BONUS: What's it like as a player? (on Dark Dice)

Summary

Dark Dice: BONUS Episode – What It's Like as a Player

Release Date: July 8, 2024
Host/Authors: Fool and Scholar Productions
Episode Title: BONUS: What's it like as a player?

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Introduction

In this special bonus episode of Dark Dice, host Florian and Caitlyn delve into the intricate experiences of playing and contributing to the horror-themed actual play podcast. This episode offers listeners an insider’s perspective on the dynamics, challenges, and creative processes behind their immersive Dungeons & Dragons (D&D) campaigns.

How Florian and Caitlyn Joined Dark Dice

[01:01] Florian: "We were walking in the streets and we realized we ran out of time. We just recorded a choir for eight hours yesterday and were super tired and went to sleep."

Florian and Caitlyn recount their initial connection through online German language classes, which organically led to their collaboration on Dark Dice. Caitlyn shares her first encounter with Florian outside the classroom setting.

[02:04] Caitlyn: "People were asking a lot about the process of recording the show, what it's like."

Scheduling and Recording Logistics

Managing a podcast that spans multiple time zones presents unique challenges. Florian and Caitlyn discuss their meticulous scheduling process to accommodate players from regions including California, Texas, Brazil, the UK, Berlin, Spain, Taipei, and Malaysia.

[04:09] Florian: "We had like a checklist. A lot of people say, like, oh, go over the things that are important. And for me that's logistics."

They emphasize the importance of flexibility and adaptability, often adjusting schedules to ensure smooth recordings despite the diverse player base.

Character Creation and Player Experience

Caitlyn shares her journey as a first-time D&D character creator, introducing Jaare—a pacifist pirate whose non-violent approach adds depth to the storytelling.

[11:37] Caitlyn: "I played some pre made pre gen characters for other games, but I never had to come up with my own character."

The collaborative process between Florian and Caitlyn in developing character backgrounds and personalities is highlighted, showcasing their commitment to enriching the narrative.

Managing Multi-Timezone Sessions and Player Dynamics

Handling a large group of players requires strategic management to maintain coherence and engagement. The duo explains their approach to splitting parties, introducing new players, and maintaining order during chaotic sessions.

[14:22] Caitlyn: "The first session was wild, but then the second session was very much… people knew what it was going like and how to behave."

Implementing tools like hand-raising and structured introductions helped streamline interactions and ensure everyone’s contributions were heard and valued.

Editing and Post-Production

Post-recording, Florian and Caitlyn tackle the extensive editing process to transform lengthy sessions into engaging podcast episodes. They discuss cutting down four-hour recordings into multiple episodes, ensuring a focused and captivating narrative.

[10:00] Florian: "So you're telling me we edit the show, but it's not like we're making a whole new script and a whole new show. It's just the game."

Their dedication to maintaining the integrity of the game while enhancing listener experience through thoughtful edits is evident.

Co-DMing with Special Guests: Interview with Scott Sigler

A standout segment features an insightful conversation with Scott Sigler, a renowned author who co-DMs with Florian. They explore the dynamics of cooperative DMing, emphasizing fluid storytelling and meticulous time management.

[33:12] Scott Sigler: "When we're working together to cooperatively DM and tell these stories, we're not clashing heads very often."
[36:19] Scott Sigler: "We try really hard to create those timelines because we are usually recording for a podcast."

Scott elaborates on their synchronized approach, utilizing tools like Microsoft Excel to adhere to strict schedules and ensure a seamless narrative flow.

Storytelling and Crafting Adventures

Florian and Scott discuss the collaborative creation of adventures like Shores of the Silver Thrum and Sunken Bulwark. They emphasize the importance of playtesting, adapting to player interests, and balancing pre-written content with improvisational elements.

[40:44] Scott Sigler: "What are people's interests going to be drawn toward? What will really resonate or not work?"

Their shared passion for storytelling ensures that each adventure is both engaging and adaptable, catering to diverse player dynamics and preferences.

Music and Sound Design in Dark Dice

The episode also delves into the crucial role of music and sound design in enhancing the podcast's immersive experience. Florian and Caitlyn discuss their collaboration with composer Peter Elenki and sound designer Steven Mercado to create atmospheric scores and soundscapes.

[51:22] Caitlyn: "What was that like? So we're now working on songs that are going to be the backing of the stuff we recorded."
[54:33] Caitlyn: "I get to put words in their mouth."

They highlight the meticulous process of translating story elements into musical compositions, ensuring that each piece complements the narrative’s emotional beats.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, Florian and Caitlyn reflect on their growth as storytellers and the evolving dynamics of Dark Dice. They express gratitude towards their listeners and emphasize the importance of community support in expanding their podcast’s reach.

[62:06] Caitlyn: "And to help us with this discussion, please, in the comments, let us know. Let me know what midnight looks like to you."
[63:34] Florian: "Thank you to our lovely patrons and Discord people."

They encourage listeners to engage on social platforms, fostering a vibrant and supportive community around Dark Dice.

Notable Quotes

• Florian [04:09]: "We had like a checklist. A lot of people say, like, oh, go over the things that are important. And for me that's logistics."

• Caitlyn [11:37]: "I played some pre made pre gen characters for other games, but I never had to come up with my own character."

• Scott Sigler [33:12]: "When we're working together to cooperatively DM and tell these stories, we're not clashing heads very often."

• Caitlyn [54:33]: "I get to put words in their mouth."

Final Remarks

This bonus episode of Dark Dice offers a comprehensive look into the player and DM experiences, highlighting the collaborative efforts that bring the dark and immersive world of their campaigns to life. Whether you're a seasoned D&D enthusiast or new to the genre, Florian and Caitlyn's insights provide a valuable perspective on the art of storytelling within tabletop role-playing games.

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Connect with Dark Dice:
For more insights, behind-the-scenes content, and to support the podcast, visit realmspod.com/darkdice or follow them on social media at @DarkDicePod.

Transcript

[Travis Vengraf]

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[Florian]

See Dutchbros.com hi, my name is Travis Vengraf. Hello, it's Florian and I am with Florian in Budapest. We were walking in the streets and we realized we ran out of time. We just recorded a choir for eight hours yesterday and were super tired and went to sleep.

[Caitlyn]

Instead of nine hours instead of nine.

[Florian]

Then we slept and then we woke up and we're like, oh, we're leaving. But people wanted a QA episode, so we'll have these cool Nimonas.

[Caitlyn]

Here's your Q and A episode.

[Florian]

Yeah, so people have been asking a lot of stuff. We recorded Shores of the Silver Thrum. It was very interesting as we're also walking outside through Budapest on the street, trying to get to breakfast. So you hear that in our voice. A little bit of stress. This is not me. Sound design. Hunger. Yes, the hunger of Hungary. I'm not.

[Caitlyn]

I'm ready. Two minutes in.

[Florian]

We haven't even made it to the first block. But this is not my sound design. This is actual sounds. So that's why it sounds a little funny. So questions for you?

[Caitlyn]

Yes.

[Florian]

People were asking a lot about the process of recording the show, what it's like. So let's start at the very beginning. We knew each other, you and I met through the Internet, became friends through the Internet through actually working on the German language together. My proficiency or lack thereof. And I said, hey, would you like to be on this show? What was that process?

[Caitlyn]

So working on your language proficiency happened in German classes on Zoom. And then one day I was in class with another student and we. And you sent a text whether I had time for a short call. And I Thought, okay, short call. Maybe he wants to know something about homework or, I don't know, I don't have time. I'm teaching people right now. I don't know, class would end at 2 or something and then I'd be available. And then right around 2, I said, I'm available now. And immediately I got a video call. And I thought, video call? That's. That's a strange thing. People don't do video calls for homework. And as soon as I picked up and you opened with the line, do you seek him? I knew, okay, this is going to be a strange call. And then that second question after how you doing? Was, would you like to be on.

[Florian]

This show because we're making a new season.

[Caitlyn]

Yes.

[Florian]

And what details did we give you? I don't remember them. And we're passing a really creepy statue garden as we talk.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. If you are great Doctor who fans and you like the weeping Angels, I don't like turning my back towards those statues. Honestly, that first call, I don't know. I know that my wife and mother were around that day and they didn't understand why I was screaming and going crazy all of a sudden.

[Florian]

In a positive sense.

[Caitlyn]

In a very positive sense. But that is why I remember very little from that initial phone call.

[Florian]

I remember. So we had like a checklist. A lot of people say, like, oh, go over the things that are important. And for me that's logistics. So we went through and made sure that if we're going to play, were you available for certain times? Would you be available for a certain number of games?

[Caitlyn]

I think that came later. But you must have asked about the month in general.

[Florian]

I remember we also went over if there's anything in particular you didn't want in the game that was highly important that not be in the game.

[Caitlyn]

I know that you skipped me on that one.

[Florian]

I skipped you on that one?

[Caitlyn]

Yes. You once showed me that you did this checklist for the first season of Dark Dice that features a very prominent picture on top of the checklist.

[Florian]

Oh. With Captain America. So you want to roll the dark dice.

[Caitlyn]

I complained that I never got to see that checklist. But I want to add, I am very much aware that Travis and possibly Caitlyn usually sent these things around. But at that point we got to know each other well enough that they probably knew.

[Florian]

Was there anything I shouldn't have included that we didn't?

[Caitlyn]

Absolutely not.

[Florian]

We also had like a we can stop at any point thing. When we were recording, we used the tools to, ah, it's a total shortcoming. That's okay.

[Caitlyn]

Then again, if you sign up for rolling the dark dice with these people, be prepared for everything.

[Florian]

So that was the first step, and then we started recording by sending out these little doodles.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, yes.

[Florian]

Which is like, here's your schedule for the next six months.

[Caitlyn]

Are you available?

[Florian]

When aren't you available?

[Caitlyn]

And why aren't you available on the day you said you would be available?

[Florian]

Yes. And what time zone are we doing this in? Because one person filled it out in the wrong time zone, and then I had to make the adjustments. And then at some point, we told you there were people playing, and then we started recording the show as one does through zoom, across the time zones of California, Texas, Brazil, the uk, Berlin, US Then Enrique in Spain, Taipei, and then, I believe Malaysia's another hour further. It was a lot of time zones, and then we all would play at a time that was terrible for one person or more.

[Caitlyn]

For at least one person.

[Florian]

And basically we had this moving schedule of this is going to suck for you twice. If you live that long.

[Caitlyn]

If you. If your character lives that long.

[Florian]

Yes. Are there so many cute dogs here? No one wants to hear about that on this podcast. We're talking about dark and scary things.

[Caitlyn]

Dogs. Dogs can be dark dog dice.

[Florian]

So then we recorded playing the game. What was that like? We were through zoom.

[Caitlyn]

Well, I'm an absolute noob when it comes to D and D and things like this, so I was very happy that we got this prologue episode which was just Enrique and me.

[Florian]

So we broke you and Enrique aside to talk about the ship.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, exactly.

[Florian]

What did we give you?

[Caitlyn]

I think at the end. End of the session, you gave us the drawing, the map of the ship, and then some. A list of things that we should be aware of, like that infamous harpoon gun and the quarters and the general layout of the ship.

[Florian]

And the other people on the ship.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, exactly. The crew, once we got to meet.

[Florian]

What they smelled like.

[Caitlyn]

What they smelled like. Was that in there?

[Florian]

I think so.

[Caitlyn]

What did UDA smell like?

[Florian]

Various meats or stews. Like that worm. Like, you know, the stew sort of clings to you, and you have, like, that grandmother smell.

[Caitlyn]

All right. Oh, okay. Yeah. So we got to know a little bit more about the ship than the passengers that were about to arrive in the next session.

[Florian]

So we recorded the game. We played the game. So you're saying that was. You guys played that. What was. It was easier because it was only four people. Caitlin and I co dm.

[Caitlyn]

It was easier in the Way, there is so much attached to that. We played using, or we tried using for the most part. Roll 20. And I've used roll 20 before, but it was always with these automated dice and everything. So having to type in everything myself, I rolled a lot of twenties simply because I gave the command to roll a twenty.

[Florian]

Yes.

[Caitlyn]

So figuring out how to actually use that was good before all of the other people showed up. And then again, I am not a professionally trained voice actor, so there was also this. I knew that some of the people that were coming in were voice actors or on other shows. So there was this mixture of being starstruck, but also huge imposter syndrome. So having this leg in the door already knowing the surrounding and having at least one person that, you know, okay, I know their playstyle a little, that was very good. That took the pressure off a little.

[Florian]

And then from the actual recording, how different, how drastically do you feel we changed what happened from your Session zero comparably to what we actually recorded?

[Caitlyn]

I think Session zero was very much the same.

[Florian]

We just got those amazing voice actors from Wooden Overcoats and no Sleep and.

[Caitlyn]

Oh man, that was about the first thing I knew about this episode, that the NPCs that we were talking to. So Caitlin and Travis were then going to be voiced by Felix Trench. Nicole, Goodnight. And just, I mean, this, this fact. I learned about this after playing the session. But it's so interesting seeing, okay, this is the way that Travis and Caitlin voice these characters and because of the way they talk to you, you interact with them, but then knowing that they're going to be voiced by completely different people and being super excited for what they're going to do with the characters, that was always very interesting. I mean, with all of the NPCs that we encountered.

[Florian]

So you're telling me we edit the show, but it's not like we're making a whole new script and a whole new show. It's just the game.

[Caitlyn]

No, Travis, you are not doing that.

[Florian]

Thank you, I appreciate that. Sorry. There's this one guy on Reddit who's been annoying.

[Caitlyn]

I mean, there are. And this is mostly down to me and all of the other actors. There are ways where, just as you can hear right now ramble on, where you misspeak mispronounce something. So we get to do retakes for that.

[Florian]

I'll even cut you off in the show and be like, hey, by the way, it's this. And you're like, oh, yeah, I'll say the name.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, yes, exactly.

[Florian]

It's not the Willow's fake, it's the Willow's Wake.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, the Willow's fake.

[Florian]

The Captain. Captain Gelman. Captain Gelmane.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, yeah, I remember Uter and Mr. Omen or Oman or what's his name?

[Florian]

Oman.

[Caitlyn]

Oman a couple times. So, yeah, names are always interesting. So we get to do retakes for that. Especially for things. Jahre. That's such an easy name. That's so easy to pronounce. No, but most of the stuff that gets changed in post is just us not being satisfied with the way we did that.

[Florian]

And also we cut stuff down. Like, my goal is to make sure that a four hour recording session, which is the average game session we played, was four hours of the break in the middle is cut down to a series of three or two episodes. I think is them reaching the island was the first episode. The first session we recorded everything getting to the island was session one. But yeah, and I missed this part as well. We had character creation. What was that like for you? Because it was your first D and D character, I think, right?

[Caitlyn]

It is my first D and D character. I played some pre made pre gen characters for other games, but I never had to come up with my own character. Funnily enough, when one of you told me that this was possibly going to be a nautical adventure, I immediately remembered a fake pirate character that Travis and I made up in one of the German classes. Because that's the kind of stuff you talk about fake pirates.

[Florian]

Important pirates from the north.

[Caitlyn]

From the north. And this particular fake pirate's name was Jaar. And from there, I don't know, I remember standing in the kitchen chopping up things for dinner and it was just, oh, this is a good idea, this is a good idea. This is a good idea. So I think within an hour or two, I had most of his background done.

[Florian]

We just reached our restaurants. We're going to eat and then we'll come back to this interview in a bit. So we are now sitting down for breakfast here at a cafe in Budapest.

[Caitlyn]

At the wonderful Flow Cafe. Should you ever be or live in Budapest.

[Florian]

Yeah.

[Caitlyn]

And sorry for butchering the city's name on and on.

[Florian]

So you were saying you're building your character. We talked about this pirate ahead of time and then we put them together.

[Caitlyn]

But we didn't talk about this iteration of the pirate. We did talk about a weird pirate. I think it was a faux monkey island. Like weird pirate, dude.

[Florian]

That was so fun.

[Caitlyn]

But then I remembered his name and I thought, okay, I'm gonna Build my character up from there. And then once the story stuff was done, we sat down over Zoom again and try to figure out, okay, what kind of character is he, what class, what build, what skills and whatnot.

[Florian]

And you made a pacifist in a dark dice game.

[Caitlyn]

Interesting choice.

[Florian]

He breaks into places, but he doesn't kill the people. He just takes the things that he's looking for to avenge and learn.

[Caitlyn]

He borrows information. Yes.

[Florian]

Yes, this is true. I don't think they're getting that page back.

[Caitlyn]

Yeah, well, if you've listened to the last episode. Yeah, maybe.

[Florian]

So then we recorded that. You did the first session. What was the. The first session? Because we went from basically like two DMs, two players, which is almost. I can call that a one on one or a two on two. It doesn't. It's not adversarial. So it's not like a fight. But then you go from that to two DMs, eight players, 10 people on a Zoom across all those time zones. And we're trying to manage this and trying to do.

[Caitlyn]

We didn't have the eight players immediately, did we? It was seven.

[Florian]

Oh, we didn't. It was seven players. Yeah, because Sam doesn't appear till later.

[Caitlyn]

Yeah, because players were introduced. Well, okay, we got the bulk of characters in the first session, the first actual session, but then surprise players by the end.

[Florian]

We just needed more space to introduce everybody.

[Caitlyn]

It was chaos. I'm gonna say the nature of Zoom and people's Internet connections is that you'll be talking over each other without intending to do so. And especially in a game where people get to improvise and tell more, say fun stuff or need to check on the rules. Again, the first session was wild, but then the second session was very much. People knew what it was going to be like and how to. I'm gonna say, behave. The etiquette of.

[Florian]

We had the hand raise if you wanted to say something or so that people weren't genuinely interrupted. And also we had everyone introduce themselves. And that was. I realized midway through, it's like, hi, I'm Eric Nelson. I'm an Emmy winning actor. And then it goes to like, hi, I'm Jess William Cartwright. I am a. He's done so many things. I'm on D20. I'm on three back halflings. I'm on Laundry list. I've done Dunedina Castle. Hi, I'm Florian.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. Jasper, if you listen to this, I'm still rooting for you to be on that game Changer show. Yes.

[Florian]

Yes, we are.

[Caitlyn]

But yes. Having all of these big, big people that I didn't necessarily know before then. And then introducing yourself. Yeah. Hi, I'm Travis and Kaitlin's German teacher. Nice to get to know you.

[Florian]

And like, Lily. Lily. We emailed Lily and we're like, hey, do you want to play this game? Because you're really fun. We watch your streams. We think it would be really fun to work with you on this. Her sponge is like, yeah, sure, why not? Like, that was the entire response I got from her. Was that one sentence with some punctuation in the middle. I think it was just a comma. Yeah, sure, a comma. Why not? No, period. And I was like, I think that was a yes. We went to the, like, the scheduling part and was like, okay, I guess this is really happening. It was a blast to work with too. And then you have Danilo Barascini, who is also lovely, lovely, lovely. I would love to work with him so much. I've wanted to work with him since the White Vault season three, like, on everything, everything. Because he's just so fun, man. And then, like, I guess you also. You'd listen to some of our shows. So you knew these voices.

[Caitlyn]

Absolutely, yes.

[Florian]

Sophie Yang, who is amazing and always really fun.

[Caitlyn]

And this is especially interesting for. I hope all of you have listened to the show, if not spoilers. This is especially true for Erik Nelson if you listen to him as Simon on the White Vault and he's just this very nice person and you care for him, and then all of a sudden you got Vint and.

[Florian]

Yeah, that's another question people have had. So how do we. We didn't record everyone at once all the time. We did these sidebars. So we tell you all to, like, take a 5 minute break or take a 10 minute break. Set your timer to it. Don't listen to what's happening. It's important. It's top secret. Yara's buying coffee or Yara's going to get the coffee. And it would be like Yara getting the coffee, but it's boring if I say this. So tell us what that was like as a player.

[Caitlyn]

I was just trying to remember. Wait, when did he get coffee?

[Florian]

There was a secret coffee meeting that Vin wanted to get in on.

[Emily]

That's true.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, but he didn't buy the coffee. He snuck the coffee from the coffee pot.

[Florian]

The terrible tasting and for some reason that.

[Caitlyn]

That didn't make the show. But all of a sudden, just because I knew the layout of the. Of the ship And I knew, because that was in the document in the file, I knew that there was a pot of coffee for the crew. And I mentioned that somewhere. And suddenly all of the players were picking up on that, saying, wait, there's coffee. We need to get that coffee. And it turned into a, I don't know, ten minute thing. And there was a secret coffee meeting, but it was.

[Florian]

We cut it down to like, less than 30 seconds.

[Caitlyn]

Horrible coffee. Horrible, horrible coffee. Just one question. Who has the better day?

[Florian]

Who had the better morning? Oh, he's had the better morning. I'm still Kop Schmelzen.

[Caitlyn]

And you want to get the smiley one.

[Florian]

Thank you. It's a smiley face. This is amazing.

[Caitlyn]

That's creative sometimes. And you just got it this one.

[Florian]

So thank you so much. Thank you, thank you. And you've got a heart. I'm going to do the millennial thing because this is a podcast because you guys can't see this amazing thing.

[Caitlyn]

And I'm going to take a picture of Travis taking a picture.

[Florian]

No, no, that'll look weird. I'll smile with my smile as this is. This is me smiling. I feel very happy about this as I have my matcha latte with a strange kombucha drink that I know will be cold and combat the headache, which is why I sound like I'm half asleep. We were talking about sing, though. We were saying, yes.

[Caitlyn]

Sidebar sidebars. From time to time, there was something that was maybe not of interest to the other characters because it was a thing from a personal backstory or like.

[Florian]

Going to a cave.

[Caitlyn]

Well, that was a bigger thing. But we had like 5 minute or 10 minute sidebars. If there was something that within the session didn't make sense because players needed to leave on time. And then we said, okay, we're going to do this thing that is not of any importance to any of the other players. We're going to do this in a 5 or 10 minute sidebar.

[Florian]

Yara's going to open up a puzzle seer.

[Caitlyn]

Exactly. Opening up the cube, for example.

[Florian]

Keep you after the session. And we just did that as like. That was actually 30 or 40 minutes of content with you.

[Caitlyn]

Well, there was other stuff to be discussed in that sidebar as well.

[Florian]

And we. We cut that all. It was all original dialogue cut into a single sequence of just Yara doing Yara talking to himself with Caitlyn narrating.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, but then there were. Of course there was. Was that session two. Was that session three where the party got split up? Well, the party got split up, but also the players got split up.

[Florian]

Yes. Because there's eight people going to a bar, and we didn't want to. We're introducing a new player.

[Caitlyn]

So to have more time to cater to the player's interests in roaming around the sunken bulwark. That was a. Was it a 50? 50 split? It must have been.

[Florian]

We asked you ahead of time, okay, what do you guys want to do? And then convo's like, I'll do it. I'm assigned. And then you're like, well, I guess I'm with convo. And then the other two were like, we're going to go on adventures. And then the other team was like, we're very specifically here to do a very specific thing because we've heard about a specific place that we want to go to.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, cool.

[Florian]

Okay, guys. So, yeah, we split you guys up 50, 50 beforehand, and then we scheduled it, which was much easier.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, yes. And it's easier to schedule with only four players instead of eight across multiple time zones and jobs and life and family and whatnot. But, yeah, that was the time the party got split up and we had some fun on our team doing things. Oh, there's breakfast. The white chocolate.

[Florian]

White chocolate tin.

[Caitlyn]

Thank you.

[Florian]

Thank you so much. This looks great.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, yes, it does. Thank you.

[Florian]

Okay.

[Caitlyn]

I don't know if you can hear the delicious looks of these pancakes that we just got. Mmm. So party was split up. We all had individual golds or interests and whatnot. And I will say this, right before that session, it was very clear to me that Jaare was going to find a new friend in this adventure, and Jaare needed to hang out with Nimble some more when the group came back together again. And then there was the next session. So that's the session after the split. So people met up again at the. What was it? The ritual of last light. And all of a sudden, there were less players on Zoom. Significantly, significantly less players. And I thought, okay, they're going to join us later. They're going to be on the boat. And then, yes. All of a sudden, you hear players talking about someone was killed, and you go, what? So we didn't know anything about that. Obviously. We knew that the player wasn't around anymore.

[Florian]

And you were learning as you were listening to the podcast.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. I mean, yes, very much.

[Florian]

If you do listen to the podcast, apparent. I'm told by sources who are listening.

[Caitlyn]

To the podcast, I do have that one advantage over all of the listeners is doing retakes. You get to Read the scripts. Sometimes you get a little sneak peek before the episode releases. And you know, whoa, this is what happened.

[Florian]

I'll clarify transcripts. We transcribe painstakingly every episode, and we do cut it down, but the retakes are highlighted in yellow so that people can re. Say the names the right. The first time.

[Caitlyn]

Yes.

[Florian]

Essentially for a lot of it. Or there's parts where there's action we want to get you, like screaming or where you're crying, but you were actually laughing while you were playing. You're like, this is so sad for Yara.

[Caitlyn]

And then some players will get instructions like, don't read so slow. Faster. This is faster.

[Florian]

Yeah. We try to take off that dialogue for Caitlyn and myself to make it faster. But we're gonna stop the recording real quick so we can eat. Yes. So we. We just finished our amazing meal. Thank you, patrons, for helping us eat.

[Caitlyn]

It's important for letting us have delicious pancakes.

[Florian]

Yes. So good. Our conversation reminded me of some things. It was our first D and D game that I got to play in years because the stuff with Jeff and the stuff with Rowena, 8th order and hem and the others who. I won't get into names because it's surprises. That was years ago. Like, I was going through. And I went through one session like, oh, Baron's in the scene. And then the same session, Baron's in another scene. And then I realized that Baron, in this one play session, we recorded it over six years ago. And the actual actor, my cousin Theo, is an adult and taller than me and no longer like 8 or 12. So that was. That was fun. So it's been a while. So that was. That was kind of cool, though. And I've learned a lot, and the storytelling that I could do is a lot better. I feel like the technology is a lot better with what we're working with. And Zoom is a lot more stable.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, yes.

[Florian]

But I don't miss the waking up at 2am to record. So then you're playing the game. And you constantly mention this to me every time we chat and do German courses. Like, oh, man, I hope. I hope the next session isn't my last. What is this like for you? Because we are. Improvised characters died very unexpectedly for us and you. We did not plan any of it.

[Caitlyn]

It was scary. I mean, I have with. With all of the people that get to play these games whenever they choose to. I have a circle of friends, of very great friends. But all of you out there will know that life will throw everything in the Way of playing games and game nights, Especially if you have kids. So these sessions, Aside from them being dark dice sessions, which was amazing, they were also game nights for me. So knowing that at any point, any character, and especially my character could kick, it was something like, no, I don't want these game nights to go away. There are these lovely people that I'm playing with. If you listen to the show, you will maybe see that my playstyle of jael is very. No, no, no. I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna get into this brawl. No, I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna try and keep him alive.

[Florian]

I clarify to a lot of people because we've done panels at events, and the bigger questions happen to be around, like, okay, what's the difference from, like, a home game to a this sort of game? And I think in my opening message to everybody in our conversation, it's like, hey, this is not us just having fun. This is trying to entertain people. So when you make decisions, when we do things, it's not what is the best for you or me to have fun. Although we do have fun. It is what is going to tell the best story. Which, as an actor, because you've done some theater work.

[Caitlyn]

That is true.

[Florian]

What's going to be really cool.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. And that's also very true because aside from trying to save game night or game midnight for me, There was always this, okay, me. If I was playing this with friends and we had a regular game night thing, I would totally do this just for the heck of it. But then you always, in the back of your mind, you have this, okay, but they're going to turn this into a show, and other people want to be entertained by us being entertained at the moment. So maybe do something a little more crazy here or something more creepy there. So there was always this. Yes, this needs to fit the show as well.

[Florian]

And it's very much of a yes and environment where you had designed and come up with some really cool plot elements where you would just randomly make things up about the ship that would then become, like, the map. That wasn't something I'd written. You just made fun of the fishmen. And the one book. And the one book. The one book to rule them all. So in a way, you shaped the willow's wake and others as well and made it into a bit more of what it was. I have a nautical background. Me, personally, I've lived on a boat. So a lot of the descriptions early on were things that I'd painstakingly Written out because I love boats. And Caitlin was like, why is this so many pages of descriptive text for a boat, Travis? So in a lot of ways, you guys really did influence what was popping up. How much of the show do you feel like was from you as a contributor and as a major part of the story?

[Caitlyn]

I mean, this is a question I get asked a lot because, hi, Mom. My family and some of my friends don't understand D and D or pen and paper. So whenever I told them that we would sit down for another session, they would ask, well, have you learned your lines? Because as Travis just said, I did some theater work. And you always sit down with a script and you learn your lines and you go over them and over them and over them. And this is what my family knew and what my friends knew. And then whenever I told them, well, there are no lines, well, then how does this work? And I said, well, it's Travis and Kaitlin. They. I mean, most of you listening know how D and D works, but I would always tell them, they give us a situation, a place. They say, well, this is what surrounds you. Go have fun.

[Florian]

And we're pretty rules light, right?

[Caitlyn]

Yes. Which was very nice.

[Florian]

Eric had no idea. And he would just, like, describe, like. And I'm throwing like six javelins at the guy. And I'm like, okay, you're throwing all your javelins. Let's roll. And if it rolls well, that's visually what's going to happen. Let's do it. It's going to be awesome.

[Caitlyn]

Yeah. So I feel like we had a lot of freedom in doing whatever we felt like doing. If it was somehow okay with the basic rules that you would still have to follow.

[Florian]

And then a lot of people have also said, like, the story of the season is almost exclusively interpersonal relationships of people being stuck on a boat together.

[Caitlyn]

Yes.

[Florian]

This is not replicatable. This is not something you could put in a book and make happen because it would be a different group of people. So to a lot of extent, the story we've seen on the Willows Wake was largely you guys.

[Caitlyn]

Yeah. I feel like if you put different people, if you put different players on that boat, it would be a different story.

[Florian]

We had run the campaign once or twice before at D and D in a castle, which was really fun, but it was a completely different experience. One of the players was the prisoner. The others were investigators trying to find their kids, actually, because their kids had been. They were trying to help another family who'd lost their kids more recently, kind of get and maybe patch things back together as a couple while trying to do good in the world. And it was like a very different story.

[Caitlyn]

Oh, yeah, you told me about that. Because it's always. Whenever we ended one of those sessions, and I'm the kind of person I want to know everything about the story. I would have done a lot more investigating if we had the time. So I'm always curious, how much did we miss out on? What didn't we see?

[Florian]

Did you guys miss the crab face?

[Caitlyn]

The crab face.

[Florian]

But don't worry, certain elements of the crew won't.

[Caitlyn]

So. Because I get to a little sneak peek behind the curtain from time to time, hearing about the things that we absolutely didn't do and that other people could have done, other players will do eventually, probably that. Yeah. Would make for an entirely different adventure.

[Florian]

And then we released them as pen and paper adventures. People can play after. And I know Domain of the Nameless God has been quite popular. And Silver Thrum should be released in a bit, probably sometime next year. Because we want to focus on our print edition of our book, which is kind of cool. I'm excited. So much art. We also part of our character creation process. You guys got artwork by Marcel Mercado and you got these sketches.

[Caitlyn]

I'm laughing because again, peeking behind the curtain, I would from time to time get a work in progress update from Travis or epaulettes. It was all these creative people because we're still talking dark dice. So they wanted pictures for every kind of scenario that they could possibly put in a book. And all of these creators would always take Jaare and put him in horrible situations because apparently he's the only average kind of human you could throw into these situations without clear photo reference, who looks like the player without having to draw horns and tails and whatnot on them. So, yeah, the character, the avatars, we got those pictures. And then we got to be nitpicky and say, yeah, that needs more of that. That needs less of that.

[Florian]

Don't give him a dagger, give him a marlin spike.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. Learning everything about marlin spikes. Look them up. That's Jaage's weapon of choice that he never gets to use.

[Florian]

Or the harpoon gun.

[Caitlyn]

But hey, he's stitching up sails with it, so he gets some use out of it. And then, of course, I mean, a lot of it is down to player preference, the colors, the.

[Florian]

We had your descriptors and information to work from, give to the artists. And then, like, the very specifically what Sealy's going to look like. Yes, that was important.

[Caitlyn]

And that was that. That was done after session zero. And I remember because. Improvising, I remember describing Celie as the midnight colored owl. And then there was some debate on what midnight looks like on an owl. On an owl or in general? Because when I think of midnight, I think of black and other people thought of blue.

[Florian]

Yes. But really quickly, let's talk with KA Stats. We're going to flash forward to find out what it was like from the DM's perspective. Let's go. Okay. I have left my basement, I've walked up a bunch of stairs, and now I find myself in the domain of the writer. KA Stats. Hello.

[Scott Sigler]

Hello.

[Florian]

I get to work with you a lot on a bunch of different podcast fiction stories, but we also do something rather unique. We play Dungeons and Dragons together. We are CO DM's in our adventures.

[Scott Sigler]

I almost feel like playing a tabletop RPG podcast is less unique because there seems to be more of them to clarify.

[Florian]

That's true, but CODM's is.

[Scott Sigler]

Oh, Codium, I feel like, is very unique.

[Florian]

And we did that for Shores of the Slur of. We have future plans, of course, as well. What's that like for you?

[Scott Sigler]

Co DMing with you?

[Florian]

Yeah, well, in general, I know I can be annoying, so I don't think.

[Scott Sigler]

I could co DM with anybody else.

[Florian]

Oh, why not?

[Scott Sigler]

So you and I are married.

[Florian]

This is true.

[Scott Sigler]

And we have been together for so long that we have very similar ideas and mindsets. We have experienced so much of the same media and experienced experiences together that you and I follow along a very similar wavelength when it comes to storytelling. So when we're working together to cooperatively DM and tell these stories, we're not clashing heads very often. There might be a couple things here or there where one of us has designed a character that the other person doesn't fully understand or something like that. But when it comes to, oh, our player just did something really interesting, sometimes we'll just look at each other and we'll know exactly what we want to do. And that is not something I think I would have with any other CO DM.

[Florian]

And then in general, the experience of CO DMing, we break things up. So if our players want to do something and one of us needs to get more hot tea or something, we basically tap the other person, like tag team wrestling. And just like, all right, you're in.

[Scott Sigler]

I mean, that's a very selfish example, but I think also I do have to recommend it for other people because I think it's Such a fluid way to tell a story, especially in a role playing game format like 5e, where, okay, we're going to have a battle now. So if I am 100% focused on all of the numbers of the battle, I'm the one taking the number notes, I'm the one marking people, I'm the one making sure that everything flows smoothly as far as the battle goes. And then you do all of the descriptions and you move the story forward. We're able to get through pieces like that, like set pieces like that so quickly that the story feels so fluid.

[Florian]

It really does. And speaking of the fluidity, we also have, we do something quite, in my opinion, unique. We have this timeline in Microsoft Excel, a spreadsheet that says, like, all right, we're going to give them an hour to do this. We're going to give them 45 minutes to an hour to do this. And that's.

[Scott Sigler]

Yes. So we try really hard to create those. Because we are usually recording for a podcast or in the case of when we go to places like D and D in a castle, we have only a few days to get through a very specific campaign.

[Florian]

Hours, specific hours.

[Scott Sigler]

So we've literally broken it down into this is how much time we will allot to this section of the story.

[Florian]

We also sometimes don't have access to talent for infinity. We have to end the campaigns at certain points because people have TV schedules and other stuff or they're just busy. So we really stick to the schedule, even though it's, you know, there's 30 minutes of variation or something. Can be 15 minutes to an hour and 15 minutes sometimes, because we do expect them to RP and role play and interact with things. We've done a couple of really cool creative things that allowed us to adhere to a schedule like that, that's fairly rigorous and get through an entire campaign within one session of what we thought it was going to be originally.

[Scott Sigler]

I think that also comes a lot from a basic understanding between us and the players that we choose or the players that choose us. It's true, they know that we've created a sandbox, but there's a very specific part of the sandbox that's tailored to them for them to have the best experience that we can give. And if they don't choose to do that, then it would mess up our schedule. It would mess up everything. But I think that there's an understanding between us as CO DMs and them as players that they're there to experience something that we've crafted for them, so they won't break away in the way that, let's say, if you're just playing with friends around a table, which is always a great experience, but is so much more of an open sandbox world.

[Florian]

It does keep them on schedule, with the exception of one Mr. Greyview and Mr. Ogan.

[Scott Sigler]

Well, I'm thinking of it like if you're in university and you're attending a class and you know that the professor has a very specific plan for that day, and the professor is very enthused to teach you about this one thing. If one person in the class is suddenly asking about something that is tangentially related but technically still falls within the purview of the class, everyone's like, okay, yes, you're not wrong. But also, we need to get to schedule. Yeah, we got to get to what we got to get to. So that's.

[Caitlyn]

That's.

[Scott Sigler]

That's how I can kind of view it.

[Florian]

I can very much understand that in terms of crafting the adventure of Shores of the Silver Thrum and other ones we're working on. Overall, what is the experience of crafting an adventure with two people? I don't remember how we started with the idea of Shores and Silverthrom. If I came to you and said, let's do this thing, or if you said, let's do this thing.

[Scott Sigler]

When we start with a nugget of an idea, like a little seedling of an idea, it bounces back and forth between us so much, so quickly, so fast, and things change, and things change, and notes are made, and notes are crossed out, and more notes are made and more notes are crossed out. And then eventually there's something drawn on a whiteboard, and it goes very quickly.

[Florian]

We were coming up with ideas while we were driving across the country. I remember because that was like one of our biggest brain sessions. Brainstorm sessions.

[Scott Sigler]

Yeah. So when we first started coming up with the idea for Shores of the Silver Thrum, we were still living in America, and we were still living in the basement.

[Florian]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Sigler]

And we still didn't have plumbing.

[Florian]

This is true. We were thinking about the cold while it was very cold.

[Scott Sigler]

This was honestly one of those ideas that we came up with. We came back to every once in a while, but it was so low down the priority ladder that we weren't working on it for months at a time. And then we come back to it, and then we do a little bit and then have to go back to a full schedule of normal work, and then we'd come back to it. In a few more months. So years later, we had left the US and then finally we were like, okay, this idea can become something really great. Let's sit down. Let's work on this. And then we had to find time in our schedules to actually create the story in time to have it play tested in time to then fix anything we wanted to fix and then play it with our cast.

[Florian]

And getting to playtest was really vital toward seeing if some of our ideas were too difficult or too easy or how they would kind of interpret them. Again, the sandbox, right? You've got a sandbox. You have many tools, many directions you can go. What are people's interests going to be drawn toward? What will really resonate or not work? We had a couple things.

[Scott Sigler]

Resonate, huh?

[Florian]

Yeah, I know, I know. What will just flat out fail. That was quite exciting. And then getting to adapt and adjust and getting another shot for the actual recording of the show, because we do. We play test at Dianina Castle. It's sort of our testing ground of ideas. And it's very fun to see. Maybe sometimes Caitlyn makes a puzzle that's a little bit too tough. Sometimes she does.

[Scott Sigler]

I didn't think it was that hard.

[Florian]

Sometimes it's not our fault or failings, but sometimes it is. We have a lot of fun with this stuff. So building the adventure together is really cool. And then also the Sunken Bulwark. I think the whole thing was stemmed.

[Scott Sigler]

From a painting well you sent me. Was it the picture of the temple?

[Florian]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was really cool.

[Scott Sigler]

And you said, this is just where they stop, you know? And then I was like, but what if it's more.

[Florian]

Yeah, but also still very small the entire season.

[Caitlyn]

Yeah.

[Scott Sigler]

I mean, I love the Sunken Bulwark. It's this desolate but very peaceful place until our heroes arrive.

[Florian]

Yeah, they're kind of the antagonists in the story. With the development of ideas and actually implementing a story, when we're DMing with two people, we. There are a lot of times where we're interjecting like two NPCs so that we can both be in the scene. That's one fun little trick that we have found is amusing.

[Scott Sigler]

Well, party splitting too.

[Florian]

Yes.

[Scott Sigler]

We have the opportunity to party split, which means that if you want to be character A and take half of the party, because half of the party wants to go do one thing, and then I want to be character B and take the other half of the party that wants to go do something else, we get to split them off, which saves time for our players, but creates double the amount of content for.

[Florian]

Our listeners in the same amount of time. Yeah, if, say, a certain shipwright wanted to go investigate a hold while everyone else was trying to buy illicit goods.

[Scott Sigler]

From a pirate, I feel like the only thing that stops us from utilizing CO DMing to a greater extent in the podcasting space is that we are very commonly recording from the same computer, the same zoom account, the same camera, and the same audio mic. So we can't take advantage of the split or split party as much when it comes to digital. But whenever we were doing live play tests, we really got to use that. And that was very fun.

[Florian]

That was. What are you excited about with what we're working on? If you can speak words, I can.

[Scott Sigler]

Say nothing regarding exactly what we're working on. I am excited because I absolutely adore making puzzles. I love making puzzles.

[Florian]

I know you do.

[Scott Sigler]

It's so much fun. And this time, I really tried to make a variety of types of puzzles and I tried to make them at a variety of difficulty levels.

[Florian]

You're talking about future seasons, not.

[Scott Sigler]

Yeah, I know. I'm just really excited to see how people play them. I feel like I should have play tested them maybe with my family or something instead of Travis, because Travis did not get them.

[Florian]

I got some of them. Maybe sort of the.

[Scott Sigler]

No, you did your best, sweetie.

[Florian]

There's hand holding going on. Well, another element to this, though, we also release book form releases of our adventures. He says plural, even though only, like, one is out right now. With that, what is the difference in writing for the books? How do you feel about that for other people to play the adventures that we've run, experienced, play tested? What's the difference in writing versus.

[Scott Sigler]

I mean, it's a completely different style of writing. It's more technical. It's technical writing. It's a story that's wrapped around a skeleton of rules that allow people to experience it again. We benefit because you and I have created these worlds together. We've created these ideas together, and we've created the story together. So when we're playing through it, even if those notes don't exist in our documents, they exist in our heads. So we know what to fill in with bits and pieces here and there. But for.

[Florian]

But for Izo, come be on our podcast.

[Scott Sigler]

But for.

[Florian]

Only when you speak. I don't know. On top of that, Izu, come on. It's just the neighbors.

[Scott Sigler]

When I'm creating for books, you have to write very technically. You have to fill in a lot of what you don't even know is a gap in knowledge. Additionally, I usually only have to write audio. One of the things I really enjoy about writing for our books is that I get to describe things visually which I don't usually get to do. So that's a great opportunity. It takes a lot of time to put these things together. It takes a lot of time to explain everything and to decide what is important enough to include versus what I want to include, but which may be considered unnecessary fluff that would only confuse a DM trying to play our game. And we certainly hope to put out books that can help other people play these fun games, terrify their players, put them through wonderful but horrible situations. What we want to do is get that out into the world. So we kind of have to take a hit to our own ego. Even if we say, oh, I really wish this was in here, but we know it doesn't have to be and it's not worth it to be in there. I think as far as things I would say that DMs should be doing, if I have any right to tell a dm, you must do this. I'm not saying must, I'm saying should. Because it's fun, especially for players. We include skills challenges. I really, really enjoy skills challenges. I know that they're not in use very much in the modern versions of D and D especially because there is, like I said, a skeleton of rules and people put time and thought and effort and in some cases like some amount of affectionate building into their character. They want to be able to use their abilities in a non combative way but still have the high stress situation of something that seems impending. And one of the things I really enjoy working with you on is skills challenges when we record those when we're playing through them because it is literal fast paced story building where you have the beginning of the story and the end of the story. The end of the story is good or bad? We don't know yet. And you guys have to tell the story about how you're getting there really fast and it's so much fun. It's again, one of those things that you and I benefit from playing as CO DMs because we can write everything down, we can have everything figured out and then we can just have this really fast paced, stressful, fun story that takes up a short amount of time.

[Florian]

In which the players don't always survive.

[Caitlyn]

Yes.

[Scott Sigler]

Like I said, the ending could be good or bad.

[Florian]

That was a lot of fun to record, I have to admit. And there are many other skills challenges that we will play in the future and that we've been working on that I'm also really excited to run through. Yeah, I think the ship, the Tempest, was the most fun I've had running a skills challenge and, like, preparing that.

[Scott Sigler]

I have to say that one of the skills challenges that we ran at one of our playtest tables at D and D in a castle was the most thrilling for me. Can't tell you which one it was.

[Florian]

Okay.

[Scott Sigler]

But I remember that one so clearly, and I think it was just a hoot.

[Florian]

They were excellent. Do you have an opinion on the production value that we. Do you listen to a lot of actual play podcasts in your day. Do you feel like us doing anything different is a benefit to your storytelling style, or how do you feel about that?

[Scott Sigler]

I mean, I've listened to some that are not very produced.

[Florian]

They're completely raw. They're raw?

[Scott Sigler]

Yeah, like, they're raw. They're a lot of people using similar mics. Maybe, like, half the table with one mic, half the table with the other mic.

[Florian]

They're great stories.

[Scott Sigler]

It's a lot to do with the people who sit around the table. But I think that the variety of types of stories being told, even if everyone is playing in a fantasy world with elves and dwarves and all these things, maybe different gods, different terrain, all this kind of stuff, but the variety of types of stories being told, be them serious or silly or anything, is one of the great strengths of TTRPGs. Even when you have everybody playing in, like, a Call of Cthulhu story. Okay, if you have 10 call of Cthulhu TTRPG podcasts, you're going to have a variety of different types of stories being told in different tones. Like, these are different people doing different things, and ours is different people in a different way, telling a story that's supposed to feel more immersive to the world and less like the ones I've listened to in the past, where it's people being very friendly. Like, the feeling that you're at the table with your friends. Yeah, the ones where you come away with that idea of, like, what's it called? Parasocial relationship, when you feel like you know these people at the table and then you're like, I do not exist to them at all. But for. For us, we're trying to have a balance between. We want to immerse you in a story, but also show you that that story has emotional effects on the people playing it.

[Florian]

That's very well said. As I Think through it. We've. We've done a lot of really emotional work in our stories, and some of them have had lasting effects. Some of our players have gotten married as a result of meeting from our games, which is absurd and really cool, and I'm very happy. Is there anything else you wanted to add before we wrap this up and jump to Florian and Budapest?

[Scott Sigler]

I want to thank everyone for listening, but more, and I apologize, listeners, but more important than our listeners, I want to thank our players for, again giving us the chance to bring them on this story. We love podcasting. We love playing D and d. We love DMing. And this is an opportunity that, if you had told me during my first few years at uni or in high school, I would have been like, ah, you're. You're joking. First of all, podcasts were, like, just coming out when I was in high school, so I would have been like that. That doesn't make any sense. But we're really, really thankful and really lucky.

[Florian]

Okay, and we're back. So we're back with Florian to talk about the creation process. So we have the music. It's been written. We're here in Budapest. Why are we here?

[Caitlyn]

Because we just recorded a choir.

[Florian]

The. The music, it was written in sheet music form, let's say a MIDI demo. So, like, really cheesy instruments that you'd find in GarageBand or other sorts of.

[Caitlyn]

Programs, which, to be fair, already sound fairly amazing to someone that isn't able to put these things together.

[Florian]

It's all Steven and the team putting these amazing voicings together. And then we have a syllable count. We get the words because we have to write lyrics to it, because the choir is not just going to go, ah, ah. So we cover the concept for each song in our world, ties to a region, and those regions have kind of like cultural things that are important to them, like the gods of sea and storms or other things like that. So we pull into the hotel, okay. And then we have these lines and these melodies as we're in the elevator. The da da da da. It's just a bunch of ahs. And then we count it out. We count ah, ah, ah, ah, ah. That's like five or so. Or maybe we could do four and just have it be four syllables or even one ah for one syllable. Then I write a story, and I say, like, okay, can you say intangible contradictions in five syllables or less? Yes. In German.

[Caitlyn]

That was. This is where I come in. This was the greatest fun. When Travis asked, hey, can you Help me translate these into German. And I said, yeah, sure, sure, I can do this. And then you realize there's such a thing as syllable count. And if you know anything about German, and I know much of this is a stereotype, but if you know anything about German, we have very long words. And then Travis tells you, I need to say this in four or six syllables. And you say, okay, well, we need articles, we need adjectives, and most of them already are way beyond your six syllables. So how are we gonna do this? That was creative. Bending the rules a little from time to time.

[Florian]

It was an adventure, but I think.

[Caitlyn]

We did a very good job of it.

[Florian]

So we turned these stories into songs with syllables. We got there, we're sitting there, we have a choir of 40 people singing in front of us, which is, frankly, still unbelievable. I was, like, really getting teary there for a few minutes. We've got Peter Elenki, who's. When you watch Netflix, if you get to the credits, usually it's conductor Peter Alenki, and you're like, oh, my gosh, this guy has done, like. I think he did Spider Man. I'm pretty sure he did The Spider Man 2 soundtrack. Miles Morales. That game was really fun.

[Caitlyn]

I should have gotten that autograph.

[Florian]

It's him. I'm gonna get the signature. So I got his, like. Shook his hands like, I'm not famous, you know, like, no, you. You are to me.

[Caitlyn]

Yep.

[Florian]

And then we're in that room, and you're making sure that they sound. They're doing the right words, and I'm trying to keep them tonal and pitched correctly and, like, the right emotions. And Steven's really trying to keep the right emotion of, like, louder, softer, more mercado, all the different things that makes it sound amazing because Steven is a wizard with music that he is life composing. What was that like? So we're now working on songs that are going to be the backing of the stuff we recorded.

[Caitlyn]

My mind is still blown to the extent that I don't know how to put that into words again. I'm that little guy that enjoyed audio productions from the age of three. And now I get to voice a character. I get to, well, not conduct a choir, but I get to put words in their mouth.

[Florian]

You push the button, you're like, actually, it's doch.

[Caitlyn]

Yes, please go a little more German on the German. Yes. This is a real word. Please pronounce it that way. So most of yesterday was me being in teacher mode, which was weird because there's people in front of you, doing stuff that you are amazed by buy and that they're doing for you. And yet you say, okay, yeah, but you did this wrong. I'm sorry, can I correct you on this?

[Florian]

And we did that for about seven or eight hours yesterday, including breaks. Eight hours of nine. We stopped early and we got our music set because we were ahead of schedule. The biggest question I think for me is, so you're also even a fan of the show. Before we met, you listened to the show and you're like, I heard you're moving to Germany in one of your episodes. If you need to learn German, hit me up.

[Caitlyn]

Here I am.

[Florian]

So we became friends that way, which is still also unbeliefful.

[Caitlyn]

Internet's power, strange way of becoming friends.

[Florian]

But yeah, then you hear the show and your mother's, of course, listening to the show. So what was hearing the episodes in their final. They've got sound effects, they've got music. I've edited it down and done my pass of brushing a coat while people are moving in a scene and adding shark noises, which sharks are quiet, Fun fact, trying to make them.

[Caitlyn]

These sharks aren't spooky.

[Florian]

And all the zinger noises and things and all the sounds from Svalbard I recorded and all the other stuff. And I was in a hurricane trying to record that thunder for an episode. For the Tempest episode, I've recorded like four different hurricanes for that. To get all those lightning strikes. And then you get to listen to it. And then as someone who played, you know where it's going well, and you, I guess you've peeked at the scripts, the transcripts a bit. So what was the final immediate product for you kind of feeling of that?

[Caitlyn]

I mean, I talked about this somewhere. It might have been. I might have been commenting on Patreon or something, but especially that Tempest episode while we were playing it. And even though you cut it down to size because of, again, questions about rules and whatnot, there was a lot of that table talk happening in that episode in particular, because there's a lot, lot going on. But even between all of these questions, the way the story was told and the things we were doing and the knowledge I have about the shows you do and that little voice in the back of your head going, oh, this is where Travis is going to do this and this is where that or that music is going to come in. This is going to be amazing. Even as we were playing and then now, what is it like a year later after recording. Yeah, maybe I listened to that episode and it's the episode I was waiting for. Because I don't only have my mom listening, but there are friends listening, and they're always going, oh, yeah, there's a new episode coming out. And you go, yes, listen to it as soon as it drops. I can't wait to talk about it. But I got to, again, being a patron, I got to listen to it a little early and. And it still blew my mind. I mean, I knew there was going to be a tempest. I knew. Yeah, okay, insert wind noise here. There's going to be lightning. There's going to be the St. Elmo's Fire, which, funny coincidence, is in a kid's book that I showed my mom saying, hey, this is what my son is reading right now. This is what he's looking at. Did you know about St. Elmo's Fire? And she didn't. And I educated her right in time for that episode. But yes, still with the pacing. I mean, again, that session was around four hours, maybe.

[Florian]

Yeah, it was a four hour session. It started at the Last Light Ritual. It ended with.

[Caitlyn]

All right, yeah, yeah, there was a little more. But still, that tempest, if it might have been during the session with the.

[Florian]

After, because we did the Yara Box.

[Caitlyn]

Stuff after the episode, there were sidebars after the fact.

[Florian]

Okay, so forget what you know is coming and let's have you go through the things. Because we need to go through the motions.

[Caitlyn]

But, yeah, so it's you. I had an idea of what the final product was gonna sound like, but again, the cutting it down to size, the pacing, the music, everything. Then again, I don't know if I said this out loud anywhere, but Caitlyn's narration, that just. Wow. All of that adds layers and layers and levels of emotion to the whole thing, especially if you've been a part of it. But I think even as a fan, I would have gone, wow, what is this I'm listening to? I hope you're all feeling the same. If not, I'm well.

[Florian]

And if you are to it again, please, please comment online. Say stuff. The biggest inhibitor to our growth right now is we need more buzz online. Just people saying stuff on places like Reddit, Twitter, Tumblr, Tumblr. We love you guys. You're so lovely. Um, again, happy Pride. It's probably after pride when this comes out, but talking about it in places and spaces online is really the best way for us to grow right now. I know it seems like we're a huge show. We're really not. Um, we do have the luxury of working with really cool people because our other podcasts are quite large and successful and we're trying to make this one the same so we could do more of it. I also wanted to interject Viviana and Yuhai, we're not being dicks.

[Caitlyn]

We're not.

[Florian]

They had no idea what was happening. They were on their own sidebar and we gave them descriptors like you heard. And their options to not get involved were reasonable, given what they knew. Yep. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I was feeling it like when we were working on the episode, I could tell, like, this is where the music's gonna hit. And I was working with Steven to write the music. At the same time we were recording Wrath of Winter, which is the 5 minute song we looped for 25 minutes unknowingly to most people, just doing so many layers that we could sneak it in that way. And I was like, okay, this is where the st. Almost fire is going to get really intense. And here's we have lightning and here's someone falls overboard and we've got fire here and things happening. And he's like, how are we going to fit all that in five minutes of music? He's like, you don't understand. Okay. Lyrics of giving everything you possibly can to avoid drowning essentially, to the gods of the storms to avoid winter's wrath. It was really fun and emotional and hearing the final version, getting it mixed from Marissa Ewing of Hemlock Creek Productions, where it didn't sound like a bunch of sound effects layered on top of each other, but actually sounded like a scene. And it didn't just sound like me brushing a coat on top of a scene with a bazillion sounds. That was really cool for me. The final, like, mix. Getting to enjoy it and not have to critique and nitpick, it was so cool. You guys did a great job also with your screams and fallings and explosions and it was a blast to.

[Caitlyn]

It's always fun getting to read the transcript. And then, okay, so you did the thing here. Okay, all of you have listened to the final episode. At this point, you fell overboard here and you're coming back up for air. And you did the thing on the show, but it wasn't audible. So let's have a retake of that. And then you sit in your little room in front of the microphone going, how do I sound? Grasping for air after hitting very cold water. So, yeah, all of these tiny little pieces coming together is always great fun.

[Florian]

Well, I appreciate your time. I know we're about to run out, to catch trains and planes and all the things. It's been a really fun morning discussion while we walk through the streets of Budapest.

[Caitlyn]

And to help us with this discussion, please, in the comments, let us know. Let me know what midnight looks like to you. I'm really interested.

[Florian]

Yes.

[Caitlyn]

This is still something that's on my mind all the time. So.

[Florian]

Spotify also has the questions feature that we've been using a lot, which is fun if you're a Spotify listener. And if you're not, any app is fine, except whatever social media. You can Tag us at DarkDicePod and let us know your midnight answers. This is probably gonna be like 10 years from now. Somebody like midnight is this color and they'll send us like a screenshot of.

[Caitlyn]

Wait, this was recorded when there was still a moon. Okay. Yeah, this is.

[Florian]

This is pre. Pre moon Covid or pre moon explosion?

[Caitlyn]

Covid.

[Florian]

Moon Covid.

[Caitlyn]

Yes. This was recorded before the moon turned over to its dark side. So.

[Florian]

Yes, yes. And spun. And then the face was there. That face and the whales, because. Final Fantasy 4. But seriously, all, thank you for listening to our show. A lot of you had asked for background information, questions, and this is a direct response to you because of your lovely feedback. So thank you to our lovely patrons and Discord people. If you don't know how to find a Discord Ask, someone will give you an invite link. They'll find you and seek you out if you seek it. We look forward to sharing more Dark Dice with you. I don't know when this episode is going to come out because it's a lot to edit. I'm also working simultaneously to try and wrap season two in a. Holy cow. It's a lot of content. We will be releasing more. And thank you all so much for joining us. I'm Travis Vengraff, the sound designer, producer, editor of Dark Dice and DM Torian.

[Caitlyn]

And I'm Florian. Just a guy rambling on. Enjoy.

[Florian]

Ciao.

[Caitlyn]

Welcome to the ultimate social deduction game, Blood on the Clock Tower.

[Travis Vengraf]

The evil team must stalk the streets at night, hunting down members of the good team one by one. Meanwhile, the good team must outmaneuver the evil team using their unique abilities.

[Caitlyn]

I'd like to kick things off by telling you all that I'm possibly the demon.

[Travis Vengraf]

Our players can mislead and manipulate others with absolute freedom.

[Caitlyn]

I didn't like hearing my name in the same sentence as demon. That was very upsetting for me. Emily and I will be your storytellers, guiding you through every labyrinthian twist and turn.

[Scott Sigler]

How are there so many evil players in this game?

[Caitlyn]

What's happening with guests from no Rolls, Bard, the Pandemonium Institute, and Oxventure? You won't be able to stop listening. Go to realmspod.com clocktower to find out more.

[Emily]

If you want a person dead, you call a hitman. If you want a monster dead, you call Lincoln Franks. But you better be able to pay the price he asks because Lincoln doesn't work for free. Pay to slay bitches. Slay Season 2 is the current season of Scott Sigler Slices, a fiction podcast with dark tales hacked from the mind of a number one New York Times bestselling author. Slay is a foul mouthed monster killing drug addled antihero story that's John Wick meets Buffy meets Breaking bad. Slay Season 1 is complete and waiting for you in the feed, as is Scott's short story anthology, Blood Is Red. Scott Sigler Slices is the world's longest running fiction podcast, 19 Years and Counting, with new episodes dropping every Sunday. Get Scott Ziggler Slices on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.