cache of neurons, and there wasn't much you could do about it. What you're suggesting, and, you know, I realize other people are catching onto your work now, but what you're suggesting is that that's not the Case that you can improve your brain throughout your life.

C (5:35)

Our brain has a repair kit in place just in case something happens. What you can do is to tap into that repair mechanism and improve your brain in the absence of trauma or stroke. So, for example, when you exercise, you increase the amount of bdnf. When you learn something new, you increase the number of synapses. When you eat a healthy diet, you reduce inflammation, and you can then increase the size of hippocampus. In other words, the improvements in the brain are not subtle. They're so prominent, they're so profound that you can see it on mris before and after. And I'm not the only person who has shown you can increase the size of hippocampus. In fact, I put together my program after seeing dozens of studies that showed individual lifestyle factors, what I call five pillars of brain health, increase the size of hippocampus. So I argued if exercise alone can increase the size of hippocampus, improving sleep, reducing stress, meditation, brain training, if all of these individually can grow the size of hippocampus, it should be the case that putting them together would produce better results in a shorter period of time. And that's what I saw when I published my paper in 2016. And since then, there have been dozens of other randomized control studies that have shown lifestyle interventions can profoundly improve brain functions. So, in short, our brain has neuroplasticity, and that capacity is just sitting there. Our brain is made of cells, just like our heart is made of cells, and those cells need oxygen and nutrients. And so it's not surprising to me that our brain responds to lifestyle interventions just like our heart does. Response to lifestyle interventions.

A (7:27)

How new is this what you're talking about? Because again, going back a few decades, when we were in medical school, that was not what people thought.

C (7:36)

I think in the past five to

A (7:37)

10 years, five to 10 years, people

C (7:39)

have come to appreciate how easy it is to change the brain anatomy with interventions.

A (7:46)

You know this, doctor. But if you ask older people what their biggest fear is, it's usually something related to their brains. They're going to lose their memory, they're going to lose their personality. They're not going to be able to have a joyous retirement because they just don't remember things as much. That is people's number one fear. My parents, this is what they fear about. Frankly, I've started to worry about that. But with lifestyle changes, not necessarily a new medication or a new procedure with lifestyle changes, for a significant percentage of people, maybe not everybody, but A significant percentage. That does not need to be the case.

C (8:24)

Absolutely. And what I find interesting is that when I talk about those things in my public lectures or in other interviews, people are surprised to hear it.

A (8:33)

Yeah.

C (8:34)

And what I love to do in my future public lectures and interviews is to empower people to take charge of their brain and realize that they can improve their memory and improve their cognitive functions at any age.

A (8:48)

There are six things that you really focus on in the book. Main reasons that lead to brain shrinkage. And I just want to read these. We're generally talking about inflammation and reducing blood flow. So that's sort of the cornerstone of all this. We're talking about stress, sleep apnea, obesity, insomnia, untreated depression, and concussions. Those are the things that you say to focus on in terms of what might actually be causing cognitive decline.

C (9:16)

Yes. Those factors have been shown to reduce the size of the hippocampus in a dose dependent manner. So the worse the obesity is, the more hippocampus shrinks, the more number of concussions you've had. The more hippocampus shrinks, the more stressed you are, the higher cortisol levels, the more your hippocampus shrinks. And unfortunately, if you have all of these things, your risk for Alzheimer's disease decades later would be 16 fold higher. 16 fold, for example. Yes. This has been shown in another study in JAMA. So if, let's say your risk in your 70s is 2%, then 2% is not significant. I mean, there's 98%. You won't get it. However, if you've had these factors and your 2% is 32%, which is significant.

A (10:06)

Again, I just want to emphasize this because this is such a big fear for people. Those things are reversible. Yes, the impact on your brain is reversible. As quickly as your brain may shrink in these areas, it can start to grow again as well.

C (10:22)

Exactly. See, in 2009, I wrote a paper about what we just talked about, all the factors that shrink the brain. And I publish it actually in nature. Then in 2010, 2011, I published papers about how many factors, what I call the five pillars of brain health, Exercise, sleep, nutrition, stress reduction, and brain training, increase the size of hippocampus. So then I asked myself, well, if these things are so obvious, why hasn't anyone put them all together as a program? And that's when I started in 2012 to create my program. And as I mentioned earlier, I thought it would take a long time to see results. But it turns out that 12 weeks seems to be a sufficient amount of time to see objective improvements in brain functions.

A (11:12)

Why weren't more people thinking this way? Why did it take so long to say, hey, look, this doesn't have to be the case that you can actually improve your brain at any age.

C (11:21)

I think people follow the leader and sometimes somebody says something and is met with criticism, and then as that person or that group of people provide more information, more and more people say, hey, maybe there's some point in that. And of course, 10 years later, people say, oh, obviously. Let me give you an example. In 1950s, people felt that your heart beats only so many times and so you don't want to exercise too much. Eisenhower's cardiologist, Dr. White, was one of the first cardiologists who said, actually, exercise is good for you. At that time, people who had heart disease were told to rest and take it easy. In 1980s, there was an article in New York Times that said, some cardiologists believe exercise is good for you. It was so revolutionary back then. I mean, not talking about 100 years ago, 1980s, and then of course, 1990s, more data showed that exercise was beneficial and there was a paradigm shift. I sincerely believe that 10 years from now, 20 years from now, we're going to look back and say, what were people thinking? Why weren't they taking care of their brain the same way they would take care of their teeth or their heart?

A (12:35)

Is it generally true that what is good for the heart is good for the brain? I mean, if we adopted those healthy lifestyles as a result of what we learned about heart disease, exercise is good. Eating, a low fat diet, things like that, are those things equally beneficial for the brain or is the brain different in some way?

C (12:54)

Everything that's good for the heart is good for the brain, but the brain needs something extra on top of what the heart needs, and that is brain training. So I think your brain is like a muscle. The more you use it, the stronger it gets. So everything you do in terms of lifestyle that's good for your heart, it's good for your brain, and you add some cognitive training and then you'll be in good shape.

A (13:16)

Good shape. I mean, that's inspiring. Like I said, I'm in my late 50s now. I worry about this. So what should I be doing? We understand that exercise is beneficial, a healthy diet is beneficial. But what did these 12 weeks when you put people on the program, what did it look like for them? How challenging was it?

C (13:39)

I think people need to appreciate that they don't need to have cognitive decline. With aging, the first step is the change in your mindset. You have to realize your brain is an organ just like your heart is an organ. That's step number one.

A (13:55)

Let me just stop you for a second because that is very much the assumption.

C (14:00)

Yeah. So the first step is to stop that. Because if you keep saying, oh, I'm getting old, what do you expect? You do less, you do fewer things because you think you can't. So you reduce your brain activity and you challenge your brain less because you think you're not capable. You just brush off. You just say, I can't do this. And the more you become sedentary and the less you use your brain, the more your brain shrinks, which then becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. You know, you do less, you are less capable, which then confirms your idea that you're declining. And this is what I found exciting about my work. See, a lot of people think that you either get Alzheimer's or you don't. You either are lucky and you dodge this Alzheimer's disease or you know, you're stuck and you become demented. In reality, there are many factors that shrink the brain. The pathology of Alzheimer's, which is called the amyloid plaques and cow tangles, is two components of, let's say, eight components that can shrink the brain. Sedentary lifestyle, sleep apnea, insomnia, poor diet, chronic stress, all those things shrink the brain in parallel to these plaques and tangles. Now the media and many of my neurology colleagues have focused on those plaques and tangles with the assumption that if you eliminate these with medications, then you cure Alzheimer's disease. And there has not been enough emphasis on these treatable components. So put it simply, cognitive decline with aging has two components. A component of what's called Alzheimer's pathology and a component of lifestyle related treatable conditions. If you treat the treatable components, you improve a lot. As you said earlier, not everybody who does these things will then be cured of Alzheimer's disease. There are still small percentage of people who are who have predominantly plaques and tangles as the main culprits for their cognitive decline. But in my experience, 90% of people improve when you treat the treatable component of their soup of issues. And so my program has two components. Take care of the negative things, like if somebody has sleep apnea, treat the sleep apnea. And if somebody has a central lifestyle, you know, get them to do those things. And another component is to do brain training and really get their brain to wake up. Your brain is like a muscle. When you challenge it, it actually grows. So when you combine, you know, taking care of negative things and focusing on positive things, you can see results in 12 weeks.

A (16:51)

More of my conversation with Dr. Majid Fatouhi right after this short.

B (16:59)

I'm Kathryn Nicolai and I help millions of people around the world sleep better, rest their nervous systems, and shut their brains off when they won't stop spinning. On my podcast, Nothing Much Happens. I tell cozy, calming stories where nothing dramatic ever happens. Just soft narration, sensory detail, and gentle repetition designed to lull you to sleep. There's no plot to follow, nothing to figure out, just peace. Listen to Nothing Much Happens Wherever you get your podcasts, Blizzard Entertainment presents Midnight, the newest expansion for World of Warcraft. Midnight calls every hero home to Azeroth. All paths lead to this moment. Xal' Atath rises, the void follows, and the Sunwell stands stands in peril. Raiders, explorers, storytellers, newcomers and legends alike. This is your world, your story, your moment. Because Azeroth is home, and home is always worth fighting for. Available now@worldofwarcraft.com

A (18:10)

welcome back to Chasing Life and my conversation with neurologist and author Dr. Majid Fatouhi. There are these new medications that have been approved. There hadn't been anything approved for, I think, you know, almost a decade and a half for Alzheimer's dementia. Now there are these medications, monoclonal antibodies, which I think you're referring to, which help address these plaques and tangles in the brain. And, you know, there was a lot of excitement around these drugs. What was your thought when you saw these drugs get approved?

C (18:40)

I think it's exciting that we have drugs that can eliminate amyloid in the brain. However, as I expected, eliminating amyloid has not cured Alzheimer's disease. Patients whose brain are cleared, like more than 80% of amyloid is cleared from their brain. The before and after brain images are very striking, like all the amyloid's gone. You would think if amyloid was the main culprit that the person would all of a sudden become normal again. In reality, this does not happen as I would have expected because you only address one component of a super problems. These medications reduce the rate of decline by a little bit. Whereas several studies, not just mine, dozens of studies have shown that multimodal lifestyle interventions programs which, like mine, combined lifestyle interventions, produce better, more robust results than these drugs do. And so I think again, I'm an optimist. I think that in 10 years from now we're going to look at Alzheimer's disease Much the way we look at diabetes. In other words, much of diabetes can be prevented. And when people have diabetes, we have medications to treat it once it's happened. And in reality, we use a combination of lifestyle interventions and medications for effective treatment of diabetes. And so I think we will look at Alzheimer's in the same way. I think these new medications are first generation medications and that the second and third generation medications will be more effective. And it will be helpful to start these earlier because the earliest footprints of these pathologies appear in the brain 20 years before the symptoms begin. So the best time to do these things is your age, where you want to exercise, you want to sleep well, you want to avoid junk food, you want to keep your stress low, and you want to improve your brain, brain training. So I think what we need to do is to make taking care of your brain as part of your daily routine. Just like you take care of your teeth every day. There are things you could do to take care of your brain every day, such as. So, for example, you want to reduce your stress, you want to limit stress for things that are really worthy of stress. You don't want to get stressed over, you know, traffic and minor things in your life. You want to leave the stress for major things you want to avoid. Junk food. No junk food. You know, food that are high, you know, highly processed food, food that are high in trans fats and food that spike your sugar, increase inflammation in the brain and literally shrink the brain. Literally. Not, not theoretically, literally. So, no junk food. Keep your stress down, move every day, you know, walk 3,000, 5,000 steps a day, exercise about three hours a week, and do something that challenges your brain every day. In other words, if you set aside one hour a day for brain maintenance with those things I just mentioned to you, you'll be ahead of 90% of the population.

A (21:51)

Let me just ask about you. You're the author of the Invincible Brain. Great title, by the way.

C (21:56)

Thank you. I love it. What do you do in terms of stress? I really leave stress for things that are severe, significant.

A (22:08)

Do you meditate?

C (22:09)

I do breathing exercises. Several studies have shown that slow breathing exercises, things that increase what's called HRV heart rate variability. Biofeedback is a very effective way to reduce cortisol levels, reduce stress, and reduce amyloid in the brain. So I actually enjoy those breathing exercises for five minutes. And of course, you know, I teach students, I'm mentoring students, I write books, I write journal articles, I do research, I take dancing lessons with my lovely wife. And so I have Something to challenge my brain every day. So I exercise. I exercise most days. I sleep well, I'm tired. Usually by the time I go to bed at night, I'm tired. I just crash and I'm tired. And then I don't eat junk food at all. You never catch me eating donut. And if I have to eat ice cream, I have a small amount.

A (23:05)

You know what's so interesting is it sounds simple. Right. And maybe that's the point. I think there's so many gravitational pulls in our society to move us away from what you just described. So for people who are listening, this sounds simple, but at the same time, it's not that easy because there's all the, you know, it's easier to eat processed foods. It's just much more ubiquitous. There is a lot of stress in our society and, you know, we live an increasingly sedentary life. So I think, you know, you talk about breathing exercises and people may say, well, come on, we're talking about monoclonal antibodies, we're talking about brain surgery, we're talking about all these things to try and reduce plaques. But the idea that breathing exercises could accomplish some of those same things, in some ways, that's the most extraordinary part of this, the simplicity of it.

C (23:54)

Absolutely. And one thing that I know you and I focus on is having a sense of purpose in life. Yeah. If you have a sense of purpose in life that helps to guide your daily routines. For example, I think it's a reasonable goal to say, look, I wanted to be a brain superager, someone who reaches the age of 90 and remain sharp and independent. You may not get there, but you will set that goal. And if that's the goal and they say, okay, this is my sense of purpose, that's what I want to do, then every day when you are faced with choices, you will take a choice that's in line with your purpose. Let's say your purpose is to take care of grandchildren or take care of your children. Then you remind yourself why you're doing what you're doing. And you want to be able to be in good shape when you get in the 80s so that you can spend time with your children and your grandchildren. So you use the sense of purpose as a carrot. That helps you decide whether I'm going to have these French fries, I'm going to say, no, thanks.

A (24:56)

Look, I think it's hugely inspiring to hear that just making that decision, those micro decisions on a daily basis can help keep these three and a half pounds of tissue healthy.

C (25:08)

Yes, I think what we need to do is to help people appreciate that the destiny of their brain is in their hands. For the most part. Only small percentage of people do everything right and get Alzheimer's disease or they do everything wrong and they don't get it. Very small percent of people do that.

A (25:27)

What do we talk? Because that is often the argument that you hear, right? And I'm always careful, I think as a physician, because you say, hey, look, if you engage in these healthy behaviors, then you're likely to not develop Alzheimer's disease. And then you'll inevitably get somebody who said, but I did that my whole life. Now I feel like I'm being blamed in a way because I or I got unlucky in a way because I did all the right things and it still happened to me. What percentage of people are we talking about?

C (25:56)

Okay, let me talk to you. In terms of pathology, less than 10% of people who'd reached late 80s have only plaques and tangles of Alzheimer's disease in their brain and nothing else. In other words, 90% of people experience cognitive decline because of a soup of problems. And so in my practice, you know, 5%, 10% of people would fall in the category where genes played an important role. I think genes and hereditary play an important role for early onset Alzheimer's disease. When somebody has parents who develop cognitive decline and Alzheimer's disease in their 50s or early 60s that has a strong genetic component. But the late life Alzheimer's disease is really super problems. And very small percentage of people experience chronic decline and Alzheimer's disease if they've done everything right. It's interesting also that the incidence of Alzheimer's disease is declining in many western high income countries. So I think that people are catching on and that there are parts of the world where our people are staying active and sharp as they get older. And that is a trend. And I tell you, in 10 years from now people are going to look back and say what were they thinking? Why weren't they doing things to keep their brain sharp? That's why I wrote my book the Invincible Brain, because I felt these things should not be limited to patients who come see me in clinic. Everything we're talking about are readily available for people everywhere. And you just have to change your mindset. You have to realize you can take care of your brain the same way you take care of your skin and your heart. If you have that aha moment, then you will really think twice about eating that french fries. You eat twice, just shut off the alarm and go back to sleep. And you just go for a 40 minute walk or something. Because we need to change people's daily habits in order to see big results. But they need to start easy. So when I talk to my patients, I say, listen, don't make your brain health another source of stress. Don't add to your list of feeling guilty about things. Let's just make a habit of walking 20 minutes a day. And then I want you for the next two, three weeks, cut back on the amount of junk food by 10%. Like if you have a cookie or a muffin or a bag of chips, just eat less of it. Still eat it, but less of it and see how you feel. What happens is that when people make these changes, they feel that brain fog evaporates and they start feeling sharper in a matter of weeks. I think it's a tragedy that so many people are experiencing cognitive decline unnecessarily. It's really tragedy because they can take care of themselves easily and they're not.

A (28:52)

How would you describe the level of evidence behind the things that you're saying?

C (28:57)

The level of evidence for multimodal lifestyle interventions reducing cognitive decline is compelling. There are many randomized controlled studies in which one group of participants received a combination of diet, exercise, stress reduction, improving sleep, and another group did not receive those interventions. And standardized tests were applied and showed that the group that received intervention had better cognitive function, they had better size, larger size, hippocampus. I know this because I reviewed the literature. Dozens of randomized control studies have been shown that lifestyle interventions improve brain functions. To put this in perspective, I wanted to know how these randomized control studies for lifestyle interventions compare to the new Alzheimer's medications.

A (29:52)

Yeah.

C (29:54)

So I went to the literature and guess what? The benefits of lifestyle interventions are far higher than the new medications. And it makes sense.

A (30:06)

Pharma companies aren't going to like to hear that.

C (30:08)

I think I salute pharmaceutical companies for all the investment they've made in the past 30 years. They've spent billions of dollars to come up with a drug that helps reduce amyloid. More than 100 clinical trials failed and they kept at it. So I saluted them. I encouraged them to continue to find medications that can help reduce amyloid and tau in the brain. And I think this new medications they have produced are the first generation medications and that the second and third generation medications will be effective. Let me put this in perspective for you. If somebody has heart disease and experiences a heart attack, there are many factors for it. They may have high cholesterol, diabetes, obesity, stress and treated Sleep apnea, just the main risk factors. Now, if you just treat their cholesterol, you will not prevent future heart attacks. You need to control their cholesterol and you need to put them on an exercise program and you need to treat their diabetes and you need to treat your sleep apnea. Those things will reduce the risk for developing a heart attack in the future, not just treating the cholesterol. Treating the cholesterol with statins or other medications will make a small dent, but it will not eliminate. Whereas if you do the whole thing, they will have a significant reduction in their risk for developing a heart attack. We're on the same level with amyloid and lifestyle interventions when it comes to Alzheimer's disease. If you just reduce amyloid, you make a small dent in risk for cognitive decline or further cognitive decline. Whereas if you reduce the amyloid and do those five pillars of brain health, exercise, sleep well, eat healthy, reduce stress, and do brain training, then you will see remarkable results.

A (32:00)

One of the things that's different is the brain training part of this. What does that mean? I mean, are you doing crossword puzzles and number puzzles or what are you doing to train your brain?

C (32:11)

Okay, can I just use your brain model for a second? So the outer layer of the brain is called the cortex. And this is where what I call is the main brain area for cognitive functions. So parts of the brain in front are important for attention, concentration, planning. Parts of the brain inside the temporal lobe, called hippocampus, is important for learning new things. And all these brain areas are highly malleable. Now, you can choose to work on parts of your brain for attention and concentration, or you can choose to work on parts of your brain for memory. Just like if you go to a gym, you can choose to work on your biceps, triceps cores or your legs. So depending on what you like to achieve, you can focus on those brain areas. Now, the controversy is, well, I did some brain training and I still got Alzheimer's disease. Well, first of all, brain training is five pillars, is one of the five pillars of brain health. And by itself, it's not going to cure your Alzheimer's disease. You need to do all of them. And also, you have to realize, if you really are concerned about your memory, you need to do memory exercises. If you really are concerned about your attention and concentration, you really need to work on the frontal lobe. And these days, there are lots of apps like Lumosity, BrainHQ, Peak, Elevate, where people can choose which brain area they can focus on. Just don't do Crossword puzzles or sudoku. Because you feel you must do brain training, choose what it is that you want to improve and work on those specific cognitive domains.

A (33:51)

Do you have specific things you work on?

C (33:53)

My memory, you know, I memorize my credit card numbers. I memorize the cards.

A (33:58)

My wife memorized my credit card number.

C (34:00)

Great.

A (34:02)

Very well, I might add.

C (34:04)

My wife and I take dance lessons together, and I play card games with my daughters during college, and they're much faster than I am. And I do my best to keep up.

A (34:14)

Is ballroom dancing good for your brain?

C (34:16)

Absolutely.

A (34:17)

How so?

C (34:18)

Well, for one thing, one study showed that if you take bone room dance classes and continue for a year, parts of the brain that are important for coordination and planning increase. And the size of hippocampus also increases in the group that took ballroom classes versus group that didn't. And I think exercise and ballroom dance in particular has many benefits. For one thing, you're exercising, you're on your feet. Number two is that you have to keep track of your steps. You have to memorize steps, and you have to keep track of where you are. You also have to listen to music and coordinate the music that you hear with the body movements. And you're close to someone, you're enjoying yourself. You actually have more dopamine in your brain. So I think ballroom dancing, dancing in general is one of the best ways you can improve your brain function. When I see patients, I say, pick something you enjoy. If you like fishing, if you like golf, if you like, you know, photography, do it, Go to the next level. You don't have to do boring things to challenge your brain. If you don't like apps, and these brain apps, don't bother, you know, learn a hobby you always wanted to do. Like, if you like painting, take painting classes. If you like cooking, cooking is great brain training. You have to keep track of all the ingredients, you have to put them in sequence, and there's a definitive outcome that you can see how you did and you can improve. Realize your brain is like a muscle. It has the capacity to grow and become stronger by challenging it. And then combine the things that challenge your brain with the things that also enjoyable to you and you'll see the best results. Yeah, I don't.

A (36:04)

You know, it's interesting. People think of brain training solely as maybe number puzzles or word puzzles, but the idea that ballroom dancing can do all those things that you were just describing for your brain, pretty remarkable. When I, when I was thinking about brain health, one of the neuroscientists, I was talking to said, start painting. I'm a terrible artist, but I started painting and he said also I'm right handed. He said, start doing with your left hand. Which I thought was really interesting. And it's something I've maintained. I got a little easel and I will paint sometimes and I find it relaxing but also I find it activating to other parts of my brain. Well, look, as a, as a fellow brain nerd, thank you. Because, you know, I, I think a lot of us have, you know, I'm a journalist. I've, I've followed your, your work for a long time and I think trying to get a lot of your messages out there. But I really thank you for writing this book. I'm going to hold it up again. The Invincible Brain. I read it, I even blurbed it.

C (37:02)

Yes. Thank you very much for your, I loved it.

A (37:04)

I, I meant every single word. So it's very inspiring. I, I think, you know, like I said, people are scared, especially when it comes to brain health and I think this provides them a lot of peace, hopefully. So thank you. Sure.

C (37:17)

Thank you for having, appreciate it.

A (37:22)

That was my conversation with neurologist and neuroscientist Dr. Majeet Fatouhi. His new book is called the Invincible the clinically proven plan to age, proof your brain and stay sharp for life. It's available now. Thanks so much for listening.

B (37:41)

Day or night, VRBoCare is here 247 to help make every part of your stay seamless. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out. From the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either. I'm CNN tech reporter Claire Duffy. This week on the podcast Terms of Service, is the AI market a bubble waiting to burst? And if so, how should we all as individuals be thinking about our personal investments and retirement accounts? To help me answer those questions, I have Ross Mayfield here with me. He's an investment strategist for Bayard Private Wealth Management where he helps clients make informed investment decisions.

C (38:35)

The dot com bubble of the late 90s is the go to example, particularly for today because it's a brand new technology. This also resembles pretty closely the mid-1800s railroad bubble, which this is my favorite bubble. Yeah, it's great, right? Because railroads are such an old school technology, but in the 1800s they were the AI of their time. It was this game changing technology.

B (38:57)

Listen to CNN's terms of service, wherever you get your podcasts.