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- [00:08]
A
Welcome again to Christ in Prophecy. We certainly live in interesting times along the lines of the Veiled Omen. May you live in interesting times.
- [00:17]
B
But from a biblical perspective, can you think of any more exciting time to be alive? We are witnessing the fulfillment of Bible prophecies that previous generations could only anticipate and and hope to see within their lifetimes.
- [00:29]
A
That's exactly right. Not only do we have the blessing of hindsight to realize all that has transpired over the past 2,000 years, from the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ to the sharing of the Gospel around the world, to the re establishment of Israel in the middle of the 20th century, faithful followers of Christ long to see what we take for granted.
- [00:48]
B
But in recent years, the signs pointing to Jesus soon return have accelerated and begun to converge like never before, to the point that many Christians are quite overwhelmed and even alarmed.
- [00:59]
A
Our guest today is a man who is uniquely gifted at cutting through the confusion and explaining prophetic truths with clarity and joy. He is a bold proclaimer of the Gospel of Jesus Christ and has been given countless opportunities to share that wonderful truth in settings often perceived as hostile to Christianity. I'm speaking, of course, of Pastor Robert Jeffress of the First Baptist Church in Dallas, Texas, and a cherished friend to Lamb and Lion Ministries. Robert, welcome back to Christ in Prophecy.
- [01:26]
C
Well, it's great to be back with you. Thanks so much for having me.
- [01:30]
A
You know, I am always amazed and frankly eternally grateful that you are so quick to respond when I reach out to you. I know men of much less busyness who will not respond to calls, but you always do. And so I'm so grateful that you are gracious with your time and, and with your encouragement, even your mentorship. Thank you very much. Personally.
- [01:50]
C
Well, I believe, and we at First Baptist Dallas believe in the ministry of Lamb and Lion Ministries. You are a beacon for the Gospel and we just so appreciate what you're doing and reminding everyone of the soon return of Jesus Christ.
- [02:04]
A
Well, I often listen to your sermons and your teachings that are shared through pathway to victory.
- [02:09]
C
And you had me anyway.
- [02:11]
A
Well, I really do. I listen to. And you've often returned throughout those teachings over and over again to the theme that we are living in the end times. Personally, what made you aware that of all the generations of Christians who have lived over the past 2000 years, ours is unique in what we are witnessing?
- [02:29]
C
Well, as you know, I make a distinction and I think the Bible does in the last days, in the end times. I technically refer to the end times as that final seven year period, beginning with the Antichrist signing the peace treaty with Israel, ending with Armageddon and the return of Jesus Christ. So although I don't think we are in the end times those final seven years quite yet, we are in what the Bible calls the last days. The last days begin when Jesus ascended back into heaven over 2000 years ago and extends until we hit that seven year end times. And I think we are definitely in the last days. As Paul said, we're closer today than we were when we first believed. And when I think about that, I always think about an experience I had years ago. When I first started working with Fox News. I was on a program with the late Alan Combs, who used to be Sean Hannity's partner on Hannity and Combs. And Alan was Jewish, and he would have me on to kind of ridicule me, but in a good natured way about my beliefs. And one night on his program he said, pastor Jeffress, do you think you're going to live to return? You're going to live to see the return of Jesus Christ on earth? And I said, alan, I really don't know, but it really doesn't matter. And he was kind of shocked by that. He said, what do you mean it doesn't matter? And I said, well, I know in the next 30 or 40 years one of two things is going to happen. Either Jesus is coming or I'm going. But I'm in the end times for me. And so, you know, I think one reason as I get older, I preach about it perhaps more is I realize and perhaps our audience realizes how close we're getting to the end, whether it's the end of this world or the end of our life on this world. And we are closer now to the return of Christ than we've ever been.
- [04:29]
A
I know. I like the saying, one person said, if I don't get to heaven soon, my friends are going to think I didn't make it. So whether the Lord comes or I go, either one is a joy I look forward to. You know, Pastor Jeffress, when we first met in late 2020, it was because I was interviewing you for a series we called God's Prophetic Voices to America. And now, less than six years later, it feels like the very signs that we talk about are indeed increasing in frequency and intensity. Day by day, we're seeing developments that were just hard to imagine a few years ago. So what do you think is the greatest sign of the return of Jesus? And that it is an imminent event and by that we mean it could happen at any time, not that we are setting a date or declaring it will occur with human immediacy.
- [05:14]
C
Well, I like the image you use talking about the birth pains because that's what Jesus described when he was talking about the end times in Matthew 24 and 25, the end times. He compared it to the birth pangs that a mother feels. You know, a mother can go through labor pains, but when those labor, tame labor pains increase, as you said, in both frequency and intensity, she knows something big is about to happen. And it's the same way when we look around the world. And in some senses, I mean, some of the things we've seen, wars and rumors of wars, famines, earthquakes, immorality, apostasy, they've been around from the beginning. But I think we're seeing these things increase in intensity and frequency, which I think is a sign that something is going to happen. You know, we talk about the Middle east and what's happening there, and I think we have to be careful not to try to read something prophetically significant in every daily headline from the newspaper or on the news feed. But we need to see the pattern. And I think there are some things we're seeing right now that are unique. I think, for example, support for Israel, even in our own country, it is plummeting. Every poll shows that Americans, even conservatives, are less and less inclined to support the nation of Israel. I think that's leading us to that time when Israel is going to stand alone against the rest of the world. You know, we talk about discord in the Middle east. That's been going on for thousands of years. But two words make this time different. Nuclear weapons. I mean, remember, not since the founding, before the founding of Israel in 1948. The current state of Israel, of course, is what I'm talking about at that. Before that time, there was no such thing as a nuclear weapon. But it was around in the 1940s that we developed those nuclear weapons and used them against Japan. And there's every reason to think that this nuclear threat is what's going to bring the enemies of Israel to the plain of Jezreel for that final battle. So I think we have to say, yes, we've been here before, but never with this intensity.
- [07:34]
B
Well, as we're seeing Israel battle Iran, what is the future, as the Bible says, between Iran and Israel?
- [07:40]
C
Well, the future. A lot of people believe there's going to be a skirmish that turns into a war either before the tribulation or perhaps as a part of the tribulation. And Israel's going to be successful, and people are going to be amazed at Israel's success. I can't pinpoint exactly who those people are that Israel will be fighting, but it very well could be Iran. But what I do know is this. I know in the end times, everyone is going to abandon Israel. I know, for example, that the United States of America as it exists now, will no longer exist. In those final seven days, final seven years of Earth's history, either America will cease to exist or she will be absorbed as part of the 10 nation confederacy that is ruled over by Antichrist. And it's just going to be interesting to see how all of this unfolds. But we know that in the end, Israel is going to endure believing Israel, those who accept Christ as their Savior. And think about it, Israel is the only nation in the the world that has been given the promise of endurance. God created Israel to be an object lesson of his power, his faithfulness, his love. And to touch Israel is to touch what the Bible calls the apple of God's eye. And so, you know, short term there's going to be some real turbulence and I think increasing persecution of Israel, but in the long term, God's going to fulfill his promise to believe in Israel.
- [09:16]
A
Obviously, I appreciate what you said about not getting fixated on any one daily headline. I liken it to connecting the dots. You don't want to focus too much on an individual dot. You want to step back to see the pattern. As you said. I also believe that even as we like to categorize wars, whether it's the war of independence or the Yom Kippur War, the Six Day War, or now the war with Iran. I think all of these are skirmishes in a much longer battle for Israel that may soon culminate in what we think of as the Psalm 83 outcome where Israel finally has peace among its surrounding neighbors. But I want to turn our attention to one thing you just touched on, Pastor, and that is the growing anti Semitism and even deception. And as the pastor of a large church, a very gifted pastor, what would you say to Christians who are being swept away by some of the anti Semitism and really the propaganda related to Israel today?
- [10:12]
C
Well, I think you need to realize, just as you said, that it is propaganda that there are people with a motive behind this anti Semitic rant that we see among many conservative podcasters and media types. And look, I think the reason, frankly, that support for Israel is plummeting is because pastors have failed to teach the truth about what the Bible says about Israel. I think to name names. I think Reformed theology has done a lot to engender hatred of Israel by saying that Israel has been replaced by the church of Jesus Christ. Nothing could be further from the truth. God does have a church. He's got a unique plan for his church, the Bride of Christ. But God has not forsaken his covenant with Israel. Romans 11 tells us. And I think that pastors failure to grasp that truth themselves and to pass it along to their people is one reason people are so quick to turn their back on Israel. They don't rely, they don't understand the simple truth of Genesis 12 when God said to Abraham, I will bless those who bless you and your descendants, and I will curse you those who curse you. And I, as you know, had the Privilege back in 2018 of leading the dedication prayer for our United States Embassy being moved to Jerusalem. And on that day, before Netanyahu and other Israeli officials, I said, to be on the wrong side of Israel is to be on the wrong side of history, but more importantly, on the wrong side of God. And I would just say to anyone listening to this, you know, we talk about defense budgets right now. Our Defense Department is asking for a record number of dollars to support and protect our country. That's all fine and good, but the best thing we can do for our national defense is to be sure we're on God's side on these important issues. Because no army will ever exist that can defend itself against the power of God.
- [12:26]
A
That's exactly what Abraham Lincoln said when asked whether or not the Lord was on his side. He said, I it more important that I'm on God's side. And Pastor, I'm glad you were there in Jerusalem. I also am very grateful that our mutual friend Mike Huckabee is the ambassador to Israel today. I think that's a great point of encouragement.
- [12:45]
B
Well, Pastor Jeffress, if the Lord does tarry, what do you think is the next prophetic event that's going to happen on the prophetic timeline?
- [12:52]
C
Well, I think the next thing that you hinted at earlier was the rapture of the church. I believe there is a rapture of all believers. I think it's clearly taught in numerous places, including First Thessalonians 4. On that day, the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. And then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together to meet the Lord in the air and as you so ably teach through your ministry, there's no prophecy that has to be fulfilled for the Rapture to come. It's imminent. It could happen before we finish this broadcast today. And so I'm looking forward to the Rapture to happen and happen soon.
- [13:35]
A
Well, obviously, Pastor, as we have been blessed to have been born and raised to live and serve the Lord in the United States of America, we know that the United States is about to mark a 250th anniversary here in 2026, a semi quincentennial if people are not familiar with that word. And we share a firm conviction that this nation was founded on Judeo Christian principles. So how would you describe the state of our union a quarter of a millennium later from a heavenly or from a godly perspective?
- [14:06]
C
Well, I wouldn't give it a good prognosis. Frankly, when I look at what's happening in our country now, there are spots of blessing and some bright lights in some places. I'm grateful that we have a president who loves Israel and understands the importance of faith. And as we're taping this broadcast right now, I'm getting ready to speak at the Rededicate 250 ceremony on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. commemorating the 250th anniversary of the first call for prayer for our nation back on May 17, 1776. The Second Continental Congress ordained May 17 as a day of prayer and repentance toward God. John Adams and his wife to Abigail said there ought to be a celebration of America's anniversary every year. And it ought to be filled with shows and celebrations and illuminations, fireworks. But it also ought to be a time of solemn devotion to God. And I believe the President is right in calling for our nation to rededicate ourselves to God. You know, we all talk about America repenting America having revival. If America is going to have a revival, I must first have a revival in my heart. If America is to repent, I must repent. If America is going to rededicate herself to God, then I must rededicate myself to God. Revival begins with me.
- [15:41]
A
I so agree. And that's why I point people to Daniel 9, when he humbled himself first to pray that God would forgive, and he included himself in needing God's forgiveness and in repenting on behalf of his land, let alone the lessons of Jeremiah 29. So beautifully said, Pastor Jeffress.
- [15:59]
B
Pastor Jeffress, we are at least our country was founded on judgeo Christian values. I mean, as Christians, we believe that we live in a Christian country. So to speak, you'll find that Christians love this country more than most other people do. But I don't know about you, but I'm starting to feel like a stranger in a strange land in this nation. What advice do you have for Christians who feel like this country wants Christianity to just get out?
- [16:22]
C
Well, I think we need to not allow the media or social media to exaggerate. You know, Richard Nixon. I'm old enough to remember Richard Nixon back in the 70s, our president who talked about the silent majority. I don't necessarily think we're in a majority any longer as Bible believing Christians, but I still think there are millions of believers out there. So I wouldn't get that discouraged over it. But I'd also remind people that our strength as Christians is not in the number of Christians, it's in the power of the Holy Spirit. And sometimes we tend to have more influence on the culture when we're in minority status rather than majority status. So I do think this is a precarious time. I think we are moving further and further away from God. I know there are talks of revival taking place in America. I don't see what other people are talking about when they talk about that. Yeah, you may have a few rallies here and there, but the fact is, in the last 25 years, we have lost 40 million adults from attending church. In other words, there are 40 million fewer adults attending church than 25 years ago. That is more people than were saved in the first Great Awakening, the Second Great Awakening and all the Billy Graham Crusades combined. I mean, that's unbelievable. And I think if there were a spiritual revival taking place, people would be flocking to God's house, not running from it.
- [17:56]
A
You know, you mentioned that we don't have to be a minority. I'm reminded of Gideon, who the Lord said, I don't need so many. Let some of them go home perhaps. And I don't wish that the numbers would continue to decline in church attendance or in people who profess to be Christians. But maybe some who are just hangers on or just going through the motions of faith have essentially gone home. And so the Lord, with the number, the remnant that is left, he can and will work in a mighty way. We know he can. Whether or not that happens in our land, as you said, and I so appreciate that it must happen in my heart, I must remain dedicated to the Lord and, and serve him boldly wherever he's placed me. And on that note, the Lord really has opened some amazing doors for you to speak biblical truth to Power. You mentioned Alan Combs. I love that story. And in some very unexpected places. So how have you been able to gain an audience with powerful people who often have a reputation for expressing disdain toward religion in general and Christianity in particular?
- [18:58]
C
I'll tell you a funny story about that. First of all, it's only something God has done to open those doors. But a number of years ago, I can't believe it's been 15 years ago. But a number of years ago, I was in the news for a controversial comment I'd made about Mormonism being a cult and so forth, and talking about that, and everybody just went ballistic over it. And as a result, Bill Maher from television, from hbo, invited me to come to Hollywood and be on his program. Well, I thought, if I have a chance to share the gospel, why not go? And so I just immediately accepted the invitation. And then somebody said, you better watch his show before you accept that invitation. So I watched a couple of tapes of it. I thought, oh, my gosh, what have I agreed to? And I thought I was going into the lion's den. And so I took my wife and my youngest daughter. We all flew to Hollywood one Friday, and I went over to CBS to do that show. And, you know, before we left the hotel, my wife and my daughter and I had a little prayer circle, and we prayed for God's protection and that God would open a door to share the gospel. And so we went over there, and I went out, was introduced, and people were booing in the audience and heckling after the first two questions. But then something happened, and they kind of turned around and they started cheering and applauding. And when I said things, and it was one of the most affirmative interviews I've ever had, and getting to share the truth of the gospel. And afterwards, Bill Maher invited us to come to the after party for the show. And so we went to some location, walked in there, the marijuana smoke was wafting through the air. And Bill and I stood over in the corner, and I guess we talked for about 30 minutes. And he said, you know, Pastor, I don't believe one thing you believe, but you are a great representative for your faith. And that was one of the kindest compliments I'd ever had. And I think he was just making mention of the fact that when I talked, I wasn't angry and I wasn't frothing at the mouth, but I talked to him in a respectful way and in a winsome way. And I would just say to people, wherever you are, whether it's In a TV studio or talking to somebody at school or somebody in your neighborhood. Remember, the goal is never to win an argument. The goal is to win a person to Jesus Christ. And that's what it's all about. So I'm grateful for those opportunities. We all have different opportunities like that. That's why Christ left us here instead of rapturing us to heaven when we were saved, so that we can be a light for the gospel.
- [21:42]
B
Well, Pastor, you've written so many books. I've read many of them. We've featured them on Christ in prophecy. Perfect ending. Are we living in the end times? And ask Dr. Jeffress about the end times first. Why, with all the different realms in which the Lord has allowed you to speak, are you so passionate about Bible prophecy? And also, what do you say to Christians who are skeptical about Bible prophecy?
- [22:05]
C
Well, first of all, I'm passionate about it because the Bible speaks so much of it. I mean, just think of the number of books of the Bible. Old Testament, Genesis, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel. Think of the New Testament books that mention the coming of the Lord so frequently. It's such a common theme in scripture. I think not to talk about it and not to understand it is to really miss a lot of what the Bible is saying. But, I mean, if the prophecies are true, that Jesus Christ is coming back again, man, that's the most important thing we could be talking about. And, you know, I'm reminded of a story I tell in perfect ending. True story. January 1961. A few days before the inauguration of John F. Kennedy, Kennedy asked Billy Graham to come down to West Palm and play golf with him. And so they played golf. And they were driving back in Kennedy's convertible. Lincoln convertible. And Kennedy pulled off to the side of the road, stopped the engine, looked at Billy Graham and said, billy, let me ask you something. Do you believe Jesus Christ is coming back to earth one day? And Billy Graham said, yes, sir, I do. Kennedy said, then why do I hear so little about it today? And I think that's an indictment of the church that so few Christians ever hear about the return of Jesus Christ. It's malpractice for a pastor not to remind people that Christ is coming back to judge the wicked and to reward the righteous. And the most important decision we can make is to trust in Christ as our Savior.
- [23:47]
A
Amen. Pastor, if you were given that opportunity, I know you do have the ear of our president today. But if you were talking to other kings and rulers around the world in a private moment, what would you tell them here in the year 2026.
- [24:00]
C
I would tell them the same thing that Billy Graham told John F. Kennedy, that Jesus Christ is returning again and he is the one Daniel 2 says who establishes kings and removes kings. And I just, I think people instinctively know that and I think they need to be reminded of that. I think the president certainly knows that. Our president. I'll tell you kind of a funny story. One time I walked into the Oval Office to say hello while I was there, and there was a well decorated general in the chair in front of him. They had been having a conversation and when I walked in, President Trump said to the general, general, this man is more powerful than you are. And the general kind of looked at him funny, like, what do you mean? He said, general, think about it. Every morning, Robert talks to the one who controls everything that happens in this universe. And I think that's an understanding our president has. And I think it's an understanding every ruler needs to have, that the most powerful person being in the world is God or almighty. And the most important thing in life is to live a life that's pleasing to him.
- [25:21]
B
A true leader is one who knows who's the one really in authority, right?
- [25:24]
C
That's right.
- [25:25]
B
Well, Pastor Jeffress, how can folks get in touch with your ministry and follow Pathway to Victory?
- [25:30]
C
Well, our website at Pathway to victory is ptv.org and you can download all of our messages free of charge, no charge for that, and find out about our ministry.
- [25:41]
A
Robert, I have to tell you how grateful I am and we are personally for your friendship and the encouragement and mentoring you have offered. You've offered me specifically as someone who also followed in the footsteps of another ministry giant. You know how important it is to keep our eyes on Jesus and love him with all our heart, soul and mind and to glorify him with the gifts and talents he has given us.
- [26:02]
C
Well, you are doing a great job of carrying on that legacy of faithfulness to God's word. So thank you for all you're doing at Lamb and Lion Ministries.
- [26:12]
A
Well, thank you, Pastor Jeffress, for sharing your time and insights with us, our viewers today. I will look forward to crossing paths in person with you again soon.
- [26:20]
C
Thank you.
- [26:21]
A
The name of Pastor Jeffress Ministries says it all. Pathway to Victory. There are not many roads to heaven or many paths to everlasting victory.
- [26:29]
B
There is only one way, truth and life. And that is Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, who laid down his life according to the will of the Father, so that all who believe in him might live.
- [26:40]
A
The Christian walk is not a tiptoe through the roses. It is it is a long slog through trials and little t tribulations in this lifetime. But in Christ, those who have trusted in him and keep their eyes on him are more than overcomers.
- [26:54]
B
So we pray that you are already on that straight and narrow path and guaranteed a place in the Father's house. God does not wish that any should perish, but that all will come to repentance and receive his gift of everlasting life.
- [27:06]
A
Pastor Jeffress addressed the question Are We Living in the End Times? In his book by the same title, here is the bottom line. Whether Jesus comes in the next few days or months or years, or whether your mortal life comes to an end, all of us will experience an end to this life just as we experienced a beginning. Our hope is that you have chosen to believe in Jesus Christ unto salvation before it is too late. Only then will you be on the pathway to victory. If Jesus tarries, we'll see you again next week. Godspeed.
- [27:38]
D
Pastor Robert Jeffress is a treasured friend of Lamb and Lion Ministries and a winsome proclaimer of the Gospel. He is also a prolific writer who emphasizes the imminence of Jesus coming for his church. We are delighted to offer two of his wonderful books focusing on the end times. Are We Living in the End times? And ask Dr. Jeffress about the End Times. Both offer insight and encouragement and will be powerful additions to your own library. Just call the number on the screen or visit our online store and we'd be glad to send them to you. And as always, our pricing includes shipping.