The Vault: The Sponsorship Blueprint & The Guide to Successful Brand Deals

Summary

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Content Is Profit – Episode Summary

Episode: The Vault: The Sponsorship Blueprint & The Guide to Successful Brand Deals

Date: October 2, 2025
Guests:

• Hosts: BIZBROS (A, B, C in transcript; likely Luis and Fonzie)
• Justin Moore (Author of "Sponsor Magnet")

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the mechanics of brand deals and sponsorships for creators, podcasters, and entrepreneurs. The focus is on actionable strategies, real-world case studies, and the mindset needed to build successful, lucrative partnerships with brands—regardless of audience size. Special guest Justin Moore, a sponsorship coach and the author of "Sponsor Magnet," shares frameworks, lessons from his experiences, and practical tactics, making this a blueprint for anyone looking to monetize their content.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Celebrating Justin Moore’s Book Launch

• Justin shares the excitement about his new book, "Sponsor Magnet," a distillation of 15 years’ experience and $5M+ in personal sponsorships.
• The hosts surprise Justin live by helping him hit the 1,000 sales milestone.

  “You guys just bought 10 books. Let’s go, dude. That is legendary, guys. Thank you so much.” – Justin Moore [03:26]

2. Sponsorship Strategy Fundamentals

• Mindset Shift: Don't just focus on “sponsorships,” think in terms of “brand partnerships.”
• Customization: Avoid cookie-cutter, one-size-fits-all packages; focus on the brand’s unique goals.
• Intentional conversations: Take the initiative to get on real calls with brands—don’t hide behind email or automated ad bookings.

  “Simply asking the brand, what is success to you? What is your goal with this collaboration... that’s going to help you move the needle.” – Justin Moore [00:12, 11:48]

3. Real-World Case Study: Paul Jamison (Green Industry Podcast)

• Niche podcaster with 130–150k downloads/month, struggling to monetize.
• Through Justin’s coaching, Paul learned to deeply engage with brands about their campaign goals instead of sending out generic media kits.
• Breakthrough: John Deere approached Paul; instead of selecting from a price menu, Paul led with discovery calls, resulting in a major, creative partnership (live podcasting at a tradeshow).

  “You don’t say, ‘Here, pick one package.’ You say, ‘Let’s get on a phone call… What is success to you?’” – Justin Moore [10:53]

4. Why Most Creators Struggle With Brand Conversations

• ~80% of creators Justin works with have never even spoken on the phone with a brand, often out of fear or inexperience.

  “...the prospect of getting on a phone call with the brand and having a conversation is terrifying. Maybe you’re an introvert and you’re like, no way.” – Justin Moore [13:42]

• Pro Tip: Come prepared with 7–10 questions for brands, focused on their needs and campaign goals.

  “All it really takes is doing a little bit of research before the call and writing down a list of seven to ten questions…” – Justin Moore [14:13]

5. Standing Out to Brands

• Taking a call sets you apart; brands remember creators who genuinely engage, even if they charge more.

  “Even if you’re charging two or three times what some of these other people were, the brand may just decide to hire you because... you seemed like you were more invested.” – Justin Moore [17:15, 18:33]

• If a brand won’t hop on a call, send a personalized video (Loom, Tella, etc.) or detailed email to keep things human and creative in the negotiation.

6. Negotiation and Contract Red Flags

• Exclusivity: Always negotiate the terms—long anti-compete or "first right of refusal" clauses can limit future earning potential.

  “That actually is dangerous… you can negotiate this stuff.” – Justin Moore [21:23]

7. When Things Go Wrong: Handling Deal Collapses

• Example: A client’s six-figure deal with a major streaming service collapsed at the last minute after months of work.

• Lesson: Don’t "burn the bridge"—remain professional and empathetic; this often leads to future opportunities.

  “If you can be the person who says, ‘Look, I get it, I understand this is business...’ they are going to remember that.” – Justin Moore [26:21]

• Another story: A jewelry campaign had to pivot at the last minute due to unforeseen inventory issues; Justin and his wife proactively offered solutions, earning trust and respect from the brand.

8. Follow-Up Systems & Relationship Nurturing

• Most brands are only open to new partnerships a few days each quarter. Make follow-up about value and personal engagement, not just opportunism.

  “Your expectations have to be shifted about what the purpose of nurturing is… It’s about staying top of mind.” – Justin Moore [29:03]

9. WIFT Mindset: “What’s In It For Them”

• Approach every conversation from the brand’s perspective—not what you want, but what they value.

  “You gotta talk about something that interests them, right? That is for their benefit. And that is the same approach...” – Host [16:30]

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• “By popular demand, in studio, by Fonzie, by everybody… you’re here. You did something big recently, right?” – Host [01:55]
• “I wrote a book. Let’s go. I knew it was gonna happen.” – Justin Moore [00:01, 02:19]
• “He went from really struggling to know whether he could make this podcast sustainable… to basically beating brands off with a stick.” – Justin Moore on Paul Jamison [07:39]
• “You are a Content is Profit bestseller. Just saying.” – Host [04:23]
• “Have that conversation because that's the way deals are going to be made.” – Host [16:30]
• “...You should always be trying to investigate creative solutions.” – Justin Moore [31:48]
• “You guys need to get those markers, you know, the ones that like, smell like watermelon or something.” – Justin Moore (lighthearted, referencing the WIFT acronym) [32:16]

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Segment Timestamps (Highlights)

• [00:12] – The essence of asking brands what success means for them
• [03:26] – Live milestone: 10 books sold, 1,000th sale
• [06:55] – Paul Jamison’s case study breakdown
• [10:53] – Real brand call example with John Deere
• [13:42] – Why creators are afraid to talk to brands
• [16:07] – WIFT explained and mindset advice
• [17:15] – How calls make you stand out among other creators
• [19:17] – What to do when brands avoid calls
• [21:23] – Negotiating exclusivity and contract clauses
• [23:05] – Handling high-profile deal collapses with grace
• [29:03] – Building real brand relationships and nurturing connections

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Sponsorships aren't just about numbers—the real value is how well you solve a brand’s specific problems.
• Don’t be afraid to start personal, in-depth conversations with brands, even if you’re an introvert or don’t have a massive audience.
• Strong relationships, professionalism under pressure, and creative thinking are more valuable than big numbers or “influencer” status.
• Always negotiate contract terms, especially around exclusivity and “first right of refusal.”
• When things go wrong, your reputation, empathy, and flexibility can lead to more (and bigger) deals down the line.
• Nurture your brand network regularly with value—not just asks.

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For more step-by-step frameworks, case studies, and actionable playbooks on turning your content into profit, grab Justin’s book at sponsormagnet.com.
To win a free copy, DM the hosts at @bizbrosco on Facebook or Instagram.

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Transcript

[A]

I wrote a book.

[B]

Let's go.

[A]

I wrote a book. Let's go. I knew it was gonna happen.

[C]

Fully recommended. Inside is your frameworks, the process that you follow. Right. You break it down so well.

[A]

It's simply asking the brand, what is success to you? What is your goal with this collaboration will allow you to come back to them and say, oh, well, knowing that that's your goal, what about we do this thing over here that I've never done before, but it seems like that's going to help you move the needle.

[B]

Do you find that maybe a lot of people are intimidated to maybe have those conversations? Is it lack of information? Is it, you know, maybe they don't know the market?

[A]

Probably 80% of the creators, influencers, podcasters that come to me have never been on a phone call with the brand. They're petrified.

[B]

Hey, guys. Welcome back to Content is Profit.

[C]

We had the one and only, the incredible Justin Moore, who just published his book, Sponsor Magnet. He was so kind to send us a copy. And then today we, you are listening to the new conversation that we have with him. Lots of, you know, very specific tips and case studies on how sponsorships might work for you and how you can secure some of those. Absolutely amazing. Justin is great. If you want to claim his book, make sure you go to sponsormagnet.com disclaimer. He's actually not paying us. He is that cool. And we believe so much on his sponsorship model and what he talks about that we just want to support him. So make sure you go to sponsormagnet.com also. We bought quite a few copies and if you want a copy for free from us, make sure you send us a message izboroughsko on Facebook, on Instagram, or send us an email. I don't know, whatever way it is that you want. But those copies are limited, so make sure you do it quick and we can send you one of those free copies.

[B]

Cool. Have fun. Welcome back, Justin. Now that we talked about like seven minutes.

[C]

Yeah. Now that we had a full on behind the scene conversation.

[B]

Yeah. By popular demand, in studio, by Fonzie, by everybody that, you know, kind of heard us talking about sponsorship. You're here. You did something big recently, right? Want to walk us through?

[A]

I did, I did something enormous. I got my personal bench press record. No, not that. I, I, I wrote a book.

[B]

Let's go.

[A]

I wrote a book. Let's go. I knew it was gonna happen. And I'm, I'm so, so, yeah. So it's called Sponsor Magnet.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How to price or, sorry, how and execute your dream brand partnerships. So it's basically like a complete distillation of everything that I know over the last 15 years about, you know, from collaborating with brands. I've done, you know, over 500 sponsorships myself, personally made over $5 million. So it's like a big way in which my wife and I, as creators have. Have derived revenue over the years.

[B]

So cool.

[A]

But I also ran this agency for. For many years where I brought deals to other creators. So I basically took these two perspectives, put it in a book, and. I can't believe we're here.

[C]

Yeah, that is true, man. You and hand enough to send us a copy of the book sponsor Magnet. So if you're interested listening right now and you want to get your your hands on one of these books, go to sponsor magnet.com and I also recommend you to listen to the first episode is published right before this one. We did a little bit custom shit. What just happened, Justin?

[A]

What just happened?

[B]

What just happened?

[A]

Guys, hold on a second here. Okay, okay, okay, I see you guys. Okay. Okay, so I got to describe what just happened here. Right before we hit record, I told these two fine gentlemen that I was four books away from hitting a thousand total sales for the book. And I told them it might happen on the podcast live. And what just popped up here into my book order, zapier automation, was you guys just bought 10 books. Let's go, dude. Oh, man, that is. That is legendary, guys. Thank you so much. No, I super appreciate that. Like, holy cow. That really, really means a lot to me, you guys. And you'll forever be, you could ever forever claim that you pushed it over the over the top.

[C]

Right from this moment on, you are a contentious profit bestseller. Just saying.

[B]

By the way, for everybody listening or watching right now, and you, if you want one of these copies, you send a quick dm, we're happy to. This is by far the number one question we get for, you know, from people that come in the studio and online. It's like monetization as soon as we started the conversations, like, how can I go and start, you know, looking into brand deals? You know, I don't like to call them sponsorships anymore. It's part, you know, brand partnerships, like you said on the book. So I'm stoked, man. I'm very happy for you. And of course, like, what you're bringing onto the market is a. Is a huge solution for a lot of people out there. So thank you.

[C]

Absolutely.

[A]

So appreciate that, man.

[C]

So excited. So. So all Right. Well, I was going before the awesome news. You know, congrats on very random purchase at the right time. Who would have known? You know, last episode, the first one that we did, we cover a lot of the nitty gritty on sponsorship, right. And I took a little few notes in here as a teaser. If you haven't listened to episode one, make sure you go back. But you know, talking about, do not commoditize in yourself by talking about your reach and all that stuff, right? Align yourself to the brand's goals. Be a detective. Do audience intent based brand pitching. Don't just pitch any one of your favorite brands as your audience and pitch to what they want, right? Who to talk depends on the company size. And then we had a little kind of talk about a little spaghetti at the wall hypothesis that we, that we had going on, which I absolutely love it. I'm definitely going to revisit that conversation. But what I want to do for today, right, you had your book sponsored magnet and again, fully recommended inside is your frameworks, the process that you follow, right? You break it down so well. But I want to cover a little bit of the case studies, right? Because somebody right now listen, they're like, but how does that apply to me? They could be have a medium size following, big following, small following, but as we know, doesn't really matter, right? Because I think this is my new favorite answer for most of things, it depends, right? Somebody talk to me about scenario based things.

[A]

I'm like, it depends.

[C]

You know, every problem is unique. Any challenge, challenge is unique. So I would love to hear about some case studies. And actually the first one I want to talk to is about this book. It's about our good friend Paul Jameson. You introduced him to us, we got the pleasure of actually met him, meeting him live in one of the conferences. And he is a niche podcaster, right. So why don't you break down a little bit, kind of like, what was the work that you did with him and some of the results that you guys got?

[A]

Yeah. So Paul is actually one of my longest running coaching clients. I mean, I think he holds the record for the single, the most like coaching calls that anyone's ever done with me is, is probably Paul. And so just a quick kind of context for, for Paul's business. So he runs a podcast called the Green Industry Podcast. And y' all listening are going to love this because he teaches lawn care professionals how to grow their business. And he's doing, you know, somewhere between 130 and 150,000 downloads a month on his podcast. And so how, how much more niche can you get for, for something like this, right? And he, when we first started working together, he very much was frustrated because he was seeing these big numbers, right? He would, he would go to kind of the, these local kind of meet up, meet and greets and in conferences, regional events and things like that. And he was kind of becoming almost like a little mini celebrity because people were wanting to take photos with him, ask for his autograph. Like, so he was seeing a lot of these like kind of big download numbers but he was like, where's the money? Like, I, I'm, I'm not like, you know, being able to cover my costs here. And he had editor and he had, you know, some people who were a producer who was helping him with stuff. And so he was just pretty frustrated because he, even though he was optimistic about, and remember he still at that time had a lawn care business. So he was kind of doing the, the, the side hustle juggling act, right? With the, with the business and the, and the content creation stuff on the side. And so basically we started. He booked like a, a coaching call at the very beginning and he kind of just did this dump, you know, to me of like, here's everything that' right now. And I just don't know what to do. I've, I've heard of this idea about getting sponsors and working with brands, but that whole process just feels so overwhelming. It feels very amorphous. It feels like there's all these different steps that you need to do and I just, I don't know anything, right. And so basically we started working from, from zero. Actually, I take that back. He, he did do a very early deal. He did a very early deal where, where a brand came to him and they were like, hey, we'll pay you this amount of money to like run, you know, ads on your podcast. And so he just basically said yes to whatever number that they gave him because he didn know like, oh yeah, sure, you're gonna pay me a thousand dollars to do like 20 AD reads like that sounds awesome. You know, this, I don't know what the number was. It was something like that. And so he just was very inexperienced. And so over the course of the next basically couple years, he has absolutely, completely transformed his business. He went from really struggling to know whether he could make this podcast sustainable financially for him to basically beating brands off with a stick. Yeah, the one. And so, you know, he's done, you know, he also, in addition to the podcast, he has social Media. So he's able to kind of amplify these campaigns across social media as well as the newsletter. But I want to just share a quick anecdote that actually isn't in the book about Paul's story because I think that this will, this will be a really eye opening lesson for a lot of podcasters listening, which was that one of the most recent partnerships that most recent and most lucrative deals that, that Paul has ever done came recently from a brand that we all are very familiar with, probably even if we're not in the lawn care space, which is John Deere tractor. Right. We all know the John Deere tractor, that big green and yellow logo. We, we probably have all seen that at one point. Right? And so John Deere is, is the behemoth in his industry. Right? And John Deere came to Paul recently and they said, Paul, we would love to collaborate with you. And so what a lot of podcasters do in this situation is they say, great, here's my media kit, here's all my packages, here's, you know, abcd, here's my pricing. Pick one, pick package one through five. Right? And so instead what, you know, we have taught Paul, me and I had several sponsorship coaches on my team now have taught Paul to do over the years is you, you do not do that. You don't say, here, pick one package. You say, let's get on a phone call.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Let's talk about what's going on, what's important to you. Tell me more about this campaign that you want to bring to life. And you know what the, what, what the brand said, what John Deere said is they said, look, Paul, the largest trade show in our industry is happening in October. And you know what we would love for you to do? We would love for you to podcast in our booth.

[C]

Nice.

[A]

For three days. We want you to bring all your friends and interview them. We want to interview people on the marketing team at John Deere Tractor and we want to have our logo in the background while you're filming all these videos. It's the largest event of the year. All the press are there, all the photographers, all the videographers, every, all the key opinion leaders in this industry go to this trade show. And so what's the, tell us how much it's going to cost for you to be in the booth for three days. And, and so he basically named his price. And.

[C]

$100 million.

[A]

$100 million. Generation, generational wealth. Right. No, but for real. And so, and so this, this I hope is a, is A great example for anyone listening that, like, the whole point of the book and that kind of the central theme throughout the book is how do I have this mindset of creativity when I am talking with a sponsor? Because I may have been used to doing certain types of partnerships or certain types of deals, but simply asking the brand, what is success to you? What is your goal with this collaboration? Will allow you to come back to them and say, oh, well, knowing that that's your goal, what about we do this thing over here that I' done before, but it seems like that's going to help you move the needle.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

I think with, you know, some of the conversations that we've had, I think most people, obviously, they don't know what they don't know. This is new territory for a lot of newer creators, right? They just hear through, you know, the veins, or they might see some sponsorship online as consumers, right? And they're like, maybe that's the way, right? And, you know, there's obviously creators that are not business owners, right? So the content is not directly related to that, but they just have a message or they're very passionate about something. And like you say a lot of people is like, okay, let me just cover my production costs initially and then go from there. I think that's step number one. Do you find that maybe a lot of people are intimidated to maybe have those conversations? Is it lack of information? Is it, you know, maybe they don't know the market because, you know, to have a conversation like that and go back to a brand, be like, hey, what do you actually need? Right? To me, it's like a different layer of that. You know, maybe we need to go through the negative experiences to be like, man, like, this may be a partnership that, you know, is not the best fit for me. How can people avoid that? Or what do you think, like, when they come to you guys and. And they consume your content, is that. Is that a correct theory of mine or am I completely losing my mind?

[A]

It's funny because I was just, like, I was commenting back and forth with someone on LinkedIn who was saying that it blew their mind. They were like a salesperson. They were. That was like their job. They're used to getting on phone calls with brands and customers. And I had said, like, probably 80% of the people of the creators, influencers, podcasters that come to me have never been on a phone call with the brand. They're terror. They're petrified of this. And so one of the reasons why they mail it in or One of the reasons why they have a place on their website where you can book an ad spot in my podcast. Oh yeah, use Stripe, like whatever, use this. One of the reasons that they do that is because the idea, the prospect of getting on a phone call with the brand and having a conversation is terrifying. Maybe you're an introvert and you're like, no way. There's no way I'm gonna do that. Right? This is why I'm podcasting in the privacy of my bedro. I don't want to talk to a human being. And. And so I totally get that. I totally empathize and I understand with that. I understand that. What I will say though is that you don't need to be a genius, you don't need to be an expert to be able to just establish simple rapport on a phone call with the brand. And all it really takes is doing a little bit of research before the call and writing down a list of seven to 10 questions that you want to ask them. That's it. It's about them questions saying, hey, tell me a little bit more about your product roadmap. Tell me a little bit more about this campaign that you had in mind. Have you worked with podcasters before? If you did, you know, how did it go? Did it go well? Did it not go so well? If it didn't go well, what was the reasoning? Do you have like, what's the competitive landscape looking like for you, you know, in your industry right now? And there's going to be some probably industry specific questions that you might ask, but that's, that's really, that should be the bulk of the call. It shouldn't, you shouldn't expect that you're going to need to get on this call and just like be an expert and like educate the brand and like do all these things. No, that's not the point of the call. The point of the call is to learn more about them and ask questions from them. And so that hopefully maybe gives people a bit more comfort of getting on a phone call with the brand because you don't need to have the answers. And by the way, if they ask you something that you don't know, you could say, you know what? No one's ever asked me that before. I'm going to like, think about that or do some research and I'll get back to you. And that actually I think is brands will appreciate that, right? It's like, you're honest, you don't know the answer. I'll get back to you. They'll appreciate that more than blowing smoke.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It sounds like, I mean, we talked about this on last episode, but, you know, we use the acronym whiffed and it kind of sounds like you're sniffing something, but it's actually, what's in it for them is that when you sniff something. I don't know, when I say whiffed every time I use the acronym, I'm like, they probably think I'm. I don't know, I'm talking about sniffing something out there. But.

[A]

Well, now I do. I wasn't before, but now I do.

[B]

Everybody listening does.

[C]

Hey, you see? Well, now they have that mental connection and they will remember about WIFT and what's in it for them. Right? And you know, it. I first learned it as a copywriting principle. When you're, you know, crafting your hooks or crafting your copy, you know, what's in it for them? You gotta talk about something that interests them, right? That is for their benefit. And that is the same approach that you're using on these conversations with brands, right? And you go with the mindset, okay, what's in it for? Not what's in it for me. Like, if they win, you are going to win as well, right? And go with that mindset, tackle that conversation. Don't hide behind, you know, your computer in your golden Speedos and, you know, not. Not jumping on a call, jump on the call, have that conversation because that's the way deals are going to be made.

[A]

The other reason that calls are so important is that you have to remember they probably, in addition to reaching out to you, they probably reached out to 20 other podcasters, right? Because they are trying to kind of kick the tires on people. They, this larger budget, you know, let's say 50, 100K, whatever, to like, spread the word about this initiative. And so they don't just want to work with you, they probably want to work with other people, too. And so they're trying to just get an assessment of, like, what people, how much people are charging. Like, you know, what, how are we going to do this? What I always say is that when I ran my, like, influencer agency, the brand who hired us would basically say, here's 100k, we want to work with 10 people. Figure it out, like, because you're running the campaign for us. And so we had to do this kind of Tetris act where we were kind of getting someone's right here and they're right here and just like trying to make it work because everyone charges differently, right? And so the, the value of getting on a call is that you establish this rapport. And so here you were, the one person who took the call with the brand versus these, like, faceless, nameless to 19 other podcasters who just sent their media kit or sent their rates. And so even if you're charging two or three times, what some of these other people will, were the brand may just decide to hire you because they're like, you know what? Even though Justin's, like, more expensive, I just feel like it's going to go better.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He seemed like he was more invested in this than these other people. I can't tell you how many times I did that when I ran the agency. I just felt like, I don't know, I'm gonna hire this person because these other people, I don't know, they seem a little unprofessional.

[C]

Yeah. Is that that intention? Right. Like, you, you see the intentionality, the energy behind people. And when you, when you have that close conversation.

[B]

Yeah. Have you ever run into where, like, you, you pitch the call?

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, they reach out to you or the, you know, the brand, you might be talking to them, and then they are like, hey, we don't really want to hop on a call. Right. That's a possibility, I'm assuming, Right.

[A]

It is.

[B]

What, in that, in that case, Right. Do we continue the conversation that we pursue for another call? Like, what's the pivot there? Be, like, maybe this is not the brand for me because they don't want to talk to me.

[C]

Right. I don't know.

[A]

So there's two alternatives that I suggest in this situation, because it absolutely happens. I really, really like doing asynchronous videos like on Loom or Tela. So I do this a lot where I will. They'll say, oh, we're super busy. Like, can you just give us the info? Or something like that. And I will fire up a video and I will just say, hey, you know, I just have a few quick questions about. To try to scope this partnership. I say, you know, tell me what success would look like. You know, what types of platforms are you hoping to activate on? I kind of rattle off a bunch of the things in the book about kind of the. What are the main things you need to ask of the brand to. To, you know, kind of quantify and qualify what the engagement is going to look like. And simply doing that asynchronous video and then at the end of it being like, hey, and if, you know, you. If it's easier, you can Just send me back a video like this too, so we don't have to get on a call. You can just do it asynchronously. A ton of brands have. Oh, yeah, this is cool. I've never. Thank you for sending this. I've never thought of this idea. And yeah, this is great. Let me just. And they fire up a five minute video. We don't have to waste an hour on Zoom. And then if that's still doesn't work, you could still try to ascertain some of this information via email. You could say, hey, fine, I get it, whatever. Here's the, like, you know, eight things I need to know, you know, which is like I started to mention it, right? The goal, the, you know, scope of work and I call it the DO rule D U E. So deliverables, the usage rights. Right. Do they want to repurpose this at all on their platforms for paid advertising? And the exclusivity, that's another thing you need to ask about. Right? So there's a lot of these elements that you can ask for via email as well.

[B]

Or you can just show up to the CEO's house, knocked on the door and be like, hey, let's just.

[C]

On your golden Speedos.

[B]

On the golden Speedos.

[A]

Yeah, 100%. For those of you guys who have no idea why we're talking about Golden Speedos so much, make sure to listen to the first episode.

[C]

Yeah, exactly. That's a callback right there. And very intentional callback. I love this. So I'm curious on. You said the DUI on exclusivity, I would assume also exclusive deals would be priced at a higher rate too, right? If you're only allowed to work with one brand.

[A]

Brand, Exactly. Because that represents a direct opportunity cost for you to. You can't work with any of the brand's competitors for a certain duration. This is pretty common with. As you get, as you grow your podcasts, where in the insertion order, it'll literally say, not only. By the way, this is fascinating, but not only can you not work with any of their competitors for a certain duration, but a lot of podcast agencies will ask for first right of refusal. So they'll say, hey, if one of your competitors, if one of these other competitors, you know, comes to you, even after the exclusivity period lapses, there's this longer period, like six months or a year or something, where if that happens, you have to come to us first and allow us to make an offer to you prior to this other competitor. And that actually is Dangerous because they'll say something like, you give us 10 business days to make an offer to you first, first write a refusal. And you know, like this other brand, this competitor is not going to be willing to wait 10 business days. Like, what the heck, that's craz. So like again, you need, you can negotiate this stuff. You could either say, hey, I don't want a first writer refusal clause in there, or I'm going to give you 48 hours. That's fine, but 48 hours, you need to give me a response. And so this stuff matters. Like this could represent real dollars out of your pocket.

[C]

Yeah, that, that's super interesting. I'm curious if you have, you know, we, we went over that case study with Paul and it was a very positive case study. I'm curious if you have the other side of the coin, maybe I can study that. They resold wasn't what the creator expected. Rather they were like, oh, you know, it was rough, you know, of course we signed a contract I'm going to have to fulfill. Not what I wanted, you know, but then of course there's always lessons.

[A]

Yeah. So I mean, I could, I could rattle off a bunch of horror stories that my wife and I had happened personally, but I could share another example from one of my coaching clients where, yeah, the outcome was not great. So, so I'm going to redact some information as I tell this story, but basically one of the largest streaming services, so you can imagine which one this is, came to my client with. They had a new show that they had invested, you know, a lot of multiple millions of dollars, tens of millions of dollars in the shows, a lot of fanfare. And they wanted to hire my client to create some content. It was going to be not just social media content, but there was going to experiential element to the activation. So they were, he was going to be doing stuff in person at a conference and all this stuff. And it was going to be a lot of work, like a ton of a ton of work. And there was multiple meetings that had happened to kind of scope the partnership out and do all these things. And so I was working with my client to put together like a really detailed comprehensive proposal that we would then bring to the client and say, okay, here's what it's going to be. And it was going to be, you know, six figures plus, like it was going to be a lot of money. And so we worked together extensively to design this whole thing. And everything was looking really good. It was really good. Really good. And then at the very last moment the brand cut the budget, they said, you know what, we're so sorry. Like, you know, we were, you know, and they had like a multi million dollar budget for marketing for this whole thing. And so like, it was just that the social media activation component line item on the marketing budget got cut at the 11th hour, basically like a couple, couple weeks before the event. And, and my client was just so destroyed, it was distraught. They were so looking forward to this. In their mind, it was definitely going to happen. And so I tell this story for a specific reason because this has happened to my wife and I many times where we really thought that this was going to happen. And it was just like a kind of a foregone conclusion. We're waiting on the contract and this type of thing. And for whatever reason, the brand made some changes. And the danger here, here is that you turn as a creator from an uber fan of the brand to an uber hater. You're like, screw this brand. How dare they? They jerked me around. I was on all these calls and all these meetings forever and then they did this to me. Screw them. I'm gonna tell everyone I know. In fact, I'm gonna make a tick tock talking about how much this brand sucks. And this happens all the bridges, like people do this, People do this, right? They turn into an uber hater. And what I always have to say is that, that this is business. It sucks. I will be the first one to say it sucks. And yes, I, my wife and I have gotten, you know, super bummed when stuff like this has happened. But if you can be the person who says, look, I get it, I understand this is business, this happens sometimes. If you could say that to the brand, if you could say that to the agency, they are going to remember that. They're going to remember the fact that. And it, by the way, it probably was not even them, it was their boss that made the decision, or it was their agency.

[B]

They wanted to have that conversation.

[A]

They're like, like they don't want to have that conversation. Yeah, they feel so terrible, probably too. Right? And so remember, they're just, they're humans too, right? And so they can empathize with you, probably. And so if you can remember, I guarantee you in their mind, they feel terrible. And the next opportunity that they have to bring you a deal in the future, they're going to, you're going to be the first person they think of because they feel so bad about what happened with that last deal. But, but if you blew them up, if you said, screw you. How dare you. If you burn the bridge, you're never to give them that opportunity to kind of pay you back.

[C]

Yeah, my mind goes to, probably a lot of people will think like, oh, I wish I would have closed the deal earlier, you know, make it work before this happened, etc. My, my first thought is kind of like having that stoic mindset, right? Which is, what can you control? Which is your response. You cannot control those events. You had no idea that could have happened. You know, maybe the brand, the people you were talking to, they had no idea that was going to happen either, Right? But at the end of the day, like, rather than being reactive and, you know, start badmouthing the brand, you can reflect on it and say, okay, you know, I don't want to burn any bridges. I believe there might be a future opportunity. Whether that is that brand, you know, sponsoring me next or somebody that's in that position, they might go to a different company and then they might call you back and they're like, hey, it's great working with you. I love that. Come here and do it. Right. So I, I think a little bit of that stoic mindset and calm and your response, right? What can you control? You can always control the way you're going to communicate with them and deal with that.

[B]

Justin, how much of this is also like a system, a process, right? As in, like, hey, I have these brands, I might proactively look out and establish conversations or relationships and then maybe from some of those opportunities that maybe don't come through, like, how much is that is like weekly, monthly, you know, biweekly follow up to just, hey, how you doing? Building relationship aspect of it. Like in my mind I'm like, well, you know, if that scenario happens, there's going to be a new opportunity down the road, right? Like, my mind is already thinking, hey, let's, you know, let's, let's continue to work together, let's continue to stay in touch. I'll keep you posted on what I'm doing. How much of that it's involved in this process.

[A]

I mean, it's a huge part of it. And you're absolutely right. There is a whole kind of system to doing these types of follow ups. Even if that deal fell through, you're constantly basically staying on the radar of these brands and these companies so that again, the next time an opportunity slides across their desk that you'd be a great fit for, they instantly think of you. And it's not just, hey, just wanted to follow up, do you have any deals for me?

[C]

Hey, how's it going?

[A]

You working on any campaigns that I could support? You know, this type of thing that's super annoying and not useful because the amount of, I call it basically the amount of times that a brand is in an active recruitment, recruitment phase where they're actively trying to find people to collaborate with on a, on a campaign is very small. Like a lot of brands running, you know, let's say quarterly campaigns. So they, There may be 10 days, you know, a 10 day period where they're like actively emailing people, hey, can you do this thing, this type of thing, 10 days, four times a year, basically. So it's 40 days out of the year, 10% of the year. So the likelihood of you reaching out and them like being ready, yeah, here's the deal. This is great. Boom is very low. And so your expectations have to be shifted about what the purpose of nurturing is. It's about staying top of mind so that when again, when they're ready, they can think of you. I want to share just one more quick example about something that happened that was, was not great for a deal that my wife and I did. Because again, this is something that happens. You can't anticipate it, but it's a real, like how you respond to it really matters. So the quick example is that my wife and I were going to be doing a deal with a jewelry brand and we created the content, we signed the deal, we created the content, everything was going great. And then the day or the morning of when we were about to publish the activation, the brand frantically emailed us and said, we're so sorry but we unexpectedly ran out of inventory. We don't, we like. And so all of a sudden they paid us a bunch of money and we're going to publish this thing, drive a bunch of people to the E Commerce store and they can't it, no one, no one can buy stuff. And so they basically, you know, said like what could we do? Like all this, could we delay it? Like what can we do? And so we basically gave them two options. We said, look, we can do two things. We can publish it as is and basically change the call to action to a wait list. Call to action. Like, hey, sign up for the wait list for when this, you know, piece of jewelry is still is going to be available again. Or we can delay until the inventory is back in stock. Like it's, that's okay, I understand. And so we easily could have been pissed. We could have been like, what the heck should screw the brand. Like, they, they, you know, they should have known this. Like, this is not our responsibility. Too bad. Like, we're gonna, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna post it anyway. People have this mindset, right? And it's not our problem. You figure it out. Whereas just really trying to empathize and understand, like, like the brand didn't know that there maybe someone placed a bulk order or like they just didn't know that. You know, a lot of brands have omnichannel distribution, so they have retail stores and E commerce and so just like, it's hard to predict sometimes these things that happen. But to your point, like, if you can. Can look at this more like a partnership, which is what it really is, you should always be trying to, you know, investigate creative solutions.

[C]

Yeah, I love it Is honestly very similar to a process of, of selling, you know, again, understanding the goals of the other person on the other side, in this case of the brand that you want to work with and thinking with. Right. Again, no sniffing anything, just with what's in it for them. So that's also amazing job.

[A]

You guys. You guys need to get those markers, you know, the ones. Ones that like, smell like watermelon or something. Just get the rainbow pack and just like.

[B]

And then you'll find it in that corner, addicted to them.

[C]

I like that. I like that.

[A]

Yeah, you should do that.

[C]

This has been absolutely amazing, man. Thank you so much again for you listening. We want to get him to not only a thousand, but ten thousand sales over there. So make sure you buy the other 9,000 left. So if you want your book, make sure you go to sponsormagnet.com. is that right, Justin?

[A]

That's right. And guys, seriously, you will forever be the ones who got me over the hump. I really, I super, super appreciate it, honestly. And by the way, if you guys, if you end up fighting over that copy, just let me know and I'll send you another one. Let's go.

[C]

No worries, no worries. We'll take one of those copies that we bought. And the rest of the copies, please. If you're listening and you're like, I want to get my hands on Justin's book, feel free to send us a message right at Bizbrosco on Facebook, on Instagram, say, hey, I listened to the episode. I loved what you guys talked about. I want part three, especially with the golden Speedos and all that stuff. And then we'll send you one of the books, one of the copies that we got. So thank you so much. Justin, anything else you want to share before we we head out?

[A]

No. You guys are so kind. I super, super appreciate it. And one of these days, we are going to do an episode live in person, because I really want to make that happen at some point.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

Let's go.

[C]

That'll be a blast.

[B]

Oh, absolutely. And go to Speedos. All right, guys. With that said, thank you so much for tuning to the Contents Profit Podcast. Go ahead and follow the show in your favorite podcasting platform and on social media at Beast BrothersCo.

[C]

That is right. And if Justin here help you move one step closer towards your sponsorship goals, make sure you share this episode and don't forget to leave a five star review. See ya.

[B]

Bye, guys.