How To Get Your First 500 Email Subscribers with Shelley Niehaus

Summary

Podcast Summary: Content Is Profit Episode: How To Get Your First 500 Email Subscribers with Shelley Niehaus
Host: BIZBROS (Luis)
Guest: Shelley Niehaus
Release Date: June 10, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of the Content Is Profit podcast, host Luis from BIZBROS welcomes Shelley Niehaus, a seasoned expert in email marketing. Shelley shares her extensive experience in helping over a hundred businesses build their first email lists and achieve their initial milestone of 500 subscribers. The conversation delves into the intricacies of email marketing, overcoming common fears associated with unsubscribes, and creating effective email sequences post lead magnet download.

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The Importance of Email Marketing

Luis opens the discussion by highlighting the universal advice entrepreneurs receive about building an email list but acknowledges the common struggle many face in getting started.

Shelley emphasizes the critical role of email marketing in directly selling to an audience and generating revenue. She states:

“Email marketing is how you actually sell to your audience and that's how you make money.” [02:14]

She explains that many businesses rely solely on social media, which often operates on "rented land," limiting direct communication and monetization opportunities.

Luis reinforces this by mentioning the “six levers” framework, stressing the necessity of linking distribution to monetization through an effective email strategy.

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Overcoming the Fear of Unsubscribes

A significant portion of the conversation addresses the anxiety surrounding unsubscribes. Luis shares a personal anecdote about his fear of losing subscribers, likening it humorously to having "sweaty armpits like Fonzie" [00:00].

Shelley counters this fear by presenting unsubscribes as a positive outcome:

“If you're not getting at least one unsubscribe every time you send out an email, you're not sending enough emails.” [23:13]

She urges listeners to embrace unsubscribes as they help refine the email list to include only engaged and interested subscribers, ultimately improving key metrics like open and click-through rates.

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Building Your First 500 Subscribers

Shelley outlines a straightforward, step-by-step playbook for entrepreneurs starting from zero:

1. Choose a Platform: Shelley recommends platforms like ConvertKit (now Kit) for beginners due to their simplicity. She advises setting a 60-minute timer to research and select a platform without getting bogged down in details [08:29].

2. Identify the Problem You Solve: Determine the specific problems your product or service addresses. This clarity helps in creating a compelling lead magnet that offers immediate value.

3. Create a Lead Magnet: Develop a freebie that solves a quick problem for your audience, such as a downloadable PDF checklist or guide. Shelley advises tailoring the lead magnet to your specific industry and audience needs.

“Your lead magnet needs to be the Chick-fil-A chicken nugget to the full entrée.” [14:49]

4. Deliver Immediate Value: Ensure that the lead magnet is delivered promptly upon subscription to maintain engagement.

5. Nurture the Relationship: Implement an email sequence that continues to provide value, aligns with your business goals, and gradually introduces your products or services.

Shelley emphasizes the importance of intentionality in each step to ensure that the lead magnet effectively transitions subscribers into loyal customers.

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Personalizing Email Interactions

Luis and Shelley discuss strategies to make email communication more personal and less automated. Luis shares his experience of sending personalized emails and even voicemail messages to new subscribers, which significantly increased engagement.

Shelley advocates for treating subscribers as individuals rather than numbers:

“Stop treating your list like numbers and treat them like the people that they are.” [38:33]

She suggests simple, yet impactful actions such as sending a personalized welcome email or a short video message to establish a genuine connection.

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Content Sustainability and Authenticity

Shelley addresses the common overwhelm entrepreneurs face in maintaining consistent email content. She advises starting simple and scaling content efforts as capacity allows, emphasizing sustainability over perfection.

“Done is better than perfect and start messy.” [19:13]

Luis adds that leveraging AI can aid in content creation but cautions against losing the personal touch, which differentiates authentic communication from generic, AI-generated content.

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Reviving and Reengaging Existing Lists

For entrepreneurs who have existing email lists but haven’t engaged with them recently, Shelley provides actionable tips:

1. Re-Warm Your List: Approaches vary from being upfront about the hiatus to gently reintroducing yourself and your value proposition.

2. Lead with Value: Share useful information, tips, or updates that align with your subscribers' interests and needs.

3. Personal Touches: Incorporate personalized elements like voice messages or individualized emails to rekindle interest.

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Practical Examples and Case Studies

Throughout the episode, Shelley and Luis share real-life examples illustrating both successful and unsuccessful email marketing campaigns. For instance, Luis recounts a failed attempt at collecting leads through a pizza shop promotion where the lead magnet didn’t align with the target audience's needs, resulting in low engagement [07:05]. In contrast, Shelley shares how an esthetician client successfully used a discount as a lead magnet, which not only attracted relevant subscribers but also fostered long-term loyalty through consistent, valuable communication [15:58].

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Final Action Steps

As the conversation nears its conclusion, Shelley offers a compelling call to action:

“Pick one step that we talked about, set a 60-minute timer, and go do it this week.” [42:38]

She reinforces the mantra “done is better than perfect,” encouraging listeners to take immediate, actionable steps towards building their email lists without succumbing to perfectionism.

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Conclusion

The episode wraps up with an inspiring exchange between Luis and Shelley, emphasizing the importance of authenticity, consistent value delivery, and personal connection in email marketing. Shelley shares her contact information and encourages listeners to reach out for personalized advice and support.

Shelley reflects on her journey, highlighting that without content creation, she’d be "hanging out with my dog in the backyard," underscoring the transformative power of proactive content strategies [43:12].

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Notable Quotes

• Shelley Niehaus [02:14]: “Email marketing is how you actually sell to your audience and that's how you make money.”

• Shelley Niehaus [23:13]: “If you're not getting at least one unsubscribe every time you send out an email, you're not sending enough emails.”

• Shelley Niehaus [14:49]: “Your lead magnet needs to be the Chick-fil-A chicken nugget to the full entrée.”

• Shelley Niehaus [19:13]: “Done is better than perfect and start messy.”

• Shelley Niehaus [42:38]: “Pick one step that we talked about, set a 60-minute timer, and go do it this week.”

• Shelley Niehaus [43:12]: “Without content creation, I’d be hanging out with my dog in the backyard.”

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Key Takeaways

1. Start Simple: Begin with selecting a user-friendly email platform and creating a straightforward lead magnet tailored to your audience's needs.

2. Embrace Unsubscribes: Understand that unsubscribes refine your audience and improve engagement metrics.

3. Personalize Communication: Foster genuine connections through personalized emails and interactions.

4. Provide Consistent Value: Maintain a sustainable content strategy that delivers ongoing value to your subscribers.

5. Take Immediate Action: Overcome perfectionism by taking actionable steps within a set timeframe.

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Connect with Shelley Niehaus

For those interested in diving deeper into email marketing strategies and building a profitable email list, Shelley Niehaus offers additional resources through her podcast and social media channels.

• Podcast: Podcast Marketing Tips for Small Business Owners
• Instagram: @shelleyniehaus
• Website: shelleyniehaus.com

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This episode of Content Is Profit provides invaluable insights into the foundational aspects of email marketing, empowering entrepreneurs to bridge the gap between content creation and revenue generation. Shelley's practical advice and relatable anecdotes make the process of building an email list both accessible and achievable.

Transcript

[Luis]

Hey, guys. Welcome back to Content is Profit. Today I have a special guest. Way back when we first started our business, email was one of the things that everybody kept telling us to go do and collect and communicate with them, but we had no idea how to even get started. So this is why this guest is so important and so fun. The conversation we just had, because we talk specifically about that she has helped over a hundred businesses grow with the first email list and get their first 500 subscribers. Subscribers to us. That was a huge milestone and it took us years and she's gonna help us do it very, very quickly. You know, apart from that, we also talked about the value of the, of the unsubscribe. You know, we shared this story where I was like, oh my gosh, sweating bullets. We're like sweaty armpits. Like Fonzie saying because I was so scared to send this email because of the unsubscribe. And we talk about that and why that is actually a good thing. We also talk about, like, what are the emails that we need to send after they collect your lead magnet? Or different things. Like, does it need to be like a 30 day indoctrination sequence? Does it have to be like a full year indoctrination sequence? Does it have to be a one day thing? So we go specifically on like what to do after they download your stuff and also what to do after you get that notification that somebody subscribed to your list like, like in the first, like 15 to 30 minutes. The cool thing is that these all applies to online businesses. So service based and even brick and mortar businesses. So, so good. This conversation is back to value. With that said, enjoy. Let's go, Shelly. Welcome to the Content Is Profit podcast. For those that are tuning in, I'm Louise. Fonzie's not back yet. We're trying to convince you guys, send them DMS be like, fonzie, we miss you. Fonzie, we miss you. Come back to the show, please. But anyways, Shelly, I'm stoked because we met a couple of weeks ago, right? You're about to go on a heat trip. But before you go on the huge trip with your family, you came here to teach us something really, really cool that I'm like, I need it for myself too. So off we go. What do you want to teach us today?

[Shelly]

Well, I love the jam on. I feel like it's a term that scares people, but email marketing, because that's how you actually sell to your audience and that's how you actually make money and I really work with a lot of clients that are trying to sell from social or just trying to do their business on rented land, and they're missing that magic link of getting the people onto the list. And so I just love to help businesses, service providers, consultants, coaches, learn that link so that they can actually start monetizing their audience and selling.

[Luis]

Yeah, no, absolutely. And by the way, guys, you know, we talk about the six levers, right? And between your distribution and monetization, there has to be that link that Shelly talks about. And I was like, when we connect, we're like, that's what we need. And if you don't know what I'm talking about, go to Business Creator Club. You'll find the six levers there. And also we'll leave all the links right below. But, Shelly, I know, you know, since we started this journey, me and my brother, every single person, every single entrepreneur, every single person that, you know, we've learned from masterminds, they're like, guys, email list, you know, bring the people to your own platform, communicate directly to them. Find a way to do that. And it's been interesting. There's definitely different ways that you can connect and grab those emails and I'll share with you kind of what we've done. And then you'll be like, luis, that was horrible. And then we're going to go through, I guess, a little bit of a playbook from starting from zero. If you have no email list and get to those 500, you know, followers. Correct.

[Shelly]

That's right.

[Luis]

Awesome. So before, before getting to that, like, how do you get into this? Like, is this like your. Your full, full passion? You're like, I want to collect emails?

[Shelly]

No, I have. I fell into it by default. So I actually have 20 years in the service industry and I've worked in four different industries. And the one thing that was consistent was my personal brand. You, you know, you have a strong personal brand. It goes with you from industry to industry. You. And I realized that keeping those connections was so important. But then I was trying to do just like everyone else, and I was like, why isn't anyone buying my products and services and things that I'm posting online?

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

And it was through the magic of learning email and just how to sell through my email list that I actually transformed my business and I double my sales. When I went into implementing just some offers, some promotions, and emailing my list and not trying to just buy, hopefully they find me on social media.

[Luis]

Yeah. So what was the thing that changed there? Right? Because a lot of people, including us. Right. Like, we publish content. We're like, we're trying to be in as many platforms as possible. If you build a system, you can be multiple platforms. There's a lot of people that choose just to be in one and go deep in, like, one platform. But from there, like, they seem to develop these relationships inside of that. One example is like our Facebook group, for example. We have about 300 members in there. We were lucky to collect those emails before we started the group as they were coming in. Right. But some people miss that. They're like, oh, I started this group and maybe we have this engagement, but then, like, the next step, then I don't know how else to communicate with them. So, like, in your case, like, what was it like a moment that you're like, man, like, I'm losing sales or I'm not. I'm missing opportunities because I don't have that email list. And what was that first step that you took?

[Shelly]

Well, I. First of all, I wanted to be more intentional about my selling instead of just hoping people find me and book me. I learned about what it was to have an actual timed promotion and to put it out there. And then I also learned after that that you can't really do that exclusively on social media because people aren't always on the platform. They aren't always seeing your post. And the most effective way to do that is to take those people from social media, and then once they're on your list, there's so much more likely to buy.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

And that was the thing that just really resonated with me is, oh, my goodness. What? These people are much more engaged. You could have much more intimate conversations with people in your email list if you use the system to tag them and make sure. And it's instead of, I always say, instead of like, standing out on the street corner and shouting with a bullhorn, which is what it is when you're trying to compete with all the algorithm rhythms and all the distractions on social media. And I love social media, so I'm not saying that I don't want to be on it, but you need that. I always say that bringing them to your email list is taking them off that busy street sidewalk and bringing them into your storefront. Now you get to control the environment, the tone, the pace, the rhythm, the feel. And that's the magic that connects with people, that allows them to want to get to know you more and eventually buy from you.

[Luis]

Yeah, that's awesome. So how do we start building those initial building blocks? Right. Because they're like, okay, like, how do I actually make the transition between that content that. Let's assume we're providing consistent, frequent content that's valuable. We're solving problems for people. Right. Recently we just did an episode about a good friend of ours, Wes, right. He's a incredible dietitian coach. He was my college coach for, you know, when I was playing a D1 soccer. I know if people see me now, it's like, you played? And I'm like, yes, I promise. I was like 40 pounds lighter. So I called him, I was like, wes, I need your help. Right? And he's like, I need your help. And I'm like, well, maybe Shelly can help you. Because like, he's starting to build the audience and starting to build that. And we talked about this, we started about, you know, delivering this, like content that is valuable, solving problems. So let's say, you know, he starts. Lots of people starts. They're creating this. How do we make them that connection? Because people are not going to know, oh, I should send them an email. Right? Like now people are so, I think more educated to on like all this kind of stuff. And they're like, they can tell like if it's fishy, if it's not fishy, how do we come across as like a valuable resource for them? So then they can give us their email, phone number, you know, preferred method of communication.

[Shelly]

Okay. We always have. Well, first of all, you have to start with a way to collect these emails. And that's the thing that a lot of people just step one, get completely overwhelmed with.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

Is. And the people in the online marketing space love to make things complicated. They love to make things big and scary. And that you need these thousands and thousands and thousands of subscribers because they want to sell you the products. So I love to just, let's dial this down. Let's super simplify it and make it easy so that if you are sitting there with no one on your email list, we all started with our first subscriber. So how can we just get those first few people to actually subscribe? So you have to come up with a way to pick. You have to pick a platform and a way to actually collect these emails. And that's something that's a whole nother conversation. But the best advice I could give you with that is don't get lost in the overwhelm. I always tell my clients, you have 60 minute timer set, a 60 minute timer, do the research. And at the end of that 60 minutes, you have to pick A platform. Nothing this side of heaven is permanent. You can go back and change, but don't get lost in the minutia of just trying to figure out where to start. I will tell you, I love Kit. It used to be ConvertKit. It's super simple. I think it's a great way, especially for beginner email marketers to start. And that's usually what I recommend. But I guess you can't get lost in just trying to even get started.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

So step one, you gotta pick that platform just so that you can even start to do the next few steps that we talk about. Step two is you need to really decide what problems that you solve. And you know, this is really kind of basic marketing, but you've got to figure out what are. If you're, if you and your product or service take someone from like 0 to 100 with your transformation, what is step one or step two? Like what's 0 to 2, 0 to 3. Just something super simple. And that is the, the thing that you're going to need to offer of value so that you can lead with reciprocity. Give them something that will solve a very quick problem. And this is what the people in the industry call a lead magnet, a freebie and opt in. And I don't believe in a one size fits all. And that's one of the things that I really like to work with people on is what is actually the right one for your business. Because every business has different nuances, different industries. So what might be great for an esthetician is not going to be the right thing for maybe a fitness coach or a photographer or a coach. You've got to figure out what's right for you. But you've got to solve a quick problem for them. The easiest one is always a downloadable PDF. People love checklists, they love things like that. And something I love to say that they could print out on the refrigerator and they're going to refer back to time and time again.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

And that keeps you top of mind.

[Luis]

Oh, I like it. So quick recap, right? Step number one is pick the platform, which by the way, it took us years like to pick the platform. Like we are the worst at this. And then once we pick it, we, we ended up changing it. Now we have the one that we use. But yeah, I think to your point, like don't overthink is a very important point because that will stop a lot of people from doing the thing right. Every single platform. And I promise we tested so many, they are decent, they're good like, they will tell you exactly what the next step is. It's going to work. And then as you grow, you're going to find like, maybe some limitations and then there's going to be a solution if you do need to change. But more than likely, you know, just listen to Shelly and just go to. You know, we've used that because of our network. We use a different platform now that we cannot mention in the, in the show for sponsors purposes. But send me a DM and I can, I can let you know. And then step number two is like, okay, pick the problem that you solve. The more specific probably the better at that point, right? And then a way to deliver. I think on my side, I'll add, depending on your type of audience to like, the way of delivery might be interesting. Just recently I was on a show with Adam Shelby. He's also in the podcasting space. And he, he, he's incredible when it comes to, like, social media. He has a very specific approach. He goes, he does Instagram threads. That's the only type of content that he does. And then he leads people into email through his newsletter. So what he said really resonated with me. And this is interesting. This might be like a topic of, of discussion because I've seen success with both for him, it's like, I don't do like, magnates, because people will come to you because of that and then that's it. Like, they want that, right? He's like, they were going to sign up to my newsletter. Might be a higher friction point. Might be like less people, but they want to continue listening or consuming my own content. Right. And that, to me, like, resonated a ton because I've been that guy. I was like, oh, let me just get this, like, little quick guide. And then that's it. And then I also scribe or, you know, so like, I've been on that other side of it and I would like to hear your thoughts on it, because I also been on this, that I get the downloadable, I get the results, I implement. Oh, this is awesome. And then I continue the relationship with that person over that business. Right? It's like it's either or.

[Shelly]

Yes.

[Luis]

Now, now, like, how do you pick? Like, how do you, how do you go about it?

[Shelly]

But I think that's such a good question. And I'm glad that you brought that up because I think that's where some people kind of miss the mark, is they just want people on their list. So they start throwing together anything and they're not really intentional about where they want to take people. So for instance, you know, you've got to, you know, we've all heard this, you've got to start with the end of mind. So your lead magnet, your freebie, your opt in has to be very intentional. I've seen, I used to be in the photography industry and I would see people go to wedding shows and offer a hundred dollar, you know, chance to win a hundred dollar Amazon gift card if they would register for their list. Those people want the a hundred dollar Amazon gift card they have. They don't care. Like it's not even aligned with what they're trying to sell. So you've really got to make sure that your what your entry point for your audience is something that solves a problem. And back to what I said, if your service or product is the full seven course meal, maybe you could just give them the appetizer because again, I grew up in the south and I love chick Fil a and I used to love to go to the mall when I was a kid because they only had them in the mall. But what do they do? They sit outside with that platter of chicken nuggets and you got the sample and you're like, oh my goodness, I want to go back and get the eight count or the full sandwich.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

And so that's what your lead magnet needs to do. It needs to be the chick fil a chicken nugget to the full entree. And so if you're really smart about what you put out there, just give. And the reason I teach this for a lot of people is creating the biggest struggle I see a lot of my clients work with is creating newsletter content on a regular basis. Like they already feel like they've got a thousand things going on and if you tell them they have to put together a heavy hitting newsletter every week, they're not, they're just going to shut down. So we have to figure out what's sustainable for you at this season of your life. And if you don't have the bandwidth to send out a newsletter every week or you know, even more, start with something downloadable or something easy again, an easy way to get started. And then after that you can start to nurture them with really good quality content that's aligned with where you're going to take them. Again, it's all intentional. It's that through line and then that's where you start to sell. But I think a lot of people that disconnect is that it's not aligned that initial lead magnet with where they want to take them in the end.

[Luis]

I love it. I think also people might think that is a lot more work than it needs to be. Like, just recently. Like, it could be easier. It could be where it's like, hey, as soon as they download this thing, you know, part of it. Let's say you have an optional phone number field in there, right? Some people might put their phone number, Some people might not. Let's say you put the phone number. Guess what? As soon as they come in, why don't you. We give him a quick call, right? Like, you know, hey, Shelley, how you doing? This is Luis. I just saw that you downloaded, you know, this guide. So awesome. Let me know if I can help you with anything, right? Like, and then it's incredible. We do something similar for our studio. We used to do that when we. When I was working in the fitness industry. And the results were crazy, right? Because they're in there. They're in that state of mind. Or even if you see the email come through. An email, a personalized email by. Doesn't have to be a sequence, right? It could be like, hey, Newly came in. All right, let me send a quick email. Maybe a loom video, right? It's like, hey, Shelley, how's it going? Thank you so much. Obviously, as you scale, that might be a little bit challenging to do, but we're talking about the first few emails, right? So I think that personal touch is massive. And going off of your chick fil a example, I remember. And this is how we learned. It's like, this is not the right lead for that stuff. When I was working at that fitness studios, a boutique studio, and, like, right next door, we had a pizza place and they were doing dollar slices every Thursday. And we saw this line of people coming in and consuming the pizza. And I was like, man, look at all those leads, right? And we're paying at the time, I think, 20 bucks a lead online with ads. And we're like, we can just like, buy two slices and then get their info and then hopefully call them and bring them in here, right? So we go in there, we set up the tent. We talked to the owner. The guy's like, yeah, absolutely. I think that day we got about 100 leads. Something like that is like, you know, for the cost of, like, 10 online. And we're like, we're awesome. Look at all these names and emails. Well, first of all, half of them were fake. They just wanted the slice, you know? Second of all, they didn't want to be there. They just want to Go there and eat the pizza. So they just got a free slice of pizza and there was not the ideal client. So like you said, it's like the Chick Fil A. It was not relevant to that audience. Like they did not want the workouts. We, I think we saw two people come in and maybe one signed up. Like, maybe. But it was like horrible because there was like no context whatsoever. And you say like, start with the end in mind. I think so important that sometimes we lose track of that because we might be so like, you know, what's. Is this lead magnet a good step towards what I have next? And sometimes we don't know what we have next. Right. So for those people that are like in that phase, maybe they don't have a high ticket offer on the back end or they don't have a coaching program. Like maybe they have a service. Like how do we align that? Like, do we have to sit down and have that fully ready to go? Do you work with people? Have you worked with people, have case studies that might have a product that they might be building, but they don't start the email list because of fear that they don't have it ready? I think a lot of people are in that space.

[Shelly]

I see that all the time. Especially I work with a lot of creatives and they have perfection. They want to be everything to be perfect. And as a former creative, I was a photographer for a long time, that we can really use that as a crutch to not get started.

[Luis]

So.

[Shelly]

So one of my mottos that I say in my class all the time is done is better than perfect and start messy. And if you work with me, you know, you hear those things probably every time you're on the phone with me, because that is what we're going to do. Done is better than perfect. And you know, back to everyone likes to make this so hard and so complicated. Marketing is testing and stop holding things so tightly and so permanent. I always say give something 90 days. We got to try for 90 days. Because if you don't, you know, give it 90 days, you don't really know if it's working. So we have to, to pick some just I always say pick what you like and see if it grows. So pick a lead magnet, find out. You know, obviously as long as it meets those criteria, it leads to where you want to take them, even if you don't know exactly. Even if you're just next. Right. Thing is to just start nurturing that relationship via email. You know what you're kind of wanting to talk about what your next steps are. Just get them on the list and start talking to them, and you're building that relationship. And then when you are ready to launch or sell, they've already been on your list. Or you're probably your raving fans by this time, and they're going to be the first ones to pull their wallet out because you've led with reciprocity.

[Luis]

That's. That's awesome. I think that removes. That takes off so much pressure of people, right? Like, because we think, oh, we have to have it ready. The product has to be done. Well, sometimes the product might not even be a fit for that person, right? Because they don't really know. So a couple weeks ago, we started the find your voice challenge in the content is profit group. Right? I think we talked a little bit about this, but I remember that was the first time that I was gonna email a list after probably a year or so, right? Super bad. Don't follow my example. And I was just sitting there before the first email, and it was like a little bit of a weekly campaign. We're adding value in there, and we're gonna ask people to go and join this challenge that we're doing in the group to reactivate, you know, the engagement. By the way, full story. It worked out great. But I remember sitting there and I was like, man, we have, you know, have about this thousand people that we've collected. You know, then we have, you know, these other people, 400 other emails from the studio. When we acquire this studio, they kind of know that we're the new owners and we do this kind of stuff. I was like, I just need to rip the band aid, right? And I was like, my first email was, hey, this is probably the first time in a long time that you've heard from me if you don't know who I am. Like, this is what we do. I'm ripping the band aid. By the way, if this is not relevant to you, here's a big unsubscribe button. Just go ahead and click it. Like, it's fine if it's not relevant. Totally understand. But here's what we're doing. And then I just basically share, you know, the next steps and, you know, kind of, you know, studio production and then the challenge. And I just, like, leaned in into, like, the fact that we haven't, like, emailed so much. But that moment, I can see how super intimidating it was for me, right? I was like, I hit the send, and I was like, oh, crap.

[Shelly]

I.

[Luis]

And I saw you know, three unsubscribes and I'm like, oh no. Yeah. But at the end of the day it's like they might not be the people that you're looking for for your business. Right. And I think we need to normalize the fact that people are just going to not follow, you know, here and there. You know, we do it all the time. Right. You get emails and you're like, I don't, I don't follow this anymore. And that's totally okay. Right. So like if you have, let's say somebody is listening to these, right. And they've been somehow collecting emails, whether they're like on zoom calls, right. Or calendly, and they have all those emails of people they've connected with or they have, maybe they had a lead manual that was relevant and they're changing product. Right. And they might have like a smaller type of list. What are the steps to maybe, I guess some people might call it revive that list or like reengage with them. What are some of the tips that you recommend them doing?

[Shelly]

Okay, so first of all, I want to talk about what you talked about, the unsubscribe. I think I have so many clients that just get so worked up over their unsubscribes. And, and there's a famous sales book back in the day called Go for no. And I tell my clients if you're not getting at least one unsubscribe every time you send out an email, you're not sending enough emails.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

So you need to be okay with that because if they unsubscribe, they are actually helping you out. They never were going to be your client anyway. You are probably paying for that subscriber to send that email. And if they're going to lower your open rate, they're going to lower your click through rate like all the metrics. So thank that person for unsubscribing because it makes your life easier and you want. I would always rather have someone have a smaller engaged list than a massive list with all these people that are not engaged at all. I would rather you have 100 engaged subscribers than a thousand people that you just collected randomly and they're not engaged at all. That's on the unsubscribe. So embrace it. It happens to all of us. And it's okay. It's. They're doing you a favor.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

Now on the re, the warming up, I always call that like a re. I just basically had a re. Warm up your list. There's several ways to do it. And again, this is where I think marketing is super personal. What does it look like if you were to have a relationship with a friend and you hadn't seen him in a year, what would you do personally to. To re. Engage with that friend? Would. Would you just, you know, do, like, your strategy where you just called it out and like, hey, I'm back. I dropped the ball. That's great, because that's really aligned with who you are. Someone else might be like, oh, that's a little too much for me. And so you could just gently dip your toe in the water, be like, hey, your life's gotten a little busy. We all get that. I'm back. And then don't really spend too much time on why you haven't been there. Just talk about what they're going to get and say, I am so excited about. You know, you obviously can address the fact that they haven't heard from me in a while. I want to reintroduce myself.

[Luis]

And.

[Shelly]

And here is why I'm mailing you. This is what you're going to get. This is the transformation I'm going to offer through these sequences or through this challenge or through this newsletter. And if you focus on where you're taking them, that's really what's the most important.

[Luis]

I love it. I think more and more today, we have to lean so much more in who we are more on the personal side, because at the end of the day, there's so many. A lot of people, especially now with AI, right. That a lot of stuff is almost like AI writing content for AI, the more authentic that we are in that sense, obviously we have to follow the principles, and there's different frameworks that we can follow to create. But I think that's super important, right? It's like maybe a couple of lines, right? It's like, hey, I'm here. We're back. Fancy just is a dad. So he's not writing the emails. It's just me now. So you're gonna know, you're not gonna. You're not gonna see good writing. And then here we are. Let's. Let's reconnect, right? Like, something like that. At the end of the day, we have to be more human. I feel like.

[Shelly]

Right, yes. People want relatable. I mean, one of my favorite, you know, podcast is Mel Robbins, and I love the bloopers at the end. You know, they want to see that. They want the feel behind the curtain, see what your life is like. That makes you more relatable. They build that know like and trust factor. So I say bring it out, whatever that looks like, with your personality, least the less formal you can be, you know, and you hit the nail on the head with AI. AI is making it so easy for people to create content that you really have to lean into your personality, your vibe, your storytelling, and making people feel like it's really you. And it's not just, you know, chat, GPT, writing your email, and you copy and paste it and throw it into your newsletter, because people can sniff that out in a second these days.

[Luis]

100%. 100%. We've seen it over and over, and in one of the sessions that we did for the group, we talked a lot about that, where it's like, okay, shoot. And Fonzie is like this, like a discussion that we have 24 7. I do think that we need to use AI to leverage a lot of the stuff that we're creating, like, to speed processes up, for example. There's different tools that can help you do that. But I think the creation process to start with us, where that's like that email, that lead magnet, right? It has to come from us. It's not like, let's say we're talking podcasting, right, for the studio. So it'd be like, okay, chatgpt, what are the five steps to start a podcast, right? And it'll tell me, right? Let's say, oh, I want to use that as a lead magnet, right? At the end of the day. It didn't come from us at the end of the day. That's not our experience. So I rather start with me and then use AI to kind of help me, right? So for that specific example, be like, okay, we've started podcasts. We know the problems. We know, like, what are the friction points for this? I'm just going to either write it out super informally. I was like, hey, here's the steps of how to do it. For me, the way of creation is a lot easier if I record a video or a voice notes instead of writing. So less friction for me. So I'll do that video. Be like, hey, guys, like, here's how you start a podcast. You know, step number one, you know, decide that you want to do it, right? Nobody does that. Nobody. Everybody's like, it's start a podcast, go to this platform and, you know, click, upload, like, decide you want to do it, for example, right? So you say those things and be like, okay, now you grab that transcript or that thing that you wrote and be like, hey, maybe I Can help me structure it a little bit better for a lead magnet of different things, but it came from us. So do you find that there's a lot of friction with people trying to create like that, what is like that first solution, you know, you said earlier in the conversation the appetizer right to the next thing. Do you find that people get confused or it's like, how do I actually pick the one thing? Do I have to keep that one thing? Can I have multiple lead magnets? Right. How, how does that work again?

[Shelly]

I think that depends on who you are. I have clients that have seven different lead magnets and I have clients that have one. You have to know what, you know what season of life you're living in. No, obviously if you just had a baby or you have a toddler at home, you're going to be in a very different season of life than someone who's doing this full time or is an empty nester. And you know, so you, you've got to look at your, your situation first. And that's the most common thing I see where people start to just drop out is they over commit at the beginning and either to how often they're sending emails or they start to create these really complicated funnels because that's what some marketing expert told them. And then they throw their hands up and they're like, I'm done, I'm burned out, this is too hard. And they walk away. So your first step is you have to just really examine your life and your bandwidth, your business and what feels authentic to you in this season. So for instance, I just graduated twin boys from high school. I did not have that. Yes, I'm celebrating. I didn't have the bandwidth in the last six months to sit around and create complicated funnels. So I've done some really simple lead magnets that just allow me to start building that relationship. At the end of the day, you're just trying to start building that relationship. So back to find that one and figure out if it works. You know, find that appetizer. So, and I am not opposed to discounting products if you're a service based business. So I have an esthetician, she's one of my clients and she offers 20% off the first service. Yeah, you know, that's just a great entry point. And they get in and then of course they're on her table. She's building that relationship with them and that gets them in the door. And now she's nurturing them with emails. You know, once, probably two times a month about skincare products and they came in with a discount but she over delivered so much on the service and the lead that they're now her fans for life. So again it's like what can you bring them to the table with and then how can you over deliver and how can you just make them really excited to be in your world and to want to learn more from you. And back to marketing assisting. If you come up with a downloadable or a checklist and it's not resonating, you have permission to create something new. You have permission to and you kind of touched about on it earlier. Go back and look at the content you've already created. Look at your content that most resonates. So if you have a really strong video or something like that, that's a really good sign that that would be a great lead magnet.

[Luis]

Yeah.

[Shelly]

So go back and mine your own content, see what's resonated in the past and take that and start creating. Don't. You don't have to start from scratch and reinvent the wheel. Let's make this an easier lift by looking at, looking, reflecting on what's worked to make it work in the future.

[Luis]

Yeah, I love it. We are an event once and one of the speakers, she built an incredible company. At the time they were selling, I think like fitness supplements and it was all aimed to women. And when she was speaking she said, we built this company based on what our audience was asking for. And it was like the email, like every product that they launch, everything that they launch, any program that they did was because they asked their email list be like, what else do you want? They would like survey their email list 24 7. They will deliver value on the topics and the things. But they were like, they will gather these indicators and that will give them the idea of the next thing. So they will sell out of every single product. So I like, since I heard that, I was like, wow, that's so awesome. Because a lot of people start with on the other side. The other. Most people start with like, oh, there's already a business, you know, or they have an idea of their business in their head or they're providing a service and it's like, okay, now I have this thing that I have to market. I have to like add value to people to, to kind of bring them in here. Right. But maybe we're not finding a good fit is because we're not giving them exactly what they really want or we're not, you know, the exact solution that they want. So to me, like that idea has been so attractive and again, right now we're in a position with the three businesses that it's like same as three layers, I guess with the community, the studio and now the production teams that at some point that was like that, but now we're in that spot where it's like, man, how do we continue? And I think that's the approach that we're going to have with Business Creator Club. It's like, what do you want? Yesterday on the conversation with them, we're like, hey, what we have is the frameworks that we've developed that people kind of come and is a baseline. But we want to develop this with you. So if you become a founder, like we're going to be asking you a ton of questions. So like make sure that you're involved because this is for you. I think that's the approach that I'm, I'm really excited about and I have that relationship with that person because at the end of the day is a win win for everybody. And anyways, that business went out to sell for a bunch of millions of dollars. And just now my wife has been selling like this birthday invitations on Etsy as a hobby. And like there's like all the moms and I think in like two months she sold like 100, right? Not with no effort. She's just been putting designs out there. I was like, babe, you have the emails of these people and she's like zero entrepreneur. And it's like, can we send in an email saying thank you? And it's like, what else do you want? You know, because it's a birthday. So what else after the birthday is like, you know, the cake recipes or ideas for a cool birthday party, like, what else can we like, you know, build off of this? It's just like, stop, stop, stop. I don't want to do that. I'm like, oh my gosh. Going to be so awesome.

[Shelly]

Those people that are married to us entrepreneurs just don't get it sometimes.

[Luis]

I know. I'm like, wait, how many emails have you collected? And she's like, I don't know. I'm like, what are you talking about? Oh, that's awesome. Have you seen as we wrap up because we're almost over, but this has been awesome. Thank you, Shell. I appreciate it. So with that what I mentioned, like there's platforms out there that also allow us to collect information, right? And I think this has been a thought to maybe you don't have your own platform, but maybe, you know, you're an Etsy seller. You sell on ebay, you sell, like, different things, maybe products. Right. And obviously you're selling at that point in like, you call it rented land. Right. There's people have these side hustles, different things. In that specific case with Etsy, right. Once they make a sale, you can collect that information and then you can connect with the platform and then you continue that relationship. So these like, mini products or mini things that you sell, they become like your lead magnets in a. In a way. Right. Have you had experience with different platforms like that? How do you recommend making the transition? Is it similar to what we talked about?

[Shelly]

Well, I'm not sure as far as the connecting of the platforms, but I've had a lot of clients come in with client lists from, you know, say that, you know, these are people that I've worked with and they're like, who can I add to my list? Like, where do. What's the line? And I'm not going to say there's a right or wrong answer, obviously. Um, but I always say if they've done business with you in the last year and you've exchanged money, you can absolutely put them in. Let them start getting, you know, nurturing emails from you. You know, I'd prefer you not to wait a year, but if you have those, you know, put them in there. And again, there's an unsubscribe button and people will unsubscribe, and that's fine. But you're, again, you have to lead with value, like, thank you for your purchase. Like, here's, you know, if they purchased a product or service, here's five ways to maybe use this product or service that you haven't thought about before. And again, like, they're giving them value. And. And then one of the things, I was just on a call with the client this morning. What is easy to us in the business? Like, we're so, you know, involved in our business and we're overwhelmed. Sometimes we forget to go back to those very beginning stages of what it's like for our clients to just start working with us. And we had so much knowledge and everything packed in our head that we forget to share that. So if you could just take some time, step back about five steps and say, okay, what would it be like to be someone who just started working with me? What questions or what value could I offer? Send that to them in a couple emails, and they're going to be so excited to start hearing from you.

[Luis]

That's so cool. Awesome. All right. To recap that Quick path, right? Let's say we're creating content every single day. We chose the platform. Let's see, let's say they chose Kit, right? I'm assuming that platform has a little bit of a landing page or a website where, you know, hey, if you go to, let's say Business Creator Club or Chilli, what's your website? So people can go there.

[Shelly]

Shelley niehaus.com Perfect.

[Luis]

You can pick either or and then go on. There's like, hey, by the way, here are the five steps to, you know, build your first email list of 500 people. Here are the first five steps to build an incredible awesome podcast, right? And then they click that. The platform is going to help you on the back end to deliver that to them, right? And then continue the conversation.

[Shelly]

So yes, you want to make sure that your freebie is delivered right away just so they get that value. And then you're correct, sorry, yes, you do continue that conversation.

[Luis]

That's awesome. And then as a baseline, when people, let's say they're starting from scratch, you're like, okay, I picked my platform. I know what problem I'm solving for the initial lead magnet. I'm already delivering value in my content and I'm sending them to this little domain that I have. They download the thing. What are the next steps? Like, do you Recommend Like a 30 day email sequence, a 3 day email sequence, a phone call, like another email, a personalized email? Obviously it might be depending on the business, but what are the things that you've seen that maybe help people a lot that remove the friction right, from executing? I think that's important.

[Shelly]

So I say people consume content in different ways, as you're probably very aware. So some people are going to read, some people want to, you know, videos or whatever. I think a simple three step welcome sequence is very easy. They get it, you follow up with them to make sure they got it. You ask them, you know, if they had any takeaways or any questions and then maybe the next step that they will hear from you, like, you know, say I will send you, you know, emails once a week, let people know the frequency, because then if they know they're going to get an email, you know, once a week or once every two weeks or once a month, they're going to be a lot less likely to unsubscribe than if they think you're going to start blowing them up every day. So you've got to like, be kind to them and remember, you know, honor that email address. So that's the written one. And then I. You really hit the nail on the head. I think the magic, especially in smaller email list is don't treat people like numbers. You can do. I've done several things where I've literally taken my the email out of my email system and sent them one for my personal email address so they know they're not getting blasted and I've just welcomed them and said thank you or created a short loom video, you know, or you can do as you said, pick up the phone. I know this is crazy, but pick up the phone and call them. Do you understand how much you will stand out from someone and the thousands of other email marketers if you actually leave them a voice message or send them a personal text, they're going to be mind blown. So again, stop treating your list like numbers and treat them like the people that they are. And that is the magic that's going to turn them into raby fans.

[Luis]

Oh, so good. I know some people are listening to these are like, that's going to be so hard to scale and they might not even be there. Right. And I think that's where our head goes. But I think it's super important to do the unscalable at the end of the day, right? And then there's a way that if that brings value and it gets the results in your company, there's a way that we can figure out how to scale it. And there's a famous event or there's a piece of content that has been going up a lot that I resonated a lot with Alex Hormozi and he says that he's like, do the unscalable. And he was talking to this entrepreneur and the person is like, well, what's your sales system? I was like, hey, I do workshops. It's like, what's your closing rate on your workshops? And he's like, 90% right? Because they come in, they do this thing, right? And he was trying to find a different way to do that and they've tried so many things and it's like, what are the results on those? Well, 10%, 15%. I was like, why don't you continue doing the workshops? And the guys, do you hate doing the workshops? No, I don't. I actually like it. So it's like, why are we looking for that stuff? So I think that's important. Especially what a blessing is that to have three new people that reach out to you every single week that you can talk on the phone with them. Right? I'm Going to give a huge shout out to Mary and Dana. I connected with them. They became part of the founding members of Business Creator Club. Their episodes published last week and it was something like that. One was in Australia, the other one here in the States. And it was not a phone call, but it was a dm, a video dm. And then immediately, right. And they've been waiting patiently for the launch of the club since like February. And they're like, dude, the fact that I asked him, why are you still here? Right? And they were like, the fact that you guys communicated with us, basically, that's. That's what it is. So super valuable. Shelly, thank you so much for your advice today. How can people connect with you? How can people reach out to you?

[Shelly]

I have a podcast marketing tips for small business owners, really for all kinds of service based per night, service based providers and entrepreneurs. And I am on Instagram at Shelley Niehaus as well as my website that I mentioned earlier. And I honestly just, I love to connect with people and build relationships. So send me a DM or and let's just talk. Let's just start the conversation.

[Luis]

Yes. So awesome. Last thing. What is one action point that you want people to take home with them and be like, I can't execute on this today.

[Shelly]

Pick one step that we talked about, whatever your step is, and I want you to set a 60 minute timer and I want you to go do it this week.

[Luis]

I like the.

[Shelly]

Don't overthink it.

[Luis]

Yes.

[Shelly]

Yeah, 60 minutes. So if it's picking your platform, if it's creating that first lead magnet, if it's writing that email, wherever you are in the process, pick your step, set the timer, and remember, done is better than perfect and we're looking at progress over perfection.

[Luis]

That's right. I love it. And then that question, I know you publish content. Where will you be if you never published any type of content?

[Shelly]

Where would I be? Yeah, I don't know. I would just. I guess I'd be hanging out with my dog in the backyard or something. I mean, you got it. You got to put yourself out there.

[Luis]

Yeah, yeah, no, I agree. I love, I love it. Well, Shelly, I appreciate it. Thank you guys so much for tuning to the Continents profit podcast. Go ahead and pick your one thing, put the timer and start emailing people. They want what you have. You are solving a problem for them is a disservice. Not to let them know that you do that saying, thank you guys. Take care.