invisible strings | catherine ebs

Summary

Podcast Summary: CHEERS! with Avery Woods – Episode: "Invisible Strings | Catherine Ebs"

Release Date: June 30, 2025

In this heartfelt and introspective episode of CHEERS! with Avery Woods, host Avery Woods sits down with her close friend and admired TikTok influencer, Catherine Ebs. The conversation delves deep into themes of grief, personal growth, blended families, and the complexities of life as a modern influencer.

1. Introduction to Catherine Ebs

Catherine introduces herself and her journey:

[01:55] Catherine: "I'm the creator of Questions I Never Got to Ask, which I made after my dad passed away. It's a card deck that asks incredible questions you should be asking your loved ones."

2. Navigating Grief and Loss

The conversation begins with Catherine sharing the tragic passing of her father during a family vacation, a moment that profoundly impacted her understanding of grief.

Catherine reflects on her father's death:

[06:36] Catherine: "We went on a family vacation and he died in my arms. It was the craziest, most tragic thing I've ever experienced."

David adds his insights on grief:

[07:38] David: "I realized how many grievers there are, especially young grievers who don't expect such losses."

3. Creating "Questions I Never Got to Ask"

Prompted by her own experiences with grief, Catherine developed a card deck designed to foster meaningful conversations between loved ones.

Discussion on the card deck's impact:

[08:41] David: "We have a lot of people with blended families who play it. It's just a huge game that hits a lot of people."

Catherine emphasizes proactive communication:

[08:11] David: "You just never know until you know. Play while you have the time."

4. Transitioning from Traditional Careers to Social Media

Catherine shares her professional journey from banking to social media, highlighting the pivotal moments that led her to embrace online platforms fully.

Her decision to leave a stable job:

[13:07] Catherine: "I ordered a huge deck of questions and turned it into a product that quickly sold out. That was life-changing for me."

David discusses his own shift:

[10:16] David: "I started in accounting and loved my job, but after my dad died, I realized I wanted to pursue my passion for social media."

5. The Reality of Being an Influencer

The duo delves into the challenges of being in the public eye, including dealing with online harassment, maintaining personal relationships, and safeguarding family privacy.

Catherine on online negativity:

[16:37] Catherine: "They leave messages on our doorbell camera, handwritten notes. It's a mix of flattering and boundary-testing behavior."

David shares his experiences:

[17:20] David: "Protecting our family became paramount when people started leaking personal information and making baseless accusations online."

6. Blended Families and Co-Parenting

A significant portion of the episode focuses on the dynamics of blended families, the emotional challenges involved, and strategies for effective co-parenting.

Catherine discusses her role as a stepmom:

[76:44] Catherine: "I've shared little things, but I will always respect their mom's privacy. They are my children, and I give them everything I've never had."

David reflects on his own family experiences:

[75:08] David: "Giving up custody battles and navigating stepfamily relationships is incredibly challenging, but grace is essential on both sides."

7. Mental Health and Personal Growth

Both Catherine and David emphasize the importance of mental health, self-advocacy, and the support systems that help them navigate life's hurdles.

Catherine on building confidence:

[61:36] Catherine: "Having kids made me so confident because I saw what my body was capable of and being a working mom gave me inner strength."

David on seeking therapy and self-care:

[31:48] David: "I've never said we're infertile, but struggling to conceive is a mental game too. It's important to advocate for yourself."

8. Future Endeavors and Legacy

Looking ahead, Catherine expresses her passion for expanding her card deck, leading grief panels, and continuing to use her platform to support others.

Catherine on upcoming projects:

[42:23] Catherine: "I'm excited for the grief panel I'm leading. I want to use my voice to help those who feel they don't have one."

David shares his aspirations:

[43:44] David: "Creating content genuinely is my passion. I love filming and documenting my life, even the moments I don't post."

Notable Quotes

• Catherine Ebs:

  "Grief is just so interesting to me because there are so many deep levels to it."
  [06:36]

• David:

  "If you've got something wrong, it's easy to lose people, but true supporters stay."
  [14:38]

• Catherine:

  "Everyone deserves a normal childhood, and I'm honored to provide that for my children."
  [74:31]

• David:

  "Real strength comes from opening up about what you're caring and doing something about it."
  [31:48]

Conclusion

This episode of CHEERS! with Avery Woods offers listeners an authentic glimpse into the lives of Catherine Ebs and David, highlighting the invisible strings that connect us—whether through shared grief, blended family dynamics, or the unspoken challenges of being in the spotlight. Their candid discussion not only sheds light on personal struggles and triumphs but also serves as an inspiration for those navigating similar paths.

Transcript

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Hi guys. I'm so excited for today's episode. We have on one of my very close friends that I have been a follower of, a fan of and admired for so long. Her name is Katherine. You might know her from her TikTok. She is such an honest human being that has talked about her experience with Grief after losing her dad. She keeps it real on being in an interracial marriage, living her life to the fullest, sharing beauty, fashion, anything in between. She's also the creator of Questions I Never Got to Ask, which she made after her dad passed away. It's a card deck, and my husband and I are obsessed with it. As soon as he got it in the mail. It asks so many incredible questions that you should be asking your loved ones that maybe will prepare you for the future and what's to come. I've been so excited to sit down with her and chat with her on a deeper level. Just past scrolling on the screen, and I think today's conversation just went amazing. And I learned so much, not just about her, but about myself as well.

[Avery Woods]

Hi, welcome to Cheers. I'm your host, Avery Woods.

[Catherine]

Hi. Queen. Hi. How are you?

[David]

Good. How are you?

[Catherine]

Thanks for being here. I'm good.

[Avery Woods]

I.

[Catherine]

When you sat down, you said you feel like we've known each other forever. And I feel like that. Like we don't have to break the ice or anything.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

Because we've been mutuals for so long, and I feel like I know you.

[David]

Yeah, I do know you.

[Catherine]

Yeah, actually, I do.

[David]

I'm like, I actually know you.

[Catherine]

So for those that don't know you, who are you? How would you describe yourself?

[David]

Oh, my name's Catherine. I do lifestyle content. Nothing wild and crazy. I am who I am. I always say that. I actually have that tattooed on my back because I'm like, this is real. This is raw.

[Catherine]

I love it.

[David]

It's gonna get real and raw for me. I don't know. My husband's my best friend. I feel like that's a very huge part of my life.

[Catherine]

And he's here.

[David]

Yeah, he's here.

[Catherine]

Supporting. We love it. Which. Your eyes are insane. Like, I know you get that all the time. Yeah, he has gorgeous eyes.

[David]

He's winking at me like I'm supposed to give him some validation.

[Catherine]

I'm like, please, I think the babies will get those eyes.

[David]

I pray.

[Catherine]

Yeah, I pray. Oof. I can't wait to see those gorgeous babies.

[David]

I can't either. Or I'm waiting.

[Catherine]

Yeah. So I found you a long time ago when you and your dad would get espresso martinis.

[David]

Really?

[Catherine]

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[David]

That's wild.

[Catherine]

And you know what's funny is I don't think I ever had an espresso martini. And then I think after watching your content, I was like, I need to try them. And then I got to an age like when I had kids where I can't survive unless I, like, drink an espresso martini because I actually need the caffeine, so which, by the way, I have to bring up because the game that you made, the card game, which is questions I wish I.

[David]

Questions I never got to ask.

[Catherine]

I never got to ask. When you sent that to my house, my husband literally ran up the stairs and was like, have you seen this game? We got. I'm obsessed with it. We didn't love that because it, it really is one of those conversations that you need to have with people in your life, but it's kind of awkward or maybe hard to kind of bring up. And I love why you made it and, like, the message behind it. So will you kind of talk about your story with your dad and why you made the game?

[David]

So my parents are actually divorced. I was raised in Florida. My dad was from Minnesota, lived there, so I would only get to see him spring break, summer break, and Christmas break. It was like the court ordered dates that I would see my dad. And I eventually got in a fight with my mom in high school, moved to Minnesota. My mom, I literally said to my mom, like, you, I'm leaving. And she was like, fine, bye. And booked me a flight two days later. So moved to my dad's house and realized how much of my dad I was and like, got really close with him over the last few years of his life without realizing that his life was over. We went on a family vacation and he died in my arms. It was like the craziest, most tragic thing I've ever. Yeah, it was wild. And that morning, like, grief is just so interesting to me because it's just like, there's so many deep levels to it and so much. I had so much anger that I wasn't raised with my dad. And I ended up doing a podcast episode with my mom because I'm like, again, I wasn't raised with my dad. So I didn't know my dad past just being my dad because I didn't have the day to day life with him. I had just like the short moments and it's like the fun, like they take you to the water parks and they do the fun stuff with you because it's like the small amount of time that they get. But I'm like, the older I had gotten when he died, I'm like, I don't really know my dad as Bill. I knew my dad is my dad. I didn't know, like, what did he think when he got the positive Pregnancy test. What did he think when he was 28 and navigating life like I am now. My dad's dad died when he was 8. So I'm like, how did you get through your dad's death? Like, all these questions were going through my head, and I'm like, the one person to answer them is buried six feet under right now.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

So I ended up doing a podcast episode with my mom and I asked her a bunch of questions. I'm like, because I wanted to get to know my mom on that level. And that podcast episode was one of the craziest ones I've ever done. Like, it blew up. It was viral. Like, people were like, this is insane. And I just realized when my dad had passed, I realized how many Grievers there were and how many young Grievers there were, because you don't expect it. You have no idea that it's coming. And, like, you hope you live forever, and you think your parents are going to live forever. So, yeah, I just, like, sat down one day and I just did a huge deck of questions and I turned it into, like, I just. I ordered them online. I ordered 500, and they sold out within a few hours of launching. It was crazy. So I ordered again. It actually sold out on pre sale before, and I had, like, tripled that order. So now we have, like, thousands of them in our garage. Because I'm just like, I just want to tell people all the time. You just never know until you know. And it literally happens in the blink of an eye. We were on family vacation. Like, what? What do you mean? My dad died on family vacation? You know, it just happens instantly.

[Catherine]

Yeah. And I think, like, David and I have a little bit of a different perspective just coming from, like, the medical cop field, because that's questions that we would ask family members, like, when the time had come. And a lot of these people are just aren't prepared. Yeah. For the unexpected. And it's hard because, like, you don't want to have to ask questions like that, but they are necessary. And when the time comes and it's too late, it can be really, really difficult to know what to do or to deal with grief when you don't know the answer to a lot of.

[David]

Things I say all the time. I don't want that game to be for Grievers. I don't want you to have to have lost a parent to want to buy that game. And that's my huge audience is Grievers, because they understand. I'm like, I want to get ahead of grief. That's why I sent it to people who don't relate to it because I'm like, you shouldn't have to have a dead parent to want to play. I'm like trying to send it to people. It's like, play while you have the time. Or even just like having stepchildren in the picture. Like, there's so many things that they probably don't know how to ask or like, they didn't know about you because they just don't think like that.

[Catherine]

Totally.

[David]

We have a lot of people that are like, I have a blended family. And they play it. So I'm like, it's just a huge. It hits a lot of people. And like you said, you just don't know until you know. And you don't even know to start asking until it's too late. And that's why nevers crossed out, because it's questions I got to ask as a consumer. But I put never because obviously I got to not ask them.

[Catherine]

Yeah, no, I love that. And I, I think too, like, I think about my kids in the future because there's such a large age gap. Like My oldest is 15 and then 13, and then we have a 6 and a 3 year old. Yeah. So like a lot of the girls lives, the kids won't remember, like my youngest kids. So I think as they get older too, as a blended family, those will be really important questions to ask. And I love it. I love that you did that. You obviously came from a different background, kind of like me. You came from a different career. How, like, where did you start working? What was your career? And then how did you get started in social media?

[David]

I started in the bank, so I didn't finish college.

[Catherine]

Finance, Girly, period.

[David]

I love money. Excel spreadsheets, like Excel. I need to deal with you. So I started just in the accounting world. I worked my way up and I actually loved my job. It was never my intent to quit. I never like. But I've also grown up with social media. I remember in 8th grade Snapchat came out and I've just always been on Snapchat. Like, yeah, I was the girly that you would have to like, tap through my stories, be like, okay, she's so annoying. And then genuinely with the dog filter. Absolutely. And the rainbow, whatever. That would come out of your mouth.

[Catherine]

Yeah, yeah, that would come out of your mouth.

[David]

Yeah. So my dad was a big presence because my husband and I lived with my dad. So my husband and I, like, we didn't really have Money. We were getting married, we bought a house. We were renovating the house. So we're living in my dad's basement. My dad and I just really got along. And it was him, my dad or my dad. Me and my husband, we were always like making funny tick tocks, whatever. Well, then my dad died and I got three days of bereavement. And again, if you know, you know, three days is bullshit.

[Catherine]

I actually worked with a nurse that had two young kids. Her husband was diagnosed with, I believe it was stage four cancer when she was nine months pregnant with their second. And he passed within like six months. And everyone at the hospital donated hours because her bereavement was like nothing and she would have to use all of her pto, which she needed to support her young kids. I think it's crazy. Like bereavement and maternity leave are crazy in America.

[David]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Raphael did the same thing. He donated hours to someone on maternity. That's amazing because he had and into the government. You just rack him up. He was donating him.

[Catherine]

I'm like, no, that's amazing.

[David]

I'm like expecting her back after that. Yeah. Anyways, so my three days of bereavement was up and thank God I was with a firm that was very understanding. They let me apply for FMLA. I took 30 days of leave. So my 30 day call had came. I extended for another 30 days. On the 60th day they called me and mind you, like my social media was probably at like 500 000, 500 to 700 maybe at this time. But it wasn't like flowing because I wasn't chasing it like that. I was just doing it for fun. And I really didn't like care about the brand just because again, I love my job. It was never my intention, but my call came with my manager to extend another 30 days. And as I'm on that call, I kind of had a feeling I wasn't going back. I was like, but I get a call and I always take my calls on speaker. A Gmail popped up and it was a brand deal for like three months worth of my bills. It was the biggest one that I had ever gotten at that time. And I just out of the blue I was like, you know what, I don't think I'm going to come back, but I really need to talk to my husband about this. I got off that call and I'm like, I'm still shaking because I like that day was just so life changing for me. And we sat in bed and he was like, I trust in you. Like, let's do it. And I sent an email just, like, thanking them. Like, thanking them for giving me that 60 days of peace to just kind of, like, figure out my life. And here we are. And I quit. I literally sent an email, and I was like, thank you guys, but I won't be returning. And we never looked back. And I really say that there was two main people in that. It was my dad from above, like, guiding me, but also just, like, the support of a husband and, like, pushing you, especially in a female role, like, to be seen and bullied by so many people, but to have a man that stands behind you and is like, there's 20 people that want you to fall, but there's 2 million that want to see you succeed. Like, just keep going. Just keep pushing through this. And again, it's changed my life, so.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

But I loved. I loved my job.

[Catherine]

I feel like I've had this conversation with so many people in this industry, but it takes a certain type of husband to be behind a woman online. And, you know, I've also dealt with this in my personal life where I feel like people read so many things about you or comments or opinions that usually are lies or people are just jealous, whatever the case may be, and that can affect and bleed into your personal relationships.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And I've had people in my personal life judge me or maybe end a relationship or not want to be associated with me anymore just because of what people online think about me. And there's nothing more hurtful than that because, like, trying to shake them. Like, you know me as a person, how can you believe this about me? Or how can you say this? But when you have, like, your. Your consistent, stagnant person, which is your spouse, and they're like, it doesn't matter. Like, you don't want that person in your life anyways. And you also kind of realize, like, you're the only opinion that matters. Like, for me, it's like the close people in my life, my husband, my kids, that's all that matters. You know, everything else is just kind of noise. But it's also, like, a very scary thing to fully count on social media as an income, because it is so ebb and flow, and it can end at any time. So to have your support person believe in you, that changes everything.

[David]

Absolutely. To the comment about people wanting to. I just. What's that saying where it's like, if you've. If it's that easy to lose you, you didn't have me to Begin with, you know, like. Yeah, and we went through that. I had a really, really, really, really close friend that for whatever reason decided to sign up for email updates on my Reddit thread. Oh, she was my best friend at the time. Yeah.

[Catherine]

How did you figure that out?

[David]

Because she was fighting with me over stuff that was being said. Like if I would be out with someone and I would say, for example, like you and I go out to dinner and I tag you and the next night we go out and I don't tag her. That was one of the fights is that I had tag. I didn't tag her. And someone like screenshotted it and put it on Reddit and was like Katherine's clout chasing with this person cuz she tagged her but doesn't even tag her best friend. And like that was one of the fights. And it was like my biggest question is why the are you signed up for my Reddit threads?

[Catherine]

Like what Reddit is, in my opinion.

[David]

It needs to be burned down.

[Catherine]

I think it is the most toxic place in the world. Like the things. By the way, I will say I've never in my entire life looked at anything on Reddit about myself, not one single time. Because I knew if I ever opened that can of worms, not only would it not be good for my depression, my suicidal ideation, but I would never stop. I would become obsessed. And I would also, like, you want to defend it? Yeah. And like, I used to read comments. I don't read comments or anything anymore, but when I used to read comments, I almost took it like constructive criticism. And I would start changing things about myself and then I realized I'm not going to win either way because they're still going to be mad and. And that's all that Reddit's gonna be. But it was brought. I didn't even know about a Reddit existing about me. And then it was brought to my attention legally because they leaked the layout of my home and said which children's rooms are which windows on the outside of my house and like how to access them.

[David]

Yeah. Remember I reached out to you? Yeah.

[Catherine]

It was fucking crazy.

[David]

Except I don't have kids in the house, thank fucking God.

[Catherine]

It was crazy. And I was like, there's two things that make me laugh about it. Number one, people that say I show my kids on the Internet and have a problem with it, but then they risk their lives by sharing the layout of my house and saying what their bedrooms are. And then number two is, why are you so obsessed? Like, why is it to the point where you want to risk my family's life, like, their safety.

[David]

Didn't you say it was like, a mom too?

[Catherine]

Yeah, I was a mom of four. That's crazy. Yeah, that is crazy.

[David]

Is she, like. Did she get in trouble for that?

[Catherine]

Well, it's funny because my. I apparently had, like, a main Reddit account that had tens of thousands of followers. It legally got taken down and they were all really mad about it. But when you spread lies, there's legal things involved, like defamation of character, the safety of my children. Do you know what they would do every Monday? Happy Monday. Time to leave. A one star review and a bad comment on Cheers. And they would illegally download my episode, post it on Reddit so I wouldn't get listens or, like, views. So they would watch it on Reddit.

[David]

They're just fans.

[Catherine]

That's copyright. You can't do that.

[David]

Wait, so did you sue? I'm like, give me the tea.

[Catherine]

We know we have their names, but the Reddit got removed and it was internally flagged. So anytime they make new accounts, they just get internally flagged and taken down. So they're mad about it. But it's funny because, like, we track their IP address and I'm like, you have kids at home. Like, I can see where you work. I can see what your husband's name is. I can see the city you live in. I can see your four children's names. What would they think as they get older? That their mom, while they're playing in their house, is on her phone or on the computer wanting someone to end their life.

[David]

What makes me sad is I'm like, how do you talk to your kids?

[Catherine]

Right.

[David]

I have this older lady who harasses the hell out of me, and I kind of dove into her life and she has, like, a young daughter in college.

[Avery Woods]

Isn't it sad?

[David]

And I literally responded to her. I was like, I pray you don't talk to. Used her daughter's name like this.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And she was like, I'm just giving you feedback. And I'm like, feedback I didn't ask for.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Like, if you don't like me, unfollow, I'm. I'm not paying you to be here. Like, you do not clock in here.

[Catherine]

Yeah, it's crazy. I think people also just have an issue with, like, outspoken women, because I don't know if you've experienced this, but I feel like the majority of people that I've met from social media are much more, like, reserved online because we really do, like, put up a shell and protect ourselves. But I feel like you and I are the type that just like, speak freely.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And that automatically puts a target on our back and make us. Makes us controversial, which I don't agree with. I think anyone, especially like, in the podcasting world, any man can say whatever the they want, but the second it comes out of a woman's mouth, we get. And I think it's.

[David]

Yeah, I agree, it's tough. It's tough. Cuz exactly, like, what you say, you take it as like, feedback and you're like, do I change? Like, I play that in my head all the time. You have no. Like over the last. Probably the last year, I watch back and I cut out and I cut out and I re edit and I re film. And I'm like, when did I become so concerned about what I'm saying? I know, and it honestly bothers me. But then even, like, I'll hear him where he'll be like, oh, you should maybe like, redo that, or, oh, maybe you should take that out. And I'm like, now he's even, like, seeing how much criticism I've gotten, and he'll be like, no, maybe that's not the best. And it's crazy because it's not even like, anything wild. I'm not sitting here saying, like, some wild. I'm literally just talking. Yeah, it's nuts, it's annoying, it's very frustrating. But what's funny is I cheer everyone else on. So I'm like, always. I don't even if, like, it was someone who came from and did the same. I don't know, Whatever.

[Catherine]

Yeah, I know. I think about when I worked as a nurse and I would watch people in my position and I was like, damn, she's killing it. Like, that's my motivation. Good for her. Never. Even when I was broke as hell, working crazy hours, working during COVID pregnant, I was never like, that girl.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

I hate that she's successful and makes money. I was like, I'm going to be that.

[David]

Yeah. I'm like, how'd you do it?

[Catherine]

No, seriously. I'm like, what's your secret? Like, I want to do the same thing. Anyways, I was like, we can talk about this. I'm like, anyways, I want to hear the story about how you guys met because you're just the sweetest and I'm obsessed with you guys.

[David]

Yeah. So we're both from Florida.

[Catherine]

Okay.

[David]

Buckle up.

[Catherine]

Wait, where in Florida?

[David]

I'm from the Clearwater area, right outside of Tampa.

[Catherine]

Okay. Yeah, we go to Destin every year.

[David]

But it's like the Panhandle. Okay, so Tampa Bay.

[Catherine]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, there.

[David]

It's the middle of the state. And then he's from Orlando. Okay, okay. So invisible strings. So I was raised in Florida with my mom. My dad lived in Minnesota. Raphael's parents got a job in la. So he was out in la, did football here. He got recruited, was like top in the country, period. Went to college for football and ended up. His story is. His story ended up in Minnesota for football. Was playing there. Right. Okay. I got in a fight with my mom. I got sent to my dad's in Minnesota. Very weird. So a couple years goes past, I'm working at the bank. I was at Wells Fargo. He came in, he has a whole Florida sleeve tattoo on his arm. And I was like, 407, Orlando. He was like, how the do you know that? And I was like, 727, Tampa, Orlando. Yeah. Anyways, because Minnesota boys are like, not it. No offense, but. Or like actually full offense. Take that as criticism. Okay. Anyways, so we got each other's Snapchats. This is years ago. Eight or nine years ago.

[Catherine]

Not the Snapchat exchange.

[David]

Well, because we're seven. Six years apart. We're six years apart. And I actually was like in an on and off again relationship. It was really horrible. Very toxic. But was still living with the guy. But we were on our off, so got each other Snapchats. It was too. It was too serious to get numbers, you know. So over the years, like four years had gone past and I was always running into him all the time.

[Catherine]

Four years?

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

What?

[David]

Huh? He would like bounce at the bars on the weekends because, like. And I never I. To the. To that day, I didn't know his first name. I knew nothing because he goes by Wash because our last name's Washington. And football, they called him Wash, whatever. Never even knew his first name. I had him in my phone as a ghost emoji because again, I'm like in a very toxic relationship where I was like, I'm not trying to get. Whatever. Anyways, so time goes on. We consistently ran into each other all the time. I end up moving downtown, I get jury duty, and I posted on my Snapchat that I was at the courthouse. Didn't say why I was at the courthouse. He slides up on my story and was like, what judge do I need to talk to? Mind you, I really don't know anything about this man. And I was like, what do you mean? What judge Do I need to talk to. He's like, what trouble are you in? I was like, no, I'm here for jury duty. This is in January of 2020. So we ended up. He was like, hey, do you still have your boyfriend? And I was like, no. I was like, are you seeing anyone?

[Catherine]

No.

[David]

Okay, so CO hits two days into co. I'm like, I'm going to. I messaged him on Snapchat. I was like, I'm going to Cheesecake Factory to get cheesecake. Do you want some? He was like, sure. I pull up to his apartment. He's three blocks from my apartment. Yeah, we live downtown together. Didn't know that. Have been together literally ever since, but come to find out. So again, I'm from Florida. He's from Florida. He has a brother my mom's age. His oldest brother is my mom's age. And his daughter is my age. So his niece is my age. She worked with my stepsister, which was really weird. Cause, like, very weird. So then also my stepsister married a guy who's from where. He went and played football in California. So we were like. It was just all these invisible strings that, like, kept. It was just weird. But that's how we met. Long story long.

[Catherine]

So it was. It was meant to be.

[David]

Absolutely meant to be. We dated for about a year, we got engaged. We were married nine months later. And I just, like, they say when you know, you know. But I genuinely. Okay. So when I met him and got his Snapchat, we went on one date, like, again in that month that I was off with someone and the day didn't go well. But I left that date, like, no, that's okay. Like, I'm not really about that. But then I kept just being so pulled to this man. And I was like, why? I remember sitting at a bar with my girlfriends, and I had said to them I was in a full relationship with the ex boyfriend. And I was talking to my girlfriends. I was like, when that guy is ready for me, I will leave whoever I'm with that's my husband. And at our wedding, I said that in the vows, and everyone standing behind me was like, yeah, she's batshit crazy. But it worked. I'm like, I just always knew. I don't know. And now, like, again, looking back, 100%, we were meant for each other. And I really believe that God both made us together. Like, we're very much. And it's like sometimes I look at our horoscopes, I'm like, holy. Like, all that stuff. Like, Everything about us is very yin and yang, but we balance so well. It's like, it's absolutely crazy, but we have so much fun.

[Catherine]

You said you're six years apart. So are my husband and I. We're six years apart too.

[David]

Aren't they hot?

[Catherine]

Yeah. Oh, people, people, people hate it though, because I met him when I was like two months before I turned 19. So like you were 18 and he was 24. I'm like, okay, now we're 30 and 36. Sue me.

[David]

Right? Like we were 20 and 26. Raphael's behind the camera.

[Catherine]

I'm like, babe, it's okay. We've been together for 12 years. I'm like, do you want to give.

[David]

Me notes on how to get a hot older man?

[Catherine]

No, Literally, I'm like, have fun dating a 20 year old boy. So you've talked about starting a family, having kids. What's that journey look like for you guys?

[David]

We've been sharing our struggles. What's. Okay, so this is like a two edged sword. I've always leaned towards no. And I've publicized.

[Catherine]

No, I didn't know that. Okay.

[David]

And we're getting ripped to shreds right.

[Catherine]

Now because you said that.

[David]

Because we've always leaned no.

[Catherine]

And that's your choice to make. If you are set and not having children, that is a very impactful, important decision that you are making.

[David]

Oh, absolutely.

[Catherine]

Because unless you are 120, sure no one should be having children. If you're not ready to fully give up your life to put your kids first, kids deserve better. Yeah, like that's. I'm. I think it's a very brave decision and a very important story to share because there's a lot of people in your position that think the same. And I think that they're shamed in that because when you're a woman our age, a child bearing age, it's like, where's your kids? Why aren't you pregnant?

[David]

You know, here's the things that people are mad about. One, I've always leaned no. Publicly leaned no. Like I've probably actually said online, no. Like, not even I'm leaning no. I've probably. I don't have exact videos, but I'm sure there's people out there that are like, no, Catherine, I've heard you say no one. You don't know exactly what I was in. I was in Minnesota, my dad's family, my dad's wife and her. Like, it was just a very, very toxic situation. Like, I remember going to Costco and running into someone that looked like her. And I had, like, almost a full panic attack because after his death, like, it was just this whole. It was horrible. I couldn't imagine raising a kid in Minnesota, being around, just having anxiety, just being around the situation. I didn't. After my dad's death, too. I'm like, I didn't want a world where I had children and my dad didn't know them. I didn't want a world where my kids didn't know my dad. Like, there was so much to it. The money was different. Raphael's job in Minnesota was so much different than what it was in Texas. Than what it is in Texas. And it's just like, a lot of pieces. Then we moved to Texas and we started to breathe. And not only breathe, but we started to, like, our marriage grew so much. And it's like, I don't want to say, like, it came, like, it was bad before. I thought it was great before, but now I'm like, holy, how much deeper we've gotten when it was just two, like, just the two of us figuring out life. And I'm like, I would love a kid. I would love to bring a baby into this. I would love to share our love with them. Anyways, so what That's a big problem is going from yes to no or no to yes. And then now I've been talking about. Because I'm huge into, like, I know it's not necessarily easy to get pregnant. They say wait up to a year before you go to infertility. But I'm like, two healthy human beings. And y' all be like, what do you mean we're not getting pregnant? I'm not stupid. And so many people. Because I'm advocating for that year long gap between waiting to see if we're infertile. And I'm talking about, like, struggling to get pregnant. I've never said we're infertile, but the infertile people like the women that have. And I'm like, that's a journey in itself. And I respect that. I'm sorry for what you're going through, but I'm getting ripped to shreds being like, just wait till you're seven years deep. And I'm like, but stop invalidating what the women go through in this year.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And I ended up going to the doctor early because I had said, like, I don't. I didn't even bring up, like, we're struggling to get pregnant. I was like, something's wrong in my body. Because I was to the t. Every Single month for the last six years that I've been off birth control. And I'm like, now I'm 17 days late, 15 days late. I'm having breast issues, I'm having nausea, I can't sleep. I'm like, what the hell is going on? So I called my doctor and they were like, no, yeah, something's obviously wrong. Come to find out I have pcos. And I'm like, okay. But I advocated for myself. And so now I'm online saying, don't say that you're infertile. Like, just say, like, hey, something's wrong in my body. But this time frame is so difficult because I'm like, I'm not invalidating the women that are infertile, but if you're struggling to get pregnant, that still sucks too. And I've never once came out and said, we can't get pregnant. But I'm like, the struggles to get pregnant is still also a mental game. Then I go into, well, I've said no my whole life. Why do I feel bad? Like, why am I upset with myself that I'm not getting pregnant when my whole life, I didn't want this? So there's just like this whole mental game with it. So we've changed our diets, we've done everything that, like, is PCOS friendly. And right now, honestly, we're not trying. We're just kind of hanging out again. Because I'm like, the. Just the mental struggle of, like, feeling.

[Catherine]

Like it's a no every month.

[David]

Yeah, it's hard. It's. And it's like, I don't know, it's just something that I was like, the way I was getting ripped to shreds. I'm like, okay, maybe let me just chill and like, have fun and maybe it'll happen.

[Catherine]

But yeah, I, I think going back to what you said before too, about how first it was a no, now it's. Everyone changes, everyone evolves. And I also think where you're at in life is very important. Like, we have very close friends of ours that we've known for 10 years, and they were both so adamant. No kids. No kids. No kids. And they started dating, got married, and now they have a one year old. Like, that changed for them, like getting married and finding a partner that you're like, I could envision, like, creating life together and like raising kids together. That's a normal thing. And I think the fact that people don't give you grace and being like, well, my frontal lobe is now developed and I feel like I'M ready to be a mom. That's okay. That's a normal thing. Yes. And also, whether you're struggling for a year or five years, that doesn't mean it hurts any less. And I think that those moms that are trying and not getting pregnant and coming after you, I think that's something that they're very hurt about.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And maybe, you know, projecting because they're upset. But I also think, as women, like, we should encourage each other and be there for people that are going through the same things as us trying, whether it's for a short amount of time or a long amount of time.

[David]

And the community of that under a year is huge.

[Catherine]

Yes, it's huge.

[David]

So it's like, I don't care if you talk shit about me, but it's all the women in my comment section saying, thank you for advocating for this, because I feel uncomfortable complaining. But, like, six months is still a long time. Like, to know some again, when you're two healthy people, like, you're doing everything to a T. Like, you know you're ovulating. You know you're doing everything that you're supposed to be doing. You're like, what is wrong? Like, that's. But you can't go to the doctor yet. It's like, that's a. A year is a long time.

[Catherine]

It is.

[David]

And then you just sit there and like, what's wrong with me? What did I do? And you have no answers because you can't go to a doctor yet. Like, that year sucks.

[Catherine]

It does.

[David]

And when you just hear, like, when I see other women, like, comment to other people, and, like, I've. It's just crazy. And I'm like, It makes me sad because I'm like, I get the women that have waited for more than a year. I know that that's hard because clearly I'm under a year, and it's still hard. But to rip the people in my comment sections apart, being like, well, you've only been trying for six months. Shut up. It's like, it's just nuts to me. It's hard.

[Catherine]

And also, like, have a little bit of grace and, like, compassion and empathy. I think people that are keyboard warriors, like, we've lost empathy in this world. And it just makes me really.

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[Scott]

Thanks.

[David]

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[David]

Not right now. @ T Mobile. I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Avery Woods]

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[David]

Oh, let's see.

[Catherine]

Hand sanitizer.

[Avery Woods]

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[David]

I'm good. Seriously.

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[David]

Really, I'm fine. Oh, I have raisins.

[Scott]

I'm a mom.

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[David]

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[Catherine]

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[David]

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[Catherine]

Download the app to today that you are very honest. Like, you speak your mind on social media, your podcast. Where does that come from? Like, what motivation did you have to just always be yourself and speak about things that most people would not?

[David]

My mom.

[Catherine]

Really?

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

Is that how she is?

[David]

No.

[Catherine]

Oh no, no, no.

[David]

My mom came from a mom who only liked boys and she had three brothers and just her was the only daughter and really just like mentally abused the hell out of my mom. And my mom's got a lot of confidence issues because of it, so she just beat the hell out of confidence into me. She was like, you walk in any room, you own anything, you can do anything. She loves everybody. Like, she, like, I don't worry about bringing anyone around my mom because she's just always taught me that like, just be you, hang out with who you want to hang out with, do good in the world. Like, and still to this day she's like, I don't know where you got it from. I'm like, you like everything that you lacked, you literally just shoved down my throat for so long and. And we butt heads all the time and I sometimes look at her And I'm like. And I've had struggles with her lack of confidence because I'm like, what? Like, I'm like, how did you beat the hell out of this? And like, when I turn around, like, mom, just have a backbone. Like, come on. Like, you know what to do. Yeah, just do it for yourself. But yeah, definitely my mom and then my dad's just funniness was like. He was just very much the same way of like. But he was very outgoing, very confident. He could run any room. So definitely the both of them.

[Catherine]

You guys recently moved to Texas?

[David]

Yep.

[Catherine]

Congratulations. How do you like it?

[David]

I wouldn't say no, I'm just kidding.

[Catherine]

Why?

[David]

It's Texas.

[Catherine]

Why? I heard it's like the place to be. Everyone's moving there. Are you kidding?

[David]

It's a place to be. To save some money and get a nice house.

[Catherine]

You know what? Period.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

Hey, I was in Arizona for a long time for the same reason.

[David]

Remember I text you, I was like. And you were like, yeah, no, yeah. That's how I feel about Dallas. If someone.

[Catherine]

Yeah, yeah. Because you were asking me about Arizona. Yeah. Here's the thing. We bought our house in 2019. Like, we were a cop and a nurse. We were able to buy a good sized house to fill all six of us. And you go where you need to go.

[David]

You know, we just had to get out of Minnesota and we kind of talked. We're like, where do we go? Especially with. I was full time at that point. I'm like, where do I go that will progress my future? Where do I go that you can still have your career? Where do we go to save money? And we always said Texas was our stepping stone. We don't think we're going to be there permanently. We had a two to a five year plan. We ended up the morning we got our A house. We had walked like 40 houses the day before. The next morning we came to check out like four or five of our favorites. And we just so happened. The first house we walked in on second day, it was directly across the street from our house. And I was like, did we see that one yesterday? And the guy was like, no, it just fell from contract this morning. Mind you, when we were looking to buy, we were in phase C of the neighborhood. The guy that fell from contract was in phase A and they honored phase A's price point.

[Catherine]

Oh, damn.

[David]

So day of Closing since then, one neighbor paid 150 more than us. One neighbor paid 120 more than us. House across the street's paying 100 more than us. So we're like.

[Catherine]

We knew.

[David]

We walked into equity, which was the whole goal in Texas, to just kind of settle down and make, like, save some money. And that's just what we've been doing. We don't. I don't love it. It's Texas. And I like. Like, the roads there are horrible. They don't have the infrastructure for it. There's constantly construction. The drivers are just. And I really just blame this on the driving. I hate the driving there.

[Catherine]

Wait, really?

[David]

It is so bad. I literally get in, and I'd pray. I'm like, just please don't take my life today. Like, he has to drive everywhere, because I literally drive like. I drive like a grandma. I'm so scared there. And I normally never drive like that. Like, I grew up in Florida. My. My Florida instructor literally said, don't use blinkers when you're changing lanes, because that gives the opportunity to let someone not let you in. So I don't use blinkers. Well, I used to not. But anyways. Yeah, it's just. And the weather scary. I don't think a lot of people know Dallas is, like, the very end of tornado alley. So, like, our first week living, there are people. Not people, but houses in our neighborhood that were just wood at that time, blown everywhere. Like, storms get so bad there. And I think that's one of the biggest, scariest things for us is, like, we don't really. With natural disasters. We're like, okay.

[Catherine]

I'm like, who does. Yeah, I know. I.

[David]

It's terrifying to just lose everything. And then our thing is, like, we have dogs. But I'm like, I can't imagine raising babies in this house and having to get the dogs out. Like, where do you go?

[Catherine]

Yeah. Do you have a basement?

[David]

Texas can't dig into the ground because it's all clay. Oh, yeah.

[Catherine]

Shows how much I know. Don't you have to have, like, some sort of escape bunker or something for natural disasters like that?

[David]

Is that you're supposed to. But I don't think Dallas was. I don't think Dallas was fully prepared because we're, like, on the eastern side of Dallas. So we're at the very tip of the. Or at the very end of tornado Alley. And, yeah, we have no resources.

[Catherine]

Damn. Yeah.

[David]

The dogs driving away from the storm.

[Catherine]

I guess I spent most of my childhood here in California, but, like, more central coast, and I was in a pretty large earthquake, and I was babysitting when I was, like, 11.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

Because at our schools, we didn't have fire drills. We had earthquake drills. And so we had to learn how to, like, deal with earthquakes. And so I, like, knew to put these kids under the table and stuff. But I remember aftershocks waking me up for, like, the next year because you have aftershocks of an earthquake. So, like, we couldn't have anything on our walls. Yeah. Our street completely cracked in half. Like, people in our town died. But now we're, like, back to earthquake zone. And. Yeah. And I think it was, like, two weeks ago, someone was like, oh, an earthquake just happened. I was like, oh, shit, we're back in natural disaster zones. I feel you.

[David]

When we talked about Florida, I was like, I grew up in hurricanes. Like, Katrina took. It was tough.

[Catherine]

Oh, that's so scary.

[David]

The one that just hit. Hit my hometown and killed a lot of people. Oh, that's so. I'm like, I can't.

[Catherine]

That's so sad.

[David]

I can't.

[Catherine]

So what do you have coming up? What's, like, what's your next plan over the next five years?

[David]

Oh, my God. Deep. I'm like, I didn't think about this one. I want to keep living life.

[Catherine]

Just living life. Like Courtney Kardashian.

[David]

Yeah. I love to just live life. I say that all the time. Like, I like to just speak positivity into the universe and to say, like, I get paid to live my life is the coolest thing ever.

[Catherine]

The best.

[David]

I love to travel. I want to grow the cards into more. I want. I've already have, like, nine renditions, like, for the girls reconnecting couples. Before marriage, like, there was so much positivity and the amount of people that I've met from that. I am doing my first grief panel.

[Catherine]

That's amazing.

[David]

Leading a grief panel. Yeah. So I really want, because I have and, like, not to toot my own horn, but toot, toot. I very much know how to put feelings into words. I don't know where it came from, but I, like, process. I feel them. And then I'm like, okay, how do I articulate them? And then every single time I'm like, every single time I meet people, they're not like, oh, my God, you're so funny. Every single person I meet, they're like, thank you for changing. Thank you for, like, changing my life. Thank you for articulating this for me. Thank you for letting me process my own feelings without like, we just met someone yesterday at a coffee shop, and she was like, my dad's death actually happened before your dad's, but when you were Processing your death. You were helping me because I was such numb. I was so numb from years that I didn't even, like, acknowledge his death. I was in denial. And she was like, I started grieving my dad when you started grieving your dad. And I'm like, how wild is that that me just processing and sharing my life online was able to help people? And I always knew that I was put on earth to help. And when I got a platform, I remember saying to myself, like, why the hell do I have this many followers? Like, I really don't do anything crazy. And then the death happened and the grief. And, like, more and more that I go through, I talk about, and I'm like, this is why. And I really want to continue to use my voice for others who feel like they don't have one. I don't want to say, like, no one has a voice or people that don't have a voice, because everyone has a voice. It's just sometimes you don't feel like you do.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

I want to keep speaking for those. So I'm excited for the grief panel, which is really weird because I'm like, when is that? July in Boston?

[Catherine]

It'll be fun, exciting.

[David]

Yeah. I'm excited.

[Catherine]

You deserve that. You're. You're the perfect person to speak at something like that. Thank you. Because you do articulate yourself very well. And I feel like your grief content, even for people that maybe haven't experienced that, can empathize. And I think it also maybe prepares them for the future if they experience something like that.

[David]

Well, I want to say everyone experiences grief.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And I think that's something that a lot of people think death is grief. But I know so many college athletes that grieved the NBA. You know, they grieved that. I know so many women who have grieved the thought of a child or there's so much grief in life or, like, even an ex boyfriend, where, like, I was. I'm grieving the life that I thought I once had. Everybody experiences grief, and it's just at a different level. And when I hear people all the time being like, you're so strong, I'm like, no, you have it in you, too. You didn't realize that every storm you've weathered your entire life is getting you to the. To the biggest hurricane that you're going to ever experience. But you know how to stay afloat because you've been battling these storms your whole life.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

It's just now you're losing your dad or now you lost your mom or your best friend or your husband or your child. Like, but everyone has it in them because we've all been through shit.

[Catherine]

Totally.

[David]

And that's again, where I'm like, grief. I wanted to talk about it in a way of, like, it's not necessarily just death. And so I'm excited because I'm like, everyone in that room relates to grief. You just don't process grief. You don't put grief on, oh, I didn't make it into my favorite college or my best friend. And I no longer talk. I'm more in best friends. I'm more in the relationships I once had.

[Catherine]

Every day.

[David]

Absolutely.

[Catherine]

I grieve nursing.

[David]

Do you really?

[Catherine]

Yeah, totally. Like, even when I was back there, you know, when I visited for Nurses Week and was talking to some of my old managers and friends, and I just like to stop by when I'm in Arizona. It's nice to see them. But, yeah, like, I see, you know, what they're doing in the rooms, and I just, like, I miss that part of my brain. And, like, obviously my entire life, I wanted to be a nurse since I was a toddler. And so I never expected to be here.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And also, like, I fully expected to be at that unit for my entire career. And, like, I wouldn't have left if I didn't have other opportunities for my family. But it is hard when you have life changes like that, and that is considered grief. I've never really thought about that.

[David]

Yeah. Or just for example, like, say, Scotty one day gets this amazing opportunity. No, but, like, for example. Right.

[Catherine]

Going to happen. I'll pay you more.

[David]

You say you're not going anywhere.

[Catherine]

Nope. Nope.

[David]

But for an example. Right. Like, that would be a huge loss.

[Catherine]

Unfortunately, he wouldn't be alive.

[David]

Sorry, Scotty. You know what? Never mind.

[Catherine]

For murder.

[David]

Don't even get it in your head.

[Catherine]

Everyone here is dying.

[David]

She's the first suspect.

[Catherine]

So the one person I won't be grieving is Scott, because Scott's unfortunately stuck with.

[Scott]

Okay.

[David]

But for example, like, got it. When you're like, you know, you cheer someone on. You're like, I love that. But you miss those moments. Yes. Those memories. I know so many people who graduated college who spent four years in a dorm and they missed that. They missed the life. There's so much that we grieve every single day. I just feel like people don't process it because we think of grief as a lost loved one.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Which obviously, that's the biggest form, in my opinion. But I feel like we're all prepared for it when it comes simply because we've been battling it our whole life.

[Catherine]

Yeah, I definitely grieve like my pre baby body, that's for sure.

[David]

I'm like, okay, so I should be taking more pics right now.

[Catherine]

Oh, my God. No. You're literally so hot.

[David]

No, I'm like. That's why I'm like, I need to.

[Catherine]

I need. You're going to be bump and only bump. I turned into Shamu.

[David]

Did you?

[Catherine]

Yeah. I was an exhibit at SeaWorld. I had like the biggest splash of all time, you know, like the wet zone, like the soap zone. Yeah, that was me.

[David]

I love that.

[Catherine]

Yeah, I love it, Big mama.

[David]

I say this to my friends all the time, though, but you grew a healthy and beautiful baby.

[Catherine]

Oh, yeah. I could give two shits. I was eating dozen Krispy Kreme every day. Like, I did it to myself. And you know what? I relished in it.

[David]

One of my best friends called me the other day and she's three months postpartum right now. And she answered the phone, her hood up, like, her hair messed up.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And I was. I had just taken a coffee. So I answer the phone, I'm like, you look like. She starts crying.

[Catherine]

I'm like, yeah.

[David]

I'm giggling like, I'm like, what's happening? And she was like, I was calling because I just feel so bad about my body. I was like, oh, let me get my life back together right now.

[Catherine]

Wait, do you want to hear a crazy story? Actually, I've never talked about this publicly, so I used to have this friend that's also a very large content creator. No longer in my life, but when I was postpartum with Stevie, I mind you, I exclusively breastfed that child for 14 months. Okay. And I worked. I worked full time as a nurse.

[David]

It's okay.

[Catherine]

Oh, girl. I had to get a lift. It was a whole thing. No, I fixed that. No, they weren't. Nothing about my boobs. Breastfeeding.

[David]

Yeah. Because they got teeth by that age, right?

[Catherine]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. She was ripping on that. I didn't really have feeling anymore, you know? Anyways. Okay, okay. So that's like. I'm very proud of that because I worked as a nurse. Like, I was pumping. I was up all night breastfeeding. I'd go work a 12 and a half hour shift. Like, you know what? You can say whatever you want, but like, I sacrifice those titties. Okay. And that girl loved her milk. But I remember on maternity leave, I was postpartum. David got like, four weeks off with her, which was so nice because with Ziggy, he got three days off. So, like, I had help at home, but then he went back to work. So of course I'm up all night breastfeeding. And then I have a two and a half year old as well. That's like running around trying to potty train him. My life was chaos. I looked like, okay, I was in a nursing bra and sweatpants. I washed my hair, like, once every three months. It was. I was a disaster. But I would always do, like, Q&As on my Instagram. And, like, one thing about me I think everyone's aware of. Like, I don't care how it. Like, I'm here, no makeup. I just don't care.

[David]

It just see me at all stages of life.

[Catherine]

Yeah. And also, like, would you rather me be fake and, like, put on a full B?

[David]

Some people do, you know, which is.

[Catherine]

Crazy to me because I'm like, you're. It's just not relatable. I just don't care. You can say I look ugly or old or whatever, but, like, I just don't care to get ready every day. That's just not me. So I was answering questions and, like, breastfeeding Stevie and, like, I had a messy bun. I look like, listen, I was up the entire night. And I remember specifically in that Q A, I was like. I was showing on my breastfeeding app that she was up, like, eight times.

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Where your kid asks for help with.

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

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[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Don't miss out.

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Most of the time.

[Avery Woods]

I don't even have to ask them to do ixl. They do it on their own because they have so much fun doing it.

[Catherine]

They don't even realize they're learning.

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Today at ixl.com cheers visit ixl.com cheers.

[Avery Woods]

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[Catherine]

Nice. I was getting like 30 minute stretches if that, right? And then David goes and works a ten hour shift. I'm alone. Well, she sent a screenshot of me answering the Q and A and goes, she looks like absolute. I cannot believe that she has the confidence to show herself on the Internet like this.

[David]

She sent that to you on accident?

[Catherine]

No, she sent it to someone else who sent it to me.

[David]

Did you drop her as a friend right?

[Catherine]

Oh yeah, immediately. I also so bad want to tell everyone on the Internet that I drove her to her liposuction procedure that she was never honest about as she's advocating for body positivity, but I never did. You know, that's the kind of stuff and those are the kind of people online that are like, oh my God, I love you, you're amazing. And I'm like, if only you know what she's done behind the scenes. It's crazy because so many people have so many opinions about me, but I'm like, you can't say that I'm doing like that because that's is. I would never even to my biggest hater. That's so mean to me. I will always kill them with kindness.

[David]

Okay, so we were talking about this before. Not me, like, taking over.

[Catherine]

No, please.

[David]

We were talking about this before because this truly drives me nuts. I get. And I was saying to you, like, I see people say this about you. You're no longer relatable because you're no longer a nurse. Same thing with me where people are like, you bought a new house. Like, I followed you when you lived in your parents basement. I'm like, cool. You want me to live in my parents basement for the rest of my life?

[Catherine]

And you cheered me on until I was successful and then you dropped me. Why is that?

[David]

That's my biggest question. But then I just made a video the other day where I was like, but there's people who were going to be successful no matter what in life because they had parents that would never let them fail. They're on benders. They're carrying these $10,000 bags in college, but they post something.

[Catherine]

They have trust funds, but then they.

[David]

Post something like, oh, I'm bloated today. And you're like, oh, thank you for advocating for the bloated girlies. I'm like, what? That is, like, the number one thing. Truly, that is not a lot pisses me off. That is the number one thing that gets to my skin where I'm like, why are certain people on pedestals where they are so relatable, but people who have genuinely come from nothing? Like, I remind people all the time. My husband was homeless at a point in his life. Like, I didn't know stability. There was times in my life where, like, I went to bed hungry because it was easier to sleep than it was to be hungry on my couch, you know, watching tv. So I'm like, I remember at a job, like, looking out the window, hoping my car didn't get repoed, and you're mad that I bought a house.

[Catherine]

House.

[David]

Like, but I just. I. It drives me nuts. How do you deal with that? When you meet people that are, like, put on a pedestal, but you're like, you are not anything that these people think you are.

[Catherine]

Oh, you know, what's actually funny is I feel like a lot of those people are, like, in awe of my story because they've never. Like, no one knows the full story online. Right. And, like, that's my story to share.

[Avery Woods]

And I won't.

[Catherine]

Yeah, probably because no matter what you Say gets picked apart. But I think when people get to know me or come from a different background, they're like, holy shit. Like, that's kind of crazy. But it is different. Like we kind of talked about this before the cameras were on. Which is when people have had the same privilege their whole life. It's not a change. They don't see a drastic change. But when people, you know, have followed me since nursing school and they see where I'm at now, they support you until that success kicks in and you're able to make a change. But they would too. They would do the same exact thing that we've done. And you always will. Especially when everyone relies on you. Like my family relies on me heavily. Like, you know, that's, that's something that people don't see behind the scenes is like the more success I make, the more I will always give and take care of others. Absolutely everyone that works around me is a close friend or family member.

[David]

Creating content genuinely is my passion. People ask me like, what's my hobby? I love to film.

[Catherine]

I love it.

[David]

You know me videos I have on my phone that are like vlogging and documenting my own life that I don't post.

[Avery Woods]

Yeah.

[David]

And I'm like, why would you not chase getting paid to do what you're passionate about? And that's another thing that you had brought up, like how much you give back. That's us too. And I'm like, I know people who are making multi millions of dollars that never wants to care about their community. They don't do anything. And again, you're on a pedestal. I'm like, it just drives me nuts.

[Catherine]

Or like, or when you give back. And like if I ever like vlog me giving back or doing something, which usually is just to put attention positively on a brand that cares. Or maybe a cor. Like St. Jude, who I love so much. And they say you do it for attention. I'm like, if only you knew behind the scenes what I do, the free will and like.

[David]

But if we were to film it, you'd be like, you're doing this for attention.

[Catherine]

And I am so blessed to be able to do that. But I'm like, if I filmed every single thing I did, you would also have an issue. So it's like just.

[David]

Or they're like, we did a huge. We call it the human holidays because our business is human too. And we did like a, a ten thousand dollar giveaway of like gifts and stuff. And they're like, this is just for write off purposes. And I'm like, okay, please. Like, what do you want?

[Catherine]

Literally?

[David]

Because I'm like, either way, I'm still paying taxes. Like, don't worry about that. Like, I'm still, like, I'm still giving to the government as well. But I'm like, why would I not give back to our community if we can? Like, it just doesn't make sense.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Or I get that too, where we did, like, a teacher appreciation, and someone was pissed. And I didn't publicize the teacher appreciation because we just did it for, like, our local schools. And someone was like, like, why do you never care about the teachers? And, like, these people and these people. And, like, I literally sent her photos of us, like, dropping them off at the school.

[Catherine]

So I was like, that's actually hilarious. Because my parents were both teachers. Like, my mom was a. She did kindergarten through second grade and then some special education in between, but for 42 years.

[David]

Oh, my God.

[Catherine]

And my dad was a high school math teacher and golf coach for, like.

[David]

See him being 35.

[Catherine]

Yeah, he was.

[David]

He definitely got hit on.

[Catherine]

He was my math teacher and my sister's math teacher. It was funny because, like, I was the nerd that got A's and, like, loved math, so I got an A in his class, and everyone thought we cheated, and he was like, five years ago, I gave my other kid a D. So. No, but, like, I clear teachers lists all the time so much. Like, my. My. Both my kids, all of their teachers list cleared. I will do anyone that tags me. I will always clear teachers list. But because I don't advertise that, it's. Why the fuck don't you give back to teachers? Why aren't you clearing teachers list? I do, but I don't need a advertise for. I'm just doing it. It's frustrating, you know, but if you share it one time, it's, oh, you just want positive attention. If I wanted it for views, I would be sharing multiple times a week.

[David]

I'm like, I know how to get views, babe.

[Catherine]

Yeah, literally.

[David]

I really know I could start some with literally, if you really want.

[Catherine]

Okay. So apparently you have some questions for me. She had a great idea. And you asked your followers to ask me questions? Yeah.

[David]

I love it.

[Catherine]

Okay. Period. I've never been in the hot seat on my own podcast. I know.

[David]

That's why I wanted to do it.

[Catherine]

Okay.

[David]

Because I have always done the podcast. And I'm like, I'm the interviewer. I was like, I don't know. I don't know. I've never really been the interviewer.

[Catherine]

Now I'm ready. I'm an open book.

[David]

Okay. So you actually asked me this question, so I love that this is one that someone said. I love her energy so much. How is she always so confident?

[Catherine]

Oh, that's so nice. Well, I wasn't for a long time, but I always say having kids made me so confident because I always had really bad body image issues. Like, I went through a bulimia phase in high school. I say phase like it's like, a casual thing. I. Not. It's not funny, but, yeah, I just had really bad. Yeah, I had bad body image issues. And I feel like when I became confident in myself, it was after seeing what my body was capable of. Having kids and also, like, being a working mom, that gave me confidence within. And I also. I'm such a fan of the phrase fake it till you make it, because I feel like when you fake confidence and, like, your presence, you feel that way. And also, confidence is from within. It's not about what you look like. Like I always say in the bedroom, if you're insecure versus confident. Like, a man thinks confidence is so hot no matter what you look like, you know, because you're like, I'm comfortable.

[David]

We love that in men too.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Like, we love a confident man, not a cocky man. Absolutely.

[Catherine]

Exactly. There's a big difference.

[David]

Yeah. Huge difference.

[Catherine]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[David]

Okay. Someone wants to know, what is your skin care routine? Her skin is flawless.

[Catherine]

Oh, my God. I made it. No one knows that. Yeah, I'm excited for that one.

[David]

Which is funny. When you said that, I was like.

[Catherine]

Yeah. I just. I also say all the time, like, I feel like skin has always been number one to me, especially because I.

[Avery Woods]

Was an aesthetic nurse.

[Catherine]

Like, I'm so educated on it because I'm obsessed with it, but I wear makeup maybe two to three times a week, if that.

[David]

Okay. I want to ask you, have you done lasers?

[Catherine]

No. Never.

[David]

Never. It's genuinely just skincare.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And genetics. Yeah.

[Catherine]

Yeah. I mean, my sister was on Accutane.

[David]

So really rude. I. I was expecting, like, a whole laser treatment. I was, like, excited.

[Catherine]

No, I've never done, like, laser Morpheus. I do, like, my sprinkle of Botox, like, in my forehead, my crow's feet, and that always gives you a little glow.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

But I dissolved my filler. That's all gone. But it's. I could not tell you.

[David]

Are you gonna do it back?

[Catherine]

I don't think so.

[David]

Really?

[Catherine]

I don't think so.

[David]

I just dissolved because I. My bottom lip is natural.

[Catherine]

Oh.

[David]

But my top lip is like, okay.

[Catherine]

DSLs.

[David]

Literally for real. So when I. I was migrating, I dissolved it. And then I was like, I ha. I literally have to have top filler simply because my bottom one is just like.

[Catherine]

I want to give it, like, a month for, like, the filler to fully dissolve. Because it takes, like, a few weeks.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And then see where I'm at. But I. I always tell people, like, I. I wore makeup only a couple times a week, and when I do, it's like concealer and liquid blush. Like, I never wear foundation unless I'm at an event. No, I know.

[David]

I see this all the time. And I was like, that's why I was like, no, it has to be lasers. I'm glad that you're advocating for that, like, opposite, though, because I feel like a lot of women feel like they have to spend thousands of dollars on lasers.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Me being one of them.

[Catherine]

No. I think, don't sleep with makeup on. I never touch my face with the inside of my hands. I'm like, super OCD about that. If I have an itch, I'm like this. Because the oils and dirt on the inside of your palms is so bad for you. I change out my pillowcase multiple times a week. That's a big one, too. And then I double cleanse my face even when I'm not wearing makeup.

[David]

Top two favorite cleansers.

[Catherine]

Oh. Used to. The people killing green tea spinach. I've used that since Ziggy. I was pregnant with him. No. When I was pregnant with Ziggy. Fun fact. Which he's turning seven this year. That's crazy. So seven years ago, when I got pregnant with him, my. I, like, that was the first time in my life I had acne. I was like, what the Going on with my face because my hormones were all whacked.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And all of my products had some sort of, like, retinol or peroxide that would pass through the placenta. And so my OB was like, try this. It's an all natural cleanser. And I've used it ever since. For seven years.

[David]

Yeah. That's a long time. Yeah, That's a really long time.

[Catherine]

Obsessed.

[David]

Okay, Good to know. What scares this is actually for both of us. What scares you both about being an influencer? What scares you most about being an influencer?

[Catherine]

Scares me. I mean, probably my safety. Like, that's what I was gonna say. It's funny because people think, even still now, like, I share every part of my life, but I really have, like, slowly become very private. I think people, like, haven't really caught on to that. But like, I pre film a lot of my stuff.

[David]

I was gonna say, I've noticed that.

[Catherine]

I don't show a lot of like, where we live anymore. Yeah. I just got to a point, you.

[David]

Were having people show up at your door every day.

[Catherine]

And we lived in a gated community. Yeah. Like they were following in people. They were leaving messages on our doorbell camera, handwritten notes.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And it gets to a point where of course, sometimes it's flattering and like, you know, they're a fan. And I'm so grateful because I would not have my life or a platform without the people that support me. I'm grateful every day.

[David]

But there's boundaries.

[Catherine]

But there's boundaries. And also, like, I have young kids at home and maybe if my husband's not home and I'm a woman like that, that, that can be scary. And I think that there's a lot of crazy people on the Internet and.

[David]

You know, yeah, we, our answer is the same. It's the safety. We've been followed home. We've had our floor plan leaked. And then also just dealing with his job, he's dealing with very high end criminals. And it's like if something were to go wrong, they don't give a about Raphael's life. They're like, yeah, we know exactly who your wife is. We want to hurt you, not you physically. We want to hurt her so we can hurt you internally.

[Catherine]

That's actually like part of the reason I left nursing, like full time. That was like my final straw in October of 2023, I. So I left PICU in December of 2022 because I wanted to try aesthetic nursing full time. And after the pandemic, everyone on our unit pretty much left. And I was like, I'm not staying here anymore. They were doing like really unsafe patient pairings and it just, just wasn't good because we didn't have staff. So I did aesthetic nursing while I was building up my social media full time. I actually didn't even leave nursing until I think I had like 1.5 million tick tock followers and a full team behind me because I was so scared to leave. Like, I. That's how I support my family. And that was a scary.

[David]

You're raised that you clock in, you get a steady paycheck, you get your 401.

[Catherine]

Oh, yeah, girl. At 16 years old, I pay for my own health insurance. Like, my parents instilled that work ethic in Me and I had an appointment booked for a virtual consult for someone to get Botox, and it was a man. And I was like, okay, whatever. Like, people would come in from out of state because our med spa particularly had, like, a really great incentive program. So people would come, like, travel out. And, like, obviously a lot of these people wanted to meet me, which, again, is flattering, but, like, I am technically a nurse, and, like, I am treating you, so it's going to be professional. And people would start, like, to bring in their friends and, like, make it almost like a photo shoot. And I was like, this is a professional setting.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

So anyways, this guy books a virtual console on Zoom, and we go to sign on, and he's like, oh, my computer's not working. Can we just do it over the phone? And I'm like, okay. And I, like, immediately had a bad vibe. So I got the owner, who's a good friend of mine, with me in a room, and I'll put it on speakerphone, because I was like, I just feel like I need a witness this. I feel like this is weird. Oh, God. And he goes, oh, Avery Wood. Like, you're. You work as a nurse? I said, yeah. He's like, are you registered nurse? I'm like, yeah. And he's like, oh, and you work here? You guys charge this much? And is, like, asking questions about the Botox? And I'm like, yes. And then he, like, starts to get weird, and he's like, oh, and I see you're married. And I said, yes. And he's like, and, like, you have kids and a family. I said, okay, where is this going? Like, this is supposed to be, like, a Botox console. This is freaking me out. And he's like, well, I met someone online that used all your photos, and I wired her over a bunch of money, and then she cut me off and ghosted me. And so I reverse Google Image the photo, and it brought me to your profile, and I had had no way to contact you, so I saw you work at this med spa, so I booked an appointment. So I booked an appointment because I called the FBI and they said I need to contact the actual person using the photos in order to, like, file a report to get my money back. And I was like, was he expecting.

[David]

You to pay him?

[Catherine]

I can't help you with that. It wasn't me. Obviously, you know it wasn't me, because, yeah, it wasn't me. Why the Are you sending someone? I was like, did you talk to this person, like, face to face on the phone? No. I'm like, idiot. Well, obviously. So I was like, I think it's time for me to leave nursing.

[Avery Woods]

So I did.

[Catherine]

Yeah. Yeah.

[David]

Okay. Is there anyone that you're dying to meet?

[Catherine]

Beyonce.

[David]

Really? Mine's Sophia Richie.

[Catherine]

You know what? Do you know what's so funny?

[David]

Don't ruin her for me. Is she.

[Catherine]

No. She's the greatest. And my really close friend Kathleen just did her. Met Galahair. We were just texting. She slapped the house down.

[David]

I was like. Like, that's the only person I ever care about.

[Catherine]

Kathleen does my hair for every event, and she's the greatest. But I met Sophia at an MEJ event. Mej, the hair company obsessed with them. And this was probably in 2023. And I was sitting at the table, and I get a tap on my shoulder, and it was, I heard you're the it girl of TikTok. And I turned my head and it was Sophia Richie.

[David]

And I was like, I would shit myself.

[Catherine]

No, you're literally Sofia Richie. I'm no one. I'm obsessed with her. She's like, the biggest girls girl. Just.

[David]

I was gonna say she gives the best vibe.

[Catherine]

She's such a kind, human, and just like, oh, my God. And I was like, I'm obsessed with your trousers. Where are they from? And she's like, East St. Laurent. And I was like, out of my budget. But I love you. No, she's iconic.

[David]

I was gonna say I can vibe pretty well. Like, people's vibes.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

And I was like, she just gives me the kindest, most amazing person and, like, to just look like her. I'm like, what's it like?

[Catherine]

She's incredible. And like, Kathleen says she's the greatest mom.

[David]

Like, I love that.

[Catherine]

Just the best mom. They're really the sweetest family. Yeah.

[David]

Dream podcast interview Beyonce. I love this. Okay, this is actually a good question. A little controversial.

[Catherine]

Okay.

[David]

Do people go on your podcast because you genuinely like them or for publicity?

[Catherine]

I will say that I turned down a lot of guests.

[David]

Really?

[Catherine]

Yeah. For sure. Because I feel like they either don't really fit the vibe of the podcast. Also, I interact and listen to my audience so much that I know what they want to see. And so I'll always, like, guide that we're technically listed as a comedy podcast just because I like to have fun and, you know, we tell jokes and all of that, but if it's not part of my genre or something, I don't think my audience would click with or I would click with, then, you know, kindly. We Pass. But people obviously approach us to be on, maybe if they have something coming up.

[David]

But.

[Catherine]

If I enjoy the person's content or I want to get to know them a little bit better, I love having them on. I'm also, like, I don't care about numbers or following or engagement. Like, that's not important for me. I think having a podcast gives you the opportunity to have a voice and share people's stories. And whether people know the person or not, I don't really care. Because, honestly, that's like, the beautiful thing about my job is I get to have a conversation with someone and get to know them better or learn something. You know, Like, I learned something with you today about grief, and I loved that.

[David]

Thank you.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

This is one last one that I have, actually. I lied. This one's funny. Would you rather sneeze or fart every time you orgasm?

[Catherine]

I'm dead, probably.

[David]

Really?

[Catherine]

Yeah. Because, like, what if he's down there? I don't want to fart while I'm getting off the. You get pink eye. Poor guy.

[David]

Okay, this is one last one that I have that someone asked. Actually, a lot of people wanted to talk about the blended family, and I don't know if you've ever talked about that, but I came from a blended family, and I had bad blended family. Like, they did better the older we got just because my mom and dad were able to kind of figure it out. What is your blended family look like with the mom's side? Because obviously you have a great relationship with the girls. What does it look like as parents, though?

[Catherine]

I mean, it's been hard. Like, I'm not gonna lie. It's. It's been really difficult. And, like, I've shared little things here and there, but obviously, I will always respect her privacy and the fact that she is their mom. I will never speak down about her. I will never speak down about her in front of the children, ever. All I can do is control my relationship with them. That's the only thing I can do. I can show up for them. I can support them. I can make sure that they have the best life possible and that, you know, they're set up for college and to get a car and have a wedding and these things that will come up, like, you know, that's going to be my responsibility, and that's something that I signed up for, and I'm honored to do that. And also, whether they're my blood or not, they are my children.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

And I will give them everything in life that I've Never had that will be forever, you know, Like, I remember at 19 years old, I went to Target and bought them new swimsuits for summer. Like a normal 19 year old doesn't do that.

[David]

You know, you knew what you signed up for. Yeah, I respect that. Huge. Because I, I went opposite. I had said, I will never marry someone with children simply because of the trauma that my stepmom instilled in me. It wasn't my parents, it was my step parents that like, they, they signed up for something and acted like we showed up at their door. Ten years later, I'm like, no, you signed up for this. No, as an adult. You put a lot on a kid that, like, I'm still healing through as a, as an adult.

[Catherine]

Yeah, like, I remember. And I've, I've always been told, like, you're a very old soul. That's why when I met David and he was 24, my parents weren't surprised because they were like, you've always been very mature for your age. And like, I always wanted to be a mom. I knew I always wanted to be a mom. And so I loved, you know, it was half the time they were with us. Like, that was three and a half days a week, every single week, while I'm a college student working at Starbucks. Like, they were home with us. Like, that was what we did, you know, and they were 4 and 2 when I first met them. And I, I remember, you know, obviously there's hesitancies when it comes to the beginning when you, like, meet each other. But that was something I told her, you know, I really wanted to meet her in front of the girls because I didn't want them to think that there was any animosity. Ziggy and Stevie are starting to ask questions now. They don't understand why their sisters aren't with us all the time or why they have another house. Like, they don't get that. And like David has always said, that's a conversation he's gonna have with them individually when they're older, because that's his story to tell and I respect that fully. But, you know, it's. Fuck, what was I saying? What was I saying?

[David]

What was I going to say? I have one last question to go off of it. So is there any advice that you would give to someone that is struggling, especially being the stepmom or the bonus mom? What is if there's another bonus mom out there that's struggling to co parent with someone else? What's advice that you would give them?

[Catherine]

I didn't ever want her to think that I tried to replace her as a mom. That was my biggest thing. I knew where I stood in that scenario.

[Avery Woods]

I was not their mom.

[Catherine]

And that's one thing, too. Like, they called me Avery until I think around when we were engaged and they chose to call me Mom. Like, that was a choice that they made. That was never like, you call me Mom. Like, I was Avery to them for a lot of years, you know, and. And it was even more of an honor that it was their choice to call me that. You know, that was.

[David]

Did they just one day call you Mom?

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

Did you cry?

[Catherine]

Oh, yeah. Like, and it was always like, that's your choice. Like, we don't ever want you to feel like you have to do that. And it was always like, no, we want to. You know, I think that we've navigated it very well and that it's been, you know, over a decade. And the girls are like, anaya's gonna be driving soon. You know, that's crazy. Like, we're gonna be car shopping for her soon. And that's. There's a lot of life events that are going to be coming up where we're all gonna have to be together. And our number one priority is to focus on the girls, make sure that nothing's awkward and make sure that when it's time to celebrate them, that attention's on them.

[David]

Yeah, like, what you're doing is celebrating them.

[Catherine]

Yes. And, like, I even deal with that when it comes to my job because my littles don't understand. Like, they have no idea what I do for a living. But, like, obviously my oldest girls go to junior high. Like, all of their friends have Tick tock and Instagram. And, like, they see who I am, they know who I am. And that's something I, you know, have empathy for my girls because they don't deserve that. Like, they don't deserve to see horrible things said about their mom, their stepmom, their. Not their bio mom. But when I'm saying mom, me, like, obviously, as a public figure, and that's something that we try to protect them from as much as possible, which is why I went so long without showing them online. You know, I went three years without showing them online. And then that was a decision that they made, that they wanted to be in my content. And that's something that we talk about anytime I share anything. Like, I'll always be like, are you okay if I post this? Is this okay if I post this? You know, that's their decision to make because it's their choice now at, you know, almost 16 and 14 years old, which is.

[David]

How wild is that?

[Catherine]

No, it's crazy because we really grew up together.

[David]

Yeah.

[Catherine]

Like, when I'm 35 and I will be 21.

[David]

That's nuts.

[Catherine]

Yeah. So I was like, girl, we're going to Vegas.

[David]

Can I go to her? 23. Like, invite me, please.

[Catherine]

Yeah. So anyways, I just, you know, you can be as protective as. As you can, but also give them some leniency when it comes to being kids. I just, you know, all I care about is that they're protected, that they have a normal childhood. And they've, again, have grown up with me. Like, they've seen me. They were with me when I was studying my ass off in nursing school. And now I get to take them with me to events to meet Selena Gomez because they're obsessed with her. So it's like, what a privilege. That's such a cool thing to experience with them. And I'm so lucky to do that. And they're. They're all also, like, I will do anything and everything for them because they're the best kids. Like, they are so respectful. They're such good students. They're involved in amazing extracurricular activity. Sydney's so great at volleyball. Anaya is incredible at musical theater and choir. Like, they're so talented. And it's not easy to come from a divorced family so young. Like, that's really fucking hard. And then now to have a stepmom in the public eye that a lot of people give shit to, like, that's really, really hard. So I'm just so proud of, like, their poise and the way that they carry themselves and their emotional intelligence. And, you know, I just. I love them so much, and they are so equally aligned with Ziggy and Stevie. It's not even. It's not even a question.

[David]

You don't even need to, like, defend that. You can just tell. You can feel it. Yeah, because I ate that. That's why I wanted to ask that, because that's hard. It's hard to be a stepmom in that role. Like, I give grace for step moms, actually, because. Exactly, like, what you said, it's like, you. So my issue was my dad was fighting for custody when he got with my stepmom, but we. My parents forced before I was even 1 2, and she was pregnant with her son. So my brother. And she told my dad, you have to pick and choose. Like, we have a kid on the way. Stop Fighting for custody for them.

[Catherine]

That's crazy.

[David]

And. But that's where it was like, you know, like, so I give grace to both sides of the. To both sides of the coin. But I always want to know, because you handle it with such grace and you don't feel like you're at least on your content side. You don't feel like anything is one or the other or higher and less. And even just like with the bio mom, like, you don't feel like you're trying to replace her. Like, you can tell all of that. Yeah, but I think that's really hard, especially in your role of like, maneuvering and like your own children and having them and like making David feel comfortable and all of it. I give you a lot of grace and obviously her as well, too.

[Catherine]

But yeah, I. It's crazy because I met. Well, Dave and I met when I was 18. I think I met the girls when I was 19, and I didn't have Ziggy until I was 23. So for like six years it was just us, you know, so they. I always say, like, they made me a mom, you know, not in a normal, natural way, but like, they taught me how to parent, how to be selfless and like, never put myself first. And as a 19, 20, 21, 22 year old girl, like that, that's. I can't imagine that's a huge sacrifice to make that I look back on, but it was never a question for me. It was never like, is this worth it? Like, oh, I don't want to do this. I. And nothing filled my cup more than being with them, you know, and again, like, they're just the best. They're the best kids ever. And anyone that meets them says that, like, they are just truly. I feel so lucky to have them as my kids, you know? Yeah.

[David]

All the time, even, like, we were meant to be in the roles that we were in.

[Catherine]

Yeah, absolutely. And I sometimes I wish, you know, maybe I was a little bit closer with their mom, but I think that I will always respect her boundaries and what she's okay with. And, you know, I think it's. Again, it's like, it's really hard to mourn what was your life before. And like, that was something that David was in therapy for, for a lot of years in the beginning of our relationship, you know, like, it's hard to go through divorce and split custody. That's a very real thing.

[David]

I can't imagine being his shoes. Giving up two of his kids every few weeks and then back and forth.

[Catherine]

Oh, that's tough. Yeah.

[David]

I remember just watching my dad just ball like a baby every time he had to take us to the airport.

[Catherine]

Yeah.

[David]

But it's life.

[Catherine]

Yep. And you know what? For everything that those kids have been dealt, I just couldn't be more proud. And I can't wait to see what they do. Like, Anaya wants to study music and go to somewhere like NYU and do theater, and Sydney wants to do cosmetology. And I'm like, whatever you guys want to do. I'm just. I'm just so proud of them. So I can't wait for them to be here this summer. We're gonna have so much fun.

[David]

Well, thanks for answering my question.

[Catherine]

Of course. And thank you for being on. You're the best. I just love and adore you so much.

[David]

Thank you.

[Catherine]

What's your. Where can people find you? What are your socials?

[David]

I'm the annoying girl that you've probably scrolled past many times.

[Catherine]

That is so not true.

[David]

Stop Instagram. Tick Tock. All the good stuff. Catherine abs on everything, though. Caddy Abs on Tick Tock because someone stole my username, and then we're like, 10,000 to get it back. I was like, caddy, it is.

[Catherine]

10,000 is crazy.

[David]

I know. It was. And Caddy abs was like my nickname in elementary because that's when mean girls came out. So it was like, yeah, I was caddy. And then.

[Catherine]

Yeah, it just stops in your podcast.

[David]

It's on pause right now. Oh, the cards have just been such a passion of mine. And the podcast was tough. Not tough. I loved it. Again, giving people voices and advocating for a lot of different things in life, but it was too much for me. So I don't know when it'll be back and if it'll be back. A lot of people are like, are you canceling it? I'm like, you know what? For right now, I'm just chilling.

[Catherine]

We're just pausing. And there's nothing wrong with that. Well, I love you, I'm proud of you, and I can't wait to see what you do the rest of the year.

[David]

Thank you. Cheers.

[Catherine]

Cheers.

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[Catherine]

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