Alex Demch (2:17)

I had to pay him a lot of money. No I'm kidding. But no, I've just, I've had the opportunity to be mentored by John for the past six years. So I played college football at University of Missouri and I was a walk on quarterback and John and I connected and over the years, through being on his team and really just learning from him, it was kind of a no brainer for me. As we kind of talked about this book and there was a ton of symmetry in what we were doing. And I think all these organizations, teams, schools that we speak to, there was this one overall theme that I think we kept seeing and that's what we decided to write the book about.

Heather Monahan (2:51)

How do you guys write a book together? I've written two books. Both I've written all by myself and then I email it off to editors to make changes. How, how do you come together collaboratively to work? What does that look like?

John Gordon (3:02)

Yeah, Heather, Alex deserves a lot of credit for that. He really wrote the book, had the idea initially, right. So he came to me. I've been mentoring him for all these years. He's been speaking, he's, you know, for me, for various organizations, companies. He did about 13 different universities, college students, college athletes on a tour. One time, I couldn't do it. They didn't have a big budget. Alex went and did it throughout the northeast from city to city, sharing the message on positive leadership. Came back and you know, he was an improved speaker by doing that. Think about it. He was starting when he was 23, 24 years old. He's now 29 years old. He's 29, but he was starting this when he was young. So I've known him this whole time and he has lived this message of integrity, of doing the work because I saw him work hard. I saw him go out there and do anything, anywhere, right? Hey, Alex, you're going to South Dakota. Alex, you're going to Kansas. You're going here. Alex, you're going to this place. And they only have this much, but you want to do it? Yeah, I'll do it. So I saw him hungry, I saw him work hard, and he was going to do the work. And so when he came to me with this idea of, of the sale, I said, you know, I love that it's all about integrity, you know, it's all about focus. I love the story. And then we got into then reworking it, tweaking it. I had to put my touch on it, right. I've written a number of books. It had to be something that would be part of my voice as well, that I feel. Felt comfortable sharing. So I did a lot of editing and a lot of tweaking. We changed the ending. We changed some parts in the middle. But the main gist was him, his idea and all that story still remains. And it was an incredible story. I was like, wow, this is a really good book, Alex. Like, what you wrote was. Is really strong. And when I saw it, I thought, you know, especially with the title, this will make a great book to do. So that's how we ended up doing it together.

Heather Monahan (4:53)

Well, for everyone listening, what I just heard John share is that Alex was coming up. He hadn't, you know, quote unquote, made it yet. And John gave him a lot of tough things. Gritty, not glamorous, not sexy. Not write a book with bestselling author John Gordon. But, hey, hit the road and hit this challenge city in this area, right? So, Alex, really, you took the opportunity, but then you put that work in.

Alex Demch (5:17)

Well, yeah. And when I first started working for John, you know, John has people just like you, I'm sure, reaching out all the time, like, hey, can I get some of your time? Can I do a book with you? And so at the beginning, John was like, hey, go out and do these free gigs, you know, and he's like. And John would tell me, he's like, speaking leads to more speaking. And he's like, the more you put yourself out there, these. The more these opportunities will come. And, yeah, a lot. When I was 23, I didn't really know what I was getting into, and I'd go to a company sales meeting or like John was saying, I did this big tour in the east Coast. It was, I think he said, 13 talks in 14 days. And so it was just insane, right? I was feeling sick, but I pushed through it. And it's John, I think, seeing that in me and saying, hey, just go for it. And there's times where it was hard. And I'm like, wait, why am I doing this talk for free? I should be at like a normal 9 to 5 job, but for all the people listening, that, like, when you see what you want to do. And I saw that in John, like, if I thought about 20 years from now, what do I want to be doing? It's what he gets to do. It's what you get to do. And I'm like, wait, why wait 20 years when I can start doing this now, even if it's free, even if I have to grind a little bit? And so it's just been really fun ride these last few Years and so thankful for his mentorship because that's him pouring into me, has allowed me to do this work and I'm so grateful.

John Gordon (6:29)

And Heather, like you when you left corporate America, when you were done with corporate America, like, okay, I'm going to now build my brand. I'm going to go out there and do it. I look the same way. He recently just quit his job at a, at a mortgage company where he was working, getting a paycheck, a good paycheck, supporting his family. He's married, has a daughter. Right. And so he is basically, he's like an old soul. He's like a 40 year old person and a 29 year old body because he thinks about the future. He's got a 401k. I didn't even think about a 401k at 29. Like. But Alex is thinking about all these things and he's like, you know, should I give this up and pursue this? I'm like, Alex, if this is what you want to do, then you should. And he's recently giving up the corporate life to now pursue this just as you did, stepping out into the unknown and going after it. I have a lot of respect for that.

Heather Monahan (7:12)

Yeah, he is an old soul. By looking at him with those old AirPods on, for sure, I get that same feeling from him. All right, Alex, tell us a little bit. How did you come up with and for anyone that hasn't read John's books, you know, one of the signatures of his books are these fables that he shares that really pull the reader in. Alex, how did you come up with this fable about Matt?

Alex Demch (7:32)

Well, I think the biggest compliment we've received in the last week or two is that people have said like, wow, this feels like one of John's other books. Like it fits right in. And I think that's been the coolest compliment to hear. When I think back to just getting started with speaking and going to these schools, going to these organizations, what doesn't matter what industry, the message of integrity kept coming up and I think if you, you could even just turn on Netflix, there's documentaries about whether it's downfall with or hillsong. There's all these documentaries right now that you could look into that deal with integrity and, and I think as we started to talk about that topic of what does it look like to lead and to make a difference, but do it the right way so when you look back, you're proud and you're excited of how you lived and the other people around you, they looked at you as a person who did things the right way. And so as John and I started to formulate this story, I think that's what it was. We wanted to make the main character, Matt, a very relatable person. And I think when you read the story and you see Matt and what he goes through, you're like, wow. I could see myself wanting to have success, wanting to do the right thing, but also being torn because that's as we'll get into the story. That is the story. Matt has the chance to make the sale of a lifetime. He's in sales, a very lucrative industry, and he has the chance to make this sale of a lifetime. He would make $7 million. I mean, that's a lot of money where I come from. So $7 million. But the only problem is he has to lack integrity in some pretty major ways to go through with the sale. And so that's the story is he meets this mentor named Randy, who teaches him these laws and principles about integrity. And Heather, John and I can't tell you the ending of the story. You'll have to. Everyone, all your listeners have to see the ending. But it's very cool to see the transformation in Matt's life, learning about these different principles.

Heather Monahan (9:18)

So for both of you, I'm interested to know at what point in your life did you have to face this question of do I go left or right on the road to when it splits? And there's a choice between, you know, following integrity or taking the other road?

John Gordon (9:32)

I think it's a choice daily. I think it's a choice that comes up quite often. I mean, even just recently, I had an engagement with the Women's Basketball association for College Coaches, and they asked me to speak. It was supposed to be at a certain time. They changed the time. And then I had to go to Fort Lauderdale from Minnesota, where Catherine, my wife, was, and where there's an event that we were supposed to go to. And that was the only fight out was at 10:40. And so if it was at the time that they changed it to, I wouldn't be able to make it. So I reached out to them, we talked, and I could have just canceled, but I said, no, let's try to make it work. And they were a little upset. They were disagreeing, and I was disagreeing. And finally I just said, look, don't pay me, don't pay me, and let's just do it at this time. And they said, okay. And so they were. They were happy to do it. You know, at that time, I didn't get paid, which was fine, but I just felt like I did the right thing by saying, don't pay me. Because we took that out of the equation. I spoke for 30 minutes instead of an hour. We started half an hour early. The talk went incredible. Probably one of the most powerful talks of the year. For me, the response was unbelievable. I made my flight and made the weekend, and it all worked out by me just saying, look, don't pay me. For me, that was a choice. And there's been other, I guess, situations where, you know, when something happens, do you let someone know that they double paid? You know, I've had that happen before as a speaker. Have they ever had that happen? We got two checks.

Heather Monahan (11:02)

I have. I have people not pay me, and I'm chasing them down. Don, sign me up.

John Gordon (11:07)

I've had. I've had two checks, and I've had to let them know they sent me two checks and send that back again. Little things like that that come up along the way. Of course, there's those big decisions, but for me, I don't even see them as decisions because I'm really going to take the right path and the right road. So it's really not even a decision. You've already decided. So to me, it's not a decision because you've already decided.

Heather Monahan (11:27)

All right, but you sound like the COVID of Wheaties right now. Like you're. You're. There's a face on the Wheaties box. And here's a thing for if somebody hasn't heard the first episode that you were on, you did not always live your life. It wasn't as clear to you when you were younger.

John Gordon (11:40)

Right? So I. Yeah, I was miserable. I was negative. I was not always a great person. I did not always live with integrity. Right. So in my younger ages, I wasn't like Alex. Alex has been, you know, an integrity kind of guy since he's probably like a teenager.

Alex Demch (11:55)

Not true. Not true.

John Gordon (11:57)

Okay, well, then you'll get it. You'll have to get into that, Alex. But I wasn't. But along the way, you learn, you grow, you make the decision, and then you truly choose to live your life that way.

Heather Monahan (12:07)

Meet a different guest each week.

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Heather Monahan (16:05)

I asked you to try to find your passion. It's important for everyone listening John wasn't always living this amazing life. I certainly wasn't always listening to you share that story reminds me I remember when I was an equity partner in my early 20s, I had scaled this company huge. We bought it for 25 million, sold it for 55 million in under three years. I was so proud of my work. However, I remember right at the line that we're about to sell the company, we're about to close, they were doing their due diligence. Someone brought me in on a conversation and said hey, it looks like the books have been cooked. Which I didn't even know what that meant back then. I was so young. And I said well explain. I don't understand. Explain to me, I don't know what, I don't know. And so they started talking to me about we had moved revenues from month to month, not duplicating revenue, but shifted to our benefits so that the growth trajectory would look as attractive as possible. And that was not ethical and I did not know, right? I sat there, I listened to the conversations and then I knew, okay, we've been doing something wrong and I didn't make it a bigger deal. Fast forward to after leaving that deal. We left with a lot of money, did really well in that deal. I remember never feeling great about it. I remember being on the plane leaving Michigan. I remember thinking crap like I did a great thing but I don't feel so proud. This sucks. Cut to, you know, 20 years later or whatever it was when I'm getting fired and that woman that fired me asked me to sign a non disparaging agreement to never speak about what I had went through at that company and if I would do it. I'd get a really big check that would take care of my. My son and I. And I remember pushing those papers back to her. No matter how bad I wanted that money, I was not going to walk away from a big business deal and say, I just don't feel great about who I am. And that first not so great situation set me up for big success in that next one. So I totally appreciate what you shared, John, that, you know, you didn't always have this clear vision. I certainly didn't either. Alex, give it to us. What was your moment that you learned about the importance of integrity?

Alex Demch (18:07)

Yeah, well, Heather, what you just said is perfect. And honestly, for your listeners, once you read the book, what you just described is pretty close to the storyline of the sale, which is super exciting. And the cool thing is that you identified the second time, right? Like, you lived that first experience, but then you made the correction. And I think all of us have opportunities to do that. And so I think back to my junior year of college was really big for me. I actually got cut from the team. And I was living the dream as a college football player, a quarterback, doing all these things for this SEC school. And they came in and they said, long story short, we're bringing in someone to take your spot. That was my identity. Like, that's who I was. And so in a. In a blink of an eye, it was taken from me. And that entire junior season, I had to do all these small things. Like, all these things I did not want to do, did not feel like doing. I had to make the people who took my spot look better. Like, that was. Talk about humbling. And that entire season went by. It was tough. I didn't do it perfectly. And then my senior year, I ended up. I continued to work out, got back on the team as a quarterback. It was an awesome experience. But for the first time in my life, I had to take ownership because early on I was blaming the coaches, saying, oh, they made the wrong decision. Like, kind of gossiping, well, he's not that good. I think for me, that was an integrity issue of, yeah, I'm going to try to make him look worse when I'm the one that got cut. And so I had to learn I have to own my responsibility, I have to own my actions and try to get better. And what are my blind spots? And I think for all of us, we have these blind spots. If I ask my wife, hey, what are my blind spots? She could give you a list of all of them pretty quickly, right? And she's awesome and great, but if we have that open and trust relationship, we're going to be real with each other. And I think, just like the story you just described, I think so many of us have these opportunities in life to do something that maybe will make the quick buck or a lot of bucks in the situation you just told us. But how cool is it that you were able to say, you know what, I'm going to push the papers back across the table and I'm not going to move forward with this. And that's, I think, the message we're trying to share in the book.

John Gordon (19:57)

They asked Alex to actually coach if he wanted to be a volunteer coach the year that he chose. When they cut him, they said you could still be involved in the program, but not as a player, as an assistant coach, basically a gopher doing all the things that we don't want to do. You have to do it.

Alex Demch (20:12)

Alex chose that role, right, Alex? Yeah. I mean, Heather, I was literally making coffee for the coaches, printing off copies. And this was where, you know, football for me was it like, that's what I wanted to do. That was my passion. And then they're telling me, essentially, you're not good enough here. Do these menial tasks, right? That brought me low pretty quick. And yeah, John, you're right. I mean, it was. It was humbling. And that was tough. So that for me was a time where it was very easy for me to be like, screw you guys. But I had to really learn and be humbled through that experience to say, you know what? I'm going to take ownership for me and how I can improve.

John Gordon (20:45)

Heather, I remember my mom, when I was younger, my mom caught me in a lie. I was a teenager, and she said, don't ever lie to me. She said, if you lie to me, I can't trust you. And if I can't trust you, then we can't have a relationship. So make sure you always tell me the truth. And I never lied again after that. So that was a really defining moment for me.

Heather Monahan (21:05)

Okay, I'm going to rewind that and play that back for my son, my 14 year old. Thank you very much for that, John. All right, so guys, tell me, to me, integrity in business, I don't want to say goes without saying, but you just assume people know, right?

Alex Demch (21:20)

Although.

Heather Monahan (21:21)

And you were mentioning this earlier, Alex, when you look through business day, you look at headlines today. CEOs of companies are being ousted because of lack of integrity. I mean, we're industries are going down because people are out there making claims that aren't true, lying. I mean, it's beyond. They've forgotten about integrity. So who is this book for? Is this book for everyone in business?

Alex Demch (21:45)

It's absolutely for that person who I think you just described in business who is maybe running at a pace in life where they're having success, they want to have success and maybe they're in a corporate job, maybe they're an entrepreneur, but they're someone who's achieving these high levels. But at what cost? Like, I know for me, last September I started to get these heart palpitations. I started getting this racing heartbeat and I was doing so many things in life. I had a new child, I was doing all these different things. And so I actually went to a counselor and they said, they did the ekg, they said everything was fine. They said, you're running at a pace that's unsustainable. This is going to stop you if you don't scale down. And so I eventually did and that led to me eventually quitting my job to go all in on speaking. But I think this book is absolutely for someone who is saying, I want to have high levels of success, but do it the right way. Because just like Heather, you mentioned the CEO who's in the headlines. What if the CEO that maybe has years worth of small rationalizations of maybe decisions, behaviors, they get away with that all of a sudden someday it's an explosion. What if the CEO could read a book like this and maybe think about introspectively their character and integrity before that explosion happens? I think that's why we wrote this.

Heather Monahan (22:52)

Book, the man in the Mirror. Right. It's really about looking in that mirror and owning who you are. Mistakes. And one of the things I like, John, that you've done, you know, your career has spanned decades and it's 26 book. It's incredible what you've achieved, but you're always innovating. You're trying to find a new, different way to evolve and grow. And I love this NFT initiative that you took on with the book, the sale.

John Gordon (23:16)

Yeah, really cool. And innovation is something that we are proud of. We do want to do new things and stay current and stay young. We got to stay young. So for me it's about how can we use the latest technology and what we're doing. And I really love NFTs have been following the crypto world. My son got into it when he was home last year from the quarantine and everything with college. And so he started investing in crypto I was investing with him, I start to learn more about it, start to follow NFTs and what's happening there. So what we're doing is like with the sale, for instance, if you buy 11 copies of the sale, 11, you get a free NFT. And NFT is a non fungible token. It basically exists on the blockchain, and that's even hard to explain. But basically you get this sort of digital product, this digital currency. It's a token, say, and it's worth something. It's almost like the Cracker Jack box or the set of baseball cards. And you have these cards and when you have this box or you have these cards, you don't know what's inside. So we're giving everyone an nft. So you have something of value, but you don't know what it is. What happens is, technology wise, is a randomizer that will randomize what you receive and what value it has. So someone might win, right, the chance to get to play tennis with me, or they get to hear a virtual keynote from Alex. They can come to a keynote or they can have one for their company. I'm going to do where someone could come with me to one of the sports teams, I speak to, college or pro team. Someone's going to win that, they get to come with me on that. Then there's simple things like you might get the opportunity to come to a training that we're doing or attend a virtual webinar that we're going to do. There's going to be a lot of people who win that. The idea is that each thing has value and then you actually can use it, actually, you know, experience it, or you can trade it, or you could sell it. So if you win a virtual keynote with Alex and a company that might go for $10,000 and now you have a $10,000 value on your coin and you can actually trade it in the market, which is very popular in the NFT world. You can trade it or sell it to someone. They might buy it for 5,000 or 7,000 and you just made 5 to $7,000. So we're not going to make money off this whole NFT thing that we're doing with the book. The idea is do something innovated, something cool. You'll see the crypto coin on the front cover. So we tied it into the story as well. Can't share how and why, but let's just say a lot of money could be made, right? And they will maybe, maybe get paid in crypto. We'll see if that happens because we know that's happening in the world. And so we also tied that in to the story and to what we're doing here. So we had some fun with it, which is really cool, but also using it as a way to create value, create community. Now I'm having all these people getting these books and they're part of this community and now they're going to basically have these different valuable things that they can use and then from there they'll be able to make money from it. So it's a great fun thing. I'm going to come out with another NFT in the future based on the energy bus and that's going to be our big drop. This is sort of like our initial thing to get, you know, get going with it and have some fun in the process and get more people involved in the book. We've got a lot of crypto people that are now for the first time getting to know about me and my book, right? They're reading the sale, it's their first book they've ever read of mine and they're like, wow, this is a pretty cool book. I love this book. So we're getting great feedback. So it also opens us up to a new market and reach a new market. A lot of entrepreneurs, entrepreneurial people, crypto people. We're already big in schools, right? Businesses, corporate leaders, sports. But not as many like entrepreneurs or people who are striving on, on that level. So it's fun to reach that market as well.

Heather Monahan (27:00)

Meet a different guest each week.

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Heather Monahan (30:28)

I asked you to try to find your passion for everyone listening. You know no matter what level of success you've achieved, we've always got to challenge ourselves to say what area can we grow in? What's a new area that we can expand to? How can we serve people in new and let's test and try something different. How do people get and access the nft? Where do they go?

John Gordon (30:48)

All they have to do is go to the salebook.com the sale book.com you go there and there's instructions on how to get your NFT. You buy the 11 books, then you actually share proof that you bought the books and then you submit a form and then once the NFT is ready we'll be ready by the end of May, what we do is we then will send everyone their NFT via an airdrop, which is a whole way you do it. It sounds complicated, but it's not. And we're making it really simple. Like we have this great designer and developer that's doing this for us and we're going to be making it really simple with videos on. Here's how to open up and create a wallet. Here's how to receive your NFT into your wallet. It's like a virtual wallet, how it works. And so we'll be guiding people on how to do that. And this will be a lot of people's first time into the NFT world. But that's one of our goals too, is to bring people along with us, teach them, because this is here to stay. Sounds foreign to most people, but it's a new language. But this is something that's going to be part of our world and our lives for the foreseeable future. And we're just getting it on the ground floor and we're helping people do that. I see a Heather Monahan NFT in the future. It's coming and it's going to be fun and you'll probably do it. And that's the whole point. I want to encourage others. Gary Vee is the pioneer. I got to give him credit in doing this. He deserves all the credit. He showed us what was possible. So now what I'm showing is an author like me, I'm not a social media icon like him. A regular old author like me could actually use that idea and do it this way to show proof of concept. And Since Alex is 29, it's a perfect idea to do it. Someone young.

Heather Monahan (32:27)

You know, I think it's so interesting because to me, I have trepidation around getting into cryptocurrency and NFTs because I don't have knowledge. Right. I don't want to jump into something. This is the problem with. We know. I talk about all the time fear is a green light. It means go. But when it comes to my money and my risk, I'm like, hang on, pump the brakes for a second, let me take a step back. And John, that's why I'm appreciative that you're sharing this with me today, because I feel like I definitely am more in your boat than in Alex's. Right? So I have to say, okay, if John's willing to go out there and jump into this, I've got to be willing to, to push myself into it and I had a phone call with one of my dear friends the other day and he said, you know, we both have kids around the same age. We grew up together. And he said, gosh, Heather, it's too bad, you know, we're not. If we were our kids, we'd get into crypto right now. If we were our kids, we'd get into the nft. And I hung up with him and I'm thinking, but we don't have to be our kids to actually do it. We just need to immerse ourselves and start learning. Alex, are you up to speed on all this stuff?

Alex Demch (33:28)

I'm up to speed and I'll say this. My grandparents bought 11 books, Heather, so they have an NFT. So there you go.

John Gordon (33:35)

Wow.

Heather Monahan (33:35)

You're totally normalizing NFTs at any age. I absolutely love it. Alex, now that you got this book the sale, which didn't it go number one already on Amazon?

Alex Demch (33:47)

Yeah, in a few categories. It's been selling pretty good, so it's been exciting.

Heather Monahan (33:50)

Yeah, the reviews are incredible already and it just came out. So now that you've gone into this author world, what are your thoughts for you on your future? Are there more books that you're going to be coming out with?

Alex Demch (34:01)

Gosh, I haven't even thought about that yet because right now it's just been the sale, the sale launch, but been really excited. And I think I have seven speaking engagements in the next two weeks, so that's going to be exciting. And yeah, just been continuing to learn from John about speaking writing world and just, we're just so excited about the message of the book. And honestly, the last week just being flooded with people saying like, oh my gosh, thanks for writing this. I needed to hear this book, like, that's been worth all the money in the world because, yeah, you're not writing the book for the money, you're doing it for the impact. And so that's been really cool to see.

Heather Monahan (34:31)

But it's important for people to know you weren't sitting on millions of dollars when you made that leap from corporate America.

Alex Demch (34:37)

You took a risk too, 100%, and had a mortgage and had a new baby daughter and a wife that stays home. And so. Absolutely. One thing I would say for people who are kind of on that fence is I actually talked with 12 people before I made the jump. John was one of those 12. I talked to people in the speaking industry like John. I talked to people in the mortgage industry and kind of just spilled my guts and said, hey, here's what I want to do, here are my numbers, here's where I'm at. What do you think? And every single person, 12 out of 12, they literally said, not all of them said it this way, but most of them said it's a no brainer, you need to go for it. And I even heard Dave Ramsey one time talk about on his show, he said whenever you're making a jump, you need to make sure that if you're in one boat, you don't make a splash when you go to the next boat. And one of my mentors, they said, Alex, right now your boats are not only close together, but they're, they're docked together and tied up and they're actually causing friction. And so like until you make this jump one way or the other, you're just going to be banging your head against the wall. So you need to go for it. And I think for your listeners, someone that's thinking about what should I do, should I go for it? Assess what boat are you in and what boat are you trying to go to and how can you get those boats closer so that when you jump there's not a huge splash that was so good.

Heather Monahan (35:47)

And when you're describing that, I'm thinking to myself, the same goes for relationships. People, you know, they want to say, you know, I'm still with this person but I'm not really happy. I'm going to start seeing what else is out there in the world. Until you make a clear decision to get out of one boat and go do something else, you're never really going to open that door up for opportunity. So thank you for that reminder, Alex. It's a really powerful one. And if Alex could go make this jump with a mortgage, with a stay at home wife and a new baby, I'm sure everyone listening can to move into fear. I remember I interviewed Sarah Blakely a couple years ago and she brought a big bag of gifts for me and I took it back to my hotel room after and I was going through everything and I saw this one card and I pulled it out and it said the only risk in life is not taking one. And I just thought of her trajectory of success and you know, what this woman had achieved. And that was the one parting message she wanted to leave with me. And I'll never forget that I still saved that card. And for everyone listening, take the risk. We don't know what tomorrow holds. Get the NFT go get the 11 books of the sale. This one's a winner. And be a part of a winning team. Guys, I'm so grateful to have both of you here. Until next time. We will be creating confidence with you. Go check out the sale mat.

Sponsor/Announcer (37:00)

Me?

Heather Monahan (37:03)

I decided to change that dynamic. I couldn't be more more excited for what you're gonna hear. Start learning and growing. Inevitably something will happen. No one succeeds alone.

John Gordon (37:17)

You don't stop and look around once in a while. You could miss it.

Heather Monahan (37:21)

Come on this journey with me.