Dive Club Episode Summary: Catt Small - How to Influence and Lead as a Staff Designer

Release Date: January 17, 2025

In this episode of Dive Club, host Ridd engages in an insightful conversation with Kat Small, a seasoned designer with nearly 15 years of experience spanning industries such as entertainment, financial services, e-commerce, and SaaS. Kat shares her extensive knowledge on thriving as a staff designer, delving into areas like product strategy, systems thinking, relationship building, and leadership.

1. Kat Small’s Design Journey

Kat opens the conversation by outlining her evolution in the design field. Starting with a foundation in graphic design during her college years, she transitioned into web development, interaction design, and eventually product design and user experience. Her first role as an interface designer set the stage for a diverse career across various industries.

[01:05] Kat Small: "I really liked the combination of getting to study people and learn how they think and getting to figure out the right place to put things."

Kat highlights the importance of continuously honing her craft and adapting to different industry demands, emphasizing her passion for engaging and impactful design work.

2. Defining the Role of a Staff Designer

Kat elucidates the multifaceted responsibilities of a staff designer, which extend beyond conventional user experience tasks. The role demands a balance of systems thinking, high-quality visual design, and strategic business acumen.

[03:04] Kat Small: "As a staff designer, you have to be good at systems thinking... you also have to be leading design in terms of the craft side of things."

She recounts her experience at Asana, where she was entrusted with creating a new product area—a role that underscored the high level of responsibility and the necessity to inspire and guide diverse teams toward a unified vision.

3. Approaching Large-Scale, Ambiguous Projects

When faced with complex and undefined problem spaces, Kat adopts a methodical approach to navigate ambiguity and drive project momentum. Her strategy involves:

• Identifying Unknowns: Assessing what is known and what needs exploration.
• Engaging Stakeholders: Conducting internal and external interviews to gather diverse perspectives.
• Utilizing Design Sprints: Employing iterative processes to converge on viable concepts.
• Reducing Risk: Prioritizing work sequences that align with company goals and minimize uncertainties.

[06:45] Kat Small: "Anything that I can do to figure out the signal, like, where am I moving towards something good or am I moving further away from it?"

This approach ensures that projects are grounded in both user needs and business objectives, facilitating informed decision-making and effective project execution.

4. Fostering Creativity Beyond Constraints

Kat underscores the importance of encouraging creative thinking free from immediate constraints. By fostering an environment where “wacky” or seemingly impossible ideas are welcomed, she helps teams explore innovative directions that might otherwise be overlooked.

[08:51] Kat Small: "I really try to encourage people to just turn off the part of their brain that's very stuck on constraints."

She advocates for open conversations that allow for the exploration of radical ideas, which can lead to groundbreaking solutions and the identification of novel problems to solve.

5. Building Influence and Executive Presence

A key differentiator between senior and staff designers, according to Kat, is the ability to influence and exhibit executive presence. She shares strategies to cultivate these soft skills:

• Investing in Relationships: Building trust and understanding colleagues’ goals through regular conversations.
• Effective Communication: Framing discussions to align personal contributions with team and company objectives.
• Ownership and Visibility: Clearly owning one’s work and sharing it as a teaching exercise to provide value and build recognition.

[22:29] Kat Small: "A key differentiator between senior and staff designers is the mushy stuff like executive presence."

Kat emphasizes the shift from seeking external validation to internally validating one’s work and contributions, fostering confidence and respect within the organization.

6. Evolving Communication Practices

Initially striving for perfection in presentations, Kat learned to balance professionalism with approachability. She now focuses on:

• Efficiency Over Perfection: Creating effective, reusable artifacts with minimal time investment.
• Humanizing Presentations: Incorporating personality and authenticity to make communications more relatable.
• Flexibility in Sharing: Adapting the level of preparation based on the audience and context.

[28:40] Kat Small: "I try to find the right level of relatable, but also put together that kind of, like, that's the way that I approach being a staff designer."

This evolution has enabled her to communicate more effectively and authentically, enhancing her leadership presence.

7. Shifting Mindset from External Validation to Internal Confidence

Kat reflects on her personal journey from seeking external validation to cultivating internal confidence. This mindset shift involved:

• Focusing on Quality Work: Prioritizing the work itself over titles and recognition.
• Building Self-Belief: Gaining confidence in her abilities and consistently communicating her value.
• Embracing Vulnerability: Sharing successes and learning experiences as teaching moments rather than bragging.

[31:06] Kat Small: "I realized that it is more about the work that you do... a belief in yourself."

This transformation not only enhanced her professional growth but also allowed her to become a more effective leader and mentor.

8. Mentorship and Advancing Within an Organization

Kat offers practical advice for designers aiming to transition from individual contributors (ICs) to staff designers:

• Proactive Engagement: Scheduling regular one-on-ones with product managers and engineering leads to understand broader project contexts and demonstrate strategic thinking.
• Collaborative Prioritization: Engaging in conversations to align on project priorities and manage workload effectively.
• Visibility and Influence: Actively participating in meetings and discussions to build trust and become a go-to resource for strategic decisions.

[35:43] Kat Small: "Proactively reach out to people and people start to see you as an ally and an asset in some way."

By expanding their engagement beyond immediate tasks, designers can gain the necessary context and relationships to take on more strategic roles.

9. Managing Workload and Communicating with Managers

When faced with tight deadlines and execution-heavy roles, Kat advises:

• Clear Communication: Discussing priorities and defining what “done” looks like with managers.
• Time Management: Collaboratively setting expectations and negotiating workload to maintain quality without overextending.
• Delegation and Focus: Identifying tasks that can be streamlined or delegated to create space for more strategic work.

[43:29] Kat Small: "If you are looking for this level of craft, then I need this much time. Is that still the case or is that not the case?"

This approach ensures that designers maintain the integrity of their work while effectively managing their responsibilities.

10. Influences and Learning from Teammates

Kat highlights the impact of Micah Bennett, a colleague whose approach to storytelling and visioning profoundly influenced her own practice. Micah's ability to visualize future states and translate them into actionable roadmaps demonstrated the power of effective storytelling in garnering support and reducing project risks.

[47:41] Kat Small: "She was really good at visualizing the future in a way that felt relatively immediately tangible."

This mentorship underscored the importance of bridging creative vision with practical execution, inspiring Kat to enhance her own storytelling abilities.

11. Kat Small’s Staff Designer Course

Towards the end of the episode, Kat introduces her comprehensive course designed for designers aspiring to or currently in staff designer roles. The course covers:

• Baseline Expectations: Understanding industry-wide standards for staff designers.
• Building Influence: Overcoming communication barriers and establishing executive presence.
• Strategic Problem-Solving: Deciding which problems to influence and managing up.
• Stakeholder Management: Navigating relationships to achieve desired outcomes.

[49:44] Kat Small: "It is all about figuring out how to either move up to that level or excel at that level if you're already there."

The course aims to equip designers with the tools and confidence needed to thrive in senior design roles, fostering both personal growth and professional excellence.

Conclusion

Kat Small’s insights provide a comprehensive roadmap for designers aiming to ascend to and excel in staff designer roles. Her emphasis on systems thinking, strategic communication, personal growth, and proactive engagement offers valuable lessons for fostering leadership and influence within design teams. Through her experiences and practical advice, Kat illustrates how designers can navigate complex projects, build meaningful relationships, and continuously evolve to meet the dynamic demands of the field.

Notable Quotes:

• Kat Small [00:00]: "I really try to encourage people to just like, turn off the part of their brain at the beginning that's very stuck on constraints."
• Kat Small [03:04]: "As a staff designer, you have to be good at systems thinking."
• Kat Small [08:51]: "I really try to encourage people to just turn off the part of their brain that's very stuck on constraints."
• Kat Small [22:29]: "A key differentiator between senior and staff designers is the mushy stuff like executive presence."
• Kat Small [31:06]: "I realized that it is more about the work that you do... a belief in yourself."
• Kat Small [35:43]: "Proactively reach out to people and people start to see you as an ally and an asset in some way."
• Kat Small [43:29]: "If you are looking for this level of craft, then I need this much time. Is that still the case or is that not the case?"
• Kat Small [47:41]: "She was really good at visualizing the future in a way that felt relatively immediately tangible."
• Kat Small [49:44]: "It is all about figuring out how to either move up to that level or excel at that level if you're already there."

Resources Mentioned:

• Dive Club Website: Dive.club
• Kat Small’s Course: Staff Designer (Details available at Dive Club Partners)

For more episodes, key takeaways, and bonus resources, visit Dive.club.