Podcast Summary: Creating Confidence with Heather Monahan
Episode: Confidence Classic: The 4 Phases of Change That Shape Your Next Level
Guest: Jason Feifer, Editor in Chief of Entrepreneur Magazine
Date: January 6, 2026
Main Theme
This episode explores how to not only survive but thrive during moments of change, both in business and life. Host Heather Monahan interviews Jason Feifer—from his perspective as an entrepreneur, editor, and author—on the four phases of change that help us reach our next level. Together, they discuss why adaptation is crucial, how to navigate disruption, and the mindset needed to find new opportunity in uncertainty.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Change as a Constant State
- Permanent Beta:
- Jason emphasizes the importance of living in "permanent beta"—constantly evolving and refining oneself.
- Quote: "We should live in permanent beta... think of ourselves as a product in beta that never is finalized, is always being refined and revised." (00:47, 19:57)
2. The 4 Phases of Change
Jason’s central framework, derived from observing entrepreneurs and his own life during the pandemic:
a. Panic:
- The immediate reaction is to view change as loss.
- Example: Jason’s own move from NYC to Boulder caused a crisis of identity.
- Quote: "The first thing we do when change comes to us is we panic and try to hold on to what we had before, because we experience the change as a loss." (02:48, 06:20)
b. Adaptation:
- Forced to find new habits, skills, or routines.
- Emphasis on reframing: looking for perceived gains instead of dwelling on losses.
- Tip: Jason suggests three self-reflection questions to move through panic:
- What is the new thing I’m doing?
- What habit or skill am I building?
- How can this new skill/habit be put to good use?
- Quote: "You’re forcing yourself to at least have some kind of answer... you can start to push yourself to reframe things as change as gain." (08:17-11:09)
c. New Normal:
- Discovering new routines, gaining confidence that change can be positive.
- Example: Jason finds value in the Boulder lifestyle he initially rejected.
d. Wouldn’t Go Back:
- A point where the gains are so significant you wouldn't want to return to your old life.
- Quote: "I have something so new and valuable, I wouldn't want to go back to a time before I had it." (05:40, 19:57)
- Insight: While this is the goal, it’s also where people risk clinging too tightly to the new status quo.
3. Speed and Growth in the Change Process
- Key Question: How can we move through these phases more quickly and with intention?
- Quote: "The greatest challenge is... how fast can we move through [the phases], how efficiently, how thoughtfully?" (06:20)
4. Mindset Shifts for Navigating Change
-
Reframing Loss as Gain:
- When panic sets in, deliberately search for what’s being gained.
- Jason highlights the benefit in unexpected disruptions (e.g., kid interruptions on Zoom calls became memorable moments for audiences). (13:00)
-
Embrace Authenticity and Vulnerability:
- Stories of on-stage mishaps and business blunders show how relatability creates connection.
- Quote (Heather): "They thought it was so funny... who knew that was going to be the thing that got people fired up?" (16:21)
-
Don’t Let Self-Perceptions Limit You:
- Jason recounts advice from Malcolm Gladwell:
- "Self-perceptions are powerfully limiting." (29:25)
- Don’t define yourself too narrowly; some of your best opportunities may lie outside your current self-concept.
- Jason recounts advice from Malcolm Gladwell:
5. The Power of Transferable Identity
- Separate What You Do from Why You Do It:
- Anchor your self-worth in your intrinsic values and skills, not job titles or outputs.
- Quote: "If you identify too closely with [your job], then as soon as that changes... you are going to feel completely unmoored." (19:57)
- Example: Jason’s core: "I tell stories in my own voice." (19:57)
- Case study: Stacy London, who transitioned from TV to menopause advocacy by focusing on her core as a "truth-talker." (26:05)
6. Taking Risks and Learning from Failure
- Failure as Data:
- Use setbacks as learning points, not as fixed definitions of your potential.
- Personal stories: Jason’s “first date after 9 years” fiasco—valuable not as a failure, but as useful data on what not to do. (34:03)
- Comparison to product development: Michael Dell keeps reminders of failed projects as fuel for future success. (34:03)
- From Annie Duke: "We date ideas, date experiences—sometimes they're not for us, and that's okay. Not everything is meant to be forever." (39:00)
7. Applying the Framework to Business and Life
- The "four phases" framework is primarily for navigating career change, but also empowers listeners to manage personal changes and relationships. (33:46)
- Advice is universally relevant, especially as pandemic disruptions continue to ripple through every aspect of daily life. (41:30)
Memorable Quotes & Moments
- On the Universal Relevance of Change:
- "Everybody goes through change in four phases: panic, adaptation, new normal, and wouldn't go back." (06:20)
- Jason on Moving:
- "I came out of that experience with great new friends and some new lifestyle habits, frankly... and a sense that I had reached what I now like to call, wouldn’t go back." (02:48)
- On Vulnerability as Strength:
- Heather’s near-fall on stage became a crowd-pleasing, bonding moment. (16:21)
- On Letting Go of Labels:
- "Self-perceptions are powerfully limiting." (Malcolm Gladwell via Jason, 29:25)
- On Transferable Skills:
- "If you can identify something about yourself that is so core... that it can survive any change... then you have an orientation point whenever there's a moment of disruption." (19:57)
- On Failure:
- "We should treat failure like data... when we try something and it doesn't work out, instead of thinking this was a terrible failure, instead say, this taught me something. In fact, it taught me something that I now know better than other people." (34:03)
- On Personal Outreach:
- "The number one thing that people want is to feel heard and I want to validate that." (43:15)
Notable Segment Timestamps
- [00:47]: Jason on “permanent beta” and constant evolution
- [02:48]: The four phases of change, applied to Jason’s move to Boulder
- [05:40]: Heather’s analogy of being fired, introducing personal context
- [06:20]: Breakdown of the four phases of change
- [08:08]: How to move through the panic phase faster
- [11:09]: Reframing change, relatability of “things going wrong”
- [16:21]: Heather’s story of almost falling on stage and making it a bonding moment
- [19:57]: Why "wouldn’t go back" is the hardest and most important phase; the importance of intrinsic self-understanding
- [24:03]: Discussion on identity and core transferable strengths
- [29:25]: Advice from Malcolm Gladwell on the limits of self-perception
- [34:03]: Applying the framework to relationships; failure as data
- [41:30]: Who the book "Build for Tomorrow" is for and dealing with ongoing change
- [43:15]: The value of responding to everyone who reaches out to Jason
Actionable Takeaways
- Accept the four phases as normal—panic is common, but focus on adaptation and seeking gain.
- Reframe setbacks as growth opportunities.
- Create an identity statement based on intrinsic, transferable qualities—not just your job title.
- Allow mistakes and disruptions to humanize you and create true connections.
- Be open to living 'lanelessly'—don’t confine yourself to old self-perceptions.
- Treat failure like data, not as a dead end.
- Apply lessons from business change to relationships and personal life.
- Reach out and validate others—connection creates lasting impact.
Guest & Book Information
- Book: "Build for Tomorrow: An Action Plan for Embracing Change, Adapting Fast, and Future-Proofing Your Career"
- Find Jason Feifer:
- Website: jasonfeifer.com/book
- Instagram: @heyfeifer
- LinkedIn: Jason Feifer
By weaving together expert insight, relatable anecdotes, and actionable advice, this episode empowers listeners to become more adaptable, resilient, and confident when navigating life’s inevitable changes.