← Creative Pep Talk
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- [00:03]
Olivia Rafferty
On the creative journey, it's easy to get lost, but don't worry, you'll lift off. Sometimes you just need a Creative Pep talk.
- [00:22]
Andy J. Pizza
Hey, you're listening to Creative Pep Talk, a weekly podcast companion for your creative journey. I'm your host, Andy J. Pizza. I'm a New York Times Best selling author and illustrator and this show is just everything I'm learning about building and maintaining a thriving creative practice. Let's get into it. I'm a believer in the idea of dressing for the job you want, not the job you have. And I have applied this to my creative practice too, which means if you want professional results, you need to present online like a pro. And that means going beyond social media and having a professional website that reflects your style and looks legit. I rebuilt my site this year with Squarespace's Fluid Engine and was so happy with how easily I could build my vision without coding that when they approached me to support the show, I jumped at the chance because I love and use this product. So go check it out squarespace.com peptalk to test it out for yourself. And when you're ready to launch your site, use promo code PEP talk all one word, all caps for 10% off your first purchase. Thanks goes out to Squarespace for supporting the show and supporting creators all over the world.
- [01:53]
Olivia Rafferty
Hey, in case you don't know, we.
- [01:55]
Andy J. Pizza
Have a monthly live virtual meetup every last Monday of the month with supporters of the show from Patreon and Substack.
- [02:03]
Olivia Rafferty
We have so much fun on these.
- [02:05]
Andy J. Pizza
Calls and they are the warmest, most encouraging creatives that I have ever met and we also talk real creative practice stuff. We have authors, illustrators, lettering artists, picture book makers, fine artists, musicians and folks that work in video and film as well. And we have people that are just starting out, people super established in their creative careers and everything in between. For the rest of this year we're going to chat through our new Journey of the True Fan series, exploring questions and ways to apply these ideas to your own creative practice so that you can leave 2024 stronger than you came in with more visibility, connection with your audience and sales. Sign up to whichever suits you best@ either patreon.com creativepeptalk or andyjpizza.substack.com and I hope to see you at this month's meetup. Today's episode is a little bit different. We have an up and coming musician and listener of creative pep talk, Olivia Rafferty on the show today. Every once in a while I see someone who listens to the show, whose art I really enjoy and who is also doing something super interesting that I think all the listeners should know about, because I think there's something really juicy and interesting to learn and I think it could really impact your own creative journey. Olivia is an indie musician hailing from Northeast Scotland and whose music has been featured by BBC Radio Scotland and Folk Radio uk. To me, her music sounds like a really interesting mix of like Kitty Craft and the Sundays, if you're familiar with those two bands. This episode has some really juicy takeaways. The first one is that this is another great example of the thing that we've been talking a lot about, which is the independent spirit in your creativity. It is so easy to sit around and wait for the institutional validation that comes from getting signed or getting picked up by a publisher or getting the a prompt and a brief from a client. Like this episode is about what does it look like to be a self starter? The second thing that is that I really wanted to talk to Olivia about was that it's an incredible example of how to quit trying to find your niche in your medium, like trying to find what makes me unique as a musician or what makes me unique as an illustrator, and instead think about where are places that I belong or that I invest into, where what's unique about me is that I'm an illustrator or what's unique about my contribution to that community is that I'm a musician, for example. We're going to go deep into how Olivia has created this really interesting niche as a musician within the world of geology. Yeah, it's as surprising to me as it was to you, most likely. And there's just some really cool stuff that has come from owning that space and being the musician in that space. Her first single from the project dropped September 8, and you can learn more about the Geology album and Olivia's work@olivierafferty.com Stick until the end for a creative call to adventure called Rocket. And we're going to talk about how you can find your own niche within the communities and special hyper focuses of your own life. Let's go.
- [06:21]
Olivia Rafferty
So you were on episode 395 and you asked a question and we did a Q A episode and we shared one of your songs. And I wanted to talk about your latest project because I'm curious about like how this came about as well as I feel like it illustrates some core ideas from the show, but I wanted to see if you could give us an overview of who you are and what your creativity is all about.
- [06:53]
Yeah, so I am. My name is Olivia Rafferty. Do I have to do that? Hey.
- [06:59]
I mean, I'm going to intro you probably, but it's good to hear it in your voice.
- [07:05]
Yeah. So I'm Scottish. I'm a singer songwriter that's based in London in the uk. One of my friends actually described my songs as Wes Andersonia for the Ears, which I feel like is a great sort of comparison. So I write songs, but I think the main reason I really love doing music and stuff is I actually really enjoy the whole kind of world building around it. And outside of singing songs and writing them, you know, there's like the storytelling and the visuals. I make my own artwork for the music as well. So it's kind of like the whole package. Like, music allows me to kind of do everything that I want to do. So in 2020, I did a project called 100 Tiny Songs, which is, I think, where you first kind of stumbled across what I was doing. And in 2021 I released my first EP, which I think the 100 Tiny Songs kind of gave me like the impetus to actually do. And then. Yeah, so now I have got this album coming out in sort of singles coming out end of this year, album coming out beginning of next year, which is a concept album about geology. And it's my first full length album, my debut.
- [08:21]
That's amazing. Yeah, that feels big. Can people pre save it? I don't know really what that means, but I've heard people say that you.
- [08:32]
Can pre save it. I'm on a little bit of a tirade against Spotify at the moment, to be honest, so I'm not telling people to do that, but they can.
- [08:39]
What are you telling them to do? Sorry? You tell me. What should people do?
- [08:44]
To be honest, I would just love if people subscribe to my newsletter and then when the album comes out, go to my shows, buy my merch, buy the cd, which will be available as well. Stream me if you want, because I know so many people still use streaming, but there are other ways to engage which will also enable me to make more amazing music in the future.
- [09:06]
So I want to talk to you about the album. Typical Forever and it's a concept album. You did it. You launched it on Kickstarter. And I am not going to make a joke about how it's not a rock album, even though it's about geology. But it was right there.
- [09:21]
I mean, you would be maybe the hundredth person to make that joke because it's right there.
- [09:26]
So I'M not doing for the record. I didn't do it. I said I wasn't doing it.
- [09:31]
Andy J. Pizza
Let the record show.
- [09:34]
Olivia Rafferty
But first, I wanted to see, like, how did this come about? Like, for your first album, to be a concept album is a unique thing. And then also to kind of have a really specific focus that's also a surprising focus as a musician. So I wondered if you could talk about where this idea came from. Yeah, why don't we just start there?
- [09:57]
God, I'm gonna have to tell you, like, a short tale of woe, basically.
- [10:02]
Right.
- [10:03]
Which we all love on the pizza podcast. So I was selected, like, during the Pandemic lockdown, back in living with my parents, and I was selected to be part of this online mentorship thing. I got, like, two sessions with a mentor who has worked in music industry for years, and I thought, wow, what an amazing opportunity. Like, they're going to. And I don't know, you have this thing where you're like, oh, they're going to be like, olivia, you're so talented. I can't handle it. And I got the complete opposite in my first session. She just absolutely, like, tore me down, and rightfully so. But at the same time, when I recounted this experience to a lot of people, they were like, I don't know if you should have gone about that that harshly. I was basically told that I'd wasted years of my life. And I think that's sort of any. Any artist who hasn't reached, like, some kind of standard platform of success. Yeah, like, that is just a shot to the heart instantly.
- [11:08]
Yeah.
- [11:09]
Especially being told it by someone who you perceive to be an authority figure. So I. I don't know, in some sort of, like, masochistic moment to like, preserve how I was feeling, I, like, recorded myself, like, talking and crying after the meeting, and I was like, I need to remember how I feel in this moment.
- [11:33]
I love that you did that because I have this ADHD object permanence thing, and I have a really, really hard time accessing anything but how I feel right now. So I think that. And it's a true artist moment there. I mean, that's.
- [11:48]
It really was. And it's not like, you know, I'm going to be, like, putting up on YouTube and be like, my story, but I'm gonna. I think. I don't know, something about that was like, this is, like, one of the lowest moments you'll ever feel as an artist specifically. And I think that's often been, like, a jumping off point for doing things. And so she. We ended up doing another session together and she was sort of like, I want you to apply for some funding and I want you to start thinking about a project. And that's when I started to really kind of learn that project based work is kind of the best way to actually propel yourself and get things done. So I was like, right, what's my project gonna be? What's my project gonna be? And the whole like, you've wasted your life was like floating around in my head again and again. And being in the pandemic at the same time, I was kind of like, right, there's this concept of wasted time and time moving really slowly and feeling like there's periods of your life which have amounted to like nothing or there's stasis. Maybe it's like mental health issues, maybe it's like physical health. Maybe it's like you've been in the wrong, like living situation or relationship for a really long time and you feel stuck. How do I reconcile that for myself and for other people? And so I started reading up a lot about time and got into kind of long termism and this idea of like, you know, setting up society to basically not just think about the next four years, which we kind of tend to do, especially like in terms of politics and stuff, but think about like the next 200 years, for example. And someone recommended me a book called Timefulness by Marcia Bjornerud. And it was basically a Trojan horse for geology. And it basically just kind of explained all the general concepts of geology and made you understand this perspective that like, the, the world is old, time is long, and there are really, really long stretches where nothing happens. You know, for example, there's like, there's like a billion year period in history that scientists refer to as the boring billion because like, objectively nothing was going on apart from like the tiniest organisms just like limply floating and like slime or whatever. So I was like, I don't know, I think just the more I read and the processes of like, how mountains are formed and, you know, the ocean splitting apart and volcanoes and all this stuff and like the separation of continents and the reforming of them, I was like, wow, you know, so much of this stuff is so interesting and it's actually so relevant to like, our lives as people and, you know, it's almost like these are all. The way the world works is like a giant allegory for our own human experience. I want to share that with people. And that was sort of like my main drive. I was like, I Have to just tell people about how cool this is. So I didn't really set out to make an album from the offset. I actually ended up starting a substack where I just kind of wrote about all these thoughts and then thought, okay, I'm going to write a song as well as writing about it. So I did that over a few times, and we just kind of share the demos on my newsletter. And eventually I had got this body of work and was really trying to decide whether or not to release that or go back into 100 Tiny Songs and, like, finesse them and release that or release some regular songs. I'm saying this with, like, quotation marks, you know, about life and love. Release some regular songs about. Just regular stuff. And I spoke to somebody in the music industry, and they warned me. They were like, don't do a concept album as your first album. Which, you know, I guess if you're a pop artist would make sense.
- [15:49]
Yeah.
- [15:51]
And then I spoke to another person, and she was like, it sounds like you really want to do that, then do it. So that's. That's kind of the origin story of typical Forever, really. I just. I just went for it from that point onwards. And that was in January of 2023. I'd written it over the course of 2022. I really took my time. Like, I wasn't pressured about it.
- [16:13]
Andy J. Pizza
Yeah.
- [16:14]
Olivia Rafferty
And then I started, like, basically creating the actual album from the beginning of 2023 onwards.
- [16:22]
One thing that really resonates for me is that I felt like my illustration didn't really have. Wait until I was writing a lot and I was writing and for my blog and then my podcast. And there was something about the substance of that that started to change the. The. The weight of the illustration. And it kind of made me a fan of having these different ways of executing creatively, both in form, but also, like, metaphor versus literal versus, you know, whatever did that. It sounds like that kind of happened. Is that. Was that your experience?
- [17:03]
Yeah, it's something that, like, I try and, like, put into practice now, like, when I write, like, any song, like, I'll do some free writing. And that normally kind of, like, gets me, like, deeper into the idea. I find that, like, I would kind of write these essays and then the essays. I think normally the essays kind of came after the songs or, like. I don't know. I don't know if it was, like, what came first, you know?
- [17:26]
Andy J. Pizza
Sure.
- [17:28]
Olivia Rafferty
But they were definitely, like. I wanted each song to kind of have a real grounding to it and a Real world and a real like, approachability for like anyone coming from any angle. I wanted them to understand the story behind the song, whether it's the geological story or the personal experience. And that would really basically make them connect with the subject. I mean, for example, I've. I've got a song called Fossils, which is about how objects in our life like. And I always think about this like sparkly hoodie that I made my dad order off of Forever 21 when I was like 15 and Forever 21 did not exist in the UK at all. And blessing me, I think he paid like about 50 pounds for it to get here. Like this really crappy hoodie, baby. Beautiful. And I loved that hoodie so much. And it was really kind of emblematic of like my late teens. I would wear it to parties and stuff and it's gone. I have no idea where it is now. It's just kind of lost into that sort of detritus of your life. Yeah, there's so many objects like that. And like, you know, your favorite like CDs or like albums that you had when you were a teenager or whatever, they all kind of disappear at some point. Like fossils, you know, like certain dinosaurs that aren't around anymore or like the Ammonites and stuff. And even though they're not with you, they are part of your bedrock as a human being.
- [18:53]
Yeah.
- [18:54]
And so I told the story on my newsletters, like specifically about like this, the band Billy Talent I was like really into as a teenager. And I remember feeling so sad because I had this like future nostalgia about how I wouldn't have a crush on the lead singer anymore. When I was older. I was like, oh, he's so handsome. But one day when I grew up, I'm not going to fancy him anymore. And I just had this real sort of sense of, I don't know, just like this awareness of the future coming at me and knowing that something I love now will not be a major part of my life anymore. But it, you know. So I wrote about that and also presented a demo of the song as well because I wanted people to really connect with the emotional human side of it as well as the geology side.
- [19:44]
That's. I love that idea. Especially as someone that has. Is so prone to hyper focuses. That's a very. It's almost. I love that you kind of romanticized it because I'm tempted to do the opposite when I as I've gone through so many phases. I mean, it's helped me not to take myself so seriously, but it's also made me less romantic about my interest to where I'm like, yeah, you're obsessed with this right now, but guess what? In three years you're not going to give a shit. So yeah, does it matter? Like, that's my nihilistic side. So I like that. I like that kind of there's a romance to also just being in it. And I think that's really cool.
- [20:34]
Andy J. Pizza
You know the other thing I was.
- [20:35]
Olivia Rafferty
Going to say, I love that you went for the concept album because one of the things that I've, you know, when I first started getting into storytelling, which is kind of what I really love in creativity, I got really obsessed with. I think at the time I felt like people were really anti stories having a message or having a meaning. This was like maybe 15 years ago, something like that. And every like. But I was really obsessed with like allegory and how, how when you have a story that has a super poignant.
- [21:24]
Andy J. Pizza
Thing that you build everything around, it.
- [21:26]
Olivia Rafferty
Tends to work better. Now, I'm not saying that that's a rule, but it tends to work better. Then fast forward to now and we have so many things like Barbie and you know, Soul from Pixar where the meaning is on top of the symbol.
- [21:44]
Andy J. Pizza
And for.
- [21:45]
Olivia Rafferty
For a minute I was like, yes, that's what I. Because I've been like so obsessed. And then now I'm like, we like, we're losing the symbol, which is the metaphor, which is the what, where I think the power comes from of a story. And so one of the things that, you know, this idea of like using things like fossils and geology and rocks and all this is like these are like really archetypal things, are things that like are a thing in our mind of like, what are these? And it feels so. I've been like really hoping that music would swing back that way because so many songwriters, a lot of the most famous songwriters right now, they're all like the slice of life or like the particular, like my friend Sam and me at the dollar store, like so literal and I, you know, I think it's just a. It's not a good or bad. It's just kind of a swings back and forth. So hearing you talk about that is so satisfying because I'm like, I want some of that. I want more of that.
- [22:54]
Yeah, yeah. Do you mean like sort of. I don't know, it's kind of like going general but not like spoon feeding stuff to people, I think. I mean, I have my own thing with pop music at the moment where I find, like. I don't know if it's a. I think it definitely is a kind of. I'm gonna say radio one thing. And in the uk that is like the mainstream, right? The mainstream pop music. I think a lot of people are making songs about like, how bad they feel right now, which I'm like, yeah, it's part of like the general collective consciousness, but there's this kind of new awareness of like anxiety and stuff. But, like, I think a lot of people are cashing in on that as well. And so it's like we're walking down the street listening to songs which are going, I hate myself and I don't know what to do. Like, I don't know. I. I think, like, I. I like things to be like, parceled up in a way where it's kind of like you listen to the song but. And you get a feeling of what it's about. But you might not necessarily like be hit over the head with it. Yeah, all the time. I mean, like, I think that's how I like my art and how I like my stories anyway. You know, it's like, don't. Don't tell me what it's about. Let me feel it before I know it.
- [24:09]
And it's a hard time to do. That's a frustration that I have even when going to make books, like, feeling like, you know, we're in the time with the short form video where you have to tell me what is the point of this in the first 0.2 seconds. We all know, like, art, the best art is not like you don't really. Maybe you're attracted to it, it's mysteriously attractive and you don't really.
- [24:38]
Andy J. Pizza
Maybe you never know what it's about, but.
- [24:40]
Olivia Rafferty
But maybe 10 years later you know what it's about for you at least, you know, so it's. Yeah, it's. It's. That's a. It's a difficult thing to navigate.
- [24:50]
You're going on Tik tok being like, did I write the children's book of the summer? You gotta do that.
- [24:57]
Yeah. Oh, God. Okay, so. And then the title. Where's the title come from?
- [25:02]
The title comes from this book. Sorry, I'm just seeing if I can see it on my shelf. It's by a guy called. Oh God, Malcolm Something is his last name. It's from a book called Hottense and it's by guy called Malcolm Something and he basically has this amazing quote where it's like. It's talking about the, like the uniformity principle which is basically what kind of like, the science of geology and, like, the investigation of it is based on. And that is basically, we have to come up with, like, a general rule and understanding that the way that the world works now in terms of, like, really basic processes like gravity and it's raining and water erodes rocks and all that kind of stuff is how everything happened. Like, how the world has always kind of like, that's been the rules of the world for the last 4.6 billion years.
- [25:56]
Yeah.
- [25:57]
And so he says something like, what we see around us is typical Forever and has no difference from the past. And I really like that because I sort of found that it was, you know, it kind of said pretty much the main message of the album for me, which is, you know, the way the world works is typical Forever. It's always been that way. The way we react and interact with each other and exist as humans. We've kind of been. We have the same drives, the same emotions, the same feelings as we have, like, in the past. And even. Even in, like, the past of our own lives. It doesn't have to be in the last, like, 18 million years or something. And it's also how we are is typical of how the planet is as well. Like, life is just life, whether it is like a person, a fly, like the Earth, like Mount Everest or whatever. Like, we all kind of go through processes which are kind of similar, really. And, you know, I sort of, like, went through a different. My boyfriend really wanted rock music or something like that, I don't think. No. And you'll probably get mad if I say that, but, you know, people were like, why don't you just do, like, you know, rock music? But I, you know, don't want to give people the wrong idea because it's more sort of like, folksy Americana type stuff. But, yeah, I just thought Typical Forever was a really good summation of the themes.
- [27:26]
Yeah, yeah, that's really. It kind of leads me all over the place. I like the idea of. It reminds me of, like, the white light refracting into the rainbow. Like, all of these, it's all just, like, the universe being one thing and kind of working in the same rule book. And it kind of evolves in these different formations. When you started doing this project, both in just the creative aspect, choosing to do the concept, choosing this as your debut, and to focus on this instead of the other pile of songs that you had, and then also, like, launching it on Kickstarter. What were you afraid of when you were doing that? I'VE launched two Kickstarters. I don't know about you, but I know the day. But the whole time planning, I'm like, this is going to be sweet, like, boom, boom, boom. We're going to do all this stuff and then the day we're doing it, I'm like, oh my God, no, this is, it's so vulnerable. I feel like if you've never done one, you don't know how, it doesn't really matter.
- [28:32]
Andy J. Pizza
Where you are in your career is.
- [28:33]
Olivia Rafferty
A super vulnerable thing. So, yeah, just in any of that, what were you kind of afraid of?
- [28:39]
Yeah, well, I mean, especially with the Kickstarter, you're kind of asking like your friends and family to put like a monetary value next to like how much they care about your art.
- [28:47]
Yeah.
- [28:48]
Which is insane. But so going into this project, I really think that, like, there were a few things that I maybe should have like been bothered by, but, like, I wasn't. And the main fear that I had was actually just like, how do I get the resources to do this? How do I manage? Because, like, making an album, I don't know, I really can't compare like what I do to other art forms because for me, I have a very one dimension. Well, not a very one dimensional, but I have like a kind of one dimensional view of like, oh, if you're a book writer, you write a book and obviously it's like you also need a publisher and an editor and da, da, da, da, da. And like, if you're painting pictures, you're painting them. But like, if you're recording an album, you need a lot of people involved with a lot of different skills. Like, you know, it's like I'm going to be singing the songs, I'm going to be playing acoustic guitar in the songs and piano and doing the backing vocals. But hey, I need a studio to get inside to actually record this. I need engineers in that studio, I need a mixing engineer, I need mastering and I also need the bloody money to start everything. So at that point I had done an EP and I'd pretty much done it like with one producer and then taken that away, finished it off myself, and then randomly found a good pal of mine on Instagram who ended up mixing the project for me. And it was very limited team and I knew that I was going to have to expand for this project because it was like on a much larger scale. And I also wanted to work with different people because I feel like I need to take those opportunities to kind of expand my network and expand the kind of people that I'm working with in order to, like, produce something like, bigger every time.
- [30:33]
Yeah.
- [30:33]
So I just had absolutely no clue. And I had been applying. I'd done like, a project with a friend where we had written songs based off of, like, Craigslist posts. And we had tried to like, make an, like, some funding bids with like, a couple of organizations based in the uk and we'd been rejected from two different, like, major organizations. And in the uk, you're kind of like, well, that's it. Like, if I don't get money from help musicians. No, I don't get money from PRs, which are incredibly competitive, especially if you live in London, because they want to spread their money out across the whole country. So, you know, if there's like 2,000, like, musicians in London, they're going to go, well, you know, would rather give, like money to people who live in bloody Derby and like Inverness or something, you know. So I was sort of like, how. How do I make these people care about, like, what I'm doing? Like, and I'm an early career artist. I've not made this incredible piece of work which is going to blow everyone's minds. Like, my track record on Spotify so far as, like, this EP that I've done. And it's really beautiful, but it's not like, you know, Sabrina Carpenter levels or whatever. Not that I'm trying to be her, but you just sort of really worried about, like, the quality of the work and what you're kind of presenting and that faith that people need to have in you to give you the money or join the project before they've actually seen you leveling up, I think, if that makes any sense. So, yeah, I was just scared about getting the resources and also I think so, I mean, I'll quickly tell you about, like, how I basically got the initial start was not through the Kickstarter, but from. I emailed a geologist essentially, who I'd gone on a walk with in London, and they took us through London and kind of pointed out what all the different buildings, what rocks they were made of and where all the rocks came from. It was like, this building comes from North Dakota, this building comes from China. It was amazing. So I emailed her and she said, well, you know, there's actually. The Geologists association in the UK has a fund called the Curry Fund, which is about supporting projects which promote public engagement and awareness of geology. This would be really good. And what I didn't know was she was actually on the board and so she was like, oh, you're fine, you'll get in. And so I spent a lot of time writing a funding application, and they gave me enough money to get into the studio, basically, which was amazing. Which really was that first burst of, okay, I can do this. And I don't know, I felt like I duped them a bit because, like, my application wasn't being reviewed by people in the music industry. They were like geologists sitting around a table going, oh, that'll be lovely. And so it was so much easier to kind of sneak that past them. I mean.
- [33:31]
Yeah, I mean that one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you was that maybe the number one reason was that. So in the first half of my career, I was constantly thinking about, okay, what makes me different as an illustrator rather than what makes me different as a podcaster is that I'm an illustrator. Or what makes me different as someone who likes psychology is that I'm an illustrator. And I feel like imposter syndrome will stop you from going into those rooms, but you become the most interesting person to them in that room because everybody else is doing what they're doing.
- [34:09]
Yeah.
- [34:09]
And I honest, I think it's such a good hack for creatives.
- [34:13]
Yeah. I mean, like, having gone to, like, a music college and playing gigs in front of other musicians, there is nothing more soul destroying because they're all sitting there going, oh, see you at night.
- [34:23]
I wouldn't have.
- [34:25]
So if you're in a situation where, like, you're the one musician and, you know, I did this, I went to. I've now played the Yorkshire Fossil Festival twice.
- [34:35]
That's so cool.
- [34:36]
As their sort of musician in residence. And, you know, people go, wow, you're incredible. And I'm thinking, oh, I really flubbed that chord. Da, da, da. They don't see that. They see someone who's got this incredible skillset that they don't have. And it just makes, like, the whole experience of, like, that festival, for example, so much richer because everyone's bringing their own creative interpretation of the theme, as it were.
- [35:01]
Yeah, I love that. And then also, you know, you get the thing of just. Just like you said, there's a competitiveness to the people that are in your industry, and what ends up happening is you can really connect with people without that, and you have this shared excitement, but also mutual respect. And it's just. It's something I don't see creative people do a lot. And I was really excited when I saw you digging into this in a significant way again. That Was not a pun. No, I don't do puns. But the other thing I just wanted to call out real quickly was I think there's another really cool example of you doing this 100 song project prior to this. That's a huge testament to this notion of not waiting for people, especially for people in the music world. Almost every musician I've ever talked to and I get.
- [36:00]
Andy J. Pizza
I'm not a musician, so I can't understand.
- [36:03]
Olivia Rafferty
Yeah.
- [36:03]
But I love your project because I think everyone can record a bad, like a. Not a bad, but low recording, like.
- [36:13]
A low five recording somewhere.
- [36:16]
I'm just saying you can throw something on where. Because so many musicians, and for good reason know that it's a collaborative thing, it's an expensive thing to really get in the game. But if you let that stop you from making songs, recording stuff, writing stuff, you're going to be, you're never going to be ready to go do, to go into the studio. And so your journey is really inspiring in that level too.
- [36:39]
Thank you. I mean, like, I just think about like the artists that I really, really love.
- [36:44]
Yeah.
- [36:44]
And it's like, like Daniel Johnson, Stefan Merritt of the Magnetic Fields. Like.
- [36:50]
Yeah.
- [36:51]
David Byrne and like, you know, people like, who just make stuff where it's like you can tell the song comes out no matter what the recording medium is. Yeah. Because they've just written a beautiful song. And when, when I did 100 tiny songs, like, I recorded everything on my iPhone and like, you know, I even had a microphone at one point. I made a point of not doing it through the microphone. Like, I literally would just hold my voice notes up to my face and hold it to the Casio keyboard I was working on and I'd like put it together in the, like in door, like in Ableton. But at the same time it was like I wanted to take all the preciousness away from it because it would be fun and like, I really just like wanted to have fun because for me, I think that's also like a big part of like my creative practice. Like, and I've tried, I've tried to be serious. Like, I've tried to be like the Phoebe Bridgers of Scotland. And you know what? It, like, it didn't really fly because it wasn't who I am. Like, I like to have fun. Like, I like to make silly songs about, like, toothpaste and like buying milk and, you know, all this kind of stuff. And, you know, I feel like there's still like a life for 100 tiny songs. And I'm not quite sure how. And if I had like another, you know, not a pandemic, hopefully, but another like, stretch of time where nothing happens, I would love to do the project again and see what comes of it. But it was an incredibly valuable process for like, honestly, it was just like loosening things, like, just loosening that like constriction you feel around production value and stuff. And like, yeah, one of those songs became Happy New Year, which you played on one of your episodes. It was honestly just like a really good exercise in basically sitting down and sketching, which I think is something that not a lot or personally as a songwriter, I don't do every day.
- [38:46]
Yeah.
- [38:47]
And I think probably a lot of artists wouldn't say that they do it every day as well either because you think you've got so much going on. But if you. Yeah, that. That exercise of making myself make something every day, it became like a diary and like a sketchbook. And yeah, also like one other thing like, about that which kind of made me sort of gave me like a real good idea of what I wanted to do going forward was I finally had something to talk to people about when it came to my work. Yeah, I, you know, I could approach and I think for me for such a long time I felt like I couldn't approach anyone, like approach people I admired or approach like, you know, people who could maybe help me out because I didn't have anything going on. Whereas I could then turn to anybody and say, hi, I'm Olivia. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Oh, by the way, I'm working on this. You can literally go see it happen real time and engage with it. And it actually, like gave me so much confidence to just approach people because I was like, I've got a work in progress that you can see right now. Something is happening with me There's a talking point now all the newness has faded and useless oceans Away from the place I call home the years dread, calm they all cry to the top of that mountain Wind and rain make a beautiful fountain and tumble down at the ground.
- [40:34]
I run.
- [40:37]
I'll run away ca.
- [41:13]
I was thinking through like book projects for creative pep talk related material. And one of my ideas is creative projects as a. I realize, like as I'm going back through, we're about to hit 10 years. So I'm like kind of in a reflective space and thinking about like through line. One of the biggest through lines is just projects project based approach to creativity. I literally probably have at least a book's worth of stuff to say about it. So I'm not going to do that now.
- [41:44]
Andy J. Pizza
But.
- [41:45]
Olivia Rafferty
But part of it is just kind of what you just said, which is it has this level of ownership where at any point you can do a project. There's no, no one has to say yes to that. And all of a sudden you're at the party and people are like, what are you up to? I'm like, well, I've got this project. And you're like, oh, it's a project now. It's like liter, just, you know, doing your little thing in your room. But it's so empowering. And there's so many other great aspects of a project, but yeah, I love that component of it. The other thing I was going to say was I loved what you said about. I can't help but underline things that I think are really juicy and interesting. So for me, when you were talking about the songwriting bit, I was thinking about this the other day. I hadn't listened to Passion Pit in a long time. Like, it's, you know, it's been a long time, but I was listening to the really good running music and I was listening to them yesterday and on this particular version, the end has like these acoustic strip back versions of their songs. And I just thought just what you were saying. Like, for me, it came up this idea of the coffee versus the cup is the way I usually talk about it, like the essence versus the packaging and that the songwriting for most people, like you were saying, you know, Dana Johnson and David Byrne and like the song could be expressed in a bunch of ways. Often the way it gets expressed, the cup you put it in has to do with the time, the era, all kinds of different things. But underneath it is something really timeless. And that's Things like the 100 Day Project with music is such an example of or writing or whatever, almost all types of creativity. There's an essence that you could practice in almost any circumstance.
- [43:45]
Yeah.
- [43:46]
And that is even though the packaging does sometimes make or break something, that the essence is the thing that matters. And you can always be kind of developing, crafting, and enjoying doing that, you know?
- [44:01]
Absolutely. Yeah, I agree. I. I'm just gonna say I agree. Yeah.
- [44:08]
I just got a little bit excited there to talk about that aspect of it. And so. Okay, so were you, before you launched it, were you worried about, like, okay, this is pretty specific. Like, what are people gonna think about an album about rocks? Like, what, what, you know, what were those, the fears that were coming up or what.
- [44:29]
When you're talking about the Kickstarter.
- [44:31]
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [44:33]
I. I had already kind of gathered, like, a bit of excitement about the project because the Geologists association had kind of pushed it out to their audience of geologists.
- [44:45]
Yeah.
- [44:45]
And I had already performed at Yorkshire Fossil Festival at that point because someone got in touch with me through my newsletter about. So I already had, like, quite a bit of, like, support from that, the geology community, the rocks community. And I also, like, here, here's one. Here's an interesting thing because I had actually been talking about this project for, like, the last, like, year. Like, the last year, basically, you know, I started. I decided to, you know, I started talking about geology in 2022. I had written all the songs over that period and was talking about it on my newslet, then got the funding in, like, March 2023. And I was talking about it, talking about it, talking about it. And part of me was like, oh, my God, have I, like, ruined this for everyone? I've been talking about this album for two years now. Like, that's insane. That is like a very not Beyonce move to make. But I think when you're an independent artist, you need to do things differently. And through talking about it so much, I built up this audience so that by the time I came to do the Kickstarter, everyone was, like, so on board because they knew how much this meant to. And they knew what the songs were going to be about, like, vaguely. And they were so excited. I finally, you know, got to reveal the album cover. I spent. I spent a lot of time looking on Kickstarter, though, and I think before I made the decision to do a Kickstarter, I was worried about how successful the project would be. And then when I went on to Kickstarter and I looked at all the projects that had been, like, funded, especially the music ones, I was like, oh, they all got funded. And the ones that didn't get funded are missing really huge, crucial chunks, or they're asking for way too much or they're asking for nothing. And I was like, I can present something which is going to work. Like, I can. I know I can. So I wasn't scared, I think. I think I was kind of scared about, like, maintaining the momentum. And for me, like, purely from, like, a, like, energetic posting on social media place, like, I am very, like, on and off when it comes to social media. Like, I go through periods where I'm like, you know, just like, going nuts on stories and what have you. And then, like, there are periods, for example, right now, I've scheduled everything for the week and I don't want to bloody look at it.
- [47:17]
Yeah. So I get like, that.
- [47:19]
I really. I really can't be, like, consistent. But I did write out, like, every post I was going to make. I wrote out, like, every email I was going to send and I tried to draft as much as I could, but the response, like, just blew me out the water. Like, we got the project fully funded in five days and, like, it was over 50% funded in the first day. And I was really, really like, I have gotta get that. The special mark was like, if you do 30% in the first day, you're good. And I was like, gotta get to 30, gotta get to 30. And it was like 11 o'clock and I'm like, oh, God. Just like, no thoughts, just watching the numbers go up and up and up. And, you know, if there's like a dry period, I'm thinking it's all over. But it happened. And it happened because a lot of, like, people I knew, like family and friends, were like, so aware of the project that they contributed. People that I thought might contribute, like, maybe didn't contribute. But then people who I never thought would, like, toss anything my way, like random people from the past, you know, like these, like, spectres, like, would come up and it's like, put a little bit of money in the pot and it was incredible. And it really connected me with so many people that I hadn't kind of been in touch with for a while as well.
- [48:34]
Yeah.
- [48:36]
And like. Oh, I was going to say one more thing. I think it was just. Yeah, it was an amazing marketing tool as well.
- [48:44]
Yeah.
- [48:45]
Because I got selected as one of their Kickstarter projects we love a few days in, and that kind of pushed it to a lot of people's desktops. There are some people who are just on Kickstarter to be on Kickstarter and support things. And I think my. I do think, and like, part of me, I think from now on is kind of going to go more concepty, like, with albums in the future. Because I think if it was like, Olivia Rafferty writes songs about heartbreak and Love, you'd be like, nah, I'm okay, actually.
- [49:16]
Andy J. Pizza
Who doesn't?
- [49:17]
Olivia Rafferty
Okay.
- [49:18]
Yeah.
- [49:19]
So I think having like, that kind of edge really drew a lot of people in who were just kind of passing by on the web website, you know.
- [49:28]
Yeah.
- [49:29]
So it really liking it was. It was honestly, like such a beneficial, like, thing all around. Thankfully, I got a lot of fears out just by being so meticulous with the planning stage. And double checking, like showing the page to like family and friends like a week before, like telling everyone I was going to do this a week before as well. Like, I really decided against the whole surprise. I wanted to give people as much lead up as possible because I am not someone with a massive platform. I had like 250 subscribers to my newsletter and just a thousand followers on Instagram. And I raised £4,500 in five. Like in. Well, in 30 days. I raised £3,500 in five days.
- [50:15]
So yeah, it's, it's amazing. And I think there's so many good little takeaways. I love the thing you said about not being Beyonce and not doing the drop because I think we look at that gets so much fanfare and attention that we all think that I'm gonna blow them away with this thing. But you don't realize like that you, you're not Beyonce, I'm not Beyonce. We can't just do that. And actually the talking about it, letting people be companions on the journey gets investment. And then also you just realize like, nobody's paying attention to you closely enough. Like the 80th time you said it is the first time that they clocked that you were doing a thing. Absolutely. And so I think that that's just really essential. And I, the other thing I put down was I think it's great for people to hear about Kickstarter as presale and a PR thing as a way to just create momentum and kind of the scarcity of like this is happening right now, so you have to pay attention. There's all. And then also just the different ways that it gets on different radar. And the other thing I'll just highlight is I. The thing about, oh, okay, maybe it is about heartbreak and love, but you know, on, on the surface it has this other specificity. And I think that a lot of people don't realize that most things that take off start with a die hard core audience that were appealed to through a specific niche. That said, this is what this is about and you already know you like that. And then they fall in love with it from the packaging, but then they get into the coffee, they get into the essence and like, oh, this is great. Even like the podcast is the same. Where I started out, it's always been a creative podcast. But being an illustrator first, before I was an author, a lot of people thought it was an illustration podcast. And then a lot of people were telling their friends or music who are musicians and writers, like, you should listen to it. I think you would like it. It. It's, you know, something beyond that. And the same happened as we moved into, like, it being more of a creative thing. And now, you know, I think the latest review on Apple is from a psychologist. And we have a lot of people from all over the place that don't think of themselves as traditional creators. And so I think that's a great. It's a really. It's a counterintuitive idea to try to appeal to a small group of people in it, but it's really powerful.
- [52:52]
It is. It really is. And it is just like that, man. Like, I have made friends with, like, people who are specifically, like, geology, Like, Earth science, Like, influencers.
- [53:05]
Yeah, yeah.
- [53:06]
On Instagram and stuff. And, like, there's just some really lovely people who have been, like, so supportive of the project. And, like, it is that thing where it's like. And I. And I think, like, sometimes you need to, like, people who are consumers need to give, like, this grace period to kind of get into a piece of work. And it is about that particular entry point, you know, like, if the concept is interesting and stuff, like, I'm not gonna get people by, like, playing my song or like, on TikTok and being like, song of the summer, you know, because people are going to be like, oh, okay, whatever, flick on to the next thing. Like, people have to hear it a lot and people have to be, like, engaged from the off. And like, unfortunately, like, I'm not going to get people engaged if I'm just, like, standing kind of like authentically me wearing jeans and a T shirt, just saying, this is a song.
- [53:56]
Yeah.
- [53:57]
You know, like, the only way I'm going to get people engaged if they're like, oh, this is an intriguing topic. I want to. How could you possibly write, like, a song about geology or whatever? And then they listen to it and they might listen to it again. They might listen to again, and then it becomes like a part of their playlist or, like, their favorite song of the moment or something. You need, especially with music, might not be the same with visual because you see everything in one go, but with music, you need to give people time and you need to create ways for, like, people to, like, be given time to like your song.
- [54:32]
Yeah, that's so much a part of, like, what we like in terms of music, I think especially is just. Just that repeat thing makes it meaningful and you have experiences where you connect it to other things. But the other thing that comes to mind is, as we're talking, like, obviously a lot of times on the show, we're talking about creative practice, trying to, like, the stuff that happens around your work and ways to get it out there, etc. But I noticed, like, as you were talking about connecting to people in this field, I just realized, like, oh, there's a part of me that is also selling it to creative people, like, making these connections. Like, I have really interesting connections with people in psychology. Like, and I realized, like, oh, part of what I'm doing by trying to encourage people to put a serious investment into their interests and not be afraid to make niche things because it'll help your creative practice or creative business or whatever. I realized, like, oh, part of that is like a bait and switch for me because I'm like, the truth is the real value is the connection. Like, these people are probably interesting people and you're having this, like, human, like, this experience that, yeah, sure, it's good for your, you know, momentum or whatever, but it's also just like, rich life. Like, it sounds cool to talk to these people.
- [56:03]
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's kind of that thing where it's like, I don't know sometimes because I do, like, I write a lot of my newsletter as well about, like, creativity and stuff. And it kind of sometimes feels that you're like, it's not for you. It's not for you. If you're like an estate agent, forget about it. But, you know, it is. It is for everyone. I think being creative is like a very human thing. The other day, I was literally just thinking about, like, my school friends. Those are those. Those are them that have grown up to do jobs which aren't creative, you know, like practicing law or, like, you know, journalists or whatever, and they're. I was just like, reminiscing about, like, back at school where, like, one of them had, like, written a song and printed up the lyrics and wanted us to, like, read it. Or the other one who used to, like, post poetry on her Bebo, which was like a MySpace for the UK, you know, like, and all these kind of, like little sort of like, attempts as teenagers to just kind of express themselves and put them out there. And it's like you kind of. I don't know, sometimes I think you're at fault of, like, discounting, like, people that you don't see as creative. You know, where it is, like, this is for everybody and it is about connecting, Connecting to yourself and connecting to other people.
- [57:16]
Yeah. One last question. Before you started the Hundred Song project and then this project, so all the way back then, what do you think you got wrong about what it looked like to have a creative practice around making music? Like, what. What's the big, biggest shift in your approach or mindset from today versus then?
- [57:41]
I think it is like, the trying to figure out what the path is and who is the. I mean, I always, like, just think about your storming the castle analogy, you know, where it's like, I'm walking down the major path. I'm getting to, like, the guards and the henchmen being like, I would like a music career, please. And they're going, forget about it. You know, and then I have to kind of go around. I spent so long, truly, deeply wishing for a mentor to, like, come out of the sky and stand in front of me and go, olivia, you want to be Olivia Rafty, the singer songwriter? I'm going to tell you exactly how to do it. Come with me. Take my hand. Let's go. And you don't have to think about it. And that is what I was waiting for. I actually got, like, kind of mentorship when I finished music college with one of my old teachers, and it ended up being incredibly unhelpful, just because we weren't, like, a good fit. I was trying to do what he wanted me to do. I was trying to write pop songs for Capital FM and was just dragging myself down in the process. And I think when someone. I think it is, like, I need a broad range of input from people. I remember doing, like, I think I did, like, a reel or something on Instagram about this, where it's like, I need, like, a lot of advice from a lot of different places, and then I'm going to take 25% of this advice, 50% of this advice, 70%, like, of that advice. I'm never going to take somebody's advice. 100%.
- [59:21]
Yeah.
- [59:22]
But I am going to take what I know in my gut works for me from people that I respect. And some people who get it wrong, like, I still will take a little bit from them, but, like, I'll just take less.
- [59:37]
Yeah.
- [59:38]
You know, like, nobody is an authority. And I've realized that, like, I am my own authority on myself, and I've got so much that I can learn from other people. But at the end of the day, like, I. And I think a lot of creative people have, like, the. I mean, it's probably why you started the process. It's like you probably wanted someone to tell you what to do, and you became that person for yourself, you know?
- [60:02]
Yeah.
- [60:03]
It is that thing where it's Like I think in kind of telling ourselves what to do, we help other people. And that advice will be taken 50, like 75% or whatever from other people. But it is about feeling safe enough to become your own authority on your practice.
- [60:20]
Yeah, I think that is really brilliant. Completely true. I think that there's no substitute for discernment and testing. That is all you have. And it doesn't matter who's telling you what they're telling you, they're not on your path. And it gets to this thing of the pathless path idea that you hear and kind of mystic tradition of like there is no person that has lived what you're going to live or can do what you're going to do or. And you're going to have to make it up too.
- [60:58]
Yeah. And I'll say this one thing as well, actually. Like, I realized that the way I got things done was like, do a bit of research, make an educated guess guess and then do that. Like you're never going to get the exact set of steps, but if you make an educated guess, it'll take you somewhere, you know, and it's like, it's kind of like, I don't know, you're thinking, right, how can I make a beautiful puppet of a cat? I don't know. And you know, you get all these cardboard box and you make a cat shape and you know, it's not like, you know, the tried and true practice from like the cat puppetry school in Milan or whatever, but you've done it and you make this like shitty looking cat and then everyone goes, wow, how original. What a beautiful cat. You know, it's like you just do what you can with what you've got and in that in itself is original and authentic to you.
- [61:52]
And that is exactly what. It's maybe the most powerful aspect of a project for me, which is it is the ability to test a hypothesis. It is the ability to test an educated guess. You take all the advice, hopefully you get, you know, people in your life that are somewhat mentors, but realizing that nobody knows, including you, you'll never know until after it's over. And so the project has this thing of here's a start, here's an end, and then you can reassess and the things you got right, you could double down on and you know, all that kind of thing. And that's. Yeah. And I love, I feel like you're such a great illustration, your work is such a great illustration of how this can apply in music and create forward momentum in a Space that feels. I don't know about how you feel as a musician, but it is a difficult space to do anything.
- [62:54]
It's expensive and it's lonely, even though it's very collaborative as well. I mean, I think all creative practices are kind of like. There is a period where you're feeling quite isolated, and it's sort of of a medium which is getting more and more devalued by the day for a whole bunch of different reasons, really. But then there's just, like, this. I find after, like, deleting my Spotify account and going back to buying albums and stuff, I just felt, like, good again, and I just started connecting with music again and, like, you know, going to shows, buying the merch, buying the CDs and the cassettes, whatever, like, really connecting with people that you love and, like, connecting with the artists that you love, rather than just like, sitting on, like, a Spotify playlist and being fed Drake, like, 20 times over. You know, it's like, it's. It's a beautiful thing. Like, musicians create worlds, and it's a beautiful thing to be able to do.
- [63:54]
Yeah. And I'll. I'll just add one other thing, which I came across a quote from William Blake that says I must create a system or be enslaved by another man's. And I just think that that is. I think that that's a really difficult. I think there's great. You can find models, you can find mentors, you can have really good guesses. But ultimately, the whole idea is that you would make up your own. Yeah. And it's tricky. Well, thank you for doing this. This was extremely interesting. Fascinating and enlivening to go into a totally different creator's headspace. And I. Yeah, I just. I'm really grateful for you generously sharing your story.
- [64:44]
No, thank you. Honestly, like, this is kind of. I think I maybe wrote down at one point in some goal. Listen. Get on the creative pep talk podcast. Because you've. You've been, like, such a. Just, like, a wonderful kind of guide, I think, to like, so many people and really kind of, like, you know, showing rather than telling when it comes to making stuff and building a creative career. And, yeah, it's honestly, like, you have been just, like. Just through, like, tiny bits of support here and there. I felt like you've been such a champion of my work, and I've really. I'm really appreciative. I'm really appreciative.
- [65:25]
Thank you. Thanks. I really appreciate you. Well, good luck with the album cycle. I think it's called I hope it.
- [65:36]
Goes, oh, shall I give you an exciting date? I mean, yeah, tell us the date.
- [65:41]
And where to go and all that.
- [65:43]
I'm not quite sure when this podcast is going to come out, so I'm going to say August 9th is when the first single is coming out. It's called Earthquake Room. It's about the earthquake simulator at the Natural History Museum and a date I went on there. And then we've got the next single, Cascade, which is about sedimentary cycle and rocks tumbling down the mountainside that is coming out early October. The album itself will be out in March 2025. We've got four singles leading up to it in total. And yeah, it's, there's going to be a lot of like behind the scenes stuff that I'll share in the stories of the songs and things on my newsletter as well on Substack. So it's going to be a juicy few months coming.
- [66:28]
What's your substack called?
- [66:29]
It's. It's called A Constellation, but if you look up Olivia Rafferty on Substat, that that's pretty much my handle there. And I'm there every Thursday for better or for worse.
- [66:42]
Awesome. Thank you.
- [66:44]
Thank you. We met in the museum. I never understood what drew me to you holding your hand in the earthquake A man felt immortal Massive.
- [67:05]
Andy J. Pizza
Thanks to Olivia Rafferty. You can go follow Olivia on Instagram at Olivier Underscore Rafferty R A F F E R T Y on Instagram. She's also on Substack and you can find her website@oliviarafferty.com where you can find her releases and music and learn more about her. I think that I was really excited to have her on the show. We've, we've had a clip of her on the show in a previous previous episode because another really great project that I think really illustrates some of the ideas from the show, but applied into this different medium of music is her project of 100 tiny songs where she made 100 tiny songs and a project that she worked on from 2020 to 2021 where every day for 100 days she would write a new song and she couldn't spend a ton of time on it. It had to be less than one minute. And I just think it's such a creative example of how some of these principles we talk about every week can be applied to whatever medium you create in. I'm super inspired by her work in this geology space and with that I'm going to leave you with A quick CTA that we're going to call Rocket. How can you rock it within your medium when it's so freaking noisy out there? When there are so many people and so much steep competition? How do you even have a chance? I think you don't. I think you gotta pack it up and move into. Move out of your little sphere of designers or illustrators or filmmakers and go serve other audiences. Go make your niche, not the little tiny difference and competitive advantage you have against all the other people that do what you do, and go do what you do in a place where no one else does it. For me personally, that looks like stepping into the worlds of psychology and Jungian thought or going into the world of podcasting. You know, I've talked about this a lot on the show, where some of the best opportunities and most interesting jobs I've ever had have come from going to podcasting festivals and making connections there. Because guess what? At an illustration conference, I'm one of hundreds of people live illustrating the conference. But when I did that at the On Air Fest, which is an audio conference podcasting festival, I was the only one doing that. And it helped me stand out and get projects and get opportunities. And the next time I went, I got to emcee a half of the event. There's really, really interesting things that can happen when you don't define yourself by only what you do, only what you think your expertise is, but instead brought in how you think about yourself, brought in how your audience thinks about you. How do you exist as a human in other ways? What are your other hyper focuses? Write those out and start joining. Be a part of the community. Show up as your full self. See who needs some of the skills that you have. I think Olivia's example just blew me away about how she got a grant in a totally different field where there was probably no other musicians applying. It's a really, really powerful example of this principle. And when we're in a time where things have never been noisier, I think this applies in more than ever. Each episode of Creative Pep Talk is designed to help you maintain a consistent creative practice. If you're trying to transform your creativity from an infrequent hobby into a real discipline, sign up to our newsletter@andy jpizza.substack.com so that you never miss an episode. Creative Pep Talk is part of the Podglomerate Network. You can learn more@podglomerate.com Massive thanks to my team, Sophie Miller, for content editing and co writing to Connor Jones of pending Beautiful for editing and sound design, and thanks to all of you for listening. Until next time, stay pepped up. Hey y'all, one more quick thing. Earlier this year I rebuilt my website using Squarespace's new Fluid engine and I was so pumped about how it turned out that I have been really thrilled to find as many ways to partner with them and tell you about what they can do and bring you discounts as possible. With social media going haywire, I think having a site that feels as unique as your creative work is essential to building trust with your target audience or your clients.
- [72:31]
Olivia Rafferty
I have had several clients point out.
- [72:33]
Andy J. Pizza
How cohesive and fresh my site looks lately, and if you want to check that out and what I was able to do without any code, check out andyjpizza.com if you want to test it out, go to squarespace.com pep talk to test it out yourself. And when you're ready to launch, use promo code pep talk for 10% off your first purchase. Thanks Squarespace for supporting the show and.
- [72:58]
Olivia Rafferty
For supporting creative people.
- [73:05]
Zibby Owens
From Academy Award winning actor Matthew McConaughey's soulful and humorous picture book to New York Times bestselling author Kristin Hannah's the Women Moms don't have Time to Read Books is an author interview podcast unlike any other. In 30 minutes or less, each episode of this chart topping and Webby Award winning show dives deep beneath the COVID fostering friendship and camaraderie, support and curiosity, connection and compassion. Hosted by me, Zibby Owens, author, bookstore owner and head of what the LA Times called the Zippy Verse, Moms don't have Time to Read Books has something for everyone, whether you're a mom like me or simply a busy reader. So don't miss out. Follow Moms don't have Time to Read Books on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you're listening now. New episodes are released every weekday, bringing books to life.