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- [00:01]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
BBC Sounds Music Radio podcasts. Hello and welcome back to Diddy on Trial from BBC Sounds with me, Anoushka Masanda Doughty. Just a warning before we begin. This episode contains references to domestic abuse and drugs here at the Southern District of New York court. It's the middle of week two in the trial of rapper Sha Diddy Combs. Now it is getting trickier and trickier to find a place to record. Everywhere you turn there's an influencer or a commentator with a phone on a tripod, streaming or recording. Now a reminder, Diddy is on trial for charges of sex trafficking, racketeering with conspiracy and transportation for prostitution. These are charges he's always denied. Yesterday we heard from an exotic dancer known as the Punisher, Cassie's mum Regina, and one of Diddy's former assistants. We ended the day with a homeland Security agent, Agent Gerard Gannon, describing those raids on Diddy's properties that took place in March 2024. He showed the jury parts of a semi automatic rifle in the courtroom which they'd found. And they also saw pictures of 7 inch heels, boxes of lingerie, baby oil and Astro Glide found in Diddy's Miami home. Now agent Gerard Gannon is back on the stand today. We're also being told that another one of Diddy's former assistants will be taking the stand later. I'll be catching up with our New York correspondent Neda Talfi. But now it's time to see what is going down in that courtroom today. Okay, so it's 3:45 and I'm here with Neda Talfeek, the BBC's New York correspondent. Neda, it picked up where it left off yesterday with the homeland Security agent. What else did he have to say?
- [01:47]
Neda Talfi
He was really just kind of detailing what else was seized from Combs Miami home. Remember that was at the time of the raids from the FBI. And he said that they got several drugs, cocaine, ketamine, mdma. But then we quickly moved into cross examination by the government. It was a long cross examination. We saw Diddy's lawyer saying everyone in Florida has a gun and asking Agent Gannon, do you own a gun? And the judge allowed that question through and he said yes. Diddy's lawyer also asked if there were any fingerprints or DNA of Diddy's on the gun parts that were retrieved. But he couldn't answer that because he's not the one who collects fingerprints. And then, you know, other questions such as why they didn't take pre search photos of certain parts of Combs House And a Gucci bag that had some drugs in it. He was suggesting that the samples were so small that there was nothing left after they tested them.
- [02:47]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
And then we had the inclusion of Dr. Dawn Hughes. And this is important because anyone who's listened to the POD for a while knows that there was such a back and forth about court experts, people coming in to give expert testimony. She's a blind expert. What does that actually mean?
- [03:02]
Neda Talfi
So the government and defense basically went back and forth, right, about what's allowed, what she can talk about. And very much the consensus with the judge was that she would just speak in general about her expertise and her experience working as a clinical psychologist, someone who works in forensics and about trauma and what they see through scientific studies. She wouldn't be able to testify about the details of the case at all.
- [03:34]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
What was she mainly speaking about?
- [03:36]
Neda Talfi
What we heard from Dr. Hughes was that her time working with victims of abuse is that it's very common that memories can come back at any time. And she said that doesn't mean they're any less accurate. She also said it's often that, you know, there's a delayed expression of PTSD. And this was from her experience in 30 years of private practice as a psychologist. She said she also worked with forensics, right, working with courts to analyze victims. Dr. Hughes saying, look, people don't stay in relationships that are abusive because they want to be abused. They do it because of fear, because of other issues that make them feel trapped. Even if there's love in a relationship, there is that intense psychological bond.
- [04:27]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
And then, which is always the case with expert testimony, the defense will get up and sort of question the credibility of that expert. And that's exactly what we saw here.
- [04:37]
Neda Talfi
They did it in a number of ways. First, they took a lot of time going over the fact that she had a webinar that helped advocates for battered women, trying to suggest that she was, you know, biased in some way because of that. They also tried to point out that 60% of her income now comes from testifying in court cases. So kind of a two pronged approach there, you know, discrediting her, hopefully, in the eyes of the jury, they think because she's getting paid by the government. And then on the other hand, she's not really practicing anymore. They were trying to suggest she's just doing this. She's not really keeping up with the latest scientific information coming out.
- [05:21]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
Didn't they question her saying, you've never come and testified in support of a man who's been accused of Sex crimes.
- [05:28]
Neda Talfi
She said, correct. I don't evaluate offenders. And there was also a moment where the government came back and was like, didn't somebody on the defense team actually hire you for one of the cases they were working on as an expert? But then the defense came back and said, well, yes, Brian Steele did hire you, but then he never used you. You never actually testified in that case.
- [05:54]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
And then we had another witness, George Kaplan, who was another executive assistant to Diddy, a personal assistant. So we had David James the other day, and now we have George. And some of the stuff that George was saying, we'd heard from David as well.
- [06:07]
Neda Talfi
He talked about how he was promoted to become the executive assistant to the chairman, who was Diddy in 2014 and 2015, because Diddy liked his work ethic. But then very much like the last personal assistant, David James, he talked about the long hours, getting there early to get Diddy's breakfast together, make sure everything was in order. And then there was a real focus on the hotel rooms. And we heard this from David James, too, that there was like a specific list for the hotel rooms. And what we heard from George Kaplan was that he prepared the bags for Diddy. He said in it would be clothes, a speaker, candles, baby oil, Astroglide. And he brought those items to the hotels. And whenever he needed to refill the bag or recreate the bag, as he put it, he said he would buy the items with the corporate credit card, so the Combs Enterprises credit card. So. So again, this all goes back to, of course, the racketeering charge here that, you know, employees helped Diddy carry out his crimes. And here it is, the corporate credit card, Diddy's money being used to buy these items, used in the freak offs. He said when he would get to the hotels, they said, you know, how would you know how to find the room? And he said it would be under Frank Black. And that was a reference to Biggie, the Notorious B.I.G. who went by the name Frank White. And so he said, you know, Diddy would always be in there with a female partner from 12 hours to a couple of days, and that he would go back and collect any belongings, but also clean up the hotel rooms. And he said that often meant getting rid of, for example, brown crystallized powder one time off the bathroom sink, or wiping down what was a lot of baby oil all over the hotel room and collecting empty bottles of Gatorade and water. And he said he did that because he wanted to protect his reputation. He knew in the media hotels were often selling, according to him videos or pictures that would embarrass celebrities.
- [08:17]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
There were also questions to George about some of the other things that he did for Diddy. He spoke about being asked to buy drugs for him.
- [08:24]
Neda Talfi
Yeah. He talked about how, for example, one time in Miami, he was at Diddy's house and Diddy gave him a number to call and he gave him cash and he went outside the house and met up with the man. He called the man, gave him a bag of pills. He said inside was mdma, and he gave the man the cash that Diddy had given him. But another time in Los Angeles, they were at the Bel Air Hotel. Diddy again gave him a number, told him to take some money, and he arranged to meet this person in Hollywood. This person gave him a bag. He wasn't sure what was in the bag this time, and he gave it to Mr. Combs. And he details how often during these freak offs, Combs wouldn't be in contact with him right during these days and it was a time for him to rest. But occasionally he would call him for food or for drugs.
- [09:15]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
And if you stick around after court, you can hear what's happening the next day. And they said they're gonna get through, or aim to get through, five witnesses tomorrow. And one of them is somebody that people will probably know they're talking about one of Cassie's romantic partners.
- [09:29]
Neda Talfi
Yeah, Kid Cudi. We've all been waiting to see if he's gonna testify in this case and he is. He's going to be speaking tomorrow.
- [09:38]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
Neda, thank you so much for breaking that down and we'll definitely catch up with you tomorrow.
- [09:42]
Neda Talfi
Yeah, it's going to be an interesting day with a lot of witnesses.
- [09:55]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
That was the BBC's New York correspondent, Neda Talfik speaking to me, Anushka Matan Adawati for Diddy on trial from BBC Sounds. And if you're listening in the UK and would like information or support on some of the issues raised in this episode, please go to BBC.co.uk actionline and please keep sending us your questions on WhatsApp. You can get us at 033-01-2235, 555 1. That's 033-01-235551. We'll do our best to answer them on Thursday's weekly roundup with criminal defence attorney Sean Kent. So make sure you subscribe and turn on your push notifications. So you.
- [10:34]
Natalia Melman Petruzella
I'm Natalia Melman Petruzella and from the BBC. This is Extreme Peak Danger.
- [10:41]
Anoushka Masanda Doughty
The most beautiful mountain in the world.
- [10:43]
Neda Talfi
If you die on the mountain, you stay on the mountain.
- [10:48]
Natalia Melman Petruzella
This is the story of what happened when 11 climbers died on one of the world's deadliest mountains, K2. And of the risks we'll take to feel truly alive.
- [10:58]
Neda Talfi
If I tell all the details, you won't believe it anymore.
- [11:02]
Natalia Melman Petruzella
Extreme Peak danger. Listen first on BBC sounds.