Mindful Microdosing & Mimosas with Katie Maloney

Summary

Detox Retox with Tom Schwartz Episode: Mindful Microdosing & Mimosas with Katie Maloney Release Date: April 22, 2025

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Introduction to Mindful Microdosing

In this episode of Detox Retox with Tom Schwartz, host Tom Schwartz welcomes guest Katie Maloney to delve into the intriguing world of mindful microdosing with psilocybin mushrooms, commonly known as magic mushrooms. The conversation seamlessly blends discussions on wellness and self-improvement with personal anecdotes and lighthearted banter, embodying the podcast’s signature mix of mindfulness and mischief.

Understanding Microdosing with Psilocybin

Katie Maloney kicks off the discussion by demystifying microdosing, explaining it as the practice of consuming sub-perceptual doses of psychedelic mushrooms. She emphasizes that microdosing does not induce hallucinations or intense trips but rather offers a subtle enhancement in mood, focus, and clarity.

“Microdosing is the practice of taking a sub perceptual dose of psychedelic mushrooms... you might feel a subtle shift in your mood, your focus, your clarity.”
— Katie Maloney [01:25]

Benefits and Precautions of Microdosing

The duo explores the multifaceted benefits of microdosing. Katie highlights several advantages, including:

• Mood Boosting: Reduction in anxiety and depression symptoms without the side effects associated with traditional medications.
• Enhanced Focus and Creativity: Acts as a "brain tune-up," facilitating problem-solving and creative thinking.
• Emotional Balance: Creates a buffer between stimulus and reaction, promoting thoughtful responses over impulsive reactions.
• Mindfulness and Presence: Encourages living in the moment, which is increasingly valuable in our digital age.

However, Katie also cautions listeners about the potential downsides. She advises practicing microdosing responsibly, recommending schedules like every third day to prevent tolerance buildup and urging awareness of personal mental health states, as mushrooms can exacerbate negative feelings in certain contexts.

“Microdosing can create more of a space between the stimulus and the reaction, making it easier to respond rather than react.”
— Katie Maloney [04:40]

Personal Experiences and Anecdotes

Transitioning from the technical aspects, Tom and Katie share their personal experiences with microdosing. Tom recounts an incident where a microdose led to unexpected sensations of detachment while driving, highlighting the importance of dosage and setting.

“I took one before I went to the doctor, and I was driving home on the 405 and felt like I was in a video game.”
— Tom Schwartz [09:12]

Katie echoes similar sentiments, discussing the nuanced effects of microdosing versus macro dosing, and the importance of set and setting in ensuring a positive experience.

“With the micro doses, you don't really feel a wave. Come on. It's very soothing and gentle.”
— Katie Maloney [10:42]

Reflecting on Their Relationship and 'Vanderpump Rules'

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to reflecting on Tom and Katie’s past relationship and their time on the reality show Vanderpump Rules. They candidly discuss the complexities of maintaining friendships post-relationship and the emotional toll of being in the public eye.

Katie shares her insights on personal growth, emphasizing the importance of being a better listener and setting healthy boundaries.

“I'm such a better listener. And like, when someone is having a bad moment, I don't... I let people vent, I listen.”
— Katie Maloney [14:15]

Tom expresses mixed feelings about the show's conclusion, describing it as "bittersweet". He articulates nostalgia for the camaraderie and energy of filming, while also acknowledging the dysfunctional aspects that ultimately led to the show's end.

“We all fell out of a decade together and all of a sudden, like, nobody's talking to each other.”
— Katie Maloney [23:23]

Current Projects and Future Endeavors

Shifting focus, Katie and Tom discuss their current lives and future projects. Katie mentions her foray into managing her own brand and contemplating opening a dive bar, humorously named "Once Upon a Tom". Tom shares his excitement about the upcoming season of The Valley and his work on various podcast projects.

“We don’t do the Barbara Walters things. We talk about all kinds of... [various topics].”
— Tom Schwartz [44:09]

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode winds down, Tom and Katie continue their heartfelt and humorous exchange, reaffirming their amicable relationship despite past challenges. They emphasize the importance of personal well-being, mutual respect, and the enduring bonds formed through shared experiences.

“I love seeing you. And I’m glad we’re... I’m glad we’re friends.”
— Katie Maloney [39:40]

The episode concludes on a warm note, with both hosts appreciating the intimate and honest conversation, leaving listeners with a blend of insightful information on mindful microdosing and a glimpse into the authentic lives of Tom Schwartz and Katie Maloney.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• “Microdosing is the practice of taking a sub perceptual dose of psychedelic mushrooms... you might feel a subtle shift in your mood, your focus, your clarity.”
  — Katie Maloney [01:25]

• “Microdosing can create more of a space between the stimulus and the reaction, making it easier to respond rather than react.”
  — Katie Maloney [04:40]

• “I took one before I went to the doctor, and I was driving home on the 405 and felt like I was in a video game.”
  — Tom Schwartz [09:12]

• “With the micro doses, you don't really feel a wave. Come on. It's very soothing and gentle.”
  — Katie Maloney [10:42]

• “I'm such a better listener. And like, when someone is having a bad moment, I don't... I let people vent, I listen.”
  — Katie Maloney [14:15]

• “We all fell out of a decade together and all of a sudden, like, nobody's talking to each other.”
  — Katie Maloney [23:23]

• “We don’t do the Barbara Walters things. We talk about all kinds of... [various topics].”
  — Tom Schwartz [44:09]

• “I love seeing you. And I’m glad we’re... I’m glad we’re friends.”
  — Katie Maloney [39:40]

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This episode offers a comprehensive exploration of mindful microdosing and its impact on personal wellness, intertwined with heartfelt reflections on relationships and personal growth. Whether you're a seasoned listener or new to the show, Katie Maloney and Tom Schwartz provide valuable insights wrapped in engaging conversation.

Transcript

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[Tom Schwartz]

It's now time for your weekly detox with Tom Schwartz.

[Katie Maloney]

Mushrooms, shrooms, boomers, giggle caps. Taking a peek behind the velvet curtain. Taking a ride on Ms. Frizzle's Magic School bus. Yes, those mushrooms, magic mushrooms, psilocybin. I'm sure you guys have heard of them. Maybe you're looking to break the reins of stagnation. The doldrums of your daily routine elevate your appreciation for the natural world around you. And remember how lucky we are to be freegan alive. Yes, I feel like almost everyone I know has tried shrooms. You know, maybe high school, college, on a whim with almost zero consideration or preparation to set and setting. Maybe you're in the parking lot at Denny's on a random Friday with a handful of silos, ibq, benzis, no particular place to go. I've been there, done that. But we're talking more mindful doses on this episode. Some people, many people have referred to taking shrooms as one of the most profound experiences of their life. You know, it can really help you get in tune with yourself, the natural world around you, the universe. And it's great for getting a fresh, different perspective on life. So, yeah, I'm sure you guys have heard of it. If you haven't, we're going to get into it. Microdosing, if you remember, was kind of sweeping Silicon Valley back around like 2015. It almost became like, it almost became memeified on the net. But it's mainstream now. You know, shrooms are no longer stigmatized. Well, maybe aside from like the federal government, as technically there's still a Schedule 1 drug, but they're being heavily researched and heralded for their practical applications, curbing addiction, ptsd. We're just here at the beginning with the potential of shrooms. So, yeah, let's get into it. What is the deal with microdosing. So microdosing is the practice of taking a sub perceptual dose of psychedelic mushrooms. Maybe around like a 10th to 1 20th of a full dose. You don't hallucinate or trip, but you might feel a subtle shift in your mood, your focus, your clarity. Maybe like a nice pleasant body high, maybe some giggles. Why do people do it? Yeah, let's. Let's break down the potential benefits. Okay. Mood boosting. Yes, Many users report reduced symptoms of anxiety, depression. Microdosing can kind of gently lift the fog without the side effects of traditional meds. It can lead to increased focus and creativity. Think of it as like kind of like a brain tune up. It may help with problem solving, thinking outside the box, getting into a flow state, more and more creative thinking. Also improved emotional balance. Yes. Microdosing can create more of a space between the stimulus and the reaction, making it easier to respond rather than react. Enhance connections like I talked about earlier. You might feel more in tune with your environment, Mother nature, the people around you. It's subtle, but it's grounding. Yes. More mindful, more present. It can help you feel more in the moment, which is especially important in an ever digital age. You know, we're all chronically online these days. It's also important to remember that everybody's body and brain are different. What works wonders for one person may not do that for the other person. Or maybe too much. That's why most protocols recommend microdosing every third day or so, to avoid building a tolerance. And you want to stay in tune with how you're feeling. Also, side note, if you're going through something dark or you have heavy anxiety, a life crisis, sometimes shrooms can also enhance a bad feeling. So just be careful. They're not a cure all, but they're a tool. Yes, I like that they're a tool. Microdosing, it's magical, but it's not magic. It won't fix deep trauma overnight or replace therapy, but it can be like a gentle companion on the path to healing, clarity, and maybe hopefully a little personal growth. So, without further ado, let's microdose. Here we. I am here with the one, the only, Katie freaking Maloney. Meloni.

[Tom Schwartz]

What's up? Did you call me Maloney? I know, so weird.

[Katie Maloney]

It is weird.

[Tom Schwartz]

Hi. Hi.

[Katie Maloney]

Thank you so much for doing this, you guys. I just got here and I thought this was gonna be. Well, listen, this is like a mindful microdose. You know what I mean? I thought it'd be fun to do a little Post VPR meditation hangout. But also I see you frequently. But we don't get to sit down a lot, so I was like, let's have a drink. So we're. So we're rebranding this one to microdosos.

[Tom Schwartz]

And mimosas, except we're not having mimosas.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, I'm having a little drink and you're having a little wine. By the way, I brought something special. That's why I wanted to bring another wine glass out here.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, my. Where did you get that?

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, you guys, in front of me. You want to describe what we're looking at, Katie?

[Tom Schwartz]

This is potion number three. This is the red wine, the red blend that we did. I like all those things on the back. It says hints of ripe red fruits and spice. A luscious blend to chill on ice.

[Katie Maloney]

The freaking witches of WeHo.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know, man.

[Katie Maloney]

Is that still for sale, by the way?

[Tom Schwartz]

I believe so, because. So Kristen Satina. When we started this, it was the. It was like a collab kind of thing. Yeah, Knocking point. Does collabs with celebrities and athletes and all different people. Well, they'll do just like, kind of like a one off. But we wanted to do more than one. We wanted to do as many as possible.

[Katie Maloney]

Pass that shit. I'm gonna pour a glass. You guys set and setting. When you're. When. Even if you're microdosing, when you're shrooming in general, it's important to take care of your set and setting. You know, you want to be mindful of who you're hanging out with right now.

[Tom Schwartz]

What your podcast is. You tell people how to do drugs.

[Katie Maloney]

It's very. It's very experiential. One week we expand the mind, body, soul. The next week we kind of let loose. This was gonna be a detox episode, but I guess we're kind of pivoting to a slight. A mindful retox. But set and setting. Katie, where are we?

[Tom Schwartz]

We're at my place.

[Katie Maloney]

Butters and Gordo are here.

[Tom Schwartz]

They're here.

[Katie Maloney]

I want to see if you guys can hear this. Butters is licking my leg. I have my favorite sandwich from something about her in front of me. It's the Drew.

[Tom Schwartz]

The Drew with Pudo.

[Katie Maloney]

I got to pour up a little Witches of Weho wine. And you guys, we took. So, like, apparently the standard dose for like a proper mushroom trip is 3 grams. Sounds like a lot. A microdose is usually one tenth of that. So the little gummies we took are 0.25 milligrams excuse me. 0.25 grams. A standard microdose is 0.33. Ours is a little less. I feel like I had, like, a nice strong matcha, except a little happier. A nice little mini body high. I feel tuned in.

[Tom Schwartz]

Do you remember when you gave me that little drink? The cava Kratom, Whatever it was. Do you need help?

[Katie Maloney]

I got it.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay. And I hadn't had. I. I'd have kava before, but I don't know what this was. And I decided to drink the whole thing.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

And this was. I was. I filmed with you at your place, and then I had to go. This is.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay. Just so they feel like they're here with us.

[Tom Schwartz]

And then this is when I went and filmed with Ariana and Lala and Sheena. And I think Lala and Ariana were kind of, like, hashing some things out. And I was eating the french fry, and I just felt like I was. I was there, but I wasn't there. Yeah, Like, I was like watching from a movie theater.

[Katie Maloney]

Like an astral projection of yourself almost.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. Like, I. I was like, oh, my God, Wait, I can't just, like, watch them have this conversation and be in throw. Like, I was eating popcorn. Watching, like, the french fries, like, but that's how I felt. Like, I was like, oh, my God, I'm swimming in the cosmos. I need to come back down to earth and get involved in whatever's happening in front of me.

[Katie Maloney]

But it was like, that sounds like a macro dose.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, no, that. That shit was. And the people are telling me they're like, that I told. That I drank that. They're like, I, like, got so addicted to. Apparently that stuff is addict. So you need to put warnings out there for people.

[Katie Maloney]

Not kava. But you're talking about Kratom, which is something different.

[Tom Schwartz]

Kratom is similar to kava.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. I haven't fudged with Kratom yet, but. But I'm going to do a deep dive into that.

[Tom Schwartz]

Actually, some of those drinks, like, that one has kratom in it.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. By the way, have you ever mindfully microdosed on a regular basis as part of your regimen? Like, to work out, to work on your podcast?

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, not. Not to, like, get creative juices flowing, but remember, I had the. Some. There was a contact I had with somebody. I won't give them away. I don't know how, like, legalize this is, but they. They did, like, microdose capsules. It was a really small amount. I also had, like, lines made in It. But it's small enough.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Do you remember?

[Katie Maloney]

I do remember those. Those are great.

[Tom Schwartz]

And the first time I ever did it, though, I did have a little bit of a. A situation. I remember I took it in the morning because they're like. You won't have any psychedelic effects. I was like, perfect. I took one before I went to the doctor, and I was driving home on the 405 and felt like I was in a video game.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God. So you actually started tripping a little.

[Tom Schwartz]

No. At the doctor's office, I was like, something's weird.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

I get my car and I'm like, something's very weird. But it was fine. It was. It wasn't like I was like, up. It was just slightly. There was a little bit of, like, a lens.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. And by the way, and for people who haven't done mushrooms, when you take them, usually it comes on in a nice, pleasant wave, unless you do too much. Then it's like a tidal wave. And, you know, there's. No matter how fast you run, you can't escape it. But with the micro doses, you don't really feel a wave. Come on. It's very soothing and gentle. It kind of washes over you in a gentle wave.

[Tom Schwartz]

It's like that. Euphoric.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, exactly. And it just makes you feel, like, a little more in tune with yourself, mind, body, soul, with the universe, you know? It's nice. On a hike, I love a micro do.

[Tom Schwartz]

And a hike, I love a micro do at Disneyland.

[Katie Maloney]

That sounds so fun. Pretty sure we've done that.

[Tom Schwartz]

Best time we.

[Katie Maloney]

I think we've done that.

[Tom Schwartz]

I think we did something else.

[Katie Maloney]

We've always been pretty good and mindful and respectful of shrooms. I feel like during the pandemic, we may probably overindulge because we. Out of boredom.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. Who was it that said it's the only way you could travel?

[Katie Maloney]

Was that Sandoval?

[Tom Schwartz]

I think it was. Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

It's the closest thing we have to time travel.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God. Wait, I remember the last time we all did them was. I think it was the night Bo and Stassi got married in our backyard. Didn't we have an after party?

[Tom Schwartz]

No, that was just us hanging out. They came and stayed with us.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, that's right. I'm thinking of the time where. Remember that one weird night where everyone was at our place? It was later in the pandemic. Guys, relax. But everyone came over and Jax took a ton of shrooms, and we were all laying out in the backyard. We had The.

[Tom Schwartz]

That was just a night we were all hanging out.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, it was such a fun, pure night. But then I remember Jax went home and confided in Brittany. He's like, brittany, I'm freaking out. I'm pretty sure Tom and Katie were trying to have sex with me.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, my God. Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Like, he was being earnest and he.

[Tom Schwartz]

No, I know, but he was like. We were just trying to, like, calm him down. Definitely not trying to.

[Katie Maloney]

No. God, no.

[Tom Schwartz]

I would rather chew my arm off.

[Katie Maloney]

No, but he was just tripping really hard and I think he was freaking out. He was a little. Yeah. But, yeah, it's nice being here. It's so cozy. Can I ask you a question? I, for the longest time, figured I would probably never ask you.

[Tom Schwartz]

What?

[Katie Maloney]

How's your new boyfriend, Nick?

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, you've met him.

[Katie Maloney]

He's awesome, by the way. Nothing but great things to say about him. I actually was at the Broad at the LA art show, and I did an interview, I think, with Us Weekly, and I was gushing about him, and Katie talked to me the next day because she was picking up the dogs and she's like, do you have a crush on my boyfriend?

[Tom Schwartz]

You were like, yeah, you were gushing about him. And now I know. You followed him on Instagram. You guys followed each other? Yeah, funny. No, he's great. He's like. We became friends a year ago, and, you know, he was seeing someone at the time, and so we would just. We had, like, stuff in common. He actually, like, had a one point years prior to lived in the old building I lived in. So when I met him, who went to one of their shows with someone else at the time, and we were talking about la, he's like, I live in la. And I was like, I live there. And then we figured out that he used to live with my old building. But anyway, so we became, like, friends and would just, like, talk music stuff. And I invited him to the soft opening of Something about Her. He came, he brought his girlfriend at the time. I met her a few times, and. And then they ended up breaking up sometime during the summer. And he and I just started hanging out more.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Talking more. And then it just sort of like we went from being friends to just being more, like, pretty. Like, I don't know when you. When you know somebody already pretty well, it's just like you decide like, that you just want to, like. I don't know. Yeah, dating is so weird, you know? And it's like, yeah, people are terrible at communicating. It's always just sort of like, I guess we're not hanging out anymore. I don't know. It's a weird, weird vibe. But it wasn't like that with him because we were already friends.

[Katie Maloney]

I feel well equipped for it. I don't love dating, but I feel well equipped after being married, being with you for 12 years, I feel, you know.

[Tom Schwartz]

Are you, though?

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I am.

[Tom Schwartz]

What have you learned?

[Katie Maloney]

I'm such a better listener. And like, when someone is having a bad moment, I don't. It doesn't trigger my fight or flight anymore. I let people vent, I listen. I don't try to give them a logical answer.

[Tom Schwartz]

You let them be emotional.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Without criticizing their emotions.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. And you come home every night. You whipped my ass into shape.

[Tom Schwartz]

Not really, but. What, do you come home every night?

[Katie Maloney]

Yes. Oh, my God, I'm so much more tame now.

[Tom Schwartz]

I don't know. I'm so good with your girlfriend.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, she's not my girlfriend.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay.

[Katie Maloney]

But we're really good friends.

[Tom Schwartz]

What happened with the girl that you were seeing?

[Katie Maloney]

We're just really good friends now. I try to.

[Tom Schwartz]

What does that mean?

[Katie Maloney]

I just listen. I try to be respectful of her privacy. She's very private, but.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay. Well, that's. That's a little difficult to do when you're dating someone who's not private, but.

[Katie Maloney]

Like, let's just say. Listen, I don't want to be self deprecating, but like, you know better than anybody. Maybe it's not the biggest flex to be referred to as Tom Schwartz's girlfriend. I. I saw her getting relegated to that and she's so much more than that. You know what I mean? She's a awesome human being, but let's not do a deep dive into that.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay?

[Katie Maloney]

I'm good. I'm happy right now.

[Tom Schwartz]

All right.

[Katie Maloney]

I'm peaceful.

[Tom Schwartz]

So you're friends, but you're not dating?

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, we're not dating, but I'm going.

[Tom Schwartz]

To go the other one.

[Katie Maloney]

Wait, am I just kidding? Am I the. Oh, God.

[Tom Schwartz]

I saw she's. I don't. We don't got to give, you know.

[Katie Maloney]

But like, we can maybe talk about that on your podcast.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay.

[Katie Maloney]

By the way, am I the only non musician you've ever dated?

[Tom Schwartz]

No, I dated an actor.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, that's right.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

But yeah, I feel like a lot of them have been in the music.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. Well, you seem happy. The sandwich shop is crushing. Every time I walk by, there's a line outside again. Got my favorite sandwich from. Something about her. It's the Drew. You were just there today. How was it?

[Tom Schwartz]

It was good. We got, like, some. A little bit of a rush in there, so I didn't want to, like, stay too long or take up too much space, but I like popping in there for, like, a couple hours here and there and, you know, having a sandwich, hanging out, vibing out. I love being there. It's such a. It's such a, like, cozy little spot, and it was exactly what we wanted it to become. So it's really nice to just, like, being there and, like, you know, obviously vibe out on, like, some future plans that we want.

[Katie Maloney]

And what about what's up with the menu placement you promised me?

[Tom Schwartz]

I didn't promise you anything.

[Katie Maloney]

The Schwartz and Sammy. It's a Muffaletta. No, that's a little too close.

[Tom Schwartz]

I remember you did bring a muffler. But, I mean, if you ever had the Cameron. The Cameron's similar.

[Katie Maloney]

I had it when you guys were doing R D and test. In doing taste tests.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, but that.

[Katie Maloney]

That.

[Tom Schwartz]

Those. Those recipes and sandwiches don't exist anymore. Like, our Italian is on up. It's called the Cameron.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. By the way, if you guys haven't been super chic, kind of Parisian, and it's delicious. I go a lot, actually, but the line usually dissuades me, and I don't. I feel bad cutting.

[Tom Schwartz]

There hasn't been a line recently. As long as you don't go, like. Yeah, if you go between, I don't know, 12 and 2, it might be a little unpredictable in terms of line.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. You guys. You guys.

[Tom Schwartz]

Uber eats, though.

[Katie Maloney]

You're on Uber Eats, by the way. Props. You guys are in there a lot. You know, you guys are doing the damn thing.

[Tom Schwartz]

Remember when you're like, you got to, like, be in there, though. When I wanted to help with swords and sand, he's like, yeah, but you're going to have to, like, be in there. I'm like, I'll be in there.

[Katie Maloney]

I know, I know.

[Tom Schwartz]

Only because I guess sometimes became really overwhelming to be at, which is, you know. But that was also for other reasons, too.

[Katie Maloney]

No, you've. You've always been better about setting boundaries, but also you're really gregarious and super friendly to fans. I see that, and I know they appreciate that.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, yeah. I'm. I don't. I'm not as friendly as you are. You. You take it, like, to the next level. I do. I can be kind of shy.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

With strangers. And so sometimes I just keep it, like, really short and sweet. But, like, I'm happy.

[Katie Maloney]

I aim to please master people pleaser over here.

[Tom Schwartz]

How's that going for you?

[Katie Maloney]

I'm. I have healthy boundaries and my peace is protected now. I'm not on a lease for, I'll just say, five figures a month. And I feel like I can breathe again. Nice deep breaths, Very mindful, very present. I'm not floundering.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay. But I was asking how the people pleasing.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, no, it's great. My boundaries are up. All right.

[Tom Schwartz]

What bound. What Boundaries are most important with people pleasing.

[Katie Maloney]

Don't drink too much with them. Don't follow them on Instagram. Definitely don't give out your number.

[Tom Schwartz]

You're like, those are some good places.

[Katie Maloney]

You're like, this is 101.

[Tom Schwartz]

That. That's just like, stranger danger.

[Katie Maloney]

The look she just gave me, you guys, I was. I was coming back from TomTom because I've been trying to get brunch popping again the other day, and Donna texted me on the way home. Donna's the. The new homeowner. She bought our home.

[Tom Schwartz]

You talk to the new home?

[Katie Maloney]

No, but. No, my mail still goes there.

[Tom Schwartz]

Why?

[Katie Maloney]

I don't know. And she's like, bro, your mail's still coming.

[Tom Schwartz]

You have to go to the post office.

[Katie Maloney]

It's just two things from two banks. And honestly, I just tell her to throw it out every time. But sometimes when I drive by the house, I just. I. I don't get sad, like, but I. I. This by. This is not a cry for help, but, like, I. I sometimes will shed, like, a tear. It's not like a sad tear, it's not a happy tear, but it's just kind of a nostalgic tear, you know? I'm just like, I miss that crib.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know, I know, I know. I mean, I know what you mean, but, like, I can't think of it like that. I mean, it's, like, been completely redone. Not even the same, like, house.

[Katie Maloney]

Very tastefully, mind you, by the way.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

It's not something masochistic. I go. I don't go out of my way. But sometimes if I sit across the.

[Tom Schwartz]

Street and play sad music, like, hello, is it me?

[Katie Maloney]

I sit across the street and I play the Vanderpump Rules theme song.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, God.

[Katie Maloney]

Were they the best days of our lives?

[Tom Schwartz]

They were days.

[Katie Maloney]

They were something.

[Tom Schwartz]

They. No, I mean, listen, I. I wouldn't want to change anything. I mean, like, there was times that were really difficult, and I would. I was watching the Valley the other night. I'm like, I'm so glad I'm not filming a TV show because I just thinking about their walk ups that they're doing, having the conversations that they don't want to have and it just, it is so. It can be really draining. It can also be the best time ever. But like totally where I'm at right now, I'm really happy just getting to like enjoy my life and the way I want to enjoy it. We worked on that show for almost 12 years. I know there's only 11 seasons. Like 12 years was 12 years. And so it was just, it's been so nice to just be like, I get to just like hang.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

And like, yeah, I'm working the podcast. There's things I'm working on but like.

[Katie Maloney]

Shout out to the hundredth episode. Disrespectfully.

[Tom Schwartz]

Disrespectfully.

[Katie Maloney]

If you don't follow, follow now.

[Tom Schwartz]

Tomorrow Tom will be on disrespectfully. So it's like this is a twofer. This is a back to back.

[Katie Maloney]

You're killing it. By the way, before we move on, like, I remember when the show was ending, you were pretty vocal about not wanting to come back even if we did get another season and people gave you so much. They were hitting you with the sure Jan meme. Yeah, I saw that a lot. But like I think you were being honest. I, I think it wasn't a, it wasn't a deflection or a self defense thing. I think you would made peace with being done with the show. Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh yeah, no, I was, I was very, very much ready because. And I talked to my mom about it and that was like, I was almost nervous talking to my mom about it cuz I'm just like, she's probably going to try to like convince me or no, but she just is like, are you going to be okay for money? I'm like, yeah, of course. And then I was just. She's like, you know what, I support that. Like, I can just tell that this past year was not good for you. You were really, really unhappy. And I think I just hit a wall. And I was like, either the show's going to end tremendously and I'm going to be like walk and feel good about it or I'm gonna eventually get to the point where I'm like, I can't do this anymore.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. By the way, I feel like, well listen, it is a great job. It's a great job to have. It's like, you know, you get to fly first class. It's like obviously being a cast member on a Bravo television show, not to be a brown nose over here, but it's pretty freaking awesome, right, Katie?

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

It has a. It has many fringe benefits and there's.

[Tom Schwartz]

A lot of stuff I'll miss. I'll miss, like, watch what happens live.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

I'll miss, like, all those things, you know, but being on the show where you. It's just. It's designed just to break people down is, like, really difficult.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, just to be radically honest and raw. I don't know if it's designed to break people down.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, the thing is, I was radically honest and raw, and that's a byproduct, I think.

[Katie Maloney]

And they don't. Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

But I think sometimes it can't be shown in the way that it's most intended from me. Because if I was in editing room, I'm like, well, that's not how I meant that shit. And I thought that was pretty clear. But I don't know, my delivery or blah, blah, blah. But I don't know. I think also don't take this the wrong way, but for one thing, the cast was so divided. People just.

[Katie Maloney]

We all so disjointed.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. Like, I just didn't, like, truly did not want to with some of those people.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. We don't have to get into that.

[Tom Schwartz]

But then also, it's just like. I just also don't know if me. If it's the healthiest thing that, like, I'm trying to go on trips with my ex.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Not that I don't like. I'm very. Was happy to see you and we. It's. We have a good relationship and the dogs and everything like that, but it just was feeling like this is.

[Katie Maloney]

I get it's starting to feel. It might have felt a little contrived had we had another season. The reason I was rooting for another season, not obvious reasons, not more money, but I. I was like. I didn't love the way it ended. It just felt like such a chasm. It kind of felt sad because even though we were highly dysfunctional, Katie, you know, burn better than anybody, we were like, also a big, happy, dysfunctional family for a while.

[Tom Schwartz]

Not at the end there. There was no family vibes.

[Katie Maloney]

I know. It's just like we spent 10 a decade together and all of a sudden, like, nobody's talking to each other. Well, some people talk to each other, but yeah, it just was. Made me kind of sad the way it ended, you know?

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, yeah, because I think after that many years, we would have hoped we could have gone out on some Kind of high note, or at least been like, this is our last season. Let's just put our hearts in it. We don't need to, like, with each other after. But, like, I don't know, it just. It. Yeah, it did feel very kind of anticlimactic. But, you know, even though I was fine with it and I wanted to walk away, it was like, I don't know. This just feels weird.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I remember. I don't even know if you know this, but I found out. Well, I chose. A month away from our last day open at Schwartz and Sandy's, I. I chose. We all decided as a group partners, what day we're going to is going to be our last day. So in my mind, Schwartz and Sandy's is officially closing Bittersweet. We're not going to go into that. But then the next day, I found out from our executive producer that Vanderpump Rules is ending. And it just was like a. That I was like, that's my whole life, man.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know. I remember everyone's like, did they announce this on purpose? Like, I know. I mean, the thing is, I had a feeling it was happening because just the conversations that were going on of like, okay, well, maybe we could do this hold this month or potentially this date. And I was the whole time, like, I talked to Alex Baskin and Jeremiah, and I'm like, bro, I'm not doing it.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

But there was a. There was a world where they were going to maybe do some type of, like, you know, putting a bow on people.

[Katie Maloney]

I thought we were going to do an abbreviated season. It was in talks, but we just couldn't get the right chemistry going. I'm not a producer. I'm not behind the scenes.

[Tom Schwartz]

Just something to make it a little more finite.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

We're just not necessarily about going and having, like, you know, happy hour with everybody, but just sort of wrapping it. Wrapping up.

[Katie Maloney]

Are you gonna watch the new Vanderpump Rules?

[Tom Schwartz]

I don't know.

[Katie Maloney]

It's filming as we speak, I think.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. And the thing is, is, like, again, I was prepared and ready to walk away, whatever, but it doesn't mean I'm like, don't care about our show and, like, the legacy that we brought to it. So to.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh. And we did bring it.

[Tom Schwartz]

And I feel like this isn't against any of them. I don't know them, but it just feels cheap to me. It feels cheap. And I don't. I don't like cheap.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay, well, listen, that's a hot take.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know, but this Isn't disrespectful, anything to do with them or anything like that. It's just sort of like, why I. If it was. Why can't it just be, like a whole different show?

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, well, I think it will be with the same name, different show, and.

[Tom Schwartz]

Just not even a season one. Just like, to me, it just feels like it's going to try to have the same flavor, the same everything, and it's just, again, like, when you try to replicate a recipe just based off of taste, you can't do it.

[Katie Maloney]

We had lightning in a bottle. We were all living together, dating each other, best friends. We were hanging out before the show. But I think everyone knows that. I think that was. Speaks to the magic of the show, you know?

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, I think everything that made our show great is also what tore us apart at the end.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. Well said, by the way. But you watched the Valley.

[Tom Schwartz]

I did.

[Katie Maloney]

It's so good. I. It's weird saying that, because they're all, like, people I know and hang out with, but, like, if I can step away from my friendship with them objectively, it's such a good show.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. I mean, I'm not as. As involved as you are with everyone anymore, but I. I. Nick wanted to watch with me, so I put it on, and I'm trying to explain to him, okay, this is this person. This is these people. Because obviously it was season two, and I'm like, it's fine. You can pop in. And he never watched any, like, Bravo shows. He likes reality tv. Like, we'll watch, like, Love is Blind and those types of shows, but, like, he's never watched a Bravo show.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God. Has he seen any Vanderpump Rules?

[Tom Schwartz]

He's watched some clips. Yeah, he's watched some clips that have. That has not sat well with him, but.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, God, you know.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, I don't. I don't want. I don't. I don't want anyone I'm, like, dating if they've already seen the show. Listen, I can't really do much about it, but, like, if you haven't, it's like, I don't know why you would want to watch that. Because it's like, do you want to just see a highlight reel of, like.

[Katie Maloney]

My best and worst moments?

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. And also, do you want. Oh, do you want to watch me get engaged? Get married?

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

You don't think you want to see that? I don't. I wouldn't want to see that play out for them. I like. Yeah, but.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay, we're getting A little Barbara Walters. So let's lean into it. Well. Well, first of all, you guys were happily, respectfully separated.

[Tom Schwartz]

Divorced.

[Katie Maloney]

Divorced. But is there anything you miss. I'm not saying about me or our relationship, but anything you miss about that old life?

[Tom Schwartz]

No. I mean, we had so much fun.

[Katie Maloney]

We did. I think people never saw us. Like, I know we were dysfunctional. We had many issues. But, like, we also had a lot of fun. There was a lot of love.

[Tom Schwartz]

You. You. Because you're a fun guy.

[Katie Maloney]

Thank you.

[Tom Schwartz]

And so, like, that was. It was never short on having, like, a good time or, like, if we went on a trip or some. You know, like, there was. There's. I have so many really amazing memories.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. On that note.

[Tom Schwartz]

What.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, I don't. I didn't mean to cut you off. Like, what. What are your fondest? Because I get asked this every interview. It's very stock. But what are your fondest. When you close your eyes and think of the past 11 seasons, what are your fondest, happiest moments? Or, like, just most hilarious moments on Vanderpump Rules?

[Tom Schwartz]

I mean, it's. I'm sure everyone says this, but the trips were always the most memorable, man. Because we would just have. We would get after it, you guys.

[Katie Maloney]

We would grip it and rip it on the trips.

[Tom Schwartz]

Like this being some of the worst hangovers of my life.

[Katie Maloney]

No, for real, our wedding. Our wedding was, for me, literally the worst hangover I've ever had in my entire life.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. And then I had to drive. We couldn't even drive to, like, two hours. And I think it took us like, four because we just, like, kept having to pull over. But. Yeah, that was terrible.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

I think, like, the trips are always really fun and just kind of like, I loved, like, the first day of, like, filming.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

You know, you're hopeful. You're naive, innocent still, somewhat. I don't know, maybe. So that's always fun because you're just like, all right, fresh start.

[Katie Maloney]

Fresh start. It's spring. Like, we have. We hope. We always start around. Like, we hope pride. We all love that. And it just was always good energy in the beginning. And then I guess it would slowly descend into chaos.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

The worst times were about that mid season hump.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

We were like, just kill me. Just put me out the pasture. Like, I don't want to do this no more. I think every year people were like, I don't think I can do.

[Katie Maloney]

No, no, We. We had. We were down and out.

[Tom Schwartz]

Sometimes I'm, like, really shocked at your Trajectory that you've been on with, like, popping up on the Valley, doing the other stuff that you. Was that Mars.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, stars on Mars.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. Because you were just so, like, I don't know, like, you. You pushed back a. On the whole reality TV personality, whole song and dance for so long.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I did. I remember in the beginning, I was like, I don't know if I want to do this. I'm an artist. I'm an actor. You're like, tom, you've done a Kohl's commercial. Relax. Listen. That Kohl's commercial changed my life because it gave me the confidence because I was in a room full of people more talented and better looking than me. And then I booked that, and I was like, how did I book this? Maybe I have something. Maybe I have something.

[Tom Schwartz]

You're a mactor. I haven't heard you do a Mayo commercial.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God, you guys, just in case you don't know, in the business, I hate mayonnaise, and Katie rubs it in my face. But no, in the industry, if you ask somebody, if you're like, oh, my God, what are you guys filming? Anybody for production will tell you, we're filming a mayonnaise commercial.

[Tom Schwartz]

I didn't know this. And then when we were on set doing that, they're like, it's so crazy because we're. That's what we would always say. But now we're like, not kidding.

[Katie Maloney]

Wait. Barbara Walters, round two. Okay, I gotta ask you this. What did you learn about yourself through our relationship and everything that came after it?

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, my God.

[Katie Maloney]

That's a deep one.

[Tom Schwartz]

What I learned about myself, I learned that I have a lot of love to give and that, you know, I don't want to, like, have to, like, dull my shine in the process and forget who I am and what's important to me. Me and what I truly need and want. And that's okay.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

But to. I just, you know, to just stand up for yourself, I think.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I like that. If you could go back and I wouldn't want to go back and change anything, like you said earlier. But if you could go back and maybe change one moment. And you cannot say, not marry me. Okay.

[Tom Schwartz]

In our relationship.

[Katie Maloney]

No, no, no. Just in the show.

[Tom Schwartz]

On the show, I was like, damn.

[Katie Maloney]

You can't hit me. I. Sorry I stole your thunder.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, you were asking about what I learned about myself in our relationship. And now you're going back to the show, which I think the show that would go similar for the show.

[Katie Maloney]

They're one in the Same.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. Okay. What was the question?

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, yeah, listen, listen. That's a little deep.

[Tom Schwartz]

What was it? No, what was it? I was just.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I don't remember what I asked you after that. I literally. No, I asked you what you learned through, you know, about yourself, post. Our relationship.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

And then if you could change anything and go back in time. I get. I get asked this every interview, and I never know what to say because.

[Tom Schwartz]

They'Re, like, not get drunk as much. Yeah, like, that was. Those were always my worst moments when I would just, like, drink too much. And, like, that's. That's one thing I've learned is that, like, I need to never get drunk.

[Katie Maloney]

Do you still talk to Tequila Katie? She's in there.

[Tom Schwartz]

No.

[Katie Maloney]

What?

[Tom Schwartz]

Because sometimes he killed the kid would be fun. So, like, there's been definitely times where I'm just, like. I'm definitely a little tipsy, but, like. And don't go dark side. I don't rage text. The last time I think I was. I was super drunk was in Vegas, and I just, like, went to sleep and woke up with a terrible thing ever. But, like, nothing had.

[Katie Maloney]

Like, that's fine.

[Tom Schwartz]

I went to a show, and then I went to a tiki bar after. You don't have tiki drink nightcaps. Like, that's not what you do. But I did that thinking.

[Katie Maloney]

Like, tiki drink nightcap. That's diabolical.

[Tom Schwartz]

It is. No, it started with the demon steaming shot. That's a. What it's called.

[Katie Maloney]

I want one right now.

[Tom Schwartz]

It's exactly what you picture looking like and tasting like it was a pineapple. I don't know what's in it, but this. The. The best tiki bar is in Vegas called Golden Tiki. Yeah, they light drinks on fire.

[Katie Maloney]

That's downtown, isn't it?

[Tom Schwartz]

It's in Chinatown.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, nice.

[Tom Schwartz]

So it's near. It's near like old Vegas. But, yeah, no, I. I wanted them flaming.

[Katie Maloney]

We still love the drinks. We still love a good dive bar, don't we?

[Tom Schwartz]

I love it. I only go to dive bars, I think, first of all, I haven't been to a bar in, like, a while.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, the only bars I go to are pretty much TomTom. Sometimes I help over at Jax's bar. I go to the. I go to the bayou a lot. I'm not gonna lie. I still love the.

[Tom Schwartz]

Jax's.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, I mean, I go and then I have my regular spots in the Valley, like, black market liquor bar. I don't want to. Boy. Boy, the audience.

[Tom Schwartz]

I went To Tab Laurel Tavern recently. Yeah, I love that. That place. Like when it smells like drinking outside, I go there.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, I know. There's a good energy in that little strip over there. I was thinking about. And I'm gonna run this by you. What if I opened a dive bar in the Valley and I called it. Ready for this? Once upon a Tom.

[Tom Schwartz]

Do it. Just don't go into business with a friend.

[Katie Maloney]

Listen, lesson learned. By the way, I actually almost did a pop up in San Francisco and I don't.

[Tom Schwartz]

It's not like I'm saying don't go. Sorry. In business friends, but don't with your friends. No specifically.

[Katie Maloney]

But listen, lesson learned over here. Katie, can we tell this to the audience?

[Tom Schwartz]

What.

[Katie Maloney]

What you just said, but directed at the audience. You guys be very wary of going into a high stakes business with a lease with your friends. And I'm not talking trash. I learned a lot. It was a very valuable lesson.

[Tom Schwartz]

It's been. Arian and I have been great because like we. No one, none of us are like too much of a control freak over anything. Like, she's like, you know, she knows that she has to be away. She's like, trust you, whatever, you know, blah, blah. We like keep each other in loop on everything. But in terms of like the decision making and everything, that was just so easy with her. It was like very. Just the most overwhelming part was like the. When all the scandal stuff was happening, that was also like. There was just so much happening, like on the precipice of like trying to get open and trying to find this person, you know, so it was just.

[Katie Maloney]

Like, we don't say that. We don't say the S word.

[Tom Schwartz]

I don't like saying it.

[Katie Maloney]

We say, you know what? Of all.

[Tom Schwartz]

You know what?

[Katie Maloney]

That's what we all say.

[Tom Schwartz]

Is your friend.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Do you still hang out with him?

[Katie Maloney]

I don't see him nearly as much anymore. I gotta be honest. He's very much in love. He's working.

[Tom Schwartz]

You travel to go.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, that. That was. Cuz I want to go see you're an appearance. I. Okay, should we talk about this, you guys? Am I too old to be doing appearances? Am I washed up? Here's the thing. After each one, every time I'm like, oh, I had such a good run. I've probably done a 100 appearances. They pay well. They. But I actually also, I love people and it's like I'm not in the bars as much as I used to and my peace is back and I love that. But I also do love hosting. Butters are shaking.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know. Because you're a people pleaser.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

You want everyone to be happy.

[Katie Maloney]

Is everyone good?

[Tom Schwartz]

Do you need anything? Like, meanwhile you're like tired, overworked, drunk.

[Katie Maloney]

Stressed, don't have much left over for the people who matter the most.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yourself, Most importantly, the only person you hurt in that whole people pleasing thing of it all is yourself.

[Katie Maloney]

I'm past that. Just so you know. You look incredulous.

[Tom Schwartz]

I don't believe it. I don't know. I'm not around enough to know this.

[Katie Maloney]

But I feel like. Yeah, well, ever since I've closed Schwartz and Sandy's and also I moved to a new beautiful place, like, I'm so happy. I feel like I'm, I'm. I feel like I'm just. I'm in my ideal spot in North Hollywood. By the way, your place, your new place is gorgeous. I, I think I can speak for both of us when I say we don't miss our old spots.

[Tom Schwartz]

No, those were transition spots because we had to like, you know, we were starting to film season of Vanderpump Rules so we wanted to move before that all happened. And the house, the. We're putting the house on the market. So it was just sort of like, find somewhere. I found you. Please.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Cuz you were like, I can't.

[Katie Maloney]

I know. By the way we crushed it on, on selling our house. We bought at the perfect time, 2019. And we sold at a great time too. Not going to say how much we made. Maybe it was already on the show, but anyways. No, I'm not talking about that. But man, listen, it's nice to sit down with you. Yeah, it's nice chilling here with the boys.

[Tom Schwartz]

Brain busters.

[Katie Maloney]

Nah, I didn't want to get too deep, honestly.

[Tom Schwartz]

I mean, that's what, that's what it's about.

[Katie Maloney]

No, this has actually been nice. I just. Yeah, I just. I honestly was just more curious if you're sentimental and nostalgic about Vanderpump rules.

[Tom Schwartz]

And of course I. Listen, I don't mean to say that just because I'm not out there like talking about all the time. It was a huge part of my life.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Huge, huge chunk like of my adult life. I barely lived an adult life without the show, so of course I'm sentimental towards it. But I'm. You know, there's some, there's some sticking points too that are painful on heart that I, that caused me to have confusing feelings about things, you know, totally with certain people and just events that Happen.

[Katie Maloney]

And what's bittersweet? I know it's so, like, cliche to say, but I think that's the perfect description. The ending of the show was bittersweet.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

But mostly sweet.

[Tom Schwartz]

I'm excited to watch the season of the Valley. Yeah. It's sort of like. It's crazy how much that show is so just similar to Vanderpump Rules. I know they were trying to create, like, a, you know, some difference in it, you know, but the transitions, the music transition, everything is, like, the exact same. It's like this is basically just what our show, what we were, wanted our show to eventually become at one point.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. That was the direction, which is what.

[Tom Schwartz]

Pisses me off, because, like, Jackson, like, I created this show. I'm like, we've been. This was in talks, like, years before this. Like, this was. This was, like, going to be a thing. Like, you didn't create anything.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, I mean, he was instrumental in it, but listen, let's not give him.

[Tom Schwartz]

I'm. I'm never going to give that man credit.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

For anything.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. He's not a big fan of.

[Tom Schwartz]

He's your neighbor, though. How's that going?

[Katie Maloney]

Your business partner. He is my neighbor. That was not by choice, but he's actually been really sweet. Quiet. I never even see him. I mean, we hang out once in a while, but I've never heard a peep out of Jax as a neighbor.

[Tom Schwartz]

Do you realize this is the second time he's encroached on your living space?

[Katie Maloney]

Wait, what was the first time?

[Tom Schwartz]

When we lived on King. Then he's like, oh, my God. Kind of like behind her back to, like, move in.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, I was, like, not happy about it.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. At first. But then it ended up being really fun, being fine.

[Tom Schwartz]

But I was just like, God damn it. Like, we were.

[Katie Maloney]

We were mongrels in that building.

[Tom Schwartz]

That building was.

[Katie Maloney]

We had some nights in that building.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

I think everyone hated it.

[Katie Maloney]

No, I. I still love West Hollywood. I go there all the time. But anyways. Yeah. Anyway, it's nice to sit down with you, and even though we're happily separated.

[Tom Schwartz]

You know, we're divorced. We're divorced. You can't call it separated. That's when people. That's. That's prior to. And I don't. I'm not trying to.

[Katie Maloney]

It's okay.

[Tom Schwartz]

But.

[Katie Maloney]

Divorced, yes. Tomato, tomato. No, I don't think so, but no. There's a little part of me that always still loves you, and it's so nice to sit down and Chill with you.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. And I'm glad to see you so happy. And I'm glad we're. I'm glad we're. I'm glad we're friends. I know we're not besties, but I love seeing you. And I'm glad that I'm not just somebody that you used to know.

[Tom Schwartz]

I love Gauthier.

[Katie Maloney]

He's coming back in a major way.

[Tom Schwartz]

No, he's not. He never wanted to.

[Katie Maloney]

I know. I'm saying the song is everywhere now. Everywhere.

[Tom Schwartz]

Guess what? It never left my world. I, I, I would think about G, like at least a couple times a month for no reason. I don't know.

[Katie Maloney]

No.

[Tom Schwartz]

Maybe there's. Maybe there's some type of like invisible string tying me to go.

[Katie Maloney]

That song cuts deep and it's so real. Cuz it shows both sides of the story. You know what I mean? And both are valid and understandable. But it's important to hear both sides.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, that's something we can talk about in our pocket. Because that's been a topic that Dana, I have discussed amongst each other of just being spending your life with somebody or spending a chunk of your life and then they just become a stranger. And that's such an odd.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Odd thing.

[Katie Maloney]

I know. It's like. I think we both fall in love easy. We meet people easily. But. Yeah. I remember after we separated, I just like. It's the, the thought of like meeting someone, moving in together.

[Tom Schwartz]

You did that? What are you talking about? You. Literally. Literally.

[Katie Maloney]

No.

[Tom Schwartz]

Am I crazy?

[Katie Maloney]

Wait.

[Tom Schwartz]

Meeting someone and moving in with them?

[Katie Maloney]

Don't you do this to me. She didn't move in. She would hang out there sometimes.

[Tom Schwartz]

Okay.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, her stuff was always there, so.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay, let's not open up that can of worms.

[Tom Schwartz]

She's.

[Katie Maloney]

Let's not open up that can of worms. We were, we were doing so bunny somewhere. I got witches of WeHo in the system. My micro do is flowing. Do you feel like anything?

[Tom Schwartz]

I'm, I feel sweaty. It was so. It was so cold in here when I walked in. And now I'm sweating.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, don't, don't blame the micro dose.

[Tom Schwartz]

I'm not. I don't know if it takes a minute, right?

[Katie Maloney]

It takes like 30 minutes to set in.

[Tom Schwartz]

That's why you should have like. We should have done this earlier.

[Katie Maloney]

I know. I took mine before, so I feel nice. Okay, well, sorry. I didn't mean to rub it in.

[Tom Schwartz]

Once this is done, I'll be like, oh, here we go.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, no, but this has been Nice.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

It's good to see you. I'm so happy you're happy.

[Tom Schwartz]

Thanks for bringing the boys.

[Katie Maloney]

Can we give him one more shout out? Something about her podcast? Disrespectfully Shout out to Nick. You want me to gush about Nick for a little bit more?

[Tom Schwartz]

Sure. He's the best.

[Katie Maloney]

He's a literal rock star. Yeah. But anyways, I love you.

[Tom Schwartz]

I love you too. Thank you for having me.

[Katie Maloney]

Let me ask one more thing. Do people still call you Bubba? Like fans or strangers?

[Tom Schwartz]

No.

[Katie Maloney]

Really? They call me Bubba all the time.

[Tom Schwartz]

Because you have a tattooed. You were you. You made it your brand.

[Katie Maloney]

I kind of did. By the way, now that, you know, I've. We've been through that and we were Bubbas or whatever. Like, I've. It's. It is a ubiquitous universal pet name nickname. I'm talking for pets. Literally pets. But also for humans, lovers. Like, everyone's like, oh, my God, this is my Bubba. People's.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, No, I hear people saying that to each other, like, out in the open. I'm just like, so it's not that weird. Why. Why we got so much heat for that? I don't know.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah, No, I was in Chicago last weekend, shout out to Chicago Joy District. But from across the street, someone was like, what up, Bubba? And I was like, what up?

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, okay.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Well, I mean, no, I think I became more the Tequila Katie.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

People would be like, I'm also Tequila Katie. I'm like, okay. No, but I mean, I don't know, because some people, like, they're excited about it or it's like a negative thing, or they don't care or they think it's hilarious. I don't know. Or people just come to me, they go choke. Like, that's why.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, listen, your reality television royalty, still iconic, and I'm happy to see you thriving.

[Tom Schwartz]

That's great.

[Katie Maloney]

And I'm glad. I'm glad we're still tight.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, well, as tight as, you know, possible.

[Katie Maloney]

Within reason. Yeah, exactly. Katie's gonna watch the boys tonight, and then I'll pick him up tomorrow. We're good. We're good puppy co parents, aren't we?

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah. I mean, they're primarily with you, but I think that works because you dote on them like I could never have. You always were like the, you know, the primary caretaker, but.

[Katie Maloney]

And so not to diminish your love, though, because I know you love them more than anything.

[Tom Schwartz]

I know. But I think they might love you, and I wasn't gonna deny that. So obviously.

[Katie Maloney]

Well, anyways, I love you. Thanks for sitting down with me and.

[Tom Schwartz]

Yeah, anytime.

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, my God. Are you guys gonna roast me on your podcast tomorrow?

[Tom Schwartz]

No.

[Katie Maloney]

I was so gentle.

[Tom Schwartz]

We'll have a good time.

[Katie Maloney]

Okay, cool.

[Tom Schwartz]

We don't do, like. We're not. We don't do the Barbara Walters things. We. We talk about all kinds of.

[Katie Maloney]

Yeah.

[Tom Schwartz]

Have you never listened to an episode?

[Katie Maloney]

Oh, I've dabbled. I've heard okay clips on social media, but never a full episode all the way through. But you guys have great sound clips.

[Tom Schwartz]

Oh, yeah.

[Katie Maloney]

We're not filming this, guys. Sorry. But anyways, it is cozy in here. Microdose is micro dosing. The pups are sleeping. The witches of Weho wine is flowing through my system. But it's good to see you.

[Tom Schwartz]

It's good to see you, too, and I'll see you tomorrow, you guys. Come on.

[Katie Maloney]

Disrespectfully, Katie Maloney. All right, this is goodbye, guys.

[Tom Schwartz]

You need to sign off.

[Katie Maloney]

All right, let's sign off.

[Tom Schwartz]

You say toodaloo.

[Katie Maloney]

Toodaloo, motherfuckers.

[Tom Schwartz]

Detoxification complete.