Session 38: Calling Crissle

Summary

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Crissle's Couch – Session 38: Calling Crissle

Release Date: August 4, 2026
Host: Crissle
Theme: Crystal-clear advice and empathetic, lived-in insight for listeners struggling with relationships, family, and self-care, through live call-ins and candid conversation.

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Crissle's Couch, Crissle welcomes live callers seeking advice on a range of personal and family issues. Over the course of three deeply candid call-ins, she offers her signature blend of empathy, tough love, cultural critique, and gentle accountability. The episode traverses complex situations—ending long-holding friendships over fundamental values, maintaining boundaries with family amid emotional turmoil, and supporting a teen Black girl’s mental health journey—showcasing Crissle’s ability to both comfort and challenge.

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Key Discussion Points & Call-In Summaries

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1. When Shared History Collides with Fundamental Rejection (Cameron’s Call)

[01:49–16:36]

The Dilemma:

• Cameron, a gay man in his late 30s, is torn about whether to end a 20-year friendship after his close friend revealed she believes being gay is a sin—framing his sexuality as a "choice" and likening it to making harmful life decisions.
• Their relationship, founded in adolescence, has been one of trust and openness, making her rejection especially shocking.

Key Moments:

• Cameron details the origin of the friendship, the friend’s fluctuating religious stance, and how her stance appears selectively strict regarding Cameron’s sexuality.
• Crissle probes whether there’s hope for change and what real acceptance looks like.

Crissle’s Main Advice & Reflections:

• You cannot maintain deep, authentic friendships where your core is up for negotiation or viewed as morally wrong.
• It’s not Cameron’s job to educate his friend if she stands by her beliefs, especially when rooted in faith over reason.
• Emotional reaction acknowledged: the unique pain of having a chosen family member place conditions on your existence.

Notable Quotes:

• Crissle [07:22]: "This is so disorienting. It throws you off entirely because it’s like, bitch, we have been friends for 20 years."
• Crissle [09:02]: "Faith doesn’t require science or facts or research... you can pick it up and put it down however you want to."
• Cameron [13:07]: "Can a friendship survive when one person believes a core part of the other person's identity is morally wrong?"
• Crissle [13:17]: "Not on a deep level, no. You can be superficial, surface level friends, hi-and-bye type friends, but you can't have true intimacy and vulnerability with another person when you know that they believe something like that about you."

Crissle’s Bottom Line:

• Even if the friend apologizes, “it does not take away what she said before” ([14:41]).
• Cameron is encouraged to take space, acknowledge the pain, and accept that the friendship may have run its course.
• Community and safety take priority: “You don’t get to be in community with me, you don’t get to have access to me, if you are gonna say something like my existence is a sin or who I am as a person is flawed and wrong” ([15:15]).

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2. Navigating Family Fallout, Boundaries, and Guilt (Max’s Call)

[20:31–42:17]

The Dilemma:

• Max has been with her partner for four years. A family misunderstanding spiraled when some relatives suspected inappropriate behavior between her partner and a mutual friend; Max trusted both, but sharing the rumors led to a rift.
• Her family now acts distant, and attempts to clear the air trigger further criticism. Max’s mental health has suffered, manifesting in severe anxiety and panic attacks.

Key Moments:

• Max explains the platonic relationship in question, her family’s discomfort with mixed-gender friendship, and their disappointment that she told her partner about their suspicions.
• She describes crippling anxiety and the struggle with medication and therapy.

Crissle’s Main Advice & Reflections:

• Family members sometimes impose burdens and expectations that create unnecessary emotional labor—particularly around misguided loyalty.
• Accepting relationships as they are (not as we wish them to be) is a key part of boundary-setting and maintaining well-being.

Notable Quotes:

• Crissle [33:53]: “It doesn’t have to be, ‘I'm giving up on you,’ but letting go of the idea that the relationship is going to look a certain way, and accepting that it’s going to look this way instead.”
• Crissle [36:09]: "It’s more about really evaluating what the person is capable of giving you."
• Crissle [39:46]: “Keep taking your meds, keep seeing your therapist... sometimes you just gotta... stop wishing that it could be different or hoping or, you know, just that little shred of maybe one day. It's not that that possibility ever stops existing. It's that you stop holding onto it.”

Crissle’s Bottom Line:

• Max can remain available for honest, adult conversation when her family is ready, but shouldn't sacrifice her own peace or health to fix dynamics that others are unwilling to repair.
• Medication and therapy are empowered choices, not admissions of defeat.

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3. Supporting a Teen Through Broken Trust in Therapy (Marlee’s Call)

[44:04–61:34]

The Dilemma:

• Marlee is a single Black mom with a 17-year-old daughter struggling to find a consistent, trustworthy therapist. Her daughter, one of few Black girls at a predominantly white Catholic school, has opened up only to be let down—therapists leaving practices, missing appointments, and inconsistent care.
• Marlee asks: How can she help her daughter maintain faith in therapy, especially as her daughter starts to recoil from the process after repeated disappointments?

Key Moments:

• Marlee describes the systemic and interpersonal barriers in accessing mental health care for Black youth, even with good insurance.
• She recounts her own therapy journey and feeling helpless watching her daughter lose trust in the process.

Crissle’s Main Advice & Reflections:

• Therapy access is often harder for youth and for Black families in white-dominated spaces—especially with insurance-mandated turnover and overburdened clinicians.
• It’s okay to pause, validate disappointment, and model what healing looks like instead of pushing before the child is ready.
• Consistency is crucial for therapeutic success; interruptions can retraumatize and erode trust.

Notable Quotes:

• Crissle [47:50]: "How do I help my daughter keep believing in therapy when therapy keeps giving her reasons not to?"
• Crissle [52:36]: "Anytime you can pay out of pocket or privately for health care, including mental health care, you’re probably going to get better care—because that therapist… has so much more time to focus on clients."
• Crissle [55:26]: "You are your child’s biggest teacher, her most primary source of inspiration… seeing you do the work is probably the biggest thing that keeps her in the running for, you know, rejoining that process herself."
• Crissle [60:57]: "Your daughter deserves consistency. And every fucking therapist knows that consistency is required in order for therapy to work."

Crissle’s Bottom Line:

• Allow space for healing and acknowledge the validity of her daughter’s retreat.
• If taking a break makes sense, let the daughter lead the pace of return. Marlee’s continued growth and stability in her own therapy is itself a powerful model.
• Don’t hesitate to report or leave therapists who fail their professional obligations, especially with minors.

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• On Religious Disrespect as a Friendship Dealbreaker:
  "Even if she says the most perfect thing, it's not going to take away the fact that she said the other thing." – Crissle ([14:41])

• On Revising Expectations:
  “Sometimes the boundary is saying, ‘I'm giving up on you,’ but not… throwing you away. It's letting go of the idea that our relationship is going to look a certain way, and accepting that it's going to look this way instead.” – Crissle ([33:53])

• On Black Kids and Therapy Gaps:
  "She deserves consistency… Every therapist knows that consistency is required in order for therapy to work." – Crissle ([60:57])

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Important Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamps | Highlights | |----------------------------|---------------|----------------------------------------------------------| | Cameron's Dilemma | 01:49–16:36 | Friendship, faith, identity, acceptance | | Max’s Family Conflict | 20:31–42:17 | Family boundaries, loyalty, anxiety, closure | | Marlee’s Therapy Journey | 44:04–61:34 | Black girls & therapy, finding consistency, maternal care | | Notable Quotes | 07:22, 09:02, 13:17, 47:50, 52:36, 55:26, 60:57 | |

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Tone & Language

Throughout, Crissle remains candid, compassionate, and direct—calling out hypocrisy (“pipe down, Miss girl”), validating pain, de-stigmatizing therapy and medication, and reminding listeners that protecting one’s peace is not selfish. The show reflects her deep understanding of cultural context, family systems, queer experience, and the long grind of healing.

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Conclusion

Session 38 of Crissle’s Couch puts community care, honest evaluation of relationships, and practical healing on center stage. Whether you’re grieving a fractured friendship, coping with family judgment, or navigating the mental health system for yourself or a child, Crissle offers grounded validation and actionable, real-world advice: it’s okay to take space, redefine connection, and protect your spirit.

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Transcript

[Olivia]

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[Crystal]

Hi and welcome to Crystal's Couch, the show where I answer your questions for advice and talk to the most interesting people in the world today. I am so excited to be back in the lab with the live callers. Yes, one of my favorite things to do on this show is chat live with some of you listeners, so I'm very excited. I think we got a great lineup for today. So without further ado, who's up first?

[Cameron]

Hey, Crystal. I'm Cameron.

[Crystal]

Hi, Cameron. How are you?

[Cameron]

I'm good. How are you?

[Crystal]

I'm doing good, baby. What's going on?

[Cameron]

Oh my God. Okay, so I'm a gay man in my late 30s and I'm trying to figure out whether it's time to let go of a 20 year friendship.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Cameron]

A few weeks ago we were sitting out by the pool just having drinks when she told me she believes that being gay is a sin. She said she still loves me but doesn't agree with my quote unquote lifestyle and doesn't believe that people are born gay. Then she Compared my being gay to a mutual friend who keeps going back to an unhealthy relationship, saying that you can love someone while still disagreeing with their choices. But here's the problem. I don't experience my sexuality as a choice, right? So, like, it felt like she was comparing who I am to, like, a harmful decision. It didn't feel like a difference of opinion. It felt like a rejection of a core part of who I am.

[Crystal]

Right?

[Cameron]

And like, this isn't some random person. This is someone I've loved for 20 years. We've grown up together, traveled together, celebrated milestones. I've known her since we were 17. I was at her wedding just this year, and I always believe, like, she fully accepted me. So now I'm just left wondering, like, was I ever truly accepted or just tolerate it?

[Crystal]

Yeah. Oh, my God. So you, y' all met when you were 17? Did y' all meet in high school or at church?

[Cameron]

What was your mutual friend?

[Crystal]

Mutual friend.

[Cameron]

I was two years older.

[Feeding America Representative]

Okay.

[Cameron]

But yeah, she was in 10th grade when we met.

[Crystal]

Got it. And so has she always known you to be a gay man?

[Cameron]

I've been gay since. She's always known.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Cameron]

It was never a secret.

[Crystal]

Got it, got it, got it. And does she have this same sort of religious kind of strict mentality about other things, or is it just about gay people where she's like, this is where I draw the line.

[Cameron]

She seems to pick and choose, like, what she wants to. Like, she's always been, like, so hot and cold with her religion. So sometimes she'd go in spurts when, like, she wasn't really about it, and then she, like, takes a pause and then goes deep into it. So right now she's back in her deep, deep mode into seems to be just a gay thing because, like, she can have free sex and like, she's out here having sex before marriage and, like, just doing all these other things. But when it comes to gayness, it seems to be like, I don't understand why that's her big problem. Like, why that's her non negotiable.

[Crystal]

Right. And so did you all. I understand why you wouldn't, because this is uncomfortable, but did you try to talk to her more about, like, these beliefs and, and what they're really rooted in? Cause when you said she compared it to, like, a friend who keeps going back to a toxic relationship, that made me think that maybe she doesn't actually have a real or correct understanding of sexuality or how it works.

[Cameron]

She fully believes that she's like, well, maybe you were influenced and I was, like, influenced by what? Both of my brothers are straight. And if I was influenced to be gay, wouldn't I. Wouldn't. I mean, if I was influenced, wouldn't. Wouldn't I more likely to be straight? Because there's more straight influences than there are gay influence? So I don't understand what she's talking about. I'm just like, I expected more from my friend, and I'm so confused.

[Crystal]

Right. Did she have a response to that? Because that's an excellent point.

[Cameron]

We were drinking, and she was just like, oh, no, I just think you're choosing that way. And then her friend that we met together was like, co signing it, because I guess she's dabbled with girls, and she's like, yeah, I think you're sending. I think you're choosing to be that way.

[Crystal]

Oh, God. Okay, first of all, a straight who has kissed a couple, you know, when she was drunk in the club or whatever, can't tell me nothing about who I am. Like, pipe down, Miss girl. But, wow. So you were. Y' all were drinking. So it sounds like it was probably more of a casual sort of environment anyway. And then all of a sudden, these two people you've been friends with for years are like, oh, yeah, by the way, I think who you are as a person is flawed and you're doomed to spend the rest of eternity in hell.

[Cameron]

And I don't even. Like, that means nothing to me. Cause I'm not religious. But it's just, like, I know what it means to her.

[Crystal]

Right?

[Cameron]

And I'm like, the fact that I'm your friend and this is how you feel. I don't even know how to carry on with this friendship like this. Unless you change your mind, how can we be friends?

[Crystal]

Right?

[Marlee]

And

[Crystal]

I mean the whole. Unless you change your mind, we can't be friends. I completely agree. But how likely do you think it is that she will come around on this issue?

[Cameron]

I don't know. Yeah, I really don't know. I feel like she needs to go on, like, a spiritual journey and, like, go. Go to Bali, go on some spiritual journey and, like, really get it together. Because she seems to be conflicted about a lot, right?

[Crystal]

So ordinarily I would just say, okay, this girl block her. Who cares? But y' all have been friends for so long. It sounds like it really hurts you to be in this position in the first place.

[Cameron]

This was my girl. I thought, like, we were there with each other, like.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Cameron]

To see that she feels this way. I'M like, where is this coming from? Like, I never known you to be. Not the family I choose for myself.

[Crystal]

Right.

[Feeding America Representative]

Known.

[Cameron]

I never known I would pick so I would be friends with somebody who has these type of opinions.

[Olivia]

Right.

[Cameron]

I'm, like, so baffled. Like, do I not know you?

[Crystal]

Yeah. This is so disorienting. It throws you off entirely because it's like, bitch, we have been friends for 20 years.

[Cameron]

She's been in the gay clubs doing, like, what the hell?

[Crystal]

Come on, come on, come on. That's the sort of thing where it's like, I. It throws you off so much, and I'm putting myself in your shoes right now and trying to think of how I would feel if one of my oldest friends that I've known since we were high school age was like, oh, yeah, by the way, I feel this way about you. And I guess I always have, but now I'm just kind of, like, making it clear that who you are as a person, that is so devastating. Like, we can know one thing, you know, with our brains. We can know rationally or logically. Like, this person's full of shit and their opinion about this doesn't matter. They're clearly ignorant about sexuality and how it's developed, how it works. But that doesn't take away the pain that we feel in our hearts over having been connected to somebody for so long. We've shared so much. We've been vulnerable. Like, 20 years is nothing to sneeze at. So. So do you feel like sitting down and having, like, a big capital C conversation about this?

[Cameron]

I don't even know. Like. Like she. She stood on what she said. I don't even know like, how a conversation would change. Would it just be, like, an ending conversation? Like, you know what? Like, this is how you feel. I don't see how this friendship can last anymore. Like, I don't know. I don't. I don't know what the comments, how the conversation would go.

[Crystal]

Right. Well, I don't think that it necessarily needs to be like, this is the end of our friendship. But it also doesn't have to be like a. Here is a lecture on homosexuality and, like, why you're wrong and how homosexuality appears across species and all of this other stuff. And, you know, gay people have been around since forever. You don't have to go into all that either, because it doesn't. Frankly, it doesn't sound like she's even really open to hearing it. It sounds like, you know, she stood 10 and toes down on what she said, and this is her belief. And a lot of people will just back that up with, well, that's my religion, or that's my faith. And they'll end it at that. Because when you believe in something based purely off faith, you don't have to investigate it any further than that. Faith doesn't require science or facts or research or, you know, anything like that. It's pure vibes. And so you can pick it up and put it down however you want to. So I wouldn't even recommend you go through all of that sort of turmoil. I might mention it briefly. Like, by the way, you're wrong about that. But I'm not trying to convince you or change your mind. If anything, I would sit her down and say, you know, we've been friends for 20 years, and I don't know that I can continue being your friend knowing that you feel this way about me. I was so hurt when you said that you feel like my existence and my personhood is a sin. Like, you're not talking about a choice that I made because I did not say, hey, why don't I go out here and be gay? Gay isn't a choice. Gay is feelings. And you can never, ever act on the feelings and still be gay. So what are you saying here? That I should either deny my sexuality, deny who I am, not embrace the complete fullness of my existence on this plane and just pretend that I'm not gay? You want me to do that, or you want me to be out here with women lying to myself and to them? Like, what do you want me to. What do you think is really going on here? And what would be the solution? God is gonna love me if I decide to lie about who I am? Is that what you're saying? Like, are you being for real right now? Are you going to hell because you had sex outside of marriage and you smoke and you drink and you blah, blah, blah, blah, whatever else? Like, how is it that this applies to me and not to you or any of the people you know who have also done things that are considered to be sins? So I. I think if I were to have the conversation, I would focus on, like, not even trying to come to a resolution, but just expressing to a friend, you really, really hurt me and seeing how she responds to that. Because I think a good friend will want to know when they've hurt your feelings and would want to know that it is affecting you this deeply. And so maybe by having the conversation, that will cause her to really reflect and be like, wow, I've been judgmental. I've kind of been an asshole. I've been, you know, unfair to this person and I've been projecting, you know, all of my religious stuff onto him as if there's something wrong with him. Like maybe that will kind of send her in that direction. Or maybe she's going to triple down on it and be like, well, God said and the Bible said and pastor said, so I mean, I still love you. You still my friend. You know, love the sin, hate or love the sin or hate the sin, child, they love that line, you know, something trite like that. But for me, it would just be about expressing the feelings and seeing how she responds. Because if you're not remorseful, if you're not trying to like, come to an understanding or come to a place where you no longer believe that about me, then why would I even want to be close with you?

[Cameron]

Right? Because I'm like, she can be remorseful and all that, but like, can a friendship survive when one person believes a core part of the other person's identity is morally wrong?

[Crystal]

You know, not on a deep level, no. You can be superficial, surface level friends, high and by type friends, but you can't have true intimacy and vulnerability with another person when you know that they believe something like that about you. Especially if you're not willing to then cover up or lie to yourself about who you are. Like, you don't feel any shame about who you are. And that's really, I think what's saving you here is that you know enough and you are secure enough in yourself to say, oh, she's wrong, she's fucked up. This is, this is not actually about me, this is about her. But no, I don't think you can be true friends with somebody who has that sort of attitude about gay people when you are an out and proud gay person.

[Cameron]

So the friendship is dead.

[Crystal]

Well, I mean, it does sound like it. It. Damn. Because you know what? And here is the real gag about it all, Cameron. What's really wild about it is that even if she does come back and says, you know what, I was really tr and like, of course I don't think, like, you're a sinner because of who you are. Like, obviously that was so ignorant and I can't believe I said that. I'm so sorry. Like, even if she says the most perfect thing, it's not going to take away the fact that she said the other thing.

[Cameron]

Right?

[Crystal]

It could only lay the pavement for the possibility of y' all repairing the friendship and getting back to where you used to be, but it does not take away what she said before. So it is very possible that the friendship has been fractured in a way that it cannot be repaired based off of this statement and for good reason. Yeah, yeah.

[Cameron]

That's kind of the way I was leaning. Just needed some other opinions.

[Crystal]

Yeah, I mean, this is. It's really inexcusable. Like, you can have anybody. This goes for anybody. They can have their faith, they can have their religious beliefs or whatever, other kind of beliefs, but you don't get to be in community with me. You don't get to have access to me. If you are gonna say something like, my existence is a sin or who I am as a person is flawed and wrong, at that point, you need to take it up with God, because, again, I didn't make me gay. I'm just here, girl. Like, I'm just having the experience. I didn't decide that for me. So, yeah, you can have your beliefs, but you're gonna have to have them away from me with all that nonsense.

[Cameron]

Right. Not the family you choose for yourself,

[Crystal]

not the family you choose. Right. It's nothing you can do about blood, but, I mean. But even blood don't have to be in your life. You just can't change the fact that they. Blood.

[Cameron]

Right.

[Crystal]

I'm sorry, though, that's so hard. And I would. I wanna make sure that we take the space to really acknowledge how painful this is to be in this position with somebody that you thought was a real true friend and thought that for years. Yeah. Because this is really. It's fucked up, baby. I'm sorry.

[Cameron]

Yeah. All right, well, thank you so much, Crystal. I really appreciate you.

[Crystal]

You're welcome. Cameron, thank you so much for calling into the show. Take care.

[Cameron]

You too. Bye.

[Crystal]

Bye. Yeah, y', all, the thing about the homophobia and stuff like that, again, it's just not something I play with. You can think whatever you want to, but if you come over here with your feelings that aren't based in facts or anything that can be backed up and you just want to be hateful, there's no space for that in a real friendship. So sucks, but sometimes that's how it is. This episode of Chrysalis Couch is sponsored by BetterHelp. Now, y' all have heard me talk a lot about BetterHelp for a long time across different platforms, but I don't think we've ever actually talked about how much people actually love the service when they use it. You can check it out [e-mail] reviews to see how real people feel about the service in real time. The reviews are updated every day with hundreds of people talking about BetterHelp and how useful it's been for them. Again, visit betterhelp.com reviews to see it for yourself. Okay, Better Help has an average live therapy session rating of 4.9 out of 5 and more than 6 million people have used BetterHelp around the globe. The consistent feedback from real users makes it easy to see why so many continue to choose BetterHelp. Those therapists have at least three years and 1,000 hours of hands on experience and they hold all required education, training, certifications and licensure across a range of mental health specialties. BetterHelp makes it so easy to get started. You just answer a few questions, get matched with a therapist based on your needs and switch at any time if it's not the right fit. So see the reviews, see what stands out and see if BetterHelp is right for you. Visit betterhelp.com chrysal that's betterhelp.com C R I S S L E Hey y'.

[Marlee]

All.

[Crystal]

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[Olivia]

Hey friends. Olivia from Ollie. Between new routines and the ultimate group project known as parenting, you need science backed solutions that work with your life. That's where Ollie comes in. Start your mornings off right with multis made to support nutrition and immune health. Choose from our lineup of gut supporting probiotics and we've got occasional sleep support to help the whole fam chase their big dreams. Head back to class with the number one Gummy supplement brand. Stock up on ollie.com to today. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.

[Crystal]

All right, who is up next?

[Marlee]

Hi.

[Crystal]

Hi. How are you?

[Marlee]

I'm good.

[Max]

How are you doing?

[Crystal]

I'm good. What's your name?

[Max]

Max.

[Crystal]

Lex?

[Max]

Max.

[Crystal]

Max. Hey Max. So what's going on?

[Max]

So I've been with my partner for four years and I'm struggling to move forward after a conflict with that's permanently changed my relationship with my family. But some of my family Last year a few family members became convinced that something inappropriate was happening between my partner and one of our close friends. Even though I trust them both and nothing was actually going on, my anxiety was not was at its all time worst and I couldn't keep everything from my partner because doing so felt like a lie and I was on the verge of a panic attack when I told him what was being said. I tried to get everyone together to clear the air. My family felt betrayed that I said anything at all. Instead of trying to clear the air, the conversation turned to listing off everything I had done wrong and my family's opinions on our relationship and our friend. Before and during the conversation, I apologized and how I could have done things better. When I shared that the situation had become so overwhelming that it was causing me to have panic attacks, my mental health was completely dismissed and that hurt deeply. Through therapy, I have realized I've spent years carrying my family's emotional burdens and trying to fix everyone's problems. Now my therapist is encouraging me to take a step back, but I'm struggling because I love my family and I don't want to lose those relationships. So my question is how do you maintain healthy boundaries without feeling like you're giving up on the people you love? And how do you accept that some family relationships may never fully Resolve or heal.

[Crystal]

Yeah, well, those questions really go together. Let's. Let's back up a little bit and go to the situation with your boyfriend and your. Your partner and your friend. Why is there. Did your family have, like, a good reason to think something was going on? Did they see something suspicious or was it just like, oh, well, we had a feeling it was messed up.

[Max]

Not all of them. So not all of them, like, saw or knew everything until, like, they all connected. The doctor.

[Crystal]

Gotcha.

[Max]

But. So both of us believe that men and women should have platonic friendships. Like they are healthy to have. It allowed each person to see them beyond just being the opposite sex. So that's a big cornerstone of our. It's always been a cornerstone of relationship. So while they were visiting, they went and did an activity together without me. I knew about it. I was fine with it. I had no issues with it.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Max]

My family. Some people in my family felt like that was weird.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

I mean, was it like a romantic boat ride around a canal or.

[Max]

No.

[Crystal]

Okay. Okay. So they hung out like friends?

[Max]

Yes, like friends. Like, they literally went, I think, bowling.

[Crystal]

Okay. So family was tripping.

[Max]

I think it was like bowling or like laser tag or something like that.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Max]

It was like she confides in him about her, like, life, family, relationship. She does not have any siblings that she's close with, so he is like a sibling to her. And likewise, she also confides in me. I was just like, you know what? Y' all can go have brother, sister time. Our other friend is here. Me and them will go have our time together because we rarely all get to have like, one on one time.

[Crystal]

Gotcha.

[Max]

Individually with the other person.

[Crystal]

Okay. So they hung out as friends. Your family members saw this and we're like, I don't know about it. Of got together and. And pieced some. Some things together and then came to you with it.

[Max]

Yes, there was also. Because they both are actors, so they had just gotten a script to, like, to do some voice acting for, and he. The recording equipment at the time was in our bedroom. I know this. Everyone knows this. There were two family members also in the house, along with our other friend. They went into the room to record the audio.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Max]

And that is also, I guess, like, another thing they thought was weird or inappropriate.

[Crystal]

Got you. Okay. So these two incidents together, your family was like, let's come to Max and tell her what's going on. Did they think you weren't going to talk to your partner about it, though? Like, what were you supposed to do? With that information, I.

[Max]

One of them simply just said, like, you don't know her intentions with him. You don't know her intentions with him. Like, over and over again, I was like, she's dating his other best friend. Like. Like, I know her intentions. But they're like, well, you don't have to do anything with this. You could just, like, you could just watch. That was what. One of them.

[Crystal]

Oh, okay.

[Max]

Yeah. And then. But it's like, but you told me this thing about my partner. So what? In this situation, if it was different, if I chose to confront him about it, like, I feel like the comp. Then the outcome might have been different.

[Crystal]

Got it.

[Max]

If I went with him in a more aggressive way, confronting him, like, hey, my family's seeing this and this isn't okay, or something like that, then I feel like then they might have been okay with that.

[Crystal]

I see. Interesting.

[Max]

So.

[Crystal]

Hmm. So they kind of wanted you to just take this information, sit on it, and keep your eye on the two of them and.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

And just watch out for anything funny happening. And so they were angry at you for talking to your boyfriend about their concerns and saying that they had seen these things. Okay. How did the conversation go with your partner when you talked to him about it?

[Max]

He was very patient and understanding. He could see that. Like, at the time when I brought it to him, I was very distressed. He definitely calmly explained that, I'm here for you. I've moved here for you. I don't want people to have these assumptions about our relationship. Me or our friend, for that matter. But also, he was also genuinely hurt because he had felt he had made connections with my family.

[Welch's Fruit Snacks Sponsor]

Right.

[Crystal]

Oh, yes. Okay. So is your family. I know your family's upset at the way you handled it. How are they showing that they're upset with you? Are they leaving you out of stuff?

[Max]

So not leaving me out of stuff. Stuff. It just feels weird. Like, when we go to family events or, like, outings, it feels like there's just this wall up. I. Not necessarily with me specifically. Like, those family members will talk to me, and they'll sometimes greet him, but, like, it's. It feels like there's this looming shroud.

[Crystal]

Gotcha.

[Max]

That isn't being addressed or hasn't fully been addressed since that big meeting.

[Crystal]

Right. Is that something that you would want to do? Kind of set up something with your family without your boyfriend and be like, okay, the vibe is off. Something's wrong. Or like, I like, let's not. Let's just address what's going on Here. Because we all know that things are not normal. They're not the way they used to be. Is that a conversation you would want to have with them?

[Max]

I feel like I tried to do that. It just blew up in my face.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Max]

And I think that's why I'm just so apprehensive to trying again.

[Crystal]

Right.

[Max]

Especially because I feel like I don't want to. I don't want it to be about how, like, you betrayed us or we were trying to look out for you. And I've acknowledged. I've already acknowledged what I could have done better, and I've acknowledged that I understand that everyone was looking out for my best interest, but it feels like they're not acknowledging that they misjudged two people or misjudged the situations.

[Crystal]

Right. Like, I would think everybody would just be happy that you don't see anything to be alarmed about here. And there were perfectly reasonable explanations for what they saw. But instead, do you get the feeling that they're, like, they're holding it against you, that you said something to your partner?

[Max]

I think that.

[Crystal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Max]

Thing and saying something to them about it. About it is probably the bigger thing of just like, oh, you should have just kept that between us.

[Crystal]

Got it. Okay, so talk to me a little bit more about the anxiety and panic attacks. How did that start up?

[Max]

I've always had, like, some form of anxiety. I think I've been able to just, like, cope with it. The panic attacks. I don't think I realized they were panic attacks until it got as bad, really. It would manifest as, like, me freezing and just, like, laying in bed and not being able, like, as much as I would want to will myself to move and go do what I needed to do, I would just want to lay and stay in the bed.

[Crystal]

Right.

[Max]

And it was different from, like, feeling just depressed. It was just, like, feeling, like, this aching anxiousness, like, eating. Like something was tied around my chest and just squeezing tighter.

[Crystal]

Oh, yeah.

[Max]

And then it kind of gradually got worse to where, like, I was hyperventilating a lot. It got so bad. I can laugh about it now. It got so bad that my ribs were hurting.

[Crystal]

Oh, no.

[Max]

Because I found that that can sometimes be a side effect from, like, having panic attacks. So that's how frequently I was having them. I think at its worst, I was having them four times a week.

[Crystal]

Oh, my goodness.

[Marlee]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

When? So this happened how long ago?

[Max]

Last year.

[Crystal]

Last year. Okay.

[Max]

Yes, last year. I am medicated now, though, so.

[Crystal]

You're medicated now?

[Marlee]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

Okay. Okay. Because that was going to be my next question. Are you talking to a doctor about it? Okay.

[Marlee]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

But the panic. You were having panic attacks up to four times a week because of this situation and the dynamic with your family.

[Max]

Yes.

[Crystal]

So it's been however many months or a year and they're still feeling away about it.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

Okay.

[Max]

Certain people are certain. I will say other people just kind of like, want the resolution to be there and want everyone to be happy, but that just feels like, okay, I don't think we should sweep things under a rug. I'd love to have a new normal.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Max]

But I. I understand. We can't get to a new normal unless both sides are willing to, like, come together and really have that conversation.

[Crystal]

Right, right. So the few people that you think are still kind of holding onto it, would you be interested in having like, a separate sort of meeting with just you and them? How do you think that would go?

[Max]

I think I'm more than open to have those conversations with them, but I need to know that they want to have it. I feel like when I've tried or I. Like, I've tried to have it, I feel like I don't have the right words or I mess up or. I don't know if what I'm trying to say is just like, not getting through because I feel like. To like, exactly what you said I would. You would think that like, once people realize, oh, hey, there's nothing going on, we should actually, like, take accountability for like, misjudging these people. But instead it feels like it's turned into like, well, you. You know, you. You betrayed our trust.

[Crystal]

Right. It. It's the betrayal of trust that seems to be to me to be a little much like. I think it's very rational, actually. If I came to somebody and. And said something as serious as I think your partner might be stepping out on you with your friend, there is no part of me that thinks that they would not have then a conversation with their partner about that. Like, that seems very illogical. And I mean, maybe even if they weren't willing to take accountability and be like, oh, okay, I was wrong, you would think they would at least let it go. Like, I came to you with this concern. Turns out that the concern was baseless. And so I'm letting it go. You know, I told you. Cause you're my relative, I care a lot about you. Glad that it turned out to be nothing, and I'm more than willing to drop it. Like, I. So I'm sensing that there's some there's some weirdness from some members of your family about, like, maybe what your responsibility is or your obligation. Maybe. Maybe there's even this idea of, like, disloyalty, that you chose your partner over them. Something like that. I agree that I would probably only be open to having the conversation if I knew that they were also open to hearing it. But if I've tried to talk to you and you've kind of just. It's like, you know, there's a wall up between us, and we both know it, and we can feel it and see it, and you're not open to me, then why would I continue to put forth that sort of this effort? So it sounds like that's where you are now. Yeah. Okay, so I think the first question you asked me had something to do with boundaries. Yeah.

[Max]

Like, how do you maintain healthy boundaries without feeling like you're giving up on people you love?

[Crystal]

Well, that really depends on the boundary. Because sometimes the boundary is saying, I'm giving up on you, but not saying I'm throwing you away. It's saying that I am letting go of the idea that our relationship is going to be. It's going to look a certain way, and I'm accepting that it's going to look this way instead. Like, that's something that I had to do with my mother coming to it. And it's less about boundaries and more about a personal understanding. For me, anyway, where it was like, we already. You know, we're not the. We've never been the call and talk to my mom every day and text my mama all day, every day type. Like, we've never been that. But it's more like coming to a personal understanding of, like, this is who you are. You are set in your ways, not stuck in them. You can get out of it, but you're not, for whatever reason. And so I can either cut you off completely or accept you as you are and modify my expectations for you and for what a relationship between the two of us will look like. It really. Again, it depends on the boundary you want to set and the person you want to set it with. But it sounds like maybe you just need to have a little bit of a reframe of how you're looking at it. Like, it doesn't have to be, you know, let's say your aunt is the main one, you know, still instigating or keeping up this sort of weird vibe. It can be, all right, Auntie, I accept that you don't like it. I accept that you think that you know, I'm a disloyal niece for talking to my partner about cheating allegations that came from the family. But, you know, I'm not gonna stop coming around. You know, I'm not gonna skip Christmas because you feel this way. I'm not gonna miss out on all the other family events because you feel this way. I'm gonna just keep you at arm's length until you decide that this is something that you are ready to have a conversation about. You're ready to act like an adult about it. But I can't force it.

[Marlee]

Right?

[Max]

Right.

[Crystal]

Yeah. And what was the other question?

[Max]

And how do you accept that some family relationships may never fully heal or resolve?

[Crystal]

Oh, yes. Well, that kind of ties into what I was just saying about the boundaries, where it's. It's more about really evaluating what the person is capable of giving you. Like, this sounds like the sort of thing that ideally we could wrap up in an afternoon. Like, I'm really struggling to see how your family members are still holding onto these feelings a year later like that. It's really kind of blowing my mind that they are this stuck in it, because it doesn't seem to me to be that big of a deal. Like, if anything, I would have said to myself, okay, next time, you know, I'm not gonna come to Max unless I know for sure. You know, I saw her, man kissing somebody else in the hallway. You know, otherwise, I'm just not gonna come to Max about, you know, like, something like that. But why are y' all so dead set on holding onto it? I think if I were in your shoes, I would try to set up a meeting, you know, something private in person with, If. If possible, with the people who are having these concerns or, you know, who are still in their feelings about this. And if we. If we have a conversation and you're still, like, just 10 toes down on me, getting on your nerves because I talked to my partner about it, then at that point, I just gotta let you have it. Okay, auntie. Okay, cousin. Okay, Daddy. You know, I'll see y' all at Labor Day or whatever. Like, I'll see y' all for Big Mama birthday party. I can't put so much effort and thought into this to the point where it is making you sick. It's causing you real health problems. You gotta go see a doctor and get medicated because of the anxiety you're having around this conflict with your family. Like, come on, now, y'. All. Come on. Let's be for real. Do they know that. That it's Causing you to have panic attacks.

[State Farm Sponsor]

I.

[Max]

After. When I tried to say that, it got so overwhelming that I was on the verge of having a panic attack, and it kind of was just dismissed.

[Crystal]

Oh, right. You did say that. You did.

[Max]

Yeah. I just. The only person that in my family that knows I am. Well, my. Both my parents know that I'm medicated now.

[Crystal]

Gotcha.

[Max]

Yeah. My mom and my dad, they know that I have been medicated for the last few months. I feel a lot better.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Max]

Yeah, I would. I. I feel like my fear of getting on medication for years was just really like, oh, my God, what if it changes me completely? But I'm like, if I was medicated like this last year, I think everything would have just like, okay, cool, whatever. Yeah, y' all can think what you want. Yeah, I'm not worried about it.

[Crystal]

Yep. Yeah. I mean, medication can really be a great thing. It really, really can. And it exists for a reason. And I'm so happy that you got over whatever internal doubts you had about trying it out, and I'm glad it worked for you. But. Yeah, that I probably. To be completely honest, I probably wouldn't even bring that up to the family members because it doesn't sound like it really matters to them anyway. But, like, this is. This is an absurd thing to hold over somebody's head for this amount of time, especially for it to turn out to be a complete nothing of an issue. Like, it just sounds like some people in your family maybe need to grow up or get over themselves. Like, it's not actually about you, sweetie. So I would try to have the conversation, but if they still acting like this, girl, what else are you supposed to do? Like, no, they are wearing you out. No, no, no, no, no.

[Max]

I appreciate that. I just. I. I really love the work that I've been able to do with my therapist.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Max]

And then, like, also getting to my psychologist, like, that's helped. But I think it was your episode with Scottie Beam, and y' all said something along the lines of, like, you have to sometimes just step. Take a step back from certain family members.

[Cameron]

Oh, yeah.

[Max]

Inspired me to reach out to you for the advice, because I was like, I know what I have to do. I think I just still feel guilty sometimes.

[Marlee]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

Well, and if your family's anything like mine, then you were definitely raised with a us against them kind of mentality. Like, this family got to be that fist type people. And, you know, you don't never really go against the family, never violate the. I get all that. I do My family, we. My cousin's husband called us a cult. He was like, y' all niggas be doing the absolute most. Child, you can't say nothing to us about us. And to a certain degree that's a great thing, but sometimes we take it a little too far. We hold onto stuff way longer than it needs to be held onto. Is it worth losing your niece, cousin, sister, daughter, whoever, behind this? No, absolutely not. So, like, but that's on them to let it go. All you can do is be open to having the conversation when they're ready to really have, you know, an honest dialogue about it. Other than that, girl, keep taking your meds, keep seeing your therapist. And yeah, sometimes you just gotta. I don't wanna minimize how hard it is to accept these things because it took me literal years, you know, it took years to accept the reality of things and to stop wishing that it could be different or hoping or, you know, just that little shred of maybe one day. Like, it's not that that possibility ever stops existing. It's that you stop holding onto it. You stop basing your emotions and your well being around that possibility and you start working with what is actually right in front of you right now.

[Max]

Yeah.

[Crystal]

Yeah. All right, Max. Anything else?

[Max]

No, just thank you for taking the time. I really appreciate you and you are doing amazing work.

[Crystal]

Thank you so much. Oh, that means a lot. I. You know, that is. That is exactly why I started the show. So thank you for that. I appreciate it.

[Max]

No problem.

[Crystal]

Take care. Bye. Oh, you guys, families are so tricky. But sometimes Annie and grandma and uncle and them, they be doing the most and wilding and we know that and we know that you just, sometimes you just gotta let them have their feelings. And I'll be over here when you're ready to step up out of them.

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[Crystal]

All right, y', all, I think we have time for one more. Who's up next?

[Marlee]

Hi, this is Marley. How are you?

[Welch's Fruit Snacks Sponsor]

Hi.

[Crystal]

I'm good, thank you. How are you?

[Marlee]

I'm doing good. Thank you for your time. Crystal, I'm not gonna overly stan, but just know I'm a years and years and years long fan and I would love to give you your flowers. If I can give you some of the herbal ones. I would. But let me give you your black girl flowers and just tell you that I really appreciate you throughout the years. Seriously.

[Crystal]

Thank you so much. That means a lot. I really, really appreciate it.

[Marlee]

Yes.

[Crystal]

What's going on with you, Marlee?

[Marlee]

All right, so let me get into it. So I am a mother of a teenager, so that in itself in this day and time is a lot. But I'm a single mom in Phoenix with a 17 year old daughter and for, I'd say more than a year now, closer to two, we've been searching for a therapist who truly feels, feels like the right fit for her. And she attends a predominantly white Catholic school in Phoenix, Arizona. And she shows up every single day as her full authentic self. A black girl with locks, a proud member of the beehive, refusing to conform to the swifty culture, and someone who refuses to shrink or reshape who she is just to belong. And I'll be honest, I know I've played a role in why she needs support in the first place. Like any parent, I've made mistakes and there are things that she's had to

[Max]

carry that I wish I could take back.

[Marlee]

I myself am in therapy and blessed enough to have found an amazing therapist for over a year now. And I appreciate again you for constantly encouraging us to get into therapy. But every time she Begins to open up to a therapist, something goes wrong. At one practice, she was shuffled between three different counselors in less than two months. More recently, another therapist missed appointments, leaving her waiting and disappointed. One after she had opened up about some trauma that she had as far as, you know, some historical trauma that was very tough for her. But she opened up and was vulnerable Even after her prior experience with being shuffled around. Now she's understandably, and I can notice, hesitant to trust the process. With that last counselor, it was a black woman. It's kind of tough to find that. But she had opened up and become vulnerable. And although she hasn't audibly said it to me, I am noticing that she is. Is starting to recoil from the process.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Marlee]

And it's heartbreaking to watch her retreat a little more each time she's let down. And even though I'm in therapy, I know how tough it can be when you get to those. You're ripping off band aids and you're getting to those vulnerable moments, and then you know you have somebody just flake on you.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Marlee]

And I try not to go mama bear on this last counselor myself. Like, I was very frustrated. At the end of the day, it's a business you should be conducting yourself. We're fortunate that insurance and cost aren't our biggest barriers, which somehow makes this even more frustrating. It feels like we've done everything right and still can't find her the consistent care that she deserves. So my question is, how do I help my daughter keep believing in therapy when therapy keeps giving her reasons not to?

[Crystal]

Yeah. Oof. That's a doozy. Cause you said your daughter's 17, so.

[Marlee]

College senior.

[Crystal]

Right? Right. And you guys are in, like, a major city, but it's also still pretty white, I'm guessing. Especially her environment. Yeah. Yeah. I thought it might be one of

[Marlee]

every 30 black girls, even at her school.

[Crystal]

Okay. Yeah. Does your therapist have any recommendations for therapists who see minors? Because sounds like you looked up and found a great one, and now you're struggling to find the same thing for your daughter. This is hard because part of. Part of the problem is was she seeing maybe interns at that first place? I'm curious as to why she was shuffled around between so many therapists in such a short amount of time.

[Marlee]

Those are both great questions. My therapist has definitely made recommendations, but unfortunately, who he has provided. Do not see minors. And I know we're right there at the cusp.

[Crystal]

Yeah.

[Marlee]

With that first entity. It was a state funded, like, sliding scale type of entity, so that may have contributed to it. They were counselors or registered therapists, but they, with two of them, they left the practice to go to a private practice.

[Crystal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marlee]

And then, you know, they weren't in network. And I've been so, I hate to say desperate that I'm, I'm even looking at out of network. And you know how that is. I mean, it's going to be. And she's a student athlete. I'm already, you know, at a Catholic school, so there already are funds there. But I'm so desperate where it's just like, can we get once a month at your rate? Can we see her a certain amount of times based on certain traumas? But yeah, so one was state funded and the other one was within network, but she just had poor business management. And I just feel like she's just kind of like, whatever, everything short of, I don't wanna really do this anymore.

[Crystal]

Right. So part of this is the problem with the first place. You said immediately when you were like, oh yeah, state fund is sliding scale. I'm like, oh yeah, they running through therapists quick. Cause most people are there, you know, they get in the hours, the experience or whatever, and then they going over to private practice where they can make some more steady money. But the second therapist, you know, this sort of like missing appointments and late and scheduling issues and stuff like that, unfortunately, that is, we. I think that's a lot more common when you're working with insurance. And it's not necessarily that there's something. I mean, yes, the therapist is dropping the ball here, but dealing with insurance is such a giant pain in the ass for mental health professionals. I mean, really, any healthcare professional will tell you doctor's offices have whole teams just to deal with insurance and the paperwork and the back and forth and what they'll pay and is this covered and your patient this and blah, blah, blah. They. Insurance has precious little to do with the actual care you receive. But these are adult problems. You know, these are things for adults to have to deal with and sift through and, you know, complain about capitalism and all that your minor child needs help. And so that's not, you know, that's not really her concern. And I wouldn't even say that that's something we need to try to get her to become more understanding of. I'm just saying it so that you have a better understanding of. Like, this is probably gonna be something I won't say you should expect to run into this issue because it shouldn't be happening. But anytime you can pay out of pocket or privately for health care, including mental health care, you're probably going to get better care because that therapist, like a therapist who doesn't take insurance, has so much more time to focus on clients. They don't have hours and hours and hours every week that they have to spend going back and forth with insurance and maybe getting paid, you know, $50 to see somebody and then they don't want to cover it or insurance feels like, you know, six sessions should be enough to work through PTSD or, you know, it's. I cannot overstate what a pain in the ass it is for a practitioner. So especially if they're by themselves, they don't have, you know, a bigger team to help them kind of deal with that. They're. They're going to be a lot more overworked. And so stuff is going to slip through the cracks. So it's not acceptable. But I do understand how it happens because of that.

[Marlee]

So.

[Crystal]

Because if it's possible for you to pay out of pocket for one or two sessions a month, I would recommend that. But also, when does your daughter, does she turn 18 soon?

[Marlee]

She is turning 18 right at the start of the year.

[Crystal]

Okay. At the top of next year. Okay. So you got another five or six months. Um, if you've tried to find an alternative, you know, as far as like paying out of pocket, seeing who is willing to see her, you know, on a monthly or bi weekly basis, I would try to do that. But also it may open up and become so much easier once she is legally an adult. Even though I understand why some therapists don't work with minors, I really do get it. Cause it comes with a whole other gamut of responsibilities and layers of stuff to sort through. And everybody is just not suited to working with kids. 17 is right there though. Like, it's right there. So I would definitely give it a try anyway with private pay, if that's something you can swing. But, but I mean, ultimately the goal is to find somebody that is covered under your insurance who can also provide regular, consistent, good care for your daughter. And I think probably the biggest issue you're gonna run into is like, is she even still willing to talk about it? Knowing that the foundation for that may be ripped away at some point. And this is, this is part of why it's so frustrating for practitioners in general, because they know that consistency in therapy is what helps to build the relationship, the therapeutic relationship. And that's when the real work can get started. But you're asking people to bear Some of their most painful wounds and experiences over and over again, you know, to different people, and they don't ever really see the fruits of that. I understand how your daughter, even if she hasn't vocalized it, how she's kind of retreating mentally from the idea because, like, damn, girl, I keep coming in here baring my soul and crying to y', all, and then a few weeks later, I'm not even meeting with this person anymore. Like, that'll throw anybody off. So it may be that she needs a few months. You know, maybe not in the pursuit of therapy. Maybe just. I'm assuming she's gonna enter her senior year of high school or she just finished. She's gonna enter her senior year. Okay. Yeah. So maybe she just needs to enjoy the rest of the summer. Summer is actually peak time for people to not go to therapy because they're like, oh, the sun's out, the weather's nice. I'm having margs at the poolside. You know, I'm not thinking about therapy. So there may be more therapists with more availability in August or September as well. But, you know, maybe she just needs some time to chill with her mom, get ready for senior year, you know, back to school, shopping and that sort of thing. I would also look into. I'm not sure how many groups are available for people her age or if it's appropriate to what she's gone through. If it's something specific, like sexual assault or losing a parent or something. Something like that, where we call it capital G grief. And there tends to be a lot more resources or, you know, people are putting. Or being a lot more intentional about the support that is offered for people who have gone through experiences like that. There may be, like, a group teen therapy that she resonates with, but also because of where you live, she's gonna probably be in group with a bunch of white kids who may. And, you know, part of the problem is that sometimes you can end up re traumatized in the pursuit of therapy, and she may be there. So that's why I'm saying it might be worth it to. I'm kind of spitballing and throwing out a few different ideas, but, you know, it may be worth it to spend some time out of therapy, looking at other things that could be options, but, you know, maybe waiting for her to say, ma, I think I'm ready to, you know, try it again. Or if you notice something is going on, she seems to be more depressed or anxious or withdrawing from the things she loves. Whatever school activities she's in or friends, things like that, then maybe we can be a little bit more aggressive with the search. But I think it's okay to just feel it out from here, and, you know, you don't stop looking. But we also have to have some understanding for your daughter and her experience. This would have turned me off of therapy. It would have. This would have frustrated me to no end, and I'm big and grown, so, you know that I think it's beyond understandable that she's maybe retreating a bit mentally. So I think you being in therapy, you continuing to show up for your daughter and is the best thing for her because you're modeling for her what therapy can do when you find the right practitioner. So you stick with it. You show her. You know, you see, Mommy's been in therapy. Mommy's growing and changing. Like, I'm putting to work these new things, and it's hard, but it's doable. You are your child's biggest teacher, her most primary source of inspiration. And so. So that seeing you do the work is gonna be probably the biggest thing that keeps her in the running for, you know, rejoining that process herself. But, yeah, it's understandable that she's over it. And I see how we got here, for sure.

[Marlee]

Yeah. No, those are some great. Some great feedback, and I'm blessed enough to have a therapist that's in my insurance, but he's been candid with me throughout the process, even super feeling. And please explain, like, you know, on paper, it may seem like only six visits, but we're gonna be here for years.

[Crystal]

Right?

[Marlee]

You know, But I do agree with maybe pulling back and then letting her come back to it. That's what happened the first time around where she was shuffled around. Yeah, she saw me in therapy and came back around like, hey, I want to do that too. But just continuing to look, and then.

[Crystal]

Yes.

[Marlee]

Have her come to me.

[Crystal]

Yes. Yes, for sure. And also, I would. If she goes back, either you talking to the therapist beforehand or her saying it herself. But, like, I've been through issues where. Or I've had experiences where I've tried to open up to therapists. I've been open to therapy, and it has not worked for this reason and this reason. So I would love to work with you, but I also want to make sure this is a good fit and that you're ready to commit to this process, which you should not have to say, because that is.

[Marlee]

That's where the. For lack of better words, kid fury in me almost came out. Oh, Yeah, I had a consultation with her and I told her everything.

[Crystal]

Oh, you did?

[Marlee]

And she still flaked on us like this. So it was just like.

[Crystal]

So you tried that. And it. See, you know, and that comes back to. All therapists are not created equal. Just like all doctors, all nurses, all anybody. And unfortunately, you know, you can get excellent care. Like yourlike your therapist. You can get excellent care from a therapist who takes insurance and just deals with that. And you can get substandard care from somebody who was forewarned and still decided to be on fuck. Shit. Like, that's the sort of thing like, girl, I hope you reported her. I hope you. I hope you said something. Yeah, tell the state that she is abandoning her responsibility as a therapist. Cause that license means something, girl. Like, I understand you might be overwhelmed, but you gotta tighten up, especially when it comes to the minors. That's how I. You know. But y' all know how I feel about kids, so.

[Marlee]

Mm.

[Crystal]

Mm.

[Marlee]

Those are definitely some strongly worded letters.

[Crystal]

Yes. Because this is. I mean, this is her professional obligation. And your daughter deserves consistency. And every fucking therapist knows that that consistency is required in order for therapy to work. So, yeah, I would. I would tell state, like, maybe we don't need to snatch her license, but y' all need to poke her in the back or something and be like, hey, tighten up.

[State Farm Sponsor]

Exactly.

[Marlee]

Well, thank you so much for your feedback.

[Crystal]

Of course. Of course. Thank you, Marlee, for calling in. And I am wishing you and your daughter the absolute best.

[Marlee]

Thank you so much.

[Crystal]

Thank you, babe.

[Marlee]

You have a good one.

[Crystal]

Take care. Bye. Boy, nothing burns my biscuits more than therapists who ain't doing what the hell they supposed to do. But don't get me started. I'll be in here all night ranting and raving about it. Oh, that is gonna wrap up the live callers this week. Thank you so much to everyone who called in. If you're interested in chatting with me live, send me an email. Advicerystlescouch.com Follow Us Online at Crystal's Couch and we'll see you next week.

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[Crystal]

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[Crystal]

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[Crystal]

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