Staff Review With Todd Levin

Summary

Staff Review With Todd Levin

Podcast: Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend
Date: March 5, 2026
Guest: Todd Levin (Conan’s longtime writer)
Host: Conan O’Brien
Producer/Engineer: Eduardo Perez

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, Conan brings up one of his key writers, Todd Levin, for a candid and playfully deep-dive “staff review.” Leaning into their long-standing collaborative partnership, Conan and Todd reflect on the evolution of comedy writing, the unique culture inside Conan’s writers’ room, and the creative and sometimes chaotic process behind memorable “Late Night” and “Tonight Show” bits. The episode brims with warmth, inside jokes, and a treasure trove of backstage stories—especially for fans curious about how quirky comedy comes to life.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Todd Levin’s Arrival & Early Days (00:13 - 02:00)

• Backstory: Todd joined Conan’s team in 2009, just as Conan was leaving “Late Night” in New York to (briefly) helm “The Tonight Show.”
• Comedy as Career: Both Todd and Conan share that comedy felt like an otherworldly pursuit growing up in non-entertainment households—“show business is this thing that exists on Jupiter and it’s done by aliens.” (Conan, 05:02)
• Parental Influence: Todd credits his father’s record collection (Bob Newhart, Cosby) and relaxed movie rules for nurturing his love for comedy, paralleling Conan’s own upbringing.

2. Standup Comedy & “Alternative” Scenes (06:20 - 09:00)

• Finding His Style: Todd started by reading pre-written bits on stage à la Newhart’s reserved style, then slowly grew more comfortable improvising.
• The Alternative Scene: He describes New York’s late-90s/2000s alt-comedy spaces (Rafifi, Luna Lounge, UCB), highlighting the welcoming vibe for experimental humor—versus the more “combative” atmosphere of traditional clubs.
• Stand-out Quote:
  “In the alternative rooms, you’re kind of like, well, this will make you like me … [but in clubs] it’s more of a struggle, like, I have to make these idiots like me in my brain.” (Todd, 08:51)

3. Jumping Into TV Writing (09:34 - 10:57)

• First TV Job: Todd confesses that “Late Night with Conan” was his first real writing gig—a daunting leap for a huge fan who felt unworthy at first, even nearly taking a lower-profile VH1 job instead.
• Playful Regret:
  “I’d love it if you had turned us down and worked on ridiculousness.” (Conan, 10:56)

4. Favorite Bits and Legendary Skits (11:12 - 16:50)

• Minty the Candy Cane:
  • Todd’s first real “breakthrough” bit: a holiday sketch about a candy cane (“Minty”) that briefly fell on the ground—a simple, old-timey musical number sung by Brian Stack and performed by Brian McCann.
  • "Minty, the candy cane who briefly fell on the ground. Now he's covered in goo." (Conan & Todd, 12:22-12:28)
• Human Centipede Menorah:
  • A surreal, boundary-pushing Hanukkah bit riffing off the horror film. Todd recalls Patton Oswalt being “horrified” by it and cast members forming a “shared trauma bond.”
  • "Take something monstrous and make people have to celebrate it … or take something sweet and make it monstrous." (Todd, 16:50-16:58)
• Wiki Bear:
  • A children’s toy parody where an innocent-looking bear offers bizarre, dark Wikipedia facts—pivoting mid-answer to macabre trivia (like Ed Gein’s lampshades).
  • "Speaking of bright ideas … Ed Gein made lampshades out of human skin." (Conan as Wiki Bear, 18:01)
• The Man with Bulletproof Legs:
  • Brian McCann’s physical comedy, super-short shorts, and recurring “self-satisfied” bit where his bulletproof legs inevitably fail to prevent his demise.

5. The Writing Process: Ownership & Risk (19:18 - 24:38)

• Autonomy in Conan’s Room:
  • Todd was shocked—and later exhilarated—by how much responsibility writers have at Conan’s show: “You’re kind of expected to not just write your bits, but produce them and, in a sense, direct them as well.” (19:33)
• Learning by Immersion:
  • Conan credits SNL’s Lorne Michaels for this sink-or-swim creative model—writers interface with every aspect, from designers to editors, which breeds ownership (20:37–21:05)
• Creative Resourcefulness:
  • Sometimes, writers’ ambitions outpace common sense or budget:
    “Why is Minty made out of silver? Because that’s the way I thought of it.” (Conan, 21:52)
• Example of Excess:
  • Todd and Dan Cronin’s “Del Taco Delivery System” bit: a fake ad for a device that recognizes when the toilet is flushed, signals stomach readiness, and delivers burritos accordingly—a joke that ballooned into a needlessly elaborate, expensive sketch.
  • “It became so ambitious where … it opens up like a third eye and takes you to this place of nirvana, where everything’s perfectly in sync. It was so expensive.” (Todd, 22:45–23:20)

6. The Joy (and Risk) of Pushing Boundaries (24:14 - 24:38)

• Trying to "Break Conan":
  • A running motivation for the writers was to push Conan and see what might slip onto the show:
    “So much of what I felt I was trying to do as a writer was to break you because you’ve seen so much. … There’s that kind of line between okay, that’ll work for the show, and I want to see that on the show.” (Todd, 24:14)
• Conan’s Playful Antagonism:
  • Conan admits to “salivating” when a bit bombed, going into full roast mode, much to the writers’ horror and amusement (25:01–26:37).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "You’re like a ninja, an assassin … you’re quiet ... then you’ll say something hilarious and write something great, but there’s not a lot of, you know, babbling and ‘hey, look at me.’"
  — Conan, praising Todd’s low-key style (02:30)
• “My favorite era of singing is about 1914—megaphone singing.”
  — Conan, on the retro flair of the Minty bit (12:40)
• “He had a license plate that said ‘Tonight Show for Life’ ... it wasn’t even legal!”
  — Conan, ribbing Todd’s optimism before “The Tonight Show” tenure (01:35)
• “There’s no past. There’s only the present. Time is a loop.”
  — Conan, on the ephemeral nature of comedy and mockery (26:38)
• “Time flattens everything.”
  — Todd, on surviving showbiz ups and downs (26:37)

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Timestamps of Key Segments

| Timestamp | Topic | |-----------|-------| | 00:13 | Welcoming Todd Levin; 2009 "Late Night" era | | 03:32 | Todd's journey: early comedy influences | | 06:59 | Entering the NYC alternative comedy scene | | 09:34 | Getting his first TV job with Conan | | 11:25 | Bit breakdown: "Minty the Candy Cane" | | 15:07 | Bit breakdown: "Human Centipede Menorah" | | 16:46 | Comedic themes: sweet/monstrous combo | | 17:11 | Bit breakdown: "Wiki Bear" | | 19:18 | Adjusting to the hands-on Conan writers' room | | 22:02 | Ambitious/failed sketches: "Del Taco Delivery System" | | 24:14 | Trying to "break" Conan | | 25:01 | What happens when a bit bombs | | 26:37 | Finale: Gratitude, mockery, and showbiz time loops |

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Final Notes

With affection, humility, and typical Team Coco irreverence, this episode is a backstage pass for comedy nerds. It reflects how writerly obsessions, mad creative risks, and the joyful agony of bombing are as much a part of the show’s DNA as Conan’s hair or dance moves. Todd and Conan’s mutual respect—buoyed by decades of inside jokes—makes for one of the most intimate and illuminating “writer’s room” episodes yet.

Transcript

[Todd Levin]

Foreign.

[Eduardo Perez]

O' Brien needs a fan. Want to talk to Conan? Visit teamcoco.com call Conan. Okay, let's get started.

[Conan O'Brien]

Hey, welcome to a Thursday episode of Con. O' Brien needs a friend. Usually these are fan episodes, but we've been mixing it up a little bit recently. I'll tell you why. Getting ready for the Oscars. And I have my a elite writing staff downstairs in the building working hard on concepts, riddles, quizzes, recipes for the Oscars. And I am very fortunate. I'll just come out and say it. I work with the best writers in the world and one of them, I want to come up and hang with them. We did this with Ryan Kiley a couple days ago and now we're gonna do it with Mr. Todd Levin. About as sharp a writer as you will find you really are.

[Todd Levin]

That's really nice.

[Conan O'Brien]

You're craz and I'm so glad that you're helping me with the Oscars. And we've. I think you joined me. Did you say it was 2009? Was when you came on board 2009,

[Todd Levin]

just as you were wrapping up late night in New York.

[Conan O'Brien]

I was wrapping up late night and I was headed to take over the Tonight show for a 30 year run.

[Todd Levin]

And we had jobs for life.

[Conan O'Brien]

You said, I remember I hired you. And you said, you know, tonight's show hosts lasts forever.

[Todd Levin]

Yes.

[Conan O'Brien]

And you said, count me in. And you started spending money like crazy.

[Todd Levin]

Oh, yeah, it was, most of it was spent before I even got to California.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, yeah. He showed up and the first day he got, he said, I'm buying a Bentley. And he got a license plate that said tonight show for life. And I said, I looked it up. It was way too many characters for a license plate. It wasn't even legal.

[Todd Levin]

It was actually Tonight's show for Life 3 because two other people had gotten the same bag. Thank you, please.

[Conan O'Brien]

Two other writers from my Tonight show. Yeah. So you were with me for the end of late night Tonight show, then the TBS thing and now Oscars and yeah. So you will be my writer for life, whether you want to be or not. So let's get into this a little bit because there are different types of writers. There are the kinds that they chatter constantly. I'm sorry to say I was one of those what?

[Eduardo Perez]

Oh, my God.

[Conan O'Brien]

Doing bits in the room and dancing around like a chimp on crack. And then Todd, you're that I call you. You're like a ninja, an assassin. You're quiet, you're taking things in, and then you'll say something that's really hilarious and you'll write something that's really great. But there's not a lot of, you know, you know, babbling and hey, look at me. Which I really admire.

[Todd Levin]

It's not demonstrative because I believe in my work.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, wow. I am very much like a bad magician. And I'm also a bad musician, but I'm a bad magician trying to distract you. I'm like, whoa, look at this.

[Todd Levin]

Wee.

[Eduardo Perez]

Woo.

[Conan O'Brien]

And then. Cause I'm afraid someone will really look and see there's not a lot of protein here.

[Todd Levin]

No. But I think it's also just because I've never been uncomfortable with that part of, like, performing stuff. Even when I was doing standup, I was the guy who just hugged the microphone. I just held it dear to me. And I wasn't like a big actor.

[Conan O'Brien]

You'd often try and leave with it. Yeah, Todd, you've got to keep coming back.

[Todd Levin]

Come back with a mic.

[Conan O'Brien]

Well, tell me about your journey a little bit because this happens so often. I work with these really talented people and I get to know them. We're in the trenches together. And I think, hey, I don't really know your origin story, but when did you know? Oh, comedy is for me.

[Todd Levin]

I mean, I think I always knew it as a kid, but I didn't know. I think you probably hear this a lot and I think a lot of people who are in comedy say this, but I didn't know it was a career. You know, I didn't grow up in that kind of environment. You know, my parents were both state workers in Albany, New York. And I. So I loved comedy as a kid and my dad was really instrumental in that because my dad had. My parents had a terrible record collection. They had very. They had like a couple John Denver's, a couple Barbra Streisands. Right. But then my dad also had David's

[Conan O'Brien]

saying, what's wrong with that?

[Todd Levin]

That sounds great to me. Not much. I love your parents.

[Conan O'Brien]

When can I come over? David, settle down.

[Todd Levin]

But my dad had Bob Newhart records as well. So he was my. My introduction to comedy. So I would listen to his records all the time. He had Cosby records too. You could say that. Like, but those were also like huge. A huge influence on me. Huge. Yeah, yeah. And then my dad also had this rule, like we had this really strict bedt, but if we had HBO when I was growing up and if there was a funny movie on at like 9 o', clock, he would let me stay up to Watch. Watch it with him. So I'd watch a lot of comedies with my dad.

[Conan O'Brien]

Everything you're saying resonates completely with me because my parents had nothing to do with show business. I'm growing up just outside Boston. I. You know, show business is this thing that exists on Jupiter and it's done by aliens. But my father was very interested in comedy. He was a infectious disease scientist doctor. But he loved comedy. He loved Newhart. We had those records. They also had a terrible record. I mean, like, no records, but he loved comedy. And when a movie like Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World would come on.

[Todd Levin]

Oh, yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Once a year, we weren't allowed to watch TV at night. If it was a school night, if we had school the next day. But he would say, when this comedy came on, he would say we could all watch it. And I mean, this was unheard of. But that was sacrosanct. If there was a really good classic comedy, we could watch that. So. And I think Newhart, I mean, what a great person to learn from, because the jokes and the concepts. It's about jokes and concepts. He's like a matador. He didn't move that much. It's all the power of the joke and a stillness to it.

[Todd Levin]

Yes, for sure.

[Conan O'Brien]

And a musical ear.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah. I loved him. Yeah. So my dad turned me on to Monty Python, to snl, all those things. So I was really into it as a kid and had no idea that it could be a thing you could do for a living. And then when I moved to New York, which was just a place, I knew that I wanted to be in New York eventually. I didn't know what I wanted to do there. I just knew I needed to be in New York eventually. And then when I got there, I just gravitated toward people who were doing improv and doing standup. And I don't even know how or why I befriended these people, but I started to kind of get in with that world. And people, my friends, were just encouraging me to get out on stage and just do stuff.

[Conan O'Brien]

That's great.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah. So in the beginning, I wasn't even my. The beginning of my standup career was me reading bits. It was very much like a Newhart thing where I was just. I would prepare a written bit that I depended on the page. Cause I was so scared. And I just was like, I need the words to be perfect. So I would structure it like, well, I got these letters in the mail, and I thought I'd share them with you. Or I found these old diary Entries. So something that was sort of. It had to be read. And then as I continued to do it, I just got more comfortable being in front of people and being spontaneous and the pages started drifting away.

[Conan O'Brien]

But you have to find a special place to do that because you can't

[Todd Levin]

go to a club.

[Conan O'Brien]

There are comedy clubs where it's very confrontational and you have to almost fight them to prove that you're funny, which is, you know, can breed a certain kind of style. And then there are places you can go that are more open to experimentation, 100%. And so where were you finding those places?

[Todd Levin]

So in New York, that was. There was a place called Rafifi, which was in the back of a. It was like they showed movies there. And there was also like burlesque nights. It was a really weird place. There's a bar in the front and a little theater in the back. And there was a big kind of thriving alternative scene there. So I would do shows there, ucb, places like that. There's a place called Luna Lounge that had a very famous alternative show on Monday nights. Marin kind of ruled the roost there. And he was an older kind of a generation of comics before me. Yeah. So there were all these little rooms. You could do that. And then once you got comfortable, there still was an expectation that you do clubs. I never really wanted to do clubs, but if you're doing. If you're trying to get into a festival or get on tv, then you kind of have to be in clubs and you have. And it is, it's different. It's like I have to make you like me.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Todd Levin]

Whereas in the alternative rooms, you're kind of like, well, this will make you like I. This. The words I'm saying will hopefully make you like me. But like, you have to be this person that's approachable and it, it can be combative, but it's just a. It's more of like a. A struggle. Like I have to make these idiots like me in my brain.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, you morons. How are you morons tonight, you working class scum. Hey, why did the crowd wasn't that good tonight? Yeah, they were. They were really good until you screamed

[Todd Levin]

at them in your warm glass, called them suit.

[Conan O'Brien]

You dropped your horn rimmed glasses at one point.

[Todd Levin]

I waved a newspaper at them.

[Conan O'Brien]

Don't you idiots read? Uh, yeah. Everyone has to find their own way. And you do that. And then what did you do? TV jobs. Before you came to me, this was

[Todd Levin]

my first TV job. So I had been doing pretty well as a Standup. And I'd gotten, like, a TV gig just performing, and I got an agent through that. But as soon as I got an agent, I said, I want to write. Like, that's what I want to do. I, you know, I. I like standup, but I love writing. And this late night was my first TV job, and I almost didn't take it because I thought, well, shouldn't I have a job on a worse show first? Like, I had that. That's my own, like, you know, insecurity and growing up in this kind of, like, working middle class family, I was like, shouldn't I have started on something smaller? Because I was such a huge fan of the show when I got hired that I almost didn't take it. And then the week that. That week I got the job.

[Conan O'Brien]

You got the job, and you were like, hey, this show isn't that good. I think I'll be just fine.

[Todd Levin]

I don't know what all the fuss is all about.

[Conan O'Brien]

I think Conan's on pills, but, yeah.

[Todd Levin]

So I had gotten a job on another TV show, VH1 TV show, that same week, and I almost took that job. And then I got a call from Sweeney about this show. Yeah. And that's good. Yeah, it was crazy.

[Conan O'Brien]

I'd love it if you had turned us down and worked on ridiculousness.

[Todd Levin]

I know I would be rich.

[Conan O'Brien]

Clips of people in bikinis falling down.

[Todd Levin]

Rich beyond my wildest. So rich

[Conan O'Brien]

you'd refuse to come on this podcast.

[Todd Levin]

Now, I'm not talking. How much does this pay?

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. So talk to me about some of the bits that you like, your experience working on the show. What were some of the bits that you got on early days or just in general that you were really proud of?

[Todd Levin]

Well, the first, I would say the first thing that I got on that. Well, there are a couple things, like, there are a couple things, Erlan, that got. I liked, but the first thing that I got on that I was really proud of, that really kind of broke through was Minty.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Todd Levin]

Minty. The candy cane.

[Conan O'Brien]

Minty. The candy cane.

[Todd Levin]

And that was like. It just made people happy.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, it was so.

[Todd Levin]

It made me happy.

[Conan O'Brien]

Great. Now refresh us to take us through the. Minty is a candy cane, but not any candy cane.

[Todd Levin]

Minty.

[Conan O'Brien]

And he's played by McCann.

[Todd Levin]

He's played by Brian McCann. I had basically, I had so much insurance for that bit, though, because I had Brian McCann, who's an incredible performer, such a great character, so funny playing this candy cane that had fallen. The idea is that he had Fallen on the ground. Briefly, briefly, briefly.

[Conan O'Brien]

He briefly fell on the ground.

[Todd Levin]

He had a few things stuck to him like a cigarette butt and a penny and.

[Conan O'Brien]

And then the song was. Can you do the song? I'm trying to remember it. Minty, the candy cane, who briefly fell on the ground. And it was done in that kind of old time.

[Todd Levin]

Fell on the ground.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, Minty fell.

[Todd Levin]

Now he's covered in goo.

[Conan O'Brien]

Now he's covered in goo. Oh, my God.

[Todd Levin]

But like so. So McCann played him. Stack sang Brian Stack. Brian Stack, also an amazing performer, sang the song and Jimmy Vivino arranged it. I can't sing it.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's a great song. And of course, near and dear to my heart, because my favorite era of singing is about 1914.

[Todd Levin]

Megaphone singing.

[Conan O'Brien]

Megaphone singing. Oh. And you know, and it was great. He had just the perfect thing stuck to him and immediately people loved him. I loved him. I would always dance along with Minty. I think Mindy threw things at people.

[Todd Levin]

He threw. He had a little basket of candy canes that he passed out in the audience. And then he wouldn't.

[Conan O'Brien]

And then he would whip them at me.

[Todd Levin]

Violently. Whip them at you.

[Conan O'Brien]

And quick shout out to Brian McCann, who I gotta get in here at some point because he played. He was such a. That early, early late night show he was on and would just play these hilarious characters that really helped us put our stamp on the kind of humor we liked. And one of my favorites was the man with Bulletproof Legs.

[Todd Levin]

So good.

[Conan O'Brien]

And McCann would come out wearing super short shorts and an incredibly self satisfied expression. And he would sing a song about how you can't hurt me. Cause I've got bulletproof legs. Yes, I've got bulletproof legs. You can't. And then blam. He'd get shot in the chest and collapse and die. And it. One of my favorite things. Cause he'd make his legs elongate. Yes.

[Todd Levin]

He would like almost do this kind of beautiful swan walk.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes, you'd do this long legged swan walk. Bragging about how Swan walk. Bragging about how his legs were bulletproof. And then he'd get shot in the chest. And it just delighted me. And that's one of maybe 10,000 things McCann did for us. What do you got there, Eduardo? You want me to play it? Yeah. If you want to see one of these Minty sketches come to life, go on the Team Coco channel. Look up Mindy the Candy Cane. Come on, let's hear him. Happy holidays, everyone.

[Todd Levin]

The voice he chose.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, you can hear the sound of Minty the candy cane who. Misty fell on the ground. Minty fell on the ground. Now Minty's covered in two. Cause mine.

[Todd Levin]

That's it. Just a moment or two.

[Conan O'Brien]

You know, my favorite was Minty's Covered in Goo, and it's just go. Yeah. Oh, that made me so happy.

[Todd Levin]

Oh, another early thing. I don't want to talk about this that much, but was the. The Human Centipede Menorah?

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Todd Levin]

Which was. That was, like, might have been the same year.

[Conan O'Brien]

Human Centipede had just come out, which was one of the most horrifying and still remains one of the most horrifying movies of all time. Sona made me watch it on the tour bus.

[Todd Levin]

I did. Oh, really?

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Todd Levin]

I've never seen it. I won't watch it.

[Eduardo Perez]

And it buffered a lot, so it took us four hours to watch. Was really, really not.

[Conan O'Brien]

It was a labor of love. And so, yeah. Human Centipede Menorah. So did this get you tossed out of any religious affiliations?

[Todd Levin]

Well, the two things I remember about it were that, like, Patton Oswald had tweeted something about how horrifying it was, and I was like, if that got him, that's good.

[Conan O'Brien]

If this horrified Patton Oswald and got him not sleeping, then we know we're in the right territory.

[Todd Levin]

And then the other thing was that we did it multiple years, and for some reason, they always. I guess because the costumes fit. They always tried to hire back the same nine guys. Yeah. And except for, like, one of them, they all came back. It was like a. Like they had Stockholm syndrome. Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. The one that didn't come back, Timothee Chalamet, he just, you know. And he won't acknowledge it anymore.

[Todd Levin]

No, no. He doesn't talk about it.

[Conan O'Brien]

Doesn't talk about it.

[Todd Levin]

But it was crazy because those guys would. They all stayed in touch with each other. It was like a shared trauma. And they all. They all kept in touch. And I.

[Conan O'Brien]

If you want to see the Human Centipede Menorah, go on the team Coco. And then don't look at the clip. Cause it was horrifying.

[Todd Levin]

So horrifying.

[Conan O'Brien]

And it's everything you think it is.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah. Yes.

[Conan O'Brien]

Wow. So.

[Todd Levin]

But I like to do. That was a thing that I think that I would go back to a lot, which was take something monstrous and make people have to celebrate it.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Todd Levin]

Or take something sweet and make it monstrous. Which, like, Wiki Bear was, like, a sweet thing. That stack and I wrote that was like, you love it when you see it. And his voice is cute. But he's a monster.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. What was it? Was it. What was Wiki Bear was when I would take the. It was like the. The bear that they were selling.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah, yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

There's a real bear that they were selling that you could ask it questions and.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah, it's based on a real thing. There was a bear that could connect to the Internet.

[Conan O'Brien]

Could connect to the Internet.

[Eduardo Perez]

It was, like obsessed with murder, wasn't it? Constantly. The Wiki Bear was always giving anecdotes. Not anecdotes, but, like stories.

[Todd Levin]

It would give you facts that you would ask it very innocent questions. It would answer them and then pivot off the question to something. Absolutely.

[Conan O'Brien]

So give me an example. Trying to remember. I know.

[Todd Levin]

Like, so you would ask it like, it was always. I wish I could think of an

[Conan O'Brien]

example because it was a cute kid's toy. So I was saying, hey, Wiki Bear, how are you? You know, and then it would. Well, I'm fine, Conan. And then it would pivot off that really quickly.

[Todd Levin]

Speaking of blah, blah, blah, Gein made. Yeah.

[Conan O'Brien]

Ed Gein made lampshades out of human skin. And I'd be like, wiki Bear.

[Todd Levin]

Speaking of bright ideas. Yeah. It would be like something like that.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Todd Levin]

He was a clever fella.

[Conan O'Brien]

I think one of the reasons you fit in so nicely is that I think my whole life, so many bits, were me trying to be the innocent talk show host who was doing something sweet.

[Todd Levin]

Yes.

[Conan O'Brien]

It's almost like we didn't have rehearsal. If you followed that logic, I'm going to try out this Wiki Bear. Hey, Wiki Bear. And. And then I'd be trying to be like, okay, well, let's just move it along, Wiki Bear. Did you know that the. The second night of the Manson murders, they, you know. And I'm like, hey, hold on a second. Wiki Bear. But if you look through it, that's a theme that runs through the entire show for years and years and years. Any version of it is me trying

[Todd Levin]

to put on a nice show.

[Conan O'Brien]

I'm trying to put on a nice show. And I don't understand what's going on

[Todd Levin]

here, but that was a bit that you helped a lot, actually, because the original draft was like kind of. I don't think it was unfunny, but it wasn't focused. And then when we were doing in rehearsal, because the bear would move, like they could control its mouth, so it could always move. And Stack was in the voiceover booth and you guys just started talking about the Manson family. It just became a Funny thing at rehearsal, and then Stack and I kind of locked into that. We're like, that's what the bit is.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah, you have to find it sometimes.

[Todd Levin]

And it changed the whole thing. And it was.

[Conan O'Brien]

So what surprised you? You went from watching the show to then working on it. What are some of the things that struck you as, oh, this is different, Or, I mean, what were your impressions?

[Todd Levin]

Well, the thing that. I'll tell you, a thing that terrified me at first, but then became my favorite thing about the show, was that the writers have a lot of autonomy and that you're kind of expected to not just write your bits, but to produce them and, in a sense, direct them as well. And you're working with the editors, and you're working with all the departments. And in the beginning, if you've never done that before, it's so scary because you're like, there's a thousand ways to mess this up and a couple ways to get it right.

[Conan O'Brien]

Well, that is something I learned from Lorne Michaels. When I went to work on Saturday Night Live with Greg Daniels, it was. I mean, it stunned us. I mean, I was, I don't know, 23 maybe, or 24. And suddenly, yeah, I would have been 24, I think. But, you know, we pitched a sketch. They said, you know, I did well at Read Through. And the next thing you know, you're talking to set designers, wardrobe people. You're telling them, you know, Lauren would say to me, what kind of restaurant is this? And I'd be like, I don't know. I just get pizza at the corner. Around the corner, I get a slice. Are we at Orso? Are we at Elaine's?

[Eduardo Perez]

Oh, my God.

[Conan O'Brien]

You know, we downtown at Le Bon En. And I'm like, I don't know.

[Todd Levin]

They go to three restaurants.

[Conan O'Brien]

I don't go to restaurants. I've never been to a restaurant. I have two pairs of jeans and a 1973 Plymouth Valiant. Don't ever tell me that again. But, yeah. And so Lauren threw us into the deep end of the pool. And at first it felt like insanity, and then I realized no one's gonna care more than the people who thought of it.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah, it's a great idea.

[Conan O'Brien]

And so you should be the one that's anal and exacting about what it has to be, because it's your vision and so. And then you just. I think it leads to so many things. I mean, I think you have a really good director's eye. So many of the writers. Do you develop that really quickly because, you know, what you want.

[Todd Levin]

Yeah, that's very true.

[Conan O'Brien]

Sometimes, even when you didn't think you were that kind of person, you find out really quickly if you have to produce the sketches.

[Todd Levin]

I totally agree. And the downside of it is that you also waste so many resources. Like, there's so many times. Because you're in control of it. There's no one to say, are you sure you need all that? And you're like, absolutely.

[Conan O'Brien]

Why is Minty made out of silver? Because that's the way I thought of it.

[Todd Levin]

Yes, exactly. Do it for me.

[Conan O'Brien]

Do it. $800,000. Yeah. No, there would be a lot of

[Todd Levin]

times, like, there was a thing that Dan Cronin and I worked on that was so, so needlessly ambitious. It was just a parody of a commercial, like a. What was it? It was like, not El Pollo del Taco. That's what it was. It was the idea that it was a Del Taco delivery system, so that it was. It was so stupid on its face. It was a special device on your toilet that when you flushed it, it could recognize when your body had room for another burrito.

[Eduardo Perez]

I knew the toilet was gonna come

[Todd Levin]

in a bottle, and then it would immediately provide you with that burrito once you had cleared enough room out of your body for a new burrito.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes.

[Todd Levin]

And we. And it became.

[Conan O'Brien]

Trust me, this is something Del Taco's thinking about.

[Todd Levin]

I think he was off some story about how Nike or Reebok had developed these sneakers that you could press a button and it would get dominoes for you. It was, like, connected to Domino's. So this was like Del Taco's version of Synergy, man. Yeah. Yeah. And it was so. It's so stupid on its face. And it became so ambitious where there's this. It gets so in sync with your body's needs that it. It opens up like a third eye and takes you to this, like, place of nirvana, where it's like, everything's perfectly in sync. It was so expensive.

[Conan O'Brien]

But that's what Jim Downey was really good at this. He loved the comedy of take something very simple and then make it needlessly complicated. But that in itself is funny. So a long commercial about Change bank where Jim Downey's explaining to you that if you give us $5, we'll give you, you know, this. This many quarters, this many singles, or we'll also give you this many nickels, this many quarters, and over explaining it. And I think there's something to an idea that stupid that then probably uses animation Computer graphics to explain how it works. Green screens of, like, once this area has been voided, then this area is created, and this area of your brain, and you're like, this is such a stupid idea. I cannot believe that you would go to this much trouble. And that's where the funny stuff comes from. I think a lot of times, I

[Todd Levin]

think the show kind of, for me, at least, taught me some of that, too, because so much of what I felt like I was trying to do as a writer was to break you because you've seen so much. You just have seen so much. And that there's that kind of line between, okay, that'll work for the show, and I want to see that on the show, you know, And I think we're always trying. And I knew you were rooting against us.

[Conan O'Brien]

And you know what? I'm rooting against you right now. Yeah.

[Eduardo Perez]

This is what I wanted to say something. You're having such a respectful conversation with Todd, and it's very confusing to me.

[Todd Levin]

When he was being nice in the beginning, I thought it was an ambush.

[Eduardo Perez]

I know.

[Conan O'Brien]

Oh, it is. This is an IRS sting operation.

[Eduardo Perez]

Has he ever made fun of you for, like, a piece not working out? Can we talk about that?

[Conan O'Brien]

Trust me.

[Eduardo Perez]

Can we talk about you making fun of him?

[Conan O'Brien]

Trust me. Can you, Eduardo, can you kill her? Mic, please? No, no. That is. I mean, I would have this. There was this relationship with the writers where if something was really tanking, you could see me licking my lips, like, oh, yes.

[Todd Levin]

Salivating.

[Conan O'Brien]

This is gonna be delicious. And I remembered. I think we were doing. I forget, we were doing shows at Comic Con, and one of the writers had come up with, it's R2D2, but he's gone Hollywood, and he's like, hey, make sure you get me a good table at the.

[Todd Levin]

You know.

[Conan O'Brien]

And he had, like, a cigar and, you know. Yeah. And where's my limo? Yeah, she. She. And it was just. Wasn't working and felt like kind of an old take. And I. People said they saw me licking my lips and rubbing my hands together. I was so like, oh, we. We've got to have more R2D2 gone Hollywood.

[Todd Levin]

And, yes, you would sometimes interact with the thing more than needed.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yes. Tell us more R2D2. Who's gone to Holly? And whoever wrote it was like, okay, fuck you, Conan. But no one is more delighted by Left Brain. Crazy ideas that tickle me, like, those things. That's a religious experience. You've written much more than your share of those. And, you know, let's hope we can do it at the Oscars. I can't wait. It's gonna be so much fun. But yes, I will ridicule you in an hour When I come back down, I will mock you.

[Todd Levin]

Time flattens everything.

[Conan O'Brien]

Yeah. There is no past. There's only the present. Time is a loop. But cannot thank you enough. Honored to work with you and get back to work.

[Todd Levin]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Matt Gourley]

Conan o' Brien needs a fan With Conan o', Brien, Sonam of Session and Matt Gourley produced by me, Matt Gorley executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross and Nick Leow Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino Take it away, Jimmy Supervising producer, Aaron Blair associate talent producer Jennifer Samples Associate producers Sean Doherty and Lisa Berm Engineering by eduardo Perez. Get three free months of SiriusXM when you sign [e-mail] Conan Please rate, review and subscribe to Conan O' Brien needs a fan. Wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.