Best Medicine

Summary

Podcast Summary: Comedy of the Week—Best Medicine (BBC Radio 4, August 3, 2026)

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Overview

This episode of Best Medicine, hosted by comedian Kiri Pritchard-McLean, playfully explores what could truly be called "the best medicine." The theme runs through the remarkable innovations, heartwarming human experiences, and essential collaborations that shape modern medicine. Joined by three notable guests—Professor Stephen Wallace (chemical biotechnologist), Dr. Matt Clark (pediatric neuropathologist), and comedian Michelle Wolf—the panel each advocates for a different "best medicine": rubbish (recycled plastic), home birth, and collaboration, respectively. The result is an energetic, witty, and ultimately uplifting discussion blending serious science, moving personal stories, and irreverent comedy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Marvels of Medicine

• The host opens by highlighting contemporary medical advancements: a potential nasal spray for Alzheimer’s and a 3D-printed cornea restoring sight.
• Kiri elevates medicine as a source of hope in challenging times:
  “In a world of doom and gloom, medicine offers so many reasons to be positive. Medicine is amazing.” (00:13)

2. Professor Stephen Wallace: Transforming "Rubbish" into Medicine

• Stephen’s Case: The "best medicine" is rubbish—literally.
  • Most common medications originate from fossil fuels.
  • Wallace's team engineers bacteria to recycle plastic waste into medicines, such as levodopa (for Parkinson’s) and paracetamol.
    “We’ve discovered and engineered bacteria that can take waste plastic bottles and transform them into treatments for Parkinson’s disease.” (04:06)
  • From a single plastic bottle, 80–100 doses of medication can be produced.
    “From one single standard plastic bottle, we can make around 80 to 100 doses.” (08:21)
  • The process uses E. coli and simple fermentation to convert terephthalic acid from plastic into medicine.
  • The technology could eventually lead to programmable bacteria living inside humans, dispensing medicines as needed.
• Why This Matters:
  “We can cure any disease in the world, but if we don't have the feedstocks to make the medication, then those discoveries are futile...Rubbish is not rubbish, but it is the best medicine.” (12:48)
• Notable Quote:
  “You’re quite literally turning plastic waste into happiness.” (09:16)

3. Michelle Wolf: The Case for Home Birth

• Michelle’s Case: Home birth is the best medicine.
  • Personal story of two natural home births—emphasizing empowerment and comfort.
  • Role of midwives and doulas in both physical and emotional preparation.
    “They teach a pre-birth class…but also the mental and the emotional aspect of it.” (15:09)
  • Unexpectedly short labor, supportive but overwhelmed partner, and the role of classic movies for distraction.
• Empowerment & Bragging Rights:
  “You are comfortable in your own home, and also you get to brag about it for the rest of your life.” (18:06)
• Memorable Moment:
  “Cleaner than when they got there—I mean, if you ever murdered somebody and needed someone to take care of all of that, call my midwife and doula.” (13:45)

4. Dr. Matt Clark: Collaboration as the Best Medicine

• Matt’s Case: Collaboration drives breakthroughs in medicine.
  • Focus on rare pediatric brain tumors (high-grade gliomas), which require global collaboration for research samples and advances. “We're very reliant on collaboration from people around the world… to provide us with samples.” (18:43)
  • Example: An international network helped diagnose and treat a newborn with a rare tumor in Italy, leading to the use of targeted drugs that saved her life.
    “The scans showed the tumour was shrinking and then it disappeared. And she's now 8 years old.” (22:42)
  • Emphasizes the combined efforts of over 130 contributors in recent breakthrough research.
• Core Message:
  “Collaboration is the best medicine because it provides the opportunity to work with some extraordinary people… we can take a tumour that previously was a death sentence, and now we can do something that actually saves lives.” (25:11)
• Notable Quote:
  “The greatest feats of humanity have required huge collaboration—thousands of often uncredited people.” (25:38, Kiri)

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Notable Quotes / Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• “You’re a man who’s making drugs, but in a totally green way. So you’re not in the pocket of big pharma, but in the tote bag of big pharma.” — Kiri (00:57)
• “Most of the medication that you take… comes from fossil fuel. It’s petrochemical oil. It’s the same material that you put in your car.” — Stephen (04:06)
• “So your Calpol can come from a waste plastic bottle if you like.” — Stephen (07:21)
• “You are comfortable in your own home, and also you get to brag about it for the rest of your life.” — Michelle (18:06)
• “I think this week’s best medicine is collaboration.” — Kiri announcing the winner (26:03)
• “The greatest feats of humanity have required huge collaboration.” — Kiri (25:38)

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Segment Timestamps

• Introduction: 00:10–01:43
  Medicine’s wonders, introductions, and positive outlook.
• Panel Introductions: 01:43–03:33
  Guests’ backgrounds, humor, and light banter.
• Stephen Wallace—Rubbish as Medicine: 03:58–13:23
  Deep dive into recycling plastic into medicine, biotechnological details, and future potentials.
• Michelle Wolf—Home Birth: 13:33–18:19
  Personal experiences of home birth, emotional and physical stories, and supportive humor.
• Matt Clark—Collaboration: 18:37–25:38
  Explaining breakthroughs in rare brain tumor research through collaboration; moving patient story.
• Decision & Wrap-Up: 26:03-end
  Kiri chooses collaboration as the best medicine and delivers comedic closure.

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Tone & Style

• Tone: Uplifting, witty, conversational, enthusiastic, occasionally irreverent while respecting the gravity of the topics.
• Language: Original speaker phrases maintained. Humorous asides (“If you ever murdered somebody…call my midwife and doula.”), self-deprecating humor, and British wit throughout.

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Conclusion

This episode of Best Medicine spotlights human ingenuity, from biotechnological breakthroughs (turning rubbish into medicine) to personal empowerment (home birth) and the fundamental necessity of teamwork (collaboration). The panel’s cases highlight the blend of science and humanity at the heart of medical progress, with Kiri awarding collaboration the top accolade for its role in enabling all other advances. Listeners come away both entertained and informed, reminded that, in medicine as in life, working together is often the greatest cure.

Transcript

[A]

Hello, I'm Kira Pritchard maclean and this is Best Medicine, the show that celebrates medicine's past, present and future. In a world of doom and gloom, medicine offers so many reasons to be positive. Medicine is amazing. In Texas, researchers think a new nasal spray could offer hope for families affected by Alzheimer's and other neurodegenerative diseases. Although it is in the earliest stages of research, the spray could help restore cognitive function. That's amazing. Some critics have turned their nose up at the spray, but then again, that is exactly how it's administered, so it's hard to tell whose side they're on. Scientists in Israel have managed to restore a blind patient's sight with the help of a 3D printed cornea. Amazing. It's incredible, isn't it? Sadly, they can also see their own brain as they accidentally printed it. Double sided with me today to make a case for what they is. The best medicine are Dr. Matt Clark, professor Steven Wallace and comedian Michelle Wolf. Professor Steven Wallace is a professor of chemical biotechnology. Steven's work focuses on designing microorganisms to develop new biotechnologies that enable the manufacture of medicines using sustainable materials rather than fossil fuels. You're a man who's making drugs, but in a totally green way. So you're not in the pocket of big pharma, but, but in the tote bag of big pharma. I love that. So you are basically making medicine out of sustainable materials. So this what happens in your lab, is that correct?

[B]

Yeah, in my lab in Edinburgh called the Wallace Lab.

[A]

Wallace Lab. I bet the Gromit lab does all the real work. So have you always been interested in science then, Stephen?

[B]

Yeah, well, I used to be absolutely obsessed with washing machines when I was a child, like unhealthily. So I knew all the details, I knew the codes in the catalogs. I used to go around to my neighbors and do their washing for free. It was basically child labor. So I think that fascination with things that seemingly quite simple on the outside but are actually mechanically quite complex really got me into science.

[A]

That's amazing. Do you know what I watched a video about a man that came round to his neighbors to fix her washing machine. He wasn't a scientist though. But I did learn a lot about biology. Dr. Matt Clark is a consultant pediatric neuropathologist and clinician scientist based at Great Ormond Street. So Matt diagnoses diseases for the nervous systems and muscles in children and researches brain tumors. No offense, Michelle, but you've got no chance. So part of your work is researching and Examining rare tumors.

[C]

Yeah. I also go out and do a lot of public engagement work at local schools and colleges and use DNA extraction from strawberries to show some of the work that we do.

[A]

So you pretend that strawberries are tumors?

[C]

Absolutely. But despite my not having to eat

[A]

mess at your house, mate, that's absolutely.

[C]

But sadly, despite labeling the strawberries as tun, when I turn my back, the kids are often eating them. A bit of an advertisement as to why they shouldn't be allowed in the lab.

[A]

Yeah, I bet you wish tumors look more like broccoli. So, Michelle, how do you fancy taking on someone making eco friendly medicine and someone saving kids from brain tumors on a show about medicine with no medical training? How are you feeling about that?

[D]

Well, I actually was on my way to becoming a doctor. I. I studied kinesiology at university. I even dissected a human. I could have been your doctor.

[A]

Honestly, the waiting times in this country are so bad, I think most of us would give it a go. Okay, that's our fantastic panel. So let's get started. Stephen, what do you think is the best medicine?

[B]

I think the best medicine is rubbish.

[A]

Okay, can you explain rubbish to us a little bit more, please?

[B]

Yeah, sure. So I think the thing that really fascinates me is that people don't realize where their medicines currently come from. Most of the medication that you take throughout your entire lives, and certainly on a daily basis, comes from fossil fuel. It's petrochemical oil. It's the same material that you put in your car. And what we've discovered and engineered recently is a strain of bacteria that can take waste plastic bottles and transform them into treatments for Parkinson's disease.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. Okay, so what does your work sort of actually involve? Hey, today?

[B]

Yeah, sure. So this is like an emerging area of biotechnology that's called engineering biology. We use modern DNA technologies to effectively reprogram bacteria to do things that they've never had to do before. And when we think about microbes and bacteria, I think we normally think of things that we use them to make, you know, wine, cheese, chocolate, beer, et cetera. All those wonderful things in life. All we're doing here is switching the genes inside those bacteria so that they no longer ferment sugar to make alcohol. They take plastic bottles and they make medication.

[A]

So you can kind of like hack them to do stuff they haven't evolved to do.

[B]

Exactly. It's just like a circuit board.

[A]

Yes. Oh, my God. I've done the same with my male partner. He's got empathy now. So why do we want to make medication out of plastic in the first place? I'm so worried I'm finding out in real time that Cal Pol is a fossil fuel.

[B]

It is.

[C]

Is it?

[B]

It is.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. Okay.

[D]

Does that mean that dinosaurs are our medicine?

[A]

Yes, yes, exactly.

[D]

That's kind of a fun way to think about it.

[A]

But they're not harmful, right? They're making us better, so why do we need to move away from it?

[B]

Yeah, exactly. So, like, fossil fuel is this infamously unsustainable natural resource that's running out in alarming rates. It's pretty contested in my field when fossil fuels are going to run out. It's important to know because 97% of everything that we use every single day currently comes from fossil fuels. It's not our medications only, but what is agreed upon is that's going to happen in a number of years that has two digits and not three. And therefore this is going to be something that happens in the lifetime of our children and our grandchildren. And technologies are coming online currently now that enable us to recycle plastic more effectively, more efficiently. But when we recycle plastic waste, you know, those second and third generation materials that you get, you see in the shops as our pets or recycled pet, and they're never quite as good as the normal plastic bottle. So actually what these technologies are doing is entering into what we call a down cycling process where they get less and less value until they inevitably end up in landfill or even worse, in the ocean. So we were like, okay, cool, let's teach bacteria to not just turn plastic waste into another plastic bottle. Let's cure disease using plastic waste. Because you defossilize medicine manuf, and at the same time you clean up plastic waste from the environment.

[A]

So these are already medicines that exist and you're making them out of plastic waste?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

This is absolutely incredible. And so that avoids us having to extract yet more fossil fuels and using what we already have here. So what kind of medicines can you make? What kind of diseases can you treat?

[B]

So a piece of work we did recently was turning waste plastic bottles into levodopa, which is a frontline medication to treat Parkinson's disease. Last year we reported the same technology that can turn waste plastic bottles into paracetamol as well, as you just mentioned. So your cowpole can come from a waste plastic bottle if you like. So what we do is we first of all get a waste plastic bottle. We actually literally did that for this technology when we reported it. We found one on our way to Work in Edinburgh. One day we picked it up from the street.

[A]

Unbelievable.

[B]

Do Gooder, you've got to walk the walk. Right. First of all, we deconstruct the plastic bottle, and there are enzymes that can do that. We can do that chemically as well. And the building blocks that you get from that classic are terephthalic acid and ethylene glycol. And terephthalic acid is what we then take, and we feed that to our bacteria. And that, again, is a very simple fermentation. It's in water at room temperature, and we just leave the bacterium for one day, and it eats the terephthalate and then starts spewing out L. Dopa.

[A]

How much medication can you make from one little drinks bottle?

[B]

Yeah, it's surprisingly quite a lot, actually. This is only being done on a very small laboratory scale. Currently, from one single standard plastic drinking bottle, we can make around about 80 to 100 doses. Thank you. So L Dopa is used as a frontline treatment for most people who are suffering from Parkinson's disease. It's used worldwide. It's medicine that's currently made from fossil fuels almost exclusively. The way it works is you take this, it crosses your blood brain barrier and it gets transformed into dopamine, which is the hormone that sort of replenishes motor function in people suffering from this disease.

[A]

This is amazing. So you basically feed plastic waste to bacteria. The bacteria breaks it down into kind of like the building blocks, and then you use those blocks to create a special type of dopamine, which is a treatment for Parkinson's that doesn't rely on extracting new fossil fuels. Am I getting this right?

[B]

That's 100%. And the really cool thing about that is, especially in the context of what we're talking about today from plastic waste, is dopamine is actually also a sort of happy hormone that's used in the feeling of rewards and happiness in humans. So you're quite literally in this technology, turning plastic waste into happiness.

[A]

And is there any specific bacteria that work well in this?

[B]

Yeah, there are a couple of bacteria that work really, really well. We use E. Coli. I love E. Coli. It's my favorite microorganism.

[A]

I love that you've got a favorite bacteria.

[D]

Where do you get the bacteria from?

[B]

Oh, do you know, that's a really interesting question. So the E. Coli that we use and the many biology labs use around the country was actually originally isolated from the feces of someone with liver cancer many, many years ago. But then scientists turned it into a laboratory bacterium. And we use these same strains of E. Coli to make many industrial products now. And it came from this one feces many years ago.

[A]

What a weird thing to be proud of. I do a dinner party, like, well, since you asked, my feces is everywhere. So where are we now and will this be rolled out?

[B]

So we're a discovery lab. We like sort of asking whether things can be possible and we're working with companies to try and see whether we can actually take this the whole mile in the future. I think if you look back even to that infamous David Attenborough documentary Blue Planet, where really plastic waste came to the forefront of everyone's attention, that was only 10 years ago. And we've went from there really having no tools to deal with the plastic waste crisis, to technologies to recycle it. Medicines coming from plastic waste. So if we can do that in 10 years, imagine we can do in the next 10 years.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, it sounds like you're doing more than enough, mate. To be honest, I think I'm amazing. If I rinse a tin before.

[C]

What other medications might come next, Stephen?

[B]

I think like there are anti cancer medications, there are other types of dementia that are treated using small molecules that come from fossil fuels. Currently, the opportunities are really endless. Plastic waste is not the only waste that's made of carbon. We published a piece of work last year where we took sewer fatberg waste from the sewers. They're just carbon. Microbes love carbon. So we designed a pathway in a microbe that could turn fatberg waste into perfume molecules for use in.

[A]

Someone's pushing their own fragrance for Christmas. Fatberg by Stephen. So do you think there's more that reprogramming microbes can do?

[B]

Yeah, I think maybe like the most tantalizing sci fi application, I guess, of this technology could be. If you think about the fact that there are bacteria making these medicines in this technology and we're covered in bacteria, the human body is almost more bacterial than it is human in terms of number of cells. Maybe we could have these programmed bacteria maybe living inside us, for example, and maybe responding only to disease with medication inside us. So actually having to go to the pharmacy or the hospital to buy medicine might be something that we never have to do in the future. We could have little pharmacies living inside us doing that for us.

[A]

That's amazing. That's. So what if they unionize? Is this the kind of thing where so like my bacteria will be like, she's gone for a big night out. We'll Give her the ibuprofen now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, Stephen, why is rubbish the best medicine?

[B]

Rubbish is the best medicine because we can cure any disease in the world. But if we don't have the feedstocks to make the medication, then those discoveries are futile. Plastic waste is not waste. It is just carbon. Through engineering biology, we can repurpose that carbon now in a way that creates medicines that can save the lives of millions of people and at the same time, clean up plastic waste from the environment. So rubbish is not rubbish, but it is the best medicine.

[A]

Incredible. Stephen, thank you so much. What a load of old medicine. So, Michelle, what do you think is the best medicine?

[D]

So I think the best medicine is home birth.

[A]

So from the off, did you know that home birth was the right thing for you?

[D]

Well, I'm a bit of a glutton for punishment. I run ultra marathons, which is anything above a marathon. And the reason I did that is because I want to see what my body is capable of. So I've had two natural home births. I had a midwife and a doula. I actually had two midwives there. And they clean up everything. They just. It's like, I mean, if you ever murdered somebody and you needed someone to take care of all of that, call my midwife n'. Doula. Because my house was left spotless. I mean, cleaner than when they got there.

[A]

I can't believe I'm gonna have to get knocked up just so I can get a deep clean on the living room.

[D]

Initially, we thought we were gonna do one of those, like, inflatable birthing pools, which you actually think is gonna be like, oh, it's a specific pool for birth, but it's just an inflatable pool. It's the same pool you can buy at a store. It's a kiddie pool. It's just you're having a kid in the pool. My first labor was only five hours, which is very short. And we didn't have time to do the whole pool thing. But also at that point, I was like, I'm not moving. Like, I'm not. I am on the couch. We're having the baby on the couch.

[A]

This sofa is getting some real shout outs here. I feel like you work for dfs when you push out the placenta, did you say, everything must go? How does it work? So there's a midwife and a doula.

[D]

So I had a midwife and a doula. And they also teach, like a pre birth class to really explain what's going to happen. And not just the physiology of it, but also the mental and the emotional aspect of it. Because part of giving birth is your body makes oxytocin. But like there's things that can happen in your own mind that can stop your production of oxytocin. I did some therapy sessions with my doula as well. It really teaches you how to like flow with birth and like just give in to the birth, let the contractions wave over you, that kind of thing. Although you could learn as much about birth as you want. And then you start to experience it and you're like, oh,

[A]

let it wash.

[D]

This is not Washington.

[A]

Was your partner around?

[D]

My husband was kind of wandering around like he wanted to do something. I feel like you're seeing your partner in a lot of pain and you're like, can I help at all? And I was like, just push on my feet, you know, like push on the bottoms of my feet. It was nothing. But he was like, I'm helping. And I was like, thank you.

[A]

I love giving men like made up jobs.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I think that's why we invented the bins. Do you know what I mean?

[D]

He also, he had on some like very like classical, like lovely, but like classical music's a bit dark and slow a lot of the times. I was like, can we put on something a little more get up and go? And so instead of changing the music, he put on the movie Blazing Saddle. I watched the movie again after I gave birth because I didn't fully really take it all in.

[A]

Listen, I can't take in a film if the big light's on. Yeah.

[D]

And then, you know, I have my baby. I've run a 50 mile race before and I was like, oh, wow, that's, you know, like I couldn't believe my body could do that. And then I gave birth and I was like, that's like so much cooler than a 50 mile race. For me it was at least. And it's nice to know how incredible women are. Also, for the record, women can be incredible in other ways too. You don't have to have a baby to be incredible. You can just be incredible because you put up with men.

[A]

It's so lovely to hear about that experience. Michelle, I should add, obviously, always consult with your doctor first. If you've got any pre existing medical conditions or complications in your pregnancy, they might advise against a home birth. Also, if you're going to give birth on your own sofa, please, please don't forget to check down the back in case it's twins and you lose one. Just stuck to a Pound coin down. So, Michelle, why do you think home births are the best medicine?

[D]

I understand there's plenty of good reasons to have baby in a hospital, but there's also lots of cases where it's good to have a baby at home. You are comfortable in your own home and also you get to brag about it for the rest of your life.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's like the same rule with drugs in general. You know, it's safer in hospital, but more fun at home. Thank you, Michelle. So, finally, Matt, what do you think is the best medicine?

[C]

So I think collaboration is the best medicine.

[A]

So explain how collaboration is used in your work.

[C]

It's been really crucial to me in my work, researching a particular aggressive type of brain tumour called a high grade glioma. These are very rare tumours.

[A]

Does the fact that they are rare make it harder to do tests and research on them?

[C]

Yeah, absolutely. So we're very reliant on collaboration from people around the world and in this country to provide us with samples in which to do tests on. We need lots of examples of these tumours to be able to study them and understand what the different genetic makeups actually are. And so by liaising with our colleagues, both in this country, but also internationally, we can all work together to bring these tumour samples together, do these various tests and then derive positive benefits for our patients from that.

[A]

What does that look like?

[C]

So we have to send the tumour samples on dry ice, on various different transport mechanisms and hope that it arrives okay.

[A]

I love dry ice. Brings a bit of showbiz to it tonight, Matthew. I'm going to be a useful tumour.

[C]

And these tumors can occur in any patient of any age. So right away from infants, right the way up to older adults, and they have around a two year survival after diagnosis. But I did a project that looked at those occurring in very young children and infants and I was able to identify a particular change in the DNA that now has a target with a drug.

[A]

So you're getting the samples from all over the world. Is it all held in a directory somewhere? How does it work?

[C]

No, it isn't. So it's a matter of getting to know colleagues and actually contacting them directly. So when I first started the project, it was a simple matter of emailing colleagues who were working in the field, whether that's oncologists, neurosurgeons, neuropathologists, and seeing whether they had samples that fit the criteria of what I was looking for.

[A]

But you know what this reminds me of? You know when you're at a house party, you're trying to find out who's got drugs. Yeah. Who's got. Is it like that? So you have to just like network and find out who sat on a stash of tumours. So you get these samples, how are you testing them and what is it you're looking for?

[C]

What we can now do is go inside those cells and take out the genetic information, so the DNA and perform different tests on it. There's a particular type of test called DNA methylation profiling. And if you take.

[A]

I was going to say that actually

[C]

what we did with this group of infant tumours is that we analysed where methyl groups are positioned and it showed that they had a very distinct and profile to all the other known types of high grade gliomas. And so it represented a new type of tumour that then I did some further work to try and analyse what made them different.

[A]

I think you're the only person in the world probably excited by the phrase new tumour. So is the problem that they're being treated like they were like a broader category of tumour, when actually this is something completely different and it might need completely different treatment?

[C]

Absolutely. We're really reliant on chemotherapy and radiotherapy, as was mentioned earlier. The blood brain barrier is a fantastic way we've evolved to protect the brain in stopping things from crossing that might cause damage to it. But unfortunately it means we can't get these chemotherapy agents across and deal with the cancer cells. And at the same time radiotherapy, which can have some success, causes long term damage for children. So finding something where we can give a more targeted treatment that's going to really help is the real goal of all our research we do.

[A]

So has this technology been used to help kids who have this type of tumour now?

[C]

Yes. So what we identified is that there were breaks in the DNA that then rejoined together, which meant two genes that were normal, completely far apart from each other, were now next to each other and that one of these genes was causing the other to be overactivated and that this was what was driving this cancer to develop. And normally within cancers you have lots of different changes within the DNA. But what was very exciting was that this was the only change that was present within these cancer cells. It can take years and years for certain medications to be developed in response to a change that's identified. So we were really fortunate there were already drugs that specifically were able to target this particular change available.

[A]

So there is actually already medicine There, so you don't have to go through all the clinical trials and all that. And is that test in the lab as far as it's got, or is it being used on people?

[C]

There have been some amazing results from this. So one little patient I remember in particular was a little child who was in Italy. And to show the extent of this, sometimes these tumors are diagnosed before the patient's even been born. And this was such a case that happened. And through collaboration, an oncologist in Italy got in touch with me to say she suspected this was a case. And four days after this little baby was born, the surgeons took a small sample of this tumor, was sent to me at the Institute of Cancer Research, and I was able to perform these tests and send them the news that it was one of these new tumours. She was started on a drug called crizotinib, which was then changed to larotrectinib. And then the scans showed that the tumour was shrinking and then it disappeared. And she's now 8 years old. And I every. It's really lovely because usually on her birthday I get a WhatsApp message from the family showing a little video of her and things as well.

[A]

That's so lovely. I just can't wait for those awkward teenage ones, though. Thanks for saving my life. Whatever. I don't understand how this came about with this Italian girl. Is it just because you. Or did you have a personal relationship with a doctor in Italy?

[C]

It was from this networking opportunity of actually going to meetings, getting to know people in this field, and then they were aware of the project that I was doing. And so when a case came up that showed the similar features to this, they remembered my project and so got in touch directly to say that they potentially might have a case and could I potentially help with them. So the effort that went into publicizing effectively these projects has paid dividends for that child, but for others in the future as well.

[A]

I feel stupid saying this. Is the tumor named after you?

[C]

No, it's called an infant type hemispheric glioma. And it's important it's not named for me because this is a network of people that have been involved. So when we published the paper in a journal called Cancer Discovery, There were about 130 different authors on this paper, recognizing all the scientists from around the world, the oncologists, the neurosurgeons that have all contributed to this work. I was leading the project. But there are so many clever people that I work with at the ICR that have helped support me. And without them, and without the collaboration that we've had, it wouldn't have been possible.

[A]

I can't believe that there's a magazine called Cancer Discovery. Feels a bit weird, doesn't it? When their sales go into a remission, are they happy? Sad. It's tricky. So, Matt, why do you think collaboration is the best medicine?

[C]

So I think collaboration is the best medicine because it provides the opportunity to work with some extraordinary people from around the world, but also in this country as well. All of us working together to derive these samples can actually make a big difference. And this example shows how we can take a tumor that previously was a death sentence for a child, and now we can do something that actually saves lives from it.

[A]

I think it is worthwhile to point out the greatest feats of humanity have required huge collaboration. Thousands of often uncredited people as well, working together on the same projects. You know, the moon landings, the Channel Tunnel, Harry Kane's autobiography. The list goes on. Thank you very much, Matt. Incredible. Okay, so now I have to choose. What is the best medicine? Rubbish. Collaboration and home births.

[D]

Okay, can I just say, If a home birth, you know, you have a baby and that baby is going to give you headaches, and without headaches, you wouldn't need paracetamol.

[A]

I love that you're bringing your athletic, competitive strength when you're so clearly gonna lose. I think the home birth feels like it was a collaboration between your midwife, your doula, yourself and your partner. It feels like what you do, Stephen, it's absolutely incredible. But you work in a team. You know, there was some other research that had been done that helped you guys move forward with it. So I feel like without collaboration, we wouldn't have what you're doing with rubbish. So I think this week's best medicine is collaboration. Yes. Thank you so much to my incredible guests. That's about all we've got time for, obviously, because the bin men come at seven and Stephen wants a rummage before they take it away. So we better head off. Goodbye. Best Madison was hosted by me, Kiri Pritchard McLean and featured Dr. Matt Clark, Professor Stephen Wallace and Michelle Wolf. It was written by Edward Easton, Jordan Gray, Kieran Pritchard maclean and Ben Rouse. The producer was Tashi Rada and it was a large time production for BBC Radio 4. Hiya, it's Kiri here. If you enjoyed that episode of Comedy of the Week, well, you've got great taste. But also there are loads more episodes available from this series on BBC Sound. Just search Best medicine. Enjoy.