Ep. 17 Onyx Storm Deep Dive: Ch. 58-62 | Easter Eggs, Theories & Key Moments

Summary

Dear Fantasy Reader Podcast - Episode 17 Summary: Onyx Storm Deep Dive (Chapters 58-62)

Release Date: June 19, 2025

Welcome to Episode 17 of the Dear Fantasy Reader podcast, where hosts Hannah, Kinsey, and Carly delve deep into Rebecca Yarros' captivating fantasy novel, Onyx Storm. This episode focuses on chapters 58 through 62, unpacking intricate plot developments, character dynamics, and the myriad of theories that keep listeners engaged.

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1. Chapter Recap

The episode begins with a meticulous summary of chapters 58 to 62, highlighting pivotal events and character actions:

• Chapter 58-62 Overview:
  • Kinsey outlines the protagonists' mission to rescue Mira, the emergence of Theophany as a formidable antagonist, and the intense battles that ensue.
  • Hannah humorously notes a real-life storm mirroring the chapter's events, adding a relatable touch to the discussion.
  • Key Events:
    • Violet and Brennan's mission to rescue Mira encounters betrayal and intense combat.
    • Theophany's betrayal and her revelation as a storm wielder escalate the stakes.
    • Strategic interventions by Sloane and Zaden play crucial roles in averting immediate crises.
    • The emotional farewell between Zaden and Violet sets the stage for future conflicts.

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2. Character Analysis and Dynamics

The hosts dive into an in-depth analysis of key characters, exploring their motivations, relationships, and transformations:

• Theophany:

  • Hannah emphasizes Theophany's declaration: “Magic requires balance,” hinting at her deeper motives to skew magical scales in her favor ([07:00]).
  • Kinsey and Carly debate Theophany's possible allegiance, with theories suggesting a connection to General Darrymor or even Kaori, adding layers to her antagonistic persona.

• Bode:

  • Bode's complex relationship with Violet and his actions during the rescue mission raise suspicions about his true intentions.
  • Carly posits that Bode might be orchestrating events from behind the scenes, potentially hinting at a familial betrayal.

• Dane:

  • Dane's evolving powers and his secretive nature are scrutinized, with Hannah suggesting his abilities might surpass initial expectations, possibly involving a second signet or a hidden lineage.

• Riddick:

  • Carly theorizes that Riddick may possess a second signet or be an evolved offspring of Venom, explaining his unique abilities and mysterious behavior ([94:08]).

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3. Key Themes and Foreshadowing

The episode unpacks the thematic elements and foreshadowing present in these chapters:

• Balance of Magic:

  • The delicate equilibrium between Venom and the natural magic controlled by dragons is a recurring theme, with Theophany's actions threatening to tip this balance ([07:00], [08:11]).

• Betrayal and Trust:

  • Familial bonds and the potential for betrayal are explored, particularly concerning Bode's role and his relationship with other characters.

• Power and Sacrifice:

  • The immense power wielded by characters like Violet and Zaden comes at great personal cost, emphasizing the sacrifices made in the pursuit of greater good.

• Foreshadowing:

  • Kinsey highlights Theophany's hints about impending shifts in power dynamics, suggesting future confrontations and alliances that could redefine the narrative landscape ([14:29], [20:46]).

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4. Notable Quotes with Speaker Attribution

The hosts highlight and analyze several impactful quotes from the chapters:

• Theophany's Provocation:

  • “Magic requires balance. Once a century we get a chance to skew the scales in our favor, and I will prove myself to him this time.”
    — Hannah discusses the implications of this statement, suggesting Theophany's intent to disrupt magical equilibrium ([07:00]).

• Bode's Defiance:

  • “We don't have a crown.”
    — Hannah interprets Bode's rejection of traditional power structures, hinting at his complex motivations ([11:24]).

• Violet's Determination:

  • “I'll rip this very sky apart before she and Glayne accept defeat.”
    — Carly appreciates Violet's unwavering resolve, emphasizing her growth and leadership ([50:26]).

• Dane's Reassurance:

  • “You're not a weapon of destruction. You're not Venon. You're the artery power chooses to flow through your life.”
    — Kinsey finds this exchange between Dane and Sloane deeply meaningful, showcasing Dane's supportive nature ([50:35]).

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5. Theories and Speculations

The hosts engage in spirited discussions, presenting and debating various fan theories:

• Kaori as a Hidden Antagonist:

  • Carly suggests that Kaori might be masquerading under a different name, potentially linked to General Darrymor, to further Theophany's plans.

• Bode's Possible Betrayal:

  • Kinsey and Carly explore the possibility that Bode is the foretold betrayer, manipulating events to either seize power or prove his strength, aligning with Rebecca Yarros' hint at a family betrayal.

• Dane's Enhanced Powers:

  • Hannah theorizes that Dane's signet abilities might evolve beyond mere interaction, possibly allowing him to steal memories or access hidden information without physical contact, raising concerns about his true allegiance.

• Riddick's Mysterious Abilities:

  • Carly posits that Riddick could possess farsight or be an evolved Venom, explaining his unique actions during battles and his potential role in future conflicts.

• Venom's Sustainable Magic:

  • The hosts ponder Theophany's statement about protecting magic, speculating that Venom might have discovered a method to recycle or generate magic sustainably, challenging the existing magic system's constraints.

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6. Epigraph Analysis

The episode meticulously examines the epigraphs accompanying each chapter, uncovering hidden meanings and foreshadowing:

• Chapter 58:

  • “Most Cadets believe their ability to recite historical fact will usher them onto the Adept path, but it is actually the ability to observe and recount it that separates the Librarians from the scribes.”
    — Carly interprets this as a nod to the importance of active observation over mere knowledge, possibly hinting at upcoming strategic maneuvers by key characters.

• Chapter 59:

  • “It was not without risk that the first dragons bonded humans, for though they clearly hold the power, their bonded riders made them the one thing they could not vulnerable.”
    — Kinsey connects this to the emotional bonds and the potential vulnerabilities it introduces, aligning with the sacrifices made during missions.

• Chapter 60-62:

  • Themes of command, trust, and the wrath of gods are explored through various epigraphs, each providing subtle clues about character motivations and impending events.

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7. Favorite Moments and Standout Quotes

The hosts share their personal highlights from the chapters:

• Favorite Moments:

  • Kinsey praises Dane's collaboration with Sloane, labeling it as "Chef's kiss" ([49:37]).
  • Carly admires Violet's trust in her squad and her continued focus on her objectives, appreciating her character development ([49:47]).
  • Hannah highlights Bodhi's rescue moments and the intense emotional exchanges between characters ([43:06]).

• Standout Quotes:

  • “You're not a weapon of destruction. You're not Venon. You're the artery power chooses to flow through your life.” — Kinsey
  • “I swear the clouds darken slightly in acknowledgment, or maybe mocking, as two reds approach from the south at tremendous speed.” — Hannah

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8. Easter Eggs and Foreshadowing

The episode uncovers numerous Easter eggs and foreshadowing elements embedded throughout the chapters:

• Arryk's Precognition:

  • Kinsey suggests that Arryk possesses precognitive abilities, explaining his strategic maneuvers and the foresight in sending Sloane with crucial items ([66:37]).

• Brennan's Runed Scar:

  • Carly connects Brennan's unexplained runed scar to potential Venom influences, hinting at underlying plot twists ([62:06]).

• Violet's Prayers and Divine Intervention:

  • The recurring motif of Violet’s prayers being answered, possibly by Malak, suggests deeper connections between characters and the gods, adding a mystical layer to future events ([63:57]).

• Tine's Ambiguous Identity:

  • The inconsistent pronouns used for Tine spark theories about their true identity, possibly hinting at hidden dragon identities or transformations ([70:03]).

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9. The Signets and Magic System Discussion

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to dissecting the intricate magic system, particularly the concept of signets and their implications:

• Dane's Signet Evolution:

  • Hannah posits that Dane's signet might evolve to allow non-physical interactions, such as memory theft, escalating the threats posed by Venom.

• Violet's Unique Signet:

  • The discussion highlights that Violet possesses a pure power signet without a counter Venom, making her both a formidable asset and a prime target for Venom's manipulation.

• Venom's Magic Sustainability:

  • The hosts debate the possibility that Venom have discovered sustainable magic practices, as hinted by Theophany, which could revolutionize the existing conflict dynamics.

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10. Conclusion and Upcoming Expectations

As the episode wraps up, the hosts tease the upcoming content:

• Final Chapters Exploration:

  • The trio prepares listeners for the deep dive into the final chapters (63-66) of Onyx Storm, anticipating further revelations and climactic developments.

• New Author Interview Series:

  • Announcement of the upcoming Dear Fantasy Author series, featuring interviews with authors like Hazel McBride, expanding the podcast's scope beyond just book discussions.

• Listener Engagement:

  • Encouragement for listeners to subscribe, leave reviews, and join the community via Patreon and Discord for exclusive content and discussions.

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Notable Quotes:

1. Hannah [07:00]:
   “Magic requires balance. Once a century we get a chance to skew the scales in our favor, and I will prove myself to him this time.”

2. Carly [50:26]:
   “I'll rip this very sky apart before she and Glayne accept defeat.”

3. Kinsey [50:35]:
   “You're not a weapon of destruction. You're not Venon. You're the artery power chooses to flow through your life.”

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Final Thoughts:

Episode 17 of Dear Fantasy Reader offers an insightful and engaging exploration of Onyx Storm's chapters 58-62. Through detailed recaps, dynamic character analyses, and spirited discussions, the hosts provide both new and seasoned readers with a deeper understanding of the intricate world Rebecca Yarros has crafted. As the journey through the Empyrean series continues, listeners can look forward to unraveling more mysteries, uncovering hidden truths, and engaging with a vibrant community of fantasy enthusiasts.

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Subscribe now and join Hannah, Kinsey, and Carly every Thursday for your essential companion to the Empyrean series!

Transcript

[Hannah]

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[Kinsey]

By SoFi bank and a member FDIC.

[Hannah]

Terms and conditions apply. NMLS 696891 Dearest fantasy readers, welcome to the Dear Fantasy Reader Podcast where we travel through the pages of our favorite Romantasy novels. I'm Hannah.

[Kinsey]

I'm Kinsey.

[Carly]

And I'm Carly.

[Hannah]

Join us as we take flight into the world of the Empyrean series, diving deep into Onyx Storm, breaking down characters, scenes, foreshadowing and lore, fangirling over shadow daddies, building theories as we go, and more.

[Carly]

With that content warning and spoiler alert, we will be covering anything and everything in Parian series to this date and any content Rebecca Yarrows has given us. So if you haven't read 4th Wing Iron Flame and Onyx Storm in its entirety, go do that and we will be here waiting when you are done.

[Kinsey]

Also, due to the nature of these books, this podcast is rated R in content and language.

[Hannah]

As Rebecca Yarros says, readers who may be sensitive to these elements, please take note and prepare to face the storm. We have dragons to ride. This is our second to last episode of Onyx Storm, chapter by chapter. Deep Dive. We have some really exciting things coming, including a new author interview series called Dear Fantasy Author. You see what we did there. Our first just released with Hazel McBride, author of a Fate Forged in Fire that is now found under season four and will be an ongoing season. We will be releasing a what's Next for Dear Fantasy Reader episode following our final Onyx Storm Chapters by Chapters episode to share what else is in store. So keep your eye out. Time for our lightning round of current reads. Basically means what have we read since the last episode? I finished the Night and the Moth by Rachel Gillig. Absolutely incredible. I also read Assistant to the Villain by Hannah Nicole Mayer and I'm now on book two, apprentice to the villain. I have like 30 minutes left so I think you can technically count it as finishing, but so close.

[Kinsey]

Well, I finished an arc for Accomplice to the Villain by Hannah Nicole Meyer and that was one of my most anticipated reads for 2025 it was fantastic. I can't wait to discuss it. Just have to wait until release day. I also read Below Zero by Ali Hazelwood and listened to the Love Hypothesis by Ali Hazelwood, which might be my favorite. And I started listening to Shatter Me by Tahereh Mafi.

[Carly]

I just finished four Ruined Realms by Mai Coreland and I loved it. Book one was good, Book two was great, so if you're sleeping on that, it was fantastic. And I'm currently reading Glass Sword by.

[Hannah]

Victoria As a reminder before we dive in, if you'd like to jump around to any section of our episodes, you can find the timestamps down in our show notes. First objective breaking into the Archives vault for a summary report of chapters 58 through 62. With our squad mate Kinsey, Violet flies.

[Kinsey]

To Dreythis with Zaden, Bodhi and Brennan to meet with Theophany and rescue Mira. On the way they notice Arryk disobeying orders and flying south. When they arrive, Garak Distance wields and brings Jack like Theophany requested, and with their end of the bargain fulfilled, Violet demands that Theophany release Meera, but as Theophany says, Venon lie and she slits Meera's throat.

[Hannah]

Darn bummer. Bye girl.

[Kinsey]

In a chaotic chain of events, Theophany throws her dagger at Jack, misses, then pieces the fuck out. Violet and Brennan rush to help Meera. Garruk removes Jack and the dragons and remaining riders fight the surrounding Wyvern. Brennan nears burnout just as Dane and Sloane arrive bearing gifts. Literally. Sloane delivers a package addressed to Arryk from the Priestess of Dune, and then Sloane gets to work siphoning power from Dain to Brennan so he can mend Meera Crisis averted, everyone moves on to their next assigned tasks. Zaden and Violet say goodbye, which is their last scene together. On page, Taryn leaves Violet to carry Meera's dragon to safety, leaving her powerless. With Bode as her only defense. Theophany returns and tries yet again to get Violet to turn. Bode fails to counter Theophany's signet and they realize she's actually a storm wielder and not a lightning wielder. General Sorengail was her counter. Despite Bode's protests, his dragon removes him from the fight and Violet is left to face Theophany alone. As their fight continues, Wyvern break through the line and head for Midaro Pass, where Violet's squad is stationed. Theophany taunts Violet to pull power to help her squad, but Violet realizes she can't be everywhere at once and accepts that her squad can handle their own. And now we're in Ree's point of view. The 17 wyvern violet just saw are flying towards them, and they only have three dragons and four griffons to defend the pass. During the battle, Riddick freezes a wyvern to death and Re successfully leads the squad to hold the pass and protect the civilian refugees. During the battle, Riddick freezes a wyvern to death and resuccessfully leads the squad to hold the pass and protect the civilian refugees. And now we're back to our regularly scheduled Violet pov. Chapter Theophany threatens to kill Violet if she doesn't channel because at this point, Violet is too dangerous to be left alive by the Venon. Theophany begins to drain the earth, and Violet escapes by climbing onto a dead wyvern. Before Theophany can advance, Violet is scooped up by Sigale and returned to ternation. Now back at full strength, Violet unleashes her lightning against a horde of Wyvern. Taryn and Violet agree that instead of defending Dreyfus, they will chase Theophany and hunt her down.

[Hannah]

Dun dun dun. I just want to say that if you heard thunder in the background, no, that was not a dramatic sound effect. It is actually storming at my house. And it's so funny because I kept hearing it get louder when you were talking about Theophany actually being a storm wielder and not a lightning wielder. And I was like smiling because it's so fitting and that was cool. Anyways, grab your leathers, Quest Squad, as we are officially in the final stretch of Onyx Storm, which is a little bittersweet, but it's also super exciting. Diving right into our analysis and discussion section, starting with Theophany and just a couple of the things that she said that stood out. First, that she is aware that magic requires balance. It's the oldest rule there is, but once a century or so we get a chance to skew the scales in our favor, and I will prove myself to him this time. So a couple things here. Once a century is more often than I realized, and it also to me sounds like Theophany failed their leader the last century. I suppose every century, but she really emphasizes the last one. And also, once again, who is this him? And it's not the first time that she's mentioned this vague him in these chapters. She also says a weapon like you will only submit to someone stronger. So come, let's get this farce over with so you can begin your real journey. He's waiting. And then Violet guesses Berwyn and Theophany says, as if I would answer to that fool. I think not. So that is clarification that it is not Berwyn. My first assumption is General Darrymor, but that's because he's the only one that we have long ago history about. And they literally imply that he is villain.

[Carly]

Yeah, a lot of people think it's Darrimor, which I think if we're looking for somebody from a long time ago, he's really the only name we have. I feel like at this point from 600 years ago. But I just think it'd be more interesting if this person was somehow connected to our current group characters.

[Hannah]

You know, I feel like we might have had this conversation before. I'm not sure if it was on the pod. So for the sake of the pod, if that's the case, who do you.

[Carly]

Have in mind connected to our current cast of characters? Well, I think it's possible Darrymore is connected to our current cast of character somehow. And we just don't know because we know names have changed. So what if that's not really his last name? But I don't think that it's Sigeil's previous writer. Because I know I've been like, on the grandfather has to come in here at some point because that was 50 years ago. And I think whoever is the big man in charge has to be much older than that. Like the offenhere is implying last century, so we know at least 100 years old, at least that.

[Hannah]

Well, and if he's her leader, then it's implying older than her and she's at least a couple centuries.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Kinsey]

I do like the idea that maybe they potentially change their name, but I do think it's gotta be Daramor. Cause Theophany has mentioned there are only a few Vennon older, faster and stronger than her. And that doesn't really leave much room for other venom for her to report to. As for the once a century comment, kind of like going back a little bit, Hannah, I just think this means that they've been erasing history a lot more than we originally thought. Because you're like, I can't believe that it's been every century, but I believe it. But yeah, I'm like, is it Kaori? Like, I'll go back to that. Not really.

[Hannah]

But yeah, I think my original question kind of got lost in there. But like, if it's not General Darrymore, which it sounds like Kinsey. You and I are pre aligned on that. But it's also because we don't have, like, a lot of other options we're working with here. But I'm intrigued by your thought process, Carly, that it's someone that we could know. Are you thinking that it's like a relative of someone we know, or are you thinking that because we know they don't really visually age, so it could be anyone walking around that, like, I mean, Berwin even is noted as like, being extremely young. It could have been someone that turned relatively young, like in their 20s. It really could be a squad mate. I don't want to go that far. I don't really think that Riddick.

[Kinsey]

That'd be crazy.

[Hannah]

That's who I thought. That's way too far.

[Carly]

But, like, I don't think that.

[Hannah]

Well, they would have redistined eyes, right?

[Carly]

Well, no, because they can hide it, remember? So like the upper level then. And he was like, you wouldn't know. So my personal thought is, is that I either think it is General Darryl Moore masquerading as somebody they know and that's Kaori, or it's Kaori. I am like 300% in on Kaori. Suspicious as fuck. I think he's who they're answering to. Because at this point he would have had to change his name. Right? Because that's like the one name from history that they have from 600 years ago. So whoever it is, if they're in the picture, they have to be going by another name. So who would they be masquerading as? And I think it's suspicious that the Venin seem to have disdain for the Dragons and their culture and Kaori is obsessed with studying them.

[Hannah]

Wouldn't that contradict to you?

[Carly]

No, because I think he's trying to figure out how to like, take them down, basically. Because I remember he has that journal.

[Hannah]

Oh, I remember. I know. I've never forgotten. Yeah, I've been obsessed with that detail.

[Kinsey]

I do think it would make it a lot more dramatic of a reveal if it is someone we know.

[Hannah]

I agree. Because we expect it at this point.

[Kinsey]

Yeah. And I'm going to point out that Kaori is at this battle. He's in Dreythis. So, like, it's a possibility.

[Hannah]

Oh, we're going to get to that. I have a. Yeah, I have some thoughts on that as well. I will say the only person that I can confidently count out that some people may consider is General Atos. I really think that the message that Rebecca is trying to send with him, based on how she responded to one of the questions that I want to say. It was the Denver Q and A that we were at, but it might have been a different one because I watched all of them. She wants to show that there's evil people who aren't Venon, because being Venon. Yes. Equates to, like, this evil, except for we see there's nuance, like with Zaden, but that you can be a terrible human being and still not turn Venon. And I think that he is that embodiment for her, and so I can count him out across the board, but really, everybody else is fair game.

[Carly]

Hannah, I am in 100% agree with you. I definitely think that he is supposed to be that embodiment of, like, evil that seeks power in another way, because there's just no way to.

[Hannah]

Like, it could have been him had he not bonded a dragon. Like, he very well probably would have turned Benin. But he did. He got access to the power and is getting access to power in other ways.

[Carly]

And I think for him, it's political power.

[Hannah]

Exactly.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Kinsey]

Have you tried seeing if there's an anagram in Deramore?

[Hannah]

I'm sure she has.

[Carly]

I don't know that I know of any anagrams. I have seen a theory about the name and what it translates to, and I don't have those details in front of me, so I don't want to butcher it. But I believe faithfully Fantasy has a pretty cool theory about the name and what it means.

[Hannah]

We'll try and find it, and if we do, we'll link it down in the show notes.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Okay. Next suspicious thing that Theophany said. That's a lot of our discussion today, guys. Theophany tells Bode, quote, you're almost done waiting. He'll be gone soon. The crown will be yours. Bode responds, we don't have a crown. You don't know me well enough to try and fuck with my head. I'm doing exactly what I've always wanted, protecting my cousin, my province. And Theophany says, and her. This line has done wonders to our fandom, is fueled quite a popular theory that Bod is in love with Violet. So do you think that that is the case? And if not, if you do not think that he is in love with Violet, with Violet, then what do you think Theophany's referring to here?

[Kinsey]

I don't think that he's in love with Violet, but we have to remember that he did swear to Zaden to protect Violet. So in a way, he is protecting his province and his cousin by defending Violet.

[Hannah]

But what about that emphasis? Like, why would that need to be. I'm not saying I disagree. I don't think he's. I also don't think that he's in love with Violet.

[Kinsey]

But, I mean, Theophany's just pointing out that he's also protecting her. He's the only one that stayed behind at this moment. So it's just the two of them. But I'll get into that later in a theory section.

[Hannah]

Oh, okay. You're withholding.

[Kinsey]

I do not think he's in love with her. Like, and I know people are like, but he gave her her flight jacket. And I'm like, yeah, but she would have, like, literally frozen on Taryn if she didn't have a flight jacket in Iron Flame and stuff like that. But I just don't see.

[Hannah]

She also could have been getting him more on page because he was gonna play a bigger role. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

I just don't see him being in love with.

[Carly]

I see a lot of people talking about this. I know that this is, like, a really popular thing out there that people love to like. Like, people are very much on two sides of the fence on this one, I feel like. And I don't think he's in love with Violet. I think he resents Violet. I'm not going to get into this detail because I know Kinsey has a theory on Bodhi down below. You're fine. But if you look at the end of Fourth Wing when she gets stabbed and they have to take her to Arisha, the marked ones are like, this is a bad idea. Like, they don't think Zaden should save her. They are questioning whether or not they should go to Orisha or risk it and go back to Basgaeth. And a lot of them don't. And, like, she's out of it. Right. So she's not really sure who is talking in a lot of that. And so I think he's resentful that Violet was there at all, that she's got drug into this. So I think he resents Violet.

[Hannah]

Ooh, I don't know how I feel about that. I see it as valid.

[Kinsey]

I could see it.

[Hannah]

I'm just trying to think of, like, what would I prefer as far as the storyline going forward with what role he plays. And a lot of that all depends on whether or not he's the brother.

[Kinsey]

Right.

[Hannah]

Like, if he's not, I still don't Think he's there. Hmm.

[Kinsey]

I just don't think that Rebecca would introduce a love triangle between family members when she's emphasized over and over that Violet and Zaden are, like, endgame.

[Hannah]

Let me be clear. I don't think that that is a on the table thing.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, no.

[Hannah]

Like, even. I don't think it's. It's not a love triangle if it's not reciprocated to me.

[Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

So, like, even if he does turn out to have feelings for her, that's not a love triangle to me. So I. I could see her utilizing that. I don't know how I enjoy that. I think that his character has room for development in other areas, and I hope. I think that's why this line to me does. I think it's entirely valid that people think that's what's going on. And that's what I wanted to know. Like, how else do you explain this line? I don't think it. It's enough to say that they. I think it's still suspicious and that it's not covered by just saying, oh, well, it was an observation from Theophany, because it just is. Still. Why is the observation from Theophany? Maybe it was simply her just trying to fuck with him.

[Carly]

But, I mean, I'm with you, Hannah. I'm always like, why is this worth taking up word space? Yes.

[Kinsey]

Maybe they have a Precog on the Venon side that knew that Zaden and Violet would get married. So again, it just goes back to, like, maybe they.

[Hannah]

I don't want to get too much into your theory. Part of it. So keeping that entirely out as if it's not a thing. Maybe it is. Theophany really doesn't know Bode well. And she's like, oh, she's going to get your crown if they get married. And they think maybe Bode does want it instead of. Because that's what that whole paragraph before does. Maybe that could explain it. But. Hmm. Yeah, I figured that was something we couldn't not talk about, considering how it's a huge. You are on one side or the fence or the other. So we're all on the. No, they're not. He's not in love with her.

[Kinsey]

I think he was just defending her because he promised to Zaden.

[Hannah]

All right, our next Theophany moment. I don't know what you. At this point, half of our episodes this whole season have just been us talking about the suspicious things that Theophany says. So yet again, here we are. We also get clarification that Theophany's obsession with Violet is over her being a lightning wielder to prove herself and also something to do with Irids. Violet says to Theophany, you need me. And Theophany says, another will come along. You are not special. And Violet says, but I'm the only lightning wielder. You have to prove yourself now. And then, Theophany says, which meant a lot more when you had your Irid. So my question is, because this is yet again, just getting a little bit of information, but not the full picture. So how exactly is Theophany thinking that she is going to prove herself? And this is kind of rhetorical. Like, what do we think she would be doing to prove herself by getting Violet to turn? Especially now, considering that Andarna is out of the picture. Like, they still want her for being a lightning wielder. But, like, what is that proving to this higher hymn that Theophany can get Violet to do that?

[Kinsey]

I wonder if just like, getting someone to turn gives them a claim to be their teacher. And so she's like, if I can turn this, like, really powerful wielder, then that can improve my own standing. Because she'll be able to control Violet in a way. But I don't know, it's just very strange.

[Hannah]

That does follow right after her line about, like, implying that she was giving up on her being the teacher. She's only gonna submit to someone more powerful. So I would have said yes had that line not been first. I don't know. Maybe it's just as simple as, like, he gave her a mission and now she's doing. But, like, she's committing to this mention once every couple centuries. Like, what exactly does. Outside of throwing the. The balance off, Right? Because they said that they. They get the chance to throw it off, but, like, it sounds like it's just something they get to do every now and then. It's not like this groundbreaking thing, I guess. So. I don't know. I feel like there's something more to it.

[Carly]

There's a certain level of desperation with the Benin at this point. I think that this is like the big show for them. Like, this is their. Maybe their last big push or chance to really, like, take over. I think potentially they're running out of something. They need some sort of resource or something. But, like, they. They definitely need something that they don't have. Like, this feels so critical to them in this moment. The way that Theophany is written throughout, like, to present this, it's like they really need this.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, I Mean, they found out how to put up the wards, and that was a lost history before this point. So I definitely think it's like the clock is ticking. They may be immortal, but they're running out of time.

[Carly]

Yeah. But I also want to point out that, like, she is specifying, like, it meant a lot more when you had your Irid.

[Kinsey]

Mm.

[Carly]

The thing that's, like, stuck out to me as highly suspicious is that Theophany has Mira still at this point. And the second she brings up the Irid, she says, you know, you've lost your ear, and how inconvenient. That's the moment Mira tries to speak up. It's the only moment Mira tries to speak up. She says no. And that's when Theophany, like, tightens her grip on Mira. I think Mira must have overheard something about Andarna, the Irid, or something. Something she knows that Theophany wants, that she doesn't want Violet to give them. Because the second Andarne is brought up or the Irides are brought up, that is the only moment Mira tries to speak up and warn Violet. Something is very important about that line about the Iridescent.

[Hannah]

I am very team. Meera is hiding a lot, so that would actually not surprise me. I do want to make a clarification statement. It doesn't change what you're saying. But this was not that same scene when this was said from Theophany. It was well after. It was like, toward the end of the chapters. She did not have Mira at that time. But the quotes you were talking about, she does bring up the Irides. And that is when Theophany has Mira. And it still just is suspicious, because.

[Kinsey]

I think Meera probably knew that Andarna could come back and, like, reforge the bond with her. So if there is something that Theophany wants, specifically with Andarna, Mira knows it's still possible. Cause Andarna's not, like, gone gone for good. Like, she might come back in a couple years. We know she comes back at the end of the book. We don't know if she reforged the bond, but I don't know. I'm just caught up on why are they so obsessed with the Irids. Like, what does it do? Violet is still the most powerful writer of her year.

[Hannah]

It's just four dragons who are so. You worded it perfectly earlier, Carly. The way you were saying that. They have so much disdain for dragons, but all of a sudden, she worships her. Yeah. What is it?

[Carly]

Reverence.

[Hannah]

Reverence that she looks at Andarna with. And that happens when Andarna shows up. Which somehow that just completely slipped my mind that that's when Andarna showed up. So I squealed and kicked my feet again when I read it this time. But, like, she shows up in enough time to distract Theophany, and she, again, is, like, in awe of her, which is ironic, considering that she was a priestess for Dune, an actual God, and betrayed her. Like, went against that to be her own God. So it's, like, for her to then turn around and look at anything with reverence speaks volumes. And so I'm really curious about that, and I'm really, really sad that Theophany died.

[Kinsey]

Gone too soon. I'll say it again.

[Carly]

Yeah. I definitely think they need the Irids for something. And it has some. It has to have something to do with the magic.

[Kinsey]

Yeah. Because they're magic itself.

[Hannah]

Do you think that. No, that wouldn't make any sense. I was. I was trying to think, like, do you think they could turn an Irid? But the way you turn is by siphoning magic from the Earth. So unless the Irids have the sky magic and they want them to turn, like, evil, but then they already have Wyvern, so why, like, it just begs the question of what do they get out of this?

[Carly]

I think that the Arids can solve some sort of problem for them. It's just. What problem?

[Hannah]

Yeah, what does a peacekeeping breed.

[Carly]

Yeah, because I'd like to say, like, oh, maybe they can, like, make them not Venom, but they don't really seem interested in not being Venom. So, like, I don't think it's that.

[Kinsey]

There'S a reason that the Irids dropped off the face of the Earth. They didn't even know this breed existed up until. And Darna outed herself. So.

[Hannah]

Well, the humans, but not Vennevnun.

[Kinsey]

There's definitely something going on. Just wish we had a little bit more information.

[Hannah]

I know.

[Kinsey]

And to start off our not Theophany section, Sloane said, quote, someone like, you shouldn't have this much power to Dane. And I think that Dane is hiding so much more than he's letting on. Back in Fourth Wing, he told Violet that Cath channels a lot of magic to him. He had to be one of the most powerful writers of their generation, but he's keeping it a secret. So I just want to know why. What do we think is going on with Dade's power?

[Hannah]

I am not going to answer your question directly off the bat, but I have just got to, like, double down on this again. Because I know that everyone's going crazy about it now, but as you mentioned, back in Fourth Wing, we literally got an Easter egg for this exact thing. And I pointed it out. I went back to my outline for season one, first Chapters by Chapters episode, which is like, crazy because that's literally almost a year ago this month. And Violet is talking to Dane and he tells her about his signet for the first time. And he says, quote, and as for the powers, Kath channels a pretty significant amount of magic compared to some of the other dragons. But I'm nowhere near adept at it yet. And I think that, like, that is what we should be emphasizing is the yet. Because as I theorized back then, that showed that Dain's power is going to evolve his signet abilities very likely past touching someone's face. So as we've been looking for, where has he been touching other people to potentially be stealing their memories or potentially not have to touch someone at all to do it? And with that amount of power, I feel like the why could be that he becomes so powerful that he doesn't have to touch someone at all. Otherwise, I just see it as Rebecca doubling down essentially on what she had already set up for us. It doesn't give us a ton more information, but it is not new. And I think that's what I. I've like seeing all these videos of people screaming about it. And I'm like, but we. Girl, you gotta read the first book and set it there.

[Kinsey]

He's always been on my radar. But I mean, like, it's not just his segment. Like, we have to think lesser magic, the ability to use runes, like, there's so much more. And it just came off as like a well of power that Sloane's not aware of. And why is it so dangerous that he has this power?

[Hannah]

Yeah, because especially comparing to like Sloane siphoned from Lilith.

[Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Who is the counter for a very powerful Venon. And I wonder if this is almost showing that, for one, Daen is the counter to an also hugely powerful Venon, what that could look like. Who's out here touching our main characters? That sounds so bad. But who's out here stealing memories from our main characters? Especially if this theory is correct and they don't have to even touch someone to find out their memories. That could be it. It could also be connected to what Rebecca told us about. I don't think Dane has a second signet, but can it manifest in two ways? One extra power or two signets. When a family member's dragon is Bonded to a family member?

[Carly]

It depends.

[Hannah]

So I wonder.

[Carly]

Ah, so it depends. So if you're in the direct family line, it's either a second signet or you go insane. I'm not buying that.

[Kinsey]

Intense.

[Carly]

Yeah, but it's not the direct family line. But still in your family line, that's when you get like an extra powerful boost.

[Hannah]

I wonder then if this is an Easter egg to find out that Cath is not really Cath, that he changed his name. Maybe Dain doesn't know or does now or over time. It didn't when they bonded. Or maybe they together lied to the role keeper. But maybe this is like an ancient dragon who was bonded to like a more distant family member. That way he could have like an extra powerful signet.

[Carly]

Yeah, I definitely think it's a possibility that Dain has bonded a dragon in his family line and doesn't know it. I'm going to point out we nothing about his mother. Absolutely nothing.

[Hannah]

No. But she is not some like, low key detail. Rebecca has told us that we should expect to learn much more about her in the next book and I'm really intrigued to see because it seems like that's going to connect a lot to Dane's character arc and I feel like it's going to be a pretty big deal. And explain. She also implied it would explain General Atos a lot more.

[Kinsey]

I look forward to it.

[Carly]

I always thought it would make sense and explain Dain's character if his mom had died somehow tragically, and that's why he felt overly responsible for taking care of Violet. And that would have given me more empathy for him in Fourth Wing. Because when you lose somebody like that, you tend to become very overbearing. But the way General Etos acts, I'm almost like maybe she left him and he's just bitter. But I do think we're gonna find out some interesting details about his mom, which might give us more insight into why he has.

[Hannah]

Do you think his mom's Venon?

[Carly]

If she is, I don't think he knows.

[Kinsey]

And I don't think we can just assume that like anybody who's like missing is Venon. Because I think for a while people also thought Zaden's mom was Venon.

[Hannah]

But no, I'm not assuming it because they're missing. I'm assuming it. Just like you have a long list of every single person you think is Venon, which is literally everyone. That's fair.

[Kinsey]

No, but I do like the idea of his mom leaving. That's like something else that he has in common with Zaden.

[Carly]

I mean, this happens at the end of the book. Like, what if he went and dedicated himself on top of all of this and got himself some more power?

[Kinsey]

Dain.

[Carly]

Yeah. How would they know?

[Hannah]

That was a curve ball. I wasn't expecting that one.

[Carly]

I mean, he learns all about this while they're out on those islands. And he comes back, I'm like, what if he has. You know.

[Hannah]

Okay, so this is maybe more of a clarification point. I believe there's an epigraph that said that the only two gods that take dedications like that are.

[Carly]

There's only two that require a lifetime of service.

[Kinsey]

Only Loial and Dune are for lifetime.

[Hannah]

Oh, yeah. Okay. Thank you for that clarification. That is actually a big deal.

[Kinsey]

Yeah. Because you could be dedicated to Malak or Zannah.

[Hannah]

Let's lean into this for a second. A little unhinged segment. If you had to say that Dain did dedicate himself, it seems temporarily. If it's not Loial or Dune, who would that be?

[Carly]

Well, I guess after being on the isles, it wouldn't be Hedian. But I think before he went on the isles, it probably would have been Hedian.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Kinsey]

I wonder if it was Zannal. I wonder if the slap showed him something and that made him realize that he needed to dedicate to Zannal.

[Carly]

Yeah, that's what I was gonna lean into. It has to be after the islands, Zannal.

[Hannah]

My first thought was Zannal just because of how fucked up that would be. But I actually loved the gift connection there.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Okay, that's headcanon for me now.

[Carly]

And if not dedicated, maybe it had something to do with the gift. Maybe he got just more power or something. I don't know. But that's the only other thing I could think.

[Hannah]

I mean, I just want to say that it could make sense why Rebecca was trying so hard to distract us with Dane in this set of chapters. More going on.

[Carly]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

I'm just gonna say Dane is quickly becoming one of my favorite characters. And I'm gonna be like, we know I'm gonna be really upset if she kills him in book four.

[Hannah]

Babe, brace yourself.

[Carly]

Favorite character in this series or like, across miniseries.

[Kinsey]

Oh, no, like in this series. But I will say on my book boyfriends list, he has gone up. Okay, moving on to who's not my book boyfriend.

[Hannah]

Everyone expected that. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

Moving on to who's not my book boyfriend, Jack. He will never be on that list.

[Hannah]

I was gonna say no one's. But That's a lie. There are actually people.

[Kinsey]

My friend Lish is obsessed with Jack. So I don't get it.

[Carly]

I don't get it.

[Hannah]

Anyway, I am concerned.

[Kinsey]

It's fine. It's fine. When Theophany asks for Jack, she tries to kill him instead of save him. Theophany then mentions that Jack spills his sage's secrets too easily. And Zayan remarks that if she wanted him dead, he obviously knows things they don't want us to. What does Jack know that they still haven't figured out? And if Jack has only broken an interrogation for Zaden and Violet, then how do the Venon know that he's shared those secrets?

[Carly]

I don't know what Jack knows, but I think how they know goes back to Zaden, worrying that he's an unintentional leak. I think it's possible that the Venin, like, with their initiates, have some sort of either hive mind situation, like they do with their wyvern, or it's through the dreamwalking, and Zaden has started to realize that, like, they have information from him, from his dreams, and that's how they figured it out, because he's been interrogating Jack. And if that information's in his head and Erwin's dream walking into his dreams, he's gonna figure out everything Jack's telling him.

[Kinsey]

Which is crazy, because as far as we know, at least from Violet's interactions with Jack, Imogen mind wipes him every time that they talk to him. So it's like, is Berwin so powerful that he's able to, like, pull erased memories from his dreams? Like, it's just.

[Hannah]

Well, I would like to take a step back here and say that there is a reality in which it wasn't just that he broke with Zaden and Violet. He very well could have also broken with Panchec or Panchec new. And so, like, we're making that assumption there. So I want to make that clear that, like, that we're jumping to that. But we only know what Violet knows. And because at this point, we hadn't found out about Panchec, this could have been another Easter egg that showed. How do they know this information? Well, Panchak somehow could have heard from whoever was interrogating him or interrogated him himself. He could have literally just went down there and been like, what are you willing to break? Not knowing. I'm working for them, and I'm gonna tell them. And now they have that information. So, yeah, I feel like that was important context. Before we start building off of that assumption. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

He also is very close to Caroline Ashton, so I suppose it's less breaking under interrogation, but he could even just tell his friends, like, hey, you wanna get too. This is how you do it. Which would be fucking crazy, but.

[Hannah]

Oh, that's true. Well, I mean, at that point, like, isn't that like recruiting?

[Kinsey]

Yeah, you know, and like they said that the Truthsayers cleared her and cleared all of his friends.

[Hannah]

So what makes me lean toward it not being leaked information to Zaden and Violet? And outside of Violet's knowledge, they're talking about Sage secrets and we really do not see him give much. Like, maybe they're referencing the conversation with Zaden and Jack at the very beginning. But what did he give Zaden there? We found out that they want Violet. That's not news. We find out that they don't really let them keep the dragons. Maybe that could be considered it.

[Kinsey]

But he did share that only initiates bleed. And that basgaeth can be full of Sages and Mavens and you wouldn't even know it. They can disguise themselves.

[Hannah]

I feel like this line implies more direct secrets for Sage, but maybe not for me. It just goes back to why Violet never asked more questions to Jack when she had the chance. Because he clearly does know information and she did interrogate him a lot off page. But then why is Rebecca not showing us that? And then have this line in, like, if Jack gave her more Sage secrets that should have been on page or Violet should have thought about here.

[Carly]

I think it's just that the ones that they have, I just don't think that they're viewing them as important. Because what they're saying here is they're still like, he definitely knows something we need to know if they want him dead.

[Hannah]

Yeah. It's implying something that Violet herself does not know yet.

[Carly]

So I definitely think that potentially, like a lot of the information he's given them just isn't helpful or interesting or worth being on page. But there's also potentially just an element of, like, Rebecca Yarra's holding information back from us by not providing every moment of Violet's week to us.

[Hannah]

1,000%.

[Kinsey]

That was like a big portion of the book.

[Carly]

Yes. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Well, and she does tell us that she says that the reason she writes in first person and not third is because we need to know what Violet knows and not anything else. Except for until we get into those POVs. And those POVs were intentionally given to us so that we could have information that Violet did not. So she's definitely being strategic about what she gives us. And when. All I have to say about this is that I hope to the gods that this means that we will finally get more information from Jack, that they'll interrogate him again based on this comment, even though how many times have they done it before? I don't know. But maybe they can get more information out of him, and then we'll see that in book four.

[Kinsey]

I mean, if we don't get it.

[Hannah]

If it gets pushed to book five, I am gonna scream combust.

[Kinsey]

He went from being such a pivotal character to being literally put in the backseat. He was shoved in a closet, let's say.

[Hannah]

But he was. But not in a way that she's clearly waiting for something bigger for him. Otherwise, she could have just killed him off. At this point, he will never die until we get whatever that final payoff is gonna be. At least that's the vibe I'm getting.

[Kinsey]

Maybe it's like, they're gonna have to use Jack to track Zaden. They're gonna have to pull those answers from him to figure out where they go.

[Hannah]

Oh, so you're talking about his role.

[Kinsey]

In the next book.

[Hannah]

The good team, the non venon people.

[Kinsey]

Okay, at this point, Theophany didn't know that Zaden would. I mean, maybe she knew that Zaden would leave with Berwyn or just in general.

[Carly]

Turn.

[Kinsey]

Turn.

[Hannah]

I feel like. Yeah, I feel like if Theophany had some sort of precognition, Stu, that she would have seen that she was gonna die. So maybe we should take that part with a grain of salt.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, well, I don't think she has precognition, but there are two writers that have precognition type signets, Arryk and Milgrin. So there's definitely someone who's a Venon that has some sort of precog. Like, they don't have to tell Theophany she's gonna die, but we have to.

[Hannah]

Think that they just don't like her and so they don't warn her.

[Kinsey]

But, I mean, like, who cares? But like. And different choices change. Like, maybe just Arryk manifesting his signet changed the trajectory of that. But anyway.

[Hannah]

Yeah, that's true.

[Kinsey]

Everything can change one second. I think his role for the next book could be, like, tell us what you know and help us find Zaden. Maybe.

[Carly]

I just find it odd that Theophany miss throwing that dagger at him at all because she tries to kill him and misses. And I'm like, how does somebody who's been around this long miss at something five.

[Hannah]

And that villain does not miss. Like, nothing about her and her personality screams I miss. She's used to getting everything right. And that's what's frustrating to her about Violet. Yeah.

[Carly]

So I'm like, violet wouldn't have missed. How does theophany miss? So I wonder if this is even more of a setup from the Venon.

[Hannah]

It could be like they wanted them to take him back and keep fake.

[Kinsey]

Info, but then keep it like a bait and switch.

[Carly]

Yeah. I don't. I just think that there's something going on there because I'm just like, how does she miss? Violet wouldn't have missed. How does somebody who's like 200 plus years old miss?

[Kinsey]

Unless he's like a metallurgist and, like, made it, like, go away or something.

[Hannah]

That's right. We still don't even know he's doing it. But also, she would know. So she would not throw a dagger at a metallurgist. So, you know, I wish. I want to know what his signet is.

[Carly]

He was sedated.

[Hannah]

I want it to be like, he can only shrink things. Carly gets that too.

[Kinsey]

Just put him in cold water. Sorry.

[Carly]

He's already in a rhyme's dad chest.

[Hannah]

You guys, give the guy a break.

[Carly]

He's already powerless anyway. But yeah, I just think there's something else going on there. This feels like more dominoes being very purposely set up by somebody.

[Hannah]

It does. That's exactly what it feels like.

[Kinsey]

All right, time to head on over to the healer's quadrant to take a temperature check on our characters, our favorite moments and standout quotes. I'll start us off with who is hot this week? Dane motherfucking Eidos.

[Hannah]

Correction. It's Daineyes here. Ato. Yes.

[Kinsey]

And just as a bonus, I will say Sigail for her rescue. And sarcasm.

[Hannah]

I love that. I also forgot about that moment that she came to her. So loved that.

[Kinsey]

Hannah, who's hot for you?

[Hannah]

Also, Dane. I felt like I made that clear. That was just crazy because if you would have listened. If you listened back to our season one, like, I would never have guessed that Dane would make it off of my not list and onto. Not just off, but like, onto the hot list.

[Carly]

I remember specifically Kinsey telling you during our Onyx storm prep, she said, just you wait, Hannah, you're gonna be eating your words.

[Hannah]

We should. And what did I say? I for sure will be.

[Kinsey]

And yeah, you were a certified Dane hater, and I was always a defender.

[Hannah]

I was not certified hater.

[Kinsey]

I'll take that back.

[Hannah]

I actually balanced it out quite well, but I was very.

[Kinsey]

I knew it was coming.

[Hannah]

Was very much so not a fan. And I expected to be turned into, like, a not not fan. I was not expected to be turned into a fan girl of him. You know what I mean? Like, oof.

[Carly]

Anyways, okay, I loved Taryn. I think he was just doing the most, trying to balance everything and take care of everybody.

[Hannah]

I am heartbroken for him in this whole last two sets of chapters here.

[Carly]

I know. Same poor baby.

[Kinsey]

Who's not hot for you.

[Hannah]

I didn't get this vibe the first read, but maybe I was paying more attention to the dynamics between other dragons and riders when we got different POVs. But I found Fear, just sarcasm to be very unhelpful and distracting for a squad leader's dragon. Like, did y' all pick up on that at all?

[Kinsey]

I totally did, because our hot not and our quotes are, like, the same this week because I also put them on my not list. I normally love sarcasm. You guys know me. I pick the funny quotes.

[Carly]

Yes.

[Kinsey]

I thought it was just too much, and I didn't catch it the first time. Like, first of all, I had to flip back and forth between Violet's keogie.

[Hannah]

That first time. I was trying to. I was skimming.

[Kinsey]

I was like, wait, did Violet die? Did she just get stabbed? Like, that's what I thought at first. I was, like, freaking the fuck out. And then I just, like, wanted to race through Re's chapter. And then, like, when I actually finished, I had, like, reread just, like, the ending chapters just because I'm like, okay, now that, like, Panic's gone, I know who's dead. I know who's alive. Like, I can reread this scene and pay closer attention to it. I still didn't catch it, but during this reread, I was like, you know what? You're kind of an ass.

[Hannah]

Well, I totally feel that way. And Imogen and Glean, I liked their dynamic, and I'm getting my head myself for next week. But, like, I loved getting to see that. It felt. Felt like it fit. It worked really well. But I feel like this is setting up to be important for the next two books. But what we know from Taryn being a general of dragons is that the dragons also being a leader is really important for their dynamic. And so where we see Violet being the one that kind of has to catch up to Taryn's level, I kind of feel like it's setting up for showing that RHY is solid. She is the perfect character, which we've talked about being afraid, because that's why Rebecca killed Liam off. So I'm worried for ri, but maybe ri's limitation in her leadership skills and abilities is actually her dragon. And I'm really nervous about that because I was totally expecting especially a green. I was totally expecting to love Fierge, but I did not enjoy their back and forth. It was like, you're going to get my favorite character killed. Can you, like, focus for a second?

[Carly]

I think it's hard for me to judge that off of one chapter because it wasn't even a very long chapter. I think that chapter's like six pages or something, so I don't know. I can't judge that yet. I thought that they were kind of funny. I understand what you're saying, but I'm also like. I mean, maybe if I had like, six chapters of this, I'd be like, that's enough of this.

[Kinsey]

Carly's like, we listen and we don't judge.

[Hannah]

I'm judging on this one. I hear you. But it was like, if we only got a small set, then I would expect. I don't want to set expectations necessarily for the writing of it, but I would think that for the first glimpse into it, Rebecca would be trying to paint a picture and send a message of their dynamic. And what was painted for my interpretation was concern for what that's going to look like for their dynamic in the next couple books.

[Kinsey]

I think we were hype with finally finding out who said, then let us be menaces. But, like, oh, I did like that. She was just second guessing everything to the point where it was distracting. Like, are you sure you want to do this formation? Are you sure you want to go there like, you want to? And I'm just like, look, you can either, like, say yes or no and, like, lead her into, like, a better direction instead of, like, making her feel incompetent.

[Hannah]

But anyway, we've talked about this, and I. I disagree. I actually really want to talk about this. I. I will say that it's hard to compare to Taryn, but we saw a contrast in that from Taryn being like, making a decision is better than you hesitating and questioning your decision. If that is the message Rebecca is sending to us through Taryn, then why is she having a dragon literally do that to the writer? All right, I'm off my soapbox.

[Kinsey]

Carly, who is not hot for you?

[Carly]

Asher.

[Kinsey]

Oh, he's dead.

[Carly]

Why? He's not even in these chapters. But the Whole time I was reading them, I'm like, you know what? If he would have just maybe shared some knowledge and talked to his kids, maybe Violet wouldn't be having to risk her life to save Meera's. And all of this falling apart. And I was just like, you know what? It made me realize how much I feel like Asher really kind of internalized a lot of Hadanus ideals of withholding knowledge and making Violet prove she could get it and is worthy of it, instead of just like believing in his own fucking kids. Like, it's also like, in Darna.

[Hannah]

That's valid.

[Carly]

I just got to these chapters and I was like, you know what, Asher? Maybe you would have just had a sit down conversation with your kids instead of creating some world's weirdest, like, freaking scavenger hunt.

[Hannah]

You okay over there, Corly?

[Kinsey]

You know, this reminds me, and I'm not gonna say which character, but in Crescent City, I am a certified hater for a character for that exact reason. So I feel fully, fully get where you're coming from.

[Carly]

Yeah, I just.

[Hannah]

At this point in the books, I.

[Carly]

Was like, you know what? You could have done better. Yeah.

[Hannah]

I think it begs the question of why he didn't.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

And I will say that they would have been quite young before, and he probably didn't expect it. But then again, I have a theory that he did expect to die. So, like, he had time to get.

[Carly]

Those journals hidden out on the other island and like. And make Violet prove that she was. I'm like, this is some bullshit. Okay, maybe if you had prepared your children.

[Kinsey]

I mean, even just withholding the fact that she was almost dedicated to a God, like, yeah, he knew her hair was different. Like, they couldn't explain.

[Hannah]

I feel like he was scared that. This is totally. This whole section is turning into discussion. I feel like he was scared that she was gonna actually turn, turn, turn. I don't know.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, he could have literally warned her and then she'd be like, oh, fuck, venom are real. Like, it could have just helped move everything along.

[Carly]

That's what you say.

[Hannah]

But then we wouldn't have the books we have. So.

[Kinsey]

Yeah. Different conflict. Anyway, getting rid of the conflict. Let's talk about our favorite moments.

[Hannah]

I think I could speak for all of us. That Dane talking Sloane through it. Like the. Talking Sloane through it.

[Kinsey]

You know, like, okay, clearly for me, it was when Dane and Sloane were working together. It's just Chef's kiss.

[Carly]

I think I said something very similar. In our initial reactions episode, there was some unhinged reactions around this, if you want to watch that there in our initial reactions. But I think for me, just overall across these chapters was just Violet trusting her squad and staying focused on her goal. I appreciated that growth in her. I was here for it.

[Hannah]

I do agree. I really like to see the dynamic and the message that was getting across of, like, other people have to do what they're doing, and you have to trust them to do it, and Violet can only see what she is. I love that we got POVs. Thank you, Rebecca, for adding for those.

[Kinsey]

And I hope this means we'll get more and not just at the end. Favorite quotes.

[Carly]

Carly, It's Violet. She's speaking of Imogen. She says, quote, she'll rip this very sky apart before she and Glayne accept defeat.

[Kinsey]

Ain't that right?

[Hannah]

Yeah. I totally said glean earlier instead of glean.

[Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Carly]

I could also be pronouncing it wrong. I do my best.

[Kinsey]

My favorite quotes, to no surprise, were all from Danan Sloan. So, of course, the iconic eyes here. And then Dane said, you're not a weapon of destruction. You're not Venon. You're the artery power chooses to flow through your life. It's so cute. And then Sloane goes, I'm gonna hurt you. And then Dane goes, guts. Don't I know it. That's the one I typed in my notes. I said, oh, Lord Jesus, there's a fire. Yeah, that did it for me.

[Carly]

So your favorite quotes are a paragraph of an entire moment in the book.

[Hannah]

Yeah, it's an excerpt. It's her favorite excerpt.

[Kinsey]

Specifically, eyes here and God's don't I know it.

[Hannah]

Yeah, mine is God's don't I know it. And I know that eyes here gets all the hype, but for me, Gods don't I know it is what I highlighted. That is the what? That is absolutely perfection. And the fact that, like, it's nothing to do. It's a valid response to what she says, but, like, it's foreshadowing. So the foreshadowing's so juicy. It's so good. Steamy before it's even steamy. You know what I mean? This isn't really a quote, but I just loved when Bodhi called Zaden the Duke of Angst. That was great. And an honorable mention we get. You are an inconvenience for which there is no adequate measurement from Sigeil. I put it on here because I thought one of us has to have it. So I noticed you guys didn't. That is on there. It has to have its moment to shine. I loved that interaction with them. I just want to point out that I didn't have Zaden quotes this set of chapters, and I highly doubt I will next set.

[Kinsey]

Probably not.

[Hannah]

It's been a great run.

[Kinsey]

I did have the Sigale quote in my personal notes, but I figured that since I had an entire excerpt from Dana and Sloan's conversation, I was like, I'll just stick to what's the best.

[Hannah]

Yeah, valid, valid.

[Carly]

All right, now let's stop by the scribe quadrant for our epigraph analysis of the most thought provoking epigraphs.

[Kinsey]

The chapter 58 epigraph reads, Most Cadets believe their ability to recite historical fact will usher them onto the Adept path, but it is actually the ability to observe and recount it that separates the Librarians from the scribes. Colonel Daxton's guide to Excelling in the Scribe quadrant.

[Carly]

This epigraph tells us that the scribe's true purpose is to record history as it happens, not to just know the history that has come to pass, which tells us that observation skills is one of the most important skills of a scribe. It is worth pointing out that this passage is written by Colonel Daxton, who is likely a relative of Asher, which means Azure was a legacy. In the Scribe quadrant.

[Hannah]

The chapter 59 epigraph reads, it was not without risk that the first dragons bonded humans, for though they clearly hold the power, their bonded riders made them the one thing they could not vulnerable. Many dragons suffered the loss of their bonded riders in the name of self preservation. The Sacrifice of Dragonkind by Major Diandra Naveen.

[Kinsey]

This epigraph makes it seem like dragons can choose if they die with their riders, just as Taryn has decided with Violet. Instead, most dragons would rather choose suffering and momentary vulnerability over dying with the riders. It calls back to the chapter 14 epigraph from 4th Wing. In the six centuries of recorded history of dragon and rider, there have been hundreds of known cases where a dragon simply cannot emotionally recover from the loss of their bonded rider. This happens when the bond is particularly strong and in three documented cases has even caused the untimely death of the dragon. An Unedited History by Colonel Lewis Markham. It also calls back to the Onyx Storm Chapter 47 epigraph where a dragon determines its last flight because dragons are choosing if they perish with their riders. If suffering through the loss of a bond can be done between dragons and their riders, then perhaps it can also be done with mating. Bonds between dragons don't even go there. I don't want to, but I have to. This might foreshadow that Taryn and Sigale are suffering through the loss of their bond in order to survive the distance between them while Zaden is away doing Venon. Shit.

[Carly]

Just gonna move on from that. The Chapter 60 epigraph reads, the only thing more stubborn than a dragon is its rider. Colonel Kaori's Field Guide to Dragonkind.

[Hannah]

This epigraph foreshadowed its own chapter with Violet making Taryn leave her on the ground to carry Tine when it wasn't safe, and right after Sigale had just ordered her to get off the ground and stay with him.

[Carly]

The chapter 61 epigraph reads, Command is built on respect. Rules and obedience. Squads are built on trust. Leadership for Second Years by Major Pippa Donans.

[Kinsey]

This epigraph was placed right after Violet realized she can't be everywhere at once. So it fits perfectly with Violet trusting her squad to handle their own objective.

[Hannah]

It was also setting up Rhys chapter and how they navigated the battle together.

[Kinsey]

The chapter 62 epigraph reads, There is no goddess more wrathful than Dune. Entering her temple will slice the soul from any attendant who has shunned her grace. Major Rorrily's Guide to Appeasing the Gods, 2nd Edition.

[Hannah]

This epigraph was setting up to explain how the dagger gifted from the priestess of Dune would be able to kill Theophany. Given that the dagger was made from the temple marble, Violet stabbing Theophany with it was equivalent to theophany entering the temple. And hence it sliced her soul, allowing her to die even though she was Venon. Which is interesting, because you do have to have a soul for it to be sliced, and Vennon do not.

[Carly]

Perhaps since she was dedicated, she also retained a piece because it was dedicated to Dune.

[Kinsey]

Kind of like a Horcrux.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Who. Okay, well, that's still notable.

[Kinsey]

Pieces of the soul survive.

[Hannah]

We're kind of working under the assumption that Zanan is one of the first. That's intriguing.

[Carly]

Maybe he'll have to dedicate himself so he doesn't lose the last little bit.

[Kinsey]

That's what I think.

[Hannah]

I don't think I've ever heard that theory.

[Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Now take flight with us over to the hatching grounds for our Easter eggs and moments of foreshadowing, starting with chapter 58.

[Kinsey]

All right, since we are entering the last few chapters of the book, we're watching everyone's movements. We know that Zaden, Berwyn and the new brother end up in the. We get Auric flying South at the beginning of battle against orders in chapter 59, Violet thinks that she's going to throttle Arryk as soon as she figures out what the fuck he's currently doing in Rhys POV. He's unaccounted for. Later in chapter 62, Arryk brings the army from Zelnya to the southern valleys. He's not mentioned or seen again in the battle or for the rest of the book. Since he was last seen in the southern valleys, I'm going to assume he's still in the southern area. He could know about Zaden being Venon through his Precog signet. He definitely knew how most of the battle would unfurl, and I'm sure Zaden's Onyx Storm was part of that. He was part of Quest Squad and saw Zaden suffer for five months and he's the last person Zaden would expect to turn because he's a Prince of Navarre and joined the writers to fight against Venon, unlike his brother and father who didn't give a fuck.

[Hannah]

So all right, now that you've given your case for arc in this set of chapters, I'm going to give the case for Garak. We have not. None of us have like cemented our opinions, so let that be clear. But we're just providing like what all we found about each of them in this set of chapters. So with the context that Rebecca did tell us that the brother is someone who felt like they didn't have enough. So here is evidence for that being Garak through how much he has distance wielded in this set of chapters. Heads up, it's a fucking lot. Yeah, and I will be referencing these more concisely in the next episode, but detailing them all out here as we continue to track. First, Garruk wields from Orisha to Basgaeth to get Jack, which we know is about an 18 hour flight and I am working under the assumption that it takes more power to wield farther distances. He then wields to Dreythis from so assuming relative to 18 hours, again a lot. And at this point we get this line in chapter 58 quote, Garruk dismounts, then walks to the ribstad chest with slower steps than usual and pulls the keys from his pocket, showing he is already exhausted after those two trips. Right? That's pretty early on for him actually. He then wheels Jack out to safety to God's nowhere and I do imagine that is Arisha. We don't know for sure, but let's count it so say four hours. And after all of this, in chapter 60, Violet asks Bodega, can Garak get Tine up the cliffs? Bode responds, under normal circumstances, yes. Bode winces and says, but he's already exhausted from walking all over the continent in the last few hours. There's no chance now. This all happens before Imogen's pov where we're going to pick up on this next week.

[Kinsey]

End of report and next we get foreshadowing of Zaden being called south to Berwyn when Zaden's shadows won't obey his command. First, in chapter 58, Zaden's shadows are described as curling over the toes of his boots and drifting south. Zaden then glances toward the doomed city. And again in chapter 58, when Theophany says Berwin's name, Zaden tenses and his focus swings south toward the city again. And then in chapter 59, he projects a stream of shadow toward Theophany, but the bands fly southward. Each of these were clues that Zaden was being summoned by Berwyn. And this last quote could also support our theory that initiates can't attack any higher ranking Venon, not just their main sage.

[Carly]

Next, we get another mention of Violet's power being tied to Wrath and potentially Dune. My grip tightens on the pommels and I can't tell if it's Taryn's rage or my own stampeding through my veins, but it tramples every last ounce of my fear, my doubt, and my guilt until I am nothing but wrath.

[Kinsey]

And next, at the beginning of the battle, Theophany was certain that Violet would turn Venon over, a combination of saving her sister, defending her lover, and revenge. But Violet didn't turn while battling Theophany. Either Meera is still in danger, and this is foreshadowing Violet turning later, or Theophany and a potential Venon precognition were wrong because Theophany was absolutely convinced it would happen, which makes me think someone actually predicted it.

[Hannah]

Or she was just teasing her. But yes, I hear you.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, I'd like to toy with the.

[Carly]

Thought that it's a Precog for Chapter 59. We have previously mentioned Violet being called to play with her power, and it seemed that it was possibly Dune calling to her. But now we get this quote from Theophany. Time to play Violet. Perhaps Dune and Diophony were both competing for Violet.

[Hannah]

Ooh, good catch on that. We've gotten quite a few of those play references. I like that.

[Carly]

Yeah, it is odd language.

[Hannah]

Yeah, this next One is really just clearing up some confusion around Brennan's runed scar. So this is the quote that everyone's up in arms about. Quote, Brennan walks away weird. There's no mark at the back of his neck like he carries on his palm. And there hadn't been one on Dane's wrist either. So a lot of people are confused about this part because they're questioning why there wouldn't be a mark, thinking something is up with Sloane or Dane, rather than realizing that this actually shows us Brennan's mark didn't come from Naolan as a siphon, that there is something more going on. Violet is not aware of that to this point, so she is questioning it. She's making that connection in real time, not jumping necessarily to Naolyn, but we're doing that. She's just sorting this out. She's. She's a little behind on this. It does also support the whole Brennan is a Wyvern theory, but we won't spiral into that one right now.

[Kinsey]

I went into that enough in season two.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Kinsey]

Violet continually prays to the gods and they seem to listen when Mira is attacked by theophany. We get three notable quotes. Malak, please, no, not Meera. I yell at whatever deity will listen and press harder. And then for the third one, you can't have her. I whisper up to Malak and I swear the clouds darken slightly in acknowledgement, or maybe mocking, as two reds approach from the south at tremendous speed.

[Hannah]

I'd also like to point out here that it's not just the clouds darkening. That is a sign of acknowledgment. We also know that the two Red Dragons are Sloane and Dain's, which literally could be interpreted as a gift from Malak sent to save Mira's life.

[Kinsey]

We also get a moment where Violet sees the wyvern approaching the past and she thinks Dune be with them. And as far as we know from Rhys point of view, they didn't have any casualties. So yet again, except for at the past.

[Hannah]

Quinn.

[Kinsey]

No, but she wasn't with Rhy.

[Hannah]

Yeah, I think I just kind of took that part as she was praying for everyone.

[Kinsey]

But no, she was specifically looking at the past and thinking about Ri. Because the wyvern were flying and she said, do.

[Hannah]

Sorry, Rebecca. Rebecca clarified to us right there that anyone at the Past was not safe. We should have known that it was Quinn.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, exactly. That should have been it. I'm just kidding. But I just want to know, why are all of Violet's prayers answered? Are they compelled to answer since she's touched by Dune? Or is it, yet again, just vying for her favor?

[Carly]

I'm wondering if maybe the one Malik really wants favor with is Dune, which is why he seems to answer to Violet.

[Kinsey]

Ooh, I like that.

[Hannah]

Oh, shit. I like that a lot.

[Kinsey]

I mean, war does result in death, so they're kind of connected.

[Hannah]

Are they lovers?

[Carly]

Maybe the gods are mentioned together. Are they.

[Kinsey]

Maybe.

[Hannah]

What's the word? When they're kept apart? There's a trope for that.

[Kinsey]

Star crossed lovers. No, that's not it. Forbidden love.

[Hannah]

Sure, that one works. Feels like there's a different one, but. Yep.

[Kinsey]

All right, for my next one, Dane says, quote, fucking first years. And that's exactly what he'll be doing with Sloane later.

[Carly]

Hey.

[Hannah]

Oh, my gosh. Kinsey.

[Kinsey]

So I'd just like to point out we get more foreshadowing for the slain train. We also get.

[Hannah]

Not that anybody didn't know this, but Kinsey loves to talk about it, so go for it.

[Kinsey]

We also get parallels between their story and Violet and Zaden's wing leader versus first year father responsible for brother's death, enemies to lovers. So hopefully it's not an exact parallel, because that could make Dain the new brother. I don't think he is, but I'm all aboard the slane train and will literally do anything to guarantee a slane scene in the future books, so.

[Hannah]

And on the slane note, I also want to point out that Arryk sending Sloane with that letter wasn't just for the package and dagger's sake, but also because he likely foresaw Sloane being needed. The chain of events where Dain would follow and also be needed.

[Kinsey]

So he ships the slain train.

[Hannah]

Totally. He totally does. Or at least he sees that it's undeniable. Which, all of these were, of course, clues that Arryk was a Precog. And sets up for our next Easter egg, that Arryk sent Sloane with a package saying Violet would need it, but it was specifically addressed to Arryk and had an unbroken seal of Dune on it, meaning Auric never even opened. Was right there, guys. It was right there.

[Carly]

Next, we get a callback to how Taryn's power had saved Brennan in the past. Quote, your brother nears the limit of his power, Taryn warns, and I can't give him mine.

[Hannah]

That just makes me want to cry, thinking about how Taryn must feel every time he sees Brennan.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

I don't think I'm gonna talk about that later.

[Kinsey]

Okay, in the last on Page moment we have between Zaden and Violet. She demands that Zaden quote come back to me. And he responds, only ever you.

[Hannah]

Why did that not make my list? You know, why was that not a fair Only ever you. Too late.

[Kinsey]

Too late.

[Hannah]

Retroactively adding it, thankfully.

[Kinsey]

I think this quote means they won't be separated too long. In book four, the only remaining piece of his soul belongs to Violet. So he will return to her physically and maybe with a cure.

[Hannah]

What about Rebecca? Yarros says to you that they will only be apart for a short period of time. In book four, I need to, like, set expectations for all of our listeners and ourselves that this is gonna be the down bad book.

[Kinsey]

It's gotta go up on an up, and we're at the low.

[Hannah]

She said it's gotta get worse first.

[Kinsey]

This is the worst.

[Hannah]

And then it gets to the up. And so just want to brace yourselves, guys.

[Kinsey]

I'm just saying they're gonna get back together and she's gonna go for him.

[Hannah]

I was just emphasizing your not too long.

[Kinsey]

No, but like, they're not going to be separated the whole book. I don't think they are.

[Hannah]

We'll see.

[Kinsey]

Not even in their dreams. Like, she's going to see him. She's still going to be together.

[Hannah]

Now, I do agree with that.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, they're going to be together in some capacity. She's got the compass.

[Hannah]

I'm just saying Iron Flame exists. And that is a blueprint. For what? She's setting expectations. She finds all the ways to keep them apart. Anyways. Next. This moment stood out to me as odd, where Violet describes Zaden as holding her gaze for another few steps, then turning to Bode and saying, stay with her, but remember your promise. So I assume his promise is to take over Tyrandor based on Bode's response, I don't want your fucking province. But I am confused because if Zaden planned all along, like we've talked about, for this whole season, to leave Tyrandor to Violet, then that kind of contradicts this line here and supports the idea that Violet was the backup because Bode did turned. And not that she was like the plan all along.

[Kinsey]

I mean, I read this line and I thought the promise was to protect Violet because just a few chapters before this, Zayan said Bode would make an excellent duke if Violet was captured in battle. So Zaden is reminding Bode of the consequences of not keeping Violet safe.

[Hannah]

I didn't read that line about if Violet was captured in battle as implying that then Bode would take Over. Brennan was saying, if Violet's captured, you're gonna go get both of yourselves killed. And Zayden was responding, well, if I'm killed, then Bode's gonna make an excellent dude.

[Kinsey]

So he's just saying.

[Hannah]

I don't know about that.

[Kinsey]

I think he's saying what would happen. And then he just threatened that I'm gone.

[Hannah]

That moment. Yeah, both of them were gone. But my question here is, was Violet the plan A or B the whole time? Was Bode plan A or B?

[Kinsey]

I think Violet was plan A, and I think the promise was to protect Violet.

[Hannah]

We also get foreshadowing of Zaden leaving Violet, quote, I don't want to leave you.

[Kinsey]

Ha ha ha ha ha.

[Hannah]

Yeah, that one's a baby one. Anyways.

[Kinsey]

He should have made better choices if he didn't want to leave her.

[Carly]

So, you know, it's amazing how hard she can hurt us with so few words.

[Hannah]

Oh, man. I know.

[Kinsey]

Like, we made it a good one.

[Carly]

It's barely a sentence.

[Kinsey]

It's been my honor.

[Hannah]

You're just, like, on a mission to make us cry.

[Carly]

I know.

[Kinsey]

It's fine.

[Carly]

All right, next, we get some suspicious information about Tine. Violet says, quote, we'll figure out how to free Tine so she can follow. And then in chapter 60, Taryn says, he does not wake. When referring to Tine, Tine is both referred to as a she and he. The only other dragon that is notable for this is Bade, which was Jack's dragon. I am wondering if this is one of the clues that it is a dragon that may be hiding who they are.

[Kinsey]

I never caught this, and I don't think it was a typo.

[Carly]

I don't either.

[Hannah]

I think there's another dragon that was also described with he she pronouns. And was that Liam's dragon?

[Carly]

I don't remember.

[Kinsey]

I don't know. Maybe it's a case of when Rick Riordan changed the sex of the Pegasus. He just forgot that it was a she and then made it a he later on in the series and just stuck with it.

[Carly]

I think, given what she has told us, though, about dragons who aren't who they say they are, that she is very careful about what is referred to with these dragons and how they interpret.

[Hannah]

And I want to say that she brought that up in the conversations about, like, kind of paying attention to the last 100 pages, that she dropped a lot of Easter eggs, and I feel like she wanted to by the end because we were the stop on her Onyx Storm tour. I think she was looking for a reason to bring up this lore drop about the dragons lying and switching it out. And so I feel like that would be such a good way to let us know to look out for this.

[Kinsey]

And I feel like she. I mean, don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure she has a book Bible too. So this isn't a deep. Yeah, she does. So something like that would be a detail in her book and she wouldn't accidentally typed the wrong thing.

[Hannah]

She has implied that she also uses it religiously, that she has one per book. So maybe. Maybe there's a typo somewhere. But I feel like that's a stretch. I feel like this is pretty valid. Carly.

[Kinsey]

Amazing catch.

[Hannah]

Amazing attention to detail is incredible.

[Kinsey]

I never caught that. I wouldn't have caught that. That's insane.

[Hannah]

Now for chapter 60 first we have this line from Taryn. Do not lecture me on the laws of my kind or you will learn how comfortable I am brave breaking them. This could be foreshadowing Taran breaking dragon laws to help kill the elders and steal the eggs at the end of the book.

[Kinsey]

And maybe he must have already done something by breaking from the Empyrean to form the Eretion Riot and later when they went to alter the Wardstone. So if he hasn't done something bad before, what's gonna stop him from doing something?

[Hannah]

Oh, and I totally think like he is. He's made it clear he's comfortable breaking them. But I'm wanting to emphasize that, that it set up for the end of.

[Carly]

This book well and back and forth when he says this line about how dragons are bound by bonds. But he says it almost like he's frustrated about it.

[Hannah]

So I wonder, where does your mind go with that? I'm not connecting it.

[Carly]

He doesn't like the constraints of the rule system on dragons, and I think that there's a certain element of him being like, I know what needs to.

[Kinsey]

Be done, like altering the woods.

[Hannah]

He definitely thinks he knows better than everyone else.

[Carly]

Yeah. Yes.

[Hannah]

Now back to talking about Theophany, because apparently we just like, can't stop. I compiled a list of everything we learned about Venin from Theophany's various suspicious comments that we did not discuss in the discussion section, starting with the first excerpt quote. She's fast. Violet replies just as softly, remembering how she disappeared from the brig at this gaieth. So that is talking about the jack heist attempted. Okay, Theophany replies. There are only a few of us who are faster. Older too. My lips part she heard us from 20ft away. So here are the things we can take from that one. Only a few then, and are older and faster than theophany. Two, they can hear whispering from at least 20ft away. That's pretty intense. And also, Violet is describing her questionable disappearance here specifically as speed and not not distance wielding. So I stand by my belief that there is just one distance wielding Venon, or at least that not all Venon can distance wield. And the only thing I was hesitating about was that brig and explaining it. So that is explained to me now. There was also another moment where Violet and Rebecca double down on this in chapter 62, when Violet thinks that Theophany quote shrieks, then uses her speed to appear 25ft to my left, clutching her nose. So again, she's not distance feeling, if we take Violet's word for it.

[Kinsey]

To be clear, we also learned that Venon have an insane sense of smell because Theophany made a comment that Violet reeks of Bodhi's kin, AKA Violet smells like Zaden. It could be as simple as Venom being able to smell people's pheromones, or maybe they can smell bloodlines and or the exchanged bodily fluids from banging the night before. But regardless, it seems like all of their senses are way more powerful than the rest of the average human.

[Hannah]

Next, we have Pity you had to kill them. They take forever to generate. Are you ready to tip the balance, Violet? So this is in reference to Wyvern, which tells us that Wyvern take a long time to generate, thank fuck. Also, it's interesting to me that Zaden had turned as one of the most powerful riders. But Theophany is claiming here that Violet will tip this balance. Which brings us to our next thought from Violet. Having two lightning wielders on any side wouldn't just tip the balance, it would destroy it the same as Shadows. End quote. So Violet is implying here that Lynx and Zaden being on the same side would destroy the balance of magic, which is not a hopeful realization, because that would mean that Zaden coming back to the good side would either require Lynx to die or turn to maintain balance. But also Theophany is saying here that the balance hasn't tipped in the Venom's favor, even with Zaden turning, that it would require Violet to do so. So that tells us that the good side has been overpowered just trying to gauge where this balance line is. But I suppose we don't really know what Big Venn have or may have been killed that could have thrown off the scale to lean toward the good side being more balanced. There's like, it's so. This gets so muddied and it's so hard to nail it down.

[Carly]

I want to see like, Rebecca Yarros's math on this.

[Hannah]

Like, did she have these scales that she starts. Like, she put little blocks on scales and she's like, oh, links turned. Oh, Zaden turned. Let me put 10 blocks. Like, how does she bounce? Like, how does she actually make this accurate?

[Carly]

I mean, if we're seeing the venom being this big of a threat, what does that mean about what the dragons, like, how powerful they had become? Like, so I don't know. It's interesting to think about. Next, Theophany tells Violet, quote, your mother knew at your age that she was no match for me. That would mean Lilith knew before she reached the rank of captain or major. Which is when Lilith told Violet that most people are told the truth by leadership. So I am just wondering how long Lilith knew about Violet.

[Hannah]

Catch. Good catch, Harley.

[Carly]

Thank you.

[Hannah]

I was so distracted by her being the match. The age. That's so good. Okay, so we've previously discussed the lightning in Sineva possibly not being Theophany, but something to do with Dune. This doesn't discount the other moments, but it is mentioned as a revelation by Violet that it was a product of and a clue that Theophany was a storm wielder. Quote. I was wrong. She's not a lightning wielder. It had. This is the thoughts of Violet. It had struck in both battles, and I'd conflate its presence with hers when it was simply a byproduct of her true signet. She hadn't controlled the lightning during their assault on Sineva. She'd controlled the very thing. Control causing it. End quote. So that's like a clarification on one of our previous theories. Next, we get confirmation that Violet doesn't have a counter venon for her pure power signet. This is not about her dream walking signet quote. There is only one exception to the rule. Violet Sorengale. Imagine my surprise when it turned out to be you.

[Kinsey]

Next. While Theophany and Violet were fighting, Theophany made a comment that, quote, a weapon like you will only submit to someone stronger. So come, let's get this farce over with so you can begin your real journey. He's waiting. If Violet turns Venon, she gets a power boost. And I interpret this line to mean Violet will be more powerful than Theophany. Which is why Theophany is giving up on Being her teacher here, meaning Violet will only be less powerful than the main Venon in charge. It's wild that Venon can sense how someone's power will grow if they switch sides.

[Hannah]

I also want to point out how suspicious the situation is with Bodhi not being able to counter theophany. Because how is it that he is just now finding out that he can't counter Venon's signets when he has been in battles, multiple battles on page in these books where he is fighting Venon? That's less of an Easter egg so much as like a. This is confusing. We don't have an answer for this yet. And is an Easter egg we just don't know how to contextualize yet.

[Kinsey]

I have a theory on Bodhi that could explain it, though. It's very unhinged. So I'll talk about Bodhi later.

[Hannah]

And for chapter 61, we get another clue that Sinal is deciding or manipulating fate. From Re. Quote, Zanal gives what he sees fit.

[Kinsey]

There were so many mentions of luck and Zanal in Rhys chapter that I think he's heavily involved in this battle. And he's on the side of the writers against Venon.

[Hannah]

Ooh.

[Carly]

Next, during the fight with the Wyvern, RI notices quote. Aytrim flies by in pursuit, and a curl of green fire rushes up his tail. I cease breathing until the brown outruns the flame, saving Riddick from a painful death.

[Hannah]

How?

[Carly]

How does Riddick and a trim outrun a green fire wyvern when not even Teyrn is faster than them?

[Hannah]

You're not supposed to catch up with a green one.

[Carly]

No, they say specifically that they're faster than any of the dragons. So I'm just like, something weird is going on with Riddick and his dragon.

[Kinsey]

Unless Riddick is a Venon and is controlling the Wyvern and making the wyvern slow down so that he survives. Or someone that they know. Or someone that they know is doing this and sparing him.

[Hannah]

I just can't really enjoy that storyline.

[Carly]

And his personality and him being Venon.

[Kinsey]

No, I don't think it is. But I'm just trying to make sense of how this is even possible.

[Hannah]

Yeah, I think it says something more about Aytrim, personally.

[Kinsey]

And it's haunted me since we first read this line. As you guys have probably been able to tell from this entire season, I feel like we bring this up every single episode.

[Hannah]

On the topic of Riddick. During the battle when the wyvern shrieks and a paler shade of gray spreads along its Scales emanating from Riddick's hand. That was Riddick freezing the wyvern's blood solid through touch, which we got an Easter egg for at the beginning of the book that he was practicing. And not all ice wielders can do that. So just some more evidence that there's something special going on there.

[Carly]

I've got more on that in my theory down below on Reddit. Yeah. No, but that was wild. When I read that, I was like, what just happened? I had to reread like three times to be like, what just happened?

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Carly]

Next we get this little tiny moment where Violet is describing the storm that Theophany has created. She's frustrated. She says, quote, God forsaken rain. I found this too funny not to include. The rain was created by Theophany, who forsook Dune.

[Kinsey]

Oh, my God.

[Hannah]

Forsaken.

[Carly]

I just find it hilarious.

[Hannah]

That's one of those moments that's just, like, in retrospect, so satisfying. What a wonderful catch. It's a perfect little moment that was.

[Kinsey]

So intentional by Rebecca.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

God forsaken rain. Cause it was foreshadowing also that she was storm wielder and not just lightning. Like, that is so. Yeah. That's so good.

[Kinsey]

That's amazing. And finally, for chapter 62, it's notable that Taryn told Violet tine is quickly recovering under Brennan's care. Care not watch. They say signets don't work on dragons, but it would be interesting if Mender's signets actually do work on dragons. Or maybe he's just keeping watch while the sedative wears off. I just found the wording to be very suspicious.

[Hannah]

Is he trained to be a healer as well? Maybe it's just that could be. But I like that observation. Next we have this quote from Violet to Theophany. Fuck you. End of Easter egg. Just kidding. I've proved to Dune's favorite isle that I'm anything but the weakest, while she no longer car Dune's favor. I thought that the Isles people chose to worship a God, but I didn't realize that the gods reciprocated and favored them back. And so, in case you also didn't realize that. There you go.

[Kinsey]

Next. This is an obvious Easter egg, but in an effort to get Violet to turn, Theophany asked her if she wanted to have forever with Zaden. Which means Zaden is currently immortal, just like all Venon are. In order to resolve this, he will either have to be cured, or Violet will need to turn, or we'll get an awkward age. Gap where Xaden is a hot 24 year old forever and Violet is a grandma, which is nasty.

[Hannah]

So I didn't even consider that he'd be immortal. Yeah. And great for Violet, but she could still turn.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, she could turn or he could turn back.

[Hannah]

So we hope. Yeah.

[Carly]

Next we get quote. If Kaori and the others fail their orders, none of us will survive without falling back and abandoning the civilians. It is interesting that Kaori is being pointed out to as leading the officers. For a character that was not mentioned much up until the second half of Onyx Storm, he is suddenly mentioned many times and adds to the suspicion that he is up to something.

[Hannah]

I thought it should have said Pancheck. I felt like that would have been the perfect foreshadowing that Panchik was there. And the. You know this, he's. He's literally the leader of the riders quadrant. And so why is Kaori the only one mentioned that is so suspicious?

[Carly]

Well, and not like Kar, like who actually trains them for.

[Hannah]

There's just like, there's levels that you'd expect any number of these people to be mentioned before Korean.

[Kinsey]

I mean, Karr's not there, but okay. Brennan's on the sidelines, but like Felix should be there. And he's a general for Zaden, is he not?

[Hannah]

Felix is working on the alloy. That's what he's doing. Which is intriguing because we still don't fully know what his signet is. And so I'm curious about if it.

[Carly]

Has to, but it does feel like there's so many more people. It would have made sense. And it's Kaori.

[Hannah]

There's so many Orisha writers or Pancheck and Kaori. Like, why, like, why not mention Pancheck there? That's a.

[Kinsey]

Because Panchek was with Berwyn. All righty. Most likely.

[Hannah]

So at the beginning of the battle, like.

[Kinsey]

Cause he was gone before the battle even started. They assumed that he went to go get reinforcements, but reinforcements were didn't come from Basgaeth. Panchak just left. He went to go spill their plans and went to see Berwick.

[Hannah]

Oh, well, there you go. That's okay. That actually explains a little bit better. Why not Pancheck then?

[Kinsey]

Yeah, you're good. You're good. All right. For this week's ice watch, Violet reaches for Xaden through the bond and is, quote, met with a wall of black ice. Black ice. It is the first time the ice is described this way. For those who don't live in cold climates, black ice is especially dangerous. Because it's actually clear and hard to see. It's very slick, and people have a false sense of confidence driving over it before they lose control.

[Hannah]

That sounds about right.

[Kinsey]

Yes. I do think this comparison is intentional. Violet can see through the ice, Zaden is in danger, and he is going to lose control very soon.

[Hannah]

And that is what we call literary analysis.

[Kinsey]

Yeah, no wonder I got an A.

[Carly]

And finally, Theophany tells Violet, quote, to survive in our world, you must protect the magic that sustains you. I find this notable because the Venin are using magic in an unsustainable way. So it makes me wonder if this is foreshadowing that they have found a method to recycle the magic they use or generate more or something that allows them to be more sustainable.

[Kinsey]

I definitely also thought of recycling because of the wyvern.

[Carly]

Yeah. Because earlier she also says, like, repurpose. Like, repurpose the magic. And I'm like, what is going on here? What does she know about their magic system that we don't know that's allowing them to maybe, like, not run out of magic, but.

[Hannah]

Okay, but does this change our whole magic system understanding here?

[Kinsey]

Because we don't even have a solid definition on the magic system.

[Hannah]

But what we do currently understand is that the whole reason that there is this conflict between the dragons and the Venin is that the dragons are good, that they're using the Earth's magic as nature would like them to. But if nature likes everything in balance, that also means that nature is approving of venom. They just want it balanced, which is a whole other can of worms. But. But isn't the whole issue that Venin are not sustainable inherently because they steal it from the Earth, which is interesting language, and then it's used, and then there's nothing. Like it kills everything, and then there's nothing for the dragons and the other earthly beings to utilize. Hence, like that. If there's ways to not do that, does that not just solve the issue? And can't everyone just live in peace and harmony and all, like, get along?

[Carly]

I think there's just so much about the venom we don't know. It's hard to say what are we missing about the magic system? But I've been wondering for a long time. The way the Venin function doesn't really make sense. Why would you want to make more venom? To compete for the resource, right? Oh, yeah. The more Venin you have, the more people you're competing with for the same pie. Right.

[Hannah]

And you're literally asking Violet, someone who would be using a huge amount of magic to join your side. The logic is not there.

[Carly]

Yeah, well, and she's saying, to survive in our world, you have to protect the magic that sustains you. So that implies that the Venin have some way to protect the magic that sustains them.

[Kinsey]

Maybe they just kill their initiates that suck. And that's why she's trying to kill Jack, too.

[Carly]

But, I mean, still, they've really grown their army in the last 50 years. That's been implied a lot throughout the last couple books. So it's just, how are they sustaining the magic? What are they doing? How are they recycling it? Repurposing it? Like, it doesn't. Because the way that they function doesn't make sense for their goals. And so, to me, that tells me that they've figured something out that's gonna.

[Hannah]

Send me on a spiral. Yay.

[Carly]

That's what I'm here for.

[Kinsey]

We love.

[Hannah]

Which is perfect, because now this is the space to spiral. Theories.

[Carly]

We're in theories. Time for your signet sparring professors to help you hone your farsight and precognition sign.

[Kinsey]

Okay, this is really unhinged, and I'm not sure I fully believe it, but what if Bode has been playing all of them this entire time, Whether he's the brother or not? So before Onyx Storm came out, Rebecca said that there would be a family betrayal. Bode was one of my original suspects. But then after Onyx Storm, I just assumed the family betrayal referred to Violet's father, and we were done. But what if it is Bode and we just haven't gotten there yet? So after Theophany left in chapter 59, Bode got everyone into motion. Originally, Brennan was supposed to stay with Violet, but Bode told the battle strategist, who insisted Violet needs to stick to her assigned task, that I know you were supposed to stay, but take Meera, effectively taking Brennan away from his own objective. Bode then insisted that Zaden go too. It specifically says he urged Zaden and was reminding him there's a whole battle going on. To me, it came off as Bode trying to rush Zaden out the door during Zayden and Violet's final goodbyes. Which left Bode all alone with Violet. With no other witnesses for Theophany's next interaction against Brennan's original plan, Theophany taunted Bode and asked, tell me, do you not grow tired of being a less powerful version of your cousin? Which could be seen as a reason for Bode wanting to turn. Maybe he did grow tired of being seen as less powerful. Then there's the whole part about Bodhi's signet not working against Venon, even though he's battled Venon before. So this shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. I'd like to point out that Bode said it's working and Violet was the one who told him. No, it wasn't. Either he was one lying about trying to counter Theophany. Because she did point out that Venon loved to lie. One reason for lying could be to give Violet a false sense of security and set Violet up for failure. Or he's lying because he didn't want Violet to realize his signet doesn't work against Theophany because as a Venon, you can't harm your Sage, similar to how Zaden can't harm Berwin. Two, it's also possible Bodhi didn't know about this Venon limitation and thought his signet was working because it's worked against lower level Venon before. Or three, it's possible he's not Venon and just isn't powerful enough against Theophany. But it does seem like he was trying to set up Violet to be against Theophany without Brennan or Xaden. Maybe he's the brother. Maybe he's planning a betrayal. Or maybe he's legitimately just confused and not as powerful as Theophany. But all of these instances were highly suspicious and he is back on my shit list.

[Hannah]

Okay. Love the observation that he seems to kind of have been the one that got Brennan away. Like, I love that. I do wonder why Theophany wouldn't have outed him or, like, rubbed it in. Like, I guess I just don't understand Theophany's theatrics. If Bodhi was Venon, it does well.

[Kinsey]

To have a spy.

[Hannah]

Mm. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

You don't want to out somebody who's helping you.

[Carly]

Yeah, I've had an eye on Bodhi ever since that last part of 4th Wing, where I'm like, he seems really. Because he goes from, like, questioning Zaden and thinking this is a bad idea to take Violet to Orisha, which. What was the other option? Death to very quickly acting like he's on Zaden's side. He kind of flip flops really quickly. And I've kind of always been like, I love Bode, but also I find him suspicious because I just. I don't trust him.

[Hannah]

Yeah, like, wouldn't Zaden have been able to recognize that Bodhi had turned unless it was recent?

[Carly]

Well, but Satan also seems to. He says during his chapter that the sage has created him another sibling. So he seems to know that he already has one because another isn't.

[Hannah]

I kind of assumed that that was Jack is his other siblings. Yeah.

[Carly]

But he says it's another one to use against him. How would he. I mean, unless there's something about Jack we don't know. And how he can use Jack against Zaden. But what does Zaden care if Jack dies?

[Hannah]

That's true. I just want. Because I wanted to point out this thing that I noticed was also suspicious. But I needed to establish whether we actually thought Zayden would have known at this point because he should be able to sense new Venon like he should be able to sense Asyms and initiates. So I didn't point this out, but Bodhi was missing from two classes the days leading up to this. And Zaden gets on him for, like going to the front or somewhere and being in battle. And that's explained. It explained away why he was missing from those classes. But now we can place him at a battle that Zaden was or wasn't at. I don't recall. But I don't know why I've started going so against it. Being boaty. But these. Like, there's so much evidence that. Cause there's evidence for everybody.

[Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Why is there evidence for everybody?

[Kinsey]

I have like a top five.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kinsey]

All right.

[Carly]

I have a little theory here on Riddick. During Rhys pov, we get the following observation. Riddick stares at the northern peak, not the path through the valley, just south of it. Like he could see straight through the thing if he tried hard enough. And in the very next chapter, we get the following question that Violet asks Taryn. Why would riders develop farsight if you can see that clearly anyway? And Taryn replies, the privilege of our sight is afforded to few. I believe it's possible that either Riddick has a second signet and that it is farsight. These quotes are mentioned so close together, I find it highly suspect. These two points seem like they must be connected. If not a signet, it could be a feathertail gift, since the dragons don't always lose them as they mature. However, I also think it is possible that Riddick is the evolved offspring of venom, just as the Irid suggested might be part of the solution to the Venon. It might be why Riddick has kept his backstory secret, why he didn't immediately try to kill Zaden and was willing to hear Violet out. It might also explain not only how his Signet has gotten so powerful. But why? Riddick made that comment in Iron Flame about the weather in the Barrens. Why would he know what the weather there is like unless he's been there? It's worth mentioning that at least through the scene with the Ayren, and Riddick is almost certainly not Venon himself, or he would have been exposed. I want to point that out. I don't think he's Venon. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Holy shit. I'm fully convinced on the farsight thing, because I also highlighted that line. And then I was like. I kind of talked myself down because I was like, oh. But Reid just thinks it's. He's just looking. They just know Violet's in that direction. But I accept that part.

[Carly]

Okay.

[Hannah]

I don't want him to be doing anything bad, but it's not bad.

[Kinsey]

It's a good thing if he's the offspring, the evolved offspring of Venom, because that means there's, like, hope for Zayan and Violet. Maybe. It just makes you wonder why Riddick wouldn't speak up to Violet at this point if he is the evolved offspring. I feel like that's a really good point to bring that up.

[Carly]

I just wonder, though, if he just doesn't have enough information to be helpful. That's true. And so he's not gonna be like, hey, I have these, like, little pieces, but I don't have the whole puzzle. Like, and if it's his family, he may be trying to protect his family.

[Kinsey]

True.

[Hannah]

I mean, do we think he for sure knows?

[Carly]

I don't know that he for sure knows, but. Cause I think some of this could be explained away as just, like, coincidence. But I definitely think it's odd. Like, he is so powerful. His dragon is out running Wyvern. He seems to have these, like, kind of odd moments, these two quotes being mentioned so close together. There is something going on with Riddick. Whether it's a second signet, some reason for being able to be stronger. Maybe his dragon is lying about who he is. But it's just there's something weird going on there.

[Kinsey]

Absolutely. And that wraps up our deep dive into Onyx Storm chapters 58, 62. Thank you so much for listening. Don't forget to join us in our next episode as we break down the final chapters 63 through 66 and make sure to subscribe wherever you're listening.

[Carly]

Don't forget, you can access all of our episodes ad free a day early and on full video over on our Patreon. Plus extras, like my weekly Onyx Storm PDF annotations shoutouts, bonus resources, and exclusive access to our Dear Fantasy Reader Book Club.

[Kinsey]

You'll also find our Patreon link in the Show Notes along with all of the ways you can support the show, whether that's joining a tier, subscribing, leaving a review, or just sharing us with your fellow Romantasy readers.

[Hannah]

If you haven't already, check out our Season one fourth Wing through the Lens of Iron Flame Deep Dive.

[Carly]

We'd love to hear from you. Send us your thoughts, tag us on Instagram, or come fangirl with us over in our free Discord Chat. If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review. It would mean the world to us.

[Hannah]

Until next time, Dearest Fantasy readers, prepare yourselves for the final chapters of Onyx Storm as we continue our journey through the Empyrean series.

[Carly]

Yay. Only one more.

[Kinsey]

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