Season 7, Episode 24: Mary and Roxanna's Top Reads of 2024!

Summary

Episode Summary: Season 7, Episode 24 - "Mary and Roxanna's Top Reads of 2024!"

Release Date: January 20, 2025

In this heartfelt and insightful episode of Currently Reading, hosts Mary Heim and Roxanna Kasamkara delve into their favorite books of 2024. As bookish best friends, they share their annual reading statistics, celebrate their top picks, and offer thoughtful recommendations to help listeners discover their next great read.

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1. Reflecting on the Year: Reading Statistics

Mary Heim begins by discussing her reading habits over the past year:

• Total Books Read: 84
  • Print: 59%
  • Digital: 24%
  • Audio: 17%
• Genre Breakdown:
  • Fiction: 94%
  • Nonfiction: 6%
  • Adult Novels: 71%
  • Middle Grade: 16%
  • Young Adult: 7%
  • New Adult: 6%
• Diversity in Authors:
  • Male Authors: 14%
  • Female and Non-Binary Authors: 86%
• Own Voices Representation: 18%

Mary emphasizes the importance of tracking her reading habits, noting, “[00:50] Mary Heim: ...I read 84 books this year, which is pretty average for me...” She appreciates the balance between fiction and nonfiction, acknowledging that while most of her reading serves as a comfort and escape, the nonfiction selections were impactful, with two books making her top ten.

Roxanna Kasamkara shares her own reading statistics:

• Total Books Read: 70 (down from 83 the previous year)
  • Five-Star Ratings: 19 (12 were rereads)
  • Genre Breakdown:
    • Fiction: 81%
    • Nonfiction: 19% (primarily memoirs)
    • Mystery: 16%
    • General Fiction: 31%
    • Romance: 17%
    • Fantasy: 14%
• Diversity in Authors: 10% People of Color (PoC)

Roxanna reflects on a challenging year, highlighting personal struggles that influenced her reading choices. She remarks, “[05:07] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...my reading had to serve me more than me serving my reading...” Her selection process favored books that resonated emotionally, with an emphasis on comfort and introspection.

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2. Top 10 Books of 2024

Mary and Roxanna each present their top ten books of the year, offering detailed descriptions, personal anecdotes, and alternative recommendations to cater to varied reading tastes.

Roxanna's Top 10 for 2024

1. "Hotel Nantucket" by Ellen Hildebrandt
   A charming tale set in a newly renovated hotel in Nantucket, featuring quirky characters and a ghostly presence. Roxanna praises it as, “[10:51] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...the best book about a hotel that I read.”

   • Alternative Recommendation: "The Home Wreckers" by Mary Kay Andrews
     A delightful summer romp set in Savannah, blending reality show antics with a darker mystery.

2. "10,000 Doors of January" by Alix E. Harrow
   An absorbing adventure with beautiful writing and fantastical elements. Roxanna describes it as, “[20:24] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...a perfect escape. So if you haven't picked this one up, this really is one that's just beautiful and fantastical.”

   • Alternative Recommendation: "The Last Dragoners of Bobasar" by Indra Das
     A coming-of-age story blending cultural identity with magical realism.

3. "Where Are We At?"
   (Details not provided in the transcript.)

4. "Hotline" by Dimitri Nasrallah
   A Canada Reads finalist offering a deep dive into the immigrant experience and personal redemption. Roxanna notes, “[17:11] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...it's one of those books that makes you feel something about the world.”

5. "Fellowship Point" by Alice Elliott Dark
   An atmospheric novel exploring friendship and land conservation among octogenarians in Maine. Roxanna reflects, “[32:02] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...a beautiful saga that just exactly what I wanted to sink into.”

6. "Be Ready when the Luck Happens" by Ina Garten
   A memoir celebrating creativity and overcoming challenges with grace. Roxanna shares, “[62:28] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...her unconventional solutions that lead to a success that was even better than what would have happened if she'd avoided the problem altogether inspired me.”

7. "Matrix" by Lauren Groff
   A powerful narrative about a woman’s rise to power in a medieval abbey, blending historical drama with personal triumph. Roxanna describes it as, “[70:07] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...a short book, but it is so beautifully written and yeah, so powerful.”

8. "A Letter to the Luminous Deep" by Sylvie Cathral
   An epistolary fantasy novel set in an underwater regency world, exploring themes of identity and mental health. Roxanna praises, “[53:35] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...the world building, like I said in this story, was to die for.”

9. "Death in the Dark Woods" by Anneliese Ryan
   The second installment in a Wisconsin-based mystery series, blending local folklore with gripping suspense. Roxanna comments, “[20:24] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...a really fun, under the radar mystery.”

10. "Pumpkin Princess and the Forever Knight" by Stephen Banbury
    A magical middle-grade novel perfect for the spooky season, featuring a heartwarming father-daughter relationship. Roxanna enthuses, “[58:30] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...it is such a special reading experience and also it is such a special book.”

Mary's Top 10 for 2024

1. "Sandwich" by Kathryn Newman
   An emotionally resonant narrative exploring parenthood, aging, and the complexities of family dynamics. Mary shares, “[71:18] Mary Heim: ...everything about this was a perfect experience to me and I think the reading of this book is one of those really special ones that's going to stick with me for the rest of my life.”

2. "A Letter to the Luminous Deep" by Sylvie Cathral
   (Also Roxanna’s topic #8.)
   Mary highlights its immersive world-building and nuanced depiction of OCD, stating, “[65:00] Mary Heim: ...it really is and I can't wait to see how the story wraps up in book two.”

3. "Be Ready when the Luck Happens" by Ina Garten
   (Also Roxanna’s topic #6.)
   Mary emphasizes Ina’s approach to problem-solving, noting, “[49:28] Mary Heim: ...this is one that is probably most recommended to my therapy clients.”

4. "The Wedding People" by Alison Espach
   A transformative story that begins bleakly but evolves into a quirky and hopeful narrative about authentic living. Mary remarks, “[51:39] Mary Heim: ...it falls into that category that I love, which is stories that make you feel something about being human.”

5. "Total Left Turn" by Rufi Thorpe
   (Roxanna mentions an alternative recommendation but details for Mary are limited in the transcript.)

6. "The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle" by Emily and Amelia Nagoski
   (Also Roxanna’s topic #4.)
   Mary notes its research-backed strategies and compassionate tone, saying, “[48:22] Roxanna Kasamkara: ...it's 100% research backed. These are two very smart women.”

7. "The Lost Story" by Meg Shafer
   A compelling narrative reminiscent of Narnia, exploring themes of found family and forgiveness. Mary shares, “[36:12] Mary Heim: ...it has major Narnia vibes, but in the more adult way.”

8. "The Millicent Quibb School of Etiquette for Young Ladies of Mad Science" by Kate McKinnon
   (Also Roxanna’s topic #2.)
   Mary praises Kate McKinnon's performance in the audio version, describing it as, “[14:29] Mary Heim: ...it is especially, especially pick up on audio because the performance from Kate McKinnon herself reading the book is probably what tipped the scales.”

9. "Bit Much" by Lindsay Rush
   A poignant and accessible poetry collection capturing the nuances of being a woman in today’s world. Mary states, “[30:14] Mary Heim: ...a perfect place to start to add to your poetry TBR.”

10. "Total Left Turn" by Rufi Thorpe
    (Roxanna lists it as #5, but Mary’s position isn't explicitly detailed in the transcript.)

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3. Notable Insights and Recommendations

Throughout the episode, Mary and Roxanna emphasize the importance of:

• Diverse Representation: Both hosts value books that feature a variety of voices and perspectives, whether through author diversity or thematic exploration.

• Emotional Resonance: They prioritize books that offer emotional depth, whether through personal memoirs or fiction that mirrors real-life struggles.

• Accessible Storytelling: Many of their top picks are praised for their accessible writing styles, making complex themes approachable for a wide audience.

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4. Concluding Thoughts

Mary and Roxanna wrap up the episode by expressing gratitude for sharing their literary journeys and encouraging listeners to explore the recommended titles. They highlight the joy of discovering under-the-radar gems and the comfort of revisiting favorite reads.

Mary Heim concludes with a heartfelt endorsement, “[75:36] Mary Heim: ...May your coffee be hot and may your book be unputdownable. Happy reading.”

Roxanna Kasamkara echoes the sentiment, “[75:41] Roxanna Kasamkara: Mary. Happy reading.”

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Notable Quotes

• Mary Heim: “[00:50] ...I read 84 books this year, which is pretty average for me.”

• Roxanna Kasamkara: “[05:07] ...my reading had to serve me more than me serving my reading.”

• Mary Heim: “[70:49] ...the reading of this book is one of those really special ones that's going to stick with me for the rest of my life.”

• Roxanna Kasamkara: “[62:28] ...she has such a verb for life.”

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Final Recommendations

Mary and Roxanna encourage listeners to engage with their favorite selections, explore alternative recommendations for varied tastes, and utilize tracking tools like the Currently Reading Podcast Reading Tracker to enhance their own reading experiences.

Tune in to Season 7, Episode 24 of Currently Reading to immerse yourself in Mary and Roxanna's literary reflections and discover books that could become your next favorites!

Transcript

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Foreign.

[Mary Heim]

Welcome to the Currently Reading podcast. We are bookish best friends who spend time every week talking about the books that we've read recently. And as you know, we don't shy away from having strong opinions, so be ready.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

We are light on the chit chat, heavy on the book talk, and our descriptions will always be spoiler free.

[Mary Heim]

I'm Mary Heim, a therapist and mom of one living in Wisconsin, and I cannot believe we are already filling out our 2025 reading trackers.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And I'm Roxanna Kasamkara, a mom, a marketer and a mood reader living in Toronto, Canada. And 2024 was a roller coaster of a reading year for me. This is episode 24 of season seven and we're so glad you are here, friends.

[Mary Heim]

Roxanna, I am so glad to be here with you recording this very special episode today, listeners. This is going to be the books of the year for Roxanna and myself. One of my favorite episodes of the year to record. I'm so excited to talk with you about your books today, Roxanna, and here. You always put so many good ones on my list. So I'm really, really excited to do this with you today.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Me too, Mary. And I'll say some of the ones you chose last year made it into my top 10 this year, so I can't wait to talk about them. But before we start, I'd love to hear what was your reading year like?

[Mary Heim]

Yeah, so Roxanna, I think if you'll recall, last year I was still struggling to get in the groove of using my currently reading podcast Reading Tracker, the incredible spreadsheet that Katie had created. And it was kind of like my dirty little secret. Like, oh, I'm really bad at updating this, but this year I did commit tracking more thoroughly. I still haven't tracked as thoroughly as I would like to. I'm excited to get a little more in the weeds with it this year, but I think I finally got myself a good setup for updating, keeping everything up to snuff, and I was really excited to get to look at those stats. So a little bit of my highlights this year. I read 84 books this year, which is pretty average for me. In the last five or so years since having a kiddo, 59% of those were in print, 24% were digital, and 17 were on audio, which feels about right for this stage of my Life. I read 94% fiction, which means only 6% nonfiction, which is a number I know I should probably want to work on. But I'm also not too bothered by it right now. My reading is just really serving to act as a comfort, a joy, an escape for me. I just don't tend to find a ton of that in nonfiction. However, the nonfiction I did read worked really well for me as evidenced by there being two in my top 10 this year, holding two spots in my top 10. So I'm pretty happy with that balance. It's fine for me right now. I read 71% adult novel, like adult fiction or novels, 16% middle grade, 7% young adult, which is shocking to me and 6% new adult. It is really interesting that I think the middle grade and the YA numbers probably used to be flipped, but I'm really finding more enjoyment in middle grade than YA lately. So that doesn't surprise me a ton. I'm wondering if it might be, you know, the age we're starting to enter with my daughter, I'm seeing some of her kind of represented and I just really love, I really love good middle grade. So that's a new thing for me this year and I'm totally leaning into it. I thought this one was interesting and pretty indicative. 14% of my authors were dudes, 86% female and non binary, which is a number I'm pretty proud of. I have no intent on changing as it's serving me and my reading enjoyment really well. I realized that this year, like I just don't tend to enjoy books written by men as much as I enjoy books written by women and non binary folks. And that was really represented in my tracking numbers. And about 18% of my reads were own voices, which is a stat that I'm going to be actively working on raising this raising in the new year and that is what I tracked. This is the first year, like I said, that I started to get more into the nitty gritty of the spreadsheet by the numbers. And now that I've got my system down, I'm really excited to be a little more thorough and how I track and get even more of those statistics. But it was really cool and fun to see. And so here's my plug that Katie and Meredith did not ask me to make that like, hey, if you, you haven't used the reading tracker, maybe give it a try this year if you are one of our bookish friends in Patreon. It is really, really incredible. It was really cool to see this and I think in a year that also felt a little hard for me. I, I really love all my top 10 books, but it's not. I didn't have the hardest time calling them down this year. Let's say that.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Yes.

[Mary Heim]

And so it was good for me to see this and say, okay, now I can really focus on leaning into what I know works for me or if there's areas that I can see, really didn't. I can work on adjusting from there too. So those were my stats, Roxanna, I'm really curious about yours.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Well, it looks like you had some pretty robust stats for a year where you said, you know, you didn't track as much. That's pretty good, Mary. And I will say I'm with you. I didn't track for a number of years. I think I was just honestly intimidated by the tracker. And then I think I heard like Meredith and Katie talking about their stats and the bookish friends people were talking and I got a lot of fomo.

[Mary Heim]

Yes. Like, what the hell?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Goodreads tells me nothing. I don't know anything about my reading. And I actually went back that year and was like, okay, well I'm just going to retroactively put them in. And I picked three fields like Katie always tells us to do. Hide the ones you don't need. And I did three fields and I entered just those fields for whatever, however many books I had that year and was so like, honestly, like just wowed by the stats that I was like, okay, I'm going to do this every year. And then the next year I started, I added maybe two more fields. Then I've added two more fields and I've been doing it for a couple of years. And it's really, really helpful and helpful for me because my reading life is often a reflection of my actual life. And so this year I could really see that in my stats. So this year we were talking off episode for a bit. Mary. I said it was a hard year for me. You know, my dad had a stroke, my parents living situation has to change. You know, they're getting older. I left one job, started a new job, you know, had kind of some ups and downs there. It's amazing. I love my job, but it is in a new field with completely kind of a new industry and I'm building a team from scratch and we have a major growth trajectory. So I just had to devote a lot of brain space there, which was amazing but kind of very different from the year I'd had before. And just, you know, made my reading like you said, my reading had to serve me more than me serving my reading, which is, I think, honestly what it should always do. Right. So I was just like, I'm going to just lean into whatever I need this year and read what I need to read. And my brain was kind of mush. You know, I'm also. This is a lot of TMI guys. So I'm sorry, but you know, I'm going through perimenopause. My anxiety was through the roof. I really could like not get myself to read hard things. Like I really. Not even hard things. Like basically anything that wasn't the equivalent of mental mashed potatoes was. It was a tough year for that. So I'm really excited. I have an incredible top 10. But like you, it wasn't that hard to put together in the end. So. Because I think, you know, I just had that kind of reading year. So I had. I read 70 books in 2024. That's down quite a bit. I had had 83 books in 2023, but I just had less time to read this year. So I was, you know, good with that. I had 19 five star books, which is similar to last year, but 12 were rereads. I really leaned the rereads this year.

[Mary Heim]

Yes.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Because I just needed them. Right. So I think that meant that I didn't have as many five stars. I did have another 24, four plus stars. So that was like. I did have a good selection of them, but as I said, a lot of them I went back and reread. I had 81% fiction, 19% non fiction, which is higher than previous years. And a lot of those were memoirs, which worked really well for me. So, you know, I had 31% general fiction, 16% mystery. Those are kind of the same. 14% memoir, as I said, it was 10% last year and 3% the year before. So I'm really loving that. I love memoirs of older women. When it sounds like I'm just kind of sitting in a coffee shop talking like real stuff with them. It really works for me. So I love that I had 17% romance and 14% fantasy, which was also higher. So I love that I read a lot of mix of genres and that really worked for me. And I always love that. I like to go back and forth. I like to have a really diverse reading life, I will say, because of all the rereading and because I really just didn't have bandwidth to look for new books this year. I just read 10% PoC authors and that's low for me and not actually like that's a value I hold close. Like I really want to be representing different authors also from different countries and different worldviews. And I didn't feel like I did that this year. But that was really helpful because already I've read four books for January and they're all poc. So that's where the reading tracker, you know, you kind of give yourself grace and hold space for things where you're like, well, that, that's, you know, that was the year it was. And then other things when you're like, well, I really want to change that, you go ahead and change it. So I thought it was a good reading year, an okay reading year. But I will say I had some great books. So I chose books that I am still thinking about. They might have been my favorite books, they might have been my best books, but overall they're books I'm still thinking about. I read plenty of 4.5s and 5s that I'm not thinking about anymore.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So I didn't include those. So that's what you're going to hear. Books I'm still thinking about. And because we're doing this later in the year, Mary, I thought, you know, people have heard some of the same books over and over from other people's best of lists. So where there's a book that, you know, you may have heard before or was on a lot of lists, I'm gonna just share an alternate that might be an under the radar book because I know people like to get that from me and something that's, you know, kind of the same vibe so that you can add to your TBR too.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, I love that, Roxanna. And you are the queen of under the radar, excellent under the radar picks. So I did not do anything quite so cool. But I will be really, I'm like excited to hear and listen to that and see what you brought. I love it. Well, do you want to get us started with your number 10 book for this year?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Sure. So. Okay, so I'll get started. Number 10 for me was a favorite reading experience and it was Hotel Nantucket by Ellen Hildebrandt. So, you know, no one's going to call this great literature, but I will say I really loved this book. You know, if I had to choose a superlative, I'd say this is the best book about a hotel that I read. I love hotel books, you know, and it was just what I needed when I needed it. This is Ellen Hildebrand at her best. It's got this incredible setting of a brand new renovated hotel in Nantucket. Of course, quirky characters. It's even got a ghost. It's a very fun reading experience. The plot centers around Lisbeth Keaton, who is like this Nantucket sweetheart, and she's hired to manage the Hotel Nantucket, which is this fancy hotel that's been renovated from the original that burned down from a fire in 1922. And the plot really centers around the various shenanigans of the staff and guests, as well as the ghosts of a chambermaid that died in that fire. So I love hotel books because I love the way all those kind of guests come together and the different, you know, it's like a saga of all, you know, how they interact. So this was a really fun one. I thought she pulled it off really, really well. It had some really interesting characters that were fleshed out. And then for an I'll present an alt because, you know, Ellen Hildebrand everybody's heard of. So I'm going to share one that if you have read that one and you want something with similar vibes, I would suggest the Home Wreckers by Mary Kay Andrews, which is a delightful summer romp with a great sense of place. It's set in Savannah and the main character is cast in a beach house renovation reality show. And the action goes from there. It's got a darker mystery underpinning it and it's just a great, fun summer read. So something to add to your list for, you know, June, July, August.

[Mary Heim]

I love that, Roxanna. I've read maybe five or six Ellen Hildebrand books, and that one, Hotel Nantucket, is my favorite. I love the, the ghosty element just adds a little something fun to it. It's not like spooky by any means, but it's got this like almost kind of voicey, quirky historical fiction bent to a very modern current novel. And I will say you are the one who put Homewreckers on my my own tbr. And I have it on my shelf to read this summer, whether I saw it on Instagram or wherever you. I'm excited to read that one. And I think you picked a good one, especially if someone hadn't read any Ellen Hildebrand yet. That's a good, a good beach bag book for sure.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that.

[Mary Heim]

Love it. All right, Roxanna, my number 10 book is the Millicent Quibb School of Etiquette for Young Ladies of Mad Science by Kate McKinnon.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Wow, that's a mouthful.

[Mary Heim]

That is a mouthful of a title. I spoke about this one on my most recent episode of the podcast. So, Roxanna, you haven't heard this yet? Because I think it is the episode that is dropping tomorrow when we are recording this. But folks who are listening to this episode, I spoke about it last week, so I won't go too much into a rehashing. But this book was pure Kate McKinnon march to the beat of your own drum. And I just loved it. It is middle grade, but truly the type of middle grade that really defies the genre. This is one to especially, especially pick up on audio because the performance from Kate McKinnon herself reading the book is probably what tipped the scales to put this one on my top 10 list. The book itself was really fun, really great, a great story, but her performance is just next level. I laughed out loud. I got all the found family female empowerment vibes, felt the big hopeful feels and cannot wait to continue this series. That was the Millicent Quibb School of Etiquette for Young Ladies of Mad Science.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

By Kate McKinnon already added to my TBR.

[Mary Heim]

Do you see that, Mary? I love it. I was hoping, and I will say.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Last year, I think you put Emily Wilde's encyclopedia theories on my list and you're the queen of January. February, like escapist reads. When I need to just kind of dissociate, as you said, and just kind of, you know, just dive into something warm, I turn to you because I like those books really got me through. I think I listened to them both and then I listened to them again because I just needed an escape in Chan Feb. And they were so good. So this one sounds like a great escapist. Jan Fabrid. I'm gonna for sure add it to my list.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, I love it. Yes. I think this is gonna really work for you right now, Roxanna, and I am honored. That is the best title you could have ever given me. I love it. Okay. All right. What is your number? 9.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So my number 9 is called hotline by Dimitri Nasrallah, and the superlative for this is the best book I didn't like that ended up on my top 10 list. So, you know, I said some of these books were my favorite books and some of these books were best books. So I'd say Hotel Nantucket was a favorite book. This book was a best book. So I decided to pick up Hotline because it was a Canada Reads finalist and it was long listed for the Giller, which is the biggest literary prize here in Canada. The plot centers around Muna Haddad and her son, who moved to Montreal from le Madon in 1986. It's got a bunch of 80s vibes. You know, Muna leaves behind a civil war, and she tries to find work as a French teacher in Montreal, but no one in Quebec trusts her to teach the language. So she ends up as a weight loss center hotline operator, like, almost like a nutrition counselor. And she ends up talking to Montrealers all day that wouldn't talk to her on the street, but they kind of tell her their deepest, darkest secrets. And this is based on Dimitri Nasrallah's real life experience of his mom, who did exactly this. Moved here from Lebanon, couldn't find a job as a French teacher, ended up working at this weight loss center. It is so beautifully written. It's written in Muna's voice and has sort of piercing insights. You kind of feel like she's sitting down with you over a cup of coffee and, you know, telling you her story, and you just immediately get wrapped up in it. It's personal, it's intimate, and it's absorbing, but at the same time, it's super accessible. You know, it reminds me a lot of how not to drown in a glass of water. I just really love this one. You know, it's sadder than I usually read, which is why I said, you know, it's not a book I would normally like, but the beautiful writing, the unique premise, and the insights that, you know, pierce me, that I still think about a lot made me put this on my list.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah, I can see where that would land. Right. It's like a great book. It's not necessarily a book you're gonna hug because it made you feel happy and joyful about the world, but it is one of those books that makes you feel something about the world. Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Well, and I will say it is redemptive. For people who are wondering, it does end on a redemption note. Well, quite a bit of redemption. So it is beautiful like that, and it is something. If you're looking for really great writing and a unique perspective, that's one to pick up.

[Mary Heim]

I love that. I love that. Well, Roxanna, my number nine book is total left turn from yours. Mine is Death in the Dark woods by Anneliese Ryan. You might remember me bringing the first book in this series, a Death in Door county, to the big show last year. This is the second in this author's Wisconsin monster hunters mystery series, which is just a ridiculous couple of words pieced together, but it follows a series of deaths involving a supposed Bigfoot. Color me just as surprised as anybody that this ended up on my top 10 list this year. But I think what really sold me on its place in the list is the sheer excitement I have for the next book in this series releasing later this month. I was putting together my list and I just kept coming back to this one as a reading experience that I fully enjoyed. These mysteries are so sense of placey in Wisconsin, full of weird and interesting facts about my state. And in my opinion, the mysteries just keep getting better and better with each installment. The first one was fun. I enjoyed it because I read it Indoor county. The second one, I was like, oh, yeah, she's starting to hit her stride with telling these stories. So I'm really excited to see where it goes next. This is a very niche pick that I certainly don't think is going to be a five star top 10 book for everybody, but it was so solidly enjoyable and the Wisconsin ties just really made this one for me. That is Death in the Dark woods by Annalise Ryan.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that. And I remember you putting this on my radar when you brought that first one. I love books that have a sense of place that you don't normally hear about. You know, we get a lot of New York. We get a lot of Paris. You know, you don't get a lot of Wisconsin.

[Mary Heim]

No.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

That's really cool.

[Mary Heim]

Wisconsin is really quirky, and I love that about my state. And there's a lot of history and there's a lot of cool facts. I mean, every place has its history and cool stuff. But of course, I feel especially tied to repping mine, my sense of place. So I really enjoy this one and I think it's got, you know, it's just like a fun midwestern experience. I notice when my attention is low, I like a book to propel me. Right. These totally hit that vibe. I'm keeping turning the pages because I want to find out is it really a Bigfoot or not? So I really enjoyed that one. The next book is about the Hodag, which is like a mythical Wisconsin beast that is, like, really rooted in the quirky, campy vibes of kind of mythology. So I'm really excited to keep going with this series, and it's a really fun, under the radar mystery. If that sounds sounds like something that y'all would enjoy, I highly recommend it.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that. Okay, so my number eight is one that Meredith pressed into my hands several years ago, and I finally got to it, and it was amazing. It's the 10,000 doors of January by Alex E. Harrow. You know, this book, I don't need to say a lot about it. Everybody's seen it everywhere. It's a beautiful writing, an absorbing adventure, a story I could just get lost in. I read this in January, and as I said, it was such a satisfying saga and a perfect escape. So if you haven't picked this one up, this really is one that's just beautiful and fantastical and the POV is amazing. So I would for sure pick it up. As I said, I'll recommend an alternate for a book that's super, you know, been everywhere. And so my alternate here is called the Last Dragoners of Bobasar by Indra Das. So this is a story of Rue, who is a boy in Calcutta that doesn't fit in and know his identity. He's neither Christian nor Muslim nor Buddhist. He's not brown or white or Chinese. And you know, in India, it's like, for sure, racially so diverse. But people want to put you in your box, right? So he has a really hard time at school because people don't know what to call him. He himself doesn't know what his culture is. But he has these haunting flashbacks of his grandmother taking to this field behind their house and showing him this special bush with these seed pods. And she took down a seed pod. And when she opened it, it wasn't a seed pod, but a dragon. And those seed pods were the wings and it was like a baby dragon. So he has like these memories, like kind of these strange haunting experiences. But his family makes him drink this tea of forgetting after each experience so he'll forget his origins because they want him to better integrate with his other Indian classmates. They feel like if he knows too much about his past, he won't be able to move forward. So he has kind of these haunting experiences that are almost subconscious. And he doesn't know what's true and what's not, you know, so this is really a story about cultural identity coming of age. The questions we struggle with. How much of you do you hold on of your own identity? How much do you let go to integrate? It's a really beautiful story and it has a really satisfying conclusion. You know, where he's struggling with these concerns. And then how he kind of. How he comes to that, how, you know, how he finds out his identity? It's haunting, it's incandescent. It has a really like. The vibe is very like. It does feel a bit like, is it a memory? Is it a dream? But it's only 119 pages. He does so much like Indra Das does so much in these pages. And it just felt to me. Like, if you really liked those parts of the 10,000 doors of January, the identity, the coming of age, the, you know, knowing who you are in a fantastical world, then this might be a great fit. It's the Last Dragoners of Bobasar by Indra Das.

[Mary Heim]

That one you immediately sold me. I don't know if you saw me adding to my TBR as you were talking, but that one sounds excellent and I can totally see how it would have a nice like, connection tie to some of the things that so many of us really enjoyed about 10,000 doors of January. I love that.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So glad.

[Mary Heim]

All right, Roxanna, My number eight this year is Cabin off the Grid Adventures with a Clueless Craftsman by Patrick Hutchinson. This is another one I spoke about on my most recent episode of the podcast just last week week as y'all are listening to this. But just in case you missed that deeper dive, I called it Bill Bryson for Millennials. And that's really all you need to know about it. It was voicey, propulsive narrative nonfiction about a guy who decides to refurbish a very humble hundred square foot cabin in the rural Pacific Northwest. And it truly felt to me like cozying up near a fire, unplugging from the world. Getting back to basics. This one came at the perfect time for me when I was very intentionally taking a step back from the Internet and social media. And it really hit home for me the importance of connecting with my very 3D world in front of me instead of the one on my phone. And I really, really enjoyed this story. I too have been leaning into the rereads this year for some comfort and I can already tell, I think this is one that I'm going to dig back into and read again. That was off the Grid Adventures with a Clueless Craftsman by Patrick Hutchinson.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

See, I love that. Like, I've not heard about that book anywhere. Mary. Same with your last one. And I love hearing these books that are like, I wouldn't have heard of it. Sounds perfect. Especially for like a Jan Feb unplug, like cocooning kind of time. And non fiction. But not, not heavy, hard non fiction. Like you know, something you could really dive into and learn a lot from but also have a lot of fun reading.

[Mary Heim]

Yes, it was really fun. This is not an instruction manual on how to refurbish a cabin. This is like hear all about his kooky misadventures. Some of the chapters I was like, okay, maybe you can dial it back a little bit here. But overall, I really enjoyed this experience so voicey. The kind of narrative nonfiction that I really enjoy. You can tell he has a history as a journalist, so the writing is really solid. And he does such a good job of taking you through it. The whole time, I kept trying to Google, you know, ironically, as I'm saying, I'm trying to step away from my phone, but I'm like, what does this. His cabin is on the road, is called Wit's End. So I'm trying to see what does it look like? And, you know, because he's doing such a good job of painting this picture, I really just wanted to be fully in it. It was really fun. It's good nonfiction if. Even if you're not a nonfiction reader, it read a lot like fiction. So that one was really enjoyable. I hope to see it get some more buzz.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

It's on my TBR for sure.

[Mary Heim]

Love it. All right, Roxanna, what's up next for you?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Well, this one might sound familiar to you, Mary. It's easier than you think. The Buddhist Way to Happiness by Sylvia Boorstein.

[Mary Heim]

Yay.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So, Mary, you convinced me to read this. I think at our top 10 of 2023, it was on your list. And honestly, it was just what I needed. So I know my Goodreads review was, can I give a book 7 stars? This book is life changing. Audio is the only way to go. Sylvia is the Jewish Buddhist bubby I didn't know I needed. And that's, you know, exactly what this book is. It's technically, it's a guidebook in basic Buddhist teachings and principles, but really, it's a bomb for a weary and frustrated soul. If you listen on audio, which you told me was a must, and you were 100% right, it feels like your Jewish bubby telling you her life stories over a bowl of matzo ball soup and dropping truth bombs on you at every turn. It's warm and comforting, but it's also really honest. You know, like she tells you, look, life is full of pain and suffering, sister. You know, every relationship you have will end in loss and separation, which is not the most uplifting message, but it's also true, right? And especially for me in midlife, seeing my parents age, like, it's just the truth. But then she goes on to say, listen, pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional. And I think that's actually the line you said at the 2023 top 10 books that I was like, okay, I need to read this book. Because what she says is suffering is manageable. And it mostly comes from our resistance to A situation, and we can manage that. And she talks about how to do that using examples from her own life when she was successful and when she was not successful, which I really love. Right. Like. Like this sits with me. When she went to, like, this Buddhist silent retreat and it was Halloween and they put a piece of candy on her cushion and she was like, but I don't like this candy. Could I trade this candy with somebody else? Would that be bad? Does that look like it's bad? And like, to hear somebody who's like a Buddhist teacher having these kinds of trivial thoughts in their head just like I do. Yeah. Was really reassuring. She's not like, she's not teaching you from on high.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

She's with you, you know?

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And her voice is so comforting. It streams over you like water. So I found this book so helpful this year. I turned to it over and over again. I didn't read it like a guide to Buddhist teaching. She has a lot of principles and frameworks in there, but to be honest, I didn't pay much attention to the structure. I just listened to her tell me her life advice and took what was helpful. And it really did save me this year. So that's. It's easier than you think. The Buddhist Way to Happiness by Sylvia Bernstein.

[Mary Heim]

Roxanna, of course, I am so thrilled that you loved this one. That it did for you so much that it did for me. I hate. Right. That you needed it, but I also loved that it was there for you. I. We talked about this a little off mic before we started as well, but I am rereading this one right now because it really is comforting. There's something so amazing about how human Sylvia Boorstein is and so wise and, like, really great permission that, like, we're all. We're not supposed to experience life from, like, this really lofty, inaccessible place, but there's ways that, you know, we can be humans experiencing our human experience and also don't have to suffer so much. Like you said, it really is a balm. I'm thrilled that it worked well for you. And if I can just keep preaching the gospel of Sylvia Boorstein, the secular, secular gospel. I just want everyone to read this book. Book when they're having a hard time. I'm really glad I worked for you.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Thank you. Thank you for putting this on my list. Honestly. It was a gem of 2024.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, I'm so glad. All right, well, Roxanna, My number seven is a Bit Much by Lindsay Rush. This is a poetry collection. It's another one I've brought to the big show before, but it is truly so much fun. So poignant. Perfectly meeting me where I'm at at this stage in my life. Whether you are a poetry reading veteran or you've never dipped your toes into the genre, this one is a perfect place to start to add to your poetry. Tbr. I love how Lindsay Rush just perfectly captures the experience of being a woman in the world in this day and age in a way that is both laugh out loud hilarious and simultaneously incisive and just so spot on. Her Instagram handle is at maryoliversdrunk Cousin, and I can't think of a better way to describe her writing. I like to think if Mary Oliver were still with us, she'd grab a glass of wine and laugh and cry right along to Lindsay's poetry just like the rest of us. That is a bit much by Lindsay Rush.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

You know what, Mary? I actually followed her on Instagram after hearing you on the big show talk about this one. I love Mary Oliver. I read Winter Hours a few years ago and loved it. And so when you said Mary Oliver's drunk cousin, like 100 in. Yep, and you're right, she is so. She delivers those insights so beautifully, but so concisely. I love to see a poetry book on your list. And this one, your write is super accessible. So for people who are like, ooh, poetry. Like, just follow her on Instagram, read a few, and you will be in and you will want to read this book.

[Mary Heim]

Yes, a hundred percent. Oh, I'm so glad that I got to be the one to introduce you to her, Roxanna. Mary Oliver, of course, is in a category all her own, but I think so with Lindsay Rush. Right. Like, she brings something. There's room for all of it at the table.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Yeah, yeah. Love it.

[Mary Heim]

Okay, what's up next for you?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So my number six is Fellowship Point by Alice Elliot Dark. This novel is a beautiful exploration of friendship between two octogenarians living in Maine. So this is a book, Mary, that I read in Maine when I was there with Meredith in this past summer. It was deep and atmospheric and literary and just exactly what I wanted to sink into. So the story really centers around two lifelong friends who are now in their 80s. As I said, they've spent every summer together with their families in Maine at a picturesque peninsula called Fellowship Point. Oh my God, how much do I want to live in Fellowship Point? So Agnes, one of the friends, is a celebrated children's novelist and has always lived independently. And Polly, her best Friend is a mom and a wife, and she really lives for her children and her husband. But now the land that they live on is under threat of development, and Agnes is determined to protect it and to save it by establishing a land trust. But she has to get all the people who live on Fellowship Point aboard with the plan before she can make that happen. So it's a story of how she does that. And there's also an underlying mystery that comes to light about Agnes's past that ties in a bunch of different things. And it's super interesting, absorbing a really beautiful saga that, you know, comes off as slow paced and reflective. But don't be fooled. A lot happens on this book. So the writing, I'd say, was accessible but still just so beautiful. I annotated so much. I think when I brought this to the big show, I even ended up reading a few quotes because it just hit me. Like, what I love about books about older women is they often feature reflections that I'm like, huh? Like, these women know what they're talking about. They have been through it. And Alice Elliot Dark, I don't think think is an octogenarian, but she somehow brought these insights, like these truth bombs that just really had me thinking. And as I said, it's a book I've continued to think about. It was immersive. It was complicated. It was med c. It was so satisfying. That is Fellowship Point by Alice Elliott Dark.

[Mary Heim]

This is one that's been on my tbr and I remember listening to the episode where you brought it and thinking like, yes, okay, I really need to bump this one up. And I'm feeling that extra. Then, of course, it slipped off my radar, but I'm like, okay, I think I need this. Sounds like one I'm probably going to want to highlight and underline and annotate. So I'm going to snag myself a copy. Feels like the perfect one to read. I don't know why. In the summer, you know when you're. Yeah, you've got a couple days off of work and you're on vacation and you can really kind of sink into this story. I'm excited to give this one a read. I love that.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I'd say perfect summer read and, like, exactly that. Great vacation read. It'll, like, just kind of absorb you and then you're like, I need to know what happens in next. It's great for that.

[Mary Heim]

I love that. I love it. All right, Roxanna. Well, my number six is the Lost Story by Meg Shafer. This the fact that this one showed up at my top 10 this year is just as much a surprise to me as anyone. You might remember Meg Shaffer from her debut last year, the Wishing Game, which Katie and I maybe kind of infamously panned on the Big show as not for us, but something about this sophomore novel just totally worked for me. The premise is fascinating and fun. Two adult men who went missing for six months in the woods as teenagers returned safe, healthy, well fed, fully clothed, with one of them with no recollection as to where they were. This has major Narnia vibes, but in the more adult way of what on earth would you expect life to be like for those Pevensy kids once they came back? Right. I loved that it was very grounded in the real world and then also totally threw you into this fantastical storyline. I found the themes of found family and forgiveness and really finding yourself to be as touching as they were compelling. And I would recommend this one. Don't go in expecting, you know, to relive the experiences of the lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe, but if you've got some childhood ties to that kind of fantasy, I would recommend this one for you. That was the Lost Story by Meg Shafer.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

That's so funny, Mary, because I did see this one come out but didn't pick it up because I had heard you guys talking about the Wishing Game and was like, well, not sure about this. So that's so interesting that it worked so well.

[Mary Heim]

Well, yeah, I think because I was kind of auto approved for it on NetGalley that I was like, I guess I'll give this a try. I don't know that I would have picked it up otherwise, but it's interesting because I've seen on Goodreads folks saying I loved the Wishing Game and hated this one, others saying, you know, the Wishing Game was not for me, but this book really worked for me. So it might be the case that if the Wishing Game wasn't as big a hit for you. Now, of course I don't think that's going to be the case for everybody, but maybe give this one a try and see. Don't necessarily count it out. Just if you were not a big fan of the Wishing Game, well, that.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

One you've got me intrigued. I'm going to put it on that on my list because the premise sounds really interesting.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah, I would put it clock it as a good January February escape kind of a read.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Look at you. You filled up my TBR for jab.

[Mary Heim]

I love it. All right, Roxanna, we are at that 50% mark, I think. Is this number five for you?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

It is, yes. And it is Margo's Got Money Troubles by Rufi Thorpe.

[Mary Heim]

Ooh.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So this one, you know, it's been everywhere, and I infamously do not read books that have been everywhere. But I saw this on so many best of lists and heard so much about it that I picked it up. It was actually my last book of the year, and it clocked in at number five. So, you know, this is another case of, like, wait till the end of the year to make your list. List.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So people, you know, have talked a lot about this book, so I won't rehash it, but I did love it for different reasons than people have mentioned. So I'll just say those here. I love books about creativity and commercialism and how people kind of go about with the business of creativity. It was a discussion I loved in Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow. And that was my favorite part of this book, too. You know, there's a lot of talk of how does Margot bring herself, her authentic self to life but also make money, you know, because she has to support herself? So I thought that part was super fascinating. There's a lot of talk about stories that are imposed upon you. You know, she's a young single mother on Onlyfans, and then also telling your own story. And then there's really interesting discussions about how to create an emotional connection with an audience. You know, like, she's on Onlyfans, which is about anatomy, but she's trying to create an. An emotional connection so that she can get people to support her. Right? And so she turns to her wrestler dad, and, you know, wrestling is infamously about narrative and story, Right? And crafting narratives and archetypes. This book is just plain fun. But Rufi Thorpe is such a genius in how she weaves in all these messages that, like, you really, after you're done, you're like, wow. Yeah. Yeah. Like, she has a really interesting perspective on telling your own story and crafting your own narrative and the narratives that are pushed upon you. And, you know, it was just people have talked about is like a quirky book about a single mother who turns to Onlyfans. And it is that, but it is about so much more. Even just her choice of POV is super interesting. I will read whatever Rufi Thorp puts out, because this one had me really thinking, you know, not to mention that, like, I knew nothing about the world of OnlyFans. And she dives deep. And I was like, this is Fascinating. So, like just learning that I left meredith like a 30 minute message about, so this is what she did and this is how it worked and this is what didn't work. So it was just fun for that. But I will say because this one's been everywhere, I want to suggest an alternative. If it sounds intriguing to you but you're not into the OnlyFans part, I would try another quirky book about creativity and business. It's called the Second Ending by Michelle Hoffman. So this is also, you know, as I said, similarly quirky book with a great premise. A child piano prodigy who was once the most famous kindergartner on the planet because she played for presidents at the White House all over the place. She decides to return to the piano at 48, and she gets an opportunity to perform on a wildly popular reality show called Dueling Piano Knows. Unfortunately, her new spotlight exposes some shady characters from her past and threatens to explode the life she's built for herself. This was such a fun book, but also, again, had some really interesting lessons. It was madcap but also penetrating, you know, something you would think about and almost ended up it's an honorable mention for my top 10 list. So, you know, this one again was under the radar. And I don't know why because I thought it was a really excellent book book. And I think anybody can relate to, you know, that letting go of who you're expected to be and embracing who you are, which is what this book is about. So, you know, pick it up if you're looking for something similar, but not quite as racy as Margo's got Money Troubles.

[Mary Heim]

I love that. Now. I too saw Margot all over this year. It missed me on my reading list. I just wasn't necessarily super compelled or really excited to pick it up. But I do feel like I want to get to it. It feels. I'm really compelled by all of these reviews and ratings I'm seeing for top 10 end of year lists with this book on it. And I'm like, yeah, okay, it is. It was one that I was like, eventually I'll get to that. And I was now hearing you talk about this, I'm like, okay. I think eventually might need to come sooner rather than later. And what an excellent comp as well, Roxanna. You're just knocking those out of the park today. I like, love it. So my number five is Air by Sabaa Tahir. Now, if you have been around for a minute, you know I am a huge fan of Sabaa Tahir's Ember in the Ashes series. So naturally it's probably no surprise that this one showed up on my best of list. Ayre is a sequel ish of sorts, set in the many years later after Ember ends. It will be a duology, which is quickly becoming one of my favorite series lengths and I truly will shout from the rooftops how phenomenal this series and this world is. There is Middle Eastern mythology, complex and growing characters, nuanced storyline, fascinating plot, and truly spectacular writing. There are hints of some romance plot lines throughout these series, but they are far from the focus, so much so that they're probably negligible enough that you wouldn't even necessarily describe it in that way if you're describing this book to someone. However, I bring this up because if perhaps you have dipped your toes into the fantasy genre via the current popularity of books under, you know, romance, the romantasy kind of title, I would really encourage you to give this series a try as your bridge into fantasy that's maybe heavier on the fantastical elements. She says that you can read this one without the background knowledge of Ember, but I am here to tell you, don't do it. Instead, let me give the first of these five chonky books to absolutely fall into while we await the what I assume will be absolutely stunning finish to this story in the future that is Air by Sabaa Tahir.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

You know what, this is funny, Mary, because this I think made it onto Katie's best of list because you recommended it to her. And so that made my ears perk up again because I you know, the last few years I find I there's a time of year when I delve deep into a fantasy and I end up reading, you know, the whole series, which is very rare for me but has become a thing. I read the daevabad Trilogy by S.A. chakraborty this year. I read Discovery of Witches with Meredith and this one I think is the next one up because I think I don't want something that's too romantasy. I feel like it's been about played out. Like I loved Sarah J. Maas the year before, but I'm kind of done.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And I love the Middle Eastern and I love the way you've described it. I just feel like it'll be a perfect fit. I can't wait to dive into a big hefty satisfying saga like this.

[Mary Heim]

You're really gonna love this one, Roxanna. Now this is it is a separate duology still same within the same world. But I think that the experience of her writing within this world is just so fantastic. And the way the books start with the Ember in the Ashes Quartet, you really end up with something very different than you think you're beginning with at the beginning of the quartet of the original four. And I found this one. It's been years now since I finished reading that original quartet, and I was just perfectly thrown right back into the world with this one. She was not just writing to, you know, get that paycheck, which, whatever, you know, obviously do that, but she really had more stories to tell within this world. And I thought it was so fascinating how she did it. I was really excited knowing that this was on my list to record with you today, because I'm here. Like, reference Roxanna, pick this series up. Pick it up. I think you're gonna love it. So I can't wait to hear. Whenever the time is right for you to read it, I can't wait to hear what you think. And I think if anyone, even if you've read the original Ember in the Ashes Quartet long ago, you can jump into air. She will kind of build the world for you. And I think one thing that Sabaa Tahir does better than many authors writing right now is she writes characters who are morally gray in a way that still really makes you see them and understand them. She really focuses on plot and character development in a way that I think is masterful. She's really doing something really special, and I hope you love it. I really love this series.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that now you sold me on it even more. Like, I'm 100% picking up this year. I love morally gray characters that are done right. And I think that's actually one of the issues I've had with Romantasy is that sometimes the characters are, you know, it's about the love or the. You know, they're a little bit. They're a bit more cliched and not, as, you know, nuanced. And that's not. Just not as interesting for me to read, to be honest. Especially for the size of these books. Right?

[Mary Heim]

Yes.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Like, you gotta have some dimension to a character for me to want to stick with them for this long. And it's why I love the Daevabad trilogy, actually. So I'm really excited to pick this one up. Thank you for putting it on my radar and everybody else's radars.

[Mary Heim]

I love it. I can't wait to hear what you think. All right, Roxanna, so number four for you.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Where are we at so my number four is the Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle by Emily and Amelia Nagoski. So Meredith brought this nonfiction title to the show years ago, and Mary, I think you and I talked about it because I brought it as a fountain wish earlier this year. It's just one of the most helpful books I have read in dealing with stress. And, you know, you could see a theme to my books this year. I needed books like this, but this one is compassionate. It's non judgmental, doesn't put a ton of pressure on you. It's not your traditional self help book, I say, you know, like a lot of stress books I find put even more stress on you to manage your stress. You know, they're like, do self care, do A, B and C. And it's like, okay, okay, I'm stressed. Like, I don't have bandwidth and now you're telling me to go get a massage, do a date night, connect with other people. Like, ah, you know, where this one really accepts you where you are, lets you accept yourself where you are, Recognizes broader systemic factors like patriarchy and racism in contributing to women's stress particularly, but also gives you concrete actions that are doable that I'm finding really helpful. I listened on audio, I really loved it. And this one was even more significant in my top 10 because my best friend and I were going through a lot of challenges, our own unique challenges. At the beginning of the year, I shared it with her and she was able to listen and recognize a level of stress for herself that was unsustainable, that had become so normalized for her that she hadn't recognized it. And I think frankly, it saved her life and saved her family's life because it made her take action.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And even for me, I was like, okay, like this stuff that I'm like, yeah, I'm just gonna push through and, yeah, it's fine, I'm gonna get through. It was like, no, like, I actually can't live this way and I don't want to live this way, but I actually physically can't. So it was really great at helping me identify. Not just like, it wasn't like, manage your stress and be more productive. It was really like, recognize the factors around you. You know, what is your life like? What do you want it to be like? And where can you reduce some of the stress? Right. So I really loved it. I'll say their tone is much more kind of chatty and casual than Millennial. I. I love that because I found it was a conversation some people will Find it a turn off. So if you're listening on audio, download a sample. But this is also one to buy a copy of. Again, this will be like Sylvia Boorstein kind of a handbook that I come down to come back to. It is also it's chatty and casual. Yes. But it is 100 research backed. These are two very smart women. Very have evidence based strategies that are really helpful. All of it I found really helpful. So that's Burnout by Emily and Amelia Nagoski.

[Mary Heim]

I will follow the Nagoski sisters to the moon and back. They are. This is one of my, you know, I've got a handful of books that I read for my work, you know, and this is one of them that is probably most recommended to my therapy clients. Kind of in that like top upper echelon of if you're gonna read anything to supplement your work in therapy, this is one of them. And I love, I love it so much. Like you said, it's so actionable, it's so down to earth. It's really research based. Yeah, it's a Pantheon book for sure. I love that it made your list this year, Roxanna. I think, I think it might be time I take a reread of that one.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I think I might do the same.

[Mary Heim]

All right, Roxanna, my number four book this year is the Wedding People by Alison Sbach. You are no doubt seeing this one all over the top 10 list this year. And so I won't spend a terribly huge amount of time recapping it. But I will say that I got to be lucky enough to read this one before the buzz really started. And I think the way that this story absolutely transported me without any expectation of what was to come was just such a magical reading experience for me this year. I just really loved it. The beginning is so bleak, probably to the extent that if I were to pick it up right now for the first time, I would probably be dnfing with abandon. It just felt really hopeless. However, the way in which Alison Espach takes such a dark and sad tale and turns it into this quirky, redemptive, weirdly summary, truly hopeful story was just the perfect reading experience for me and I just kind of have this happy sigh every time I think about it. This is a book that falls into that category that I love, which is stories that make you feel something about being human. Now for sure, check content warnings for this one. Especially knowing that the beginning is really bleak, but know that our author truly does a masterful job of making you Care about this eclectic crew of characters and wanting to see them work through their stuff to get to a more authentic and joyful place for each of them in their stories. I just thought it was such a gem. That is the Wedding People by Alison Espach.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

You know, Mary, I'm actually listening to this right now on audio and I'm loving it.

[Mary Heim]

I love that. Isn't it just great? I really loved it.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I picked it up after seeing it on so many best of lists because I was surprised. You know, like, it looks like. And everybody has said this, but it's true. The COVID does a disservice to what the book is. It's super quirky and just like looks almost like, you know, we hate this word, but chicken. Booklet.

[Mary Heim]

Sure.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And so I hadn't picked it up, but it was on so many best of lists. I was like, I need to see what this is about. And it's great on audio. I'm really loving it. It has so much more emotional depth than you think.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I will say it is very bantery. So, you know, when I was like, there's a lot of words in this book, a lot of words. And like in audio, they. They kind of flow over you. I really like that. But I did say to Meredith, like, you would find this book in Saffron, like, because I really think she would. So I think for those who are thinking about it, try a sample, written or audio. And if you don't like it in that first chapter, you're not gonna like it. Like, if you don't like it because of the style, I think the bleakness. I think you're right. Like that the part, it does get better. It's a swing up book.

[Mary Heim]

Yes.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

But if you don't like the style of it, then you won't like it. But I really, I'm really enjoying it. It's making me go on my walks in my morning because I can't wait to listen to the next part.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, I love that. Yeah, I think you did a really good job of that caveat. I don't think this is a Meredith book and that's okay. But yeah, I'm so glad that you're enjoying it, Roxana. It's a. It's one that I think I will probably revisit as I'm really leaning into the rereads this year.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

It's very funny. Like, it starts bleak, but I laughed out loud a number of times. It's really like, she is smart as a whip.

[Mary Heim]

It's really.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Well, okay.

[Mary Heim]

All right, Roxanna, we are getting down to our top three. This is where, right. The rubber is really meeting the road. Let's hear what your number three is this year.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Okay. Well, my three is in the Shadow of the Mountain by Sylvia Vasquez Lovato. So this is a book Mary, I brought to the big show. It's yet another nonfiction, a memoir, and I'll say the superlative for this is the best book about Everest that I never knew exactly existed.

[Mary Heim]

Ooh.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So this is a story of the first Peruvian woman in history to climb Mount Everest. And I describe this book as a cross between Into Thin Air by John Krakauer and Finding Me by Viola Davis.

[Mary Heim]

Ooh.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So it's got all the peril and drama of the Everest climb. But what makes this book really special is that it's interwoven with the story of Vasquez Lovato and her journey in life. Life. And she has really dealt with a lot. You know, she had childhood sexual and physical abuse back in her home in Lima. Then she had alcoholism as she grew older, sex addiction and shame over her homosexuality. Despite this, she is very successful and makes a name for herself in the dot com boom in the early 2000 Silicon Valley. But something is missing from her life because she has all this trauma that she hasn't dealt with. So she finds refuge in the harshness of mountain climbing, and that's how she decides to conquer her demons by climbing Mount Everest. Not only that, she decides to take a small group of women on the journey to base camp with her. Women who are the survivors of sexual trafficking. This was an incredible story, well told. And frankly, I'm shocked that it's not on every bestseller list. This is a book, I think, that deserves a lot more recognition and buzz, you know, it was heavy, for sure. And it's, as I said, like, that's not usually what I gravitate to, especially these kinds of trigger topics. But it was so beautifully told. She does sort of one chapter on Everest, present day, one chapter of the past, one chapter on Everest, one chapter on the past. And that structure works really, really well. There's not one timeline that you're like, oh, I can't wait to get back to it. Both of them are equally compelling. And you just need to know what happens next.

[Mary Heim]

Next.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And it is uplifting. It is inspiring. You are so just awed by her spirit and what she goes through. You know, Everest is not built for women. So even just hearing kind of that tale of how she navigates that and the Guides and everything else. Super interesting, really. I do think it's a book everybody should read. It was excellent.

[Mary Heim]

I can't believe I haven't heard of this one. Yeah, that's immediately. I don't know if it's a right now book for me, but this is a someday I've got. Yeah, yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

It was on my TBR for years. Literally years. Mary. It's one of those, you know, when you pick it up and you're like, what? What? Why have I not picked up?

[Mary Heim]

Yes. Oh, I love that it found you at the right time. I feel like those, those books that found you at the right time just ended up being so spectacular or ones that you have been kind of just holding off on for any variety of reasons. I love that it was such a win for you to make it on to your list and so high as well. Oh, that sounds like a really good one, Roxanna.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

It was great. And I think it was a listener press too, so, you know, there's some buzz about this book. People pick it up.

[Mary Heim]

There you go. I love it. All right, well, after you read that one, if you need a little bit of a soul, soothing, cozy, comforting read, how about pick up my number three, which is the Pumpkin Princess and the Forever Knight by Stephen Banbury. Another one that is no surprise for me this year is this absolutely magical middle grade gem. Y'all know how much I love a spooky season book, right? That is my. That's my trademark. And this was my knockout hit this year. This was a fantastical, cozy, perfectly found, family esque trip to an alternate world where a giant pumpkinhead king rules the land of all of the things that go bump in the night. And he adopts Eve, an orphan desperate to flee from her unfortunate circumstances. This was cozy, atmospheric, so well written and with a cast of characters that I just truly came to love. An extra cherry on top for me was the sweet father daughter relationship at the center of the plot, a trope I am just so endeared to after losing my own dad. It was the perfect book at the perfect time for me and it has absolutely made it onto my emergency stack of emotional support books when I need something perfectly comforting and delightful to fall into. This one was the start of a new series and I'm so excited to continue to kind of fall into the coziness, the comfort, the absolute joy of this world again and again for as long as Stephen Banbury will keep writing about it. That was the Pumpkin Princess and the Forever Night.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

You put this on my TBR Mary and I can't wait to read it. I'm just waiting for Spooky Season again because it's gonna be perfect there. You brought it to the big show and it just seemed so delightful. I can't wait. Wait to put it on my list.

[Mary Heim]

Yes, absolutely. Pick this one up. As soon as those leaves start to change, as soon as it starts to get chilly, it really is just a delight. I really am. It's a debut. This author's writing is so immersive and accessible, and it's going to be just as fun for a middle grader as it is for an adult who just wants some cozy autumnal comfort. I can't wait to hear what you think, Roxanna. Love it. All right, number two, what's your number two?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Okay. My number two is Be Ready when the Luck Happens by Ina Garten.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, another one. We're seeing all over. I love this.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Yes. So I won't spend a lot of time with this because, you know, we've seen it everywhere. I will say I'm not a big Ina Garten fan. Nothing against her. I just didn't really follow her. But I do love, you know, as I said, I love memoirs of kind of older women talking about their lives. So I picked it up on audio and I, you know, it's number two. I just loved it. And the reasons I loved it are maybe different from what other people loved. So I do love a great memoir that talks about life lessons that I can apply to business, which she had in spades here. And I will say Ina Garten is a very different person than me. And then I love those stories because you really find a lot to learn. So, you know, I'm a planner. I spend lots of energy and effort trying to avoid problems. And when problems come, you know, like, okay, let's deal with them. Ina Garten is very different. She cannot see problems that are five feet in front of her. Mary, like, she literally 15 minutes down the road, she can't see those problems. But when they come, she doesn't get scared and run away from them. She welcomes the challenge of finding a creative solution. And honestly, she has such a verb for life. And yeah, like, she really wants to sees those problems by the horns. And she doesn't see them as problems. She sees them as opportunities to find a win win for all parties. And that's what gives her life. That's probably why she doesn't bother looking for them in the past, you know, looking for them in her path. Because they kind of make her who she is. So, you know, clearly that's been a recipe for success. Look at where she is. But it was also just a. You know, sometimes seeing how other people live their lives really gives you. Gives me some instruction. And just seeing the way she did that over and over again in this book, her unconventional solutions that lead to a success that was even better than what would have happened if she'd avoided the problem altogether really made me think, okay, this is a way I want to live my life. You know, instead of feeling shame about not doing it the exact right way and checking it off the way people tell me to, how about I just embrace and be proud of doing it my way may not be Ina's way, you know, but that's fine. And when a problem comes, instead of berating myself that, why didn't I see this coming? Be like, okay, the problem is here. What can we do to come up with a creative solution? It was really, really great. For that reason, it really. I put it number two because it's life changing for me, because I will be asking myself, like, you know, how can I approach this more creatively? Not to mention, of course, that is just a super compelling, fun to listen to memoir that, you know, you can take the deeper lesson or you can just listen and have a great time, which is really great. So, yeah, so this is one that's, I would say, if you haven't picked it up. And that sounds good to you, like, that sounds interesting. There's a lot more to this than just a celebrity foodie memoir. Now, because this has been everywhere, I will suggest some others because this really did send me on a deep dive of really good memoirs by older women. Yeah, I read the Third Gilmore Girl by Kelly Bishop, which has also been, you know, around a lot. But I will say it's not about the Gilmore Girls, but really about her Broadway career and her reflections on acceptance of aging. So that was super interesting. But the big one I want to recommend is called the Baddest Bitch in the Room by Sophia Chang.

[Mary Heim]

Love that title.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Right? So great. So she is the first Asian woman in hip hop. Back in the early 90s, she was a little Asian girl from Vancouver, I think is how she describes herself. She inserted herself into the Wu Tang Clan and ended up managing a couple of those members. Was really deep into the hip hop scene. She's now in her late 50s and reflecting on her career as this hip hop talent scout and then leaving the world of hip hop pop, marrying a Shaolin monk and becoming a kung fu master.

[Mary Heim]

What?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

This woman, her life is insane.

[Mary Heim]

She is the coolest person I've ever heard of.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

She's the coolest person. And really, like, she really is. She defies all expectations of herself. It's, I'll say, a polarizing memoir if you look at the comments on Goodreads because of that, you know, she really does defy expectations, and some people really don't like that. And the decisions she makes are perhaps not the decisions that you would make or I would make. But that's not what a memoir is about. Like, to me, at least, it's not like, did she make the good decision or did she do the right thing? It's like, this is how this person lived their life. Take from it what you will. Yeah, I found it really fascinating. I learned a lot. And I just, you know, to be unapologetically yourself even when you're not what people expect was really just such a great lesson. So there's three memoirs in there for the price of one. So my number two was Be Ready when the Luck Happens by Ina Garten.

[Mary Heim]

I love that, Roxanna. I had recently put a call out on social media for some comforting reads. Some, you know, my brain, I'm struggling to focus a little bit lately with some things that are going on in my personal life. And this was one. Ina Gartens was one. One that so many people were pressing into my hands as a good read for right now. And I'm gonna absolutely have to add those other two as well to my list. What a good. A good pairing, a good trio. I love that. All right, Roxanna. My number two this year is A Letter to the Luminous Deep by Sylvie Cathral. And it was so hard to choose between my top two books this year year to decide which made it into that coveted number one spot. I was really certain for most of the year that nothing would knock this one out of the top. But you'll have to see what did this Again is the first in an epistolary fantasy novel duology taking place in a kind of fantasy regency world that is both that and also feels kind of post apocalyptic. It's underwater. Our main character lives, of course there is a world above above water. But she is inhabiting this kind of underwater world in a really cozy, magical. Just the setting itself is so lush and fascinating and different from anything else I've ever read that that alone would be enough, I think, to read this book. However, we spend most of the story knowing that our two main characters have gone missing, and their siblings are working to find out what happened to them by reading their correspondence over the course of a year. The world building, like I said in this story, was to die for. The relationships are just so genuine and perfect. And my absolute favorite piece was the incredible, unexpected and really accurate OCD representation to be found within our main character. I think that's a result of our author sharing that she struggles with OCD herself. So she writes from a really nuanced and knowing place, something I really haven't seen. Well done in fiction. Oftentimes we see OCD kind of like, oh, you like things orderly, like things clean. So much more to it than that. And she does a really good job of representing that here. I loved the world. I cannot wait to see how the story wraps up in book two. Most of the people who I'm seeing who did not enjoy this story are a little angry that right as we're getting to the main action, the book takes a pause and then we are left on a pretty big cliffhanger for book one or book two. But I found so many other things to love about this story that that didn't bother me in the slightest, but just not going in. However, I do believe the second book is releasing this spring, so you don't have to wait very long to see how this story wraps up. That is a Letter to the Luminous Deep by Sylvie Cathral.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I thought this would be on your list, Mary, and I was waiting to see where it would show up. Wow. So I haven't read this, but that cover and the way you described it has put on my list. And now the way you talked about it with the OCD representation has actually pushed it up on my list. It does. I love that when books are beautiful and fantastical, but they have some grounding in real emotional territory. That's what makes them real for me. So this sounds. And also that epistolary. I had no idea it was epistolary. That sounds so fun.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah, it's so fun. It's really different. I think a lot of people tried to comp it to Emily Wilde and I do think there's some ties, but I don't think that anyone should get too attached to that idea. I think it's just because there is kind of this diary, epistolary format. It's fantastical. We've got, you know, strong female lead through lines there that tie them together. But this book is entirely its own thing, the way that Emily Wilde is entirely her own thing. And I really, really loved it. I Can't wait to. I'll probably read this one again before book two comes out because I just can't wait to be in that world. I. Yeah, I loved it.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Wow. Well, on my list for sure. I have 10 books already married that are on my list that I have to read in Jan. Feb. Thank you for that.

[Mary Heim]

I love it. All right, Roxanna, we are down to number one. I am dying to hear what your number one book of the year was.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

My number one is Matrix by Lauren Groff.

[Mary Heim]

Oh, okay. All right, let's hear.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

So this one Meredith had recommended to me years ago and again sat on my list because it had to be just the right time. But this book just blew me away. You know, funnily enough, last year my number one was Search by Michelle Hondovan. As a Muslim, I keep picking Christian books, but I just, you know, I love the deeper themes of these books. This one is the story of a powerless woman who is thrust into a position she doesn't want as APIs of a failing Abby. But then she takes that position and builds power and a legacy for herself and all the women around her. And that was so powerful and so inspiring and so moving. It just blew me away. It is stunningly written. Again, this is another one where there's quotes that I go back to and read and I'm like, huh? Like this woman has seen me like so amazing. Amazing is not the right word. So piercing. Like they're quotes I can come back to. It is a short book, but it is so beautifully written and yeah, so powerful and a story about, you know, an abyss from hundreds of years ago. You would never think it would be so relevant now, but it really is. I will say I had picked this up a few times and it is also starts super bleakly and her sense of atmosphere is so great that you're like trudging through the rainy mud in medieval England for a long time and you're just like, oh God, like, I can't. So I really did start two or three times and was like, I know this is a short book, but I can't get through through this.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

And then until I heard, okay, she becomes the abbess, things do get better.

[Mary Heim]

Yeah.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

That's when I could actually like continue reading it because I was like, okay, we're not going to be in this miserable muck of mud and lice for a, you know, a long time. And then I really, really enjoyed it. So anybody who has picked it up and been like, just know it is a big swing up book. And it is super powerful. As I said, one, one. I defy you not to think about this after you read it and think about the lessons. It's one I will reread through my life. That's Matrix by Lauren Groff.

[Mary Heim]

I love that, Roxanna. And I love that it was one that was just kind of waiting to be the right time again for you. And really. Oh, I love that so much. It sounds like very well deserved number one.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Yeah, I had no the other ones I struggled with placing the them. This one was no question. It was like, yeah, number one. And then let's figure out where the rest of them fall.

[Mary Heim]

Where everything else falls. I love that. Yeah. I heard someone describe books like that a couple years ago as a heart print. Right. Like a thumbprint or a heartbeat, but a heart print. And it sounds like this one might be a heart print book for you.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that too.

[Mary Heim]

Well, my number one is also a heart print book for me. This is Sandwich by Kathryn Newman. Really?

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Sandwich? Okay, tell me all about it, Mary.

[Mary Heim]

All right, so Roxanna, you know when you just have those absolutely perfect reading experiences where the book you're reading meets you exactly where you are at, literally and metaphorically at exactly this moment in time and again, it feels like it's imprinted on your heart. That was the experience of reading Sandwich for me. This is another book that is everywhere this year and for good reason. Most of our listeners probably already know the plot, but as a quick reminder, this is the story of a middle aged mom, wife, woman on vacation with her nearly adult children and her elderly parents at the same cottage they've spent a week each summer in since her kids were babies. I happened to bring this book along this summer to the cabin that my grandpa built over 60 years ago. There with my family, my husband, my daughter and my mother, I could not have picked a more perfect book to read on this trip. I was hit over and over again with the perfect descriptions of parenthood, being an adult child to aging parents getting a window into what's to come for me as my kiddo ages. How life is just so brutal and so beautiful and how you want to freeze it one minute and scream the next. I finished this story sitting outside our family's cabin where I've spent almost every summer and for all of my 35 years of life listening to the wind whip through the pines that have stood there since long before I was born. And I just sobbed at the end. I immediately bought copies for my mom and my sisters and ended up having A really special book club discussion experience with my mom after reading it. So much so that I think my next tattoo, my first tattoo, is something in my dad's handwriting that we found in his things after he passed. I think my next tattoo maybe a line from this book in my mom's handwriting. Everything about this was a perfect experience to me and I think the reading of this book is one of those really special ones that's going to stick with me for the rest of my life. That was Sandwich by Kathryn Newman.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

What a perfect gem of a reading experience. Like, I'm sure the author would listen to that and be like, that's exactly what I wanted for this book with that experience to be Mary.

[Mary Heim]

I love that. I can only hope. Yeah, it was. Every single thing about it was the perfect book at the perfect time. Down to the fact that it was my library's lucky day pick that month and I had been eyeing it up and it was never in stock. You know, they bought 10 copies or whatever. It was never on the shelf. And the week before we left for vacation, there was one on the shelf and I grabbed it and I was like, okay, I think this is meant to be. I'm going to read this while we are up at our cabin. Everything felt like so perfectly aligned for me to read this book at that moment in time. I really, really, really loved it.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

I love that for you, Mary. It sounds like such a special reading experience and also it is such a special book. What a perfect number one. I feel like you'll look back on this year and always remember this book as your number one and like emblematic of this year for you.

[Mary Heim]

Yes, absolutely. Well, I feel this way about both of our lists this, this episode, this year. Roxanna, it is always so much fun and so special to get to record this episode for you. And as always, we're grateful to Katie and Meredith for letting us take the reins on this very special episode this week. And that is it for us today. As a reminder, here is where you can find us. You can find Katie at Notes on Bookmarks on Instagram and Meredith is at Meredith Monday Schwartz. Megan is at Most of Megan Reads on Instagram. You can find me me @maryreadsandmakes on.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Instagram and you can find me @roxannethereader on Instagram.

[Mary Heim]

Full show notes with the title of every book we mentioned in this episode. Timestamps so that you can zoom right to where we talked about them can be [e-mail] and you can follow the.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Show at Currentlyreading Podcast on Instagram or email [e-mail] and if you really want.

[Mary Heim]

To help us become a patron, become our bookish friend. Rate and review us on Apple podcasts or shout us out on social media. It makes such a huge difference in our being able to find our perfect audience.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Bookish friends are the best friends. Thank you for helping us grow and get closer to our goals.

[Mary Heim]

Until next week. Roxanna May your coffee be hot and.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

May your book be unputdownable.

[Mary Heim]

Happy reading. Roxanna Happy reading.

[Roxanna Kasamkara]

Mary.