The Hunting Wives with Malin Akerman

Summary

Podcast Title: Dear Chelsea
Host/Author: iHeartPodcasts
Episode: The Hunting Wives with Malin Akerman
Release Date: July 17, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of Dear Chelsea, Chelsea Handler, alongside co-host Katherine, welcomes actress Malin Akerman to discuss her new Netflix series, "Hunting Wives." The conversation seamlessly weaves through personal anecdotes, professional updates, and listener questions, offering a blend of humor, insight, and heartfelt advice.

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General Banter and Updates (00:02:22 – 04:20)

The episode kicks off with Chelsea and Katherine engaging in light-hearted conversation about Doug's upcoming performances and his experiences in Las Vegas.

• Doug: "The first show sold out, so I added a show. August 21st and 22nd, I will be in West Hampton performing. And then I'm headlining the Rochester Fringe Festival." [03:09]

Katherine shares amusing stories about Doug’s dog, "Doug," highlighting the humorous interactions between them.

• Katherine: "Poor little Luna. She's a little Luna bear." [04:11]

The hosts also touch upon the challenges of pet behavior and Doug's ongoing efforts to prepare his house amidst his busy touring schedule.

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Discussion with Malin Akerman on "Hunting Wives" (08:05 – 28:21)

Introduction to the Guest:

Chelsea introduces Malin Akerman and her new Netflix show, "Hunting Wives," emphasizing the show's intrigue and Malin's enthusiasm.

• Doug: "We have a great guest today, an old friend of mine who is in a new show called Hunting Wives on Netflix." [08:05]

Show Overview:

Malin elaborates on her character, Margo Banks, describing her as a "master manipulator" and likening her to "Lady Macbeth."

• Malin: "Margo Banks... is probably one of the favorite characters that I've ever played. She's living in her own power, taking whatever she wants." [20:00]

Behind the Scenes and Personal Insights:

The conversation delves into the complexities of filming intimate scenes, with Malin discussing the role of intimacy coordinators in ensuring comfort and respect on set.

• Malin: "We have intimacy coordinators... it's very respectful and well organized." [22:34]

Malin shares her journey in embracing female power through her roles, highlighting the importance of women commanding their space and influence.

• Malin: "Women really have this power... it's okay not to use it the way my character does, but it's fun to exercise that power in a role." [28:21]

Chelsea and Malin explore the dynamics of female empowerment compared to male power, underscoring the inherent strengths women possess.

• Doug: "Women really are the powerful ones. We have so much inside of us." [28:50]

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Listener Questions and Advice (37:38 – 61:29)

1. Maintaining Sisterly Bonds Across Distance (37:38 – 41:03)

Listener Question from Jess:

Jess, a twin sister moving from the East Coast to the West Coast, seeks advice on maintaining her bond with her twin sister who is currently in a rut emotionally and lacks self-confidence.

• Jess: "Do you have any tips and tricks on how you keep in touch with your sisters that are in different time zones?" [37:38]

Advice:

Malin shares her experiences with long-distance sibling relationships, emphasizing the importance of regular communication and cherishing time together.

• Malin: "All of my besties are in different countries, we keep in touch all the time." [38:36]

Katherine suggests establishing regular calls to maintain consistency.

• Katherine: "Having a regular call, like with my mom every Friday, makes it a lot more regular." [40:06]

Doug underscores the value of being responsive and making oneself available through various communication platforms.

• Doug: "Make sure that your presence is understood... engage in a way that requires a response." [39:58]

Notable Quote:

• Malin: "Cherish your time together even more when you do see each other." [38:36]

2. Navigating Friendship Incompatibility (42:16 – 50:56)

Listener Question from Lucy:

Lucy grapples with a blossoming friendship that has elements causing her discomfort. Her friend is flamboyant and has a subtle superiority vibe, leading Lucy to question their long-term compatibility.

• Lucy: "How do you tell the difference between being incompatible and being insecure? Is it okay to love someone but not like all of them?" [42:16]

Advice:

Malin encourages open communication, suggesting that Lucy address her feelings diplomatically to understand the root cause of her discomfort.

• Malin: "Address it in a diplomatic, beautiful way that opens a conversation." [44:26]

Doug advises maintaining dignity by not engaging in negative discourse about the friend and focusing on personal boundaries.

• Doug: "There's so much dignity in not getting down with that behavior." [59:51]

Katherine recommends limiting time spent with the friend and utilizing social media tools to manage interactions.

• Katherine: "Using the mute button on Instagram... it's okay." [50:22]

Notable Quote:

• Malin: "Women really have this power... it's important for women to understand that our voices can and should be heard." [28:21]

3. Co-Parenting with a Narcissistic Ex (51:26 – 61:29)

Listener Question from Stu:

Stu, a 32-year-old straight white male, seeks guidance on co-parenting with an ex who exhibits narcissistic traits, causing significant emotional strain and affecting his son.

• Stu: "How do I stay sane and create healthy boundaries for myself for the foreseeable future and beyond in a seemingly impossible situation?" [52:50]

Advice:

Malin draws from her personal experience, advising Stu to minimize interactions with his ex and focus on self-care and providing a stable environment for his son.

• Malin: "Stick to that and have as little amount of contact with her as possible." [53:43]

Doug emphasizes maintaining dignity by not engaging in conflicts and setting a positive example for his son.

• Doug: "There's so much dignity in not getting down with that behavior... show him what the opposite of that looks like." [57:26]

Katherine and Malin discuss strategies to handle negative perceptions from others, recommending avoiding participation in drama and staying consistent in positive behavior.

• Katherine: "It's like a good introspective opportunity to find out what is bothering you about that person." [49:08]

Notable Quotes:

• Malin: "Negotiating with a narcissist is like negotiating with a terrorist." [53:43]

• Doug: "Set an example for your kid to see what the calm is and where the storm is." [60:15]

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Conclusion and Announcements (68:00 – 70:37)

As the episode wraps up, the hosts and Malin Akerman share final thoughts and congratulate Malin on her upcoming Netflix show, set to premiere on July 21st.

• Doug: "Hunting Wives, everybody. Premieres July 21st on Netflix." [67:01]

They also remind listeners to submit their questions to the podcast email and promote their merchandise and sponsor offers.

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Notable Quotes Summary

• Doug on Co-Parenting: "There's so much dignity in not getting down with that behavior." [59:51]

• Malin on Female Power: "Women really have this power... it's important for women to understand that our voices can and should be heard." [28:21]

• Malin on Addressing Issues: "Address it in a diplomatic, beautiful way that opens a conversation." [44:26]

• Malin on Relationships: "Negotiating with a narcissist is like negotiating with a terrorist." [53:43]

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Key Insights and Takeaways

1. Maintaining Long-Distance Relationships: Regular and meaningful communication is essential. Scheduling consistent calls and utilizing technology can bridge the geographical gap.

2. Navigating Friendships with Differences: Embracing friendships that challenge one's comfort zone can lead to personal growth. Open communication about discomfort can clarify compatibility.

3. Co-Parenting with a Narcissist: Minimizing direct contact, maintaining dignity, and focusing on personal well-being are crucial. Setting a positive example for children helps in managing the emotional landscape.

4. Empowerment Through Roles and Relationships: Playing strong, empowered characters can reinforce personal beliefs about female power and influence. Establishing and respecting boundaries in all relationships is vital for personal growth and mental health.

5. Handling Public Perception: Remaining consistent and dignified in behavior can influence how others perceive and respect one’s character, especially in tumultuous situations.

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Conclusion

This episode of Dear Chelsea offers a rich tapestry of discussions ranging from personal anecdotes to profound advice on maintaining meaningful relationships amidst life's challenges. Malin Akerman's insights on her new show and her personal experiences provide valuable perspectives, making it a compelling listen for those seeking both entertainment and guidance.

Transcript

[Chelsea Handler]

This is an I Heart podcast.

[Doug]

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[Katherine]

Hi Chelsea.

[Doug]

It's Thursday and I'm in Los Angeles.

[Katherine]

I'm so happy to have you here finally.

[Doug]

I know Doug has a mountain man here too. Now. I told Felix I Was like, listen, you have to take him to the mountains every morning. So he picks him up and he takes him to Los Montanas. But it's so sad, the dirt. Like, he sends me videos of Doug, and it's just dirt, gray dirt. He went from Whistler, where it's verdant and green and beautiful.

[Katherine]

Snowy.

[Doug]

Yeah, well, it wasn't snowy somewhere, but, like, you know, lakes, and now there's pictures. He sends me a video yesterday. I'm like, is that a coyote? I'm like, is Doug. What does Doug do when he sees a coyote? Nothing. Nothing. He looks at him. I'm like, oh, my God. Oh, my gosh. So, yeah, I'm like, he's living a different lifestyle for sure. Yeah.

[Malin Akerman]

Well, you know what?

[Katherine]

There are new smells here. He's having some variety. Do we love variety?

[Doug]

I mean, I guess we do love variety. I added a new show to my West Hampton show. The first one sold out, so I added a show. August 21st, now and 22nd, I will be in West Hampton performing. And then I'm headlining the Rochester Fringe Festival. And that's in September. And I am doing Napa Valley. And that's on October 3rd. I'm doing Napa Valley, some big winery. So that's going to be beautiful. Yes.

[Katherine]

And of course, we had so much fun at your Vegas show.

[Doug]

Oh, my God. Vegas. That was so fun. That was so fun. We gambled everyone. We did. Well, you didn't win in the minute, but you won and you went to the slots.

[Katherine]

Yeah, I went to the slots. And I, like, put in a $20 bill and I won $115.

[Doug]

I can see you winning at the slots, Kathryn.

[Katherine]

Yeah, I love a penny slot, like an old lady.

[Doug]

I would never waste my time at the slots. Cause that's just like, I need more bang for this weekend. I started. I started betting, like, four or five hundred dollars a round, and it worked. Or a hand, and it was working. So I left with $300 more than I started with.

[Katherine]

I mean, you were brave betting. You were, like, throwing out the money.

[Doug]

Yeah, but I also supplied again, I supplied everybody with their gambling money. And they all lost. Well, no, not everybody lost.

[Chelsea Handler]

No one.

[Doug]

I mean, the bottom line is I never see that money again. But if I walk away with it, it's like I've given away money and I'm walking away with more than I started with. That's a win.

[Katherine]

Yeah, it's a win for everybody. Everyone's happy. And then also, like, people are gambling because there's just like, you know, there's.

[Doug]

A fun energy around gambling.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Katherine]

It was a really good time.

[Malin Akerman]

It was a really good time.

[Doug]

I go to the same table every time after the show. Doug was there. Doug was gambling because he's my Meg King.

[Katherine]

Well, he's your lucky charm.

[Doug]

He's my king.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[Doug]

No, I win without him. He is definitely not my lucky charm. He's definitely not. I'm staying with my friend Kat right now, and she has a little Oompa Loompa dog. I don't know what kind it is, but it's a small one.

[Katherine]

Pomeranian.

[Doug]

Ish. Something fluffy. Not fluffy. Short hair.

[Malin Akerman]

Okay.

[Doug]

I don't know what that type is, but it's not of interest to me. But Doug. It's so funny when they play because Doug is obviously, like 14 times the size of her, and he goes to pick her up, like, with his teeth. Oh, no, it's a chewy. And I'm like, no, no, no, no. That isn't a chew toy. No, like. And he goes and gets it. Like, puts his mouth around your neck. And I'm like, no, no. And then he looks at us like, oh, I'm sorry. Am I not supposed to pick her up like this? It's like, no, you're not her mother.

[Katherine]

Is this not a chew toy?

[Doug]

Yeah, I know. So. Poor little Luna. She's a little Luna bear. Yeah. She's like. I'm like, he's rough stuff. Thank Go. He's not a rapist, though, you know? I mean.

[Katherine]

Yeah, not a humper. We don't want to hump her.

[Doug]

He did try to hump his friend Sally in Canada, but that was, you know, that was okay because she's a friend of mine, and that dog is big and could defend herself.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Doug]

You know what I mean? And she was like, fuck you, Doug.

[Katherine]

But he's, like, fixed and everything, right?

[Doug]

He just pumps the wood. No, I have a dog that's not fixed. I mean, come on. Hello. That's just one more thing that I was. Can't afford to deal with.

[Malin Akerman]

I know, right?

[Katherine]

Yeah. They just do it sometimes.

[Doug]

My friend Kat and I. Well, Kat's a good cook, so she's been cooking for me. Because my house, of course, is still not ready.

[Katherine]

No, of course not.

[Doug]

Of course not. My house is still not ready. Can you fucking believe it? I scheduled my entire European tour and my entire European travels to come home to a house, to a home, and it's still not ready. Oh, speaking of which, Ice, we have a lot of groups to donate to that I aggregated. So let's add those like different organizations you can donate to for families being affected by ice. You could donate to attorneys that are defending these people or you can donate to organizations that are helping feed them and are helping them.

[Katherine]

Legal fees.

[Doug]

Legal fees. And also to help them financially while they're unable to go to work because they're being stalked every single fucking day so that they don't get separated from their family. So it's a good place. There's like five or six donation spots that I found out that are really good to donate to. So let's do that.

[Malin Akerman]

Okay.

[Katherine]

If you want to donate to families who are affected by ICE and immigration issues, here are a few places that you can donate. So one place you can support is the Immigrant Defenders Law center. And we'll put a link in the bio. They're a next generation social justice law firm that defends immigrant communities against injustices. Jail Support la, it's a grassroots collective dedicated to supporting anti repression work in Los Angeles and they provide bail money for protesters in downtown. LA Union Del Barrio is an organization that defends Mexican and Latin American communities. They have been organizing a lot of protests and teach people how to do patrols in the event of a raid. CHIRLA is the Coalition for Human Immigration Rights and empowers immigrants to push policies that promote freedom. Freedom of movement, full human rights, vigorous civic action and strengthens democracy. Buen Vecino is an in person responder training being held on July 25th and it's in Moorpark, California. So if you want to attend that, we'll put a link in the bio.805undocufund provides funds and support for immigrants. Mixteco supports, organizes and empowers the indigenous migrant communities in California's central coast. And these raids, illegal immigration raids, continue to happen. So any support that you guys can provide will be put to good use.

[Doug]

Okay, great. And we have a great guest today, an old friend of mine who is in a new show. And the new show is called Hunting Wives on Netflix. It's not to be confused with Hunting Husbands or Hunting for Husbands. It's Hunting Wives. Try and figure that one out. Please welcome Malin Ackerman. Hi honey. Hi.

[Malin Akerman]

How you doing?

[Doug]

I was just talking about my bunion surgery. I'm getting it July 5th.

[Malin Akerman]

Much fun. So much fun.

[Doug]

I know. I can't wait. I'm excited. I'm actually excited to.

[Malin Akerman]

I'm excited for you.

[Doug]

A month off and just lying around my house, you know what I mean?

[Malin Akerman]

Unfortunately, it won't even be a month. Like, you'll be up, and if you want to, you can be up, but otherwise, just milk it. I milked it for as long as I could, even though I could walk after a week.

[Doug]

And you. You could walk. Wow. Did you do physical therapy after?

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, I did. I did with a. With a trainer and a p. You know, a physical therapist, a pt. But I was in a boot. Obviously, I wasn't walking without a boot and that you're in a boot for a while. But I think we went to Vegas two weeks after my surgery. Cause we'd already booked it. And I just got one of those. One of those little rolly things where you put your knee on it and you, like, roll it.

[Doug]

Oh, God. What? Vegas was intended for that. In Disney World, when people roll around in Disney World. Yeah. All you're missing is a drumstick. Like one of those giant turkey drumsticks. Okay, Malin, first of all, when did I see you last? I saw you at Guy's house, probably, right?

[Malin Akerman]

At Guy's house? Yeah, it was probably 3am in the morning. Dancing on the dance floor. Y. I think I was looking for.

[Doug]

My purse for about four hours at that party.

[Malin Akerman]

Did you ever find it?

[Doug]

I did. It was amazing. It's the story of my life. Some strange person just came up to me, someone who I had never met. Because I was going around the party asking people. I'm like, do you have my assistant's info? Cause I might need to get my driver, and I'm alone. I came with a bunch of people, but everybody had left, and I was still there. And then someone just walked right up to me like some sort of heavenly angel and said, have you been looking for your purse? And I was like, oh, my God.

[Malin Akerman]

Who are you? And do you know who that person is? You have no idea. It was just a lovely human being. That's nice. A good Samaritan in the world. We like that. It was a fun party.

[Doug]

It was. It's always fun, right? Although last year was a little bit too hectic. And I remember talking to Guy. I'm like, don't let anybody into that party. Like, come on.

[Malin Akerman]

I know it gets nuts, but you kind of get lost. Like, you get your little pockets of, like, I'm always on the dance floor. I love to dance. So my husband and I are the same. And so we're always on the dance floor until our feet can't take me. And I feel like you find your little pockets, and all of a sudden you turn around, you're like, oh, I'm doing the shuffle with Miles Teller. And then you turn around, and there's Chelsea falling over the table and having the flesh.

[Doug]

Exactly. That's exactly the kind of impression I want to leave people with. I remember the last time we were hanging out. This was many, many years ago. You had just had your kid. That's how long ago we've spent. It's been since we spent together.

[Malin Akerman]

12 years ago. Yeah.

[Doug]

So you were. I think you got divorced soon after that, and then you met your husband.

[Malin Akerman]

Very soon after that. My real. Like, the real life one. The first one was like a trial run. And then number two, I met him when my son was three. And so he's been in our life since then, which is awesome. Nine years. Crazy.

[Doug]

I think that's crazy that you have a baby with someone and then you become a. And unexpectedly become a single mother.

[Malin Akerman]

That was a little bit of a surprise. You know, life is. You can never plan it, as we all know. We all try to do it, but it just. It was one of those things. And we're good now. Like, he's in our life, and it's. And we're friends and all that, but it was just. When you have kids, you just never know what that's gonna be like, what it's gonna feel like. I know that so many people have so many different reactions. Some people are like, in the movies, we're like, everything's grand and beautiful, but for the most part, it's fucking shocking. And you go through a real emotional rollercoaster bringing a human being home, and you have to take care of it. So I think for both of us, it was just. We. We just prepare properly, and I think it really affected our relationship. And. But who does prepare properly?

[Doug]

Like, I don't know. I mean, it's not like so many people are taking parenting classes before they have a baby, you know?

[Malin Akerman]

No, I know.

[Doug]

And nine months is not enough time to prepare for that kind of invasion.

[Malin Akerman]

No. And I wasn't even. We weren't even preparing. I mean, I was just living life the way it normally was. And then a baby was born. You're like, oh, my God. Jeez, this is. I gotta keep this thing alive and try to keep my relationship sexy. I don't know. How do you do that? I have no idea.

[Doug]

I know. I have no idea at it.

[Malin Akerman]

But number two is a good. Is good. And we decided not to have another kid together because I was like, you know, let's just keep it sexy. And we've got A kid already, and, like, let's have fun. And when he gets old, he's 12 now, you know, a few more years and he's out of the house. And we're gonna travel the world, and we're still gonna keep it sexy. So I know you know a little something about that. Because you decided not to have children, you just kept spontaneous spontaneity part of your life, which is so much fun, and I miss it.

[Doug]

Do you? Your sister introduced you to your husband, right?

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, she did. Good memory. She is now married to the guy who.

[Doug]

She's married to your husband, too? She's.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, we live a polygamous life. It's very cool. You know, a little incestuous, but.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Malin Akerman]

Her husband is also a Brit. And so my husband and her husband were at drama school together. So he would come out for, like, pilot season when they. When there was pilot season, when that existed. And so I met him a couple times, and then we ended up sitting at Hamburger Mary's beside each other for drag queen bingo night. And that's where we fell in love, as you do, because we sat beside each other. And I just realized at that time, like, I'd met him a few times, but I was finally ready, I guess. And he was just so, you know, that British charm and wit. And he was funny and kind of cute, and so, I mean, I still didn't think we were gonna get married. I just thought we'd have a fun little affair. Cause he's seven years younger than me.

[Doug]

Oh. Ooh, I love that.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, it's great. And the nice thing about younger men is that they adore you. He's like, wow, you're my woman. And it feels. You feel like a woman around a younger man. I love it. I'm enjoying this experience. Yeah, I could see that.

[Doug]

I've never dated somebody that was so much younger than me, more than, like, a year or so. So I don't know. But I'm assuming I'm gonna get around to it, because I'm not getting any younger. Like, I'm sure I'm gonna start dating.

[Malin Akerman]

I'll introduce you to a few young boys.

[Doug]

Yeah, I mean, I'd like a little couple of flings, especially with, you know, the energy. Sexual energy that younger men have. I'm more interested in that than having to deal with, you know, men my own age and not naming any names. You DM'd me when I was in Sweden or you were texting me or one of those things, because that's where you're from. You're from Sweden.

[Malin Akerman]

I am, but I was reading your.

[Doug]

Bio, and you also have permanent residency status in Canada.

[Malin Akerman]

So I did that one. I had to give up. When I moved out here, I had a permanent. Cause I was there for 22 years. And when we first moved to Canada, Sweden wouldn't allow dual citizenship. And then when it was finally time for me to move to America, then I could get dual citizenship, but I was going to America. So I was like, I don't need a Canadian passport. I've got my Swedish passport now. I wish I would have done it.

[Doug]

But because I was about to ask you, I'm like, wait, I have a house in Canada and I don't have permanent residence. Yeah, I do. In Whistler. I go, I love ski.

[Malin Akerman]

Of course you do. Yeah.

[Doug]

I ski in the wintertime. And I love. I love Canadians. You know, they're so civilized. They're so nice and normal. It's a nice contrast to what we deal with in America, but a little bit.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Yeah. I was curious about learning. I mean, every. All my conversations lately are basically about how to naturalize in other places. How are you gonna get to become a permanent resident of another place? Back to Sweden. I have, like, a few Swedish people in my life. And when I was in Stockholm for my most recent, I just came from Europe. I was on this European tour.

[Malin Akerman]

It looked amazing. Thank you.

[Doug]

It was amazing. And Stockholm was such a highlight. It was so gorgeous out. We walked probably, like, 15,000 steps that day. We walked and walked and walked and walked. And it was like one of the first days of, you know, what felt like summer. You know, it was in May, but it felt like the first. And the whole place was pumping. And this was, like, how it was when we kept, like, hopping through Europe. We'd land and, like, the sun would be out and we'd be in Copenhagen or Amsterdam or. But Stockholm was such a highlight. And I have a really good girlfriend who lives in Whistler who is Swedish. And then I have another friend that I spent, like, my 20s with that was Swedish. And I have to say, Swedish women, a, are so much fucking fun. And I feel like Swedish culture. Tell me if this is true. Like, women don't care about marriage in the same way that American women care about marriage.

[Malin Akerman]

No, not at all. The whole thing of, like, I don't know, there's that really weird thing where it's like, you have to spend half your yearly salary for the ring. Like, there's all these rules around things. Swedish women are kind of like, take it early. I think it's like the Viking mentality we grew up on versus, you know, I guess America was built on, you know, religion. And so it's. It's a very separate. It feels very logical in Sweden. And I also feel like the women there, for whatever reason, I don't know why or the history of it, but the women in Sweden are the aggressors and they're very independent. And it feels very like. It always feels like women have always been an equal over there. And so you just feel empowered, which is really interesting. And I don't know the reason why, but I do feel like women are just strong and take what they want kind of thing. And I love that about it, you know, and men kind of follow suit and stand in line.

[Doug]

Yeah. I wonder if it does have something to do with the Vikings. I'm gonna have to read a about that.

[Malin Akerman]

I know, me too. I should know my own culture, really.

[Doug]

And I wonder if it's all scale. Like, if it's all that area and Scandinavian cultures too, where women, I mean, obviously, they're like government wise and happy wise. Like, everybody seems a lot happier in that part of the world, Scandinavia in.

[Malin Akerman]

General, when also when you get like a year maternity leave, six months paternity leave, like, everything is. It works like, everything. You pay really high taxes in Stockholm, but they go towards the things that you want them to go towards. Like, you can go to university for free in Sweden and get a really brilliant education, you know, and that's where our tax money goes to. Which I would love to see here. You know, having a kid here, I'm like, wow, it's expensive. Because he can't go to all the public schools. We were lucky to put him in a charter school for the first few years of his life, but now we just switched him over and we're like, wow, it's crazy.

[Doug]

It's crazy that we have to pay for kindergarten. Well, I don't have to pay for anything, but it's crazy that parents have to pay for kindergarten. I mean, we live in a city that is absolutely ridiculous. Watching that rat race and watching people apply to kindergartens and preschools is like.

[Malin Akerman]

Honestly, when I was pregnant, I had a friend of mine, friend of mine's mother, who was like, okay, listen, we need a meeting. And I was like, okay. And she comes over to my place and she goes, listen, you gotta start looking into preschools. You gotta start putting yourself. I'm like, my kid isn't even born. What do you mean? She's like, oh, it's impossible. I'm gonna introduce you to a woman who's gonna get you in. And I was like, okay. I was really freaked out. I didn't know what the fuck was going on. So this woman comes over and she's like, o, I know everybody at every school. I'll help you fill out all the forms. I'll help you. I was like, I feel like I could fill out a form myself. And she goes, and it'll cost $7,000. I just went, mm, I'm good. He'll go to whatever preschool he goes to, and it'll be fine. He'll learn how to count to three, and it'll be great. But it was just. There's this whole gamut here where people scare you into thinking, like, if they don't get into the right preschool, then, you know, they're just never gonna make it in life, which is nuts. It really is coming from Canada, where you're just like. You just go to the schools that you go to, you know, by the.

[Doug]

Way, Canadian colleges are $7,000 for a whole entire year. So you could either get a coach to get you into kindergarten in America, or you could go to college for $7,000 a year. You're a dealer's choice.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, dealer's choice. What are you gonna choose?

[Doug]

I'm into that new Prime Minister of Canada, though, Mark Carney. I like his attitude a lot.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, me too.

[Doug]

Speaking of taking what you want. Okay, let's talk about hunting wives. Because first of all, you are really getting after.

[Malin Akerman]

Did you get to see it?

[Doug]

I saw three episodes. Yes. I watched it while I was getting my roots done yesterday back. I saw you in full action, having lots of action with a variety of different people, and I was like, wow, look at you go.

[Malin Akerman]

Margo Banks, who is the character that I play, as you saw, is probably one of the favorite characters that I've ever played. Talk about, like, living in her own power, right? Just, like, taking whatever she wants. She is master manipulator. She is Lady Macbeth behind the scenes, just with her puppeteering. Super fun to play. You know, all the cast was. It's one of those dream scenarios where everything kind of fell in place. I mean, at first, when I read the script, I then gave it to my husband, and I was like, am I this person? Can I do this? Like, should I do this? Is this crazy? It is nuts. And he read it and he went, oh, my God, Are you kidding me? You have to do this. It's literally his fantasy is this whole show. But yeah, she is something to be reckoned with. But the beauty of it, cause you only saw three episodes. It gets. There's so many twists and turns that are coming your way. By the end, you can't even believe where it's taken you. And that's what the fun part is about it is that, yeah, you can.

[Doug]

See that there's a lot happening and there's a lot that's going to happen. Oh, this is exciting. This is awesome for you.

[Malin Akerman]

All eight episodes get dropped all at the same time on July 25th. So, you know, grab your popcorn and sit for eight hours straight and watch this crazy show.

[Doug]

Yeah. So it's basically. Let's give a synopsis of the show. It's basically this Britney Snow is also in the show and she basically moves, I think from the east coast to East Texas. Is that right?

[Malin Akerman]

That's right. Small little made up town in East Texas where Margo Banks and her husband Jed Banks are basically like the queen bee and the soon to be governor of this little town who's played by Dermot Mulroney. That's right, dreamboat. He's so sweet.

[Doug]

He is a dream vote.

[Malin Akerman]

Oh my God, he's such a good guy.

[Doug]

Let's have a man too chemistry together.

[Malin Akerman]

I love that man.

[Doug]

Yeah, he's a great guy. And it's such a great role for you. I love seeing you in a lead role and being this kind of master puppeteer. Like, I love watching that and I love seeing you shine in that way. So congratulations on that. Thank you.

[Malin Akerman]

It's so much fun. It really is. Like, if you like Big Little Lies and Yellowstone, it's like they have a baby and this is it, you know, so it's salacious and fun and sexy and wild.

[Doug]

Do you get. How do you deal with having sex scenes with different people? Does that. Is that an issue? Like, what do you do to prepare for those?

[Malin Akerman]

Well, the thing is is that, you know, we have intimacy coordinators nowadays, which is a saving grace. I love it so much because you have this person who comes to, you know, if it's me and Brittany having a scene together, she'll talk to us separately and say, all right, what are you guys comfortable with? What do you want to show? What do you not want to show? What are we doing here? And then we come in together and do rehearsals. Just like stunt choreography. She actually used the intimacy coordinator, used to be a stunt choreographer, which is awesome. And she was the best. And so it's like doing choreography, you get it all settled, then you show your director and they sign off on it. So when you go to set that day, you know exactly what you're doing. There are no surprises. Nobody's doing anything different. We both feel comfortable with. With what we're doing now. When I say comfortable, it's still not like, woo, this is going to be great. It's still weird, you know, you're still there with the crew and cameras. It's never what it looks like on screen, is never as intimate as we make it look, but it's very respectful and it's very well organized and directed and taken care of.

[Doug]

So. You know, I once did a movie like, I don't remember what it was even called, and I had to kiss this guy and I was like, I couldn't kiss him. I was like, I can't kiss this person. And the director's like, you just have to kiss him on the lips. Like, it can be short. Like, it just has to look like you're about. Like you're about to start making out. I'm like, I can't do it. Like, I'm not attracted to him. He's like, I know, but this is not real life. You're acting. And I'm like, which is why I'm not an actress. I'm like, I can't make out with a man. And the whole time I just wanted him to be yelling, cut. Before he yelled it. Like the whole time I was like, please. I had such a childish reaction to having to act in a romantic setting where it wasn't really attracted to him. So do you ever have the. Those types of feelings where you're like, I. I want this to be over.

[Malin Akerman]

I think I've suppressed it so far down. It's been so long doing it for so long that you just pull up your bootstraps and go. But no, you know, I gotta be honest, there hasn't been. I haven't. I've had. I had one once, I gotta say, and this was in the very beginning of my career, before I even came out to Hollywood. And I had to do a K. Like a kiss with a guy. It was nothing. Like, it wasn't even a makeout thing. But he, there was, he was one of those, like, off camera. Just wasn't a nice guy, like, wasn't a great guy. So I just didn't like him very much. And not only that, but he decided to eat tzatziki, which has tons of garlic in it, right at lunch, right before our scene. So not only did I not like him. He smelt like garlic and I had to kiss him. And I was like, ugh. Everything about. And that was very early on in my career, so I didn't know how to handle it. But yes, that was one moment where I was like, no, please, just cold cut. But otherwise it was. I've had a beautiful experience and most of the people that I've worked with, I've just really enjoyed. And it's been you kind of, when you're in that character, you go into it and you feel like that character. And of course, once they call cut, you feel silly and awkward and you're like, hey, how's your wife? Everything good at home? Great. It is a very strange thing. And if you're not in the acting world and you don't do it, I can understand people on the outside going, wow, how do you do that? But I guess you get used to it. I guess you do it in character.

[Doug]

Well, yeah, I guess, right? You would do it in character. But do you feel a sense of, like, you must feel a sense of responsibility to make the other actor, whether it's a woman or a man or anything in between, do you feel responsible for making the other person feel comfortable?

[Malin Akerman]

100%. And I think both, both parties, and that's been, in my experience 99% of the time, is that both parties, myself and the other party, are just super respectful and considerate. And you know, as soon as they call cut, it's like, hey, are you okay? Are you good? You know, I have some scenes with George Ferrier in this show and he plays a 19 year old boy, but he's in his early 20s and we have a relationship that's of a sexual nature. And of course, everything was treated just as it would with the intimacy court. It was beautiful. It was lovely. Respectful. But after every shot, I would be like, I felt like a mother to him. I was like, are you okay? Do you need some water? Do you need some, like, can I get you anything? I'm sorry. Or you're welcome. I don't know what to say right now, but it was just really to say that, like, it. It's just been a lovely experience. And yes, you. I think everyone is super considerate in those situations.

[Doug]

There's a great shot of you pulling up on a jet Ski. First of all, your wardrobe is awesome because your body. Yeah, I mean, I hate to comment on women's bodies, but your body's just ridiculous. And your legs go on for miles and miles and miles. And you should always Just be in a bathing suit, because you should be showing that body off. But she pulls up on. On this beach to pick up Britney. And it's so funny because it's just like, you know, you're on the hunt, basically.

[Malin Akerman]

It's like a Baywatch moment.

[Doug]

Yes, totally. It's totally like a Baywatch moment. And. But, yeah, I just like seeing you kind of command a show. It's very nice to see that.

[Malin Akerman]

I'm definitely enjoying it. And I have to say, you know, I.

[Doug]

You've earned that.

[Malin Akerman]

Thank you. I feel like I've earned it, too. But I also feel like this character, I love sitting in the power of what it is sometimes to be female and what it is to use that and weld that power. Not that I would ever use it the way she does, but it's fun to play that. Cause you go, women really have this power. Not that it should be used in this way, but, wow, is it ever fun to exercise that in a role. And it is really just juicy. And I felt the same about my role in Billions, where she was just this powerful character. And I loved women in power like that. Whether they're using it for good or bad, it's just fun to play.

[Doug]

It's also fun to examine that because men. Men can be so powerful with almost no power, you know, like, they don't really have any real power necessarily. And they. And they present as they do just because of the nature of society and, you know, the way things have shaken out thus far. But women really are the powerful ones. Like, we have so much inside of. Of us. So whenever there are people that call into the podcast, which you'll experience shortly, like, there's so many women who are unaware of the power that lies within them.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[Doug]

And totally, it's our job as women who are more mature and have. Have the wisdom and experience to know that it's. It's so important to inject women with that vibe 100%, you know, to make sure everyone knows how powerful you are. Like, yeah, like, I. I was with. I was with this young couple yesterday doing something, and we were filming something, and they were just so traditional, right. And they were, like, talking about getting married, and they were. I was in their apartment in New York City, and they were so young, and they were both adorable and sweet and kind of innocent, but they weren't even 30. And she was just. I just could tell, like, oh, this girl really wants to marry this guy, and he wants to marry. And they think, this is it. It. And, you know, it probably or may will be maybe. Who knows? But also, why. Why is it necessary to, you know, especially? I mean, I'm. You know that. Because you've been through, you know, a first marriage. But I want women to know, like, life just keeps getting better and better as you get older. And the more wisdom we acquire, the sexier life becomes and the more, like, possibilities and, like, don't limit your possibilities for the world.

[Malin Akerman]

100. And that, you know, Chelsea, that's why I love you so much. And what you put out there in the world in your comedy and your voice, you just. It shows women that you can. You can be vocal and you can be out there and you can be confident and you can do whatever the fuck you want, like skiing in a bikini, because we can. But I just think that it is so important for women to understand that our voices can and should be heard. And it's okay. Not every. I had to go through a lot of work of. I was. I still am. It's still in me. I'm a people pleaser. But I realized that people pleasing is actually just a way to control other people. So it's not a really nice thing. It's just I need to control their emotions so that they don't make me feel a certain way. So instead, I had to start learning how to say no and standing up for myself and being okay with the fact that some people might think that I'm a bitch or some people might think that whatever they want to think. But I have to align myself with what's true to me and how I feel. And the same goes with relationships. Like, when I met my husband, I was like, I'm not a finished product yet. You know, I just went through a divorce. I just had a kid. Like, I don't really know who I am right now. So who you're getting right now is not who I'm gonna be in 10 years from now. So if you wanna enter into this as a relationship, cool. It may or may not work, but we can give it our best shot. And that's fun and that's great. Now he happens to be the best partner ever, which I didn't expect. I really thought he was just gonna be a little romp in the sack. And then he's going back to England. But it didn't turn out that way. He still. But I think it's really important and it's really hard and it's a really long journey. And I feel like I'm only stepping into myself in my 40s, you know and who I want to be and understanding myself and being confident enough to take those steps to living more authentically to who I am and whoever doesn't want to be part of that just isn't going to be in my life. And that's okay, right?

[Doug]

And that the stage of your life that you're in when you meet somebody is not a fixed state. Like, you're not going to be that way forever. None of us are. We're always evolving or devolving or sometimes you go through a rough patch and you know you're not at your best. And that can happen at any time in your life. Even when you feel like you've gotten all figured out, then something can, like, you know, kind of throw you, and you're like, oh, shit, this isn't me operating on my A self. But that's okay. Like, to give yourself the grace that, okay, this is a rough patch. I'm gonna get through it. Because I've gotten through everything else that has come my way in my life. And this is just another something I didn't expect, as you said when we started talking today, that you can't really plan your life. So when I see these young people planning their futures, and I've got to marry this by this age, and I want to have this many kids by this age, I'm like, oh, God, throw that owl out the window. You can have your kids and you can have your husband, but it doesn't have to be these little tent poles in this order and arranged by.

[Malin Akerman]

And I feel like that sets you up for disappointment instead of just going, let's see what happens.

[Doug]

Okay, we'll take a break, and we'll be right back with Malin Akerman. Let me switch gears for a second and talk about one of our favorite sponsors, vital proteins. They're the number one brand of collagen peptides in the U.S. if you're wondering what collagen peptides are, they're essentially the key to maintaining a youthful glow. After 30, your body's natural collagen production starts to dip. And that can lead to lines, saggy skin, and joints that don't move like they used to. In other words, looking older. But vital proteins helps fill that gap. A daily serving keeps your skin healthy, hydrated, and elastic. It even supports your hair and nails. And because it's unflavored, you can mix it with anything. So your smoothie supports your skin, your coffee helps your skin, and your chocolate milkshake keeps your hair looking. Looking thick. Go ahead and get some vital proteins. You can get 20% off by visiting vitalproteins.com and entering promo code Chelsea at checkout. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Fragrance should feel personal and with Pura, it does. Their smart diffusers let you scent your space with premium clean fragrance you control from the app. Whether you're scenting for summer with PURA 4 or upgrading to the new PURA plus, it is the perfect way to refresh your home. Pura life is better when it smells good. I couldn't agree more. Head to pura.com and use code Chelsea for 20% off sitewide.

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[Doug]

And we're back with Malin. What's your husband's name?

[Malin Akerman]

Jack. Jack Domily.

[Doug]

Oh yeah. I love British guys.

[Malin Akerman]

Very British.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Malin Akerman]

Well, we'll find you a young one. A young girl.

[Doug]

I know, I know. Yes.

[Malin Akerman]

Next up, put the word out.

[Doug]

I like that one. That's usually where I have most of my hookups is London.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah. Because they're super fun and like just a blast, you know.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Malin Akerman]

I'll ask my husband if he has any real good ones that are single.

[Doug]

Okay. Please do. Please do. Catherine, what do we have in store for us?

[Katherine]

Well, we can start with an easy one. So Jessica says, Dear Chelsea, I'm a twin sister and my mom and aunt are also twins. My mom is one of nine and has six sisters. All that to say sisterhood is a huge value I hold and has always been a major part of my life due to work, which is a good thing and an opportunity I'm elated for. I'm going to be moving to the west side, west coast from the east coast, and my big question is about my twin sister. She's had some recent challenges in her life and I'm so worried about, quote, abandoning her or feeling like I'm moving on without her across the country. She's also a badass and is in no way in trouble like where she's reliant on me. However, emotionally and with her self confidence, she's in a rut right now. I'm wondering if you have any tips and tricks on how you keep in touch with your sisters that are in different time zones than you and also how to help them grow and navigate the challenges they might be facing while you aren't there physically. Finally, one last question is whether you prioritize certain events to be there in person with them versus those you're okay with not being physically there for. Kind regards, Jess.

[Doug]

Well, how many sisters do you have? Malin?

[Malin Akerman]

I have two half sisters and one half brother, so. And they're all over the place. I mean, we grew up in different countries. They grew up in Sweden, My brother and I grew up in Canada and I moved out here when I was 22. So I've only experienced long distance relationships with my siblings. And if anything, I think you cherish your time together even more when you do see each other. And I think with all the technology that we have nowadays, I mean, all of my besties are, some are in Costa Rica, some are in Canada, some are in Sweden. We keep in touch all the time. And when you get together, it's like no time has passed. I think the people that you're closest to, you work it out, it works itself out. And yet, yes, I think you should go and be there for milestones and big events and whatnot and, you know, make time for that. But it sounds like this woman is saying, you know, her sister's a badass and she's gonna figure it out. You can be there from a distance. Time zone is Just three hours difference. It's not that bad.

[Doug]

I don't feel like any sort of distance is prohibitive to maintaining a relationship with somebody that you care about deeply, especially your sisters. There's texting, there's FaceTime, there's Zooms. You can like, schedule calls, you can text and say, want to hop on the phone. You can FaceTime, you can do all those things and just make sure that your presence is known and available, that you're making yourself available. I think that's the most important thing for any relationship that you care about is that you're, you know, when, when you hear from your sister that you're responsive, that you get back to her in a nice fashion. Not like, I hate when this doesn't happen to me and my sisters or siblings, but like, you know, if someone texts you, you should text them back that day. I'm really good on text. I'm less good on email. You know, like, text is more immediate to me. But there are some people who don't text back for fucking four or five days. And I'm like, what kind of app do you like? How does that show up on your phone? But I think especially if you're worried about somebody, you just make sure that your presence is understood for the other person and make sure that you're checking in, going, you know, hey, what's up? And asking questions that lead somewhere rather than going, how are you? How's it going? What it, like, more specific, like, what did you do today? Who were you? You know, did you have a good weekend? Did you do anything fun? Like, I don't know, just like, try to engage in a way that requires a response. So you can kind of measure how your sister is doing rather than just checking in in a kind of banal way.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, exactly. Open ended questions that let her kind of figure it out on her own, but you're there holding the space, I think is really important.

[Katherine]

Yeah, something that's helpful for me too is like having a regular call. So it's like with my mom every Friday we know what time we're talking and like sometimes it has to move by a day or we skip a week or whatever. But having that time on the calendar, just so we know, like, it, it makes it a lot more regular than.

[Malin Akerman]

Just, yeah, that's a good idea. Yeah.

[Doug]

I mean, it really depends on your personality type. Like, I would never stick to something like that. But I think that's a great idea. If you're, if you are organized and your sister's organized, then that's great.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Malin Akerman]

It's nice to have something to look forward to as well.

[Doug]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, totally. Especially you can also put it on you, like, I'm moving away. I'm going to miss you. You know, like, don't make it about checking in on her. You make it. Present it as, like, I hate being this far away from you or I need to make sure we have a check in for my sanity.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah. And I don't know if you guys ever did this during COVID but, like, you do the zooms, where you, like, happy hour zooms, and you bring. You grab your cocktail and you sit and have happy hour together. You can do that from afar. You can do so many things with technology nowadays.

[Doug]

Those are the only kind of zooms I. Even if the other people on the zooms weren't having happy hour, even if it was a work call, I was drinking, like, okay. Yeah. I'm like. And that means everyone needs to start drinking.

[Katherine]

Well, our next question comes from Lucy. She says, dear Chelsea, I've recently become close friends with someone. And while our friendship sparked quickly, I'm now questioning if we're truly compatible or if I'm just being a hater. She's fiery, outspoken, and unapologetically flashy. Think bold designer fits and luxury, everything. I, on the other hand, lean more toward quiet luxury and a calmer energy. We share a meaningful bond. We both grew up in fairly turbulent homes, and we've both worked hard to break out of that. So there's a sisterhood there. But sometimes I find her behavior grading. There's a subtle superiority vibe that creeps in, and it stirs something competitive in me that I don't like love. I pride myself on being grounded and accepting, but this dynamic has me questioning whether I'm being too judgmental or if deep down, we're just not bestie material long term. So my question is, how do you tell the difference between being incompatible and being insecure? Is it okay to love someone but not like, all of them? Respectfully, Lucy.

[Doug]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, this is a hard lesson to learn for me. I know, because I. I want everyone to be, like, 100% of the things I like. I don't like the negative, but that doesn't happen in life. Like, everyone's gonna have the thing that grates you on your nerves when you spend too much time with somebody or enough time with somebody. And you don't have to, like, diagnose the relationship to be the best friend that you'll ever have in your Life like a friendship is give and take. The fact that she's so much different than you is, is a good thing. Like, that's exciting. Like that's a good way for you to be less narrow minded. You know, if we just become friends with people who are like us, then we're not really learning that much and we're not, we're actually being very judgmental. So I think it's always a good exercise to be friends with people that kind of take you out of your comfort zone. And then when you are feeling judgmental, something I do is like, why do I feel judgmental right now? What is it about this behavior that is making me act like this? Because I don't wanna be judgmental, I wanna be open minded, you know, or if somebody's grating on my nerves, that's usually something about yourself rather than something about the other person. Because you should, shouldn't, somebody shouldn't annoy you that much that you're friends with. Like, you don't need to spend that much time with them if they're kind of annoying. Does that, does that add up to you?

[Chelsea Handler]

Totally, totally. I, yeah, I think it's, it's definitely this difficulty, right. Of like, it's a harsh world. Like being, being human is very difficult. So I'm, I'm super receptive and open.

[Malin Akerman]

To the fact that we have so.

[Chelsea Handler]

Many different ways of going through life and, and it's such a layered experience.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

It's obviously insecurity. Is there a little incompatibility in the sense of maybe we don't need to be super close? Is this a loose acquaintance? Do you have these people in your life?

[Doug]

Yeah, definitely.

[Malin Akerman]

I think so. Absolutely. I think. You know, I read a book that John Cleese and his therapist wrote because I was studying psychology in school. I thought that was gonna be my path. And I remember it so vividly because what I loved about it was in relationships, any relationship, romantic or friendship, you get attracted to people that have these, you know, you have these sliding doors that are, you know, the mosquito net doors. Right. And behind those doors are things about yourself that you haven't shared or that are maybe subconscious or like the DNA and the fiber of who you are and the other person has the same thing. And you get attracted to somebody because of the things that are behind those doors. And then when they start come out, it's because you're meant to share those things and learn from them and grow from them. And growth can be uncomfortable. So this can, might be one of Those situations where there's stuff that's getting stirred up from behind those doors for you and it's uncomfortable, but maybe you've met this person that you have to face those things and look at them. And like Chelsea said, like, why am I feeling this way? And what about vocalizing it and saying, hey, you know, sometimes when you do this, it makes me feel like this. The onus is on me right now, and I'm just trying to figure myself out. But I just wanted to let you know, maybe we could have a conversation about it. Maybe, I don't know, you know, what's in it for you to lose, really? I did that with my husband when I first met him, and I was like, this is how I'm feeling. These are the things that I'm afraid of. And I'm gonna tell you a few things, and if you leave and walk away because you think that's terrible, then leave and walk away. And I guess I'm gonna have to take that. But I need to be honest now and start speaking from an honest place. So if you're feeling uncomfortable in situations or she does something that feels weird, address it in a diplomatic, beautiful way that opens a conversation, maybe.

[Doug]

What's an example of something that she does that gives you kind of like cringe feelings?

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chelsea Handler]

I was thinking about this. There's definitely this social media element to it, all, right?

[Doug]

Because it was just the physical experience.

[Chelsea Handler]

Of us hanging out. It's more subdued. But on social media, I think I just have like this status signaling fatigue and. And, you know, in this day and age of influencers, of course, it's usually more like indirect. And they're trying to. It's a little more modest, humble, you know, whatever. And so I kind of am like, okay, go you for my friend. Because she's a little more just like direct. Like, this is how it is. I'm excited about this. Also rubs me the wrong way, but I think it's a general fatigue, though. But I will give one example. So they recently got a little boat, and in the post, she's steering the boat with big old ring left. But I know she's right handed, you know, so I'm like, are you steering that boat with your left hand?

[Doug]

Right, right.

[Chelsea Handler]

I hear, you know, just silly little things like that where it's. It's not as though it's a massive deal. It just puts me off a little bit.

[Doug]

I think that's a fair thing to say to someone, don't you, Malin? And, like, I think that Is because that is kind of not true. She's presenting something that's, you know, and it's very showy. And while you can accept that as a part of her personality that she's showy, like, you have to understand that's who she is. But there is something about, like, presenting something that's not true. But, I mean, I wouldn't pick that example because it can be. That's pretty, like, granular. You can say to someone. It makes me uncomfortable how showy you can be. You can say that, go, that's me. That's me. Personally, I don't wanna prohibit your behavior, but it just doesn't make me feel. It makes me feel weird. Like, it's hard for me to watch a little bit. Like, that can come up organically at some point. But you also don't have to label exactly what type of friend this person is to you. Like, when you said, like, is this a loose associate or is this my best friend? You are, like, kind of declaring what something is while it's happening, and then you're, like, missing the whole moment anyway. And I've been there. I understand what that is. You're like, oh, how much. How much of this person can I take? And that's up for you to decide. But you can also have more fun within the moment and be like, oh, my God, this is fun to hang out with a person. I would never act like this. I have a lot of friends that I would. That I'm like, oh, my God, I would never act like. And half of my friends think that about me. So I think that that's like a good reminder. You know what I mean? Cause I'm sure there's things that you do that probably maybe rub her the wrong way and she's able to look beyond them, or maybe there isn't anything that you do that rubs her the wrong way. But, like, I would just pick and choose your moments. And also, it's an interesting experiment to find out when you get annoyed with someone and when somebody starts to grate on your nerves.

[Malin Akerman]

It's very, very.

[Doug]

It's like a nice introspective opportunity to find out what it is that is bothering you about that person. What. Why does this bother me? Like, what's underneath that?

[Chelsea Handler]

Yeah, no, and I. I appreciate that so much. I. I guess that is, like, ultimately what I'm trying to articulate. I feel like I'm fairly accepting, but. But this has thrown a spanner in the works a little bit. But you're. You're Totally.

[Katherine]

Right?

[Chelsea Handler]

And I think as we get older, too, like, I'm getting into a phase of life where it's harder to make friends. It's a little more difficult.

[Doug]

Have you thought about taking up hunting? Malin can coach you on how to hunt on her new show, Hunting Wives.

[Malin Akerman]

I can hunt fake wild boar. If you want, we can go hunting together, you know, with blanks. It's gonna be super fun. But I do make a mean margarita, so, you know, okay, then I'm in. I miss. I do think you go and enjoy the flash and the luxury. Dip in and dip out as much as you want. And then. And then you'll see, over time, if you need to shave the fat. And you're like, no, not a good friend. Maybe a great friend, but very different. And just limit the time and get.

[Katherine]

Very acquainted with that mute button on Instagram. Like, there are people I love in real life, and I cannot tolerate their social media presence. And that's okay.

[Doug]

It's a different thing. But it's also, like, if someone is also filming the whole time you're with them, you have every right to go, can you please, like, cool it? Like, let's not. We're not. You know, I'm here to spend time with you. Like, that's totally justifiable.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, I don't.

[Doug]

If somebody's constantly filming you or, you know, wanting to film themselves, then they're not being present at all. So that. That is something you can say. And that's not being judgy. That's being wanting real time. Plus, you don't know how many people you're going to meet through this woman. She sounds, like, very social, and she'll probably introduce you to a lot more people who probably feel the same way about her that you do. So then you'll have people. Then you can really start talking about her with some other friends. So you have that to look forward to. So many bonuses.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, it sounds like fun, Lucy.

[Doug]

Just don't put so much pressure on it. Like, it's not a romantic relationship, and we shouldn't be putting so much pressure on our relationships. Just have fun and clock yourself when you're being judgmental. Take it in.

[Chelsea Handler]

I appreciate that.

[Doug]

Yeah. All right. Thanks, Lucy.

[Chelsea Handler]

Thank you. Take care.

[Malin Akerman]

Good luck. Bye.

[Katherine]

Well, our next question comes from Stu. He's 32 and says, Dear Chelsea, straight white male, father and lover of the podcast, writing in, what straight man is.

[Doug]

Listening to this podcast? We should get a support group for straight men who listen to this podcast. Cause there's only Gotta be like less than 10, right?

[Malin Akerman]

It should be a celebration for these men.

[Doug]

He's cute.

[Malin Akerman]

Look at him.

[Doug]

Hey. Love it.

[Katherine]

So he says. I've been meaning to reach out for a while now, and I'm glad I finally am. My partner, Hannah was featured on one of your episodes about a year ago. Everything is amazing between us, and she's not the subject of my plea for advice. I have an almost 5 year old son with my ex who I dated on and off for about seven years prior to meeting my current partner. I left for good about three years ago. It was a tumultuous relationship between us from the beginning, and with the help of my friends, I was finally able to break the cycle. I had four separate apartments during our various breaks and broke all of the leases to move back in with her each time into a house that I built for her. Regardless, things are better than ever at the moment, but she still needs to be in my life. With lawyers and multiple mediations, we were able to come to a somewhat copacetic parenting agreement. However, the reality is anything but pleasant. My dilemma is basically how do I shift my perspective for the next 18 years to probably the rest of my life of having to deal with this person who's caused me so much trauma and deep, deep pain? How do I co parent with someone who's unable to communicate rationally? A person who exhibits all the classic narcissistic qualities? We can barely communicate. So the court suggested a parenting app, and that's what we rely on. Currently, being face to face is extremely challenging as she consistently initiates volatile arguments in front of our young son. Regardless of what I say or do, I feel that I'm doing the work on myself to be able to move past this and create a future of my dreams with my current partner. But what happens when you're bound to a person like this for the rest of your life? In a nutshell, how do I stay sane and create healthy boundaries for my myself for the foreseeable future and beyond in a seemingly impossible situation? Best, Stu.

[Doug]

Hi, Stu.

[Malin Akerman]

Hi, Stu.

[Doug]

Hello. Hi. This is our special guest, Malin Ackerman.

[Malin Akerman]

Hi. How you doing?

[G]

Good. Nice to meet you.

[Malin Akerman]

Nice to meet you too. She's divorced. Why don't you start since you have.

[Doug]

Some co parenting experience?

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah. My husband and I, we were together 11 years. We separated when my son was four months old and only spoke through lawyers. It was similar kind of thing.

[Katherine]

Thing.

[Malin Akerman]

I understand narcissistic people more than anyone you would know, but it's definitely they are a Narcissist is impossible to negotiate with. It's like negotiating with a terrorist. So there's. You're just never gonna. Just don't ever hope that this person is gonna come around to anything. But you can absolutely shape your own life the way you want to. It sounds like you're already on the path for that, where you're taking really good care of yourself and you're doing your own self work and you've got a supportive partner. It sounds like you guys can be a loving home for your son. There's gonna be bumps in the road and you're never gonna be able to protect your son from the world or life or her or whatever she wants to be saying or doing. But as he grows up, my son is now 12 years old. The questions start to come and they see things. They're very smart and they're very bright and they take things in and they understand what's happening. But unfortunately, I wish I knew about this parenting app where you could just go on an app and decide everything. That sounds amazing. I think stick to that and have as little amount of contact with her as possible and just do the kind of drop off and handoff of your son and just be there for him, really, and for your partner. Just take care of yourselves. But there's not much you can do when you're dealing with a narcissist. And maybe over time it'll start to dissipate. The anger might start to dissipate and the, you know, ferocity. But it sounds like you're on the right path, at least. I don't know. Chelsea, what do you have to say?

[Doug]

I have some experience with this too, surprisingly, dealing with someone who behaves in that way, who creates tons of chaos and then takes absolutely no accountability for it. And they have children and, you know, and they're in my life. And so I totally understand what you're saying. And I think what I would say is there's so much dignity in not getting down with that behavior. Like, there's so much dignity in remaining separate and never bad mouthing that person and never. Not to your child anyway. Obviously, you can go off on her all you want to your friends and family, but. And you need to, you know, but the app is amazing. I didn't know there was something like that, but I think there's so much dignity in not getting into the muck of it and mired in it with your child that once you have like a few years, and I'm not saying that you have, but I Think that in it of itself is an honorable thing and an honorable way to react with somebody who's unstable and narcissistic and creates chaos wherever they go. And it's kind of like you're setting an example for your kid to see what the calm is and where the storm is. Right. And so if you're always reliable and you're always dependable and you're always calm because a storm can't fight by itself, it just fizzles out. So as long as you, you're keep the engagement to the bare, bare, bare, bare minimum, she's gonna find somebody else to argue and fight with and, you know, hopefully that will occupy her time as soon as she, like, loses the energy that she gets from you. And I'm sure you've already done most of this, but I would say, like, just continuing through it in a dignified way and holding your son's mental health in such a high place, like that's more important than anything, is to know and exemplify the kind of behavior that you want him to attach to rather than to that behavior, you know, so that there's a contrast and he can see, oh, this person's stable, this person's reliable, this person does what they say, this person is dependable. And then there's this. So he's going to figure it out because everyone does. But it's definitely not your job to paint the picture for him. It's your job to just show him, him what the opposite of that looks like. Yeah.

[G]

And that's kind of the only thing that's kept me sane in this whole thing, honestly, is just anchoring down and really doing that myself. I thought she would change when I started dating her, and clearly, you know, that was my bad and I've learned to not. And I don't see it happening anytime in the future. But one of the main kind of issues that we're having at the moment is that obviously he's in a lot of school and summer camps now and everything, and, and she's kind of been bad mouthing me to all the other parents and the teachers and more or less putting everything on me, which I, you know, if she wants to do that, go ahead, have fun. It's clear when you meet me in person that that is not who I am. But I just, you know, it, it kind. It paints a bad picture of me and people look at me differently when I come to pick on my son. And, you know, they treat me differently. And how would, how should I deal with that? Because that is not fun.

[Malin Akerman]

But that's on them. I mean, that's crazy to me that people will just take one side of the story. You know what I mean? I. I feel like that. Then who are these people? Do you really care what they think? Do you really care?

[G]

That's a great point.

[Malin Akerman]

Like, there are two sides to every story. And if they're not willing to hear both sides, then be gone with them. You don't need them.

[Doug]

But also, I would argue they don't even need to hear your side. Because there's one person spitting tails and then there's you that's acting normal and going to pick up your son and being polite and pleasant and engaging to whomever you can. You don't have to go and convince them that you're the good guy. They're gonna figure it out too. Everybody. The person I'm talking about, everybody knows that this person's off their rocker. Everybody knows. I didn't have to tell anybody. Most people figured it out on their own. So that's another song and dance that you can just eliminate. Like, you don't have to participate in that. All you have to do is be a great dad to your kids. It doesn't matter what these people think of you in the moment. They're all gonna figure the same shit out too. And for the other people that wanna glom onto the drama of the story, there are people that create drama wherever they go, and people get tired of it. People don't wanna be involved in other people's drama endlessly. It sounds fun in the beginning sometimes, but it doesn't go on like that. So I would say it's the same advice I would give you with regard to dealing with her directly. And, like, just act in a dignified way, like you are dignified. You're doing the right thing. And just be consistent about all of your behavior. And then there. Then it's just the writings on the wall. It's just obvious to everybody. And it doesn't necessarily happen when you want to. I know you want to, like, defend yourself, but don't. There's nothing to defend.

[G]

It has to crash and burn. In my opinion, that's the only inevitable outcome is that eventually it's just gonna. She's gonna do this until she doesn't have any friends left or people obviously see it.

[Malin Akerman]

Absolutely.

[Doug]

She'll go through a million friends. That's what she'll do. She'll go through a million people.

[Malin Akerman]

Narcissists burn their bridges wherever they go, and it just happens and if you're like Chelsea saying, this is the best advice, just be consistent and be dignified, and people will see it over time. That's it.

[Doug]

Yeah. And there's no reason to badmouth her to anybody. Even if you become friends with any of those parents, like, all you have to. You just have to give the look like, I don't want to go there. I'm not interested in participating in that kind of conversation. You know what I mean? Be above it, because that is respectable behavior. And when people see that, they're like, oh, okay, there's the normal.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[G]

And it sets us more apart, too. Exactly. Like you said.

[Doug]

Yeah. So it's kind of like taking that attitude with you in every. For the big stuff and the small stuff, you know, you just have to have that attitude. And, like, it's like every morning you have to meditate for 20 minutes. Like, I will not react to her today. I will not get involved in this drama today and do that. And before you know it, then that becomes your. Your. Your second skin. And I mean, you. You sound like you have your shit together anyway, and you've done the. The hardest stuff is behind. But I can understand how challenging it would be to think of leading this life. I mean, she's gonna start terrorizing another man at some point anyway, so, you.

[G]

Know, she's been through a few, so let's hope one sticks.

[Malin Akerman]

See ya. There you go.

[Doug]

Yeah, well. But thanks for calling in. We're so excited to have a straight male caller. I can't even tell you.

[G]

It'll happen more, for sure.

[Doug]

Good stuff. Here. Thanks. Okay, well, take care. Cheers.

[G]

Thank you so much.

[Doug]

Bye. Bye.

[G]

Bye.

[Doug]

That was sweet.

[Katherine]

I know.

[Malin Akerman]

That is.

[Doug]

There's so many. See, there are such good guys out there. That's sweet. And you know, those people like that, though, that are so crazy. You know, you talk about narcissists and then everything comes up on your phone, and it's like, a narcissist will do this. A narcissist will do this. A narcissist. And somebody said to me, I was with this guy I dated. I was in Barcelona when I did this European tour, and we were talking about narcissism. Went to dinner before, and he's an old ex, and he was like, I'm. I was working with a psychiatrist, and he has this philosophy that, you know, every child is a narcissist. Every child is a narcissist because they have to learn how to get attention and they have to smile and they have to be funny. Or they have to create drama or they have to get attention. And I was like, I don't think that's the right depiction. I go, not every child is a narcissist. He goes, no, every person is a narcissist. And I was like, that's not true either. That's just simply not true. And he's like, well, you're a narcissist. And I said, I don't have a problem with you calling me a narcissist because I don't struggle with that identity. Like, I. I'm not worried about me being a narcissist, so you can call me that. And if you think that that's okay. My opinion of me is more important than anyone else's anyway. But like, a narcissist. If you call a narcissist a narcissist, they will argue with you about it until the fucking sun goes down. You know what I mean? And they. And. And they get. They get mired in details that have nothing to do with. With the actual basis of the argument or the conversation. They will talk about the color of the sky and disagree with this, and then we'll focus on this. And, like, narcissists are so toxic to be around, and they exhaust everyone around them, and they will never say they're sorry about any of their behavior ever.

[Malin Akerman]

Absolutely. They'll justify it till the cows come home. It's incredible. And it's sad, I'm telling you. It's like talking to. It's like trying to negotiate with terrorists like, we're never gonna win this fight, so.

[Doug]

Oh, yeah. Yeah. And. And the. And the only peace that you get is when you stop communicating with that person.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah.

[Katherine]

Well, stop trying to change them and, like, stop trying to have those fights. When you start picking no battles, it's like, oh, okay. It's, like, such a relief.

[Doug]

Yeah. Then they have to go elsewhere for their drama, and they can't find it there. So, like, it's. It's just always better. And. And, you know, obviously, when you share a child with somebody, it's not that easy to just walk away from somebody and not communicate with. With them. But this parenting app sounds fucking awesome. I'd like to have an app to handle a lot of my relationships.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, me too. That'd be great.

[Doug]

Okay, we'll be right back with Malin Ackerman. Let me switch gears for a second and talk about one of our favorite sponsors, vital proteins. They're the number one brand of collagen peptides in the us. If you're wondering what collagen peptides are, are they're essentially the key to maintaining a youthful glow. After 30, your body's natural collagen production starts to dip, and that can lead to lines, saggy skin, and joints that don't move like they used to. In other words, looking older but vital proteins helps fill that gap. A daily serving keeps your skin healthy, hydrated and elastic. It even supports your hair and nails. And because it's unflavored, you can mix it it with anything. So your smoothie supports your skin, your coffee helps your skin, and your chocolate milkshake keeps your hair looking thick. Go ahead and get some vital proteins. You can get 20% off by visiting vitalproteins.com and entering promo code Chelsea at checkout. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Do you want a home that smells as good as it looks? With Pura, you can customize your scent experience right from your phone. Choose from premium long lasting fragrances and let Pura plus and Pura4 elevate your space. It's scenting made smart just in time for summer. Pura Life is better when it smells good. Head to pura.com and use code Chelsea for 20% off sitewide.

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[Doug]

And we're back to wrap things up with Malin Ackerman. Okay, we're very excited. Her show debuts on July 21st.

[Malin Akerman]

Is that July 21st on Netflix?

[Doug]

Yes, it is on Netflix. It's called. So this is even a better outcome than you started with, I think, ending up on Netflix.

[Malin Akerman]

It sure is. I think so, yeah. I mean, I think a lot more people have Netflix, and so it's kind of the OG of all the streamers. So it's great. I'm very excited. I'm very excited for the world to see this show. I'm also nervous, and, you know, there's lots of feelings around it, but ultimately, I just think that it's a really fun show. I think people are going to.

[Doug]

I think it's gonna be a big hit.

[Malin Akerman]

Oh, thanks.

[Doug]

I hope so. So, yes, it's called Hunting wives, everybody. Premieres July 21st on Netflix. Thank you, Malin. I hope I see you soon. I'm gonna text you when I'm in LA this summer. Are you based in LA now?

[Malin Akerman]

I'm based in la, but of course we're going away for the summer. We go to Europe for the summer. We go to Sweden and England and visit family and stuff like that. So we'll be gone for a bit of it.

[Doug]

All right, well, we'll. We'll figure out a time to hook up at some point.

[Malin Akerman]

Yeah, that would be awesome. It's so nice to chat with you.

[Doug]

Congrats on everything.

[Malin Akerman]

Thanks, honey.

[Katherine]

Thank you.

[Malin Akerman]

All right, nice talking to you both.

[Doug]

Okay, my remaining dates for Vegas. There are remaining dates for this year. Summertime is coming, and I will be in Vegas at the Cosmo doing my residency on August 30. And then November 1 and 20, November 1 and November 29, I will be in Las Vegas at the Cosmo, performing inside myself at the Chelsea. It's called Chelsea at the Chelsea for a reason. Okay, thank you.

[Katherine]

Do you want advice from Chelsea? Write in to dearchelsea podcastmail.com find full video episodes of Dear Chelsea on YouTube by searching earchelseapod. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert Executive Producer Kathryn la. And be sure to check out our merch@chelsea handler.com.

[Doug]

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[Doug]

We finally switched to T Mobile because.

[Katherine]

With them we can be connected here and there.

[Doug]

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