← The Currently Reading Podcast
The Currently Reading Podcast
Season 7, Episode 38: Crying Over Books + A Book That Surprised Us
00:59:18
On this episode of Currently Reading, Kaytee and Meredith are discussing: Bookish Moments: silencing notifications and crying over books Current Reads: all the great, interesting, and/or terrible stuff we’ve been reading lately Deep Dive: a...
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- [00:00]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Foreign. Hey, readers, welcome to the currently reading podcast. We are bookish best friends who spend time every week talking about the books that we've read recently. And as you know, we won't shy away from having strong opinions. So get ready.
- [00:25]
Katie Cobb
We are light on the chit chat, heavy on the book talk, and our conversations will always be spoiled. Spoiler free. Today we'll discuss our current reads, a bookish deep dive, and then we'll visit the fountain.
- [00:34]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I'm Meredith Monday Schwartz, a mom of four and full time CEO living in Austin, Texas. And adding a level of focus has upped my reading game.
- [00:43]
Katie Cobb
And I'm Katie Cobb, a homeschooling mom of four living in Arizona. And I love when a series just keeps getting better. This is episode number 38 of season seven, and we are so glad you're here. Oh, Meredith, I'm excited.
- [00:57]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes, yes. And hopefully we have more series updates in our future from you.
- [01:03]
Katie Cobb
Well, I mean, we'll see, but for now, I'm excited about a series.
- [01:07]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right, good, good.
- [01:09]
Katie Cobb
Who knows what future Katie will want? All right, y'all, I am ready myself to let you know that today for our deep dive, we're going to chat about a book that surprised each of us and then figure out if there's anything we can pull from that experience to help replicate it. Very excited to get into that. But first we'll get started the way we always do with our bookish moments of the week. Meredith, tell us, what have you got?
- [01:31]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right. My bookish moment of the week, Katie, really serves as an update to the conversation that you and I had last week. I told you when we were actually, while we were recording, I was like, if I'm looking down, it's because I'm silencing my notifications. One of the things you talked about was, I mean, it's so obvious. But I just realized as we were talking how many notifications I had myself set to get.
- [01:58]
Katie Cobb
Yes.
- [01:58]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
And so I set about while we were live recording, but then also throughout the week, I set about turning off notifications on my phone because what I realized was like, there's kind of, there's a few issues related to focus in our reading. Right. And there's lots of different ways we can go from bricking our phone from there's a million different ways. I just decided to tackle this one thing this week because I realized that oftentimes when I'm reading, even if I'm reading a book in print, I will have my phone or my iPad will be in my eyeline. So I'm not reading it, but it's in my eyeline. And when those notifications pop up, my screen lights up and dang it, if I have a hard time not checking to see what that notification is. And most of the time it was either a news update. I had so many news related notifications on my phone, so I quieted all of those. Because the reality is, if it's important enough for me to know it, I am going to find it in one of several other ways. I don't need it in that exact moment. And I am a weather junkie. I had seven weather apps feeding me notifications now in a lot of places, but definitely here in Austin. This was new to me when we moved here. We get a lot of weather notifications. Hot weather, cold weather, thunder, high winds, rain, high winds, all of that. So I set about this week and I silenced all of those notifications. And also when I sit down to read whatever format that I'm. That I'm reading in, I don't brick my. I don't use the actual brick to brick my phone. I haven't gotten there yet. Maybe I will in the future, but I'm turning my phone over and turning my iPad so that it's away from me. Yeah, those things have made a really big difference in my reading this week. Small, very controllable changes. But I realized that I was getting more focus reading for 30 minutes in a focused way at a time rather than doing what I was doing, which is kind of maybe two minutes at a time or less. So working on that focus that we're all so, so paying attention to right now.
- [04:19]
Katie Cobb
Yes. There's so many benefits to this. Again, we need to have like a whole sustained conversation about this because I've been doing so much reading about it. But entering that flow state in our reading leads to deeper, better retention. Reading, like all of it gets so much better that it's worth making those small changes. I mean, definitely, like any social media stuff that do not let that notify you, it will all be there. Nobody needs that in their lives. Like, it will all be there when you come back. So, yeah, I love that. I'm so excited for you because it feels so good to like, feel like you have a little more control, like taking back your own attention and saying, I, I've been giving this to you for too long and now I'm bringing it back to where it matters to me. Oh, right. I have chills.
- [05:06]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
But one of the ones that I did turn off was duolingo. Which, of course, you know, Duolingo does not want you to turn off your notifications.
- [05:14]
Katie Cobb
No, that is they remind you, like every time you open the app. Like, don't you just want to turn that back on? Aren't you sure that you want to turn that back on?
- [05:23]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Exactly. And I will say, last night I was doing my lingo, my duolingo at 11:59pm I was out with friends last night. I've done that and got home late and I, I missed it. I finished on. I finished after 12:01 and so I had to use a freeze yesterday. Oh no, I've only done twice. And thank God for the freezes that they give to you. But I still felt like I failed a little bit. But anyway, I'm still not turning my notification back on.
- [05:50]
Katie Cobb
Yeah. Yeah, okay. I'm very excited about this. My bookish moment. This week is different. This week we finished as a read aloud in our homeschool, the third Amari book, Amari and the Despicable Wonders by V.B. alston. This was a read aloud for us and my kids have demanded that we continue the series. So we started book one. I went back and looked November 14th of 2024. And then we finished it in January. And then we read book two, finished that in February and now it's April and we're finishing book three. The first two were rereads for me, but only Levi had read the third one. Well, folks, I am not too proud to admit that three of the five of us bawled our eyes out to book three and the other two were a little bit teary and that just not full messes, but it just made me so happy. I believe I've mentioned in the past that my kids love it when I read aloud and they really love it when I cry when I'm reading aloud. They just. I don't know. I don't know if it's about letting them access their own emotions or showing them that it's okay to fall so deeply for a character or to let a plot point so affect you that it comes out through my voice and my eyes. But whatever it is, they oftentimes come sit as close to me as possible. Sometimes they'll rub my back and it's as soon as my voice gets tight, their eyes all like pop right up and they start watching me, like, being on display.
- [07:11]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
That sounds awful. I wonder though, because many times on the show you've shared with us that that's actually an experience in your reading that you enjoy. I do, right? And So I wonder if that's part of it, is that they know this is something that means you. You're really connecting with it, that I really love it.
- [07:28]
Katie Cobb
Yes, definitely. And I also think, like, props to me, really, but I have raised very empathetic kids and they are sweet. And even though it involves me crying, it is one of my favorite things about homeschooling that they have accessed their emotions through my own reading of a book. And so I take that job really seriously. Like, I really love to be ostentatious with my accents and to end a chapter on a cliffhanger. And, like, I love that so much. So many thanks this week to Bebe Alston and to Amari and for this beautiful world he built for giving us another emotional bookish moment of the week.
- [08:09]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I'm glad it was a win for you.
- [08:11]
Katie Cobb
Oh, it was so good. Yeah, I know.
- [08:13]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
That's a series that you love.
- [08:15]
Katie Cobb
Yeah, I do. I love it so much. Let's get into some other books that we've been reading, though. Meredith, what is on your current read stack?
- [08:22]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right. I've got a wide breadth of books today, and I'm happy. I'm excited to talk about all of them. All right, the first one is True True crime, which I haven't brought for a while. You know, it's not always easy for me to find true crime that sucks me in or that I think is quality enough to. To spend my time on. Man, it's a genre that I wish. I'm glad that we're getting better. It seems like it's getting better and better. It's been pretty pulpy in the past, but this one is a good one. All right, this one is called Death on Ocean Boulevard, and it's by Caitlin Rother. Here's the setup. So you might have heard about this case when Rebecca Zaha's naked body is found hanging from a balcon at the historic Spreckels mansion in Coronado, California. Bound, gagged, and with a cryptic message painted on the door of the room the balcony is adjacent to. Authorities quickly rule it a suicide. I'm gonna stop right there. I'm gonna say that again. Her body was found bound, gagged, and there was a cryptic message painted nearby. And the authorities quickly ruled it a suicide.
- [09:32]
Katie Cobb
What?
- [09:33]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Right, but with a wealthy pharmaceutical tycoon who owns the place, this famous mansion in Coronado, right, And his brother, and the mysterious death of a six year old boy that had taken place just a couple of days earlier all woven into this web, the case screams for a deeper look, which is what author, investigative journalist Caitlin Rother takes us on. Rother meticulously unravels the case, examining the controversial evidence, the civil lawsuit where a jury does find someone responsible, and the bombshell decision by the San Diego authorities to double down on their original ruling. What emerges here is a story that is compelling, it is troubling, and it raises questions that we are all asking about wealth, power and justice. This book left me flabbergasted. So a little bit of backstory here. In January of this year, I took a trip with my brother for a few days. We're talking about some business things and we spent that time on Coronado island, which is just one mile away from San Diego. It's connected by this one mile long bridge.
- [10:47]
Katie Cobb
That bridge makes my heart race. Yes, I hate that bridge.
- [10:52]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes, I was being driven by an Uber driver across the bridge, but I was definitely trying to control my. I'm not a big fan of bridges and this is a really long one. All right, so I hadn't been to Coronado before. My brother has vacationed there for 20 years, so he's like practically a local. And so as we were there, one of the things that's great about Coronado is it's super walkable. And so we were walking pretty much everywhere that we went. One night we were walking to dinner. Because he's a good brother who knows his sister very well, he made sure that on one of these walks we walked past this mansion, this freckles mansion, and he mentioned that there was a case that had taken place there. And even better, that there was a book that was written about that case.
- [11:38]
Katie Cobb
Good job, Scott.
- [11:39]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
So yes, he did a wonderful job. We scrambled back to the arrive, I guess I scrambled back to the restaurant where immediately I started looking up this book and downloaded it, started reading it that night. So this is one of those cases that is officially unsolved. I'm going to air quote that. But the reality is we know who did it. It's also one of those cases that makes you want to scream at your Kindle. And later when I reviewed a documentary on it, I was also yelling at my TV screen. It's so clear to me that the and to everyone else, not just to me, that the victim in this case did not get justice. Rebecca Zaha is the victim. It's clear to me that being a billionaire or related to a billionaire can get you all the justice that you need, even when you don't deserv deserve it. So Caitlin Rother does a Great job in this book. It's definitely in the style of Ann Rule that is that it's detailed when it needs to be. Doesn't spend a lot of time going down fruitless rabbit holes. To me, this is my sweet spot. Just for this reader, I like a straight line true crime narrative. This book isn't trying to make a larger social case of any kind. It's just that straight line, quality investigative journalism about a case that is infuriating and fascinating. Caitlin Rother leaves you to judge. She is not there to judge, but she makes a very compelling case. I highly recommend this book and then when you finish it, double back and watch the documentary Death at the Mansion Colon Rebecca Zaha, which I was able to rent on Apple tv. It is totally worth watching and it brings this case even more up to date than the book itself does. This is Death on Oceans Boulevard by Caitlyn Rother.
- [13:29]
Katie Cobb
Sounds excellent.
- [13:31]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Very even though very interesting.
- [13:33]
Katie Cobb
Also terrible, right?
- [13:35]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
And again, kudos to my brother for making sure that I was at the scene of the crime and then could read the book. Like it adds to the impact of the story.
- [13:44]
Katie Cobb
Definitely. Yes. Like an Easter egg hunt or like a scavenger hunt that ends with not only do you now have this little tidbit or this location specific information, you also can go deeper with that. How do we replicate that experience without our own very wrong brothers in our lives? Which is a throwback to season one when we called Scott very wrong brother for not thinking the audiobooks were reading so right.
- [14:07]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Which I do believe that he has changed his thought.
- [14:11]
Katie Cobb
Ooh, maybe we need Scott back on the podcast.
- [14:14]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I would love it. I would love it. He's a very good reader and he reads really differently than I do, so it's always worthy of a conversation.
- [14:22]
Katie Cobb
Yeah, we did that way back in season one. Maybe we both need to have our siblings back on the show. That would be a fun circle back for both of our beloved relatives.
- [14:33]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes, that would be very fun.
- [14:34]
Katie Cobb
Okay, my first book this week is a pretty new release. It's Good Dirt by Charmaine Wilkerson. So this is the newest release from the author of Black Cake, which was my very top book of the year in 2023. So I went into it with high hopes. Folks, let me preface this by saying there were very loaded expectations on this book for me. Good Dirt is a multi timeline and multi generational story that follows Ebbi Freeman and her family. Here's the setup. Ebbie was only 10 years old when an armed robbery ended in violence that killed her brother Baz and shattered a precious family heirloom, a centuries old jar filled with dirt. Which doesn't sound precious, but it was very valuable that crime was never solved, no justice was ever served, and the Freemans continued on in their grief, attempting to stay under the radar. But since they're one of the only wealthy black families in their area, they were always of interest to the public. When Abby gets left at the altar by a wealthy, hot, eligible trust fund kid, they are back in the spotlight, forefront of the community consciousness. Soon, Abby finds herself floundering, so she takes up her friend's offer to move to France for the summer and run her family's guest house. But her past shows up at the doorstep, forcing her to confront it and all the other trauma she left behind. I am normally a pretty big fan of a multiple timeline, sweeping family novel, and in fact I think Charmaine Wilkerson is great at that construct as that's what I loved so much in Black Cake. Throw in a central mystery check and we've got ourselves a plot that moves with Cheeto chapters and time jumps to keep me on my toes. These are great for me. However, this one felt really disjointed to me. It may have been better served if we had made it clearer when we were in another timeline, but the parental timeline and the generational timeline all kind of ran together for me. I was like, who's proposing? What's going on here? Are these people living on a plantation or are they in Maryland? What's happening?
- [16:35]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
So the chapters, it wasn't by chapter.
- [16:38]
Katie Cobb
It was, but within a chapter it would get very muddy.
- [16:42]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Okay.
- [16:43]
Katie Cobb
It was like a lot of pronouns, she and he and who are these people again? What's happening with these people? Right. And then Abby felt washed out. Her storyline, which was the most interesting to me, felt washed out instead of enhanced by the other two. By the time we got to the final 10 to 15%, 50 some odd pages to go. I was just wishing for a speedy resolution or revolution, either one, but still 50 more pages. So while I did enjoy it enough to finish it, and it does have slightly higher overall ratings than Black Cake on Storygraph and Goodreads, there is one book here that has my heart never to be unseated and it's Black Cake. I'm glad I read Good Dirt. I'm glad it is another hit novel for Ms. Wilkerson, but for me it was unable to live up to its predecessor and that's partially a me problem. As I said at the outset, I Went in with very high expectations. I think this would be a great book to read standing alone. If you've never read Black Cake, good on you. Maybe start with this one and move to the other one for me, not quite as much of a hit. This is Good Dirt by Charmaine Wilkerson.
- [17:50]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yeah, maybe that's another deep dive that we should do. Books that we feel were very, very affected by our expectations. Because I was just talking about this last night about the second. After the second book, after Tainted Cup Drop of Corruption.
- [18:06]
Katie Cobb
Right.
- [18:07]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
And since I read that, I mean, I really didn't like the second one at all. And the first one had been my top book of the year. And so. But in thinking about it, I do think that if I were to have read it at a different time with lower expectations, I think it would have been. I'm. I'm good. I may revisit that book in the future. Let me put it that way.
- [18:26]
Katie Cobb
Fair. Yeah.
- [18:28]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right. My second book is nonfiction, and this is a book called From Strength to Finding Success, Happiness, and Deep Purpose in the Second Half of Life by Arthur C. Brooks. All right, so From Strength to Strength is written by Harvard professor Arthur Brooks, and he tackles that really scary question that we all eventually face, which is what happens when our professional powers maybe start to fade a little bit? It's a reality that hits this high achiever especially hard, that moment when the very skills and drive that propelled you to success become less effective as you age. But rather than offering, like, cliches and tired platitudes about just packing it in, Brooks delivers a practical roadmap for transforming the second half of your life from a time of decline into a period of unprecedented fulfillment. What makes this book different is how Brooks systematically dismantles our culture's toxic success addiction while building a compelling case for what really creates lasting happiness. He also talks about things like fluid intelligence, which is the quick, innovative thinking that peaks early in our life. Late 20s, up to your mid-30s. And crystallized intelligence, which is the deep wisdom and teaching ability that actually improves with age. All right, so this book was a part of my morning reading that will not surprise you. And I'm irritated by the fact that I can't remember how it came on my radar. I talked on the show about the fact that as I approached my 50th birthday, and now as I approach my 52nd birthday, I have become increasingly interested in the concept of how those of us of my generation are going to use what could be the full back halves of our lives. I've become really obsessed with the notion of what legacy do I want to build and leave after me? How can I use the time that I have to the best of my ability? And this has become increasingly top of mind for me to consider, as in the next few years, I will begin a semi retirement from my day job at Here Comes the Guide. I won't retire completely, but I will transition into not needing to work as many hours as I have for these almost 30 years. So this book came at a perfect time and it's a really good book, perfect for morning reading. Also, it's a fast read. Probably the single biggest benefit for me of reading this book was just the feeling of not being alone. Not being alone in the considerations that I've just spoken about, but also not being alone in the fact that it's occurring to me more and more that in my industry, the older I get, the further away I am from the very group that is using the product that I sell. Right. Here comes the guide to the website for couples who are getting married to use to find their wedding venue. Arthur Brooks spends quite a bit of time talking about that concept and the fact that we each need to realize when we are not at the top of our proverbial game anymore as it has to do with the product that we're selling. But he doesn't just leave it there. He lets us know that while we might not be in that same position that brought us to the height of our professional careers, we are in fact in possession of a strength that we did not have 20 or 30 years previously. And that, of course, is what this book is about, how to leverage those strengths and build on those in the back half of your life. And it has a lot of really fantastic things to say about that. And it gave me some new understandings and new strategies as to how I want to use these next years. I will say that the single biggest weakness of this book is that it approaches all of this discussion from a point of tremendous privilege. There really isn't any consideration in this book that isn't around the fact, sort of around the structure of, okay, so you've built this fantastic career and you've probably made quite a bit of money doing it. So now you can consider doing a lot of different things in the back half of your life because you don't have to worry about making a lot of money. That is a tremendous privilege. And I want to be aware of the fact that that is what is going on in this book also. It's not a book written from a Christian perspective at all, but the author does use some biblical references, both in terms of Bible verses and in terms of people from the Bible. I want to mention that because although it didn't bother me, which is saying a lot given my history with the Evangelical church, it is there and I feel like it would be weird if I didn't mention it. There's a chapter in this book called Cast into the Falling Tide that I found to be by far the most insightful and useful chapter in the book. In fact, I read that three different times on three different days to make sure that I was taking in and making notes about all the things that were pricking different parts of my brain. Really, really good stuff there. So I'm glad that I read it and definitely would recommend it to anyone who is in this period of life where you're asking what is next for me. This is From Strength to Strength, Finding Success, Happiness, and Deep Purpose in the Second Half of Life by Arthur C. Brooks.
- [23:56]
Katie Cobb
Excellent. I feel like that was a great review. Very balanced. We've got the pros and the cons. You absolutely let us know if that book is going to be perfect for us. I love that.
- [24:06]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Thank you.
- [24:07]
Katie Cobb
My second book is also nonfiction, but it is historical biography and a little bit fun. Tongue in cheek, it's she Came to Slay by Erica Armstrong Dunbar. Here's my nonfiction pick for the episode, I am bringing a modern, fun version of a biography of Harriet Tubman for us all. What? Harriet Tubman, you say? Yes, this book was deep in my Libro FM account and I got lost in the rabbit hole one day finding out, like, going back and figuring out what I had gotten long ago because I felt like I was grabbing the alcs that were current and reading them right away. Like, yes, thank you, Abby Jimenez's new release. I will take that immediately. But like, they gave me stuff, you know, six years ago. What's happening with that stuff? Is there anything good in there? This title released in 2019, but in 2025 it came back to me. So here we are. We are all familiar with Harriet Tubman, of course. She is the most famous conductor on the Underground railroad, with many journeys made along the escape route and many lives changed and saved because of her bravery. But more than what was supposed to be on a Face, a face on a $20 bill, she led a long and interesting life and this book gives us a fresh take on her experiences. I did listen to this as an audiobook because obviously that's how Libro FM sent it to me, but it's very clear from the description which I read after the fact that it's important to read this one visually as well. So I grabbed a copy from my library and paged through the extra material. This book includes the prose, of course, which details Harriet Tubman's life from her birth when she was named Araminta and went by Minty, to a childhood near death experience, a head injury, throughout her marriage, her escape into her time as a conductor on the Underground Railroad, a Civil War soldier on into her geriatric years fighting for women's right to vote and completing speaking engagements while working to be paid for the work she did for the US Armed Forces. Her life is so interesting and it's not just those few years when she was a conductor known as Moses on the Underground Railroad.
- [26:15]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I had no idea, by the way. I had no idea.
- [26:18]
Katie Cobb
It's mind blowing. I have chills. She is so interesting visually. If you pick up the paper copy of this book, we are treated to photos, a family tree, a copy of the newspaper advertisement that's seeking her as a runaway, describing her maps of her routes on the railroad. So much more. It is a book that is heavily enhanced by the printed version. For me, I did really enjoy the audio narration by Robin Miles, who is a perennial favorite for me. And I loved this deeper dive into the Life and Times of Harriet Tubman, which is the subtitle of the book. I gave it 4.75 stars. This is going to go on my homeschool bookshelf like I'm. I borrowed it from the library, but I will be buying a hard copy because it gives us such a great, like, visual dictionary of this truly, truly remarkable woman who deserves to be celebrated. So I highly recommend it. Again, audio, great paper. Is the way to go. This is she Came to Slay the Life and Times of Harriet Tubman by Erica Armstrong Dunbar.
- [27:21]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
And I love the title so much.
- [27:22]
Katie Cobb
Oh my gosh.
- [27:23]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I know.
- [27:23]
Katie Cobb
It makes me so happy. It's so good.
- [27:25]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right. My third one is my five star of the day. I can't even express to you how much I loved this book. It was also kind of a surprise to me, so I definitely wanted to bring it today. This is a book called Wives Like Us by Plum Sykes. We will revisit that title. In Wives Like Us we are taken to an area called the Bottoms, which let me say is not your grandmother's quaint English countryside village. This is a glittering enclave of Cotswold villages. Yes, this exists populated by what Plum Sykes Calls the country princesses. This is not historical. This is like present day. At the center of this social typhoon is our main character, Tata Hawkins.
- [28:17]
Katie Cobb
Okay. Who lives in the bottoms.
- [28:20]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Lives in the bottom. Yes. Okay.
- [28:22]
Katie Cobb
Tatas and bottoms. I know what happening? Okay, I'm here. I've got you. Go.
- [28:27]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
This is exactly why the book was a surprise. Right?
- [28:29]
Katie Cobb
Okay.
- [28:30]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right. So at the beginning of our story, Tata has gotten into a huge fight with her husband, and they. She has decamped from the estate's grand mansion to the equally glittering but smaller coach house. That's on the. That's on the estate because she's very mad at her husband. There was some. There was a receipt. There were some jewels that did not come to Tata. There is a big fight. And so she drags her daughter Minty. Weirdly Minty. No, Araminta, who goes by Minty. And Tata's supremely competent executive butler, Ian Palmer, as she decamps to the. The coach house. Okay, so good old Tata is not the only one with drama in her otherwise perfect life. Her friends Fernanda and Sophie also have their own problems, but they are all trying so hard to be like ducks, right? All effortless, floating on top with mad struggle underneath. When the biggest mansion in the area is purchased by a very mysterious new American divorcee, very British hijinks ensues. Okay, I know that's a weird setup. Let me give you a little bit more context. I enjoyed this book way more than I thought I would. Partly it was because in the moment, I was. I was not in the best mood, and I had dnfed three books in the dark, like, two days previous to this. I just could not find the exact right thing. Then I went to the library and I used bookish serendipity to pick this one up from the regular fiction stacks. This was not like this was just in the fiction stacks, which y'all. That is where the goodness is. I picked it up. The COVID is really. The COVID that my library had is really, really pretty. All right, I'm going to say right here at the start that what I didn't love about the COVID is the only thing that I did not like about this book, and that is the title. The title, Wives Like Us is stupid. It's grammatically incorrect. And this book should have been called the Country Princesses. I don't understand why that wasn't the title, but I feel sure that if the book had had a better title, it would have gotten a bigger audience. And it should, because this book is 348 pages of absolute frothy delight. This book is a perfect hazelnut iced coffee on a beautiful spring afternoon. If you also had a little slice of lemon pound cake on the side, all the better. I loved this book. Are you getting that? What I loved most about it, beyond the surprise and the fact that I kept asking myself what I kept closing it and looking at the back going, what is this book? Who is this author and where has she been all my life? The fact that I expected one thing. I expected rich people behaving badly in this story. Or at the very least, I thought I was going to get a Desperate Housewives of the Cotswolds kind of situation. This is not what we get in this book. In fact, not only are there really no characters in this book that are straight up nasty, there are loads and loads of characters that you absolutely come to adore. And the biggest surprise at all of all is that these women, yes, they do care about what they're wearing. And we talk about different accessories and who's got what purse and the kind of picnic basket that they have and who can plan the perfectly planned kitchen supper, which was. This is a new concept to me. A kitchen supper is supposed to be like a casual meal, but it's really a very highly planned party. So you get all of that. But they also care about their lives and their marriages and their kids. They care about what their house looks like, but they also really care about their friends. There was something not only fantastically early Instagram with that aesthetic of the Great British Bake off, but also something flat out cozy about the story. It was charming and comforting. There's lots of scenes where I expected cattiness, but I got calming friendship instead. There were scenes when I thought we were going to get desperate betrayal. And instead we got feminine loyalty. I loved it. And I have to say in my. I have the word in my notes. Ian in all caps, the executive butler. In my notes, there's five exclamation points after this. Ian is the main character. Tatas butler. I have never loved a butler character more. And it is through his eyes that we experience the entire book. And that pov, I think, is the reason that this book was such a win for me. Because we're seeing the story through Ian's eyes and because Ian is such a good natured man who works to see the positive in each person. That is the main reason why, instead of being mean spirited, this book is actually very sweet. Everyone in the world needs an Ian. That said, I don't even know how to comp this book. It's not like anything I've ever read. I'm kind of wanting to call it Bridgerton mixed with Desperate Housewives, but again, I would be expecting nasty women doing nasty things to each other, and that's just not what we get here. It's a really good natured, highbrow British soap opera. I loved it so much that I hugged it to my chest when I finished it, and I was immediately put into a slump. That's one of my favorite reading experiences. This is the terribly titled but wonderfully read Wives Like Us by Plum Sykes. Apparently, by the way, when I finished this and talked about it a little bit on Instagram, other people love Plum Sykes.
- [34:16]
Katie Cobb
Huh.
- [34:17]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I've never heard of Plum Sykes.
- [34:19]
Katie Cobb
Crazy.
- [34:20]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
You will be hearing more.
- [34:21]
Katie Cobb
All right. I like it. And I have a fun tie in to that book. So now I think maybe this one is calling me, even though then I would also have to talk about Wives Like Us, which is a terrible title.
- [34:34]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
It's a terrible title.
- [34:35]
Katie Cobb
Instead, I will tell you about a book you have read, Meredith. It's A Most Agreeable Murder by Julia Seales.
- [34:42]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
These two books actually are kind of in conversation with each other. Yes, in a way.
- [34:46]
Katie Cobb
When we heard you talk about it, I was like, okay, this is gonna be a great transition. Yeah. So this came back to me after Meredith talked about it on episode seven of season six. So almost, what, a year and a half ago at this point? It came back because Schuler Books brought it to the June 2024 indie press list. This is a murder mystery for you if you enjoyed Pride and Prejudice, but really just wish that somebody would have died at at least one ball. Come on. Beatrice Steele is not really a lady. She's feisty and she hates needlework. She sucks at music, and her artwork is atrocious. She has two sisters, Louisa and Mary, and the typical regency parents. One obsessed with marriage and one who jokes it off. But while Beatrice is not interested in the womanly arts, she is interested in something. Murder. She's obsessed with the true crime cases in the local newspaper and regularly responds to the article writer to give her own theories about each case. She's attempting to set that obsession aside at the start of this novel. That's not what ladies do. They're not obsessed with all things murderful. Right, Meredith?
- [35:53]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Right.
- [35:54]
Katie Cobb
Right. So instead, there's going to be a ball. Hooray. The family is hopeful that sister Louisa, the pretty one, will be able to woo the heart of Edmund Crokesworth in Swampshire that's where they are. Swampshire Edmund Crokesworth. The most eligible bachelor in the land, of course. Otherwise another yucky cousin will inherit the estate, leaving the family homeless. But when Croaksworth drops dead in the middle of the dancing and a storm keeps all the guests locked indoors, they are unexpectedly grateful that a disgraced detective also showed up at the ball. Yay. Oh my gosh. I love this book. Beatrice has to try to keep her interest in crime under wraps while also trying to piece together the clues with said disgraced detective before anyone else kicks the bucket. This was a delight and so very fun. While I picked it up for my pre read last May, it wasn't until this year that it jumped off the shelf onto my current read stack and it was just exactly right. I loved the setting, the cutting wit, the locked room, locked mansion, mystery aspect of it all, and the way that Julia Seals let us play along. There are a number of red herrings that kept me guessing the whole way through. This is also a mixed media book where the more standard prose text is interspersed with newspaper articles and excerpts from the Swampshire Lady's Guide to Etiquette or some other such nonsense. I didn't love those portions on audio, so I actually flipped back and forth for this one in a tandem read from print to audio and back again. One review I saw comped this to Bridgerton mixed with Agatha Christie and I love that. If they made a baby mashup, I'd add that it's the setting and comedy of Bridgerton and the social commentary and intricate crime solving of Christie mixed with the stormy locked room situation of a number of her mysteries that made this combo shine. It has a great cover. Everything about this is a delight. I truly loved it. I loved Beatrice and the Murder and the Mystery Within. This is a most agreeable murder by Julia Seals and you know that her.
- [38:09]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
New one, the Sec, the second one in the series, comes out in June. I just got an arc for it, so that's going to be coming up really soon.
- [38:15]
Katie Cobb
Yes, excellent.
- [38:16]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
It also has a really pretty cover.
- [38:19]
Katie Cobb
I love. I love those, like they're like almost scrapbooky digital covers where it's like as you read, you can find little things on the COVID that you're like, oh, that's why that's there. That's so fun for me.
- [38:29]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
And okay, so there's another way that the Wives Like Us cover is like, there's another way they're in conversation because that is similar. And with both of those you get the narrative voice that really brings you through the story. Right? Like, there's just something about her narrative voice that. It's funny, you know, it's. You're. It's funny and light and frothy and very, very British. And sometimes that just is exactly what my reading needs.
- [39:01]
Katie Cobb
It was for me and it was for you. This worked for both of us, this episode. I love that. All right, let's move in to our deep dive where we are going to talk about a book that surprised us. We did try to limit ourselves to one and then come up with some actionable things from that improve our reading lives going forward. So this is a book recommendation, plus some fun observations about surprising books. So, Meredith, why don't you get us started?
- [39:29]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Okay. The book that I am bringing as the book that surprised me just, I'm not going to say most, but one of the most surprising reads for me is a book called in this House of Breed by Rumer Gauden. Now, this is a book that was published in 1969 by an author that I had never heard of before. Roxanna actually brought this author to me and was the reason we started the buddy read. It also kicked off my obsession, our obsession, Roxanna's and mine, with books set in nunneries.
- [40:03]
Katie Cobb
Convents.
- [40:04]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yeah, convents. And books about nuns. And so why did this book surprise me? Again, the. The title is weird. In in this House of Breed. B R E D E. It's just weird. I don't understand it. I don't understand what's happening there. Rumor garden. Garden I had never heard of before. Is it a man? Is it a woman? I don't understand anything that's happening there. Again, published a long time ago. I felt like there was going to be nothing that I could relate to in this story. I also thought it was going to be boring because a lot of the reviews talked about how it was character driven. So we read it in September of 2022. I feel like my reading has changed a lot in the three years since. Well, I mean, definitely in the four years since I started reading with Roxanna. Because we have started, you know, we've tackled a lot of books that otherwise I wouldn't have tackled alone. This is one of those. I never would have touched this book with a 10 foot pole on my own. So read old books again. I am more and more and more convinced that for me, the best books that I'm finding are ones that are moldering in the stacks of our libraries. Right. They are not on the new release shelves. For me right now in the season of reading that I'm in, which doesn't mean that there can't be a new release. It's not fantastic, but that's just where I'm finding my five stars. So read old books. The title and the COVID are not going to tell you everything. For me, buddy read absolutely huge. And Roxanne is not the only person that I buddy read with now. And I really. I've realized that I use buddy reads to tackle books that I wouldn't have tackled on my own. And that has richly rewarded me. Not only do you take more out of the buddy read, but I wouldn't even have picked up.
- [41:53]
Katie Cobb
Yes.
- [41:53]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Several of the books that we've read together. Gentleman in Moscow. Right. My co favorite book of all time. And then also along the lines of Gentlemen of Moscow, which I almost did choose for this because in a lot of ways it's similar. A book that's described as character driven in a lot of the reviews. What I have come to realize by seeing these patterns in my reading, a lot of times when a book is described as character driven, what that means for a lot of readers is we get a rich character. I realize now that I thought character driven meant there was no plot. This was a huge light bulb moment to me and has really informed my reading of Goodreads reviews. I used to just turn away when something. When the word character driven was used. Boom, done. Shut up. Now I realize people use it differently than I was using it. And so now, as in this house of breed, a lot happens in this book that covers, I think, 50 years of these people, these women living in this. In this convent, just like in Gentlemen in Moscow. My biggest complaint was why is everyone saying this book is character driven? It's not boring at all. I. Those things do not necessarily follow. Character driven for a lot of people means you are getting a richly described character. That is what you get in this house of breed. Characters that have stuck with me in the more than three years since I've read it, or almost three years since I've read it. They will be. The lead character will be with me forever. I am so glad that I'm figuring out patterns in books that surprised me so that I can build on them.
- [43:32]
Katie Cobb
Yes.
- [43:33]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
- [43:37]
Katie Cobb
Okay, my turn. Yes.
- [43:39]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes.
- [43:39]
Katie Cobb
With your book. Okay. So I. When I was preparing for this deep dive, I went through just the past year to try and find something within the past year that surprised me. So I ended up settling on Crowtalk by our Eileen Garvin and in this case, we're talking about a lot of surprises because I had some misconceptions about this book before I picked it up. A that it would not be what it was. Which is why it's surprising, right? There's the title, the COVID the people I saw recommending it. I had incorrectly placed this book into the romance category in my head. Maybe more literary romance, Romance plus. But really, there's nothing in this book that should have made that happen. I had recently read Birding with Benefits. That was part of it. I had seen it cover out on table displays at bookstores. It didn't matter that it was hardcover, because there are now romances being released in hardcover. Suffice to say, I was very incorrect about the content and the substance of that book. And that means that throughout the experience of reading it, I was constantly surprised by the characters, the development of the characters, the plot decisions, the way the pieces interlocked, and more. And I'm positive that the surprise here led me to enjoying it more than I would have if I knew what I was getting into. I also may not have picked it up at all if I actually knew what this book was about at the time. When I look at my reading log and I like highlight crow talk and I look at 10 books before that and 10 books after that, 100% of them are genre fiction, lighter books. I read this in October. We have recently talked on the podcast. That fall was very tumultuous in my life. I was. If I was reading anything, nothing had substance. It was just like I needed a calorie dense garbage food. That's what I wanted in my life. All milkshakes and french fries all the time. I would not have chosen anything that anybody said was literary or character driven. And yet, because I did, it was a great experience. And that is something that I'm looking to replicate. Right? So here's my three things. How do I grab that again in my reading life? First, I want to try to trust Past Katie. So if I bought a book and all of a sudden it's starting to look at me like with Most Agreeable Murder, why is that one jumping out at me? For some reason, I'm going to trust that Past Katie bought it for this current Katie because now it's pinging on my radar even if I don't read the blurb again. If it was put on hold on my Libby and it had a long wait and now it's coming up and I've delayed it and then it's coming up again. Maybe it's time past Katie made a good decision there. Trusting past Katie is a good way to let a book surprise me, even if six months ago it would not have been a surprise to me. Second, I very rarely refresh myself on the setup for a book before I finally dive in. Rather than sitting down with a stack of five and reading the COVID flap or the back cover, I just start reading. Right? And I think that is a great way to let ourselves be surprised. I don't even know how long ago it was, Meredith, when I joked about you using a Ouija board to mood read your shelves, where I was like, wait, so you just like stand there and let the spirit guide you? You were like, no, that's not what happens. But kind of, yeah, because something is making me put that on a stack. Just dive in. Just see what happens. If it's not the right book, that's okay. I can set it aside for a later time or I can dnf, but it doesn't hurt to try it and it might be something surprising inside.
- [47:09]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Well, and just quickly to that point. Also, one thing I'm always reminding myself of is that the person who wrote the COVID flap is not the person who wrote the book. And oftentimes that marketing blurb is a terrible representation of what you're actually going to get because there are things like voice and POV and structure and content and construct that can change your experience of a book. So I right, when I do my book flights, it's all about reading those first few paragraphs or chapter, however much you want to read. Not the flap, not the back, not the Goodreads reviews, right?
- [47:44]
Katie Cobb
Or the author blurbs, even. Like, who even knows where those really came from, right? We've heard so many things, it doesn't necessarily matter. Third, and this actually came up in our deep dive last week, is I let the indie press list push me sometimes into something that will surprise me. Oftentimes, the books that really surprise me are ones from the indie press list that I have to read 10 to 20% of before we record, and then something happens to capture me within that period of time. That wasn't the point of that program. It was not. We're developing a Patreon piece of content that will give us books that surprise us. But even in our deep dive last week, ChatGPT pointed out that that is something noteworthy about my reading life, that the books that are outside my norm come from the indie press list because I allow myself to dive in without reading the blurb trust somebody else's recommendation, whether it's past Katie or a bookseller that I've never met in my life, but other readers really love. Right. So allowing that to push me. And that also shows up in my buddy reading. So sometimes it's Katie pushing me slightly outside of my own comfort zone into something that, wow. Actually, we were both surprised by this. Who knew? But because we did it together, we were willing to take a risk. We were more interested than if we were sitting there by ourselves saying, what is the point of these nuns in this convent? Like, why? Why am I still here? Well, Roxanna read that next chapter, so I will too. Oh, now I'm in. Right, Right. So buddy reading will get me to commit to something for longer and maybe that's enough time for it to capture me and surprise me in a totally new way.
- [49:29]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Right. Which, by the way, I want to draw a distinction. I think a lot of people. I think you just made a really good point because a lot of people look to book clubs to do this. First of all, a lot of people make some really bad choices for books to read for book clubs. Secondly, book club is not the same as buddy read for exactly the reason that you just said. Because when we go to book club, we finished. The idea is we finished the book and we're going to talk about it as a whole. When you're buddy reading, a lot of times you're, you are greasing the wheels of getting through the book together because. Right. Someone can say, yes, you're at a little bit of a slow spot. I'm three or four chapters ahead of you. Push on, because then you're going to come out of it. Those that you're not getting that at book club, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with book club, but it just doesn't serve exactly the same purpose.
- [50:16]
Katie Cobb
Right. We did get. Actually, I don't even know if it was this week, but this week to our episode docket, I added an idea that somebody had sent us about different iterations on a traditional book club, including a currently reading style book club. And I think it's worth talking about different ways of reading and community that are not, let's meet for book club once a week or once a month and read the book that one person chose for all of us to talk about. Because that doesn't add to my reading life in a big way. It makes me feel obstinate. Whereas there are other ways of reading and community that really do add to my reading life.
- [50:54]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Right. And Yeah, I mean, this is not a deep dive on book clubs, but. Yeah. So often when my real life friends are talking about book club, they're like, oh, I want to get to that book. I just have to power through this one book I'm reading for book club. And then, anyway, so that'll be a good. That'll be a good deep dive, definitely.
- [51:10]
Katie Cobb
For sure. All right, let's go to the fountain. Let's make some wishes, throw some coins. Pink splash. What do we got?
- [51:16]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right, well, interestingly, weirdly, my fountain wish is about the fact that I wish.
- [51:23]
Katie Cobb
I'm.
- [51:23]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Katie, I'm just going to be honest and be honest with you. I haven't said this to you directly. I'm finding it increasingly hard to come up with deep dive ideas that I want to talk about. I'm not, I'm not at all finding it difficult to want to talk about the books that we're reading or like to do the show. None of that. We've been doing deep dives for seven years.
- [51:43]
Katie Cobb
Yes.
- [51:44]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
It's becoming really. So I guess my wish is if. And I hate it when content creators ask other people to help them with the content they're creating. I think that's. It's such a pet peeve of mine. And also, if y'all want us to keep doing deep dives, can you send us emails on the deep dives that you want? I just, I feel like I'm kind of coming hat in hand. I am finding it increasingly, increasingly hard with the deep dives.
- [52:07]
Katie Cobb
It is. I agree. And it's because even sometimes when I'm like, oh, that's an idea. A lot of times we've talked about something like that already. Right. Because we've been doing this for 300 and some number of episodes. It's a lot of deep dives.
- [52:20]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
It's a lot of deep dives. But a lot of the ones that we've done in the last year have come from listeners saying, hey, I'm, you know, here's a question, here's the thought, here's whatever. So hit us with your deep dive ideas. That would be my. That would be my wish. And again, I'm. I'm. I'm irritated as I say this. I'm irritated with my own self. You can't possibly more be more irritated with me, listener, than I am right now.
- [52:47]
Katie Cobb
I can co. Sign that wish, though, because. And it's so much fun to know that a. There's somebody out there listening that says, oh, my gosh, that was that was my name. I'm so excited that they cared enough about this question to talk about it and that it created this cool conversation. So y'all know us by now, right? You know what's interesting to hear us talk about, right? Tell us what you want us to talk about.
- [53:09]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
That's fine, right? Or Katie, you know, is there a world in which people are like, hey, maybe two times in the month you don't do a deep dive. You just each bring an additional current read and we kind of don't need a deep dive. I don't know. I'm just feet. I'm soliciting feedback to currentlyreading podcastmail.com that's really the best way to give us this feedback that will come to both, because if you do it on social channels, I'm unlikely to see it, you know, so.
- [53:38]
Katie Cobb
And Betsy has to forward it to us sometimes. That's a whole thing.
- [53:41]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Exactly. Which I know she would happily do. But yeah, if you. If you want to weigh in on this topic, send an email to currentlyreading podcastmail.com and you will be guaranteed that that email will be read by Katie and by me ourselves.
- [53:56]
Katie Cobb
Yes, we both get all of those emails. Correct. Okay, for my fountain wish, I am going to wish to circle back. You know, this could have been an email I wished about a month ago for a reading repair manual. Thankfully, my wish, of course, had already been granted and the listeners let me know about it. So I ordered the book that was recommended over and over and over again, which is called the novel Cure by Ella Berthoud and Susan Elderkin. It includes, it says, 751 Books to Cure what ails you. And it is organized by topic, so you can just flip open and it's like, here's something for boredom. And sometimes there's a short essay, like a page ish, about that topic. And sometimes it's just a list of books, like Being 40 Something. That's just a list of 10 books for Being 40 Something. There's Divorce, which of course, I put a little flag on that page. Motherhood. There's also, toward the end, a reading ailments index. Like children requiring attention. That is an ailment for sure.
- [55:05]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes.
- [55:06]
Katie Cobb
Right. The tendency to live instead of read.
- [55:11]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Is there one for husbands requiring attention?
- [55:16]
Katie Cobb
Oh, I'm sure there's something to that effect. There's an author index. There is a titles index. Basically, there's a lot of different ways that you can play with this book. And the ailments are in alphabetical order. So you just Kind of flip through and see where it takes you. My small critique of this one is that I did do quite a bit of flipping through. It is not very diverse. There are a lot of white authors in here which. It's a product of its time. Right. So thankfully, just a day or two ago, I was also recommended the book Bibliotherapy by Molly Masters. This one, I ordered it on the day that it was recommended to me. But bookshop takes a little longer to get here, so it's not here yet. Here's what it says. Through turbulent times, stories keep us afloat. Books particularly console and guide us, feed our souls and open our eyes to worlds, possibilities and experiences we may never have considered before. Many of us have been self medicating with books for years without identifying the practice as bibliotherapy. This carefully curated collection will help you identify the right reads for the right time. Whether you are in throes of first love or the depths of heartbreak, embarking on a new beginning, or questioning which path to take, use this guide to lose yourself in literature and find yourself anew and discover books that will always matter to you. Includes celebrated classics as well as overlooked modern masterpieces with a focus on underrepresented voices. So of course I'm very excited about this one. It's also in hardcover. Beautifully bound cover and it just came out in January of this year, so it's relatively new, which is why fewer people sent it to me because it's new to the shelves. But it looks lovely, has lovely reviews as well. So that one is Bibliotherapy by Molly Masters and the other is the novel Cure by Ella Berthoud and Susan Elderkin. I will do a story this week showing you both of these books after this episode comes out, so you can choose the one that's right for you. But I just wanted to circle back on that because people had questions.
- [57:17]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
I love it. I love it. You know what that also leads me to? That's another thing that our database could have available to. It is kind of a cure what ails you element of it.
- [57:29]
Katie Cobb
Yeah, yeah. A tag for each book entry, right?
- [57:33]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Yes. Read this if you do. I love it. So many things that our bookish database could do if I could figure out a way to do it that didn't.
- [57:45]
Katie Cobb
Make it all find 8,000 hours to work on it.
- [57:49]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Exactly.
- [57:49]
Katie Cobb
No big deal.
- [57:50]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Exactly. All right, that is it for this week. As a reminder, here's where you can connect with us. You can find me. I'm Meredith MeredithMonday Schwartz on Instagram and.
- [58:01]
Katie Cobb
You can find me Katie Oates on bookmarks on Instagram. Our show is produced and edited every week by Megan Putovong Evans and you can find her on Instagram at Most of megansreads full show notes with the.
- [58:12]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Title of every book we mentioned in the episode and timestamps so you can zoom right to where we talked about it can be found in our show notes and on our website@currentlyreading podcast.com youm.
- [58:23]
Katie Cobb
Can also follow the show at currentlyreading Podcast on Instagram or email us at currentlyreading podcastmail.com and if you want more.
- [58:33]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
Of this kind of content, have we got it for you? Become a bookish friend on patreon for just $5 a month and you get a ton more content. You get a ton of community and you keep this show commercial free. You can also shout us out on social media or leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. All three of those things help us to find our perfect audience.
- [58:57]
Katie Cobb
Yes, bookish friends are the best friends. Thank you for helping us grow and get closer to our goals.
- [59:03]
Meredith Monday Schwartz
All right, until next week, may your.
- [59:04]
Katie Cobb
Coffee be hot and your book be unput downable. Happy reading Katie Happy reading, Meredith.