Fame Under Fire: "Claims the Macrons paid for a hit on Candace Owens are 'deranged', says lawyer"

Host: Anushka Mutanda-Doughty (BBC Sounds)
Guest: Will Sommer, Senior Reporter at The Bulwark
Release Date: December 18, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode tackles the swirl of conspiracy theories surrounding right-wing US influencer Candace Owens, particularly her recent claim that the French President Emmanuel Macron and his wife Brigitte commissioned an assassination attempt against her. The discussion expands into the aftermath of conservative influencer Charlie Kirk's assassination, the ensuing online drama and factionalism, and the increasingly blurred lines between fact and fiction in the influencer age. Host Anushka Mutanda-Doughty is joined by disinformation expert Will Sommer to unpack Owens' role in amplifying unsubstantiated claims, the larger impact on right-wing politics, and the responses from all parties involved.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Candace Owens: Source of Controversy

• Allegations in the Spotlight:

  • Brigitte Macron is a transgender woman (fiercely denied by Macron, leading to a defamation suit in Delaware).
  • French and Israeli governments, as well as Turning Point USA, involved in Charlie Kirk's assassination.
  • The Macrons paid for Owens' own assassination—allegation widely circulated on Twitter and other platforms (44M+ views).

• Candace’s Audience:
  Owens is influential, with 100K live viewers per YouTube stream. Her controversies now concern mainstream Republicans, not just "YouTuber drama," because they're affecting party unity, especially after Kirk's killing.

  “This is someone who has a lot of influence... It's one that I think Republicans are really concerned about because it is having this effect of dissolving the good feelings the party had after the assassination of Charlie Kirk.” —Will Sommer (03:52)

The Charlie Kirk Assassination: Spiraling Theories

• Official Narrative:
  On Sept 10, at Utah Valley University, Charlie Kirk was killed by sniper Tyler Robinson, per the FBI and police.

• Owens’ Challenges:
  Owens rapidly began promoting alternatives:

  • Shooter from campus utility tunnels, "trapdoor" theories
  • Odd cult references, bee symbology (Utah's commonly used bee motif)
  • Allegations of Israeli involvement, citing 12 "Israeli cell phones" at the scene—no public proof.

  “She has posited that...maybe someone from a trapdoor shot him. Possibly...there's a lot of bee symbology in Utah...So essentially, she's seen all these bees and she said, this is a cult.” —Will Sommer (07:06)

• Reactions to Israeli Links & Text Messages:

  • Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu rejected claims of Israeli involvement, calling them "a monstrous big lie" (07:58).
  • Owens published text exchanges purportedly showing Kirk grew frustrated with pro-Israel donors. Turning Point USA confirmed the texts' authenticity, but denied any connection to the murder.

  “Turning Point did validate...a lot of the text messages Charlie Kirk sent...” —Will Sommer (10:32)

Infighting at Turning Point USA & The “Showdown”

• Discord Intensifies:
  After Kirk's murder, TPUSA fractured into factions. Many in the right-wing media were horrified by Owens’ monetization and publicizing of conspiracy theories, but feared speaking out.

  "This kind of twisting of Charlie Kirk's legacy, this sort of commercializing of the death...Where she's making, I would say, minimum tens of thousands of dollars, and I think likely a lot more than that." —Will Sommer (11:25)

• Erica Kirk, Conspiracies, and Online Vitriol:
  Erica Kirk (Charlie’s widow, now TPUSA CEO) originally allied with Owens, but soon Owens alluded to conspiracy around Erica herself. Online discourse turned toxic, with even Erica’s motives questioned.

The “Secret Meeting” & Community Backlash

• Off-Camera Sit-Down:
  After online pressure, Owens and Erica Kirk met behind closed doors—no cameras or livestream, only one aide each and possible legal representation.

  • Fans expressed skepticism and conspiracized about Owens’ safety and motives.
  • Owens later said she was alive but “exhausted,” sparking further wild speculation online.

  “I’m alive. I’m alive. I’m totally fine and I am sorry. I was gonna do a show for you guys this evening but I am truly exhausted.” —Candace Owens (14:09)

  Will Sommer notes the audience’s sense of betrayal after Owens appeared to soften her rhetoric:

  “Her fans...are acting like they’ve really been betrayed, like she sold out...her audience feels betrayed is that that suggests to me that...potentially her audience is turning on her now as well.” (14:42)

The Macron Hit Claim & Official Responses

• Expanding the Conspiracy:
  Owens recently claimed that a "high-ranking French government employee" warned her of a Macron-backed assassination attempt. The French elite force GIGN named by Owens called the story "fake news."

  • Macron’s lawyer Tom Clare: “This deranged allegation is right out of Ms. Owens playbook” (22:33).
  • FBI has “no credible information,” Defense Dep’t similarly noncommittal, prompting further speculation.

  Will Sommer underlines the implausibility:

  “What Candace Owens is describing would be one of the greatest diplomatic scandals in history. A NATO ally...dispatching a team of assassins to take out a major political commentator on American soil. And the American government is doing nothing about it?...It really does not pass the smell test.” (23:23)

Candace’s Globalized Web of Theories

• Connecting Everything:
  In an interview with Russell Brand, Owens tied together the Brigitte Macron trans theory, Charlie Kirk’s murder, and claims of a Western “one world government” conspiracy that's out to get her.

  “Yes, I think it’s all connected. And I think in many ways we already live in this sort of one world government system...in terms of the West, I don’t think there’s any difference in the governments. And that’s kind of the point…” —Candace Owens (19:47)

  • These theories draw in new audiences but are viewed as even more outlandish outside her core base.

Impact on Right-Wing Media Ecosystem

• Vacuum & Scramble for Influence:
  With Kirk gone, Sommer explains the post-assassination scramble for leadership and audience, involving major and fringe right-wing personalities.

  “There’s clearly a vacuum that’s been created...who will be the new face...So people like Megyn Kelly...Tucker Carlson...even some of Charlie Kirk’s enemies, like the white nationalist Nick Fuentes. I think there’s a real scramble on for influence after the assassination.” (18:10)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Allegation Outright Denied

“This deranged allegation is right out of Ms. Owens playbook...it does further fit her pattern of reckless and irresponsible defamation of our clients.”
—Tom Clare, Macrons’ lawyer (22:33)

On Conspiracy Theory Tactics

“She sort of cycles through things...she’s looking for whatever is gonna keep people tuning in. There’s gotta be some new revelation on each episode...”
—Will Sommer (07:06)

On Online Fan Dynamics

“The leader of this movement meets privately with someone she’s portrayed as the villain...and then suddenly says, well, maybe I went a little far. So...once that person tries to apply any sort of breaks to it...it ultimately will turn on its leader.”
—Will Sommer (17:21)

Important Segments with Timestamps

• (01:09–03:10) – Review of Candace Owens’ key allegations; intro to the Charlie Kirk and Macron claims.
• (03:44–04:35) – Why Owens’ influence matters: her reach inside and outside conservative circles.
• (06:05–09:13) – Official recap of Charlie Kirk’s murder and how conspiracy theories spiraled.
• (10:26–11:25) – Turning Point USA in-fighting & official responses to Owens.
• (14:09–14:42) – Owens’ “I’m alive” post after off-camera meeting stokes further conspiracy from her fans.
• (17:02–17:59) – Will Owens’ conspiracy theory live on, even if she backs down?
• (19:47–22:17) – Owens connects Macron and Kirk theories; talks “one world government” on Russell Brand.
• (22:33–23:23) – Macron’s lawyer and US officials respond; Sommer on plausibility and media strategy.

Conclusion

The episode lays bare the dizzying escalation of narrative and counter-narrative between Candace Owens, her supporters, detractors, and the global political figures caught in her crosshairs. As disinformation expert Will Sommer and host Anushka Mutanda-Doughty highlight, the saga reveals darker shifts in the right-wing influencer universe: monetizing tragedy, the volatility of online followings, and the difficulty of putting conspiracy-djinns back in the bottle—even when the truth is publicly, repeatedly, and forcefully stated. The Macrons, Turning Point USA, and Charlie Kirk’s widow remain targets, while the potential fallout for US political unity and public discourse is still unfolding.

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