Femi Olutade (3:33)

Yeah, as you alluded to, I think it was like it was around 9 in the morning when you messaged me the link to the trailer. So I listen and watch that. So as context at this point, my kids have gone to school, so I'm just, I work from home and I was at home by myself. So I was just organizing things and I got the message from you and I'm like, oh. So I listened to it. It's a minute long, just seeing some of the first visuals and being like, okay, this is a trailer. There's something coming really soon. So that was my mentality that this is coming, something's coming soon. I don't know how to even take it or the first kind of listen or what to notice or pick up from those few lyrics and images. And I didn't know what a GNX was, so I was like, okay, that's interesting. And then what happened is I think it was a work day. So I logged into work and we have a hip hop channel at my workplace where people post new kind of songs.

Cole Kushna (4:26)

Oh, cool.

Femi Olutade (4:26)

And I was just gonna say if anybody had posted anything about the trailer. And then when I looked it up, someone actually posted a link to the album. I was like, wait. Cause I hadn't even thought to look at Spotify or any music thing because I was like, oh, there's no way the album's Coming right now. It was coming in some fear to the future. And so, yeah, so. And it was. It was only like maybe 10 minutes after you had sent me that link. And so then I was like, wait, Cole, you haven't sent me the link to the album yet. Do you know about this? So that was. That was it. So it was. It was. It was, yeah, it was surprising. I was like, oh, it's a full album. It's 12 tracks. Like, I was like, wait, is this. Is this, like, real that it's coming out now? And I was like, oh, I guess it's a. It's a full project. So, yeah, I had some, like, work to do in the morning, and I normally like. Like to not have to focus on anything if I'm listening it the first time. So I just kind of got some of my work and meeting out of the way and ate lunch and then I normally go for a jog when I listen to it. So I did that in the afternoon and then listened through the whole thing. So, yeah, that was my. That was my experience of finding it out the day of and starting to get into it.

Cole Kushna (5:25)

Yeah. So I was. I was taking my daughter to school. We were in line at a coffee shop when the trailer dropped. So I'm on the phone in line and trying to. Putting the phone up to my ear and listening to the lyrics and watching the visuals kind of going back, back and forth between my. My eyes and my ear. And then I was in another. I. Then I dropped her off, watched the trailer a few times. And then I was at another coffee shop getting ready to work when I got the message that the album was out. And so I just immediately sat down because usually I like to go for a drive, but it was pouring down rain and I was like, you know, rush hour in the morning. So I was like, I'll just. Let me just experience this thing right away in the moment. So just sat down, listened in this coffee shop with headphones on and tried to take it in, then listen to it for the second time immediately after that in my car, just sitting in my car in the rain and listened to it all the way through. So let's. Yeah, let's just start with our first impressions of what this is. I don't want to talk about. We're going to. So we're going to speculate if there's more coming, but I want to honor this as much as we can as a, you know, a body of work unto itself. So we'll save the speculation for the most part. For the end of the episode. So let's talk about the sound of the project maybe first. I think we all kind of were expecting this in terms of a very west coast influenced sound sounding project. I think everything post beef with Drake has pointed in this direction. I think that was kind of fairly obvious that some version of this was coming. So I don't think that was a surprise to me. You know, we got the broccoli song, so he delivered on that. And there's a few, you know, a handful. I would say about half the album is in that vein of. Of just purely west coast inspired, more or less traditional in that vein, but it's Kendrick. So there are, you know, sprinkled in here some conceptual songs, some more, I guess, R and B influenced songs, some more classic Hip hop, 80s 90s Hip hop inspired songs. So I guess in terms of the sonics of the album, I would say, I mean it's very, very, very well produced. And I don't. What I'm about to say. I don't want to undermine the quality of the production, but it did strike me that feels less produced than his past work in terms of overall concepts, in terms of the way songs kind of evolve and go different places. For the most part these songs are kind of more or less. The beat kind of comes in and he raps and there's the typical dropout come back in with the beat, those type of moves. But in terms of more grander production, I felt like that is not so much on this project compared to his past works. Would you agree with that?

Femi Olutade (8:14)

Yeah, I very much agree. And I think we had texted each other that night and I think we both had the same perspective about what we felt about the maybe the grandeur or the scope of the album relative to the really the past. Like the four works from Good Kidman City through Mr. Morale, while all of them are different and we even have different attachments to each of them and they've been reviewed differently. There was this grand scope in all of them in this certain way. And I think one of the ways I think we like working together is we come from a different angle. I think you hear a lot of the sound and the sonics, the music and production a lot quicker. And I tend to gravitate to a lot of the lyrics and the concepts. And I think from both of them it is more simplified than some. Not that there isn't complex things, not that there isn't connections, but as you were saying, the kind of scope of how things are constructed, the things That I definitely noticed were one. The lack of spoken interludes, to me, was very noticeable because on every single album, even going Back to Section 80, there's a recurring character that's like a narrator figure even in that. So there's always been spoken interludes in Kendrick's albums, and they tend to really tie the album together and give kind of direction and help in terms of understanding it or putting the album in context. And this one really didn't have that. You have the Spanish singing, but it's not really a spoken interlude. It's also not in English. And so it's. You kind of lack that as far as, like, the structure that you kind of get used to on a lot of Kenneth Kendrick albums. So that, to me, was kind of notable. And then I think we'd have to get into the actual song itself, but just some of the. Just how the themes get developed where you can kind of see some resolution early on and how some of the later songs seems to be some ideas unto themselves conceptually. It's not that they aren't related totally, but there was a sense of. There was less of this interconnected material and this kind of grander material that stitches everything together that you've seen in the last, particularly four Kendrick projects.

Cole Kushna (10:25)

Yeah, it's still early, but I certainly don't feel any type of narrative arc going over. There's no Mother Eye Sober at the end. There's no Sing About Me. There's, you know, these classic narrative arcs that we've come to expect from his projects. Just what isn't there for me? And so this. I think we've. We've talked about this. It could. I mean, so one theory about the lack. Quote, and we're. This is all in relation to his past work. So it's like even Kendrick's most less conceptual work still has much to talk about conceptually. But I think as we have experienced Kendrick, post Mr. Morale, I think me and you have talked a lot about this privately, just kind of trying to figure out where he is artistically, conceptually and spiritually post Mr. Morale, which did feel like a very. Like a turning point, like a crossroads for him. And it seemed to be a mark of something, a new version, for lack of a better phrase, of Kendrick. And so, you know, I had a few thoughts about the quote, unquote, lack of concept on this project, which is one. It's a precursor to something bigger. Or this is a new part of this new version of Kendrick, which is he doesn't have to be the conceptual guy all the time. He doesn't have to give every project. The pressure of him changing the world with every project that that late, that weight has been lifted off his shoulders. And so maybe we just do get these kind of projects going forward or maybe just it's just this one, you know, and he doesn't feel that pressure anymore.

Femi Olutade (12:05)

Yeah, I mean, I think there is one thing I'll say is that on my first listen I very immediately felt that tracks one through six were very tightly connected conceptually and that there was a narrative in those ones, or at least like a very clear progression in terms of what he was saying on those. I felt that less so on the last half of the album, which isn't to say that it isn't connected. And I think thematically there's a lot of things even say something like Dodger Blue, which is a lot about Los Angeles, isn't really at the core of the main themes of the first tracks. But as we've seen to the Pop out show, a lot of the theme about LA and identification is part of the underlying context of which the narrative and what Kendrick's been doing has taken place. So it's in things like that that there are things that are there that are almost. It sometimes doesn't necessarily feel like it flows chronologically from after the first six tracks, but there are these kind of themes that are there. So that's what it's almost in between. Because it's not the same level, I feel like of kind of wall to wall narrative that you've seen in the last major four albums, but it's definitely more interconnected and more of a progression than say the untitled release. So it's this interesting in between and so it occupies this kind of new scope of space for Kendrick that is. I'm not sure if he will release other things that are like this in scope and then also release other things that are like the last four albums in scope. I think that's what time should be. Time will have to tell. But yeah, there is this understanding. There is this. There are levels to. I feel like Kendrick's projects very clearly and this one is kind of this interesting level where it's not fully loose, but it's also not as tightly packed as the last four albums that we've seen from him.

Cole Kushna (14:01)

Yeah, I agree with that. And it does slot into. I'm starting to view 2024 as its own type of concept. Right. And we can talk. I think maybe that's the best way to talk about the lens through which we should talk about this album, I guess, is. I mean, we don't need to rehash the Drake beef, but I think it became obvious that the beef with Drake was symbolic on his. And I would say in his perspective was symbolizing something else and the start of something else, which is these kind of two factions of hip hop, the splintering of hip hop, the lack of tradition on one side, and Kendrick being someone that is going to represent the tradition of hip hop. Whereas Drake is symbolizing something else about hip hop and where it's gone. And as part of his victory, he has re centered west coast, he's brought back regionality. All these more traditional aspects of hip hop that were. That feel less, I guess, just less prevalent today than perhaps they used to in the 90s or even in the 2000s. So post battle, Kendrick, it's. The animosity has not stopped. Let's just say, you know, it did not end with Drake. It seems to be only beginning with Drake. And so a lot of what Kendrick is saying on this album is there's, there's a lot of venom. There's a lot, you know, on the first track, which we'll talk about, he said it used to be fuck you, but now it's plural. And so he's widening his scope and it's, you know, it wasn't, it was never just about Drake. And now he seems to be preparing us for shots at everybody, or not everybody, but everyone that he feels perhaps is not upholding the values of hip hop specifically and more likely kind of more broadly moral, using maybe hip hop and the culture surrounding it as an example of a broader deterioration of morality and just, you know, across the world. Are you getting a sense of that as well?

Femi Olutade (16:11)

Yeah, I agree with. Yeah, so much of what you said, I think, yes, I think I've always talked about how I often am reticent and slow to try to over interpret Kendrick's loose songs or features until there's a larger body of work to understand them. But as you said, probably at least definitely by the time the Pop out show happened, I was like, I kind of feel like you have to just treat this whole beef as an album, as a project in and of itself, because it's so large and scope and it's adding so much terminology, it's adding so much and it's clearly all connected. So that kind of feeling. And you make a really great point of seeing this album as part of 2024, being this larger album and stuff, and this being kind of almost like a section of it, I think that is. I think that's a really great way of framing it. And then with this, I think, again, there's the actual section of the Beef tracks and the Diss tracks, and there's whatever's going on after that. And for me, I think particularly with this album, for me, the thing that I keep resonating with his album about is the previous track that he released on IG Live or on Socials, the Watch the Party Die or the Day the Party Died. That track, I spent a lot of time just in that particular track and analyzing it. And to me, a lot of this album is essentially taking that song, which was kind of a little bit more obscure, at least when he gets at what I think he was saying. And it was really layered and there's a lot more entrencher and a lot of things. And it kind of unpacks that song kind of over a wider set of tracks and is more blunt and direct about it at various points and kind of gives you more of a turn than there ever is. And that is implied in that particular track, the Watch the Party Die, but is never fully developed, and it actually gets developed a little bit more in this album. So for me, and because they are both really like their post Beef releases, there is that they're coming from this really similar space and this really similar perspective, at least from what I can see.

Cole Kushna (18:23)

Yeah, I think I want you to expand on that because just. Just to recap for people, Watch the Party Die was dropped. I mean, he. He announced the Super Bowl. I'm forgetting exactly how long after the super bowl announcement he dropped that. But it was within a couple of weeks. And to me, it was like the epilogue of the Beat Beef. It was a retrospective. It was kind of closing the door on the Beef, but now we're realizing it was. Now it's kind of acting as a bridge, you know, closing the door on the Drake Beef, but opening the door to this wider, broader thing that it seems like he's going to be working towards. So why don't you briefly kind of give us your. Your conceptual understanding of Watch the Party Die, just so we have that context as we get deeper into gnx.

Femi Olutade (19:09)

Yeah, sure. So conceptually, at a very high level, you are very right, that it seems to be like, Watch the Bright Eyes seems to be very clearly talking about Drake, but then expanding it into areas and people that clearly are not Drake himself. It starts really largely expanding it to the music industry. Record executives, like music film executives, so the whole entertainment industry really Gets implicated in this. A lot of social influencers and people in, whether social media or influence or anyone that's exercising control or putting ideas in front of people that he feels aren't benefiting the kids, aren't benefiting society. And throughout the album or throughout this particular track, Watch the Party Die, he is essentially really advocating to take really extreme and vicious acts of violence to anyone that he feels like is a danger or in some ways a bad influence on society. And throughout the track, it just gets more and more intense and more and more vitriol and more and more violence. And throughout it, he's essentially trying to justify these acts of violence and retribution as things that are going to be done for the benefit of everyone in society. And so it becomes actually this really largely philosophical song of like, okay, there's everything going on with Drake. But to some extent, the biggest thing that Kendrick focused on when he was most serious was a lot of the allegations he made about Drake, related to how Drake deals with women, girls, and him and his crew. And then tied into this larger thing we've seen with, like, Diddy and what Katt Williams called out with people in the entertainment industry about how sexual abuse or trafficking or other things are going on. And so even aside from Drake, what Kendrick, I think, is often asking very philosophically is like, when there's clear evil in the world, how should we deal with it?

Cole Kushna (21:20)

Yeah, yeah.

Femi Olutade (21:22)

That's really what the song is about. And basically throughout the song, he's on the side of almost this tyrant that's being like, if there's anything that I think is evil, these people are getting killed and tortured. And we're gonna make sure no one ever acts like this. And even if there's innocent people next to them, we're gonna kill their whole families, we're gonna burn the whole village, scorch the earth. That's the mentality that's coming out of it. But it's really this larger philosophical things that you see in wars in human society and what you see maybe in the Middle east, on various sides of things. It's this really larger conversation about how do you deal with things when you've determined this is actually not good, this isn't good for society, this is evil. How does one respond to that? And that's a lot of what Watch the Party Die I think is about. And I think a lot of that gets carried into how Kendrick is approaching a lot of stuff on gnx.

Cole Kushna (22:11)

Yeah, very well said. Yeah. And as you're saying that I'm just Thinking about our journey with Kendrick, because this has obviously been on his mind since section 8. I mean, since forever, essentially. And a large part of his discography is. Has been confronting exactly that question for over a decade now. And what his role as a. As someone who has been handed this huge microphone has been earned. You know, earned this huge microphone, but in some ways have also been given that. What do I do with this responsibility? How. How do I best navigate being this leader? What is my message? Is it one of compassion and hope? Is it one of vitriol and. And judgment? And obviously this is the dichotomy of Kendrick Amar. I think what's interesting to me specifically post Mr. Morale, because you hear on Mr. Morale, I mean, it's very introspective and very much, you know, him holding a mirror up to himself more than anybody. But there are definite moments where he is go. Starts to go at the public in a way that he has not before. I think of N95, I think of the title track, Mr. Morale. I think of Savior, where he's very blunt in a way that he just hasn't been in past works. And he's always put the focus on himself and used himself and his. His flaws as. As a. As a model and kind of. And as a model of humanity and just battling himself. And now very clearly he has taken what I feel like that now have. Were the seeds in Mr. Morale and have. Have. After going hard on himself, he's going to go just as hard on others is kind of how I'm framing it in my head because a lot of this album gnx, which we talked about briefly over Texas because there is just so much talk of I'm coming after you, I'm gonna do this thing. Yet I don't feel like he delivered on that. As much as perhaps he is purporting it's about to be something, it still feels like it's about to be something. Are you getting that understanding as well after post gnx?

Femi Olutade (24:31)

Yeah, it's a good question. I think a lot of it. And we'll have to get into it when we talk more directly of the tracks. A lot of it, I think comes back to how you understand the track reincarnated.

Cole Kushna (24:44)

Yeah. Okay.

Femi Olutade (24:45)

That is really at the crux of that track because that. And we kind of alluded to it before. But gnx, it is in this long history of Kendrick Songs of xxx, Fear of Mortal man, how much a dollar cost of Sing About Me that is from a spiritual angle, kind of pulling the veil up over what we consider reality and trying to look at it from this cross time kind of heavenly view. As in like you can see everything that's going on on earth and you're sitting outside of time and seeing the patterns and seeing the connections. This really deeply spiritually connected view of what is going on and looking at himself and looking at society through that lens. And like reincarnated is totally 100% that.

Cole Kushna (25:37)

Yeah. Okay, so let's, we're gonna. We'll use that as a great teaser because I do. That's my. I'm excited to talk to you about Moses, specifically that song. So let's get through some. A few other prefatory kind of things and then we'll really dive into that point. So let's just put a little bookmark in that. Start with because I do want to talk about the gnx, let's talk about the album title, let's talk about the car as a way to frame this project as its own kind of entity. And then we'll get into the specific songs that we wanted to highlight today. So I did a bunch of research on the gnx. Very interesting. You know, it's not just a car. You know, as much as maybe this is a looser project. I think the GNX is very symbolic of a few things. So let me just run down a few bullet points of what I. What I found in my research and kind of talk about perhaps what that means. So in a 2012 interview with Complex, Kendrick said this quote. My pops put me on to rap when I was born. I came home from the hospital and at 87 Buick Regal, while my pops was bumping Big Daddy Kane. He goes on to say that he introduced him to Rakim Biz Markie. And then he says, sometimes I sit back and listen to hip hop with my father to see where my hip hop roots come from. So we have this history of an 87 Buick Regal. The GNX is a version of it comes from this lineage of Regals. I'm not a car guy, so hopefully my terminology is going to be sufficient here. But so yeah. So the GNX is a part of this Buick Regal line of cars. It stands for grand national experiment. Only 547 of them were made and they were made in one year and they were made in Kendrick's birth year, 1987. So that feels like a significant, very obvious thread there. They are available in one color, black. And they got the nickname at the time because of the color and the shape of them and the angles of them. They were nicknamed Darth Vader's car. And the dark side, which feels to the points that we've been making, feels very appropriate to Kendrick's mentality at this moment. They're also a last of a dying breed. So the grand national, the gnx, was created to end all Grand National. It's supposed to be the cream of the crop, the most that they can do with this line of cars because they were. The next year they were going to be converting the Regal line to front wheel drive. And all past models were real rear wheel drives, which apparently is a more aggressive, more a faster experience. Again, sorry I'm not a car guy, but that was a significant change. Femi, are you into cars at all?

Femi Olutade (28:35)

I'm not into cars, so anything that I know about it I read through, so I can't help you there.

Cole Kushna (28:40)

Right. So. But it feels like this was a significant shift into this more safer driving vehicles that kind of then became very prevalent in the 90s and 2000s and there's less emphasis on performance. And so it was kind of this, this idea of being the last of a dying breed seems to tie clearly into Kendrick being more of this traditional hip hop artist. It was faster than The Corvette, the GNX, it was faster than most US market Ferraris. Yet it cost under. It cost 80,000 to, you know, a Ferrari costing over a million. So it, it was, you know, better than the rest. But it came from very humble roots, which of course feels like it ties perfectly into Kendrick's identity. So from it being created in his birth year being this rare breed, the black symbolism, the Darth Vader, it just feels like all very, very symbolic. I don't know if you have anything.

Femi Olutade (29:39)

To add to that, but yeah, I 100% agree. I endorse everything you just said. Yeah, there's definitely all the connections to Kendrick. I know he must find that really uncanny whenever he thinks about himself. And he clearly thinks in a very symbolic and connected way. And that's just one of those things that I think Kendrick would definitely really gravitate towards. So you can definitely see how that can become such a larger concept of the album. The car, of course, is mentioned several times throughout the album, so it's definitely part of tying it together conceptually. And everything about the Darth Vader, Darkseid kind of villainous kind of approach empire and the idea of empires, and particularly when you deep into Vader being the head of the empire, there's all this stuff about kings and empires and leaders and darkness and light that is one of the core themes of the album, particularly over the first six tracks. It's so interwoven in there and really deeply into what he's referencing. It's all there from a historical and spiritual and conceptual thing in the songs themselves. So all of that ties in so perfectly with what you hear going on and the power and the force and all of that stuff. It makes so much sense when you listen to the album.

Cole Kushna (30:59)

Right, right, right. Yeah. And one thread that could be a thing. You know, he's talked a lot about generational ascension, generations improving upon each other. He's talked about specifically his own father. I'm thinking of father time and just everything on Mr. Morale and, you know, your successor being able to build upon the legacy that you leave and that being such a. And Kendrick trying his hardest to leave for his children a better place them in a better position so that then they can take it further than he. He has. He says that on this album. He said this on Mr. Morale. So there does seem to be this symbolic significance to me. Whereas dad drove an 87 Buick Regal, which is the more standard kind of everyday vehicle for, you know, an average person of not much means, and him now being able to afford this unique, rare luxury vehicle, so to speak, and him kind of, okay, my dad left me this, and now I'm building on this. And hopefully my children can symbolize something even grander than the gnx. So I thought that was kind of a cool thematic tie or at least an interpretation. But I will. I do want to put. Put out this theory that in terms of if there is a concept, this is something I've been thinking about, and it relates to the gnx. So in whacked out murals, he says, riding in my GNX with Anita Baker in the tape deck, it's going to be a sweet love. And so we get this image. Apparently GNXs only have a tape deck, so you can only play cassettes in it. And so we get this idea of a tape. So a lot of people are speculating this is more of a mixtape than an album. So perhaps that's something. But more interesting to me is Kendrick talks a lot about his father. His musical influence comes from his father. We read the quote about hip hop, but we know from Good Kid, Mad city and several music interviews, his dad and his parents listen to hip hop, current music, but also a lot of oldies. And so he has spoken about hearing soul, classic soul, An R and B artist growing up in his. In his house and in his car, riding around with his father. So There is one way to conceptualize this album as being a mixtape inspired by the music heard in his dad's car growing up. And so with that in mind, I'll just lay out some bullet points that might kind of prove this theory. I. I don't even want to say prove, but it's just a way of framing the album, if only if you're in your own head. So on Whacked Out Murals, it's based on a sample by Houdini from 1984 called Friends, which we'll talk about more thematically. But that is, you know, 1984 aligns right with the music he'd be hearing as a child. Squabble up samples when I hear music. Classic Debbie deb song from 1983. Song 3 Luther Vandross 1982 if this World Were Mine man at the Garden 1 Mike 2001 Nas Hey, Now Interpolate Scotty by D4L 2005 Reincarnated, of Course Tupac 1996 Made N Words Heart Part 6 Samples SWV 1996 R B song on TV off he quotes Biggie Kicking the Door, 1997 so I haven't done the full kind of dissection of this theory yet, but there seems to be enough on the surface to where, perhaps, I don't know. Is this theory making any sense to you? Are you buying it at all?

Femi Olutade (34:39)

Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think a lot of what you said, I see a lot of connection to things that I've thought in various ways about it. A couple things, I'll point out, is one, you talk about Kendrick's father, and we've come back to that. And again, this has been a theme the last few Kendrick albums, from Duckworth to Father Time itself. But this relationship between sons and fathers is definitely something that's really significant. Like on this album, it's so significant. And again, it gets brought up in reincarnated, so we'll have to mention when we get there. But of course, even previously, we talked about it being the GNX being the Darth Vader's car, right? And what's one of the most iconic statements in the whole Star wars whole franchise history? It's like Luke, I am your father said by Darth Vader. And this choice between father and son and darkness and light, and will one go to the dark side? Will one go to the light side? And this inheritance that's kind of given over, that Darth Vader has to kind of give over to his son, and the son choosing either to receive it or to receive the essence of what is good about what the father has, but choose a different path. That's actually more towards the light. Right. So a lot of that's there. And the other thing too, with the mixtape and the fact that it is sampling these kind of classic music and very, very much having this feel of this tape of songs that his parents or his dad might be listening to. There is this larger thing about music and particularly black music in the 20th century that has been produced as part of the music industry. And that is a big theme first on Watch the Party Die and then here on gnx that is continuing very much though, again particularly on reincarnated. But this whole theme about music and this legacy and the spirit being passed down and the influence over generations is so intertwined. What's going on and being paired with Kendrick himself leaving tde, starting PG Lang, starting his own music visual visual entity company, Hard Part. We're gonna talk about hard. And this retrospective thinking about the days of. With black hippie and tde. There's so much about music industry and music and heritage that is also intertwined in here.

Cole Kushna (37:23)

Right.

Femi Olutade (37:24)

And so very much so. And so that. So even just conceptually, when you see that all that idea of a mixtape and both that being like a kind of a dated, like what mixtape really mean, being slightly like dated to a previous time and also being tied to like his parents, what they're listening to, there is this larger generational thing and choice and darkness and light that I think is all involved in there.

Cole Kushna (37:42)

Right, right, right. Okay. Okay. So let's take a quick ad break and then we're going to come back and we're going to start our kind of mini dissections of individual songs. So stick around for that. Okay. We are back dissecting GNX as much as we can. 72 hours after its release, Femio Lutade's here with me. We're going to talk. Let's just jump right into whacked out murals. God, this is such a. It's just three verses of just thunder and lightning.

Femi Olutade (38:11)

Just.

Cole Kushna (38:14)

I mean, I just remember pushing. It was pouring down rain when I first heard this song. I'm looking out the window at a coffee shop. I push play and it's just this operatic mariachi, like the kind of menacing background and it's just like so ominous. But let's talk about the intro because it is the only kind of conceptual thread in terms of interlude interspersal kind of material that we get. So when you translate these lyrics that we hear at the start it's something. I don't know if it's the right translation exactly, but the multiple ones that I've read all point to the same thing. So she sings, I feel your presence here last night. And we start to cry. Another translation I've read is, in this moment, I am feeling your presence. It's the night of our last night and we begin to mourn. So I don't. I'm still kind of figuring out what to make of this. It does. It does. In terms of presence, I feel your presence here. It does feel like it ties into this idea of reincarnation and feeling the spirit of someone, of someone's past, or perhaps your own past entity. I don't know. Do you have any sense of what this is yet?

Femi Olutade (39:32)

Yeah, it's still a little loose in my head, but as I sat with the album more, I have some initial thoughts that I'm not necessarily tied to. But what I can see is, regardless of what the main. Whatever meaning or interpretation or suggestion, it's definitely playing in some of the thematic areas that I noticed. One, the idea of night, again, I've talked about light and darkness is a major theme. And then in particular the night sky and stars and planets. And that whole imagery is really tied together in the album. So even establishing the idea of night already and this kind of relationship thing, which you see from here all the way down to Gloria and Father, son, relationship and things. So there's a lot of stuff going on there that it's already activating. I think some of the thematic elements of it. Presence. I think you're onto something there and that I do think presence is a very spiritual thing. It's a very spiritual concept that he seems to be activating by using that word. Yes, it can refer very directly to just a relationship, but I think the presence of particularly feeling the presence, is something that someone maybe has to be aware of, that wouldn't otherwise be aware of, which leads to, like you're saying, spirits, other things like that that are involved and you said reincarnated from more of the Buddhist Eastern spirituality, things which we've seen a lot more from Mr. Morale till now. And then additionally from a historical Christian aspect, when you hear the word presence, the connotation is almost consistently all the time related to the presence of God, of God being the presence. And God's spirit is often referred to as his personal presence. And so there is. What I'll say is like the thing regardless of where it's coming from, to me, it Seems very closely tied to the spiritual thing and this kind of tension in this relationship, which again plays out in reincarnated later on, which goes back to the idea of reincarnation and spiritual everything come back to that. And so all that stuff and the presence of the spirit, of God. And God, I think, and the night and darkness and light. I think there's a lot of stuff that's in there that I like. There's. I'm sure there's layers that I don't really see right now, but it's definitely. It's definitely playing in that thematic space.

Cole Kushna (42:03)

Yeah. And I mean, even the last line, we start to cry or we begin to mourn. I'm thinking back to watch the party die. And, you know, so much emphasis on killing. Whether that's metaphor or not, you know, that. That feels like, okay, something's about to. We're about to mourn something. So we'll keep that in mind. Let's. Let's. I think the first verse is probably worthy of talking about as it kind of lays the. You know, sets the foundation of this album. He says, yesterday someone whacked out my mural. This is. I think you might have the dates on this pulled up. Do you have the dates of. He's talking about a mural that was painted on. On Tam's burger joint in Compton. Is that the correct location?

Femi Olutade (42:47)

I believe so, yeah. And then as far as the dates, you're saying that. I think it was July 16th. I think the artist had posted the mural, and then I think by September 8th, someone had vandalized it, including writing OVO in reference to Drake on the mural. So the whacked out in that particular case being some kind of destruction or defilement or erasing or messing up of this mural that was done to honor Kendrick in his city.

Cole Kushna (43:16)

Right. Okay. So he starts there. And. And I love. I love the immediacy of yesterday. It's like he is writing in the moment about the moment. I mean, this is. So if we're taking him at his word, you know, it's September. It's. It's the next day. So it's September. That's a month ago. You know, all of this is. This whole album feels very recent. I think we'll talk more about that at the end. But he says that that'll energy will make you guys move out to Europe. But it's regular for me. And yes, for. That's for sure. The love and hate is definite without a cure. So love and hate, Darkness, light. There's, you know, he's establishing that right away. Later he says, I'll kill, kill them all before I let him kill my joy. Joy. He says it used to be fuck that end, but now it's plural. F everybody that's on my body. My blick first, then God got me. So right away, again making it very clear he's coming for blood and that no one is safe. So, yeah, I'm curious to hear your thoughts. The blick first then God got me is such a standout line for me. I'm very curious to hear your thoughts on these lines or anything about this first verse.

Femi Olutade (44:30)

Yeah, so, yeah, totally. Right. The violence, the viciousness, the tendency towards acts of violence and using blick, blick being a gun to protect oneself, to defend oneself, to go at people that are adversaries. So again, all of that is something that we've heard before. Like for me, it always comes back to xxx, which is one of the pivotal tracks on Dam, where he talks about the story of one of his friends coming to him. His friend's son had been killed because he was in debt to some gangsters or some other people in the streets. And then the person asked Kendrick, will you pray for me? It's been an effed up day for me. I know that you're anointed, show me how to overcome. And then he talks about this friend was looking for some closure, hoping I can bring him closer to the spiritual. And then Kendrick says, my spirit knows better. But I told him, I can't sugarcoat the answer for you. This is what I feel. If somebody killed my son, that means somebody getting killed.

Cole Kushna (45:29)

And he goes on to. Let me just say I have thought about that line so many times this past month. Oh my God.

Femi Olutade (45:36)

It's like, oh man. That like, it is just one of the rawest kind of Kendrick. And he goes into like detail about how he would stalk this person down, like try to kill him if he's coming out of church, like being in his neighborhood. And then goes out and says, like, I'll chip him out. Like I'll chip him and then throw the blower. I get another slang for a gun, so blower in his lap and walk myself to the courts. Like, bitch, I did that. Like this. Just against any form of law, any kind of rules. Going out and taking vengeance and taking, like taking violence and getting and threatening and erasing anyone who would possibly threaten or hurt or harm his family or his loved ones. You really see that there. And it's of course very in that same spirit because when he's looking for protection. He sees that there's enemies around him. I need to be protected first. It's my gun. And only after that is a God that I'm trusting to protect myself. It's that same mentality that's there that is putting up that I'm going to defend myself at whatever cost before I turn towards the spiritual at all or even take revenge. So there's that. And then that ties to the it's love and hate line, I think so much much, which I think is definitely thematic in all this. I'd won the Gen X trailer. There was that line where it says reincarnated with love. So there's that whole theme that's there. Of course, love was a track on. On Damn. And it was a track that was right before XXX that which we were just talking about. So there's all that love and hate is like right there. And then, of course, this all goes back to the Drake beef, right? Because Euphoria, Kendrick's first jab or friendly fade, as he was saying in the song, was he said very directly, one of the more quotable lines or segments of it where he's like, it ain't been about critics, ain't about gimmicks, not about who's the greatest. It's always been about love and hate. Now let me tell you, I'm the biggest hater. The famous lines, I hate the way that you walk, the way that you talk. I hate the way that you dress. I hate the way that you sneak this, right? So he goes in on Drake about this whole love and hate thing. And so like that totally activates this within 2024, that like, that is clearly one of the under attacks of him saying this, like, love and hate towards Drake, but then also maybe expanding to other people. And it's so key because from a biblical standpoint, this is. This is like all the same thing. Because the. Everything we talked about with light and darkness, the nighttime and everything we've been saying, there is a really famous passage. It's in a book called First John or the first Universal letter of John. It's written by one of Jesus 12 disciples. And one of the key themes of the whole letter. And it's about like. Takes about 10 minutes to read, but it's like, it's all about light and darkness and then loving and hating. Like, that's the whole thing is about that. And it just keeps repeating those themes. And there are these lines in it where John, the disciple of Jesus is like, hey, the one when he says, quote, the one who says that he is in the light but hates his brother is actually in darkness and the darkness has actually blinded his eyes so that he cannot see he's in darkness. And then there's a later section where he's like the. Where he's like, for one who does not love his brother, who he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen, that it's actually impossible for him to love God or say he loves God's father if he doesn't actually love his brother, which is not just biological, it's a larger category of people, definitely including for him other people that are his brothers and other black brothers, but other people that he's working with that he's there. And there's even this part of it where he talks about that letter, where it talks about, you can know, the children of God versus the children of the devil because people who don't love their brothers are of the devil and people who love their brothers are from God. And he compares people that don't love their brothers to Cain, who was a biblical figure that was a son of Adam, one of the prototypical human, who was the first murderer in the Bible, who killed his brother because he was jealous of his brother or angry at his brother. And so that whole idea of murder, of killing, and people that hate these people that they should love, not actually being able to love God, not actually being identified as the children of God, which means that God is no longer their father. And then thus them being in the light and being so blind as not even recognize that they're in the light, they're in the darkness, and they think they're in the light, but they're actually in darkness.

Cole Kushna (50:08)

Right, interesting. Okay, yeah, I can see how those ideas kind of cloud over all of this, but yeah, let's move on to. So the hook is interesting in that he goes from kind of attack mode to guidance mode, I guess, for a lack of a better phrase. Yeah, I think so. And essentially kind of says, like, follow my lead. This is how I have done things. And you should, you know, he's encouraging people to do, do it like he's doing. I don't know if you want to say anything about the hook specifically before we move on.

Femi Olutade (50:45)

Yeah, yeah, I think. Yeah, I totally agree with you. It is a switch. It seems like he's talking to other people, kind of like little homies, like giving them advice. In many ways, this section really resembles Father Time as far as the kind of like tough love, hard nosed advice, particularly Lines where it's like, keep your feelings out the way. That really echoes things. Where his dad is like, you know, he hid his emotions. He never expressed himself. Men should never show feelings. Being sensitive never helped, right? So all of that seems like really kind of key there. Understanding that work hard, which is like, his dad went to work after his mom had passed, and he's like, oh, the bill is still coming. And that he's like, don't trust anyone. Just know your mom and them. Which kind of really connects to love. But understand everybody ain't going to like you. And if they say that it's loved, then you've been lied to. Which connects back to Father Time where he's like, I might reject the love. I can't attach relationships and this whole rules of engagement. So all that's there. And what is interesting is that that all is kind of there. The part that the. Therefore, like the way one responds to the first couple lines where he's like, hey, go and up your rank. Go and level your. Go and exalt yourself and get more status and power in the streets. Because Rank, you see that in, like, it's on Good Kid, Mad City on Good Kid, where he talks about, like, people who are in the gangs that, like, live in the street with rank. So this kind of connects to that power, like, in the streets and, like, money and violence and things. And so that's all there as far as, like, this kind of pride and exaltation. But there's a really key line in here where it says, no, you a God, even when they say you ain't, which there's so much going on there. Like, I think that's a reference to Kanye impartially, because, like, Kanye had a song like I Am a God on Yeezus, where Yeez was blending Jesus and ye and, like, this kind of depicting himself as a God. Connie had interviews where he's like, I'm a God. Why people say, I can't say that. I have me saying that I'm an N word, but I can't say that I'm a God. So all of that is there. And this is all really tied because it's all tied to the spiritual thing of whether it is a good thing or not for people, particularly Kendrick, to think that he is a God. And it's showing this increased pride, this arrogance and all these things. And it is also going to be spiritually tied too, as well, because this comes up particularly in sections in the Old Testament where biblical prophets, who are the ones that Hear from God and tell the people, or even tell people that are other kings in particular, what God is saying and thinking to them. There are some significant sections where biblical prophets tell other kings who are like these violent emperors that are ruling over these newly built empires. And these emperors are acting like they're gods or depicting themselves as God or saying they represent God. And there are these whole, like, lines, particularly one particular one in Ezekiel 28, where he speaks to a king, I think of Tyre, which was one of the kingdoms up north of Israel at the time, and says, like, oh, you were proud and you thought that you were a God, right? That you've lifted up. You've lifted up your heart. You've said that I am a God, but you're not a God. You're going to die like a human. And because of that. And actually what it says I'm going to. I'm going. What it says, the prophet says, I'm going to bring. God is going to bring enemies around you to take you down and bring you down to the pit of death. So there's this whole theme of, like, people setting themselves as gods, exalting themselves, and then God eventually sending a true prophet to humble that person and bring them down. And that's really tied throughout the themes of this particular work. And I think he's setting that up there in the chorus, I think.

Cole Kushna (54:26)

Yeah. Very interesting perspective, I would say. The first thing that I thought of was just because I'm so deep in Mr. Morale right now, was Eckhart Tolle's work. One of the major things I've seen post Morale from Kendrick is this phrase I am used a bunch which I connected directly to Eckhart Tolle. I know there's probably other kind of possible connections there, but this is something that Eckhart Tolle does talk a lot about, which is this phrase I am. And when you say I am, it's a complete phrase that taps into just being itself. There's no. It's just I am. There's I am. It's not I am this, which is a form. This being a form. It's just I am. And it's just. It's totally says. Usually says consciousness, but he has many times said it's also synonymous with God and that we are all a piece, a small piece or a representation of this larger consciousness. And we're all emblematic of it. Or the collection of us is part of this larger thing. And Kendrick, I think of I am all of us, I think of I am reincarnated Even on Squabble up, he has used this phrase a few times. Points in the same direction of being a piece of God or a representation of this light or this consciousness. So that's what I. That's what I was thinking. But also to your point about Father Time and even to my point about Eckhart Tolle, I have no idea. Like, there's so what I thought I understood of Father Time and him seeming to want to expunge certain qualities that he learned from his father.

Femi Olutade (56:06)

Yep.

Cole Kushna (56:07)

Are like to your point is this. Is. This is him acting as if he is his father and passing these same lessons at his father gave to him that he seemed to be trying to get away from on Father Time. It just seems so very clearly that inheritance magnified and taken to an extreme. So I'm still. Still trying to reckon that, to be honest.

Femi Olutade (56:34)

Yeah. I think you've hit on. I think the IM is really significant. And it's significant throughout Kendrick's catalog because he actually has two songs called I Am. There's one that's an interlude that's on Kendrick Lamar ep if you go all the way back to there. And he kind of gives us the intro of who he is and I Am. He references the Sermon on the Mount. Being the meat shall inherit the earth. There's all this kind of stuff that's in there. And then that's also a theme on the Black Panther soundtrack. There's a song there. There's that kind of almost interlude I Am. And there's two distinct sections. One is the first track, Black Panther, where he says I am T'Challa. And he's depicted as like the good king, like the. And then right after the track I Am is the track Paramedic, which is like a really heavy Northern California Bay Area like song. And that starts off with saying, like, I am Killmonger. And so there is this duality. There is this light chose between light and dark, between the yin and the yang of t'challa and. And Killmonger. And like all of that is there, right? And as you mentioned, it's all in Squabble up. So all that is there. And what I think I know Kendrick realizes and what's all tied and what Eckhart Tolle is often, I think, somewhat hooking into, I think intentionally because I think he's read enough that he knows this. Is that in the Bible, particularly Moses, who's the first great prophet that Kendrick has referenced going back to even like mortal man, when God reveals to Moses what God's Name is the name that God reveals can be translated as I am, which is I am the one that's existed before all things, and I have existed afterwards, and I exist, and I'm not dependent on anything else. And so that's the idea of the creator God of the universe being what's called Yahweh. That's how it's often pronounced in English, that I am. And so that is definitely connected with God's identity. And I think what you're getting at is actually this really interesting, particularly if you've gone, as you've been reading Tolle and going into morale, the big steppers. Is there this really where Kendrick is, particularly as he references certain things from, like, New Age, Eastern spirituality and more kind of historic, somewhat like orthodox, like, small orthodox believing kind of Christianity. Is this thing of, like, how does one identify God? Like, what is God's identity and how does Kendra relate to God? And there's a sense of like is like. There's a sense of God is in people, and God is also separate, which exists, I think, in both those traditions. But there's all this sense of like, when Kendrick is relating to God, is God outside of himself, or is God, Kendrick himself have all he needs? And that gets into the idea of light and where that's kind of coming from. And also, to some extent, if Kendrick, if he's acting a certain way, is he acting on behalf of God, regardless of what he does or does what he do have to conform to something that's outside of himself? That is a different standard than what he himself would actually follow.

Cole Kushna (59:32)

Right, right, right, right. Yeah, great points. Moving on to verse two. I don't really want to go to the Lil Wayne stuff like Snoop Doggs. The Internet has handled that. I didn't feel like it was a Wayne diss. It felt like him just being very honest. I don't think he was going at Wayne. I don't know if your perception was the same there, but I agree.

Femi Olutade (59:55)

I think. I think it's this broader context of, like, people aren't happy about me, which shows you that, like, you know, things are good, which it's not specific about Wayne. I don't think it's very much like he is to some extent saying, like, if people aren't really with me and they don't respect me, then they're against me. But he's not, like, calling out Wayne as in, like, Wayne has done something really unique and stuff that he should be angry about as much as, like, his success has understandably bred Contempt. And that's why he can't trust people, which is why he's like, you know, like, forget everybody and like, I can't trust anyone. Like, if you say it's love, it's you've been lied to. I think that's all that.

Cole Kushna (60:28)

Right? Yeah, exactly. Interesting. We don't have to spend too long on this. But at the end of the verse he does say against all odds I squabbled up for them dividends. Against all odds I showed up as a gentleman. This got me thinking. I sent you the song yesterday Against All Odds by Machiavelli Tupac and specifically we're going to talk about, maybe we'll talk a little bit about man in the Garden and Nas and that, that, that being a kind of a recontextualization of one mic which comes for off the album Stillmatic. You know, there's a lot of Machiavelli Tupac influence, of course on this album specifically Machiavelli album was, was post kind of battle with Biggie. And specifically on Against All Odds, the last song on that album, he goes by name at Biggie, Puff Dre, Jay Z. Like it's, it's, he's firing at everyone which I, I felt was significant in that he doesn't see, he doesn't do it by name yet. I, I, I suspect if he, there is more and he is going to fulfill this everyone, it's up for everyone energy, which I don't feel like he's fulfilled to the, to the intensity that he is talking about it and for how long he has now been talking about feels like he'll be naming names is, is my sense of where things are going, but I thought that was an interesting connection. And Stillmatic was off of the or has Ether on that album by Nas. And so it does feel like he's calling, he's calling back to these albums where, where artists that he is respected and he feels like he is of the lineage at, at perhaps similar times in their career. Does that make sense? Yeah, I found that presence kind of the influence felt. It's hard to pinpoint at sometimes, but this was what one area I was like, okay, he's calling back to that by name and the energy is all over this record. So I don't know if that if you're buying any of that.

Femi Olutade (62:33)

Yeah, I think that's definitely there. And the idea of kind of squabbling to which even just hit it at it here is that I think he used that before in hood politics where he's like the little homies called and said, the enemy's done clicked up. Oh yeah, puto wanna squabble with me, barrio. So the idea of squabbling and kind of people ganging up on someone else and this kind of engaging, this battle is definitely kind of there and against odds 100%. I think that is referencing to Tupac. And there's so much that's, that's tied into that. And so that kind of energy and attitude is definitely there. It's clearly, I think part of the. It's clearly one way to frame everything that he did with Drake because that definitely was by name as you're kind of like mentioning to that. And so I think maybe one of the questions is that, is that the path that Kendrick continues to go on with what he's done with Drake be against some of these, some other people that he might be against. I mean, he is naming. I mean he is naming Snoop and Lil Wayne in this track. So to some extent you can say that. But I think as we interpreting in context, I don't think it's necessarily that level, not anywhere that level that we're talking about.

Cole Kushna (63:39)

Yeah, we'll see where that goes. It was just an interesting thing where I was like, okay, that feels like it's pointing at something. Is there anything else though, before we move on from whacked out murals that you wanted to touch on before, we're going to jump mostly to reincarnated. But any last words on whacked out murals?

Femi Olutade (63:55)

No, not really. I mean, I will just mention the cackling that is there. And he does mention Katt Williams and the context. He mentions Cat Williams on. Oh, it was on Meet the Grams where he talks about like Kat Williams gave this truth. I'm gonna tell you mine. And that was from this interview about Harvey Weinstein and R. Kelly. And it was kind of shrouded in what's going on in Diddy, as you were kind of like mentioning and stuff. And so he's kind of like kind of come back to this several times about this idea that part of what he feels like he needs to do on Meet the Grams, it was like some, like there's some peep. There's some weird stuff going on and some of us are here to police it. And so there's this idea of like, this is somewhat of like a policing operation of like what's going on in terms of like people all y'all being on trial and things like that. So. And him being out antisocial in his house and all. These things and, like, the reason why he can't trust folks and things. So there's a lot of stuff that's out there. And even, like, the later things about him, like, white comedians shouldn't talk about a black woman. All this is kind of, like, policing things that he seems to be kind of, like, doing. So I feel like that's all really tied in with that, like, reference to Katt Williams. Oh, and Katt Williams said in that interview, like, there's a light. Like, the light. Like, all light. Everything's gonna come to light. All truth will be exposed and, like. And God is light and things. So that light theme is also really.

Cole Kushna (65:08)

Tight in there, too, as well. Okay, right, yeah, good point. Just as much as it pains me to kind of skip over half the album, I think we want to get to Reincarnated as a good chunk of this episode. But I know you did perhaps want to point out a few thematic things before that to kind of tee up or build to. To reincarnate, to kind of set the table of what. Because you said you saw the first six songs as somewhat of a thematic unit, maybe, or you can explain.

Femi Olutade (65:39)

Yeah, I do. Yeah. I can summarize. Yeah. Like, we already talked. We've already kind of set the table. I think Whacked Out Neurals does such a good job with that. So that covers, like, a lot of things.

Cole Kushna (65:48)

Right.

Femi Olutade (65:48)

Squall went up. We actually already talked about the God knows I Am and, like, reincarnated, which we're going to get to more later. So that's there. He does mention there I was stargazing, which again, goes back to what I was saying about the night and the night sky. And, of course, if you're Stargate stargazing, it's dark, and then there are stars which are light. So this light and darkness is definitely there. And the idea of stargazing is also going to come up in Reincarnated when you understand the spiritual aspect of what stars mean within the biblical imagery. So that's also put a bookmark there, too, as well. So I think all that's there. We talked about the squabbling, so that's a lot of what I see with Scalded up. That's, I think, notable. There's other things that are more in there. Luther. What I thought was interesting with Luther, of course, Luther Vandross. This goes back to the mixtape that we were kind of, like, talking, like, his name shouted out in the track title. The thing that I thought was significant about this is that it's a Very sentimental and nice sounding song. Like, oh, I would do all these things for you if the world was mine. It's actually from a duet with Luther Vandross and Cheryl Lynn. But then it was previously like a song. It actually itself was actually previously recorded by Marvin Gaye and Tammy Terrell in 1967. So again, this is a history. There's this history of that song being kind of passed on like over generations from like the 60s, 80s to now. So there's a whole thing that's in there. So it's really nice. It's like soul music, all this kind of stuff. But what's notable about that when you really listen to it is that in the middle of he starts saying things like, if the world would mind, I would take your enemies in front of God, introduce them to the light and hit them strictly with that fire.

Cole Kushna (67:24)

Yeah, yeah, that jumped out when I. I didn't even hear it really in the song. And then I looked at the lyrics, I go, whoa, okay, well, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Femi Olutade (67:32)

It just, it sounds so sweet. But he's saying that. And when you really break it down, the idea that, oh, to have the world be yours, that means that you have exalted yourself. That means you have gotten rid of your enemies. That means that you have killed off a lot of people. You're now like an emperor. You control everything and you are going to erase anyone that tries to threaten you. And that's really what plays out in this. It's this thing of I have these people I love, my significant other, my children, I'm going to take care of them and I'm going to bring down fire and take them into fire from heaven to destroy them. And that actually gets tied back into things like Watch the Party Die where he talks about burning the whole village. And I think he makes some subtle allusions to a prophet named Elijah, who actually did get God to send down fire and burn up his enemies that were trying to arrest him. So I think there's a lot of things that are in there. And it's again going on on this even where it's a sweet kind of like loving moment, Anita Baker thing, there is this violence and self exaltation and pride that's within that particular song. So like Luther is there. That's what I point out after that. And also like, baby, you're a star again. Star. Stargazing light and darkness is all there to as well. Man at the garden. It's really interesting because one, this is where he keeps on saying, I deserve it all. I Deserve it all. It reminds me a lot of feel in terms of that kind of like repetition and the distrust and the anxiety and stuff. He's just talking about how he deserves, essentially money and power, everything to go right for his family, health, success, all the things he deserves because he kind of exalts himself in this moral superiority of all that he's done and says he deserves all this stuff. Even his son deserves a close relationship with God. And for a time, it seems like he hears God saying to him, you deserve it all. It's what it sounds like he's saying in that. And so it's this really interesting thing because it doesn't at all track with how God is presented in the Bible. It is also interesting that the title, the Garden, the word garden, does not exist anywhere in the lyrics, in the hook, or in any of the songs or any of the verses. And so it is really notable because to me, when I hear the garden and you're familiar, like her spiritual, I'm thinking of, like, the Garden of Eden, which is, like, introduced early in the first narratives of the Bible. And in that the first prototypical human is placed. And of course, the story with that is Adam the first, whose name means humanity. And along with the woman he's with, they both decide that they want it all. As in, like God said, you could have everything in this garden to eat except for this one tree of the knowledge of good and evil. And they decide, actually, we want it all. We want that tree because it's going to make us wise, and then we're going to be able to decide what is good and evil. And so they think that they deserve the ability to do that, and thus they deserve to have everything in the garden. And so that seems like kind of connected again, pride, exaltation kind of thing. And so there's that him spilling blood, him exalting himself so that other people are like insects that he can like, or blood is spilled. It's just like paint to me. Like, he devalues everyone to the point that he again, could, like, could exterminate people and not feel bad about it. So all that is there. And then, hey, now, we talked about this ourselves, about the, like, hey, now I'm all about my yin, big face Buddha get my peace from within. Which is like such a great line. It's so good. Yeah, and there's so much. There's such a great line. There's all this stuff about, like, the Eastern spirituality that he's mentioned there with, like, Buddha and things. And like, the Idea of where he gets peace from, but the idea where he says I'm all about my. My Yin. It's tricky because it, like a lot of lyrics have it rooted as yen, which would be like a form of money, particularly in Japan. It's the currency of Japan is the Japanese yen, which would match the phrase, like all about the Benjamins about being all about the money. Again, stacking money. But when I hear it, I often hear I'm all about my yin. And yin would be part of yin and yang, which is the Chinese philosophical thing. That is the circle with like the white and the black side that's representing this kind of duality between light and darkness and between feminine and masculine things like that. And yin is the dark side. Yin is the yin in Chinese means like shade or like overcast or cloudy. So again, it's about the sky and this overcast kind of thing and like light and. And to say that he's all about his yin is. He's all on his shady side. He's on the dark side, which gnx called the dark side Shadowy. It's all kind of like there. And so that kind of play of money and dark side and thing I feel like is really interesting. So those are things we need to reincarnate.

Cole Kushna (71:58)

We didn't mention it. I'll just call it out. Just the black Air Force One energy going back to Party Die. It's like he was laying that out. A number of things. He's laying out that cover image. We should just give that. Get a nod as it's tying into all this. Okay, so then we get to reincarnated. Hard to know where to start with this thing, but we should. Let's start with that. It. So for the first time since the intro of the album that we get the Spanish singing and it's the same or no, it's different. She says that reflect your gaze the night you and I. So not exactly the same, but calling in my mind. Calling back to the intro of the album and kind of reframing that before we get to Reincarnated, which I'll point out is track six. It's directly in the middle. And the next time we hear the woman vocalist is the last track. So in terms of structure, I will.

Femi Olutade (72:59)

Throw out there too. Yeah. What I would throw out too there is that I think this section is in Whackdown Murals, but it happens in between verse one and verse two. I think maybe I may wrong or maybe I missed that. I could be wrong about that. But it's definitely Connected between the rest of them.

Cole Kushna (73:16)

I think you're right. But, yeah, they appear on track 1, 6, and 12. Not as much as. I don't know if there's much there in terms of just creating a nice symmetry within this looser album, but I think that's notable. So the beat, for those that don't know by now, is essentially a recreation. I don't know if it's a direct sample. I haven't gone into that much detail about it, but essentially it's either a recreation or a sample or a building upon a Tupac beat. Made N Words is the track of the track title, and it's notable in that it is considered Tupac's last single before his death. And it's one. I don't know if it's the last music video or. But it's one of the last music videos he filmed, which was on June 4, which is just a few months before his death. So in terms of reincarnation, him choosing this beat that was towards the end of his life feels symbolic and significant. And then, of course, he raps in Tupac's cadence throughout the entire song. So I don't think he ever raps from Tupac's perspective per se, but at it. The implication to me is that he is. The whole song is a reincarnation of Tupac in a way. And that's kind of the overall framework of the song. And then he's going to speak from different reincarnations that we'll talk about here in a second. So that's kind of the overhanging concept of the song. It's also a nod to Taylor Made, I think. And I don't know if it's a oneup of, like, here's how you really. I mean, there's been a lot of that in this beef of here's how you actually respect your elders. I'm going to tribute Tupac in a way. I'm going to rap in his cadence. It's not AI. It's actually coming from my soul and my spirit. It's much more meaningful than this throwaway joke that you did on TaylorMade. Talking about Drake, of course. So there's a lot of just. There's just a lot. Before you even get to any line, just title beat selection frames this beautifully. Right. And so we start with verse one, and he talks about past life regression, which is not the first time he's talked about this. He talks about it, at least he talks about it by name once on Mr. Morale, and kind of emphasizes it on the track. On the track, Mr. Morale, where he says, I lived 2,000 lives, had a thousand wives, or I can't remember exactly the lyric there.

Femi Olutade (75:44)

He says, oh, it's in the. Tyler Perry, the Face of a Thousand Rats. Rappers using violence to cover what really happened. I know someone's listening past life regressions to know my conditions.

Cole Kushna (75:53)

Okay.

Femi Olutade (75:54)

I think he mentioned this term by name there.

Cole Kushna (75:57)

That's in morale.

Femi Olutade (75:58)

It's in morale, yeah, it's in the.

Cole Kushna (76:00)

And then. And then he also says it on by name in track three, Worldwide Steppers, which. Yeah, not a coincidence that those are the title tracks and they mirror each other on the album. But we'll get to there that in due time. Okay, so for those that don't know, past life regression is a form of therapy or hypnosis, essentially where you're put under hypnosis to explore past iterations of your life that may be affecting you or you might be carrying trauma from. In this life. And given. I mean, I'm pretty comfortable saying that it sounds like he actually had this done as much as he talked about it. And it, you know, he says it fucked me up. I believe him when he says this. This is not symbolic. It feels like he's actually done this. So that's kind of the framework of it. And then he uses that to bridge into these different reincarnations. He says reincarnated. Reincarnated on this earth for 100 plus. Body after body, lesson after lesson. So the. The basic idea of reincarnation, and you expand on this if you. If you have anything. But the basic idea is that you come back in different forms all. And you can kind of see these different life forms of your spirit embodying as an overall arc or progression in which you're hopefully building. You inherit the karma of your past lives and you're hopefully building upon what you've learned in past lives in order to. I don't know if you want to call it enlightenment. Live a pure life. There's different interpretations of what that end point is, but that's kind of the basic premise of reincarnation. So that's the framework of the song. You want to add to that at all?

Femi Olutade (77:38)

Yeah, I think that's a good summary. Yeah, there's definitely this theme of this afterlife, but this. Not one afterlife. Probably the difference between reincarnation and maybe some forms of afterlife, particularly in the west, particularly in Christianity, is that there are these multiple reincarnations that kind of go on. There's not like one life after death. Or just one new earth or things like that. There's the idea of that you reincarnate and basically to some extent how you reincarnate, from what I understand, and I don't understand this as well as I understand things like, say from the Bible, but from what I can understand is that how one lives life determines how one is reincarnated. And depending on the specific tradition, they might interpret that slightly differently. But the ideas of karma and how. And lives your life leading to something in your future life. And so that connects the idea that if you theoretically know more about your past lives, then one could be able to make better choices that would then move one towards either better reincarnation or towards nirvana enlightenment. Some kind of like better spiritual state than what it's currently in.

Cole Kushna (78:43)

Right. Okay. So then he bridges that idea, sets it up. I mean, just from a storytelling. I mean, this song is absolutely incredible. Absolutely incredible. So reincarnation one, I haven't actually. I don't know if the details have to. To. To line up with any specific person. I've done some research, a good amount. Not as much as I would like to, but the. The basic guess that people have and I. It seems like the strongest case is that reincarnation one is Johnny Lee Hooker, who was a rhythm and blues star born in 1912, died in 2001, which is. Okay, that doesn't. It's not going to line up with what. What comes next in the song. But he did live in Michigan. Kendrick mentions getting kicked out of his house by his father in 47 in Michigan, which somewhat aligns with Hooker's story, from what I can gather. And then Kendrick goes on to say that. So he got this fame with music essentially and kind of pimps it to his own benefit, to use to pimp a butterfly's terminology. Right. He dies in gluttony, doesn't make a. You know, he's a womanizer. He makes no contribution with his music. It's all self indulgence and gluttony. Do you want to speak on the individual forms or do you want to just kind of lay out?

Femi Olutade (80:04)

Yeah, sure. I think. Yeah. I also try to look into this, and it does definitely seem that Johnny Lee Hooker is by far the strongest candidate for this. I'm not sure if it actually ended up really mattering who it was, but I do think that there is a large alignment to it. But why this particular story does resonate well a lot is for a couple reasons. One, the line about Michigan in 1947, what I think that is Referring to is that Johnny Lee Hooker's first single, Boogie Chillin, was released in 1948.

Cole Kushna (80:35)

Yeah. Yeah.

Femi Olutade (80:36)

And so I think that would align with that and why that would be significant. That would be, like, when he is much more aligned with the music record industry. And that's where he's like, kind of reveting of like, that his success and the fact of, like, he's kind of, like, loved by the music, the record. Like the. Like, we get some bottled money. And while the record business loves me, so I think that is, to me, like, what stands out from that.

Cole Kushna (81:01)

Right.

Femi Olutade (81:01)

And then. And again, like the other part of the story, which it's unclear exactly how what happened, because even he doesn't even know when his birthday is. So there's a lot of things about his early life that are tricky. He also. His parents were, like, divorced, and then his mom, I think, apparently remarried. And so he had a stepdad. So sometimes what father he's relating to might be a little bit muddled, but in some way, his family was definitely very spiritual. They were very much rooted in Christianity and they had very strict rules about them not listening to secular music. That is music that was about this life and was not spiritual. That was not beyond what is just going on in the desires of this life, and was outside of like. Like Christianity, Christian spirituality. And so he was taught the guitar, I think, by his stepdad, according to what I've read. But then he really didn't. He didn't like the spiritual things. He didn't want to do what they did. And his parents were, like, in agricultural Mississippi, in the Delta area, where everybody was growing crops and things. So he apparently left home. It's not necessarily clear that he was kicked out. He might have just chosen to leave himself, but then went to Memphis, which was the home of blues and Beale street and things like that. So it's this story of running away from home, going to the big city. I think he eventually ends up in Detroit after, I think, during World War II, and then that's where he finds success there. But I do think the key of what Kendrick's presenting is this idea of someone who is a musician, who is a very gifted musician, who leaves a stable and rich light of spirituality that leaves his father and goes out to get what he wants based on his own desires. I think that is the key, regardless of who it is.

Cole Kushna (82:32)

Right.

Femi Olutade (82:33)

That seems to be the key that he is really talking about on this album. And he's definitely portraying it as one. That is what is being leveraged by the music industry. And two, it doesn't end up well is I think the other two things. And that, of course, is also tied back to what I said at the beginning is watch the party die. Because Kendrick in there is going off and after corporate guys, the Hollywood. The ghetto Hollywood divorce, the vultures from the record industry. So all of that is really tied, I think, together.

Cole Kushna (82:59)

Beautiful. Okay, yeah, great points. And then verse two, I mean, I'll just give the floor to you, but it seems like Billie Holiday was the obvious one here. Again, the timelines don't quite match up. If he was, again, it doesn't really matter. But if Johnny Lou hooker died in 2001, obviously that doesn't match up with Billie Holiday's timeline. Exactly. But I think symbolically we get what's going on. Billie Holiday famously became addicted, dies from complications from addiction. And you want to. It's the same story, essentially, but I guess the same foundational principles there.

Femi Olutade (83:43)

Yeah, I think so. I think what you pointed out, there's a couple things. Yeah. If you're trying to interpret it very strictly in like, a Buddhist or Hindu idea of reincarnation or someone dies and then it's only after that the life form shows up, then this clearly doesn't fit. And it kind of shows you that he is using reincarnation very loosely and to make a larger concept. But he's not really leaving it within a traditional interpretation of any particular Eastern spirituality. Which will kind of come up a little bit more in verse three. But, yeah, pretty sure this is Billie Holiday. Chitlin Circuit was related to just, I think, like, venues where black people could play. Chitlins is like a form of soul food and pig intestines, which is what blacks kind of ate because from slave times they got the leftovers. So there's all that kind of racial stuff that's going on. They're in that. The second verse, seductive vocalist as the promoter hit the curtains. So one, the idea of seductiveness, which we often use in a kind of. Oh, that's sexy, that's nice. But I think that is supposed to be intentionally depicted as negative within this larger concept of the song, particularly because the fact that it seems to be used by a promoter.

Cole Kushna (84:50)

Promoter, yeah.

Femi Olutade (84:51)

And this is particularly tied again to the record industry. Just like we heard with Johnny Lee Hooker. Them hitting the curtains, them using things, them kind of ending things, them controlling stuff and using it to seduce, to addict people, to push. When he. He talks about this in Watch the Party Die, where he says he gets. They. The Music industry gets rappers drugged up, full of lies. And so that whole kind of like thing is like seem to be playing around there. And then the second part is the third line where it says my voice was angelic straight from heaven. The crowd sobbed. So that is a setup for the next verse. That is clearly a setup for the next verse. We'll talk about it. But the idea of an angelic figure with an angelic voice that is coming from heaven, that is a setup. Next verse. And it's all tied together even to a, like the first person who is someone that plays instruments and the second person who is singing that is notable because like that is all a setup for the third verse.

Cole Kushna (85:49)

Right?

Femi Olutade (85:50)

And then. Yeah, again. Yeah, go ahead.

Cole Kushna (85:51)

I was gonna say, but do you wanna jump into the third verse or do you wanna.

Femi Olutade (85:54)

Yeah, yeah, sure, yeah. Other than that, it's just that her life ends up worse definitely than at least immediately, obviously worse than like Johnny Lee Hooker's because she ends up dying and is like very clearly addicted and has a lot of troubles. She's a woman too as well. She's dealing with more stuff. But yeah, that's mostly what it is. There's not much else. But just point out those things. Those things that really are what the setup is.

Cole Kushna (86:12)

No, that's great, that's great. So yeah, just lay out. I'm just going to give the floor to you for the third verse because I'm just going to sit back and watch you cook here because I know this is just. This has Femi written all over it. So the floor is yours, sir.

Femi Olutade (86:25)

Sir. Sure, I'll take on. So yeah, so we have like the first two verses and the last, the verse, right. He says, my present life is Kendrick Lamar. So again, this is recurring, this loose reincarnation idea that whatever's going on spiritually has been this influence or vitality or spirit that has been some guitarist, maybe John Ellie Hooker, some singer, maybe Billie Holiday. And it's also now in Kendrick. So this goes back to the idea of mixtapes, parents, music, generations passed down, inheritance, culture, all of that is kind of being activated here. That all of this is ultimately leading to Kendrick. Like Kendrick is the fulfillment of all this stuff. And so that's what he talks about. Him, his raising the bar, his instincts, material straight to the charts again. Music industry charts, commercials like him, commercialism. I mean him making money. And also the idea of going up your rank all the way from whacked out mural. So all that is in there. So then he goes in like my father Kicked me out of the house. I finally forgive him. So here, clearly calling back to first verse with the guitarist that is kicked out of his house might have ran away, but it's not the point. The point is, for some reason, there is a conflict, and this, this. This. This person that is a musician leaves the father's house.

Cole Kushna (87:39)

Now, like, obviously, I'll just note if you're not going to. Kendrick was also kicked out of his house by his father for a few days. I don't know if you read that.

Femi Olutade (87:49)

Oh, I remember that.

Cole Kushna (87:50)

I want to say he had to, like, sleep in his backyard because his parents locked him out of the house because he was getting into trouble in the streets. And so I'm reading this as. Yeah, callback to first verse. Kendrick himself and then setting up this larger father. Of course, that's going to. The way that he framed, like, the way that he kind of. When he says, my present life is Kendrick Lamar. It's kind of a misdirect in terms of where things are going, because it suddenly just takes this whole other turn, which you're going to get to here. But I wanted to note that it does actually apply to, like, three fonts there.

Femi Olutade (88:22)

Yes, totally. Yeah, thanks for that. That's really helpful. Yeah, I think 100%, like, there is that aspect of Kendrick himself, as you mentioned, and this other person there. That's very obvious. There's the history with what Kendrick has said there. Of course, Kendrick wasn't kicked out for a long time. It's for a short period of time. But what you said about that lesson, for him to. Because they realized something was going on and that they were trying to teach him a lesson to speak.

Cole Kushna (88:43)

Exactly.

Femi Olutade (88:43)

And try to discipline him. There's definitely something that is clear that is starting to be shown here. Additionally, if you pay attention to Kendrick's work, you have to start thinking, like, whoa, is he talking about his Kenny Duckworth, or are you talking about God the Father? Because that is always there as a subtext of when Kendrick is talking about this and this is specifically called out. Kendrick has used this terminology before, particularly on the song For Sale on Tuppa Butterfly, where Lucy, who is a shortened form of Lucifer, comes to him at a music industry event, as we talk about the music industry, and comes up and offers him to sign a contract to sign his soul over to her. Right. And that is what he says in this thing and in For Sale, he says Lucy says to him. And Kendrick raps from the perspective of Lucy. He incarnates Lucifer. Lucy as a woman That's a seductive woman. And Lucy says, lucy, no. Lucy know you Lucy gonna call you. Even when Lucy knows that you love your father. Right. And you might think is that Kendrick's, like, biological father. The next line. I'm Lucy. I loosely heard prayers on your first album. It is very clear that Lucy is talking about his relationship with God the father. It is very clear. That's what's going on. And that is definitely in the subtext, along with the idea of Lucy being there, which, as we're gonna see, is very significant. So there's that whole aspect of it. There's being kicked out of the house and Kendrick's reaction, which apparently must have been anger and frustration and resentment. But there seems to have been this progression that is happening where he's finally forgiven his dad and understand what's going on. Part of this you can understand is that if. So we have this history before with Johnny Lee Hooker, potentially with Kendrick, his house with gang banging, but being kicked out of. He's being kicked out of the house by his father. There is this sense that there has been this distance at some point between Kendrick and God. And as far as we've seen played out in Kendrick's work, if you're gonna pick any time that is. It must be on Mr. Morale.

Cole Kushna (90:56)

Yeah, exactly.

Femi Olutade (90:57)

That must be the case. It has to be like of anything. And there's a lot of things going into that we don't even have time to because it requires its own dissection. But there are. It builds. Mr. Bell builds to mother Eye soper. Where Kendrick says, where's my faith? I told you I was Christian, but just not today. I transformed and I'm praying to the trees. God is taking shape. And it's some parts, particularly those last lines about the trees and praying to the trees and how God is identified are somewhat cloudy. But it is very clear that there has been some rift between God and Kendrick on Mr. Morale. Like, it's very clear that's being represented. And so it does seem that he's reflecting on that and whatever period around or that appear that is like that that has been happening that he seems to be like. Seems to be reflecting on. And he's realizing that actually had to do with God dealing with his ego and pride, just like it was for his father. And like, with potentially Johnny Lee Hooker's father as well, too. So all of that is kind of like, there. And so he recognized. So he's kind of coming back now. It seems he's learned this lesson. This is after Morale after the birth, the beef with Drake. And so he's. Now he comes back to God. That's what seems to be the implication. And that becomes clearly God the Father. Because in the next section, where he talks directly to his father, seems to be God the Father, where he asks the father, hey, did I get everything right? It's like he's been trying to do things. He's been trying to make changes. And he talks about, oh, I'm selfless now. I've been doing things for other people. I've been doing this for my community. And particularly he talks about how he said no to the vultures, which seemed to be the record industry. They were alluded to in Watch the Party Die. So he's talking so again, that he's not taking the money. And the influence of what they were offering him, which was also the temptation in For Sale, that was coming from Lucy, Lucifer. And then when the people. He's taking care of the people. But then God responds to him is like, hey, I recognize you're doing good things, you're doing well, but your heart is closed. There's something that's still wrong in your heart. And I can still see that there's some residue, there's some defilement. There's something that is dirty, that has not been cleaned up, and that's keeping you kind of locked up. Maybe in prison, maybe in something. And so Kendra continues this conversation with Father and said, hey, I'm not perfect, but I got urges, but I'm holding them down, like, controlling them. Which he mentions earlier about, I took control of my fleshly body when the money changed. Which in part seems to be referencing back to morale, where he was dealing with a lot of the sex addiction and, like, sleeping with other women as a way to be able to both to satisfy that sexual addiction and to make himself feel better and increase his confidence and things like that. So there's all of that. That's kind of there, that seems to be there. And God seems to. Or the Father seems to recognize this, but he still says, hey, but like, your pride has to die. All these things that you're doing is still coming from the sense of pride and self exaltation, which you see if you look through those first five tracks. And then God's like, well, there's this kind of almost confession that's going on where God is like, hey, tell me everything that you've done. And Kendrick then goes on to list a lot of. I feel like what we've seen really since the Pop out show and like, beyond what he's been doing, particularly on PG Lang, of like, trying to deal with artists, trying to, like, get a bunch of these people, black institution, black artists paid. He talks about, I put 100 hoods on one stage. Like, that's referencing the Pop out show. And he's trying to push peace in LA again, trying to bring all the gangs together. Everything we heard about unity and everything like that, not like us and like, everything after that. So he said that lie was like, I'm trying to push peace to la. God immediately retorts and says, but you love war.

Cole Kushna (94:44)

Yeah, yeah.

Femi Olutade (94:46)

And it's a whole commentary about everything that went on with Drake.

Cole Kushna (94:50)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (94:50)

And like, to whatever extent Kendrick was, was. Was showing himself as being morally superior or being good or doing what's right, it's like he's like, but you actually love war. Which is something that. That Kendrick actually brought up. Previously on 616. In LA, where he's like. Where he's like, what? Who am I if I don't go to war again? I am. Who am I? I am, if I don't go to war, that there's this thing that's core to his identity and that he loves peace. But the war is ready if the world wants to see, like, this Drake bleed. So there's all of that that is there. And so Kendrick finally seems to accept that when God slash the Father points this out, and then he's like, oh. And then God says, every individual is only a version of you, which, again, ties to reincarnation. All of these artists that have been mentioned, like, earlier. And then what he says is like, how can they forgive when there's no forgiveness in your heart?

Cole Kushna (95:42)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (95:43)

Which shows the kind of influence where he feels like he's fallen short. And this goes back to DNA where he said things like, I know, murder, conviction burners, boosters, all this, but I wish I was fed forgiveness.

Cole Kushna (95:53)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (95:54)

But I have a soldier's DNA. So all of that in this lack of forgiveness. And Jesus teachings the Lord's Prayer, like, forgive us our trespasses or our debts as we forgive the trespasses, the sins, what, the wrongs being done against us, we need to forgive that. And Jesus even teaches parables and things about, if you don't forgive the people that have wronged you, God won't forgive you and you will be trapped in, like, prison essentially, if you don't offer forgiveness to people. So that is what he's saying. And basically the whole thing with Drake, there seems to be. And just other People and Kendrick's past. There seems to be this thing where Kendrick is realizing that he has not been able to forgive. And if he does that, he's not actually providing the influence that he needs to have. He's not providing the light that we've been talking about. And then Ken is still almost, still trying to justify himself by saying, I can tell you where I'm going, as if I'm going to do more, I'm going to get here. But then God's like, I am going to tell you who you are. Which connects all the way back to Swabluff where he says, God knows I am reincarnated. So this idea of God's knowledge of who Kendrick really is and his identity more than what he claims to be doing, right. And that word, it goes into a very clear like biblical spiritual thread after that where he's like, he tells Kendrick who he is and he says, you fell out of heaven because you were as anxious. You didn't like authority, only searched to be heinous. Isaiah 14 was the only thing that was prevalent.

Cole Kushna (97:15)

So this huge dramatic pause here, like, yeah, it's like a full measure of silence, which I love the drama of that because it's like, this is important. Isaiah 14, go do your research. This is very important. This is not me bleeping out someone's name, but go ahead.

Femi Olutade (97:36)

Yep, totally. Yeah. And he's referenced some verses like this, like James 4 back in lust. So he does it sometimes when it's really significant. Yeah. In lust. Yep. So he says, you fell out of heaven. This is very clearly talking about the interpretation that leads to the story of Lucifer. It is very clear that is what Kendrick is talking about. Isaiah 14. So the content of this. Who is Isaiah? Isaiah is a prophet from the Old Testament. So before Jesus, before the New Testament, Isaiah is in this period where Israel, God's people, is living in their promised land, the land they're living. But then there is. This is during the Iron Age. And the Iron Age is this time period where people have finally figured out how to like make iron. And why that is significant is because iron, the precursor for iron, are very readily available. So people are able to make tools much more quickly and much more, many more tools than they ever had before for tools for farming, but even more so for tools for war. So they're able to make weapons much more than any time in human history because of this. This particular period of time was the first existence of truly global empires. This is where you first have large scale armies invading whole nations and conquering them and like distributing them, doing all kinds of that is what's going on historically during this period of time, which is about 600, 700 years before Jesus. And so at this time, Israel is not as strong. So they're getting oppressed by these other kings, these other emperors. And at times God sends his prophet. Again, prophet is someone who speaks on God's behalf. And the prophet will sometimes talk about what Israel is doing evil, but at other times will talk to the kings and the heads of these emperors about them. Because these emperors would often justify what they were doing by either saying that they represent the gods or whatever powerful God there is, or saying that they themselves were God. Which again goes back to the back to whacked out murals of saying, know that you God, even if they say you ain't. So all of that is like there, right? And so what these prophets do, there's another prophet named Ezekiel that also says this is that they will talk to these kings and they'll talk about the fact that they see themselves as God, but they're going to be brought down. And so in that Isaiah 14, there's a longer section, but the central part of it is around, like from verse 3 to 15, where he talks about how the Lord speaks to the king of Babylon, which was one of the most powerful empires at the time. And he talks about how it says how you have fallen from heaven, talking to this king of Babylon, you. And it says Lucifer. In the older translations, what Lucifer means is a Latin form of what means the bright star, or what's called the star of the morning. That is actually a reference to Venus, because Venus is the brightest light in the heaven that still exists in the morning after the sun rises.

Cole Kushna (100:29)

Okay.

Femi Olutade (100:30)

And so it's a star that doesn't go away when the sun comes up. And if you see the sun as the true most powerful God or a symbol for that, the light that is still holding on is the one that is trying to challenge the most powerful light that is God.

Cole Kushna (100:44)

Right?

Femi Olutade (100:44)

And so that's what it means. But it eventually became interpreted as a proper name and used to refer to the great spiritual force that is opposed or rebels against God. So that's where the term Lucifer comes from. And it's connected to everything we saw about stargazing the night sky, like the night from the initial interlude of the Spanish part. So all that is connected, and it's connected to what the Father says, that you fell from heaven. And so, and this is all happening because this person has become exalted and was trying to challenge God and saying, I will ascend up to heaven. I will raise my throne above the stars of God. So Lucifer is the person that. And the stars. In the ancient near east, the stars represented or pointed towards the spiritual forces or the gods that the different nations worshiped. They were connected to the stars and they didn't distinguish between stars and planets because they thought that the Earth was the center of the universe. So to them, the stars are the same. The stars and plants are the same thing. And so this idea that there is this thing that's going to exalt himself and exist as light beyond what the stars are is this thing that's challenging God. And so God says, basically, he was trying to set your throne above God. Because of that, you thought you were going to ascend up into the clouds, but you're going to be brought down into Sheol, which is Hades, which is the place of the dead. You might be interpreted in modern English as hell. But he's being brought down, which is the idea of what's happening and this humbling that's supposed to be happening. So that's what all that is talking about. And this is all connected to Lucy from For Sale and this larger narrative that is connected often to the very start of the Bible and this force of evil that runs throughout it. The next section where he's like, my greatest musical director was you. It was colors, it was pinks, it was reds, it was blues, it was harmony in motion. So this part is actually not from Isaiah 14 or any part of Isaiah. It's actually part of another prophet called Ezekiel, who's like maybe 100 or more years after Isaiah, similar time period, Iron Age emperors coming to destroy people and take over parts of the world. And in this time, Ezekiel speaks to a king of a place called Tyre, which is also a powerful empire to the north. And there he says, there's this prophecy towards this king has exalted himself and is threatening God's people. And he says, and the prophecy says, because your heart is proud. And you have said, I am a God. I sit in the seat of the gods, in the hearts of the sea. Yet you are immortal and you are not God. And then because by your wisdom, you've gotten riches, you've used your wisdom to get riches in gold and silver. But you know what I'm going to do, and I mentioned this earlier when I talked about the I am a God thing. I am going to bring strangers around you. Ruthless nations. They're going to draw swords and they're going to bring you down to the pit and you're going to die and be killed because you've said, I am a God. And then it goes on later on and continues to say, it tells us history of whoever Ezekiel was talking about and saying, you were in Eden. Eden again, the Garden of Eden. We talked about man in the Garden. It says, you are in Eden, the Garden of God. And it talks about all in Eden, all of the colorful stones that were in Eden, which were like. It's mentioned in Genesis 2. It's like Ruby topaz, diamonds, like onyx, all these colorful gems. So he's mentioned that as being associated with this figure. And it talks about there was gold and there was the workmanship or the craft of tambourines and flutes, which are musical instruments. So the idea that is from this is this spiritual figure which then gets connected to Lucifer from Isaiah, is this beautiful, colorful figure that has exalted himself above God, that says, I am a God and is able to play instruments and make music. So historically, in the history of Christian interpretation, particularly in the west, since the Middle Ages, Lucifer has constantly been interpreted as a figure who was an angelic figure who played instruments, made music and sang to worship God, but then became proud, rebelled against God, and was kicked out of heaven and thrown down to earth.

Cole Kushna (105:00)

Yeah. Which. Yeah, Keep going. Yes, keep going.

Femi Olutade (105:08)

This is everything that Kendrick has been talking about for the last six tracks. Everything has been building up to this. All of this reincarnation of these things is what is going on. Him being kicked out, potentially. John Lee Hooker being kicked out. Everything about this beauty, everything about the music industry going back to Watch the party die, going back to For Sale and Lucy, all of this is connected. And this idea that they're going to be brought, this person going to be brought down and humble, and then God goes on to say, I sent you down to Earth again, being brought down because you were broken and you needed rehabilitation, not psychosis. Which what he seems to be saying is that this spirit, whatever's been reincarnated in potentially Johnny Lee Hooker, potentially in Billie Holiday, and then in Kendrick, is this Lucifer associated spirit that is associated with music, that's associated with influencing people, but and should be used for good. It should be used for light. But because of the light that is actually supposed to be. And thing to remember here, Venus, when what, as we know now, does not actually emit light itself, it reflects light. All of its light comes from the sun. But it's almost as if this Venus thinks that light is coming from itself.

Cole Kushna (106:21)

Yeah. Yeah.

Femi Olutade (106:22)

But the light is actually coming from God.

Cole Kushna (106:25)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (106:25)

Which even connects back to the earlier part about, like. For the Spanish parts about, like, the. The reflection in the gaze that reflects the gaze. The idea that Venus is supposed to reflect the light of God, reflect the true light, rather than itself thinking that it is the light.

Cole Kushna (106:39)

Right, right.

Femi Olutade (106:40)

So all of that is, like, kind of, like, connected, and it's pointing and it's giving this narrative understanding what Kendrick has been doing, what he's been participating in, which is much longer, like, history, where he goes into manipulating man with music again, everything. We've just been talking about this idea of superstars and see how you are moving. The idea of superstars stargazing. All of that is connected to Lucifer being this challenging God and being this, like, star above the stars. And then it's, like, there and having and promoting these evil views. And it's when Kendrick realized all of that that he then, like, repents and turns around and is like. He realized, all I really ever wanted was love. It's not the money and the fame and the power and all these things. What I really wanted was the love and approval of God and that he doesn't want to put people in fear. Going back to the track, fear and, like, all this kind of stuff. He makes his turn right here, and so he's like, I'm going to change my ways now, essentially, is what he says I'm going to like. He's like, the more light that I can capture, the more I can feel. Which, again, means the light is not coming from him. The light is something that he's capturing from God, and he's trying to actually give that to people rather than him thinking that he's actually creating light when he's actually in darkness.

Cole Kushna (107:47)

Yeah, right.

Femi Olutade (107:48)

Because he doesn't love his brother.

Cole Kushna (107:50)

Right, right.

Femi Olutade (107:51)

And so that's when God's like, okay, so then don't take your gifts. I've given you gifts. Kind of like Lucifer. Don't take it for granted. Come back home, all this stuff. And so. And make that light for every man, woman, and child and make sure they're not in captivity, which goes back to the Babylonian captivity, slavery, all those things. And then Kendrick responds saying, I'm ashamed that I ever created that enemy.

Cole Kushna (108:12)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (108:13)

Which if you read into that, one of the most obvious possibilities of that is he feels regret for creating an enemy out of Drake.

Cole Kushna (108:20)

Yeah, yeah.

Femi Olutade (108:21)

At least in this particular moment at this part of the song, after having this conversation with God. And so then God is like, all right, awesome. Let's rejoice because the son has come back home. He's been rehabilitated, he's been healed. And then Kendrick's like, I rewrote the devil's story just to take our power back carnated. And again, devil is another name for this constant spiritual force that's against or opposed to God. Throughout the scriptures. The. It's a shortening of the Greek word diabolos, which means diabolical or really means the false accuser, which is the one that accuses God of not having the best intentions for his people or for his sons and daughters. And thus that's the idea of the snake saying, oh, no. God knows that you would actually enjoy this. And, like, you would have wisdom. He's keeping it from you and accusing God. So he is rewriting the story of the devil by him incarnating the spirit of Lucifer and telling the story. And that is what he just did on this third verse. And that's what all of this whole track was. That's essentially what this whole first half of the album has been about. And to a large extent, the beef with Drake and much of Kendrick's career can be viewed as this larger history of musicians and having this choice between really, the power. The beautiful power of music and artwork and all that can be done in society and culture and how good it can be. And people having this choice to use that for light or use that for darkness. And this whole history is. Kendrick is retelling all of that as like, retelling the story of the devil, almost like kind of like retelling the past life regression, looking back at this whole history, but from this other broader spiritual angle so that we can take the power back. And that phrase really, for me, reminds me a lot of just like a lot of times where you see in like, abusive relationship or oppressive relationships, often, particularly women that either escape that find agency, that they get out of it, and they take the power back that has been stolen by this oppressor or this abuser. And so it's kind of like. And he says our power, as if, like, this isn't about Kendrick. Kendrick, again, is humanity. He's Adam. He's humanity. He's. I am. He is. Okay, Lama. He's my people. That he is doing all of this for everyone, to be able to take the power back away from being under the power of evil, of darkness, of Lucifer, of the false accuser, of the devil.

Cole Kushna (110:44)

Yeah. Fuck. Okay. I'm just. A lot of questions. I mean, that was beautiful. Thank you for that very illuminating dissection, I just. Okay. It's like, this would make so much sense at the end of an album.

Femi Olutade (111:02)

It would.

Cole Kushna (111:04)

Or. Yeah. And it's like, okay, it's track six. I'm just trying to like, okay, how does. Clearly, Kendrick is displaying a depth of understanding of his actions as they relate to these larger concepts that date back to, you know, centuries, decades. Like, I mean, just how. Like, how do you personally reckon this type of understanding with what it. What is hanging over this song, this album, this beef, this vengeance, this cutthroat energy that he's emitting and clearly doesn't shy away from after this song? How do you. So I. In my mind, I'm. Okay. Is Kendrick seeing the vengeance as some kind of noble act? That's. So what is your understanding of his actions with this understanding that he's displaying in reincarnation? Like, how do you feel like he is viewing this. Him striking vengeance or, you know.

Femi Olutade (112:03)

Yeah. So I would say that definitely the first five tracks, I think, are supposed to narratively and chronologically come before this track. I think that's pretty clear. I think Watch the Party Die is also tied to this and is supposed to definitely come before this. I will note at Watch the Party Die, he also said, like, I wonder what Lecrae would do. And Lecrae is very much a Christian rapper who, unlike Kendrick, probably isn't as much in between the mainstream hip hop world of cursing and more sexualized images. And it's very purely in the Christian world and coming from a Christian world view. So there's aspect of Kendrick really wrestling with what he should do. I think he still very much recognized there's evil. As we've been talking about. Evil definitely exists, we all recognize. Definitely exists. And I think it's still up in the debate what should actually be done about it. But it does seem that what Kendrick is saying is that his pride and his ego has led him to act in a way where it's not actually coming from a good place. And it's actually in a place where he's trying to destroy people. Now, that doesn't mean that love and care and forgiveness means, oh, you just say, oh, I forgive you, and let them do whatever they want, because the father didn't let him do whatever he wants. The father kicked him out of his house and the father disciplined them. And the whole point is that there will be some kinds of discipline. If it's not for yourself, that discipline will be given to you, for you to recognize whether now. So whether Kendrick feels that he's in a place to do that for other people. He clearly is having to learn to do that for himself just right now. And so there's definitely not aspect of like, oh, everything is just. Like. Just let everything go. But there's aspect of like, where is the energy of where it's coming from. Clearly needs to change what he's recognizing here. And I think. I don't think that that is fully developed on this album. I don't think he ever gets there on this album. It kind of ends with that recognition of what he's been doing. And even Lecrae had a response to Kendrick's Kids who Watch the Party Die, where he very much spelled out more of a Christian view, although it could have, and talked about love and forgiveness and Jesus and things like that. And I'll probably talk about that at some point separately in my own time. But, yeah, it's just. I think it's not developed here. And that's the part of that. And what you're getting at is part of why, when I list Zound. Because the rest of the tracks is not developed like that. Some of them, you can see, are consistent with this to some degree. Some of them are showing some awareness. Some of them are definitely not consistent. Some of them are just putting people. Are features of people that are definitely not. That are not saying things that are really aligned to this. So it's really a mixed bag. And additionally, some of the songs are just kind of like their own concepts that aren't really so closely tied to as tightly as those first six tracks. So that's part of why, when I listen to it, I was like, this is interesting because both the lack of the interlude, but also what is so closely tied together in the first half kind of spreads out a little bit more. And it kind of goes in these different directions that aren't really necessarily tied. And don't really get that final part of the answer. You've moved away from something, but what are you moving to? And what's the approach from here on out? And so, of course, with an album, you can never necessarily assume that everything that is in play order is in chronological order. So you can't always assume everything that happens after it should always be seen as chronologically happening after track six. You can't always assume that. But at the same time, there's nothing that really, really develops. Okay, like, is there an alternative path from the clear problems that he's been bringing up since Watch the Party Die? And I think that's There. And so that leads me, like, wow. And that's when you asked me about what I thought about. I was like, it feels like a bridge because to me, it really felt like it's bridging both morale and the beef. The actual diss track section, it feels like it's bridging into something else, whether that's something that's coming in a year or that's something that's coming in soon. Like, it's just in this thing where it is. It's getting you. And it, like, literally leaves off half the album as far as, like, the progression. And it goes in different places that are kind of developing, but kind of not at the same time. Yeah. And so, yeah, I mean, like, I would say even of anything, maybe Gloria the most is what really is. Gets more into reflecting on just, like, the good and bad and how the power of artistry can be used for good and bad. So that a lot of it's there. There's a really interesting line on TV off, which is the next track, where he's like, they like what he on. It's that Alpha and Omega bitch, welcome home. Which is just one of these Kendrick lines that are just so classic. Kendrick lies. Where is this mix of influences and all these things? But Alpha and Omega is a reference to God, to the Lord, to Jesus. It is specifically said in the last book of the Bible, which is called the Revelation. Notice he says later, this is a revelation. This line is used. This particular thing is used because alpha is the first letter of the Greek Alphabet, omega is the last letter. So it's about. He's the beginning and the end. He's over all time. Right. And that it's. And he says, I'm the Alpha and Omega bitch, welcome home. And the whole thing. He just talks about getting kicked out of his father's house. And now he's like, welcome home. It's almost this, like, partial return, but still, like, dealing with some things about, like, in the middle of this saying, like, referring this person as a bitch in the middle of saying this. So it's just kind of like there's so much that is, like, there in this revelation and getting an N word gone. Like, there's so much. There's so much in that. So it's like there are some things that are. And like, TV off is like, one of my favorite tracks to listen to in the entire album. Coming after that energy coming off of Reincarnated is just so much right there. And just the Californian ness of it. I like it just Gets me every time. It was a time where I smiled the most. Listening to the album the first time, and I heard those lines, I was like, oh, my goodness. This has been this journey so far. But, yeah, it's unclear. I feel like where it's going to go from that. And that is where I kind of feel like I see it off in the bridge. Whether you call that a mixtape, whether there's some double album or something like that, but conceptually it leaves you at something where there's clearly this path, but he needs to wrestle more with what that path looks like going forward. And if it doesn't feel like it does that on this track. Yeah. And if this was the last track, then you'd be like, okay, that's what this album is supposed to be about. But it's so interesting that it's in the middle of it, and so it kind of leaves you wondering at that point, right?

Cole Kushna (118:30)

Yeah. So let's. I mean, we're getting. The irony of us at the two hour mark now is like, yeah, we're gonna do like an hour, right?

Femi Olutade (118:38)

Yeah.

Cole Kushna (118:41)

But just. Just for the sake of wrapping this up without cutting it short, of course. But yeah, we did want to touch on the heart 6 as maybe a bridge into talking about what's next. Because traditionally the Heart series we know is never on the actual album. So if we're. If we're looking at evidence that something else is coming, that's one thing you'll point to is that the Heart six reclaimed from Drake, of course, is on this project. We should just note that it's a very. One of my favorite songs on the album. It's. I think it's a perfect Heart series in that it's Kendrick's first album post tde and he does this retrospective dedication to his come up with members of TD All. He mentions all of them by name and gives this beautiful kind of sentimental story of their rise together. It's over. SW V. Flip of use your heart, which notably is produced and written by the Neptunes, of course, of Pharrell fame. So if you're looking at connections of him reclaiming the Heart series from Drake, you know, Pharrell was part of the beef, so could. Could be a little subtle thing there. Let's get into other evidence that there's something else coming aside from the conceptual stuff we've talked about and you just laid out as well, is that doesn't feel like. It feels like it's setting. It's a bridge. It's in between. He's Wrestling with stuff seems to be pointing that there's more. So more evidence would be the incredible song snippet in the music video is not on this album, which is just obviously makes you scratch your head. And it. I noticed sonically that that song felt much more in the vein of a Kendrick, highly produced Kendrick song. Or at least that's where it was going. You had this drawn out intro, you had multiple vocal harmonies stacking on top of each other. There was a sense of grandness that we're. We're used to that just not quite on gnx. So that definitely caught my ear. And the song definitely keeps going. And he just cut it short. It's exactly a minute long. It sounds like you just cut it exactly at a minute for whatever reason. Also, there's two cars in the video and he's specifically comes out of the GNX car. There is another car on the left side of the video. So if we're looking for more evidence. Good point to that. This is all conspiracy theory at this point, but for me, it was really the production value of that that caught my ear. It's like, oh, okay, this doesn't feel like a throwaway. And why would you shoot a video for the only song that's not on the album when there's no other videos yet? So we talked about the Heart series. A lot of this project seemed to be to be written recently. So if you've been following some of the online evidence, the producer of the GNX title track, the. The. The 11th track on the album posted on Instagram that he had just given and posted the text with him and Kendrick as evidence that he had just sent that beat to Kendrick two days before the album released, two days before, which is crazy to think about. He's done this kind of stuff before releasing stuff like right away. Not entire projects, but I mean, if you actually listen to that song, he doesn't actually have a verse. It's I think three guests verse and he does the hook. So I can see that coming together in two days. If you're relying on people to come in, just do one verse each and Kendrick bridging it together with this hook. But more evidence there. The female singer, which we have not said her name yet. I'm sorry, it's. And I'm sorry for my white pronunciation of it, but Daria Barrera is her name. She was contacted after Kendrick saw her at the World Series opening game in LA, and that was on October 25th. So you have to think those portions were thought about only after that and recorded after that. And that's less than a month before we get this project. More evidence that this was, you know, a lot of it was composed recently. I can go through just like a ton of online, which I maybe don't need to do all of them. But there have been people close to Kendrick circle within TDE and people that have worked on the album that have given these little Easter eggs of things not being done yet. A notable one from, from Top Dog was that he said on Instagram, dot is very dangerous, man, right now. And ends by saying, everybody stand down. I promise you, there's producers that have said, all I must say is you're about to see a run. Another producer posted, the job's not finished. Kobe meme. So there's like 10 of these examples that you can point to that people are starting to allude that this is not the only thing. It would make sense to me that it's not the only thing. I think part of this for Kendrick is historic in terms of like, he demolishes the biggest rapper out right by numbers in a battle, and he's about to play the Super Bowl. He drops this project, he's breaking all these records, multiple number ones in a year. Like this feels like his conscious push into like a serious, serious undisputed contention of like, goat status. Like true greatest of all time status. We know Kendrick has been gunning for this, you know, this femi for years since. Since he was freestyling over monster, claiming that he's the best rapper alive and taking shots at Lil Wayne in 2000. What was that, 11 or 12? So it's like he's had this, this kind of goal, I guess, for forever. And so the stars are aligning, pun intended here in terms of circumstance. Him, him being kind of in his prime, like just by, by age, all these different things aligning and like, it feels like an opportunity of him really submitting that resume, right? If he does, if he plays all these cards right on top of all this conceptual stuff, right? So that's, that's, that's more evidence to me that something else is coming. If he can drop this great project that's going to break a bunch of streaming records, follow it up with another one, follow it up with a Super bowl, like, you know, you can just start to imagine if he plays his cards right and a stadium, a rumored stadium tour coming after that. It's, it's, it's a, it's a resume to contend with historically. Right. And I'll just say one extra note, that's always stuck in my mind in my Mr. Morale research. Is that Soundwave. And the. One of the very rare interviews anyone gave post Mr. Morale that worked on it said him and Kendrick started on their next album together the day after they finished Mr. Morale. And this is kind of like a tradition for them where they get excited about the next thing because they've kind of unburdened themselves from this other thing. And that was over two years ago. So in my mind, I'm like, these are not the only songs that he has over two years of. You know what I mean? So all that to say there feels like a lot of evidence that something else could be coming. But let's not diminish this what is a fantastic project. And maybe let's end on just some casual conversation about just our favorite tracks on the album. Femi. If you want to give just your standouts of just, you know, why you like them briefly. It doesn't have to be anything conceptual. I think we covered that enough this. This episode.

Femi Olutade (126:09)

Totally, totally. Yeah. No, my favorites right now. Whacked out murals, great start bars like the hook, like going up your rank. It's just like it really communicates what it's trying to kind of get out. And it just sets the tone for the album. So I love going back listening to that. There's so much in there. So that Luther. I love Luther. It's so good. It's so smooth. It's like unique on the album. SZA's great on it. Like, there's just so much about it. It feels really good. Like, I like the drums on it. There's so many parts about it that I really like and it just got to stick with you. And the melodies are really great. So I love listening to Luther and I love that it's both great listen to and it kind of still at the same time builds conceptually on what seems to be going there, even if you don't notice it at first. So I really like that one. And then as I mentioned before, TV Off. I love TV Off. It's great. It's both its placement, but just like the so California. I've lived in California most of my adult life, and I came when it was the start of the height of the Hyphae movement and stuff. So there's just so much about that. So now that everything that he did with Mustard on Not Like Us, there's so much about it that really captures such a great ethos on that track. And I like the switch over to a monster at the end. And even just to turn the TV off. As also a parent trying to regulate your kids screen time and stuff.

Cole Kushna (127:37)

Well, it plays into the father thing, right? Like him playing the father. Like turn you. I'm going to turn your TV off. Like that's you off dirty.

Femi Olutade (127:43)

Yeah. So that particularly with the length of like the. The aspect of like parents and like discipline and like entertainment industry and things.

Cole Kushna (127:52)

Being could be used for good.

Femi Olutade (127:53)

But are you using the bad like that there's so much about that that like, you know, not every hip hop song that's. That's going out there that's about like women or violence. Am I going to like resonate but like TV off. Even if it's rough edges, I'm like, I resonate like he's saying right here, like there are not enough people doing this for real. And like yeah, that TV needs to go off sometimes.

Cole Kushna (128:13)

Yeah.

Femi Olutade (128:14)

And there's so much, there's so much about it that is. That it's in there. So those, those are, those are my three. There's my three standards that I just like love listening to.

Cole Kushna (128:21)

Yeah. I think for me pretty similar list. Like conceptually I just, you know, I love Reincarnate Reincarnated and Heart Sticks just. And like you know, that side of my brain. But if I just wanted to like listen. I love that you can just listen to this album and just enjoy. You know what I mean? You can turn the conceptual brain off easily for this project for me at least. And so in that vein, Squabble, I mean Squabble is just. They're so fun and coming off the energy, the dark energy of the opening track and then just hearing that beat and of course like the almost kind of legend of this song, like being one of those snippets that maybe we'll never get and just him delivering on it was really fun. Luther, for all the reasons that you talked about. I really like hey now. I really like hey now. Just his voice, how it's like he's. I've never heard his voice that deep and that hollow sounding. It's really fun. And then the feature. I think his name's Dodi Doty6 or Dottie6. Really good. I need to check out more of his stuff. But that's. That's one that I haven't seen talked about as much as the others. And I, I really like that song. And then TV off, of course, just instant meme of the mustard. Of course of that. That second part. And fun fact, like he sampled the same mustard, sampled the Same album that he sampled for Not Like Us. So there. If you, if you hear that, that similarity in the marching band aspect of it, that's why. So that, that's kind of a clever little connection there. But yeah, I love, I love the project in that I do like a loose, looser Kendrick album. You know, as much as it might be a bridge, it's like you just kind of. There's not really, I guess, good kid mad city or damn, you can kind of put on, but you're still going to get those skits and it's still, you know, I'm not able to shut off my. That part of my brain as much. But this one, you know, I feel like it's not like sacrilege to put some of these songs on a playlist, which I always feel bad about with Kendrick's music, you know. So I think he very smartly. If this is something a bridge to something else, he very smartly timed it correctly. The non rollout perfect for a project like this. Feeding fans and living up to this momentum and sustaining the momentum. It all seems very strategic. All seems like it does. Something's going to come. When that comes, who knows? But I'm excited. I mean, what a year, Femi. I mean, as a Kendrick, you know, you're Kendrick fan just like me in the same, I think, obsessiveness of it. It's just been. We've been eating as the kids say. Well, thanks for. We'll wrap it up here. Thanks for joining me. You always impress me with how fast you put these concepts together, man. I'm always so floored. I remember if people want to go back and listen to the Jesus is king Kanye episode that we did, I got some flashbacks of that episode. But I'm over here, like, I'll listen to that kick drum. What sample is that? And then you're over here putting these amazing concepts together. So thanks for joining. Cool.

Femi Olutade (131:32)

Awesome. Thanks for having me. It was great. It's great to reconnect and do this again.