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- [00:00]
David Tennant
Hey, Georgia.
- [00:01]
Georgia Tennant
Hi, David.
- [00:02]
David Tennant
Have you ever wished that you could slip into a disguise and travel anywhere in an instant?
- [00:06]
Georgia Tennant
Is that a joke?
- [00:08]
David Tennant
No, no, seriously, Seriously. I'm talking about NordVPN.
- [00:12]
Georgia Tennant
Oh, okay, I see.
- [00:13]
David Tennant
Georgia, look, I'm relocating.
- [00:14]
Georgia Tennant
Relocating? You're literally on the sofa.
- [00:17]
David Tennant
Not physically. Digitally. I'm digitally relocating. Thanks to NordVPN, I can switch my virtual location to 111 different countries with just one click. So now I can access movies, shows, websites from all over the world. And I don't even need to teleport.
- [00:32]
Georgia Tennant
And what about security?
- [00:34]
David Tennant
Well, NORDVPN encrypts all my online activity, protects against cyber threats, even gives dark web alerts to keep my personal data safe. And I want my personal data to be safe. Perfect for dodgy public Wi Fi's right.
- [00:45]
Georgia Tennant
Because nothing screams hack me like a bloke at an airport clicking on free Wi Fi.
- [00:48]
David Tennant
Well, exactly, yes. Which is why we highly recommend downloading the NORDVPN app, especially for banking and sensitive data.
- [00:56]
Georgia Tennant
Want to stay safe online?
- [00:57]
David Tennant
Just go to NordVPN.com tenant, use the code and get four extra months free on a two year plan.
- [01:03]
Georgia Tennant
So you're basically getting premium cybersecurity for the price of a cup of coffee per month.
- [01:07]
David Tennant
To get the best discount off your NordVPN plan, go to nordvpn.com tenant. Our link will also give you four extra months on the two year plan. No risk with Nord's 30 day money back guarantee. The link is in the podcast episode description box.
- [01:20]
Georgia Tennant
I've fallen down in nearly every play I've done. I'm very bad at balance. I fell down in the cherry woodshed and Ronnie Pickup had to drag me off.
- [01:34]
David Tennant
David Tennant does a podcast with Jim.
- [01:37]
Georgia Tennant
Parsons, Stacey Abrams, George Takei, Judi Dench.
- [01:40]
Dan Levy
Jan Levy, Kush Jumba, Tim Minchin, Brian.
- [01:45]
Neil Gaiman
Cox, Elizabeth Moss, Neil, Billy Piper.
- [01:51]
David Tennant
Oh, hello, lovely listeners. Hello and welcome, welcome, welcome, welcome to this very special episode of. David Tennant does a podcast with. This is, if you like the season two finale. It's a season finale, but without any cliffhangers or deaths of major characters. Hopefully it's a season finale filled with all the bits we didn't have time for in the interviews that you've heard so far. Little extra bits, little, little juicy nuggets that you weren't perhaps expecting. You've already heard from Judi Dench talking about falling over. Glorious. And much more of that sort of stuff to come. But of course, making season two was a different experience to making season One, because we were all locked in our house. The great Global pandemic of 2020 meant that we had to do everything remotely. And recording through a global pandemic has its own set of technical and logistical challenges, as you can imagine, as Brian Cox in his woodland shed, can attest to.
- [02:55]
Brian Cox
Can you hear me? I'm not sure if you can. Can you? You can hear me?
- [02:59]
David Tennant
Yes.
- [02:59]
Georgia Tennant
Hello.
- [03:00]
David Tennant
There we go. We've got there.
- [03:04]
Brian Cox
I've been sent so many mics and so many things. If you looked around this room, I could start a sound studio, which I can sell from.
- [03:12]
David Tennant
Yes. Various guests have struggled with the technology in various different ways. I've certainly struggled with it myself. But we get there in the end eventually, you know, we pull out wires and plug in different ones. And sometimes people enlist family members to help them along the way.
- [03:29]
George Takei
Yeah, it looks like it's recording. Okay.
- [03:31]
David Tennant
So now I'm gonna go get George. George. George. Good morning. Can you hear us?
- [03:37]
George Takei
I can indeed. Good morning.
- [03:39]
David Tennant
How wonderful. Yes, thank you to Brad there, the other half of George Takei for making that recording a possibility. And if you've been listening carefully over the weeks, you may have caught the sounds of daily life creeping into these ever so professional productions. Pets, some children, Judi Dench's neighbors.
- [04:00]
Georgia Tennant
David, I could stop for a second.
- [04:03]
David Tennant
Sure.
- [04:03]
Georgia Tennant
Because somebody's mowing the lawn.
- [04:05]
David Tennant
Yes, there is. Okay. Is there a bit of something? I don't think.
- [04:07]
Georgia Tennant
Can you hear it?
- [04:07]
David Tennant
Yes, but I don't think that's.
- [04:08]
Georgia Tennant
Here it comes again, Sammy.
- [04:12]
David Tennant
But, yes, we have conquered these many challenges. We've had a few false starts, but we've got there in the end. We have brought you conversations with amazing people from wherever they are around the world. Thanks to the Interweb. We did it. And indeed, we managed to get some extra bits that you haven't heard yet. So here we go. Here's the wonderful Dan Levy with a delicious tale. Can I say that Dan Levy has a delicious tale? Don't know, I'll have said. Must have been very all consuming over the past six years for you. But you have managed to squeeze in some other things, I noticed, like presenting the Canadian version of the Great British Bake Off. Was that because you were a fan of the British show?
- [04:55]
Dan Levy
Absolutely right. Absolutely. In fact, I didn't even know they were doing a Canadian show. I was watching the Great British Baking show and tweeted that if it ever came to Canada, I would love to throw my hat in the ring to host. And then within 10 minutes, they bet your hat I got a response saying, not only is it coming to Canada, but would you actually be interested in hosting?
- [05:16]
David Tennant
Right, but you're not a baker.
- [05:18]
Dan Levy
Oh, God, no. No, no, no. I'm a professional eater of baked goods.
- [05:21]
David Tennant
Sure. But when you're recording that show day after day, is there not. Do you not reach a point where you go, I cannot put another piece of fucking sponge in my mouth?
- [05:29]
Dan Levy
Never.
- [05:30]
David Tennant
Never.
- [05:30]
Dan Levy
But I have an uncanny ability to just consume food without any.
- [05:34]
Georgia Tennant
Stop.
- [05:35]
David Tennant
Okay.
- [05:36]
Dan Levy
It is a skill. It's a wild skill set. I ate everything.
- [05:41]
David Tennant
Did you? Much more than you had to.
- [05:43]
Dan Levy
Oh, above and beyond to the point where I had to, like, go to the gym when I left set just to work off all the stuff that.
- [05:51]
Georgia Tennant
I had been eating.
- [05:52]
Dan Levy
But it was a dream.
- [05:53]
David Tennant
Dan Levy, they're talking about being the host of the Canadian version of the Great British Bake Off. Who knew? I. I didn't. We also heard from Jim Parsons, the brilliant Jim Parsons, who told me about life before he was everyone's favorite comedy geek on the Big Bang Theory.
- [06:10]
Dan Levy
I spent a lot of time on unemployment and I was working another job as, like, a front of. There was this fabric store called Hable Construction down in Soho and. Or were they in Nalita? I can't tell apart. Anyway, and I was working there a few times a week, and that was the. I guess that was the only job I took once I graduated from grad school. That was not acting.
- [06:36]
David Tennant
Were you good at it?
- [06:37]
Dan Levy
No, no. Well, I. I wasn't that hard to be decent at it because they didn't ask that much of me and I was nice to people, which I guess was the main part of the job. But no, my finest moments were when there was nobody in the shop and I could rehearse an audition on the. On the floor of the store, you know, but you.
- [06:54]
David Tennant
Cause you'd chosen to move to New York to become an actor rather than.
- [06:57]
Dan Levy
Los Angeles, because I'd never done any camera work at all. I mean, my logic at the time. And also remember, we're making this decision literally right after 9, 11. But even then I was like, well, it's New Yorker bus. This is 2001. And I was like, I just don't understand the logic of throwing myself into a city that's all camera work based for the most part, when all I've done is theater and all I've trained for is theater. And it's not that I don't want to do it, but I feel like I should go to the theater town and see where that leads.
- [07:29]
David Tennant
Okay, right. Of course, Sheldon Cooper from the Big Bang Theory, as played by Jim Parsons, would have been terribly over excited to find out that George Takei was on the podcast. Because George Takei of course was Mr. Sulu in Star Trek, globally famous for decades now, recognized all over the world, but turns out that that kind of global anonymity rather crept up on him. Ten years later, I'd be this enormously successful motion picture. Were you aware that this enormous fandom was kind of bubbling up while the show was on air? Or did it all happen after the event? Did you start becoming famous after you were no longer on television?
- [08:15]
George Takei
It was after the event, yeah, we were canceled in 69 and it was in 70 that I got a telephone call, a sweet young voice. She said, we're getting together to have coffee and tea at the Hilton Hotel in downtown Los Angeles. We'd like to have you come join us and talk to us about your experience on Star Trek. And I told her, you do know that the show is canceled? Yes, yes, we do know and we love the show and we'd love to have a small group chat with you about it. I said, you know, it was so sweet, people who loved the show. And so I said, all right, when are you gathering? And I drove downtown and met with them. And it was a small group, about a dozen at most, and mostly female. I think there were two guys there and the others were all girls. And I had tea and cookies, biscuits, had a nice conversation and I thought, you know, it's gonna peter out eventually.
- [09:27]
David Tennant
And then that was your first Star Trek convention?
- [09:29]
George Takei
That was the first Star Trek convention, yeah. And a few months after that I got a phone call from a woman in New York and she was a very fast talking, pushy New York woman. She said, we're holding a big convention. I thought, oh my, to call it a convention. I visualized that first gathering of about a dozen people. She said, we're having a convention at one of the biggest hotels in New York and we'd like to have you fly over to New York. I said, well, you know, air tickets are expensive from Los Angeles, New York. Oh yeah, yeah, we'll take care of it, don't worry about that. And we'll put you up at the hotel hotel for the weekend. And so I thought, this woman is mad. Pay for air flight and put us up in a first class hotel and have a convention. Because I was visualizing what I saw, what I experienced in Los Angeles. And she said, well, just to give you some comfort, we'll send you the ticket. I said, oh, really? I had doubts about that, but I kind of played along. And sure enough, the tickets came. It was first class. I said, these people are mad. They're going to lose their shirts. This is crazy. But she sent a plane ticket. So I flew. And Gene Roddenberry flew there, too. They had about four or five of us, including Gene Roddenberry. And I arrived at night, and there was somebody at the airport to meet me. One of the volunteers, they hustled me to the hotel, and it was the night before, so not. Not too many people there. And I went straight up, and they said, we'll come and escort you through the kitchen. I said, through the kitchen? Why can't we go in through the banquet hall? And they said, oh, no, no. It's too many people. I thought to myself, these New Yorkers always are such exaggerators, talking so big. But nevertheless, that young man was there in the morning and took me through that smelly hotel kitchen of the Commodore Hotel. And then we went through the kitchen, and I heard the roar coming from the banquet hall. And I thought, good Lord, what is this? And then we got to the backstage area, and it was a lot of people that I heard, and they introduced me. I stepped onto the stage, and it was a thunderous roar that greeted me. And there were people on the balcony just hanging over the balcony. I mean, it was that crammed. And that's when I knew extraordinary phenomenon was happening.
- [12:25]
David Tennant
Kush Jumbo comes from Lewisham in London, Quite a long way from Hollywood and Broadway, where she ended up. But turned out there was a bit more showbiz in her family than she first realized. I love the idea of you as this little girl writing in your diaries about all the drama that you were enjoying in life and that your name was gonna be up in lights one day and that it would all be fine. Is that where the idea of becoming a performer came from? I mean, did you have precedence in your life? Did you know any actors or dancers or.
- [12:57]
Georgia Tennant
Right, no, David. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. My dad used to say, fred and Ginger left me on the doorstep in a hamper.
- [13:03]
David Tennant
Okay.
- [13:04]
Georgia Tennant
But they don't know where it came from. Thinking about it, I don't know my extended family on either side, really. So I like to think that somewhere deep into Lincolnshire and somewhere deep into Nigeria, this is definitely in my family.
- [13:19]
David Tennant
Didn't you say there is a Nigerian acting connection?
- [13:22]
Georgia Tennant
Well, yes, I found out recently that I have an aunt. Well, she, you know, she's my dad's half sister.
- [13:29]
David Tennant
Okay.
- [13:29]
Georgia Tennant
Through his dad, who, you know, he hasn't seen in years and I've never met. She's a massive Nollywood actress. If anyone doesn't know what Nollywood is, it's like the Nigerian Bollywood. It's bigger, actually.
- [13:40]
David Tennant
Yeah.
- [13:40]
Georgia Tennant
It's the biggest thing after Bollywood, before Hollywood. Millions of followers on every platform. And, yeah, she's an actress, producer, writer.
- [13:50]
David Tennant
And your dad had never mentioned this?
- [13:52]
Georgia Tennant
Oh, no, that's my dad all the way. He's like, right. Oh, yes, dad. Who's this uche jumbo that I'm just finding? People are saying, are we related? Who's. Let me see. Oh, yes, that's my sister. What? That's my sister. Oh, yeah. She's very famous. Nollywood. I'm like, what? Didn't you think this would be passing interest at least, like, an important thing to. I've been saying to you my whole. Where does this come from? There's no one else remotely in the family does any. Anything near what I do and definitely isn't like, a maker of things. Like, I'm a maker of things. And there's this woman, fair enough. We've never met. Don't have a relationship with her. She wouldn't know who I was from Adam. But I did think that was a bit, like, bonkers.
- [14:33]
David Tennant
Yeah. For it never to have occurred to him to bring it up does seem quite unlikely.
- [14:38]
Georgia Tennant
That's just my dad. It's just, you know, Tottenham Hotspur and newborn babies.
- [14:42]
David Tennant
That's it. Right?
- [14:43]
Georgia Tennant
That's it. You've got.
- [14:44]
David Tennant
You've got to meet her, surely.
- [14:46]
Georgia Tennant
I know. I kept thinking I should do a documentary or something where I do, like, you know, Hollywood to Nollywood. Yeah, Hollywood. And, like, I go out because they have a whole different process of filming things and rehearsing things and writing things. It's all very melodramatic and almost like theatre from the Victorian era or something. And I kept thinking, oh, God, yeah, I should go out there and shadow her and find out what it's like to be. And then I thought, you know. But then you're gonna have, like, someone annoying showing up on your doorstep, like, going, hi, I'm your person that you've never met.
- [15:15]
David Tennant
She would be thrilled. Come on. At least it's a great episode of who do you think you are without.
- [15:20]
Georgia Tennant
I mean, it would be. Even if you slammed the door in my face, it would be, yes.
- [15:23]
David Tennant
That's good television in itself.
- [15:25]
Georgia Tennant
Yeah. Kush's rejection. Yeah, yeah. So. So, yeah, yeah, it is in my family. But, yeah, the rest of it, I don't know. This is an advertisement from BetterHelp.
- [15:37]
David Tennant
Hey, Georgia.
- [15:37]
Georgia Tennant
Hi, David.
- [15:38]
David Tennant
You know when you think you're fine and then suddenly you realise that your jaw has been clenched for, like, three hours straight?
- [15:43]
Georgia Tennant
Or you're lying awake at 3am because your brain's decided that that is the perfect time to replay every awkward thing you've ever said.
- [15:48]
David Tennant
Exactly. For a long time, I don't think I really understood that that was anxiety. I thought that was just what it was to be an adult.
- [15:54]
Georgia Tennant
You know what gets me? It's that creeping feeling like you're always behind, even when you're doing everything you possibly can.
- [15:59]
David Tennant
And then your body goes, oh, well, since you're not listening to me, here's a massive headache and some heartburn.
- [16:04]
Georgia Tennant
It's like your brain and your body team up to say, right, let's just shut the whole system down until they get the message.
- [16:08]
David Tennant
But we're so used to just getting on with it, aren't we? Like, being stressed is somehow normal.
- [16:12]
Georgia Tennant
Yeah, but it doesn't have to be.
- [16:14]
David Tennant
No.
- [16:14]
Georgia Tennant
Sometimes the best thing you can do is slow down and actually talk to someone.
- [16:17]
David Tennant
Therapy can really help with that. Not just in crisis moments, but for learning how to cope, how to set boundaries, how to feel more like yourself. Again.
- [16:25]
Georgia Tennant
85% of BetterHelp therapists specialise in anxiety and 69% of people say their symptoms improved after just six weeks.
- [16:32]
David Tennant
That could really make a difference.
- [16:33]
Georgia Tennant
Look at you, getting all wise every now and again. All right, here's the important bit.
- [16:37]
David Tennant
As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Get the tools to manage your anxiety with BetterHelp and our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com tenant that's betterhelp.com t e n-n- a n.
- [16:56]
Georgia Tennant
T if you don't know about flyer deals on Instacart, this message is for you.
- [17:01]
Billy Piper
Flyer deals are like strolling through your.
- [17:03]
Georgia Tennant
Favorite store looking for deals, but you're scrolling your phone and maybe you're in.
- [17:07]
David Tennant
Bed because getting delivery doesn't mean you have to miss deals like you'd get at the store.
- [17:11]
Georgia Tennant
Like the one creamer that doesn't make your stomach hurt.
- [17:13]
Billy Piper
Or the pasta sauce you can't not.
- [17:15]
Georgia Tennant
Buy when it's on sale.
- [17:17]
David Tennant
So download the Instacart app, shop flyers.
- [17:19]
Georgia Tennant
And never miss a deal on one of your favorites. Plus, get Delivery in as fast as 30 minutes. Instacart.
- [17:25]
Billy Piper
We're here.
- [17:29]
David Tennant
The multi talented Tim Minchin can sing, write songs, make blockbuster musicals, act. Performance seems to run through his veins. But as a kid, turns out he had other passions that might have sent him on a very different path.
- [17:46]
Tim Minchin
We were a hockey playing family. This is the weird thing. I was more into hockey than music up until my 20s, right. A lot of my teenage years I played hockey five times a week.
- [17:56]
David Tennant
Oh, serious.
- [17:57]
Tim Minchin
So we'd be training three times and playing twice and I loved it. And I was good. I was fine. I was like everything.
- [18:04]
David Tennant
Better than most.
- [18:06]
Tim Minchin
Yeah, I had a bit of flair, you know, and then I realised I could run a bit of distance, a bit of an 800, bit of a 1500, like second division in the school thing. But we were like sporty, actually. We were a sporty family. That's the weird thing. But there was plenty of music and my uncle was a muso and we'd go see him play, but he was the black sheep of the family, so it was rare.
- [18:27]
David Tennant
And what kind of stuff was he playing?
- [18:29]
Tim Minchin
Oh, bluegrass and blues. He's amazing. There's footage of me on the Sydney Opera House steps. I get him up to play one of his songs that he wrote in the year I was born. It's an amazing moment. He's an incredible, beautiful musician, right. As is his son. And I've got musos all over the family now, right. A hell of a lot of it's down to my big brother, because my big brother really loved music and learnt guitar and just really wanted me to learn the songs he was learning so we could play them together, right. And then my sisters, we'd all sing harmonies and my brother had such a profound influence on us just because he was. He was a good boy. He was quite high achievey, which probably speaks a bit to why I'm so needy in terms of proving myself. Yeah, sure, if you're into Euphreudian. But mostly we all just wanted to do what he did. So we all did an arts degree at University of West Australia. We all played hockey, we all did drama.
- [19:25]
David Tennant
We all to be like your big brother.
- [19:27]
Tim Minchin
Yeah, I don't know, we. We're just lucky. We just all liked the same stuff and, yeah, wanted to. When that looks fun.
- [19:37]
David Tennant
Handmaid's Tale, Mad Men, the West Wing, basically. Modern day television has Elisabeth Morse to thank for existing, but she told me that the decision to pursue acting might not have happened. So you were very focused on the ballet and the Dancing. But then that just. What, the acting just tipped the scales, or how did. How did the dancing go away?
- [19:59]
Georgia Tennant
Yeah. So when I was 15, that's kind of a really formative time as a dancer. And that's when you start auditioning for companies and you start pursuing a professional path.
- [20:11]
David Tennant
Right.
- [20:12]
Georgia Tennant
Which is so crazy to think about because it's so young, but it's the truth. So that's the time that you kind of have to go, which way am I going to go? Am I going to go and I'm going to pursue this professionally and get into a company, or am I not? And I realized that I couldn't do both. And I remember having a very long talk with my mom about it. I remember sitting on my bed, my bedroom, and talking to her. And now looking back, I'm like, I can't believe we had such an incredibly sort of mature conversation about this. But I decided that I could see a life without ballet, but I couldn't see a life without acting.
- [20:53]
David Tennant
Right.
- [20:53]
Georgia Tennant
And it wasn't just acting. I loved going to set. I loved getting to know the crew. I loved the familial atmosphere. I loved the traveling of it, and I loved the whole thing. And so I knew that I couldn't do both. And I also thought. And I can't believe I thought this at 15. I'm sure my mom helped, but that as a dancer, you know, your career is over very early.
- [21:23]
David Tennant
Sure.
- [21:24]
Georgia Tennant
And even if you're successful and you don't get injured, all of those things, you know, it would be around now that I would be kind of thinking about what I was gonna do next.
- [21:38]
David Tennant
The lovely Billy Piper also made a transition from choreography. I mean, to be fair, she can still cut a few shapes on the dance floor when she chooses to, but she used to do it professionally. She was a pop star, like an actual proper pop star. And she moved from that to acting. We spoke all about that and about how her career has changed of late. How comfortable are you with all that promotional hoo ha?
- [22:04]
Billy Piper
Whether the sort of. The promotional stuff I've become less comfortable with, I've actually found doing things on Zoom and not being live in a studio or not being. Not having to show up and attend in that sort of shiny way. I find that massively relaxing.
- [22:23]
David Tennant
Oh, that's good.
- [22:24]
Billy Piper
Yeah. So I've. I've actually quite enjoyed that experience. And I think it's because there's no pressure to sort of look great and, I don't know, probably just that simply, just.
- [22:39]
David Tennant
Yeah.
- [22:39]
Billy Piper
You know, all the Stuff that you have to do to go on those shows actually become quite stressful. As a woman, I don't know if it's the same as a man. Look great on, be funny and have good anecdotes and, you know, there's this sort of padding around, this experience that I prefer, so that stuff was fine. And then the things that people say, you know, fortunately, that's gone quite well. So all round, thumbs up.
- [23:03]
David Tennant
Yeah, yeah. It's interesting you say that you prefer doing all those shows remotely, but I find the difficult bit about that is when you go into the studio to do a talk show, whatever, you've got the bit in the car to transform from Harried's parent to sort of showbiz personality and that. I find that quite tricky that you're literally going, have you eat your beans? And then suddenly you're on air because you're all in the house together. That's a bit tricky.
- [23:32]
Billy Piper
Yeah, yeah, that is tricky. That is tricky. But I sort of feel like that in the car on the way to the studio because, you know, someone's calling with, unsurprisingly, some stressful bit of information and all you're getting ready and the kids are on the phone asking, when are you going to be. It's always. That is always my experience.
- [23:53]
David Tennant
That balancing act between the private and professional life is really tricky, but can sometimes be the unexpected engineer of a brand new wonderful chapter, which would seem to be the case for Kush Jumbo. So now you're back home, you've left that behind you. Are you back home? Is this now. Do you live in London now?
- [24:13]
Georgia Tennant
Yes. Permanent. It's a permanent move.
- [24:17]
David Tennant
Was that always something that was going to happen or.
- [24:19]
Georgia Tennant
It's when you have kids. I mean, right. Having a kid changes things. Right. Like, you know, it just. There are things you begin to think about you didn't have to before. And I'm not. I'm. I don't. I'm not going to insinuate or suggest that it's any easier for a male actor because you're a male, but when you're the mum and the actor as well, it's like this balancing guilt thing of you really are trying to leave them in some stability because of how much you have to disappear and their mum isn't going to be there, and that sounds silly because, like I said, I have my dad the other way around, so it should just work either way and be equal. But it's really hard, especially when they're small, you know, they're months, weeks old, months old, and you're leaving them and they're sick or whatever. But I think it became apparent that, okay, here's the things that are never going to change. I'm always going to have to travel, I'm always going to have to jump around and they'll get to the point where dragging him around isn't going to be an option and not fair. So how are we going to make that work? Well, in New York, we have no extended family and we don't really have a network that we can rely on in that kind of way. Someone can't just come and watch Max for the weekend or, you know, relieve Sean if he's been on with him all week, or unless, you know, you decide that you want an army of staff to pay, which is not quite the same thing. And obviously I've got all these brothers and sisters. They're all having kids. My closest friends who are not actors and live here are all having kids. And I want Max to grow up knowing who he is and who we're close to and have that like support network and identity and, and honestly, I think, I think I can say I wanted him to have a sense of his British culture, which is totally different from raising a kid in New York. It's not better or worse, it's just different. And I felt that he needed to understand who Shaun and I were by growing here, being a seedling of this, you know. Yeah, this place. So I'm, so I'm really happy to be back and I'm really happy. I didn't think I'd be close to this happy. I'm kind of ecstatic. Other than the pandemic thing, sure.
- [26:45]
David Tennant
There's that static that will presumably pass.
- [26:48]
Georgia Tennant
Yeah, we hope it will.
- [26:50]
David Tennant
Yeah. Like Kush, the politician, activist and all round wise person from Atlanta, Georgia, Stacey Abrams also came from a big family and here she is telling me all about it.
- [27:04]
Georgia Tennant
I mean, I'm an introvert, so growing up in a house that was not designed for eight people, certainly not six children, was, you know, it required that I carve out my own space. Sometimes I would go and, you know, sit in a closet so I could read and just not have to talk to any people. But it also meant I never had to have friends because I had them at home. Sure, I did have friends, but we had this very. Like my parents told us, your job is to take care of each other. And we are all still very close. We have a monthly book club.
- [27:33]
David Tennant
Right.
- [27:33]
Georgia Tennant
We believe in one another. And so I could not imagine not having them as siblings. I mean, look, I was, you know, I'd like to say I was about 15 before I realized the Snickers really could satisfy because I didn't have to divide it up with everybody. And like having a whole candy bar to yourself was a revelatory moment, but, you know, it was. I am, I am truly, truly grateful for having the siblings that I have.
- [27:58]
David Tennant
One of the things we often talk about on the podcast is how people go about finding out sort of who they are, what their voice is, particularly creatively. So here's Neil Gaiman and then Tim Minchin on some important moments of clarity that they've had in their life. In the addition I've got in the introduction, you talk about some of the early issues. When you look back at them, now that you describe them as awkward and ungainly. Is that. Was it taking you a while to find your voice? That sort of, I mean, what. What is it that's awkward and ungainly? What is it you see in those early stories?
- [28:34]
Neil Gaiman
I didn't know what I was doing, which was a good thing, actually. It really was a good thing because if you don't know what you're doing, then you don't know what the rules are. And you're actually, you find yourself, you know, there's a door marked no exit, but you actually discover that you can walk through it and nothing actually is going to stop you. It's just nobody's ever walked through it before. So I was allowed to do things like that. And I was also trying to find out for myself what this thing I was writing was. So I can point at the first, particularly the first eight episodes of Sandman and go, okay, well, the first one is me trying to do Mr. James and Dennis Wheatley and all of this sort of classic English horror stuff. The second one is me doing particularly EC comics and that kind of horror hosty thing and much more comic book. The third one is me trying to do a sort of a Ramsey campbell Clyde Barkeri contemporary 80s horror using John Constantine. The fourth one is me doing people like Heinlein, who we don't think of as fantasy writers, were writing a lot of fantasy in the 1940s for a John W. Campbell edited magazine called Unknown Worlds, I think it was called, or Unknown. And there was just something really interesting about what people were doing at that time. And I thought, okay, I can write one of those. And that's my trip to hell. And then having gone through all that Sandman 8 the sound of her wings felt like I was finding out who I was. It's just a story of, you know, he meets his sister, he's feeling very sorry for himself, and they go for a walk through New York and he cheers up. But somewhere in there, it was psycho. I think this is who I am. I think this is what I sound like.
- [30:34]
David Tennant
Right?
- [30:34]
Neil Gaiman
You know, it was the equivalent of the Malcolm Gladwell 10,000 hours or whatever. There was just that point where I was starting to discover me. I think it was Chuck Jones who did Bugs Bunny and Roadrunner who said that you have a million terrible drawings inside your pencil and you need to get them out so the good ones can come. And I feel that way about everything I wrote before that story. There are actually some good things, but anything good that I wrote before then is me sounding like somebody else. It's me going, oh, I love this thing that, you know, this writer, an obscure writer named John Collier did. And I can write a John Collier story, or I'll write a R.A. lafferty story, or I'll write something that feels like a Gothic. I could do things. And then one day I sort of discovered what Neil Gaiman stories sounded like. And that was a completely new process for me.
- [31:36]
Tim Minchin
The weird thing about comedy is I had never done stand up. I don't identify as a comedian, but it seems to be the case that when I'm on stage, I have some sense of the rhythm of how to make people laugh. Yeah, I'm incredibly comfortable on stage, with plentiful exceptions. And I guess being back on tour again has made me have a bit more respect for how lucky I am that I can do that. And I guess I'm so desperate to go back and tick all those boxes of things I wanted to do. To be taken seriously as an actor, to be taken seriously as a composer, lyricist, to just be taken seriously as a communicator. And I've been so obsessed by that. Not obsessed, but that's just been what's driving me. And much more noble things like wanting to be a better father and not tour as much and all that, that I've forgotten how incredibly lucky I am. That I find getting up on stage and making people laugh, which is the most wonderful thing to be able to give people, that I find that quite easy, is something I guess I took for granted. I'm not going to take that for granted anymore.
- [32:52]
George Takei
This episode is brought to you by Chevy Silverado.
- [32:55]
Georgia Tennant
When it's time for you to ditch.
- [32:56]
David Tennant
The blacktop and head off road.
- [32:58]
George Takei
Do it in a truck that says no to nothing.
- [33:00]
David Tennant
The Chevy Silverado Trail Boss.
- [33:03]
George Takei
Get the rugged capability of its Z71.
- [33:05]
David Tennant
Suspension and 2 inch factory lift, plus.
- [33:08]
George Takei
Impressive torque and towing capacity thanks to an available Duramax 3 liter turbo diesel engine. Where other trucks call it quits. You'll just be getting started. Visit chevy.com to learn more.
- [33:20]
Georgia Tennant
I was never really a runner.
- [33:22]
Neil Gaiman
The way I see running is a.
- [33:24]
Georgia Tennant
Gift, especially when you have stage four cancer. I'm Ann. I'm running the Boston Marathon.
- [33:30]
Neil Gaiman
Presented by bank of America.
- [33:32]
Georgia Tennant
I run for Dana Farber Cancer Institute to give people like me a chance to thrive in life, even with cancer. Join bank of America in helping Anne's cause. Give if you can@b of a.comSupportAnn what would you like the power to do? References to charitable organizations is not an endorsement by bank of America Corporation. Copyright 2025.
- [33:52]
David Tennant
I love a bit of Shakespeare and we've had a few guests on the podcast who share my passion for it and who are masters of the art. One of the all time great Shakespearean actors, he knows how to play with those words. It's Brian Cox.
- [34:09]
Brian Cox
I mean, I love Shakespeare. I just adore Shakespeare, you know. I mean, you can't get around him as a writer. You just simply can't.
- [34:18]
David Tennant
You went from not far, not long after you were at the RC doing Titus Andronis, you went back to the national to play King, learn as quite a young man, relatively 44. Yeah. Did you feel ready to play that age?
- [34:32]
Brian Cox
You need the energy, first of all.
- [34:34]
David Tennant
Right, right.
- [34:35]
Brian Cox
You do need the energy. I mean, you haven't got the wisdom. I mean, and I would take it, I would do it differently. It's a great play, but it's a difficult play. I mean, it's a hard play because it's not. Everybody thinks it's Lear, but it's not. It's. The Edmond subplot is incredibly important and it also dominates the second half and all the Gloucester stuff. So it has to be a kind of ensemble. It has to be as much an ensemble as anything else. And it's not easy because Lear, you know, after, after the hovel scene, he's only got three or four scenes seen with Gloucester. There's only two more scenes in the movie in the play, you know, so that was difficult, but I enjoyed it and I loved doing it. But a lot of it was, you know, we invented Titus. We invented it because it was a set. We didn't have costumes, we didn't have anything. We invented it from the rehearsal floor up. And I realized that's the best way to do Shakespeare, is that you reinvent it. You don't come with any. The conception is to do with the group and to do with, you know, like there's a bunch of ladders in the rehearsal room and guys grabbed their ladders and they sat me on the ladder and lifted me up. And that was. That was. That's how it happened. You know, it happened organically.
- [35:59]
David Tennant
And that presumably that's a bit easier to do. And it's not one of those. Because King Lear is one of those Olympic events, isn't it? That is. And I suppose that's an inducement and also a discouragement in a way.
- [36:12]
Brian Cox
Yeah, it's a double edged sword. It really is. In that way. Yeah.
- [36:16]
David Tennant
Because everybody's done it and everyone's got their favorite and all that. And of course, if we're talking about all things Shakespeare, then we've got to hear from Judi Dench. Here she is talking about one of her very earliest experiences in one of the Bard's plays. In A Midsummer Night's Dream.
- [36:32]
Georgia Tennant
You were called only by your surname. You called Ms. Dench.
- [36:38]
David Tennant
I see. Or just in rehearsals. Just at the tea break.
- [36:42]
Georgia Tennant
Oh, yes.
- [36:43]
David Tennant
By Michael.
- [36:44]
Georgia Tennant
Eventual. Yes. And when we did, I played the first fairy in about my first or second season in the dream. First season, I think 57, 58 maybe, or the next for other fairies. They went to the Royal Ballet School and they had these exquisite creatures. Exquisite. And I was playing the first fairy and Michael Bentor. We had notes one day and he said to me, he said, Ms. Dench, I don't want to see you coming in, barging into all those girls. He said, with your hands like two fin and Addis, does he mean? But they were. They were. They were. I mean, there was nothing of me then, but there was absolutely nothing of them.
- [37:38]
David Tennant
Right.
- [37:39]
Georgia Tennant
You know, they were exquisite. They were. And there was I being the first fairy crashing into them. Terrible.
- [37:50]
David Tennant
But Shakespeare wasn't the only love affair we heard about. Here's Dan Levy again.
- [37:55]
Dan Levy
I love London so much. I had the best time. It was everything I wanted it to be. And I hope to return there at some point, you know, in the near future.
- [38:06]
David Tennant
Have you not been back since?
- [38:08]
Dan Levy
I've been back a few times, but I haven't been. I haven't lived there since. And I have always wanted to kind of spend a chunk of time there.
- [38:16]
David Tennant
We would be very happy to have you.
- [38:18]
Dan Levy
I go on a lot of dates in London.
- [38:20]
David Tennant
You do?
- [38:20]
Georgia Tennant
Yeah.
- [38:21]
David Tennant
That's a long way to come for a date.
- [38:22]
Dan Levy
I don't know why that is, because I don't. I don't go on a lot of dates in America, so I don't. It's part of the reason why I'd like to go back, to be honest.
- [38:34]
David Tennant
Interesting. But there must be some reason. You must. Do you feel particularly liberated in London? Does it.
- [38:39]
Dan Levy
I don't know whether it's just like. Because I'm Canadian, there's kind of a sensibility. There's a similar sensibility to the British.
- [38:46]
David Tennant
They're exotic. That's what it is, British culture.
- [38:50]
Dan Levy
I have very generous friends that like to set me up with people when I go there. I don't know. It's been very lucky for me. And I just love. I love the city.
- [38:58]
David Tennant
Right.
- [38:59]
Dan Levy
I love the feel of it. I love the social aspects of it. It's been, you know, it's been very kind to me.
- [39:06]
David Tennant
Well, you'll be welcome here anytime. I can assure you. I speak for all of London there.
- [39:10]
Dan Levy
I can't wait to get back.
- [39:13]
David Tennant
So now here's Neil Gaiman tantalizing his legions of fans with a little bit about what's coming next for him.
- [39:22]
Neil Gaiman
The next new book that's coming out is called Pirate Stew, and it's a poem illustrated by Chris Riddell about some kids who wind up getting babysat by pirates. And what happens? And everybody's making pirate stew and then donuts come into it mysteriously and it's. It's glorious and silly and this big book for kids, and it's nothing like any of my other books for kids, and it's nothing like any of my other books for adults. And I like the fact that there is a. If anything unites the Neil Gaiman brand, it's the idea that the voice will probably be mine and the point of view will definitely be mine, but you don't know what that's going to be. Some of them are funny, some of them are scary, some of them are serious. Some of them, you know, Coraline isn't Stardust, isn't American Gods, isn't good Omens, isn't Sandman, but it's the best Coraline it could be. And the graveyard book is the best graveyard book it could be. But the graveyard book also isn't Coraline 2, despite the fact that everybody wants Coraline 2 and everybody wants more Coraline. And I've never gone back to Coraline because I've never come up with a Coraline story that's better than Coraline.
- [40:51]
David Tennant
One, Right.
- [40:53]
Neil Gaiman
I'm writing a new neverwhere novel right now. Started with me getting fascinated and saddened and involved with refugee issues and realizing basically how incredibly fragile the worlds we live in can be, how easily broken. Going out to refugee camps in Jordan and talking to Syrian refugees and realizing, you know, three years ago, these people were us. They were car salesmen, they owned corner shops, they sold insurance, they were dentists. They were living a normal life in a normal place. And now everything has gone away. And, you know, you drive a tank through a village, and one of the things about driving a tank, which is incredibly heavy, through a village is it crushes all the water mains under the village, so now nobody has any water. And they're getting their water from the nearby swamp and letting it sit overnight so the gunk will settle. And then they're boiling it, but they're still getting kind of sick. And the farmers aren't going into the fields anymore because people were shooting at them and putting landmines. So now there's no food, and they've eaten all the dogs and the cats because that was what they had, and they're really hungry. So they decided to walk across Syria to try and get out, even though they knew they might get killed because the prospect of staying was worse. And every single person who is a refugee has a story like that that is an absolute personal nightmare. And all I'm hearing over and over is just how fragile civilization, which we think is so incredibly sturdy is. And I thought, I want to talk about that. I want to tell a story about some of this. I want to tell people about this stuff. I wish I had a way of talking about issues like this already. And I realized that, well, I did. I had neverwhere, which I sort of. The idea of London below was a way of talking about homelessness without talking about homelessness. It was a way of talking about surviving in an urban collapse without actually talking about that. And I thought, well, I've already made that as a machine. And realized as I started to write it that there was a neverwhere story that I never told and had always planned to tell, which was called the Seven Sisters. So I'm rather nervously gone back to it.
- [43:33]
David Tennant
And finally, here's the lovely Billy Piper again, giving the most enigmatic, tantalizing tease as to what could be around the corner for her. And I'm still none the wiser.
- [43:45]
Billy Piper
Okay, so professional ambitions for me. Currently, I'm thinking about something really out there that I do not feel comfortable discussing.
- [43:55]
David Tennant
Okay, we'll come back to that another day.
- [43:57]
Billy Piper
Because I want to maybe go away and learn how to do it and fail. And I want to do. I want to have that experience privately. I'd rather not talk about it. And then if it. If it sticks, then great, we'll talk about it. And if not, it could just be that thing I went and did for three years. It was really quite weird.
- [44:20]
David Tennant
Yeah, I'm fascinated now.
- [44:23]
Billy Piper
Oh, I'll tell you, when we're not.
- [44:24]
David Tennant
Doing a podcast, send me a text.
- [44:26]
Billy Piper
I'll send you a text.
- [44:27]
David Tennant
All right. And that, dear listener, is that. Thank you so much to all my amazing guests for being part of this season of David Tennant does a podcast with. And thank you most particularly to you for listening. I hope you've enjoyed it even a little bit, as much as I've enjoyed making it and talking to these brilliant people. And if you've enjoyed this music, by the way, the composer got in touch to see how thrilled he was that we were using his music. Listen, William Benkert, I'm thrilled that you wrote this piece. I love it. It's called Take Flight William Benkert. You can catch him on Spotify and hear more of his fantastic tunes. Isn't it lovely? So that's it. We're off for a bit, but thank you so much for downloading. And remember, if you want to take us with you wherever you go. I can't believe they're making me say this. We have merch. Oh, yes, we have merch. Ladies and gentlemen, David Tennant does a podcast with his merch. I mean, can you believe that? Go to store.tenantpodcast.com you can get travel cups, metal water bottles, mugs, mugs. And you can follow the podcast on Instagram and twitteravid. Tennantpod. I mean, it's like a different language, isn't it, dear? Dear listener, thank you so much. And until the next time, Cherry. Bye. David Tennant does a podcast with is a Something Else and no Mystery production produced by Zoe Edwards. Additional production from Harriet Wood Wells, Sarah Camlett, Steve Ackerman, and Georgia Tennant. The sound engineer was Josh Gibbs. The executive producer is Chris Skinner.