Podcast Title: Click Here
Episode: Mic Drop: Take Two Chatbots and Call Me in the Morning
Release Date: July 25, 2025
Host: Dina Temple-Raston
Guest: Dr. Stephen Xenakis
Description: This episode delves into the innovative intersection of psychiatry and artificial intelligence, featuring Dr. Stephen Xenakis, a retired brigadier general and forward-thinking psychiatrist exploring how AI can revolutionize mental health care.
1. Introduction to Dr. Stephen Xenakis
The episode opens with host Dina Temple-Raston reintroducing Dr. Stephen Xenakis, a multifaceted professional with a diverse background. Dr. Xenakis shares his extensive experience:
Dr. Xenakis [00:48]: "I'm a psychiatrist, spent 28 years in the Army. I came in 1970, retired in 1998 as a brigadier general, working with military families and veterans, and do a lot of public health activity as well."
His unique career path includes working with detainees at Guantanamo Bay, advising military officials on the impacts of blast wave concussions, and pioneering the use of psychedelic therapy for PTSD.
2. Traditional Psychiatry vs. AI-Enhanced Psychiatry
Dr. Xenakis introduces his vision for integrating artificial intelligence into psychiatric practice. He contrasts traditional methods with AI-driven approaches:
Dr. Xenakis [05:29]: "We're getting away from questionnaires. That's what I'm trying not to do. I think questionnaires... are too crude."
He criticizes the limitations of standard questionnaires, arguing they fail to capture the nuanced complexities of patient experiences. Instead, he advocates for open-ended interviews supplemented by AI analysis to achieve deeper insights.
3. Implementation of AI in Clinical Interviews
The conversation explores how AI can transform clinical interviews. Dr. Xenakis explains a hypothetical model where patient interviews are analyzed by large language models to identify patterns and correlations beyond human capacity:
Dr. Xenakis [05:55]: "It would just be a raw interview that could be uploaded and compared to what we think is our reference interview or our sentinel. And how close is the correspondence?"
By utilizing AI, clinicians can move beyond multiple-choice assessments, engaging in more naturalistic conversations that AI can interpret for deeper diagnostic accuracy.
4. Potential Impact on Rural Mental Health Care
Dr. Xenakis emphasizes the critical need for AI in underserved areas. He envisions AI as a "force multiplier" that can extend the reach of limited mental health professionals in rural regions:
Dr. Xenakis [11:06]: "I mean, look, I think it'd be particularly helpful outside of our urban areas, places where we don't have a good number of mental health people, and yet we have a number of patients that are really seeking help."
This approach aims to bridge the gap in mental health services in states like Alaska and Wyoming, where the ratio of psychiatrists to population is alarmingly low.
5. Data Integration and Personalization of Treatment
The discussion highlights how AI can leverage vast amounts of patient data to personalize treatment plans. Dr. Xenakis envisions AI systems that compare individual patient data against extensive datasets to predict treatment responses:
Dr. Xenakis [12:44]: "Yeah, exactly. And then it would learn over time, so we would be able to feed that back. The more we do that, the more we learn."
This iterative learning process allows for increasingly accurate predictions on which treatments, such as specific medications or cognitive therapies, would be most effective for each patient.
6. Wearable Technology and Data Collection
Integrating data from wearable devices represents a significant advancement in psychiatric care. Dr. Xenakis discusses how devices like Apple Watches and Fitbits can provide objective data on sleep patterns, physical activity, and physiological metrics:
Dr. Xenakis [14:52]: "So let's look at that, and then let's look at what you did, or let's look at your diet. And the more we have that and we can look at it together, the better decisions we can make."
By incorporating real-time data, psychiatrists can gain a more comprehensive understanding of their patients' lifestyles and health metrics, leading to more informed and effective treatment strategies.
7. Ethical and Humanistic Considerations
While the potential benefits of AI in psychiatry are vast, the episode also addresses the ethical and humanistic concerns. Dr. Xenakis acknowledges the importance of maintaining the human element in psychiatric care:
Dina Temple-Raston [16:12]: "Psychiatry isn't an equation. It isn't about solving for X. It's about people. And people can be messy."
He stresses that while AI can augment the capabilities of clinicians, it cannot replace the empathy and personal connection essential to effective mental health treatment. The balance between technological assistance and human judgment remains a critical consideration.
Conclusion
In this insightful episode of Click Here, Dr. Stephen Xenakis presents a compelling case for the integration of artificial intelligence into psychiatric practice. By leveraging AI to enhance diagnostic precision, personalize treatment, and extend mental health services to underserved areas, psychiatry stands on the brink of a transformative evolution. However, the humanistic aspects of care must remain at the forefront to ensure that technology serves as a complement rather than a replacement for empathetic clinical relationships.
Notable Quotes:
- Dr. Xenakis [05:29]: "We're getting away from questionnaires... are too crude."
- Dr. Xenakis [11:06]: "It'd be particularly helpful outside of our urban areas..."
- Dr. Xenakis [12:44]: "The more we do that, the more we learn."
- Dina Temple-Raston [16:12]: "Psychiatry isn't an equation... It's about people."
This episode offers a thought-provoking exploration of how artificial intelligence can reshape the landscape of mental health care, highlighting both the promising advancements and the essential considerations needed to preserve the integrity of psychiatric practice.