Loading summary
Transcript211 lines
- [00:00]
Nicole Avant
If you love your phone but not your carrier, just switch to T Mobile. You can keep your phone, keep your number and we'll help pay it off up to $800 per line. You can also use our savings calculator to compare our plans and streaming benefits against Verizon and AT&T. So switch and keep your phone, keep your number and keep more of your moolah. @t mobile.com up to 4 lines via virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days qualifying unlock device, credit service port in 90 plus days with device and eligible carrier and timely redemption required. Card has no cash access and expires in six months the Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist whether you're running, swimming or sleeping. And it's the fastest charging Apple watch, getting you 8 hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series 10 available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum compared to previous generations, iPhone Xs are later required. Charge time and actual results will vary.
- [01:01]
Disney Cruise Line
Sail to breathtaking destinations in Alaska or Europe with Disney Cruise Line. Discover where onboard magic meets onshore adventures, where beloved characters Hiya pal. Meet alluring landscapes, where Broadway quality shows meet historic cities, where imaginative dining meets amazing wildlife, and where exciting experiences await the whole family. Book an adventure filled summer Disney cruise to Alaska or Europe.
- [01:30]
Child
My dad works in B2B marketing, but I never really knew what that meant. Then one day my dad came by my school for Career day and told everyone in my class he was a big Roaz man. Then he just kept saying things like the bigger the Roaz the better. Over and over. My friends still laugh at me to this day. I think it means calculating a return on ad spend. One thing's for sure, I'll be known as the Roazman's Kid for the rest of my days. Why couldn't you just be a fireman or a lawyer? Why? You ruined my life, dad.
- [02:05]
LinkedIn
Not everyone gets B2B, but LinkedIn has the people who do. And with ads on LinkedIn, you'll be able to reach people based on job title, industry, likelihood to buy, and more. Start converting your B2B audience into high quality leads today. We'll even give you $100 credit on your next ad campaign. Go to LinkedIn.com customer to claim your credit. That's LinkedIn.com customer. Terms and conditions apply. LinkedIn the place to Be To Be.
- [02:30]
Matt
Hey there, this is Matt and Joel.
- [02:33]
Joel
From the how to Money podcast that's right.
- [02:34]
Matt
Joel and I both love traveling with our families. Actually this past fall break from school, we took a trip to Cape San Blas down there in Florida with some of the families from the kids school. We all got our own Airbnbs. We had a great time.
- [02:47]
Joel
I love staying in an Airbnb, Matt. Plus, while you're traveling, you could be hosting guests in your own home. Now with the Airbnb co host feature, hosting is easier than ever. You can access a network of high quality local co hosts in your area who can help you get your home ready for guests. Find a co host@airbnb.com host.
- [03:13]
Rachel Zoe
Hi everyone, I'm Rachel Zo and you're listening to Climbing in Heels for your weekly dose of glamour, inspiration and of course, fun. Well, you are in for a real treat today. The wonderful, powerful, iconic, all around shining light of a human being, Nicole Avant is on the pod today. Nicole has many, many things. Actually, I think too many to name. But to name a few of her titles, bestselling author, producer and ambassador. I've never said that before. On Climbing in Heels today, she is sharing her incredible story. From growing up in literal music royalty in la to working for Obama, to her shift into becoming a producer and now author. Nicole's beautiful book, think you'll be happy is available now in paperback and you must read it. Nicole is a wealth of knowledge and experience. Her experience with grief and tragedy she lays out in this book and it's so incredibly healing and I'm so, so grateful that she's on the pod today. So here she is, my friend, Nicole. I want to start off by saying I could talk to you for 17 hours. So like, I know in my brain have to be like, okay, how do I make sense of this for people that don't know so much about you? And it's funny because you are one of the most fascinating people I want to talk about because climbing heels is really about celebrating and talking about and sharing the journey to get to be you. Right? Get to where you are now. So I want to start just a little bit at the beginning because you are so fascinating and you have done so much and I've had such incredible women on Climbing in Heels. But there is no one that has had a journey like yours. And so I want to talk about it because everyone's journey is different and everybody's journey is unique. And I know that I can't keep you here for 17 hours, but I do want you to share just a little bit because you, you know, of your beginnings, because you did grow up here. And not many people I've had on are actually born and bred.
- [05:32]
Nicole Avant
Right. Yeah.
- [05:33]
Rachel Zoe
And you have lived this incredible childhood, a very unique childhood, one that most people would like, fantasize and dream of. Right. But as you talk about in the book, and you talk about these things, of these happy moments, but also painful moments, I think as many of us have as children. But certain things that you touch on and you remember, I think really shaped who you are now. And I think you have gone from growing up here in Beverly Hills in the magical world of music royalty. Music royalty, literally. But then going into politics and working for Obama to becoming the U.S. ambassador to the Bahama. I mean, like, who are you? Like, who are you? I want to hear who's Nicole? How did you become? And just share whatever you want, your highlights or whatever you want. But to start to become you.
- [06:33]
Nicole Avant
Okay. It's great. I think the, the one thing that I'm really, really. I mean, I'm grateful for so many things that my parents gave me and taught me as, as a young girl. But the greatest, one of the greatest lessons was to own my individuality, that there is no one like me. That's why you take fingerprints. No one's going to have the same fingerprint. No. You know what I mean? They scan your eyes for a reason. There is only one. One you. Yeah. Period. And my job was to literally the best version of my. Myself. But to your point, I like when you said the journey, because, you know, my dad always, he calls it, his version of the journey was the dash. You come with a number and you end with a number. What are you going to do with your dash? It is your dash. It is your life. You. You know, it's that great saying, you know, if, if you're not. If you're not changing it, you're choosing it.
- [07:38]
Rachel Zoe
Yeah.
- [07:39]
Nicole Avant
Right. So it's. So he would always say, you know, my dad again. So just to go back, my father, born in 1931, Jim Crow south, full segregation, you know, talks about running from the Ku Klux Klan, you know, pick cotton, pick tobacco starting at 5 years old. You know, they really just a very terrible, you know, very hard time for many people in America. But I'm just talking about my dad times and. But he knew, he said, listen, I have a life force. I have been given a life force. I don't know how long I'm here. I have no idea. But I know it's a ride. The journey is a ride. There's ups there's downs and there's valleys and there's mountains and, you know, there's twists and turns, and you have to be prepared for that. And I'm really grateful to my mom, Jacqueline, and my father, Clarence Avon, for reminding me that the journey is not a straight line.
- [08:36]
Rachel Zoe
No, it's not. No, it is. Hell not.
- [08:40]
Nicole Avant
And the journey isn't a straight line. Life isn't a straight line. There's gray areas. Not everything's the same. Everyone's journey is different. So that's why we have to all tread as lightly as possible and as gently. And that's a challenge because we forget that every. We don't know what everyone's going through. I don't. You know, none of us do. So I think owning my individuality was probably the greatest lesson I received, because I felt as if I had a superpower all of a sudden, that my individuality and my life force was my superpower to do with whatever I chose. But also that my thoughts and my words are creative and they are energy, and you're all about energy. And as, you know, everything you speak over and over and over again, everything you think over and over, everything you're visualizing, everything you imagine. My mom would always say, if you're going to use your imagination, at least use it for the better. Why are you going to. Why are you going to make it count? The worst possible. Why would you even think about the worst scenario? Why don't you think of the best scenario? And so for me, I think having that growing up, knowing that, okay, I have the support to do whatever I want to do, I'm very fortunate to have a very different life from my parents because they earned it, and they got to a new point and they. But they took their blessings very seriously, and they knew that they were in powerful positions to open doors for people, to create a safe haven at their house in Truesdale, I mean, it was. They had a real mission, Rachel. They had a mission of, okay, creative artists are in the house, politicians are in the house, athletes are in the house. But the difference was they were all the best of the best, and they all had a purpose to make things better for people that were coming behind them. And that was the lesson that you and I have spoken about, that. Yeah, of course, you think that's what you do, and then you're in shock when you get out into the world, and then everybody. And then you see the flip side, which is, I'm going to close the store in your face on purpose. And I'm going to be mean to you on purpose, and I'm not going to speak to you on purpose.
- [11:01]
Rachel Zoe
And it was, I'm not rooting for you, and I don't want the best for you. I'm going to take it further. I want to see you fail.
- [11:08]
Nicole Avant
Yes. I remember walking into a job. I was working at a studio, and I was in my. I was in college, so I Must have been 20, probably. I remember walking into a room and I was, you know, I was a gopher. I was getting coffee. I was xeroxing scripts, and I was, you know, doing whatever. And I just remember a group of people, mostly women, and I remember walking and saying, hi, good morning. Is there anything you need? Or did. And honestly, it was as if I was some monster. Everyone just looked at me up and down and kind of smirked and then didn't say anything.
- [11:44]
Rachel Zoe
And I thought, oh, not bizarre.
- [11:47]
Nicole Avant
Okay, okay. But I was so. I mean, of course. And of course you take it personally. Naturally you do. And then. And then you're questioning, did I do something wrong? Did I look at them wrong? Die? And then all of a sudden, it became on me. And again, when I went back to my mom and I'm crying about it, she said, okay, own your individuality and do not dim your light. Don't change because someone else is rude. Sure. So do not dim your light and just become shy and meek.
- [12:15]
Rachel Zoe
And it's hard, though. That's hard.
- [12:18]
Nicole Avant
Very hard. And that was probably one of the hardest lessons I've had in my journey is to. My mom would say, you know, because I stopped saying good morning and I stopped being myself.
- [12:28]
Rachel Zoe
I scared.
- [12:30]
Nicole Avant
I was scared.
- [12:30]
Rachel Zoe
It's rejection.
- [12:32]
Nicole Avant
But here's what you just said, which is interesting. I was, you know, for lack of a better word, you know, it's. It's the idea of there I am now changing my personality. And because I'm uncomfortable with these people versus I'm going to be me. And however they want to treat me is their business. It's not my business. But I'm not going to not be myself and then turn into someone that I am not because it'll make other people feel comfortable. If they're uncomfortable or they want to be rude or they want to be unkind, they have that right to be. But I don't want to betray myself or betray my soul and become someone different that I don't like.
- [13:16]
Rachel Zoe
Right. And so in those moments, so at this point, you're working, you're. You're holding on to you. Do you ever Were you able to maintain that the whole time? Were you able to like copy correct yourself? Because I've been part of my French on by more women than I kicked down, got back up, kicked down, got back up. And, and I just remember being like, God, am I supposed to become a hater? Am I supposed to become cynical? How am I gonna. And to your exact point, I couldn't. My dad used to say to me, my mom used to say to me, like, don't let that change you. Then they win. How does that serve you? It is more poisonous to you to hold that. But it's hard, right?
- [14:02]
Nicole Avant
Very, very hard. And I went through that many, many times. It's not one and done, right. We're all put into challenging situations and then also we have to check ourselves where, you know, the beauty about awareness and the beauty of stillness and meditation isn't always to be perfect and it isn't just for manifesting, it's also really about, at least for me, is to make sure that when I go off the rail or if I am so busy that I'm not holding the door open for. Or I'm considerate that I snap out of it immediately because I'm aware of my own behavior. Right. And then you can switch and. But no, it's. It's been like that in every situation. And you, we all think it's going to stop and it, it's gotten better equipped, but it doesn't because humans are humans, of course.
- [14:50]
Rachel Zoe
But I think, but I think it is important to stop and do these things. To check yourself.
- [14:55]
Nicole Avant
Yes.
- [14:55]
Rachel Zoe
Because when we don't even as grownups, when we don't have our parents being like. Yes, and, and we have, we have to learn.
- [15:04]
Nicole Avant
We have to learn 100%. Yeah. I mean, yeah.
- [15:09]
Rachel Zoe
So tell me. Okay, so you go to high school, you go to Beverly Hills High School, you go up, you have this great childhood for the most part. Great, right? Like, I mean, all the.
- [15:18]
Nicole Avant
Actually, those were great years for me. I got very, I was very fortunate. I had the. I hear people who were so traumatized in high school. So bad because I thought those were the best years of my life.
- [15:31]
Rachel Zoe
So bad. It's a gift.
- [15:32]
Nicole Avant
It was the best. It was the best. I really. And college was great for me. I mean, I really had, you know, my childhood. I was, I was fortunate enough to. I went to, you know, Hawthorne elementary on Rexford, I mean, and then went from there to Beverly and then imagine.
- [15:51]
Rachel Zoe
It just knowing you now. Nothing about you reads. Nothing reads California Girl to me.
- [15:59]
Nicole Avant
Where Do. It's so funny. So many people say that, like, no world.
- [16:03]
Rachel Zoe
That would be you, a California girl. Everyone says that you are otherworldly, you are international, you are European, you are anywhere. But growing up in California, honestly, like, I just. Even at hello, when I first first met you, I was like, where is this goddess, like, human from? And then you're like, born and raised here. I'm like, what? But it all made sense. And, and. But I love that because I think that. I think you growing up as. I mean, if I'm allowed to say. I mean, music in. Music royalty. If I'm allowed to say that, you know, your parents are both incredibly hardworking, iconic people. Your father, that ultimately. And, and in your book, you speak about, like, there was highs, there was lows, but ultimately, the. The chairman of Motown, I mean, that is. That is mental. That is insane. Like, I don't even.
- [17:08]
Nicole Avant
You know, I think it was in his 60s. Yeah.
- [17:12]
Rachel Zoe
I mean, yeah, but how hard did he work for that? You know, and, and that's the thing. And I think that shaped who his children became. And, and. And we are products of our parents, right? And. And as I raise my children, I am so highly aware of that. And, and everything that I do and everything I say, I'm like, this is going to affect later. This is. But how did you come out of this seemingly humble, royal, incredible artistic childhood surrounded by the best of the best in every field, Right. And this loving family. Right. But I imagine there was a lot of tough love in that, which is how you became who you are. But at what point when you graduated college were you like, okay, this is what I'm gonna do? Because you've done quite a lot. So, yeah, I.
- [18:16]
Nicole Avant
You know, it was a lot of tough love. And I. Another great gift that my parents gave me was I was working. I was working at a very young age when I was 10. If. Even if it was answering phones at my dad's office, 8 years old, 10 years old, but getting there on time, having. Having responsibility, having chores in the house, you know, and all science shows that. Anyway, I just read this report the other day, and I'm thinking, well, of course the kids turn out that way, because then you're not shocked when you go into real world and someone tells you, what do you mean? I'm not going to do that? Of course you're going to do that. So my mom had me and she put me in service at a very young age, so waitressing and hostessing and. And I worked. You know, I remember In New York City, there was a dry cleaner around my parents, around the corner from my parents apartment. And my mom said, listen, you're not going to escape by here. If you're going to nyu, you get to come home. You could stay here and you know, and be here while you're in school there, but you got to go get a job. I'm not giving you your party money, I'm not giving you your dinner money. And I went and got, I just lied and said I did it before, which of course I was fired within two weeks. But the beauty about that job, I mean, I was doing anything. But the guy said, I'll never get. My boss said to me, you're terrible in my profession, however, you are so good with people. I am watching you with the customers. And I notice that you genuinely want people to be satisfied and you definitely want to bring joy to people. You're always smiling, you're always pleasant. If things are wrong, you want to fix them immediately. And that's really why I got fired. Because you know how you put foil, you fashion, you know they put foil on everything to protect the buttons on your. I did not know that because. And so I said, oh, Mrs. Johnson, I'm so sorry. I will make sure that we pay for new buttons. You cannot go to your wedding this way. We've ruined your coat. Of course the manager comes like, oh my God, mean this, Nicole. These were protecting her buttons. And then right after that, he said, you can no longer work here. However, whatever you do in your life, please don't change that part of you that actually likes to serve. Sure, you like people and you, you're very good at that. He says, so I, I always kept that in the back of my mind. It was one of those things, okay, I just lost the job, but I got a really good nugget because I deserve to be fired. I did not need that job, but I, you know, so it was so great that again, my parents always had me in situations where I'd be uncomfortable or I'd have growing pains. And my mom would say, you will thank me one day. You will appreciate this. You think it's hard? It's not hard. You need to be a responsible, productive human being in society. This is my job as your mother. My job as your mother is to raise a decent, considerate person who's productive. I don't care how, I don't care what you do. Sure, yeah, but she said, but you can't be lazy. I'm not doing that. I will not have you be. And I will not have you be lazy.
- [21:35]
Rachel Zoe
I say to my kids, I love.
- [21:37]
Nicole Avant
Her, but she said, but you can do and be anything you want to do. You want to be a school teacher, be a school teacher. You want to be a beautician, be a whatever. You want to be a lawyer, you want to be a judge, do whatever, and I will help support you. But you cannot sit around and do nothing. That. That's. She's. She just would not. It was honestly the one, she said, that is not allowed in my home. You have to be positive, powerful and productive as often as possible.
- [22:06]
Rachel Zoe
And that was writing that down.
- [22:08]
Nicole Avant
Yeah, sorry.
- [22:10]
Rachel Zoe
I'm taking the three Ps.
- [22:11]
Nicole Avant
The three Ps.
- [22:13]
Rachel Zoe
And that's going to be a new piece of art in my house. Positive, powerful, productive.
- [22:19]
Nicole Avant
And it really. But I use that. I took that with me everywhere I went. I thought, all right, so whether I. And after college, to answer your question, I went into the record business and I worked for Jerry Moss at A and M Records. And I went in and I worked in the R B promotions, marketing. And I had the best time and learned. I was learning, but I loved it. I mean, I came from the music business. My dad had, you know, we had music publishing companies. He had his own record labels. So I knew the business, but I had never done marketing or promotions, which I really wanted to do. And I learned a lot. And then. But I always pivoted. And then all of a sudden I thought, you know, I want to make documentary films. I think I want to make short films. And my parents were like, what? I said, this is what.
- [23:08]
Rachel Zoe
You're on a trajectory.
- [23:12]
Nicole Avant
You have a good job, you have it. My dad, of course, was so old school. They have very good insurance, and all he cared about was the health insurance.
- [23:22]
Rachel Zoe
I love him.
- [23:23]
Nicole Avant
You're paying. You're paying your own rent. You should save money for a home. I mean, I was on a trajectory, like you said. And then I said, nope. And then again, it was. I spoke to a couple of their friends who were in the business, and one of their cast, their friends was a casting director, Ruben Cannon. And he said to me he was casting the Tina Turner movie. And he said, if you want to be a great director, such a great movie, you want to be a director, you should go study people. And the best way to study the people that you're going to be directing, if you're going to go to New York, go to acting school, I go, but I don't want to be an actress. He goes, but you should learn the craft so you understand the people that are in front of the camera. I went to Gately Poole Acting Studio. I don't think it's there anymore. And then I went to Lee Strasberg and I ended up loving it. And it's interesting because you never know the journey of your life. But no. Did I become an actress? No. Did I do some commercial shorts that I. I booked a few things on tv. But the point of this story.
- [24:23]
Rachel Zoe
Did you like it? Did you like it or no? I loved it.
- [24:26]
Nicole Avant
It was because I wasn't chasing it. And it was never about fame. It was always about, I like doing this. So I did it. But when I became an ambassador, when I served and you give speeches every day, you write speeches every day and you're in situations, all of a sudden, everything that I had studied, yeah, at Lee Strasberg started working. And it was natural for me. So I wasn't afraid to give a speech, I wasn't afraid to give a car. I wasn't afraid of anything because I had already gone through these different processes. So again, it was because of the positive, powerful and productive theory of my mother. It was. It took me through every part in my life, even working for Obama in the very beginning when everyone was like, who is this guy you're working? But I knew there was something about Obama and I knew, whatever it was, I wanted to be a part of it, even if it. I said, even if we don't win, I want to be a part of this movement.
- [25:27]
Rachel Zoe
So you end up launching the culture cabinet under Obama? Yes.
- [25:32]
Nicole Avant
Well, yeah. Yeah, it was.
- [25:34]
Rachel Zoe
So. So tell me. So you, you go into this and then. And then you become the U.S. ambassador to the Bahamas.
- [25:41]
Nicole Avant
Yeah. So it was, it was interesting. I started with him and I'm thinking.
- [25:44]
Rachel Zoe
I mean, Nicole, I know, you see.
- [25:46]
Nicole Avant
I thought, it's interesting. I kept thinking, you know, I want to bring all these different people and different cultures and arts and I want to bring young Hollywood into. And of course, again, we were building the plane as we were flying the plane, so they were like, do whatever you want. Then he gave me, you know, it was unpaid, but all of us. There were four co chairs of his finance group in California, and they're all still very good friends of mine. Charlie Rifkin is still one of my best friends. And he went. He was the US Ambassador to France and we did something together and we just both felt that. Wow. We felt even just serving him on the ground in California was really service. And then cut to, everyone was like, you know, do you. You've done so much. And I said, oh, no, I don't want anything. I didn't do it to receive anything. I just did it out of. And then all of a sudden, the ambassadorship shows up and the. The proposition and the idea of it. And I'm thinking, no, no, no. And it was Charlie. It was Charlie Rifkin who said, nicole, this is something that you will regret. When the president asks you to do something and believes you can do it, and it's him. It's not a forever job. And I was so very focused on, no, you know, I'm 40. I. I'm dating this guy Ted, and I really like him. And I. I want to stay home. I'm tired. You know, I want to do other.
- [27:13]
Rachel Zoe
Tired. I'm tired, I'm tired.
- [27:15]
Nicole Avant
And then. But Charlie was right. And I write about it and think, you'll be happy. There's. Sometimes people have to dream for you.
- [27:23]
Rachel Zoe
Yes.
- [27:24]
Nicole Avant
And Charlie. Charlie kind of spun this dream for me, and Ted agreed with it and said, I. I will support you in every way. And we got married up to a month before I landed in the Bahamas. Ted and I got married at the Beverly Hills courthouse. We didn't grow a wedding. No, we had. Ted said, you know, he went to my parents, he asked for my hand. He said, what am I going to know in six months that I don't know? Now we've been dating nine months. She's going to go to a different country. She's about to be the U.S. ambassador of the Bahamas. I want to be there as her husband. I don't want to go and visit her as her boyfriend. Was so cry. I know, I know. And it was. And Teddy having his support, such chills. He was really great because he didn't live there with me. I mean, I moved to Nashville.
- [28:18]
Rachel Zoe
How did you meet him? How did you guys meet him?
- [28:21]
Nicole Avant
I had my first big fundraising event right when Obama received the actual nomination. And we met through our mutual friend Lawrence Bender. I'm sure you know Lawrence. So. Yeah. So you know, again. And I. You know what it was after I had turned 40, true story. I said to the universe, I am going to say yes to every thing that comes my way. It's a new decade. It's a new year, and I'm saying yes. Three months after I made that declaration, Ted was in my life. Met him and made that decoration. March 6. By June 20, I had met Ted. And then the. So I kept everything that was coming to me. I said, well, okay. And I was scared. I was scared to move because everything was new. I had no support system there. I had no friends. I was moving into a new job, new people. I was the head of the embassy.
- [29:13]
Rachel Zoe
Leaving your safe place in California.
- [29:16]
Nicole Avant
But it was. I love that my dad was behind it, saying, nicole, this is the hell I've gone through to put you here on this earth. And I stayed with you and your mother has stayed with you and putting you through school. My God, take the job. And they both had to keep reminding me. Everyone did. It's not forever. I kept looking at it as, what am I going to do if this doesn't work? What am I going to do?
- [29:44]
Rachel Zoe
That's how I would have been you. I would have played that out the same. What if I mess this up? I'm not familiar with that. This is scary. What if I'm not good at it? What if this is like. What do they call it? Like, imposter syndrome? What if he thinks I'm better that like, I. I would absolutely do what you were doing?
- [30:02]
Nicole Avant
And my dad said, and what if you're wrong?
- [30:05]
Child
My dad works in B2B marketing. But I never really knew what that meant. Then one day, my dad came by my school for career day and told everyone in my class he was a big Roas man. Then he just kept saying things like, the bigger the roas, the better. Over and over. My friends still laugh at me to this day. I think it means calculating a return on ad spend. One thing's for sure, I'll be known as the Roaz man's kid for the rest of my days. Why couldn't you just be a fireman or a lawyer?
- [30:37]
Disney Cruise Line
Why?
- [30:38]
Child
You ruined my life, dad.
- [30:40]
LinkedIn
Not everyone gets B2B. But LinkedIn has the people who do. And with ads on LinkedIn, you'll be able to reach people based on job title, industry likelihood to buy, and more. Start converting your B2B audience into high quality leads today. We'll even give you $100 credit on your next ad campaign. Go to LinkedIn.com customer to claim your credit. That's LinkedIn.com customer. Terms and conditions apply. LinkedIn. The place to be, to be.
- [31:05]
Vanta
Trust isn't just earned, it's demanded. Whether you're a startup founder navigating your first audit or a seasoned security professional scaling your GRC program, proving your commitment to security has never been more critical or more complex. That's where Vanta comes in. Businesses use Vanta to establish trust by automating compliance needs over 35 frameworks like SoC2 and ISO 27001 centralize security workflows, complete questionnaires up to five times faster, and proactively manage vendor risk. Vanta can help you start or scale your security program by connecting you with auditors and experts to conduct your audit and set up your security program quickly. Plus, with automation and AI throughout the platform, Vanta gives you time back so you can focus on building your company. Join over 9,000 global companies like Atlassian, Quora and Factory who use Vanta to manage risk and prove security in real time. For a limited time. Our audience gets $1,000 off vanta@vanta.com special that's V A N T A dot com special for $1,000 off hey, it's.
- [32:13]
Ryan Seacrest
Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway this new year, make sure you take some time to take care of yourself and your family. Now through January 28th, save up to 25% on all your favorite personal care essentials. Shop in store or online and stock up on all your favorite items like Tresemme Shampoo, Axe Deodorant, Dove Bar Soap, Dove Men's Body Wash, and Dove Dry Spray. And Save up to 25%. Offer ends January 28th. Restrictions apply. Promotions may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [32:43]
Disney Cruise Line
Hi friend. It's your inner child calling and they want Churros, a new toy and a new adventure. Or maybe five with the bestest besties on Earth. Find your moment at Walt Disney World Resort.
- [33:13]
Matt
Hey there, this is Matt and Joel.
- [33:15]
Joel
We're from how to Money.
- [33:16]
Matt
That's right. Yeah. If you've been listening to our show, then you know how much we love to travel, especially if it's somewhere out there in nature. Joel.
- [33:23]
Joel
That's right, Matt. You had a great trip out to the Blue Ridge Mountains in Georgia this past fall.
- [33:26]
Matt
Yeah, I did. It was a quick weekend getaway with a fam, but we had an amazing time. We found this incredible cabin on Airbnb right on the river. The water, it was so clean and clear. The kids were out there building a little peninsula out into the river. I actually did a few morning cold plunges out there, which the kids definitely passed on. But we hiked together during the day, sat by the fire pit at night, made mores. It was beautiful.
- [33:48]
Joel
Man, if only I had been invited. You know, whenever I'm traveling and find the perfect place to stay on Airbnb, I always think of what a smart idea it is to become a host. You let someone else enjoy all the wonderful parts of your home while you're not using it. And it's a great way to make some extra money.
- [34:03]
Matt
That's right. And even if you're not traveling but have a spare bedroom sitting empty, you can also host guests in that extra room. It's easy to do and a great way to make the most of your home.
- [34:13]
Joel
And now with the co host feature, Airbnb gives you access to a network of high quality local co hosts who can help take care of your home and guests when you're not there. They manage reservations and provide on site support. When you can't be there, find a co host@airbnb.com host right if you do.
- [34:30]
Nicole Avant
Like it, what if you do become good at it? What if again, he said, you always, it's not forever, but go in and serve your country. Serve your country. You will never regret. And it's true. I'm still friends with a lot of people from the embassy, people that I would have never, ever had the pleasure of meeting and knowing and growing with. You know, my friends who were in the Coast Guard, my friends who serve in dea, my friends who, you know, are in all different government agencies. I would have never had the pleasure and the honor to know these people who serve and protect us in so many different ways. We have no idea what these agencies really do every single day on our behalf to keep us safe. And they are friends. And when my mom died, some of the first texts that I received were some of the people who are on my country team who were, madam Ambassador, we are here for you. We love you. Let us know what you need. And I mean, I'm gonna cry now. I mean, these were, you know, those are my people.
- [35:39]
Rachel Zoe
And they will be your people always, forever.
- [35:41]
Nicole Avant
And I'm the same with them.
- [35:43]
Rachel Zoe
And let me ask you this. Did you love it?
- [35:48]
Nicole Avant
Loved.
- [35:49]
Rachel Zoe
Was it scary?
- [35:50]
Nicole Avant
Yes, very. And hard in the beginning, it was hard just to get comfort, you know, to get. My feelings were a little. But, you know, I, again, a great lesson also was I had an ambassador who was there before me, Ambassador John Rood. He was there under President Bush. He was so kind to me, Rachel. And so a part of my transition, he showed up at my Senate hearing. He would, he would send me notes and send me things from his office, tell me about all the initiatives that he had that I should continue or maybe would think about continuing, which I did, of course. But he became a really good friend. And when I asked him one day, I said, why are you being so kind to me? We don't even really know each other. And he said, I wish that someone would have done this for me. And I thought, okay, right. Paying it forward and a kind man. And we both, you know, again, he's coming from the Bush years, I'm coming from Obama. And it doesn't matter. We came together as Americans and, and that was, that was our mission of let's make the best for the mission in the Bahamas. And he introduced me to all my friends. So that's how just his act of kindness and thoughtfulness, he said, okay, maybe I was three weeks there. He said, I'm going to introduce you to my best friends on the island. And I know they're going to love you and they will be your support system. And for 20 something months, I was with. They all became really, really great friends of mine.
- [37:32]
Rachel Zoe
Wild.
- [37:33]
Nicole Avant
Yeah.
- [37:34]
Rachel Zoe
And then so you leave there and you come back to California, you're with Ted, the sweetest man ever. He's so special. He is the sweetest.
- [37:47]
Nicole Avant
That is very sweet.
- [37:48]
Rachel Zoe
You guys are like the. Just two of my absolute most favorite. As I said, like, I got to a point a couple years ago where I was like picking and choosing and it's based on energy. And I fell in love with you at hello. And I remember actually where I met you, I was at a friend's house and we were like all, like a whole group of our mutual friends. But I think you had just returned, which is why I hadn't known you before.
- [38:13]
Nicole Avant
Yes.
- [38:15]
Rachel Zoe
And, you know, and then I met Ted and I was like, God, this makes so much sense. The absolute sweetest. And I want to talk about that because, you know, it's so hard. I mean, you grew up in this amazing family, lots of tough love, so many lessons. You're this epic person you work for, for Obama. You go to the Bahamas, you come back here, you're in love, you're happy. How do you, how do you not lose yourself in that? Right? Because there's. There's a lot. Right? There's a lot. And there's a lot of trying to be all things to all people. Right? And so you've had your hands in so many things. You've had privilege, but you're not spoiled. And I think there's a huge difference.
- [39:04]
Nicole Avant
Yes.
- [39:05]
Rachel Zoe
And, and you know, again, we attribute that to our parents. Right? But, but at this point, you're, you're back. How do you then come back into this place in this world and then be still Nicole.
- [39:21]
Nicole Avant
Right?
- [39:21]
Rachel Zoe
Like, how do you come from that and then go, okay, re. Rejigger. Again. Right, like re. Acclimate. Right, like, and then still continue to do tons of, you know, be involved in politics and then in film and all these things. Write books. Like how. What is the process there, like in your head?
- [39:42]
Nicole Avant
It was a lot actually. I didn't act. It was very hard for me, to be honest. I imagine asking that question because no one really has coming back from the Bahamas as being the US Ambassador and the head of an embassy to come back. And then I had, you know, I had Ted's kids, you know, Sarah and Tony in high school. And literally I came back the next day. I'm driving them to Beverly and I'm screaming at them, get in the car. We're late, we're late. And Sarah is the stereotypical 16 year old girl. Did not want to hear crap from me. Tony is the sweetest kid. He's 14. Like I cannot be late again. And I remember thinking, what the dichotomy of my life. What have I. Wait a minute, I just left that. And now I'm coming and. But it was so great. But it was hard because then all of a sudden it was, it was, it was a very different. It all changed so fast.
- [40:40]
Rachel Zoe
Manuality check. It was a quick, like if I.
- [40:43]
Nicole Avant
Landed on Wednesday, I was driving them to school on Friday and then there were sleepers and. But it. And I remembered my father taking me to lunch and I said, I just don't know what's wrong with me. And he said, oh sweetheart, there was a big power shift. You didn't realize how much power you had, did you? And I said, oh daddy, it's not about that at all. And he goes, no, it's not. But let me tell you, that's what's happening to your brain right now, right? You just went from. Everybody focused on you when you're on the front page of the newspaper because then you come home. But it was great because he reminded me it's different, but you're the same. And it's going to take time. You have to get your ego out of this. You made a decision to come home. You made a decision to be. To stay at home to help raise Tony and Sarah. These are decisions and now you're going to have to let all of the feelings with this change. You got to roll with it. And it's so hard. It was, I just was, I was very uncomfortable with it for a while.
- [41:50]
Rachel Zoe
A little resentful, I was going to say.
- [41:52]
Nicole Avant
I was going to say, oh yes, there was a lot of resentment of, wait A minute. Why did I. I actually liked my job. I had one more year. Why did I come home? Everybody else needed me and wanted me here, and now I'm here. But I wanted. You know, so there was. There was resentment. And you gotta work through it, because I. I just had. I had to admit it to myself. I had to admit it to Ted. I had to. Because I didn't want you a little.
- [42:21]
Rachel Zoe
Mad at yourself for not feeling good about it. Because I feel like that's a struggle, that we as women, especially if we're working and have these big careers outside of our children and our families, there's that struggle. Like, I don't like that I feel like this right now.
- [42:41]
Nicole Avant
And I would say to myself, maybe about three months when I came home, I was like, wow. You know, in hindsight, now that I look back at this, I probably would have made a different decision. I would have stayed.
- [42:53]
Rachel Zoe
Yep.
- [42:54]
Nicole Avant
And then I had to say, it's hard. And I said, okay. But I didn't. And I'm here, and I'm either gonna fight what is or I'm gonna go with what is. But I had to make a choice. But I also. What I did do, which I'm. I'm happy that I did, because it took me a while to get there. I just had to own my choice.
- [43:14]
Rachel Zoe
Yeah.
- [43:15]
Nicole Avant
I just had to own it.
- [43:16]
Rachel Zoe
Easy, by the way, and. But, you know, it's actually the harder way.
- [43:20]
Nicole Avant
It's a harder way. It's just. I had to own the choice. I said, okay, I wanted to do this. It ended up being the best for my marriage. Yes. It ended up being the best for my family. 100%. My parents were getting older. I had more time with my family, thank God. But I still had to own my choice.
- [43:39]
Rachel Zoe
And now you can look at it and say, there was a plan.
- [43:41]
Nicole Avant
Yes. Yes. And now you look back and. But the lesson for me was stop fighting the choice and every day accept that you made it, and then do the best that you can with your new reality. And every choice gives you a new reality.
- [44:02]
Rachel Zoe
It does. Whether. Whether you enjoy that reality or not. Right. Because I think that's an important perspective, quite frankly, because regret is hard. Regret is really hard. I think we all have it on some level. I have a really incredible girlfriend that's always been a huge inspiration in many ways. And she said something to me in a text one day, and, you know, when something just hits you different, she said, I don't have any regrets. I can't have regrets. It's a Waste of time. I can't go back.
- [44:41]
Nicole Avant
Yep.
- [44:42]
Rachel Zoe
So why bother? And it was weird because it wasn't coming from my parents. So when something comes from someone unsolicited, that you're like, wait, let me take that. Hold on a second thought. She's right. Right.
- [44:55]
Nicole Avant
Absolutely. You know, my dad used to say, you can't unscramble the egg.
- [44:58]
Rachel Zoe
No, unfortunately, you can't.
- [45:01]
Nicole Avant
You can't. So he always would say to me, my dad was the same way. As your friend, my dad would say, it is what it is.
- [45:07]
Rachel Zoe
Now, you hate when people say that, though.
- [45:10]
Nicole Avant
Yeah.
- [45:10]
Rachel Zoe
That you can't solve that.
- [45:12]
Nicole Avant
I know. But I loved what he said after, which was great. He said, yeah, what it is? And what are you going to do about it? So his lesson for me was I would call him and I would say, so I was so upset and something happened at work and it didn't go my way. And I wanted sympathy and I wanted pity. And he'd say, it is what it is. I said, daddy, stop saying that. It's so rude. It feels like you're not even just with me and with my feelings. And he said to me one day, it was so great. He said, listen, kid, I'm trying to teach you how to get out of the storm so that you can make a better decision moving forward. If you stay in a storm, it's okay that you're in a storm. Don't deny that you're in a storm. But then you have to admit that you're in one. And then you have to calm your mind down enough to make a great decision. Otherwise you're going to make a decision in the storm and then it'll be the worst decision. So it was really great advice of it is what it is, and you have to own what it is. Like my mom would always love to say, you can't pretend it didn't happen.
- [46:23]
Rachel Zoe
I know. Even if you want to.
- [46:25]
Nicole Avant
Yeah. You can't.
- [46:26]
Rachel Zoe
I try.
- [46:27]
Nicole Avant
Yeah. And we all would try. And she said, it will just keep you stuck. But it took me a long time, like you with. With the regret. And I have to tell you, my dad passed at 92 and a half. He had zero. He'd never regrets.
- [46:40]
Rachel Zoe
Yeah.
- [46:42]
Nicole Avant
He didn't let that. Because they're so heavy and they're so burdensome. And it's okay to, you know, having heavy regret is very different from punishing yourself from. For everything.
- [46:57]
Rachel Zoe
Right.
- [46:58]
Nicole Avant
I regret things, of course. I say, oh, I wish years ago, I wish I made a different choice.
- [47:03]
Rachel Zoe
Yes.
- [47:03]
Nicole Avant
And then you do the work. And even if you can't forgive the person or the situation or you can't own it with a person, somebody. This therapist had taught me this great idea. She said, pretend the person is sitting in front of you.
- [47:15]
Rachel Zoe
What would you say?
- [47:16]
Nicole Avant
And own it and say sorry and I apologize. And here is why I'm apologizing. And it was so great. Instead of just saying, I'm sorry. I'm sorry for being rude. I'm sorry for being inconsiderate. I'm sorry for being. I'm sorry that I betrayed you. I'm sorry for hurting your soul, whatever it is, so at least you take ownership of it. And it helps you release. I think you said it before, it helps you release the bitterness and the poison.
- [47:49]
Rachel Zoe
The poison, you know, it like venom. It's like that. It's like it eats at your. Like, hurts, you know, so.
- [47:57]
Nicole Avant
And that I, you know, it's that parable of, if a snake comes and bites you, the first thing you do is you obviously try to get the venom out of you before it poisons you. But many of us go and chase the snake. Why'd you do that? Why'd you bite me? Why'd you do that? As you're gonna die because you're not getting rid of the venom.
- [48:17]
Rachel Zoe
It's true. It's so true. It's so true. And what I will say is that in those regrets, those greater regrets of, like, I should have made this career decision or I should have, whatever, I shouldn't have hired that person, whatever it is, I do find, whether it happens immediately or later, that there was a purpose to why that happened.
- [48:40]
Nicole Avant
100.
- [48:40]
Rachel Zoe
Because it. The result of it was. Was now. Right?
- [48:45]
Nicole Avant
There's always.
- [48:46]
Rachel Zoe
There is. There is. And you don't see it in that moment. I wanna. I. And that I. I definitely so important. I. I really. Because again, like, I can't even scratch the surface of your life and your journey. But I want to talk about. Think you'll be happy. And I want to talk about. I mean, I feel like everyone in the world has read it or heard about it because I feel like it was the most powerful book tour I've ever seen. Because I feel like I felt you so much through your tour, honestly, because it's so powerful. But I want to talk about what made you do it. Right. Because I obviously know. Because I know you. I want you to share why. Because it's. It's. First of all, it's a title that I've never heard of. Yeah, right. Because you would think when. When you read the title, think you'll be happy. It's sort of like, I'm gonna tell you something.
- [49:39]
Nicole Avant
Yeah.
- [49:40]
Rachel Zoe
And it's gonna make you laugh.
- [49:42]
Nicole Avant
Right.
- [49:42]
Rachel Zoe
And this. This book is gonna put you in the best mood.
- [49:46]
Nicole Avant
But it's.
- [49:47]
Rachel Zoe
But it's so much more nuanced. Yeah. So I want to talk about a why you did it and be how you got to that title, because I'm sure it was quite intentional.
- [49:59]
Nicole Avant
It was intentional. It was. So my mom's. My mom and I. You know, the last time I saw my mom was Thanksgiving of 2021. And, you know, all of us never know. If you're fortunate to know that someone's gonna pass, it really is a blessing. But when you don't know, and it's shocking. And my mom's was, of course, a shocking tragedy. So the last time I saw her was Thanksgiving and 2021. And then six days later, there was a home invasion at her house that she lived at, you know, with my dad for 54 years. And she. Six hours before that happened, my mom and I were writing. We were texting. Thank God. And her last words to me, her last text was, okay, think you'll be happy? And I got in the bath. Everything was good. Went to sleep. Six hours later. Get to the hospital. Your mom's been shot. Get to the hospital, your mom. What? And so I get to the hospital, and again, I don't know what's happened at this point. I don't know that there's a home invasion. I don't know anything. I mean, I assumed that, but no one told me anything. It was just. Your mom is at the hospital. So I get there, the doctors say she's in surgery, and I'm. I don't know anything. Mine, sitting with my dad, he's kind of giving me little hints of what happened. He didn't see the intruder, so he doesn't really know. And he's 91, so he is discombobulated, obviously. And then. So think you'll be happy. I decided, you know, I decided to. I was already kind of writing a book on. On the attitudes and the energy of grit, grace, and gratitude. And it was a project I was doing in 2020. I was, you know, all of us are trying to do something.
- [51:43]
Rachel Zoe
By the way, I feel like you just described yourself.
- [51:46]
Nicole Avant
I thought, you know what? Hold on my mom this, because I think there is a purpose and a reason for everything. And it's not a cool.
- [51:57]
Rachel Zoe
Even in that moment, even in that moment.
- [51:59]
Nicole Avant
And I said her last words to me were, think you'll be happy? Which I knew what my mom was saying. The last thing that you're going to hear me say is something that I want you to carry throughout the rest of your life. I want your soul. I want you to decide to stay a happy person. You are a happy soul, and I want you to stay who you are and spread that wherever you are, whichever situation you find yourself in. And so I wanted to. And then I stopped writing. You know, I was stopped. When I got home, my dad and my dad. It was my dad who said, what's going on with the book? I said, dad, I am not about to put a book out on great grace and gratitude. Mom is just killed. And said to me, are you going? He goes, nicole, I understand how sad you are. We all are. But I'll be damned if you're going to let this man take your life, too. And I. I didn't like that. I didn't like his answer. But I went up to my room and I thought about it. I'm like, you know, he's right. And he said, write about your mother. Write about everything. Write about your mom. You're already writing it. So. But put her in. Weave her into the stories. And he said, you know, so other people won't feel alone. Because grief, remember, grief isn't just, okay, well, my mom wasn't murdered. What am I going to get from grief? Is.
- [53:26]
Rachel Zoe
Anything you get is larger than we can ever.
- [53:30]
Nicole Avant
And it's. It's a real human experience. And we all go. And the stages of grief are so different for everybody. So there is no one formula of, oh, this day you're going to be angry, this day you're going to be sad, all that. No, it comes in different ways, different times. And I thought, you know, what if I can make someone's life richer, better, less alone by sharing the energy of my mom and the lessons that I learned from my parents and the lessons that I've learned, too, and just share my journey with other people. And then it turned into a book. You know, I have people writing me, saying, I knew I didn't know things about the record business that I learned. I learned things about black history that I didn't think this was coming in because I almost wrote it like a tapestry I just had to describe. I said, well, why is anyone going to listen to me give advice if they don't really know who I'm coming from? So then I had to describe my family.
- [54:28]
Rachel Zoe
Of course, you have to, like, do 101. Like, no one knows what I'm talking about right now.
- [54:33]
Nicole Avant
And this is why I have the values I have. And these are the lessons I've learned. And I think a lot of people picked up, you know, because as great as my mom was, of course mothers and daughters have their challenges. And I didn't sugarcoat that. And I made, you know, I made light of it. But it was true of just certain things that I would express to my mom. And then she would say, you know, she would later in life say, you know, now in hindsight, I realize that I pinched her heart, and I realized that I did these things, and I am sorry, but please know that my intention was up to understand where we were coming from. My mom was born in 1940. She said we had no doors open for us. We could not go to the bank and cash a check. Think about this. Without your husband's signature. And she said the checks would be made out to me and your father would have to sign before I could get my money. She said, so of course, I pushed. I pushed so that when these doors were opening, I didn't want you sitting there saying, I don't know if I want to go through. Right. You have no idea.
- [55:42]
Rachel Zoe
Hard for them to watch.
- [55:44]
Nicole Avant
Yes. So she said, you know, I know it was a lot, but I'm so happy that she expect that she had high standards.
- [55:55]
Rachel Zoe
Look at you.
- [55:56]
Nicole Avant
Grateful that she had high standards and go into life doing these things. I used to watch her wipe down the basin at every restaurant we went to. She'd wash her hands, but I always noticed everyone would leave their towels and my mom would wipe down everything. I'll never forget, one day I said, what are you doing? She said, being considerate. Always be considerate to the next woman. Why would you leave any space messy, untidy? It was so interesting and I. It was profound for me.
- [56:31]
Rachel Zoe
And at that point, by the way, she was living a fancy life, but she was this. Your mother was. And I'm going to say is she's like magic fairy dust. She was like. When people say her name, it was like they were speaking about this philanthropic queen.
- [56:52]
Nicole Avant
Yes.
- [56:52]
Rachel Zoe
This iconic, elegant, graceful, giving, kind, generous, smart, very smart, witty woman. And so. Which makes sense. And she couldn't. She couldn't raise ever. I imagine a daughter that wasn't going to take what she knew better. I mean, that she knew. And as a daughter, I mean, listen, it's me and my sister. Sister. And I have a very strong mother with very strong opinions and I love her and I can't breathe without her. But we fight like crazy and crazy, but because as a parent, you can't look at your child doing something and it's very hard to not correct it because you do know better and you do know what could happen to them if you don't teach them this. And as a child, you don't know that. Right. Even as a teenager, you definitely don't know it. I would argue to say as an adult, Even in our 40s with parents, you still listen to them.
- [58:05]
Nicole Avant
You still. Yeah, right, Absolutely. I mean, like I said, my dad was a little fear still. Absolutely. And he would correct me on things. I'm like, okay, he's right. But he was the parent, you know, and he's like, listen, I've lived longer, I'm telling you. I know. And it's my job. And again, my mom and I'm happy because even her friends who read the book, they said, you know, thank you for giving all. Because I didn't. As much as I wanted to honor my mother in this book, I also made her human. I didn't want to put her on this pedestal. No. And so I use, I found apology notes that she had written me and I would weave them into the stories and. Because I wanted her to be known as a well rounded woman who had faith and love and. But she really was the queen and believing when she was the queen of Beverly Hills. I mean she, she. And it was so. She couldn't believe that she was. Because for her, she was smart, she paid her way, she went to med school, she was a nurse, she was a phlebotomist, she did everything and then modeled on the side. She said, look, I took the opportunities that were given to me. There was, I wanted to be a book editor. She said, there was no open door for me to be a book editor. But now there's an open door for hopefully you to be a book editor. So please walk through the door and at least try because you are the promise to everyone before you. There have been brilliant people for hundreds and thousands of years who didn't get an opportunity. Now you have the opportunity. So be the promise. You know, live. I always say, like I, I like to live. Everyone says, what do you want your legacy to be? I said, I hope I'm living my legacy. You know, I, I just, that's the one thing that I love that they gave me was okay. And so that's why I ended up writing the book. And I'm, I'm. And now Teddy wrote, you know, as you saw on the paperback, it's so. It's so good because, you know, again, in hindsight, Ted went through this very difficult journey with me of losing my mom so tragically. And by the way, 12 days after his dad died suddenly, so his dad dies of a heart attack. I was literally planning his father's funeral when my mom was killed. So I did not get to go to Grandpa Ted. Papa Ted's funeral was Saturday. My mom died on a Wednesday. And I remember looking at my daughter Sarah, who was in her late 20s at the time, and I said, sarah. And I totally became my mother. I said, I need you to step up and I need you to bring my energy in. I need you to run the whole thing. I need you to get your dad on this plane. I need you to be kind, gentle, but you need to run all of it. When you land, you. You've got to embody me. And I heard it was seamless. Sarah knew exactly what to do. She was wonderful to Ted, wonderful to her cousins, wonderful. But she was in her young twenties. But again, my mom had passed it down to me. I had now given it to her. And I was like, here you go. And this is a dark moment because she was very close to my mom. So she's grieving my mom in shock, burying her grandfather.
- [61:31]
Rachel Zoe
My God. And how to grow up real quick.
- [61:35]
Nicole Avant
Real quick. And so. And she's a natural producer. She's a great film producer. And I told her, I said, you're great at your job because producers solve problems. What we do, it's such a hard job. Yes.
- [61:50]
Rachel Zoe
Like having been on set my whole career, I was always like, I don't think I want to be a producer. Most people didn't want to be the stylist, but I would look at the producer because it's money, logistics, budgets, say no. Making the tough decisions. When you have the most powerful people telling you what they want.
- [62:09]
Nicole Avant
Yes.
- [62:10]
Rachel Zoe
And you having to say no or not say no and turn it into a yes, but this is how you're going to do it. It's. It's. It's a lot. And problem solving it is. So I want to talk about that, because then we come to now where you have produced this incredible, incredible film. So let's talk about that. God, I love Kerry Washington. I've known her for a long time. She is such a force. Like, beyond being stunningly beautiful, she is brilliant. And she is. She is a.
- [62:46]
Nicole Avant
Her in the six, triple eight. It is now I've. We've all seen her.
- [62:50]
Rachel Zoe
I've seen some, I've seen some and I'm already losing my mind. This episode is brought to you by ebay. Whatever you love, find it on eBay eBay Things people Love I've said this before and I'll say it again. I am an excellent online shopper. I'm also an excellent gift giver. Or so I've been told. I really, really love giving gifts and consider it to be one of my love languages. Whether it's my family, my team, my friends, or my neighbors, I genuinely love finding treasures that they will love for a lifetime. So I wanted to share some gift giving tips with all of you. The first one is very easy. Shop on ebay and find literally anything you're looking for. From designer fashion to luxury accessories and great housewares, Ebay has the best variety and you will definitely discover gift ideas you didn't think of before. Second tip. Remember what people tell you. Anytime my mom or sister mentions something they like, I make note of it in my phone so I can reference it when their birthdays or big occasions come around. My mom can be so hard to shop for and this approach has always worked for me. Ebay is always the first place I search for those rare and hard to find gifts. The key is finding something that they want but wouldn't necessarily buy for themselves. Okay. Third tip. Make a gift personal if you can. I love to embroider initials or add engraving to really customize a gift. If that isn't an option, try to be extra thoughtful by selecting something in their favorite color or style to go the extra, extra mile. Last but not least, group gifts are always a win. I love gifting my team or my friends matching jewelry that we can all have together. It creates a special connection when you and your best friend or close circle have a gift in common. I hope these tips help you and remember to head to ebay for all of your hard to find gifts. We've all got a thing and it's on ebay. Maybe it's scoring all the vintage finds, building an entire wall of sneakers, or hunting down a deal on that designer bag. So go find your thing or the thing for someone on your gift list. Whatever you love, find it on ebay, ebay Things People love.
- [65:01]
Nicole Avant
It's incredible. She is. I think it's the best performance she's ever given. Ever. Tyler Perry wrote a script that was it's so excellent and it's so different for both of them. You know, it's almost as if they both have Gone to higher levels. And they were both already at the highest levels. They. They stepped up. And I think it's because it's a true story about an all female, all black battalion in World War II. And they were sent to do a job that no one could do before them, which is sort out the mail, which had stopped. So families, remember, there's no Facebook, there's no WI fi, there's nothing. So you have phones.
- [65:44]
Rachel Zoe
So.
- [65:45]
Nicole Avant
Yeah. So they expect. They depended on the mail and they depended on letters for their morale. And the families needed it. The wives, mothers, children. No one was receiving mail. And Roosevelt realized this and was like, wait a minute, hold on. Eleanor Roosevelt became, you know, she was great, The President was great. But they figured this out. They knew it. Men had been trying to. To create a. A way through this log, you know, this. This jam of mail. They couldn't do it. So, of course, the underestimated black women, like, oh, we'll send this little bit. We'll send this group of black women overseas. They'll never do it. Of course. It's 17 pieces of mail they gave them. You know, God knows how much time they did it in three months, of course. But what they did was they helped save the. They helped win the war. This is the important part of this story. When you have low morale, you cannot win anything. Yeah. And we were losing in life. In life. And so what they did. And again, this is a time where they didn't have their rights. Things were not perfect for them. Things weren't fair for them. But they didn't dim their light. They did the task that was put in front of them with so much grit, so much grace, so much gratitude and determination. But what I loved about the story, Rachel, is that they were so patriotic towards about their country and about.
- [67:15]
Rachel Zoe
Which is interesting, by the way.
- [67:16]
Nicole Avant
Yes. In their country wasn't showing them the respect that they deserved. Wasn't even paying attention. They were in. They were invisible, Literally.
- [67:27]
Rachel Zoe
There's that scene, that opening part, where Carrie's like. She said something that was so powerful. It was sort of like. It was almost like there's no expectation of you, and you're gonna crush it. You know what I mean?
- [67:39]
Nicole Avant
Like, yes.
- [67:40]
Rachel Zoe
Like, you're gonna do the best is what's gonna happen.
- [67:45]
Nicole Avant
And the beauty is, you know, it's such a great underdog story. And it's. The thing I love about it is every testing we've done, it could be black men, white men, brown. Doesn't matter.
- [67:57]
Rachel Zoe
You're the underdog.
- [67:58]
Nicole Avant
Everybody has Felt like an underdog at point in their life especially. Yeah. All the time. And underestimated and treated and it. So it brings that energy up. And then, of course, you want to see people overcome. How do you overcome? You have to be mentally strong. And being mentally strong, you have to be physically strong, spiritually strong. I think they all go together. It's very hard to have a strong mental attitude when, again, when you're unproductive and you're not connecting. Even an atheist love life, something. Believe in something so that you can connect to. Out. You can connect to a force that's higher than you, that's more powerful than you.
- [68:44]
Rachel Zoe
I call it the universe. I just universe.
- [68:47]
Nicole Avant
And it's. And the universe is so powerful. And, you know, every day someone said, well, why do you. Why do you sit in silence in the morning? I said, the same reason you charge your phone. The battery is going to die at some point if you're not recharging. So for me, when I connect throughout the day before I go to sleep, it is. I am connecting on purpose because I need to be recharged because Earth is a lot. It's dense, heavy, It's. And, you know, I need to charge. Yeah, I need to charge up. And so this film, Carrie is just. I cannot say enough. And she was my first choice, and I'm so happy.
- [69:28]
Rachel Zoe
She's the dream. She looks like, even just in the first half, you're like, you want to, like, keep watching. You want to keep watching the story. You want it so incredible and everything. I mean, I just think people are going to be obsessed because I just think even just as women, I think we've always felt like the underdog. Right? Like, we've always. We've always set ourselves up to do the best because we knew people expected that we wouldn't. 100%.
- [69:57]
Nicole Avant
Yeah. No, she's really. I'm so excited for everyone to see this because, again, and it's faith in the country I love because, like, you know, obviously, as an ambassador, I love stories of patriotism and I love. And I love America. I love my country. I love my people. I. And I always want the best for America. And. And this story is a great part of American history, and it hasn't really been told and not at this level. These women have earned it. They deserve their story to be told. And it's inspirational, it's motivational, and it's true. And so everybody, it's a true story. And it's like the Tuskegee Airmen. You have to. And if you can't give people their roses while they're alive. Many of them have passed on, but thank God we had. There were a few women of the 6, 8, 8, that Tyler and Carrie and I had a pleasure to speak, to, learn from, sit with. And they were so excited that their story is now could be around the world on Netflix and in theaters and both. I mean, it's. It's really great.
- [71:05]
Rachel Zoe
So exciting. I am like, oh, I need, like, at least another two hours. I just. I'm so. I love rooting for you. I love watching you. Your energy and the way you move through any room that you're in is just this. Like, you have this very, very strong presence that brings light. You always have. It's like you have a permanent smile. You know, some people have, like a resting bitch face. You have the opposite. You have, like a resting, happy face. But don't be fooled, because I know what's under that. Like, don't. Don't let it fool you. She's tough as nails. But, like, you know, anyone who knows you knows that. But. But anyway, I'm. I'm so happy for everything you've done. Your journey is extraordinary. I know there's so much I'm sure still to come. I mean, is there anything. I mean, I can't even imagine you have something else coming, but is there?
- [72:03]
Nicole Avant
No. No. Right now I'm going to focus on my paperback tour. I think you'll be happy. And the film again, My mom, the Universe, national bestseller. And she. They're both coming out December 3rd. The premiere in LA of. Yeah. Of the six. Triple eight. December 3rd. The paperback comes out December 3rd. Then I've got. I'm gonna do another project with Tyler Perry, which I'm excited about. And then I'm gonna do a film with Reggie Hudlin and a documentary called My Black country, based on the book. So I'm. I'm. But I'm very fulfilled and I love telling stories, and I'm very grateful for the life that I've been given and the opportunities that I have, and I'm gonna make the best out of them.
- [72:52]
Rachel Zoe
And you've earned. And you've earned, my friend. You weren't just handed them.
- [72:55]
Nicole Avant
Thank you.
- [72:56]
Rachel Zoe
It's, you know, it's. It's not just as, you know, what happens to you in life, you can't control that. You can only control how you, you know, what you do with it and how you react to it. Right. I love you very much.
- [73:09]
Nicole Avant
I love you. I love you.
- [73:11]
Rachel Zoe
I can't really thank Nicole enough for being so extraordinary today, being so open and honest and sharing her. I mean, I mean the highlight reel. Yet it was so much. I can't even imagine that that was a one hour highlight reel of Nicole's extraordinary life. The good and the bad and so many lessons and so many standout moments. Just so many takeaways. Don't fight your choice choices. Embrace being your unique self because there is only one you. And that applies to everyone. It's why there are thumbprints and we never think about that because we'll give our thumbprint and it's like, okay, it's our thumbprint, but like it is our thumbprint because it's only ours and it is only our choice. Certainly as adults, how we want to be in this life and in this world and how we want to move through life and what we want to mean to ourselves and to other people and no regrets. And truthfully, I mean, losing her mother so tragically and then losing her father, not that much longer, honestly, later. And I have to tell you, I've never seen her where she wasn't smiling, but genuinely smiling, like with gratitude, truthfully. So I can tell you she practices what she speaks and what she writes and I learned from her all the time. And I hope you feel like you have incredible things to take away from this episode. Thank you so much for listening to Climbing in Heels. If you haven't already, please subscribe to the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, the Iheart app, or wherever you get your podcasts so you don't miss a single episode this season. And be sure to follow me on Instagram at rachelzo and the show Climbing in Heels pod for the latest episodes and updates. I will talk to you soon.
- [75:14]
Nicole Avant
Ah, and here we have travelers in their natural habitat enjoying guaranteed 4pm checkout at fine hotels and resorts booked through Amex Travel. And they don't even see what's coming at them. We're in.
- [75:23]
Vanta
We got the table.
- [75:25]
Nicole Avant
Yep. With resi pricing already. Notify they're alerted when hard to get Reservations open up.
- [75:29]
Rachel Zoe
Reservation for two. Save the best for last.
- [75:33]
Nicole Avant
Thanks to Amex Platinum, the last day vacation brings yet another experience. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms apply. Learn more@americanexpress.com with AmEx.
- [75:43]
Ryan Seacrest
Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. This new year, make sure you take some time to take care of yourself and your family. Stock up on your favorite personal care Items now through January 28th and earn four times the points to use towards discounts on groceries or fuel. Shop in store online or in the app for items like Pantene Shampoo, Old Spice Body Wash, Campers, Swaddlers, diapers, Venus Razors and Crest Complete toothpaste and earn four times points on your purchase. Offer ends January 28th. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.
- [76:13]
Disney Cruise Line
Sail to breathtaking destinations in Alaska or Europe with Disney Cruise Line. Discover where onboard magic meets onshore adventures, where beloved characters meet alluring landscapes, where Broadway quality shows meet historic cities, where imaginative dining meets amazing wildlife, and where exciting experiences await the whole family. Book an adventure filled summer Disney cruise to Alaska or Europe at David's Bridal.
- [76:45]
Nicole Avant
Love is in every stitch. From the initial sketch to the final details. Each style is designed with express exquisite craftsmanship. Every wedding gown, bridesmaid look, prom dress and special occasion style in between features handcrafted details filled with love. Come see the magic in person, book an appointment and sign up for diamond loyalty to save 15% on your first purchase. Earn points towards special rewards and more at davidsbridal.com Amazon Pharmacy presents Painful Thoughts.
- [77:18]
Matt
The guy in front of me in the pharmacy line is halfway through an incredibly detailed 17 minute story about his gout. A story likely more painful than the gout itself.
- [77:32]
Nicole Avant
Next time, save yourself the pain and let Amazon Pharmacy deliver your meds right to your door. Amazon Pharmacy Healthcare just got less painful.