Life is Lifey with Sarah Shahi

Summary

Dear Chelsea | "Life is Lifey with Sarah Shahi"

Release Date: February 26, 2026
Host: Chelsea Handler
Co-Host: Katherine Law
Guest: Sarah Shahi

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Episode Overview

In this engaging and candid episode, Chelsea Handler and co-host Katherine Law welcome actress and new author Sarah Shahi to talk about her new book, Life is Lifey: The A to Z of Navigating Life’s Messy Middle. The conversation centers around navigating major life transitions, particularly divorce, personal reinvention, rediscovering joy and sexuality, and the empowerment that comes from embracing life’s messiness. The trio also answers listener questions about relationships, sex, and family dynamics, delivering both heartfelt advice and their signature humor.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Sarah Shahi’s Life Transitions & New Book

[06:12] – [14:28]

• Leaving Her Marriage:
  • Sarah discusses ending her marriage at the onset of COVID-19 and how this profoundly impacted her sense of self and motherhood.
  • She stresses the importance of modeling happiness for her children rather than “staying together for the kids.”

    "What are you modeling for your children? ... I owe it to my children to show them a mother who was happy, who was thriving, and who has the guts to go after her dreams." — Sarah Shahi [11:04]

• Filing for Divorce & Emotional Relief:
  • Chelsea relates to the feeling of relief upon finally voicing the desire for divorce, breaking the long internal struggle.
• Parallels with Her On-Screen Role:
  • Sarah reflects on filming Sex/Life while undergoing her real-life divorce, noting the striking parallels between her character’s sexual awakening and personal journey.

2. Empowerment, Self-Worth, and the Second Act

[14:28] – [19:40]

• Owning Your Second Act:
  • Both Chelsea and Sarah emphasize the rewards and fulfillment that can come from life after marriage or a major breakup.
  • Chelsea acknowledges the societal skepticism directed at women’s self-help narratives, particularly celebrities, and reinforces that everyone faces the same internal battles.
• Childhood Trauma & Personal Growth:
  • Sarah speaks candidly about how childhood trauma can shape adult relationships, and how being single made her confront patterns rooted in abandonment.
  • Individual worth isn’t determined by outside validation, and true confidence emerges from inner work:

    “You’re not performing anymore. I’m not performing my personality for a guy that I want to like me. I’m asking myself, do I like you?” — Chelsea Handler [19:16]

3. Following Your Happiness & Raising Your Vibration

[23:44] – [26:59]

• Magnetic Attraction of Joy:
  • The importance of actively making choices that bring happiness, and how this “ups your frequency,” attracting the right people and opportunities.
  • Sarah’s candid admission:

    “I was just like chasing, I was chasing dick. I was just like, somebody tell me I’m hot and tell me I am worth.” — Sarah Shahi [25:52]

• Practical Advice:
  • Do what makes you feel happy, even if it’s small — joy is cumulative and clarifying.

4. Navigating the Transition Out of Relationships

[26:59] – [34:07]

• Normalizing Pain and the Grieving Process:
  • Sarah stresses that pain is a normal emotion, encouraging listeners to “give time time” and to welcome grief as it comes, rather than resist it.

    “The only way out of that is in.” — Sarah Shahi [27:55]

  • Chelsea urges listeners not to suppress waves of emotion, but to see each bout of sadness as another step closer to healing.

5. Redefining Sexuality and Pleasure

[39:36] – [44:55]

• Sloppy Blowjobs & Female Sexual Empowerment:

  • In a standout comedic moment, Chelsea and Sarah exchange advice on giving great blowjobs, discussing how learning this skill was empowering rather than burdensome.

    “I actually think the blowjob is more for me than it is for them, because I enjoy their pleasure so much, and I’m very confident at it, that I’m like, watch this.” — Sarah Shahi [40:59]

  • Sarah recounts attending a sex class and learning hands-on techniques, and they normalize women exploring and celebrating their own pleasure.

• Normalizing Honest Sexual Conversations:

  • Sarah: “There were so many women that wrote to me and they were just like, I’ve never had an orgasm before. How do you be vocal? ... That’s sad, because that’s a God-given birthright.” [15:10]

6. Audience Q&A and Advice Sessions

a. Lackluster Sex in Long-Term Relationships

[47:22] – [54:18]

• Listener Kendra feels unfulfilled sexually despite a good partnership.
• Advice:
  • Try gently initiating new experiences during intimacy, see if he’s open to more.
  • Chelsea: If sexual needs misalign and conversation/therapy doesn’t create change, it may be time to reconsider the relationship’s future.
  • Katherine suggests medical/health checks for libido issues.

b. Empathy & Boundaries After a Breakup

[56:01] – [67:47]

• Listener Wyatt, recently out of a relationship with repeated emotional cheating, asks how to balance empathy and boundaries.
• Sarah’s insight:
  • “Per my experience, you can only meet people as deeply as they’ve met themselves... just because you are good for somebody doesn’t mean they are good for you.” [61:04]
  • Empathy is not the same as codependency; maintain standards for reciprocal energy in relationships.
• Chelsea: “Don’t confuse empathy with codependency. Those two things are very close together.” [64:47]

c. Family Gifts & Gratitude Etiquette

[68:53] – [72:41]

• Listener “Sissy” struggles after a niece makes rude comments about a gift, and the parent responds defensively.
• Advice:
  • Sarah: Be clear about your intentions before addressing it — if it’s for your own peace, do it, otherwise let it go for now.
  • Chelsea: Wait for another opportunity to revisit the conversation rather than rehearse old grievances.

7. Cultural Identity & Current Events in Iran

[73:05] – [75:10]

• Sarah shares personal family hardship and hope for positive changes in Iran.
• Both Chelsea and Sarah discuss the strength of women and matriarchal societies, relating it to the importance of female empowerment in today’s world.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "What are you modeling for your children? ... I owe it to my children to show them a mother who was happy, who was thriving, and who has the guts to go after her dreams." — Sarah Shahi [11:04]
• "You’re not performing anymore. I’m not performing my personality for a guy that I want to like me. I’m asking myself, do I like you?" — Chelsea Handler [19:16]
• "Pain is just an emotion, like joy… we don’t normalize it enough. The only way out of that is in." — Sarah Shahi [27:55]
• "Empathy is not the same as codependency; maintain standards for reciprocal energy in relationships." — Chelsea Handler [64:47]
• "If you can learn to give a good blowy, it’s literally your helping hand. You can give a good blow job and in, like, fucking three minutes flat, your husband’s asleep and you’re back to reading your book. Like, that’s the only thing I care about—how quickly I can get back to my book." — Sarah Shahi [44:23]
• "Per my experience, you can only meet people as deeply as they've met themselves. And just because you are good for somebody, doesn’t mean they are good for you." — Sarah Shahi [61:04]

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SECTION TIMESTAMPS

• Sarah Shahi's Divorce & Motherhood: [10:06]
• Sex, Orgasms & Self-Empowerment: [15:10], [39:36], [44:23]
• Second Acts & Self-Worth: [17:27]
• Vibrational Energy & Happiness: [23:44]
• Grieving Post-Breakup: [26:59], [31:32], [33:50]
• Listener Question – Sexless Relationship: [47:22]
• Listener Question – Empathy & Cheating: [56:01]
• Listener Question – Rude Niece & Family Tension: [68:53]
• Women’s Strength & Iran Discussion: [73:05]

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Episode Tone & Takeaways

• Warm, humorous, and unfiltered — Chelsea, Katherine, and Sarah share personal stories without pretense, balancing laughs with vulnerable revelations about growth through discomfort.
• The episode delivers a message of hope and encouragement for anyone confronting change, heartbreak, or feeling lost in life’s “messy middle.”
• Practical relationship advice is always wrapped in empathy and real talk, reminding listeners not to diminish their needs, and to value their own happiness and authenticity.

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For listeners seeking guidance on reinvention, reclaiming sexual joy, and living authentically at any age, this episode is a smart, supportive, and wildly entertaining must-listen.

Transcript

[Chelsea Handler]

This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human. Ever been to the pharmacy counter and your mind goes blank when the pharmacist asks any questions? That's why you need to listen to beyond the script from CVS Pharmacy and I Heart Media. Hosted by Dr. Jake Goodman, each episode features real conversations with CVS pharmacists, the health experts you see most, breaking down the questions you wish you'd asked, from which meds may not mix well to what vaccines you need before a big trip. They will bust myths, decode trends, and share practical advice that you can actually use. Listen to beyond the script on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Sarah Shahi]

What if mind control is real? If you could control the behavior of anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car? When you look at your car, you're gonna become overwhelmed with such good feelings. Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you? I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused.

[Katherine]

Can you get Join your cult.

[Sarah Shahi]

NLP was used on me to access my subconscious mind games. A new podcast Exploring nlp, AKA Neuro Linguistic programming. Is it a self help miracle, a shady hypnosis scam, or both? Listen to Mind games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. 1969 Malcolm and Martin are gone, America is in crisis, and at Morehouse College, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson locked up. The members of the board of trustees, including Martin Luther King Sr. It's the true story of protest and rebellion in black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles, our menelik Lumumba. Listen to the a Building on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. You can scroll the headlines all day and still feel empty. I'm Ben Higgins and if youf Can Hear Me is where culture meets the soul. Honest conversations about loss, purpose, peace, faith and everything in between. Celebrities, thinkers, everyday people. Some have answers. Most are still figuring it out. And if you've ever felt like there has to be more to the story, this show is for you. Listen to if you can Hear me on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or

[Chelsea Handler]

wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, guys, I am officially on my high and Mighty Tour. March 13, Cleveland, Ohio. March 14, Columbus, Ohio. March 15, Cincinnati, Ohio. And then March March 20 is Denver, Colorado. March 27, Portland, Maine. March 28, Providence, Rhode Island. March 29, Springfield, Massachusetts. April 10 is Chicago. I'll be at the Chicago Theater. April 11, Indianapolis, Indiana. April 12, Louisville, Kentucky. April 16 is Albuquerque, New Mexico. April 17 is Mesa, Arizona. April 23 is Kansas City, Missouri. April 24 is St. Louis, Missouri. April 25 is Minneapolis, Minnesota. April 30, Nashville, Tennessee. May 1 is Charlotte, North Carolina. May 2 is Durham, North Carolina. May 6, I'm doing Netflix is a joke festival. I will be in Los Angeles. That is a new announcement. Along with Atlantic City. May 15th, Saratoga, California. May 16th, Monterey, California. May 17th, Modesto, California. And then June 4th, Portchester, New York. June 5th is Boston, Mass. And June 12th is Portland, Oregon. And then Seattle is June 13th. So suck on that. Everybody go to chelseahandler.com for tickets, okay? Hi, Katherine. Hi, Chelsea.

[Katherine]

Where in the world are you?

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh, today I'm in Toronto. I had a show last night in Ontario. I had a weekend full of shows kicking off our tour. Well, this wasn't the kickoff, but I had a really fun weekend. Megan Gailey opened for me.

[Katherine]

Not kickoff, but still early.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, still early. The tour's been so fucking fun, as usual. And we're having a great time. And I'm about to go meet my cowboy at the airport. Cause we're going away for my birthday.

[Sarah Shahi]

Oh, yay.

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh, yay.

[Katherine]

See, I thought the Jamaica trip was the getaway. This is a different.

[Chelsea Handler]

No, that was his birthday. That was his birthday. Girl, I'm not going to Jamaica for my birthday. Okay? That's for someone else.

[Katherine]

Is it bad to date another Pisces? Is he also a Pisces?

[Chelsea Handler]

No, he's an Aquarius.

[Katherine]

Okay, well.

[Sarah Shahi]

Right.

[Katherine]

That's probably fine.

[Chelsea Handler]

I don't know much about it. I don't know much about it either. I mean, honestly. But luckily, enough people in this world keep telling me about it.

[Sarah Shahi]

Great.

[Chelsea Handler]

So, yes, we're on the beginning of a very big adventure. So I am ready to rumble. Yeah.

[Katherine]

I'm happy for you. All I've done the last two weeks is watch Olympics, so I don't have much to tell other than it was

[Chelsea Handler]

such a good one. Oh, yeah. The Olympics have been good.

[Katherine]

It was such a good one.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, it was.

[Katherine]

There was so much, like, women supporting women. Did you see the slalom where the Italian woman won? And there were two people who had been tied for gold. Two women who had been tied for gold. And when the Italian woman won by almost 0.7 seconds, the other two women, like, came in, fell to their knees, and were like, we're not worthy.

[Sarah Shahi]

We're not Worthy.

[Katherine]

It was such a beautiful moment. I was like, of course women would do that. That was just wonderful.

[Chelsea Handler]

That's nice. It was definitely, definitely great vibes. Great vibes for this Olympics. So many wins. So many exciting things happened.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

It was really, really heartwarming. In a perfect time in our country where we can remind people of the good stuff about America rather than absolutely minus the fucking U.S. men's hockey team celebrating with Kash Patel like a bunch of toxic assholes. Minus that part. Okay. Like, I honestly.

[Sarah Shahi]

Ugh.

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh, also, I just want to add, I have about two weeks off, and then I have March 7th in Vegas, and then I have three shows in Ohio. So I want people in Ohio to. I am coming to Cleveland, Columbus, and Cincinnati. That's March 13th, 14th, and 15th. So I will be back stateside.

[Katherine]

Amazing. And this is all new material, right? Somebody was asking me. I was like, I think it's all new material.

[Chelsea Handler]

Of course. Of course it's all new material.

[Katherine]

It's a new tour.

[Chelsea Handler]

It's a new tour. Yeah, it's all new.

[Katherine]

So if you saw her last time, go see her again.

[Chelsea Handler]

Exactly. Anyway, we have a very fun guest today who is from sex life on Netflix and the L Word. She's got a new book. It's called Life is Lifey. The A to Z Navigating Life's Messy Middle. And you can also find her in the upcoming seasons of Hulu's paradise and the upcoming sequel to Red, White, and Royal Blue. So please welcome actress and author Sarah Shahi. Hi, Sarah.

[Sarah Shahi]

Oh, my God. Hi, Mysterio. All together now. Hi, ladies.

[Chelsea Handler]

Hi, cutie. How are you?

[Sarah Shahi]

I'm well. How are you? Where are you right now? Because that background is heaven.

[Chelsea Handler]

I'm in Whistler, Canada. Ah. That's where I have my winter chalet.

[Sarah Shahi]

Oh, I love that.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah. Where are you?

[Sarah Shahi]

I'm not in a winter chalet. I'm in the Oaks of Sherman.

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh, that's so romantic, isn't it? It sounds like something out of Hamnet. The Oaks of Sherman.

[Sarah Shahi]

By the way, I saw you at Critic's Choice, and you are so fucking funny. I know. I'm like the millionth person to tell you that, but I was so excited to do this a just because I've been an admirer for a long time, but especially after seeing you at Critic's Choice, I was like, this is just going to be wonderful. Thank you, universe.

[Chelsea Handler]

Thank you. I appreciate that. And you can imagine my surprise when I was reading your book and came across a chapter opening with one of my quotes. One of my favorite quotes of all time, actually. I read it and I was like, oh, this sounds. And then I saw my name. I'm like, this sounds very familiar.

[Sarah Shahi]

That's so funny. Yeah, you know what? I'm like a walking bumper sticker. I love to talk just like a little bite sized phrases. And I saw your quote and I loved. And you know, you've been so open about your journey with heartbreak and relationships in the past that listening to you talk about that really warmed me up and opened up a side of me towards you that I hadn't felt before. So I've just, like I said, I've always just followed you. And then whenever I was using quotes and I saw that one and then this came through, I was like, oh my God, she's my new best friend. I know.

[Chelsea Handler]

I love it. I really enjoyed your book because. Thank you. I think, first of all, it's gonna be great for all of our listeners because we have so many women that are listening to this and they're on. A lot of them are married and a lot of them are in marriages that they probably are thinking about getting out of, just taking the temperature of the world that we live in today. So this is a really beautiful book that talks about these changes and how to handle them with grace and aplomb and how not to beat yourself up about the decisions you make. And it's a stark reminder that you are the most important person in your universe and if you don't take care of yourself, nobody else is going to. So, like a lot of these themes, I think, you know, I know I've written books that cover a lot of these themes from a female perspective, but not necessarily a marriage perspective. So I wanna talk to you first. I wanna talk a little bit about, you know, you talk about leaving a marriage, your ex husband, you filed for divorce or asked for a divorce, like right when the lockdown started for Covid. And you have three children, a set of twins and another child. So tell us, did that impact your decision? First of all, because obviously when you're thinking about divorce, as you say in your book, you're thinking about it for a long time. It's not something you just blurt out, but when you did blurt it out, I felt such a relief in the way you described your relief. Like finally you've said it, it's out there, you can't take it back. And it feels so good to just unload.

[Sarah Shahi]

Right. It was like a big exhale. Yeah. You know, it's it's tough. I feel that there are a lot of unhappily married women out there, and we are so used to this rhetoric where we have to come last, where we have to put everybody else first, and if we want something that's larger than the life that we're living, that we should feel ashamed or we shouldn't want that. And, you know, for me, having children, you know, here, this is another thing. It's a lot of people, they stay because of the children, and then they get a divorce when the kids are in college. And I've spoken to so many people like that, to which they always say, we knew our parents were unhappy. We wish they would have gotten it sooner. Staying in it for the kids, like, you think you're doing the noble thing, but at the end of the day, what are you modeling for your children? You know, it's like wanting to go after the life that I wanted for myself, and also seeing what I was modeling for my kids. I was like, this needs to give me strength. And it did give me strength. I pictured my daughter in my situation, and I was like, would I be okay if she were living out this version of my life? Would I be okay if my sons were in a relationship where this is how love was modeled and reciprocated? And the answer was no to all of it? So as much as it sucks, as much as, you know, nobody gets married thinking about their divorce, it was something that I was like, I owe it to my children to show them a mother who was happy, who was thriving, and who has the guts to go after her dreams. So, yeah, if anything, the kids kind of propelled me into it. And, you know, like you said, this isn't a decision that comes overnight. The. The. The demise of a relationship is never just one person. It's two people. And it's, you know, it's a downward slope for a while. So I. I tried to use the justification of let me stay in it for the kids, or maybe I should do it tomorrow after dinner. You know what I mean? It's like you just. You try to find those excuses, but at the end of the day, there just comes a point where it's like a switch gets turned on, and you're like, I cannot keep doing this to myself anymore. The pain of staying is greater than the pain of leaving.

[Katherine]

Well, and we do get questions like this a lot from listeners. I think it's almost harder in that sort of situation where it is the slow descent into unhappiness than like, he's a Monster.

[Sarah Shahi]

Right.

[Katherine]

The decision to leave is much more difficult when it's not a monster. You know, it's just you're not as happy as you could possibly be.

[Sarah Shahi]

And also, there's a lot of love. There's. You know, when you're married to somebody for a long time and you build a life and children and a home and memories and, you know, there's just. There's a lot of love. And that love doesn't just go away, you know, even if you want a divorce. It just. That was the other thing that was really interesting to me to explore when all this happened is where does that love go? Where do the pictures on the wall live? What do I do with the ring? Like, all these things that you don't think about right. Until after the fact. So, yeah, I'm happy that I get to sort of share my experience with everybody.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah. And I think it's very. I love what you said about the kids, because that's everybody's excuse. Oh, we're staying together for the kids. I can't tell you how many people say that to me, men and women alike. And it's like, that's not. You're setting. If that was happening to your own kid, you would not want them to tolerate that situation or stay in that situation. And I mean, something else that I find fascinating, and I'm sure you did, too, being yourself, is that you were filming Sex Life at this time, which was a mega hit on Netflix. I watched three episodes of it yesterday, and the fact that this was coinciding and, like, the parallel to the character on the show who's unhappily married and kind of reminiscing about. Well, not kind of, but totally reminiscing about an ex that she had. First of all, you're having so much sex on the show, so congratulations on that. I mean, what a victory.

[Sarah Shahi]

It's been so long now. I've been single for about a year. I don't even remember how it works anymore. I'm like, do your arms go up? Like, what do you do? But, yes, I did have a lot of sex on that show.

[Chelsea Handler]

How fun. Like, how fun.

[Sarah Shahi]

It was so much fun. It was, you know, it was one of those opportunities that, you know, it really was lightning in a bottle with that show. And we started filming that show. It was. It was Covid. So it was about five to six months after I had filed for divorce, we started filming that show, and as the world knows, I ended up with my co star. And, you know, the. The idea for the book really came from the fact that when the show came out, it coincided with the news of my divorce and women from all over the world, like, I didn't, you know, expect to be on this platform, but because of the show's topics, and not only was it about a woman finding the courage to go after what she wants, but it was also very sexually empowering for women to speak up. There were so many women that wrote to me and they were just like, I've never had an orgasm before. How do you be vocal? And I was like, wow, that's sad because that's a God given birthright that we all have to experience, experience this kind of pleasure, you know. Meanwhile, Viagra, something that makes a limp dick hard, like just flies off of everyone's tongue. Like it's everyday vernacular. But if we talk about sex, orgasms, uterus, progesterone, you know, hormonal differences, it's like we have to do it behind closed doors. And I really want to be part of the movement to change that. But yeah, people wrote to me from everywhere, like, how did you have the guts? You know, and also how did you bag the like hot young guy on the show? You know, so it was just a space I found myself in and I was like, let me put all of this somewhere that it can live and it can serve as like a bible for women who want a second act that's maybe better than the first.

[Chelsea Handler]

And I think that's one of the best, best parts of the book is talking about how the second act can be so much more rewarding than the first act of your life. Especially if you're a mom with children, Especially if you were in an unhappy marriage. I know it's certainly true for me and I don't have children and I've never been married. Just really smart decision making on my behalf. But especially with regard to my personality, like that just wouldn't have been a good fit. And I can't tell you how much more joyful and confident and happy and the sex that I'm having is so much better than the sex I was having in my 20s. It's like all women hold on tight. I promise you we are here to send a message that life gets. I mean, it is kind of hard to take a self help book seriously from somebody as hot as you. So I mean, I would say, oh wow, how people would look at, I mean, people might think, oh wait, what does this woman know about? And I want to say like, it's like when people say, oh, You're a celebrity, you have nothing to worry about. You're rich. You don't, you know, it's. That's none of that matters. We're all going through the same shit. All women are experiencing the same experiences. And I think it's really, it's nice to hear from a whole different spectrum of women about their experience in this life.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. And I also feel too, it's like, you know, I feel like everybody comes to the next chapter of their life based on where they were last. And also childhood trauma. Like, I know for me, you know, it's like being single for the first time in my life this last year and also throughout my relationship dynamics, my, my childhood trauma really played a part in it. I mean, I thought I was healed. You know, I thought I had been through the therapy. I sat with the shamans, I meditated for five hours. I went into the desert like, I have no more problems anymore. And it's fascinating the way these issues, you know, and I'm somebody who believes that you attract partners that will help you achieve your highest growth. Whether or not you look at it as an opportunity like that and you learn from the lessons is up to you. But being able to look at the impact my childhood, my abandonment issues, my self worth, like, it, it doesn't matter what somebody looks like on the outside. It really is the inside. And that's why I feel, and this stage in my life, and you probably feel this too. It's like you've done so much work, you're so confident, you know your worth. Like, you know how you take up space on this planet and you feel so good about that that you're not willing to compromise for someone else.

[Chelsea Handler]

And you come to the realization that the right people are going to appreciate that and who you are and who you've grown into, the woman you've grown into, you stop selling yourself and you start realizing that anyone worth their salt will recognize how great you are. You know, like, we're not performing anymore. I'm not performing my personality for a guy that I want to like me. I'm asking myself, do I like you?

[Sarah Shahi]

Right, right. And, and by the way, the other thing that I've come to is if it doesn't work out or they don't reciprocate, fine. Like it doesn't mean I'm not good or I'm not worthy or I did something wrong. It's just not an alignment. And then you become open for somebody who is in alignment. So yeah, it's just so much more rewarding to be at this space in life than the one before.

[Chelsea Handler]

Ever been at the pharmacy counter and the pharmacist asks, do you have any questions? And suddenly your mind goes blank? That's exactly why you need to listen to beyond the Script from CVS Pharmacy and iHeartMedia. Hosted by Dr. Jake Goodman, this podcast brings you real conversations with CVS Pharmacists. I need to get on this the health experts you see most answering the questions you wish you'd asked, like which medications might not mix well, which vaccines should you consider before a big trip, and even those questions you were too embarrassed to say out loud. Each episode busts myths, decodes health trends, and gives you practical, trustworthy advice straight from the people behind the counter. No white coats, no lectures. Just real talk, real answers and maybe a few laughs. Listen to beyond the script on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Sarah Shahi]

Hi, this is Jo Winterstein, host of the Spirit Daughter podcast where we talk about astrology and natal charts and how to step into your most vibrant life. And I just sat down with a

[Katherine]

mini driver, the Irish traveler said when I was 16.

[Chelsea Handler]

You're going to have a terrible time with men.

[Sarah Shahi]

Actor, storyteller and unapologetic Aquarian visionary. Aquarius is all about freedom loving and different perspectives and I find a lot of people with strong placements in Aquarius like Are Misunderstood, a Sun and Venus in Aquarius in her seventh house spark her unconventional approach to partnership. He really has taught me to embrace people sleeping in different rooms, on different

[Chelsea Handler]

houses, in different places, but just an

[Sarah Shahi]

embracing of the isness of it all. If you're navigating your own transformation or just want a chart side view into how a leading artist integrates astrology, creativity and real life, this episode is a must. Listen Listen to the Spirit Daughter podcast starting on February 24th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt Season two podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumprite became the victim of a random crime. He pulls the gun, tells me to lie down on the ground. He identified Jermaine Hudson as the perpetrator. Jermaine was sentenced to 99 years. I'm like Lord, this can't be real. I thought it was a mistaken identity. The best lie is partial truth. For 22 years, only two people knew the truth until a complete confession changed everything.

[Chelsea Handler]

I was a monster.

[Sarah Shahi]

Listen to Burden of guilt season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton eckerd, and in 2022, I was the lead of ABC's the Bachelor. Unfortunately, it didn't go according to plan. He became the first Bachelor to ever have his final rose rejected. The Internet turned on him.

[Chelsea Handler]

If I could press a button and

[Sarah Shahi]

rewind it all, I would.

[Katherine]

But what happened to Clayton?

[Sarah Shahi]

After the show made even bigger headlines. It began as a one night stand and ended in a courtroom with Clayton at the center of a very strange paternity scandal. The media is here. This case has gone viral. The dating contract. Agree to date me, but I'm also suing you. Police.

[Chelsea Handler]

Search warrant.

[Sarah Shahi]

This is unlike anything I've ever seen before. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. This season, an epic battle of he said, she said and the search for accountability in a sea of lies.

[Chelsea Handler]

I have done nothing except get pregnant by the Bachelor.

[Sarah Shahi]

Listen to Love trapped on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Chelsea Handler]

Something else I really liked was you talking about, you know, your acting, getting offers for the kind of same, same types of roles, and you were kind of over it. You're like, very prescriptive. I don't want to keep doing this. And so you stopped auditioning and you told your agents, like, I'm not doing. I'm not going out for these roles anymore. And you even got offered things that you turned down and said, I'm not doing this. I'm just gonna wait until something that is right and that serves me comes along. And I really like, I love that because I think so many people need to hear that, that you have to do things that make you happy in order to have a magnetic attraction to the things that are there that you're supposed to go through in life. Like when you are focusing on the negative, then everything does become negative. And when you choose to make yourself happy by doing the things that make you happy, for me, that's skiing, it's reading books, it's spending time with my friends, and it's also getting time alone when I know that I will infect others with my negative attitude if I'm around them, you know, to retreat. Like, I've learned all these things about myself that make me a happier person. And you speak about that, like, finding out what it is you like about yourself and what makes you happy to do and in the moments where you're not feeling it to actually exercise your right to practice the things that bring joy to your life. Because that is going to up your frequency and up your vibration.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes, you are, I feel like you're probably like me in a sense that you believe in energy and frequency. You've used that word a couple times now. And you know, and, and, and I've done so much research in this space as I, I know you probably have to, to know that it's not even woo woo, it's just pure science. It's quantum physics that you will only attract that which you are in the vibrational state of. So when you're doing things that make you happy, you will continue to attract things that make you happy. When you are doing things that, you know, make you feel sort of less than or not so great, you're just going to keep attracting things like that. And I did. And you know, it's interesting because I'm, I'm now in this, I know I've said it a couple times now, like I'm single for the first time in my life. And there was a period of time where I was just like chasing, I was chasing dick. I was just like, somebody tell me I'm hot and tell me I am worth.

[Chelsea Handler]

I'll tell you you're hot. I'll tell you you're hot right now.

[Sarah Shahi]

Second, and, and, and I was constant and nothing was working out. And it was because I didn't have the self worth. I was coming from a place of insecurity, not wanting to sit with myself. And when I started, this is another thing in the book I talk about which is follow your happy. Like instead of putting attention on the things that you don't have, start chasing the things that make you happy. Follow your happy one by one, step by step. Even if it means hanging out with your friends. Even if it means canceling on your friends in favor of like a night alone, having the extra cookie. Little by little, the past starts to appear and the things that you want to draw in, the things that are aligned with you, it's just science. You'll just start attracting all of that stuff in. So that's something that I still have to remind myself of to this day. It's gotten easier. But yeah, follow your happy. When in doubt, when you don't know what to do, stop focusing on the things you don't know because you're not meant to know it right now. That's why you don't know the answers and instead focus on the things that bring you joy. No matter how small they are.

[Chelsea Handler]

And let's talk about the transitional period. Like, once you admit to your partner that you want out of the relationship. And I think a lot of people, women especially, get very consumed with that piece. Like, what's it gonna feel like? We're not gonna have a partner. And it's kind of like a scarcity issue more than an actual. Like, you're not looking at the big picture. You're not looking at six months down the road. You're gonna be so grateful you made this decision and that you were strong enough to make that decision. So I think that transitional period is a real kind of hiccup for a lot of people that they can't get past. So can you speak a little bit about your experience and when things started to feel aligned again and when you started to really feel grateful and happy about that decision that you made?

[Sarah Shahi]

You know, I feel like the reason, you know, people don't speak up or women don't speak up is because we've been conditioned from the time that we're very young to not experience pain or that pain is bad. You know, I talk about this in the book. It's like when you scrape your knee as a child. Your mom gives you a double scooped ice cream cone. You put a band aid on it, kiss it, make it better, don't cry anymore. And so we have this, you know, story running in our minds that we are not supposed to experience pain. So that keeps us from doing the hard stuff sometimes. But as I learned, you know, especially when the most painful thing that I did was get a divorce was pain is just an emotion, like joy. It's just an emotion like happiness or sadness or grief. And we don't normalize it enough, and we. We try to escape it, when really, the only way out of that is in. So each day for me looked different. One day, I couldn't stop crying. And I would be playing a game with my children, and all of a sudden, my cheeks would flush, and I would get really, really hot, and tears would start, like, prickling in my eyes. I'm like, what is happening? What is happening? And I would sit with it, and I'm like, okay, what is this? What is this? And it was me mourning. And I had this healer tell me one time, and I thought this was so good. Yes, you're mourning. You are mourning the death of a relationship, right? It is a pure death. It is a loss of dreams. You have to bury. You have to bury all that stuff, but you're also mourning the old version of you that was with that person. And I thought that was so telling because I was a certain person when I was married, and I did have a whole bunch of dreams, and I thought my life was going to turn out differently than what it had. And so a lot of times when I was crying, it wasn't necessarily because I missed the relationship. I know I didn't miss the relationship. Right. And. And we do this thing, I think we romanticize the person when we break up with them. I know I certainly have with all of my exes, I. Where all of a sudden, they've got a damn halo on their head. And you start to forget all the things that got you to that place. You forget all the things that they did, all the fights, everything. And you start missing them as if they were this, like, most angelic presence. And it's like, no, go back. Read your journal. Talk to your friends. You know, for me, my mom, she remembers every single person who ever did anything wrong to me, back to the time that I was in kindergarten. So going back and talking to my mom was, like, really, really helpful. And it's like, yeah, you know, you don't want them to get hate fucked by a shark, but at the same time, it's like, you need to remember how you got there and not just put that aside for romantic amnesia and just allowing each day to be different. One day I was feeling frisky. One day I was like, ooh, maybe I can masturbate. And then I would start crying in the middle of it instead and just have a sore hand to boot, you know? So it was just like each day looked different, and I had to allow myself that roller coaster. I had to allow the pain to come in whenever it wanted because there were times where I thought I was totally fine and I would be at Gelson's and all of a sudden start crying over the avocados, you know? So it was just like I had to allow the roller coaster of emotions. I had to allow for every thought to pass through. I had to allow for it to be hard. I had to allow to miss him. I had to allow these things. And then little by little, it did get better. You know, one of my favorite quotes is, give time time and just trust that, you know, your heart has been broken. I'm speaking for myself. My heart has been broken so many times in the past, only to put itself back together stronger than how it was before. And I just trusted. Trusted that it was going to get better. And it did. Yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

I think a lot of times when we are breaking up or we're ending relationships and we're going through that breakup

[Sarah Shahi]

phase,

[Chelsea Handler]

we are surprised that it keeps coming up. Like, we think we've gotten through the worst of it. And then it'll hit you, and you're like, God, I thought I was over this. And it's like, don't. That is good. Every time that comes up, you are extinguishing your grief. Like, you are getting closer to the end of your grief. Don't fight the grief. Like, bring it on. Go through it. Allow those emotions to happen. Even if a month goes by and you're happy and you've met someone else and all of a sudden it hits you, that's another step in your healing. That's not something to eschew and go, oh, God, I don't want to feel any grief. Yeah, you do. You want to feel grief.

[Sarah Shahi]

You do. You do. It's a release. And the other thing, too, is. It's like, you know, two things I thought of when you said that. One was, things are only as important as the weight in which we assign to it. I don't know if I. If I said that right. So it's like, if you're experiencing grief, grief can be as big or small as you allow for it to be. Like, it's it. So. So the importance of a feeling, like, you can be like, yeah, I'm just really sad today. I'm really, really sad. Or you can make that the largest thing in the world. So that's the other thing, too, I think, for people to keep in mind is no emotion. Nothing is as important as the label that we give it. And that's really helped me at times be able to take sort of just like a. For me to step outside of my emotions, for me to zoom out and look at it from a bird's eye perspective and be like, okay. And the other thing is, anytime I. I would have those very overwhelming feelings. And I experienced this just last year with my. With my split. Instead of making it about the other person and how much we miss the other person and how we wish it could have worked out, instead of playing the story that makes it about them, I was trying to look at it from a different perspective where I would make it about me. So instead I would say, instead of being like, oh, my God, I miss them so much, I'd be like, oh, my God, look at the depths of my heart. Oh, my God, look how deeply I can love. And. And. And how my love makes me feel like I have wings, and I Can grow and my love is wild and free Makes me feel like I can do anything. Like, wow. So I would start changing the story instead of it being about them and how much I miss them, about how impressed I was with my. The depths of my own heart. And that actually helped me a lot just to change the story that was happening in my head.

[Chelsea Handler]

You said this a few minutes ago. You said you're kind of mourning the person that you were in that relationship. And I think that there's a lot of that, but there's also a lot to look forward to. The person that you become after the relationship.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes.

[Chelsea Handler]

And that woman is a cause for celebration.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes, absolutely. You start to experience yourself in a whole new way. All the things in which you put on hold because you were putting the other person's needs first or, you know, like, for example, me, I'm somebody who. I'm very flirty with life. You know what I mean? It's like, I. I like to carry myself. I'm an Aries rising, so it's like I like to carry. Carry myself with a little wink everywhere I go. Doesn't necessarily mean I'm hitting on the person. Doesn't mean I want to sleep with the person, but I will flirt with a woman barista just as much as I will flirt with the hot janitor. You know what I mean? So it's like, it doesn't matter to me. Right. And. And I had put that part of my personality aside because it was triggering to people in the past, and I didn't want to do something that felt disrespectful to somebody, so I just kind of buried that part. But now being able to experience my femininity and my sensuality in a. In a way that, like, isn't shameful. It's just who I am. Like, life just feels so much richer to take a luxurious bath and to put on, you know, a silk robe and give yourself a wink in the mirror because you think you're hot. You know what I mean? Like, it's just like life just feels so much better to laugh, to just feel that lightness, to explore the things that I want to explore. And I've never had the opportunity to really do this before. So, you know, it really does feel like I'm coming into myself. I'm owning the fullness of myself in a way that I never had the opportunity to. So. And that, you know, and that's on me. That's on me for allowing that to happen. That's not the other person's fault. But again, every. Every relationship, every situation comes to teach us something. And I've learned some remarkable things from the men I've been in contact and communication with. And I'm just so very grateful.

[Chelsea Handler]

And how's your love life going these days?

[Sarah Shahi]

Non existent sister. Do you know anybody? I'm on Raya for you.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, I do.

[Katherine]

She will recommend someone for you.

[Sarah Shahi]

I'm on Raya. And, you know, it's like, the amount of founders. I'm like, really? What did you find?

[Chelsea Handler]

I know, I know. It's just people who are just obnoxious.

[Sarah Shahi]

Good vibes only. Or, like, if I. If I do match with somebody, all of a sudden they text something really weird. Like, I see you like me with my clothes off, too. And I'm like, what the fuck? What is that line? And then they'll be like, what's your number? I'm like, buddy, no, too fast, Too fast. So anyway, yeah, I don't. I don't know, but I'm just. I'm also in a space where I, like, again, like, I am not chasing. I chased last year when I was very single and same being single was very new. And now I'm just like, my life is really good. Like, I'm really happy. I'm really happy with my work. I'm really full with my children. Like, I'm traveling a lot. I'm meeting people. And if a relationship comes in and, like, you can make my life better than what it is, like, awesome. Like, I am ready, you know? But, yeah, otherwise, I don't know. It just feels like a waste of time.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, you have to be an addition, not a subtraction.

[Sarah Shahi]

That's exactly. Exploring myself as a single person has made me more excited about love than ever. And, like, and I didn't think I would feel that way. Like, I was very jaded after my divorce, and then when I got with my ex, I was like, I love you so much. Like, this is exactly what I've been waiting for. I want to be buried on top of you when we die and we can come back as ghosts and haunt people. Like, my love felt gothic and, like, you know, like, deep. And I thought I would be jaded, but I'm just more excited than ever to show because now that I understand the fullness, the wholeness of myself, I'm like, wow, how amazing to be in a partnership where I can show someone my, like, soft and my fire, like, the full extent of my growth and to grow with somebody. So, yeah, like, I'm just. I'M so excited for whenever that happens.

[Chelsea Handler]

It's also just so empowering as becoming a woman and like, you know, getting older and realizing, like, you know, your messiness or the things that you aren't so proud of or hadn't been so proud of are okay to be on display. Like, you don't have to cover up parts of you. You can actually be 100% who you are. And there is going to be men, not just one man. There are going to be many men who are attracted to that and, like, your mess, you know?

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes, yes.

[Chelsea Handler]

And like, we've spent so many years perfecting our image to the man or men that we want to think of us in a certain. And it's all just completely convoluted and upside down. What we come to understand about ourselves is, like, the more you. You are, the more attractive you become.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes. And the more life just becomes fun. And, you know, and that's the other thing, too. It's like, I think about. I think about death a lot, but not in, like, a morbid way. In a way that's like, if I were to look back on my life, like, am I happy with the chances that I took or am I going to have any regrets? And that's my thing is, I'm not sure where I got this, but from a very young age, I was like, I don't want to have any regrets in my life. So, you know, it's like, I will absolutely jump now and ask for forgiveness later or think later about my choices. But it's like, we're here to have fun. We're here for such a short period of time. It's like, why not just squeeze the juice out of every moment as much as we can? And those that don't align, great. Those that too, great. Like, in the end, none of it matters. You know, it's just. Just have fun. Live your fucking life.

[Chelsea Handler]

I'd like to also say that the section where you quote my. Where you use my quote, I had a guy ask me once, are you drinking? You don't have to drink to make yourself more fun to be around. And I told him, no, I'm drinking so that you're more fun to be around. That section is right above sloppy blowjobs. So let's talk about sloppy blowjobs because you talk about the importance of blowjobs. And I have to tell you, for many years in my 20s and 30s, I was so fucking scared to give a blowjob because I did not know how to give a blowjob And I never gave one to completion. So I was like, I don't only know how to start, I don't know how to finish. And then my friend, who you would never believe who this sport woman is, and she's famous. I won't say her name, but she taught me. She sat me down at dinner and we were in London and she's like, chelsea, let me explain to you how to give a blowjob. And she went to.

[Sarah Shahi]

Did she have like a. Like, did you have a device?

[Chelsea Handler]

No, she didn't have a device, but she described it. And it's very analogous to the way you describe it in your book. It's just like, lots of slobber, lots of spit, lots of tips action. Acting like you're, you know, just stroking, rubbing, make it as wet as possible. And guys are just like. And once I learned how to do it, I was like. I was so empowered.

[Sarah Shahi]

Not that I wanted morning and a night. Yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

Cause I always had this thing. Like, I had this thing. Like, blowjobs are like, that's. You don't get a blowjob from me. You know, Like, I had this attitude and it's like, wait a second. I don't care if you, like, I want to give a great blowjob.

[Sarah Shahi]

Exactly. Like, I actually think the blowjob is more for me than it is for them because I've reached a point where I enjoy the person that I'm attracted to. I enjoy their pleasure so much, and I'm very confident at it, that I'm like, watch this.

[Chelsea Handler]

You know what I mean?

[Sarah Shahi]

So it's like, yeah, open up. Yeah, Like. Like many women, you know, it's like I had zero context on what a penis even looked like growing up. And I had. And I was a big fan of, like, dry humping. And so I had a boyfriend.

[Chelsea Handler]

Let me ask you a quick question. Sorry to interject. Dry humping. Does someone climax during that in their pants? Is that what happens with dry humping?

[Sarah Shahi]

You know? Have you not dry humped?

[Chelsea Handler]

I mean, not in recent times.

[Sarah Shahi]

I think I got off. Well, I haven't in recent times either. But like, when I was a teenager. Oh, my God, my mom is going to kill me. When I was a teenager, I was a big fan of dry humping because, yeah, I would, like, get off. Like, I.

[Chelsea Handler]

Okay, so it's like masturbating over the pants, which I did a lot of.

[Katherine]

You gotta be a teenager.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, the jeans would rub the bits in the right place, you know what I mean?

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, like a rudder. Like a rudder. When you have jeans with a thick seam, that is a good tool to use to masturbate.

[Sarah Shahi]

I will. Yeah, exactly.

[Chelsea Handler]

Corduroy.

[Sarah Shahi]

Corduroy is very effective, but yeah. So I had a boyfriend who was older than me, and I could tell he wanted more than dry humping. And I was like, okay. And at the time, there was this show on hbo, I don't know if you had ever heard of it or watched it, called Real Sex. And there was a woman named Lou Piguette who was like, she wrote a book called the Big O. And she was older than dirt, and she just was like her very own porn star. And she had a class that was in Beverly Hills. And I don't know how I came upon it, but I was like, oh, I need to take this class. So I took this class. There were about eight of us there. We were each handed. There was like a plate, like a fine china plate was in front of us. And she went around the room. We each got to pick out our dildos. So everyone got like a respectable 6 inch dildo full of veins and everything. They were all circumcised. And then she was like, all right, ladies, like, let's open up the back of those throats. These dildos aren't going to jack off by themselves. And she just taught us to desensitize, like, the gag reflex. Taught us, like, different, like, hand techniques. Really broke down the p. And I'm a very analytical person, so it's like, like, for me, it was hard to unleash that sexual side of me if it was just like. Because again, I didn't. I was a late bloomer. Like, sex was not something that we talked about in my household with my mom. So I didn't understand. And so, but when she broke it down, like, anatomically, and the veins and the nerve endings and the whole thing, and I was like, oh, okay, now I get it. And then I just, just love it. I just love it. And, and, and, and the perspective of the book. Like, again, because the book is for women written through a female lens. It's all about women empowerment. You know, the, the, the nights where it's like you could not be bothered with sex, but you know, you, you know, you know, you want to put something out there. It's the nights where the hands of Tom Brady himself would get slapped away. If you can learn to give a good blowy, it's literally your helping hand. You know, it's like the amount of times you can give a good Blow job. And in like, fucking three minutes flat, your husband's asleep, your partner's asleep, and you're back to reading your book. Like, that's the only thing I care about. How quickly can I get back to my book? So, yeah, it's just like, the best thing ever.

[Chelsea Handler]

So I know you say you wanted to live your life without any regrets. When you think about your life now and like, present day, what is your biggest regret yet? Or do you have one, Chelsea?

[Sarah Shahi]

I don't have one.

[Chelsea Handler]

Wow.

[Sarah Shahi]

I don't have one. The amount of times I have, you know, and I, I talk about this in the book the Failure and up chapters. Like, the amount of times I, I, you know, fucked up, overreach to a guy, got too drunk, cheated, all of those things. I learned something so valuable from those that I wouldn't trade those experiences for anything. You know, it's like I look back on my life so far and every misstep. I am so glad that I took it because it allows me to be the person that I am now. And I really like the person who puts down her head at night. I really like the person who was mothering her three children. I like the example that I'm setting. I like that I'm able to. To look at my crazy, because I can be fucking crazy and say I'm glad for every chance that I took where I showed my crazy because the right people stayed. And, yeah, I don't have any regrets.

[Chelsea Handler]

I love that. I love that answer. The book is called Life is Lifey. This is Sarah Shahi's new book that's out and we are gonna take a break and we're gonna be right back. And we're back with Sarah Shahi. So you know Sarah from sex life. You know her from the L Word, you know her from Paradise, Person of interest. And now she has a new book where she talks about getting divorced, growing into her best version of her womanhood, and living life. I think living life out loud. I like saying that. Living life out loud. Cause you kind of have to. I want to. I always wanted to have a loud life when I was little. And, you know, I didn't know what that meant other than big. I just wanted a big opportunity and big adventure and to say yes to things that really are scaring, you know, that scared me. So. And I think that's a lot of, you know, that's a big theme in your book. Book as well.

[Sarah Shahi]

I'm like you, I. I grew up in a small town in Texas, where I from A young age. I knew I wanted more than what my little town was providing me. I knew there was more out there even though I wasn't exposed to it. So I also was attracted to this idea of just living this larger than life lifestyle and that's what I was meant to do. And you know, and it's really beautiful because I feel like now at 46, like I am living that version of my dreams.

[Chelsea Handler]

I love it. We're gonna take some callers. Are you ready to give some advice to women?

[Sarah Shahi]

I'm so ready.

[Katherine]

Let's go.

[Chelsea Handler]

Or gay men. We sometimes have gay men calling.

[Sarah Shahi]

I love this.

[Katherine]

Well, our first question comes from Kendra. This one's just an email, but I felt like it was very appropriate for you, Sarah. So Kendra says, dear Chelsea, I'm a 42 year old mother of two teenagers who's divorced from their dad. We were in a 15 year unhealthy and sexless marriage. I have a new partner of five years who is so kind, fun, smart, thoughtful and great with my kids. We live together and are having a commitment ceremony this fall. The problem is our sex life is lackluster at best. I brought this up to him many times and it seems to fall on deaf ears. At first, he was very offended when I suggested we spice things up and said he was happy with our sex life. He claims I'm just more sexual than him, but I feel so confused. What man doesn't want to have a threesome or do literally anything he wants? To me, the relationship itself doesn't feel very sexual. I feel like I'm in my prime and I want to have fun in the bedroom and explore. He's the only man I've been with since my divorce. So two men in 22 years. I'm starting to feel a bit ripped off and I'm wondering if I can live with this type of vanilla sex for the rest of my life. I'm starting to understand why some people have affairs, which is horrible to say and I never would, but I get it. Help Kendra.

[Sarah Shahi]

Oh, Kendra, girl, I feel your pain. Oh, man. I understand there are a lot of good things there. But then also you feel like you're not getting your needs met in some way. I wonder in those moments when you did bring it up to him, I wonder if instead of making it a verbal communication, can you just start doing it? Can you in. In the act, can you just start directing the sex in the direction that you want it to go when he is turned on as well? Like, I wonder if that's a possibility if you've tried that or not. And I also feel like at the end of the day, the good has to outweigh the bad. And I, I don't know your relationship other than the fact that he sounds like a very similar safe, warm presence, which is beautiful. But I'm also somebody who. This is me, personally speaking. I. I don't believe in lack, and I do believe that there is somebody out there that can check all those boxes. I'm not telling you not to have your. Your commitment ceremony, but at the same time, I do think you have to really get quiet with yourself and ask yourself, is this about the lackluster sex? Or could this lackluster energy also be translating into other areas? Like, is it just about the sex, isn't fun? Or is this a person who could be missing some kind of that vitality in other areas as well, but maybe you just notice it more in the sex and is that something you can live with?

[Chelsea Handler]

I think when you have these kind of concerns before you're in a serious, like you're about to make a commit, you know, have a commitment ceremony, I think these kinds of concerns, like, if you're a sexual being and his reaction to that isn't, oh, my God, let's fix this. Let's get this figured out. Let's. Let's work together. Let's get a sex therapist, or let's figure it out together, alone. Like, what can I do to make you more. Give you more pleasure or be more sexually active or initiate whatever your things are? Like, if someone isn't open to that, I don't think those things get better as you stay together. I think that, you know, commitment leads to laziness a lot in relationships. And I'm not saying this is applicable to every relationship. I just think things become easier and you get used to someone and you try less and you don't try as hard. So if that's an issue for you now, and you are a sexual being and you're talking about potentially thinking about an affair, like, then if you wanna go and have an affair and do that and you're okay with that, then do that. But if you're not, which it sounds like you're not, then you should really think about making a commitment to this person, because that is a major. Sex is a major component of a relationship for so many people, not for everybody. It doesn't sound like it is for the guy that you're committing to.

[Sarah Shahi]

Exactly.

[Chelsea Handler]

But for a lot of us, it is important for me that Is the number one thing, like I am there for sexual sex. It's not the number one thing. Sorry. But it's up there. It's like the top five.

[Sarah Shahi]

When the sex is not good. It's like when the sex is not good, the other problems become so much more heightened. So it is, it is an important part of the dynamic. And Chelsea's right. It's like if there are signs already, like those red flags only get redder after marriage, you know, they don't, they don't go away. And you should be in a relationship where you can talk about the hard things and it's receptive, received with curiosity and interest. And, and you know, I understand if you are criticizing a man's, you know, sexual appetite, how they might at first get a little flustered by it, but at the end of the day, like if there isn't that interest to get on the same page, maybe he doesn't want to do a three way. Maybe his answer would be something else, you know, but you're right, Chelsea, like the, the interest to explore together should be there. If this is a man that you're going to make a commitment to. Yeah, yeah.

[Katherine]

And I think take steps, like do the therapy Chelsea talked about and also like get his levels checked. Cause this could be something as simple as like he's got some low T going on or whatever and his libido is low.

[Chelsea Handler]

So like.

[Katherine]

But I do like what you say, Sarah, about like he should be responding with curiosity. But like just take all the steps. Like see what you can see. See if it's fixable. And if it's not, then you've got, you know, some decisions to make make potentially.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. And don't ignore the fact that you're second guessing right now. Like that's, that's a, that's, that's a part of you, that's your higher self, that's somehow that's communicating to you. So don't brush it under the rug thinking it's going to go away because it won't go away. Right.

[Chelsea Handler]

As a 50 year old woman, like your sex drive only increases as you get older. So if you're already somebody who is interested in sex, it's going to get more and more, you're going to be more and more interested.

[Sarah Shahi]

I have to change my underwear a couple times a day and I'm not, I'm not even with anybody, so. And I'm older than you, Kendra.

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh my God. I gotta send that to my friend Ange. She doesn't wear underwear. And I was like, listen, that is so. She goes, why? I need Annette to catch whatever is coming out. She goes, what's coming out? I'm like, all sorts of stuff. What are you talking about? Nothing's coming out of your vagina into your underwear. She's like, I don't see anything. I'm like, that's cause it's on your jeans. You're so disgusting.

[Sarah Shahi]

Oh my God.

[Chelsea Handler]

But I mean, yeah, there's things, guys, coming in and out of our vaginas. Hopefully more in than out. But listen, that's what happened.

[Sarah Shahi]

That's hilarious.

[Chelsea Handler]

It's natural and it's nature.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. And it's beautiful. I love it.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, it is beautiful. That's a great way to look at it.

[Katherine]

Well, our caller today is Wyatt. He says, Dear Chelsea, a month ago, my relationship of nearly three years ended. I pride myself on my intuition, but what often gets in my way is empathy, giving people the benefit of the doubt, especially those I invest deeply in. My ex and I had a 19 year age gap. I'm 29, he's 48. Unconventional, but it worked in many ways. As the child of a therapist, I'm emotionally self aware and have spent years working on myself. Over time, it became clear that my partner wasn't at the same level of emotional development. I've learned to meet people where they are without judgment and show up fully. He came out at 26 after growing up Catholic and nearly becoming a priest to avoid being openly gay. Knowing this made me patient with his struggles around communication, commitment and unhealthy patterns like alcoholism. I saw him fully and still chose him, even knowing I might deserve someone who had already worked through those issues. Throughout the relationship, there were repeated instances of him flirting with other men online. Emoji reactions, compliments, messages. I raised this many times. He insisted he it wasn't cheating, framing it as a self esteem issue and a need for validation. Despite my gut telling me it wouldn't stop, I stayed. Then I went against my own rule and looked at his phone and saw nude photos from someone who was, quote, just a friend with my partner actively flirting back. Now here I am, heartbroken but clear that something wasn't right. I'm grateful for any advice you can offer on how to get past the cheating and more importantly, how I can stop my sense of empathy from allowing other people to mistreat me in the future. Thanks for the clarity, humor and guidance you provide to people navigating uncertainty. It truly matters. Wyatt.

[Chelsea Handler]

Hi, Wyatt. Hi.

[Sarah Shahi]

Hi, Wyatt. Hello. So lovely to meet both of you.

[Chelsea Handler]

I like that you're standing up. Like an audition.

[Sarah Shahi]

Like, oh, I'm sitting down.

[Chelsea Handler]

Oh, you are. Okay. I was like, is this a mug shot? I didn't know what was going.

[Sarah Shahi]

Very long torso. Yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

You must be. Very long ways to.

[Sarah Shahi]

It's actually a short torso, so I'm glad it's all framed.

[Chelsea Handler]

Perfect. It's the framing. The framing is helpful.

[Sarah Shahi]

Giant. You are giant. I love it.

[Chelsea Handler]

This is our special guest, Sarah Shahi. Obviously. So first of all, did you. You ended the relationship when you found. When you found those photos on his phone.

[Sarah Shahi]

It was an ending out of anger and in the moment of ending it, we had met about 10 days later to actually, like discuss and healthy manner of conversation, which really wasn't a conversation. It was just him deciding he didn't want to be in a relationship. So that's kind of how it ended. To me, it was more of a discard rather than a let's figure this out or what the next step forward is.

[Chelsea Handler]

Right, Right. Well, first of all, it's great news that that relationship has ended. It may not feel great in this moment, but you're gonna be grateful as you move through your life and heal from this. That that person, it's not a match. You don't want anyone that's being deceitful or that's looking at nude pictures online like, that's not what you're looking for. You're looking for honesty, openness, transparency. Right?

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah, exactly.

[Chelsea Handler]

So I think, I mean, we're just talking about this. Sarah just wrote a new book. It's called Life is Lifey. The A to Z's navigating life's messy middle, which is on the subject matter of breaking up and new beginnings, kind of owning your own power. And so while I understand you're hurt and you're disappointed and you're heartbroken, like, these are all tools that are gonna bring you closer to a person who is going to appreciate you and is going to understand you. And by moving on through this relationship and out of this relationship, there is going to be a rebirth. There's going to be a new version of you that you can look forward to getting to know. And that's the most exciting thing about breaking up that no one ever tells you is that you are going to bloom and blossom in ways that you did not know. That's just the way the world works. You're not gonna sit here and wallow in self pity or be upset for years and years and years. That's just not gonna happen. You're gonna meet other people. You're gonna be interested in other people. And I think the most crucial thing to do is to really not try to push any of it away. Just experience the breakup, experience the loss, the grief. Welcome it. You know, they say, like, if you allow yourself to cry and be in pain, it lasts for, like, 90 seconds, and then it's over, and it's kind of true. I mean, maybe it's less than 90 seconds. It's something small like that. It's not over for good, but you move through that, you know? So my. My advice to you is to not resist the moment that you're in and resist the reality that you're in, but to look at it with open arms and have an attitude of love. Like you. You don't have to be angry at that guy or your ex. You don't have to be mad at him. You have to just learn to understand that certain people aren't meant for us, and it's a gift. When we are separated from them, even if it's from the other person doing it, it is a gift. It's getting you closer to your real happiness. And maybe that happiness involves you spending some time alone so that, you know, getting to really sit with yourself and making sure that you're looking for any of those red flags the next time. You know what I mean? So you're not making the same kind of choices twice. I think that is the best, like, advice in life is to try not to make the same mistake twice. It kind of redirects what you're willing to tolerate, you know, from different people. It's like, I don't want to have that. I dated an asshole once. I'm not saying your guy was an asshole, but I dated an asshole once. I didn't want to ever date an asshole twice. And I have, you know, I've dated different kinds of assholes, but never the same type of asshole, you know? And, like, I like to look at that. I like to look at life through that lens. Like, it's. If something doesn't work out, great. That won't happen again the next time. I'm gonna find some. You know, I'm gonna find something different or I'm gonna find something that does work out. So I would. My advice would be that is to just sit in this moment and, you know, talk about it when you need to talk about it. Hire a therapist, if you don't have one already, to help you work through it and also develop better. Like, I don't want to Insult your judgment, because it's not about your judgment, but you have to know exactly what you're looking for. So, like, Sarah, we've been talking about this, like, getting to know what you need, what you want, how to be your most authentic self so that you're attracting the type of person that respects, that recognizes it and likes it, you know, and wants to be with you, and that all. All that work is kind of what has to happen after each break.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah, no, I fully agree on all of that. First of all, Wyatt, I'm so sorry for your heartbreak. Like, I know it sucks, and Chelsea said so many incredible things, and I can tell that you are an incredible human and you have this light that radiates through your audition looking frame. But on top of everything that Chelsea said, which is so true, there's a couple things I thought of that I want to. I would love for you to think about. You said that you can meet people where they're at. Per my experience, you can only meet people as deeply as they've met themselves. And it doesn't sound like. And it doesn't sound like your ex has met himself very deeply, even though he is, you know, 20 years older than you. I'm sure the relationship gave you a lot of wonderful things to think on, learn, chew on. And the other thing I wanted to say is, God, Chelsea, you said so many good things. Just because you are good for somebody doesn't mean they are good for you. So to speak to the part of you that feels. Because I'm very much like you, my heart is so soft, and I have. You know, when you're an empath, you have so much empathy for the other person. You can rationalize their bad behavior, and it makes you soft, and it makes you want to forgive, and it makes you want to take them back. But per the work that I've done, and your mom is a therapist, so you. You might be doing this stuff already. What I learned is that. That that's not empathy. That's me trying to prove my worth to somebody. My father left when I was very young, and I spent a large portion of my young adult life trying to prove. And I thought I was the reason why he left. Like, I thought I wasn't a good enough daughter. So every time he came back, I would like. I would be like a cat in between his legs, like, trying to purr on him and sit on his lap and just, like, do whatever I could to make sure he didn't leave again. Because if he picked me, I knew I Was worthy. So I started imitating those same patterns in my relationships. And I would have partners, like, that would leave and I would. I. Again, this is because I want to prove. Because there's a story in my brain that in order for me to be loved, I have to prove that I am worthy, that I am good enough. So I would start doing that stuff, and I would not have any boundaries. I would let the person cheat on me, throw things at me, push me, spit in my face, do whatever, and then they would come back and apologize. And because I was like, yeah, I can understand. Yeah, okay, well, they were really drunk or they were high or, yeah, you were just angry. And, you know, I'm gonna allow for you to be who you are. I would accept that. I would accept it when it's like, no, because those things. I don't deserve to be treated like that. Nobody deserves to be treated like that. Or I should say, that's not the type of relationship that for me, maybe for somebody else, they enjoy that kind of thing. That's not what I'm looking for for my nervous system. And at the end of the day, I think you should be. You know, not that I'm trying to sit here and sell a copy of my book, but, hey, why not, if you can? I do talk about, like, marriage and breakups and all that. Well, I know you guys weren't married, but just breakups in the book. And your life is going to open up in so many marvelous ways. Like, this man did you a favor. He did you a favor. So if anything, it's like, bless him, send him on his way. And anytime you have those feelings, like Chelsea said, let them come out. That's beautiful. That just shows you the depths of, like, your love. So. And. And as often as you can, try to turn it back to that, as opposed to being, like, how much you miss him, make it more about yourself and what a beautiful human you are and how much you're expanding.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah. And that's something that we were just talking about, that, Wyatt, before you were on is just when you get heartbroken or you get your heart broken, your heart comes back together. The pieces come back together, and it makes a stronger heart. Like, you become stronger, and you become. I just want to circle back because you were talking about empathy and being an empath. And, like, don't confuse empathy with codependency. Like, those two things are very close together. So when you're being so empathetic that you're allowing behaviors to exist because of what they've been through without having your own standards and boundaries in place, then that's a codependency. That's just allowing behavior and working around someone else's problems, and they're not working around yours. So for you, your next relationship, I want you to focus on having an equal relationship where you're both equally caring of the other person. And it can be imbalanced at times. But overall, when you look at, like, a spreadsheet, you both have to be putting in the same amount of effort towards each other and towards understanding. Like, caring, thinking about the other person, wondering how they're doing. It can't be one. It can't be lopsided, because that just develops into a codependency, and it's like bad, bad habits. And those are hard to break after you develop them.

[Sarah Shahi]

Them. Yeah. And then one. One more thing that Chelsea just reminded me of, too. I hope this is all helpful. No, it's 100% is. Yeah. Okay. Okay. And when. When Chelsea was talking about bad behaviors and choosing differently in the future, I had a partner actually teach this to me, and I thought this was brilliant. When someone makes a mistake. Right. They do something that is clearly not right. Okay. Or doesn't work, whatever, however you want to label it. That can be an accident. Okay. I did this. It's an accident. I'm sorry. It's not going to happen again. That can be labeled as a mistake. When it keeps happening, when it's repetitive, that's no longer an accident. That's who they are. That is chosen behavior, and that is who they are. Are so. And then there's that. Great. You know, I don't remember if it was Oprah or Maya Angelou who said it, but it was like, when people show. It was Maya Angelou. When people show you who they are, believe them. Believe them. Yep, I know. Exactly.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah. So if you take everything we said, Wyatt, like, you have a lot to look forward to. So be gentle with yourself in, like, getting through this period, and then get excited about what the future has to offer. You're 29 years old.

[Sarah Shahi]

You're gonna fall in love, and you're hot.

[Chelsea Handler]

Probably a few times.

[Katherine]

You haven't even suffered twink death. You look great.

[Sarah Shahi]

Thank you so much. Yes. Like, if this is what your torso looks like, I can only imagine the second half. So, like, it's all downhill. Bunny. You are good to go, my friend. Thank you. That's so sweet.

[Chelsea Handler]

Thanks for calling in, Wyatt.

[Sarah Shahi]

Of course. Thank you for the time and the space to listen.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, of course. Oh, What a sweetie.

[Sarah Shahi]

I know.

[Chelsea Handler]

So sweet, Wyatt.

[Katherine]

You guys gave such good advice to him. He's gonna do. He's gonna do great. He's gonna do great.

[Chelsea Handler]

He's going to flourish.

[Sarah Shahi]

He is.

[Katherine]

Well, let's take a quick break and we'll be back to wrap up.

[Chelsea Handler]

Okay. And we're gonna take a break and. Okay, we are taking a break. And we're back with Sarah Shahi. Her new book is called Life is Lifey. The A to Z's Navigating Life's Messy Middle. And you can also find her in the upcoming seasons of Hulu's paradise and the upcoming sequel to Red, White and Royal Blue. Okay, what do we have to close us out today, Katherine?

[Katherine]

I mean, I do have a quickie if you're ready for a quickie.

[Chelsea Handler]

Let's do it.

[Katherine]

Sarah, do you have a minute for a quickie?

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. What's a quickie?

[Chelsea Handler]

Like a write in without a person on.

[Sarah Shahi]

I was like, what are we doing, ladies?

[Katherine]

Yeah, like, not a very complicated question.

[Chelsea Handler]

We just straight a quick blow.

[Sarah Shahi]

I was like, I don't know if

[Chelsea Handler]

I'm ready on your dildo at your house.

[Sarah Shahi]

I didn't see this. I'm in the email.

[Katherine]

We'll finish up with our one drink question, which is Dear Chelsea, last year for her birthday and Christmas, our niece's response to our gift was, let's just say, less than enthusiastic. Plus, she made a rude comment. She's nine. We didn't say anything to her. But later, my husband talked to his sister and let her know that her daughter's lack of gratitude and rude comment hurt. His sister did not take this very well. She thought we were attacking her parenting rather than asking for her to teach her kid to give a polite thank you. His sister has asked us not to give her children presents and told us they wouldn't even notice if they got gifts from us or not. Last time we saw them, his sister was chilly. We have a family event coming up. Should I address this with her? Thanks, sissy.

[Chelsea Handler]

I mean, well, it's obvious where she got her manners from. I mean, her mother.

[Sarah Shahi]

Exactly what I was thinking.

[Chelsea Handler]

Like, what the fuck? First of all, please and thank you are the first two phrases you should learn. Please and thank you. Thank you. Thank you, thank you.

[Sarah Shahi]

I have a thought. Chelsea, do you have a fa.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, you go ahead. Because you're a mother. I always have to think things through because when I don't have kids, I have to think about what the right thing is. You go first.

[Sarah Shahi]

Okay. And by the way, I appreciate that, because the amount of times people without, you know, kids want to just give their advice, like it's the facts. So I appreciate that you have that awareness. I would say, what are you looking for? What would your intention be for bringing it up? Are you looking to resolve something or get a different way of behavior out of her, or are you wanting to just express something from yourself? So I would get really clear on what your intention is if you did bring it up. If you're bringing it up to try to adjust her behavior, I'm not sure if you would be successful at that. And if anything, you might just create a really bad situation for everybody. Whereas if you just chose to be neutral, maybe the energy would be a little bit better. But if it's something you feel like you need to say, regardless of what her response is, I am more aligned with that kind of stuff. Because then it's for you. It's not because you're trying. You don't have an expectation of the other person. So that's a tough one. But again, I. I'd be like, if you're looking to change her behavior, I don't know if it would be worth it, but if.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, I just. Based on your last interaction or the last interaction, when she was confronted with her child's behavior, it doesn't seem like she's in a place or a state of mind to take that on or to have any accountability for why her. She's obviously embarrassed that her daughter act like that. And instead of admitting that she's covering up for it and defensive, like, oh, then she doesn't need gifts from you. That's an even more childish thing to say than what the daughter said. By not showing gratitude, but also, you know, like, just, great, don't get her any more gifts. The girl doesn't know how to say thank you. She won't get any more gifts from you. And that behavior is going to surface and resurface and resurface like she's nine years old. It's not gonna get. It's gonna get worse before it gets better. If it does get better, but it's gonna happen again in some rude way, she's gonna be rude in some other way. And I guess what I would say is not to address the issue unless it's a birthday situation and you don't bring a gift. And then you can be like, you told us not to give her a gift. She doesn't. You know, you said she wouldn't care. Like, I would only bring it up if it's pertinent to what had happened, but this is gonna recur with her. With a girl.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. This is the last time the mom is gonna hear this either.

[Chelsea Handler]

So I think you're gonna have other opportunities. Instead of focusing on something that transpired a while ago, why don't you wait for the next opportunity and then bring it up in the moment?

[Sarah Shahi]

There you go.

[Chelsea Handler]

So you're not harping on anything, you know, so that would be my advice. Yeah. Don't say anything now. Wait it. Wait it out, and it will reveal itself again. Sarah, I just wanted to recognize the fact that you're Iranian and Persian and ask you if you have any family in Iran right now.

[Sarah Shahi]

I have a lot of family. I have a lot of family. My uncle actually got shot a couple weeks ago. He was caught in the crossfires, and they had a really hard time getting him in the hospital. He's fine. They were able to get the bullet out. He was driving to work, and. Yeah, it's really awful. And I pray for the situation over there to change. Growing up, being Persian is something that was always looked down upon. You know, I think the outside world believes that the Iranian citizens are like the government and that every Persian is a terrorist, and there was always this stigma around it. But I really, really hope and pray that situations change, things change over there, and the world can get to know Iran and its people for the beautiful citizens that they are. It's such a rich culture. It's such a diverse culture. It's, like, deeply immersed in poetry and beauty and songs and, you know, even there are no history books. Even the history books that reflected the beauty that Iran had, even those have just been erased. So, yeah, it's. It's tough. We. I talk about it with my family every day. We don't really have a way to get in touch with anyone over there. It's pretty sad. And I'm just praying for a miracle.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, Yeah, I am, too. I am, too. It feels like the whole world needs a miracle. We need a. Like, all the systems feel like they're about to break, you know, like.

[Sarah Shahi]

And I just. And, you know, and the people over there, they're so desperate, they have nothing to lose anymore. You know, it's like my. I have a lot of family over there, aunts and uncles. They can't afford electricity. You know, they can't afford food. I mean, inflation is so high. It's like, if you want to go out and buy a chicken, it's like $100, you know, it's Just, it's insane how little these people have and that's why they've just taken to the streets now, because they, they're dead anyway. There is nothing to lose anymore. But they need help. They need help if they're going to instigate any kind of change.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, I know. It's like, I mean. Yeah, that's a whole other political conversation.

[Sarah Shahi]

Exactly. Exactly. One in which. Which, you know. Yeah, we don't get into. But I really just pray that in this time of upheaval, you know, that the analogy of things needing to break down in order to rebuild better. I really hope that that applies.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah.

[Sarah Shahi]

For everybody.

[Chelsea Handler]

I, Yeah, I think so. I wonder. I, I think that's true. I, I wonder how many years that takes, you know, like. Or is it going to happen in our lifetime? Or is this going to be a hundred year thing? Like, are we gonna see the change? We need to go. I read this really interesting thing on Instagram this morning. It was a quote about how we were a matriarchal society for 250,000 years and for the 10,000 years that we've been a patriarchal society, shit has hit the fan. And we've had more wars, we've had more like, you know, just depravity. Especially in light of all the news circulating right now. It's like we are in a situation where women have taken like a second class citizen role at the expense of humanity.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yes. And I, and I really think that, you know, going back to the themes that we talk about too, it's like the reason why that has happened and that's. This is important for every woman listener of your, of your podcast and your platform to know is because we are so strong, we are the creators. Like the universe made us the creators for a reason. Like, societies from the beginning of time have been so intimidated by the natural power that women hold. And it's just important for us to remember and do whatever we can, big or small, to help tip that scale.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah. And it was comparing societies to like all animal societies. You know how they're like the lion, the male lions ousted out of the group because he's not helpful. You know how like all of these. But serious, it's true. Like, it's all matriarchal and animals. Elephants, lions, like all of it. They're just like, you guys aren't allowed to be here. You're violent, you're scary and you're brawny. But don't adding, don't confuse brawn with like, that's for labor you know what I mean? That's not for running societies.

[Katherine]

So men have made such a mess of things. I think, like, let's just get all of them out of power, and it's time for women to have a turn, and let's just see if we can turn this around. I think we can.

[Sarah Shahi]

Yeah. And I love men. You know, I'm not sitting here as a man hater, like, saying this. I. I love men, and I think there's a very important role for them to play. But the. The tips of the. The scale of masculinity has become so unhealthy that we need to find that balance again.

[Chelsea Handler]

Sarah, loved hanging out with you. So much fun talking to you.

[Sarah Shahi]

You as well, Chelsea. Thank you so much. This has been such a privilege.

[Chelsea Handler]

It was so fun. And the book is called Life is Lifey. The A to Z's Navigating Life's Messy Middle. So please grab yourself a copy and I hope to see you in person at some point, Sarah.

[Sarah Shahi]

I hope so too. I hope so, too. Yes, we'll be dripping in all kinds of goodness.

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, we'll practice our blowjobs together. That'll be something to look forward to.

[Sarah Shahi]

That would be fun. That would be fun.

[Chelsea Handler]

Take care.

[Sarah Shahi]

We'll switch tips. Okay, great. All right. Bye, ladies. Thank you so much. Have a great day.

[Chelsea Handler]

Okay, guys, I am officially on my high and Mighty Tour. March 13, Cleveland, Ohio. March 14, Columbus, Ohio. March 15, Cincinnati, Ohio. And then March 20 is Denver, Colorado. March 27, Portland, Maine. March 28, Providence, Rhode Island. March 29, Springfield, Massachusetts. April 10 is Chicago. I'll be at the Chicago Theater. April 11, Indianapolis, Indiana. April 12, Louisville, Kentucky. April 16 is Albuquerque, New Mexico. April 17 is Mesa, Arizona. April 23 is Kansas City, Missouri. April 24 is St. Louis, Missouri. April 25 is Minneapolis, Minnesota. April 30, Nashville, Tennessee. May 1 is Charlotte, North Carolina. May 2 is Durham, North Carolina. May 6, I'm doing Netflix is a joke festival. I will be in Los Angeles. That is a new announcement along with Atlantic City. May 15, Saratoga, California. May 16, Monterey, California. May 17, Modesto, California. And then June 4, Portchester, New York. June 5 is Boston, Mass. And June 12 is Portland, Oregon. And then Seattle is June 13, so suck on that. Everybody go to chelseahandler.com for tickets.

[Katherine]

If you want advice from Chelsea, write

[Sarah Shahi]

in to Dear Chelsea.

[Katherine]

Chelsea podcastmail.com Dear Chelsea is a production of I Heart Media. Follow Chelsea on all socials, Elsie Handler, and find Katherine on TikTok Ashkadabra. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brandon Dickert, executive producer Kathryn Law. Find full video episodes and minisodes now on Netflix and get tickets to see Chelsea [e-mail]

[Chelsea Handler]

this is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.